bridgetvic1964

My friend and I were talking about curfews the other night.We both
have grown children,and we both have young children.I remember with my
son Nick,almost 22yrs,that it was a struggle for us,probably more for
me,since I often let my fears get ahead of me,and I was pretty strict
about his curfew.I grew up in the country so things were alot more
relaxed(I do not even remember having a bedtime),but living in the
city has so many more challenges and dangers.When Nick was younger 0-
14 we hung out with him alot did sports,camping movies etc...but there
comes a time when he wanted to be alone,spend time with his friends
that's when I set curfews.My son,Moe will be three in June and my
daughter Mimi is a one and a half yrs so I know this won't be an issue
for a while yet I feel the mindset starts now.The question is how
should we approach curfews?My kneejerk reaction is enroll them in Krav
Maga and hover over them until they are 18 and then...<g>I do not want
curfews to be an issue this time around,but I do want them safe.Bridget

Bling Williams

What do you mean by curfews? I'm assuming 'time to be back home when out'?
H is 14. When she goes to visit friends she tends to stay over as they are 60 or so miles away and the last train back is at 8pm. It arrives back after the last bus so its not practical.
If she's going into town I ask her to be back by 6'ish. Bristol is a high crime city. Lots of gangs, stabbings, daylight muggings as well as the drunken chavs on a friday and saturday night in the town centre. The bus comes up through Stapleton Road and Fishponds, reputedly the mostdangerous road in the UK so I'd rather she wasn't on the bus late at night.
She's been ok with this but of course assumes she is immortal and thinks a white teenager down there where its all black or Asian wouldn't attract any attention.
At HE camps she sticks her tent y the other teens so I have no idea what time she gets back. The camp site is enormous but I tell her if they all go to the beach to make sure she's with people, not wondering country lanes alone trying to findthe campsite at 2am!
Its not been an issue with the boys as B hates going outside and R prefers to hang out here too. I was sort of hoping they would go out. It can't be normal for a 13 yo and 11 yo to never go out! At their age I'd be out all day climbing trees and hanging around. I sometiems joke that they should be out getting into trouble like normal people!
When we were in VA things were easier cos there weere no buses and the kids couldn't go aywhere ;-)

S

bridgetvic1964 <razemfamily@...> wrote:
My friend and I were talking about curfews the other night.We both
have grown children,and we both have young children.I remember with my
son Nick,almost 22yrs,that it was a struggle for us,probably more for
me,since I often let my fears get ahead of me,and I was pretty strict
about his curfew.I grew up in the country so things were alot more
relaxed(I do not even remember having a bedtime),but living in the
city has so many more challenges and dangers.When Nick was younger 0-
14 we hung out with him alot did sports,camping movies etc...but there
comes a time when he wanted to be alone,spend time with his friends
that's when I set curfews.My son,Moe will be three in June and my
daughter Mimi is a one and a half yrs so I know this won't be an issue
for a while yet I feel the mindset starts now.The question is how
should we approach curfews?My kneejerk reaction is enroll them in Krav
Maga and hover over them until they are 18 and then...<g>I do not want
curfews to be an issue this time around,but I do want them safe.Bridget





SPONSORED LINKS
Unschooling Attachment parenting John holt Parenting magazine Single parenting

---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


Visit your group "AlwaysLearning" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


---------------------------------





http://nobravery.cf.huffingtonpost.com/

www.celyn.org

---------------------------------
New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

On Apr 28, 2006, at 5:19 AM, bridgetvic1964 wrote:

> there
> comes a time when he wanted to be alone,spend time with his friends
> that's when I set curfews.

We've never had curfews.

-=-I do not want curfews to be an issue this time around,but I do
want them safe-=-

How does "be home at 11:00" ensure safety?

Our deal was we wanted to know who they were with and where they were
and if their plans changed.

So far so good!

Sandra

[email protected]

<<How does "be home at 11" ensure safety?>>

I agree. When I was a teen, my parents started with a curfew but then
I consistently pointed out that things that happen after 11 are the
same things that happen before 11. They eventually saw the light and
switched to simply wanting to know what I was doing and with whom. It
was more inconvenient for them. I would call or stop by the house all
hours to let them know that we had a new plan and were off to somewhere
else. But it worked really well.

Julie S.

Bling Williams

Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:


How does "be home at 11:00" ensure safety?

Our deal was we wanted to know who they were with and where they were
and if their plans changed.

So far so good!

Sandra


If they are hanging out on the streets ith their mates the a 11 curfew makes sense. Its at that time the pubs chuck out and the prostitutes and drug dealers are active. UK streets are rather busy from 11 with drunks. I wouldn't feel happy about a 14 yo being out with that. Even DH and me wont go out after 10 around here. Not unless we want drunken gangs of teens throwing stones and shouting etc etc..

S


http://nobravery.cf.huffingtonpost.com/

www.celyn.org

---------------------------------
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Bling Williams

It crossed my mind tht maybe its British teens. I don't know what American teens do to be honest but here, just wondering the streets with a group of mates, or hanging out on a street corner is what UK teens do. It can be quite intimidationg to walk past 15-30 teens, all in hoodies.
There's just nowhere for them to go. Pubs don;t take under-18's, youth clubs are a bit stale, hanging out at a friends house is uncool. I remember doing the same. My mum couldn't figure out what the attraction was, especially in the winter. But it was just chatting, goofing around, bit of snogging and just hanging with a group of your friends. UK teens don't have acess to a car until 18 either. I suppose some ask mum to drive them somewhere but its a bit uncool to have your mum coming to pick you up!
What do American teens do? I never saw any hanging around the street like you do here and couldn't figure out where they all were?

S


http://nobravery.cf.huffingtonpost.com/

www.celyn.org

---------------------------------
Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/28/2006 10:13:06 AM Eastern Standard Time,
bobalinga@... writes:

>>What do American teens do? I never saw any hanging around the street like
you do here and couldn't figure out where they all were?<<

I guess we're really lucky in our town...it's very small, and we have a cool
old stone school they turned into a youth center, with tons of stuff going
on all the time. They have a few rooms with lots of couches, TV's, etc, and
another with fooseball tables and pool tables, and of course a gym with
basketball hoops, tumbling mats, etc.

Behind the youth center is a skateboard park, which has been a godsend for
our transplanted California kids (we're in West Virginia now). Redneck-type
kids hang out with their trucks either in Sheetz or Walmart's parking lot and
talk, joke, shoot the breeze. We do have a bowling alley but I don't think
many kids hang out there.

Nancy B.








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

On Apr 28, 2006, at 8:00 AM, Bling Williams wrote:

> If they are hanging out on the streets ith their mates the a 11
> curfew makes sense

My kids have never been just hanging out on the streets.

If a curfew makes sense to you, in your situation, in your
neighborhood, you should have one. The discussion is about how they
can be avoided, or what other options might be.

My kids used to have a friend who worked at an all-night 7:11 in a
dark neighborhood. They would drive over there and sit outside and
have the cheap fountain sodas and talk, and visit with him. He liked
it, because he wasn't alone, and the place seemed friendlier. They
weren't scary-looking guys, so it didn't keep anyone from stopping.
And they had a place to go late, when they were younger, where they
didn't have to whisper because moms and siblings were sleeping.

As they got older and had more money, they could go to all-night
restaurants, or to the apartment of kids who weren't living with
parents anymore.


Sandra

Bling Williams

I think its a whole different culture. When I was a teen I remember reading about soda fountains and bowling alleys and all night places. We had none of that and generally still don't. I wanted to go live in America!
If it were safe and H had mates to walk home with I wouldn't have a curfew. (Although most cities have them now. No unaccompanied under 15's out alone after 9pm. Horribly disrespectful in my opinion although I can see how it appeals. People don't want loud groups of teens hanging around outside their houses)
To be honest, the curfew thing has never come up. H doesn't go 'out' as such. She goes to stay at poeple's houses and comes back weeks later .If she goes into town its for the shops so its during the day.
but, if she did ask to go wandering the streets alone at night I would have to be all heavy and say no. there's too many rapes, sexual assaults and muggings in this area. Its not safe for a young girl out alone. Its not safe for me so I don't do it. If she was bussing to a friends house very late I would go with her or pay for a taxi.
Its a real shame freedom is so limited now. Although having said that, I walked 3 miles through the dark late at night when I was 17. I'd had an argument with my friends. they'd promised to walk home with me cos I had to be back at 10 but they didn't want to leave that early (disco I think) so i hd no choice (my mum's curfew actually made me at risk!). I was attacked in a churchyard i took a short cut through. Not very pleasant.
but that was the only time. Geberally life seemed safer back in the olden days.... There wasn't gun crime like there is now :-(

S

Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

On Apr 28, 2006, at 8:00 AM, Bling Williams wrote:

> If they are hanging out on the streets ith their mates the a 11
> curfew makes sense

My kids have never been just hanging out on the streets.

If a curfew makes sense to you, in your situation, in your
neighborhood, you should have one. The discussion is about how they
can be avoided, or what other options might be.

My kids used to have a friend who worked at an all-night 7:11 in a
dark neighborhood. They would drive over there and sit outside and
have the cheap fountain sodas and talk, and visit with him. He liked
it, because he wasn't alone, and the place seemed friendlier. They
weren't scary-looking guys, so it didn't keep anyone from stopping.
And they had a place to go late, when they were younger, where they
didn't have to whisper because moms and siblings were sleeping.

As they got older and had more money, they could go to all-night
restaurants, or to the apartment of kids who weren't living with
parents anymore.


Sandra



SPONSORED LINKS
Unschooling Attachment parenting John holt Parenting magazine Single parenting

---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


Visit your group "AlwaysLearning" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


---------------------------------





http://nobravery.cf.huffingtonpost.com/

www.celyn.org

---------------------------------
New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

On Apr 28, 2006, at 8:56 AM, Bling Williams wrote:

> if she did ask to go wandering the streets alone at night I would
> have to be all heavy and say no.


If you've never had a teenaged girl ask to go wandering the streets
alone at night, then it's not a good thing to bring to the list.

None of my kids have ever wanted to go wandering alone at night.

If someone would rather be out in a dangerous place than at home
doing something fun, then home is insufficiently fun and safe.

-=-I had to be back at 10 but they didn't want to leave that early
(disco I think) so i hd no choice (my mum's curfew actually made me
at risk!)-=-

I've known lots of stories of the curfew causing problems in and of
itself, not the least of which are boys promising to get the girls
home on time only IF they do this or that that they would much have
preferred not to do.

Sandra

Bling Williams

Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:


If you've never had a teenaged girl ask to go wandering the streets
alone at night, then it's not a good thing to bring to the list.

I meant walking home alone late from somewhere.


None of my kids have ever wanted to go wandering alone at night.

Maybe the whole walking thing doesn't happen over there. Did they go walking during the day? Sometimes nights are fun. I used to love it when I was younger. The lights, the darkness. its was all shivery spooky. Actually, I still do, there's soemthing about being out at night. When I went to NYC it was wild being out in the small hours. the streets were still alive and I just liked walking and looking and watching.




If someone would rather be out in a dangerous place than at home
doing something fun, then home is insufficiently fun and safe.

Bit of a blanekt statement. You can have a fun home and still want to be alone outisde.
Its just sad that streets and cities are risky now.
I am wondering if its made kids more insular and less independant and less likely to enjoy their own company. My childhood was spent lying in a field watching clouds. Today's kids seem surrounded by music and noise and people constantly. Would be interesting to see other people's opinions on the value of alone-ness/

-=-I had to be back at 10 but they didn't want to leave that early
(disco I think) so i hd no choice (my mum's curfew actually made me
at risk!)-=-

I've known lots of stories of the curfew causing problems in and of
itself, not the least of which are boys promising to get the girls
home on time only IF they do this or that that they would much have
preferred not to do.

Sandra

That was always a feature of movies! That and the petrol (gas) running out in a lonely lane. Ahem.

S


http://nobravery.cf.huffingtonpost.com/

www.celyn.org

---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail goes everywhere you do. Get it on your phone.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

On Apr 28, 2006, at 4:19 AM, bridgetvic1964 wrote:

> The question is how
> should we approach curfews?My kneejerk reaction is enroll them in Krav
> Maga and hover over them until they are 18 and then...<g>I do not want
> curfews to be an issue this time around,but I do want them
> safe.Bridget

My kids have no curfews - the concept is fuzzy for them - I mean,
they know the word, but they don't quite understand how it would
work. One of them once asked me, "So, if a kid has a curfew of
midnight, that means they're supposed to be home by midnight or they
have to leave for home at midnight or they have to call home at
midnight or what?"

They're just courteous - they keep in touch. Cell phones are pretty
wonderful for reducing mom-anxiety. They call or text message me
throughout the evening - letting me know their plans. They sometimes
stay out all night - they spend the night at other people's houses.
But they always text message me (so as not to wake me up) and say,
"Sleeping at so-and-so's." If I wake up in the night and they're not
home, I check my phone and it'll say where they are. Sometimes I call
them, if I'm wondering what their plans are.

My dh and l always let them know, too, where we are, what our plans are.

It is very much my role in the family - keeping track of everybody! I
run through it in my head throughout the day - "Okay, Cyrus is
probably at the eye doctor by now, Rosie is at karate, Roya is at the
library, Roxana is with her friend out shopping." The girls will call
me to find out where one of the other ones is, sometimes. Cyrus (my
dh) regularly asks me, "So, where is everybody right now?"

-pam



Unschooling shirts, cups, bumper stickers, bags...
Live Love Learn
UNSCHOOL!
<http://www.cafepress.com/livelovelearn>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

On Apr 28, 2006, at 7:18 AM, CelticFrau@... wrote:

>>> What do American teens do? I never saw any hanging around the
>>> street like
> you do here and couldn't figure out where they all were?<<

My own kids - go to movies a lot, hang out at bookstores that stay
open until 11, sometimes go to video arcades, go to 24-hour
restaurants in the middle of the night, hang out at friend's
apartments or houses and watch movies or play games. They go camp out
sometimes. They play pool or go bowling. My 15 year old doesn't stay
out late very often - but she goes to overnighters at friends' houses
and occasionally there are parties at kids' houses that last late. Oh
- and LAN parties where big groups play video games for hours and
hours. My 18 yo went to a dance club last weekend and then spent the
night at a friends' house. Rosie (15) does karate a lot - two nights
a week she's at karate until about 9 pm and there are extra nights of
karate at least a few nights per month. And she has soccer practice
two evenings a week. Roxana is almost always in a show - so she has
rehearsals almost every night until 10 or 11 pm and then castmembers
will go get something to eat after that.

When we're all home together, everybody is really pleased that it
happened and we usually watch something we've taped, that we all like
to watch together - lately it is "LOST." Or, we play cards or games.
Oh, and we have extended family that lives close (my two sisters and
their families) - Roya goes to my sister's house at least once a week
and spends an evening hanging out with her - they watch Gilmore Girls
and just hang out together - sometimes have a craft project or
something to work on. Roya goes to a gym to work out with her cousin
some evenings. They all go to concerts once in a while - occasionally
a big one, but mostly little things at local colleges. And - they go
to shows - lots of youth or community theater productions and an
occasional big production (RENT is coming in July).

And, we have Disneyland passes - it costs $129 per year for the
cheapest pass and that leaves the summer and weekends blacked out --
but it still has LOTS of days and evenings that groups of teens can
go there and have a blast. There were some of us who went there just
this week and spent half a day. It is really nice for them to be able
to meet there and hang out - go on a few rides and watch a show or
two. The waiting in line time is fun for them - it is "hanging out"
time - not so different than hanging out on a street corner just
talking. The difference is that these kids LIKE the unschooling
parents - it is okay with them if we hang out, too. We have fun
together.

-pam

Unschooling shirts, cups, bumper stickers, bags...
Live Love Learn
UNSCHOOL!
<http://www.cafepress.com/livelovelearn>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Nancy Wooton

On Apr 28, 2006, at 10:34 AM, Pamela Sorooshian wrote:

> My kids have no curfews - the concept is fuzzy for them - I mean,
> they know the word, but they don't quite understand how it would
> work. One of them once asked me, "So, if a kid has a curfew of
> midnight, that means they're supposed to be home by midnight or they
> have to leave for home at midnight or they have to call home at
> midnight or what?"
>

So your city doesn't have a curfew for under-18's? San Diego does. I
let Alex go out on a weeknight with an 18 y.o. friend with a car, and
suddenly realized, when he called after 10 p.m. and they were still out
in public, not at their other friend's house, that he could get busted.
Kids have to be at home or on their way home by 10.

Nancy

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/28/2006 1:26:25 PM Central Daylight Time,
nancywooton@... writes:

So your city doesn't have a curfew for under-18's? San Diego does. I
let Alex go out on a weeknight with an 18 y.o. friend with a car, and
suddenly realized, when he called after 10 p.m. and they were still out
in public, not at their other friend's house, that he could get busted.
Kids have to be at home or on their way home by 10.


Same here. Only our curfew for the city is 9 during the week which is also
the time when you can get tickets for also violating the noise ordinance
nothing above 70 dcp i think. Weekends it's 11. And to be out during those times
you have to be with someone over 21.

~Alyssa
Slightly crunchy, unschooling Mom to Landen(2 1/2) and Gage(6 months)

"Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, and
dance like you do when nobody's watching."



(http://lilypie.com/)

(http://lilypie.com/)




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

On Apr 28, 2006, at 11:25 AM, Nancy Wooton wrote:

> So your city doesn't have a curfew for under-18's? San Diego does. I
> let Alex go out on a weeknight with an 18 y.o. friend with a car, and
> suddenly realized, when he called after 10 p.m. and they were still
> out
> in public, not at their other friend's house, that he could get
> busted.
> Kids have to be at home or on their way home by 10.

Are you sure that isn't a loitering law and people refer to it as a
curfew?

I know some courts have ruled that actual curfews are not legal.
Maybe yours hasn't been tested in court, though.

-pam

Unschooling shirts, cups, bumper stickers, bags...
Live Love Learn
UNSCHOOL!
<http://www.cafepress.com/livelovelearn>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/28/2006 1:34:51 PM Central Daylight Time,
pamsoroosh@... writes:

Are you sure that isn't a loitering law and people refer to it as a
curfew?

I know some courts have ruled that actual curfews are not legal.
Maybe yours hasn't been tested in court, though.


nope it's a curfew. I was ticketed as a kid for being out past 11 on a
weekend. It was $100 although i have heard it has gone up since.

~Alyssa
Slightly crunchy, unschooling Mom to Landen(2 1/2) and Gage(6 months)

"Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, and
dance like you do when nobody's watching."



(http://lilypie.com/)

(http://lilypie.com/)

Together a Lifetime
(http://daisypath.com/)



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/28/2006 1:47:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
SquishyMommy1@... writes:

Are you sure that isn't a loitering law and people refer to it as a
curfew?

I know some courts have ruled that actual curfews are not legal.
Maybe yours hasn't been tested in court, though.


nope it's a curfew. I was ticketed as a kid for being out past 11 on a
weekend. It was $100 although i have heard it has gone up since.



To add to this i just went back over our curfew law in our town and the
police no longer issue you a ticket if you are walking but you are put in the
back of the squad and escorted back to your house. But if you are driving you
will get slapped with a HUGE fine and maybe your license suspended. During
the hours between 11p and 6a on the weekdays and 12a and 6a on the weekends
licenses and insurance coverage become void for people under 17, so if you are
driving during those hours and you are under 17 and you get pulled over you
have no license or insurance and are then driven back to your house and issued
a court date where the judge will fine you or even take your license away. So
that is where they get you.

~Alyssa
Slightly crunchy, unschooling Mom to Landen(2 1/2) and Gage(6 months)

"Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, and
dance like you do when nobody's watching."



(http://lilypie.com/)

(http://lilypie.com/)

Together a Lifetime
(http://daisypath.com/)



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Nancy Wooton

On Apr 28, 2006, at 7:11 AM, Bling Williams wrote:

> What do American teens do? I never saw any hanging around the street
> like you do here and couldn't figure out where they all were?

Homework. They're all doing homework.

<g> Nancy

Nancy Wooton

On Apr 28, 2006, at 11:32 AM, Pamela Sorooshian wrote:

>
> On Apr 28, 2006, at 11:25 AM, Nancy Wooton wrote:
>
>> So your city doesn't have a curfew for under-18's? San Diego does. I
>> let Alex go out on a weeknight with an 18 y.o. friend with a car, and
>> suddenly realized, when he called after 10 p.m. and they were still
>> out
>> in public, not at their other friend's house, that he could get
>> busted.
>> Kids have to be at home or on their way home by 10.
>
> Are you sure that isn't a loitering law and people refer to it as a
> curfew?
>
> I know some courts have ruled that actual curfews are not legal.
> Maybe yours hasn't been tested in court, though.
>

I'll have to look into the nighttime curfew, as I'm not sure if it's a
loitering law or not; San Diego *does* have a daytime curfew for
under-18's, too. No one under 18 can be out during school hours
without a parent or a note from a school. They have to be going to or
from school or to or from work. One thing about San Diego schools,
though, is that there are many on different schedule tracks, so kids
are often around and are legitimately out of school.

Nancy

[email protected]

Thank you, Nancy! I laughed 'til tea came out my nose! <g>

~Kelly, still giggling

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org

-----Original Message-----
From: Nancy Wooton <nancywooton@...>

> What do American teens do? I never saw any hanging around the
street
> like you do here and couldn't figure out where they all were?

Homework. They're all doing homework.

<g> Nancy

Sandra Dodd

On Apr 28, 2006, at 12:25 PM, Nancy Wooton wrote:

> So your city doesn't have a curfew for under-18's? San Diego does.


Ours doesn't.
The town I grew up in had 10:30.

There are driving rules, depending on the kids' licenses. Both Kirby
and Marty have full licenses now, but during the provisional days,
they can't drive after midnight or have more than one unrelated minor
in the car. Kirby had a letter from work so he would've been okay
between there and our house after midnight on the nights he was
closing up.

Sandra

queenjane555

>What do American teens do? I never saw any hanging around the
>street like you do here and couldn't figure out where they all were?


They go to Dennys! Around here at least...its a 24 hr restaurant.
Seamus and i often hang out there after midnight, and i swear the
same kids are there from when *I* was in high school. I was talking
to one of the waitresses, commenting on whether she got good tips
from the kids or not (it varies, she says), and whether it bugs her
to have so many kids to wait on, and she said, no, they are usually
pretty nice to her and its better that they are hanging out there
having coffee than out on the streets possibly getting into trouble.

My mom used to not want me out late Thursday nights, because "all
the drunks are out on the road"...its payday for the factories
around here. But i never had a curfew (she just wanted us to call if
we'd be late), her motto was "there isnt anything you can do after
midnight you can't do before", and none of us ever got into any
trouble.

Interestingly enough, never *once* have we been asked by the staff
at Dennys why Seamus is out so late on a "school night."


Katherine