zenmomma *

>>It came from my first statements, from prior discussions here and
>>elsewhere, from a lifetime of considering this'n'that.>>

I understand that. It just seemed a big leap to make in this particular
context. All spiritual roads do not have to lead to a life of religious
subjugation.

>>I don't have a good way to indicate except to keep saying it occasionally
>>that I'm not responding to one single person's ideas or statements, but
>>talking about the ideas themselves.>>

But the ideas being presented, in my opinion, did not point to the idea of
giving over any part of one's life to that idea. That's going back to
religious juju. Not the point I was making.

>>Anyone living for heaven or a gypsy prophecy ten years away, or to grow up
>>and be real is missing the moment.>>

Very true. I guess I still don't see what that has to do with the idea of
possibilities. My denseness, perhaps.

>>The souls choosing their own new lives thing is a slice of the
marginal, not a big liklihood. Yet lots of people seem attached to the
idea, and seem to base their decisions on it. Souls being bound to one
another from past lives being a basis for life's decisions.>>

Can you give an example of which life's decisions you're referring to?

~Mary

_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/13/02 8:48:23 AM, zenmomma@... writes:

<< Can you give an example of which life's decisions you're referring to? >>

Marriage?
Divorce?
Leaving a man for another man because of the perception that the new guy was
from a former lifetime.

Staying with one child over others because the two of you were lovers in
another lifetime (I know of only one case of that, and it's an only child,
but the mother has barely let him out of her sight and he's 16 now; she did
trust us enough to leave him at our house a couple of times while she went to
a store 1/4 mile away). Her adult, retarded brother had been molested by a
priest 30 years ago, but the son has probably never SEEN a priest.

I grew up near Santa Fe, a magnet for new age weirdos. And if it's not all
unscientific weirdo stuff, that's fine, but that doesn't mean it doesn't
attract a bunch of unscentific weirdos.

Sandra, who visited her former high school English teacher, meditation
teacher, tarot-card reader, past-life channeling psychic friend Friday

zenmomma *

<< Can you give an example of which life's decisions you're referring to? >>
>
>Marriage?
>Divorce?
>Leaving a man for another man because of the perception that the new guy
>was from a former lifetime.>>

Interesting. I've never met anyone who's made such decisions based on these
beliefs. Doesn't mean these people don't exist, though.


>>I grew up near Santa Fe, a magnet for new age weirdos. And if it's not
>>all unscientific weirdo stuff, that's fine, but that doesn't mean it
>>doesn't attract a bunch of unscentific weirdos.>>

I lived in Boulder, CO for 10 years, also a magnet for new agers. I can't
say I met a bunch of unscientific weirdos, though. I met lots of people who
held wildly ranging beliefs, even some who claimed to have no belief system
at all. Some who acted strangely, some who had found real peace, some who
were obviously still searching, none I would label as a weirdo.

I do know, though, that I had a harder time exploring all of these ideas
while still living there. For me, it was something about being surrounded by
people who "know" the truth, whatever it may be.

>>Sandra, who visited her former high school English teacher, meditation
>>teacher, tarot-card reader, past-life channeling psychic friend Friday>>

That's nice. Some of my best friends are.....whatever.

~Mary


_________________________________________________________________
Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com

Pam Hartley

I've met lots and lots and lots of them (my weirdo growing-up center was
Berkeley, and science fiction conventions).

But I don't know how many were "true believers" and how many made the
decisions they wanted to, and then found the excuse of past lives or tarot
cards or the phase of the moon that fit what they wanted to do anyway.

Is it more harmful to say, "We were once together on the planet Zybot and
therefore we must be again, even if I have to leave my boring husband and
six children" than "I want to jump him every time I see him, so I'm leaving
my boring husband and six children"?

Well, yeah, I think it is more harmful. At least with the second it's
honestly selfish instead of meant for a higher purpose.

Pam

----------
>From: "zenmomma *" <zenmomma@...>
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] possibilities, was Respecting people
>Date: Sun, Jan 13, 2002, 9:00 AM
>

>>Marriage?
>>Divorce?
>>Leaving a man for another man because of the perception that the new guy
>>was from a former lifetime.>>
>
> Interesting. I've never met anyone who's made such decisions based on these
> beliefs. Doesn't mean these people don't exist, though.

zenmomma *

>>But I don't know how many were "true believers" and how many made the
>>decisions they wanted to, and then found the excuse of past lives or tarot
>>cards or the phase of the moon that fit what they wanted to do anyway.>>

Probably no way to know. Humans are great at coming up with excuses or
justifications or reasons or beliefs for any action.

>>Well, yeah, I think it is more harmful. At least with the second it's
>>honestly selfish instead of meant for a higher purpose.>>

In either case it sounds like a sucky decision. And such extreme examples do
not alter my belief in the possibilities of the universe. We can find
extremes at both ends of the spectrum, from fundamentalists to new age
"weirdos". Focusing our attention on the existence of these two ends does
not allow for examination of the vast middle ground in between. The idea
that there are possibly things we do not yet understand, and that some
people may be more sensitive to these things than others. And that many
people can live with these possibilities and still manage to remain
non-dogmatic, living in the moment, with full and loving attention to family
and friends.

~Mary

_________________________________________________________________
Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/13/02 10:01:20 AM, zenmomma@... writes:

<< That's nice. Some of my best friends are.....whatever. >>

Some of my best friends are weirdos.

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/13/02 11:40:43 AM, pamhartley@... writes:

<< Is it more harmful to say, "We were once together on the planet Zybot and
therefore we must be again, even if I have to leave my boring husband and
six children" than "I want to jump him every time I see him, so I'm leaving
my boring husband and six children"?

<<Well, yeah, I think it is more harmful. At least with the second it's
honestly selfish instead of meant for a higher purpose. >>

I think so too, and partly because of the fatalism and the excusing of
responsibility that sometimes goes with it, or the blaming of the victim.
Rather than work to find a good working relationship with someone, some
people say they were enemies from another lifetime, or that the other person
*obviously* has not learned his lessons from the *last* time they were
married.

Basically it just gags me when people say of an abused wife or child that
they chose their situation this lifetime because they had lessons to learn,
blah blah.

Sandra

zenmomma *

>>Some of my best friends are weirdos.>>

I guess I just wouldn't use that term to describe a friend. They are Who
They Are. Of course, I am comfortable describing myself as a freak. Go
figure.

~Mary

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx