[AlwaysLearning] Help! Lazy Teen?
Nanci Kuykendall
Our 19 year old Nicole (will be 20 in spring) seems to
be lazy, or depressed or something. She is fairly
non-communicative, even when asked direct questions,
so it's hard for us to know what's going on with her
inside.
She wants to be treated as an adult but is overly
sensative and emotional and difficult to talk to about
things and doesn't act as a responsible adult. She
had moved out and lived with a boyfriend for a while,
but has been back home about a year.
She doesn't have any friends or any social life
outside of online and her cell phone, all long
distance people mainly met online. She did an
independent study highschool in California (We're in
WA, she's actually my neice) and accellerated herself
to graduate early (at 16) so that she could move up
here and be with us. She had been with us part time
until then.
Nicole spends long hours at night on the computer
playing online games with people, until about 4 in the
morning. She seems addicted to them to me. She also
spends long hours during the day on her cell phone
talking mostly to a guy she met online (27yrs) who
lives in Texas. He came and visited her here last
month for about a week, and she's been having a long
distance relationships with him for about a year now.
She won't take the public transit despite much urging
and encouragement from us. So her grandparents bought
her a used car but despite our encouragement she's
shown little interest in learning to drive it. She
had high honors in school and that combined with being
low income and minority makes her elligible for grants
for school if she chooses to go to college but
although she's looked into the local schools a little,
she has not persued that option. She has had one job
interview and that was one I initiated for her (not to
push her, I just circumstantially stumbled upon an
unadvertised position with someone I know that seemed
perfect for Nicole, who had said when asked that she
was interested in getting a job, so I put them in
touch with each other.) She shows no interest in
moving out and getting her own place either. She
absolutely not interested in moving to Texas either,
but would like to move her guy here to live in her
cabin with her when it's completed. He's currently
unemployed, having been fired from a gas station store
job, and lives with his mother and brother. In his
defense, he is a really nice guy, but lacking in
ambition and self confidence.
She doesn't do much of anything around the house, just
her own laundry and some of her own cooking. She
doesn't usually clean up after she cooks or eats.
Dishes are suposed to be her main chore, because I
have psoriasis in my hands and it's something I can't
do much of. She chose dishes and claimed to enjoy
doing them, but she complains about doing the dishes,
and only does them once or twice a week, forcing Tom
and I to tackle the piles out of desperation the rest
of the time, which is at least twice a day. I've
tried making a general list of other chores that need
done and asking her to pick some things off of it to
do, but that didn't work either.
We got her two cats (which she desperately wanted) and
all their accoutrements and pay for vet and food for
them, but she has to be asked to change the litterbox
when it stinks. She also knows we are extremely tight
financially but she has never offered to give up her
online games, which have monthly fees which we pay, or
to give up other treats we buy for her (like drinking
soda) to offset the cost of her game. We give her
pocket money to spend whenever we can afford to, and
often get her little things (food treats, or other
personal items) just as we do with the younger kids.
Her bedroom must be a public room during the day, as
we live in a very small space, and we made an 8pm
cerfew for her room for everyone else to get out so
that she could have it to herself in the evenings.
The computers are in her room, as well as my sewing
things and my writing desk and other things we need
access to, yet she doesn't rise and leave her room
until 12-2pm each day. She will also often go into
her room periodically between those times (2 and 8pm)
and shut the door to talk on her phone or be alone for
a while. She knew when she moved here that we had
very little space but were happy to share what we had,
however now she seems to want to have that room all to
herself, all the time, despite anyone else's needs.
She also seems to avoid spending time with us, playing
games or talking or being social with us, (unless
there is a power outage and she can't use the
computer) and when she sits at the table in the
kitchen coloring/drawing or reading or doing a puzzle
or something she puts on headphones and hides her face
with her hair.
Thomas is celebrating his 9th birthday this Thursday
and two families who are friends of ours are coming
over for a suppertime small party. That's three extra
kids and two extra adults. She asked if she could
lock herself in her room and make it off limits to the
kids while that was ongoing. Not only did she not
want to participate and be here for a family birthday
party, but she wanted to make one of the 4 rooms in
the house (not counting the bathroom there's the
kitchin, living room, and two bedrooms) unavailable
while we had extra people in the house. We were
anticipating being able to split the kids up to play
if needed with some of them playing computer games in
that room if they wnated to. While I was explaining
the difficulty of this and why it didn't seem a good
idea to do that, she interrupted to say angrily "I
knew it wouldn't be alright. Tom can you take me to
the library at that time?"
We have been building her a studio cabin so that she
can have a little place of her own and we can all have
more space and privacy until out main house is built,
but although she's excited about it, she's done very
little work on it herself and has left it mainly to
us, despite much encouragement from us. We live in a
two bedroom single wide right now and Tom and I gave
her our bedroom when she moved here at 16. We sleep
on a loft we built in the room with the boys.
We're going to try to sit down and talk to her (again)
tonight about some of the things that have been
bothering us. I guess I partly needed to vent and
partly to ask the advice of an unschooling crowd on
this matter. I can easily get the standard kind of
disrespectful parenting advice, but I'm wondering what
to do about this situation from an unschooly point of
view and looking for advice from the good minds here.
We don't want to drive her away. We're feeling taken
advantage of.
Nanci K.
be lazy, or depressed or something. She is fairly
non-communicative, even when asked direct questions,
so it's hard for us to know what's going on with her
inside.
She wants to be treated as an adult but is overly
sensative and emotional and difficult to talk to about
things and doesn't act as a responsible adult. She
had moved out and lived with a boyfriend for a while,
but has been back home about a year.
She doesn't have any friends or any social life
outside of online and her cell phone, all long
distance people mainly met online. She did an
independent study highschool in California (We're in
WA, she's actually my neice) and accellerated herself
to graduate early (at 16) so that she could move up
here and be with us. She had been with us part time
until then.
Nicole spends long hours at night on the computer
playing online games with people, until about 4 in the
morning. She seems addicted to them to me. She also
spends long hours during the day on her cell phone
talking mostly to a guy she met online (27yrs) who
lives in Texas. He came and visited her here last
month for about a week, and she's been having a long
distance relationships with him for about a year now.
She won't take the public transit despite much urging
and encouragement from us. So her grandparents bought
her a used car but despite our encouragement she's
shown little interest in learning to drive it. She
had high honors in school and that combined with being
low income and minority makes her elligible for grants
for school if she chooses to go to college but
although she's looked into the local schools a little,
she has not persued that option. She has had one job
interview and that was one I initiated for her (not to
push her, I just circumstantially stumbled upon an
unadvertised position with someone I know that seemed
perfect for Nicole, who had said when asked that she
was interested in getting a job, so I put them in
touch with each other.) She shows no interest in
moving out and getting her own place either. She
absolutely not interested in moving to Texas either,
but would like to move her guy here to live in her
cabin with her when it's completed. He's currently
unemployed, having been fired from a gas station store
job, and lives with his mother and brother. In his
defense, he is a really nice guy, but lacking in
ambition and self confidence.
She doesn't do much of anything around the house, just
her own laundry and some of her own cooking. She
doesn't usually clean up after she cooks or eats.
Dishes are suposed to be her main chore, because I
have psoriasis in my hands and it's something I can't
do much of. She chose dishes and claimed to enjoy
doing them, but she complains about doing the dishes,
and only does them once or twice a week, forcing Tom
and I to tackle the piles out of desperation the rest
of the time, which is at least twice a day. I've
tried making a general list of other chores that need
done and asking her to pick some things off of it to
do, but that didn't work either.
We got her two cats (which she desperately wanted) and
all their accoutrements and pay for vet and food for
them, but she has to be asked to change the litterbox
when it stinks. She also knows we are extremely tight
financially but she has never offered to give up her
online games, which have monthly fees which we pay, or
to give up other treats we buy for her (like drinking
soda) to offset the cost of her game. We give her
pocket money to spend whenever we can afford to, and
often get her little things (food treats, or other
personal items) just as we do with the younger kids.
Her bedroom must be a public room during the day, as
we live in a very small space, and we made an 8pm
cerfew for her room for everyone else to get out so
that she could have it to herself in the evenings.
The computers are in her room, as well as my sewing
things and my writing desk and other things we need
access to, yet she doesn't rise and leave her room
until 12-2pm each day. She will also often go into
her room periodically between those times (2 and 8pm)
and shut the door to talk on her phone or be alone for
a while. She knew when she moved here that we had
very little space but were happy to share what we had,
however now she seems to want to have that room all to
herself, all the time, despite anyone else's needs.
She also seems to avoid spending time with us, playing
games or talking or being social with us, (unless
there is a power outage and she can't use the
computer) and when she sits at the table in the
kitchen coloring/drawing or reading or doing a puzzle
or something she puts on headphones and hides her face
with her hair.
Thomas is celebrating his 9th birthday this Thursday
and two families who are friends of ours are coming
over for a suppertime small party. That's three extra
kids and two extra adults. She asked if she could
lock herself in her room and make it off limits to the
kids while that was ongoing. Not only did she not
want to participate and be here for a family birthday
party, but she wanted to make one of the 4 rooms in
the house (not counting the bathroom there's the
kitchin, living room, and two bedrooms) unavailable
while we had extra people in the house. We were
anticipating being able to split the kids up to play
if needed with some of them playing computer games in
that room if they wnated to. While I was explaining
the difficulty of this and why it didn't seem a good
idea to do that, she interrupted to say angrily "I
knew it wouldn't be alright. Tom can you take me to
the library at that time?"
We have been building her a studio cabin so that she
can have a little place of her own and we can all have
more space and privacy until out main house is built,
but although she's excited about it, she's done very
little work on it herself and has left it mainly to
us, despite much encouragement from us. We live in a
two bedroom single wide right now and Tom and I gave
her our bedroom when she moved here at 16. We sleep
on a loft we built in the room with the boys.
We're going to try to sit down and talk to her (again)
tonight about some of the things that have been
bothering us. I guess I partly needed to vent and
partly to ask the advice of an unschooling crowd on
this matter. I can easily get the standard kind of
disrespectful parenting advice, but I'm wondering what
to do about this situation from an unschooly point of
view and looking for advice from the good minds here.
We don't want to drive her away. We're feeling taken
advantage of.
Nanci K.
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/27/2005 6:03:52 PM Central Standard Time,
aisliin@... writes:
She also knows we are extremely tight
financially but she has never offered to give up her
online games, which have monthly fees which we pay, or
to give up other treats we buy for her (like drinking
soda) to offset the cost of her game. We give her
pocket money to spend whenever we can afford to, and
often get her little things (food treats, or other
personal items) just as we do with the younger kids.
~~~
You're being too nice to her.
I have a similar situation wrt an adult child living at home again. Jon and
his girlfriend Abby are staying in my studio, but I have to insist that they
both work jobs and give me money out of every check, to pay back some money
they owe me.
They are free to go at any time, being adults and all, but they choose to
stay. They stay knowing that if they don't get up for work on time I will wake
them. If they call in sick and I don't see evidence of illness they know
that I will ask them about it. They know that as long as they owe me money and
are working to pay me back that I'll be happy to have them around and help
them make good decisions and lend my tools to work on their cars and I'll wash
towels and cook supper and invite them to eat, and let them put stuff in my
fridge.
When my son came back I woke him up every day, cheerfully, and showed him
the help wanted ads that I had seen that day. I reassured him that I was going
to let him sleep and sleep and sleep all he wanted--between shifts. I let
him know that what I cook he's free to eat and if there's something he wants
from the grocery that I'll keep it stocked. But he's going to have to work,
or look for work.
They're free to leave any time they want. They choose to stay because they
know it's the quickest way to pay the money back and they don't want to owe
it. They want to be independent again and move to Florida near her family,
where they both have jobs waiting.
But still I have to wake them up 2 or 3 times a week, and I'm not going to
keep quiet when they call in sick and I know they're not sick. They're
lacking in maturity and self-motivation in some ways. They'd rather do the fun
things than the hard things. I understand. I was like that, too. But if I
thought they were taking advantage of me, I'd ask them to leave.
I keep imagining them as good friends who are hard on their luck. Would I
ask Steve and Stacy to leave if they were taking advantage of me? Yes. Would
I wake up Steve and Stacy if I knew they had to be at work by 8 and it was
7:30 already? Yes. Would I cook food and stock their favorites? Yes, but
only if they were working.
I don't think I'd treat my son this way if he had not already left home.
Our family has made large adjustments to being just 3 of us, and it is an
adjustment to put someone back in the mix (two someones, one we didn't know well).
I've made mention to others that it seems they both need a little more
"browning in the oven" before they can be out on their own again, and I'm willing
to do that for them. But they have to do all the rising themselves.
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
aisliin@... writes:
She also knows we are extremely tight
financially but she has never offered to give up her
online games, which have monthly fees which we pay, or
to give up other treats we buy for her (like drinking
soda) to offset the cost of her game. We give her
pocket money to spend whenever we can afford to, and
often get her little things (food treats, or other
personal items) just as we do with the younger kids.
~~~
You're being too nice to her.
I have a similar situation wrt an adult child living at home again. Jon and
his girlfriend Abby are staying in my studio, but I have to insist that they
both work jobs and give me money out of every check, to pay back some money
they owe me.
They are free to go at any time, being adults and all, but they choose to
stay. They stay knowing that if they don't get up for work on time I will wake
them. If they call in sick and I don't see evidence of illness they know
that I will ask them about it. They know that as long as they owe me money and
are working to pay me back that I'll be happy to have them around and help
them make good decisions and lend my tools to work on their cars and I'll wash
towels and cook supper and invite them to eat, and let them put stuff in my
fridge.
When my son came back I woke him up every day, cheerfully, and showed him
the help wanted ads that I had seen that day. I reassured him that I was going
to let him sleep and sleep and sleep all he wanted--between shifts. I let
him know that what I cook he's free to eat and if there's something he wants
from the grocery that I'll keep it stocked. But he's going to have to work,
or look for work.
They're free to leave any time they want. They choose to stay because they
know it's the quickest way to pay the money back and they don't want to owe
it. They want to be independent again and move to Florida near her family,
where they both have jobs waiting.
But still I have to wake them up 2 or 3 times a week, and I'm not going to
keep quiet when they call in sick and I know they're not sick. They're
lacking in maturity and self-motivation in some ways. They'd rather do the fun
things than the hard things. I understand. I was like that, too. But if I
thought they were taking advantage of me, I'd ask them to leave.
I keep imagining them as good friends who are hard on their luck. Would I
ask Steve and Stacy to leave if they were taking advantage of me? Yes. Would
I wake up Steve and Stacy if I knew they had to be at work by 8 and it was
7:30 already? Yes. Would I cook food and stock their favorites? Yes, but
only if they were working.
I don't think I'd treat my son this way if he had not already left home.
Our family has made large adjustments to being just 3 of us, and it is an
adjustment to put someone back in the mix (two someones, one we didn't know well).
I've made mention to others that it seems they both need a little more
"browning in the oven" before they can be out on their own again, and I'm willing
to do that for them. But they have to do all the rising themselves.
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
On Dec 27, 2005, at 5:03 PM, Nanci Kuykendall wrote:
-=- (We're in
WA, she's actually my neice) and accellerated herself
to graduate early (at 16) so that she could move up
here and be with us. She had been with us part time
until then. -=-
If she wasn't unschooled, it's not really an unschooling question. I
can see wanting the advice of this group, but I wanted to clarify for
anyone who might have read it quickly that this is NOT about an
unschooler, and not about a teen who's the age of compulsory
schooling, either.
Lots of 19 year olds feel lost. You could press her to get a job.
You could ask her to do chores before playing video games. Is it her
computer or yours? It's one thing to do dishes for your own child
and share a computer with your own child, but with a legal adult who
has asked to come and live with you, you can easily ask for services
and assistance in return.
Is she depressed? If you enable her, what will inspire her to get
help or to find cheer?
-=-She doesn't have any friends or any social life
outside of online and her cell phone, all long
distance people mainly met online. -=-
Are you paying for the phone calls? That's no good if so.
Tell her to use IM instead of phone, if you're paying for it.
-=-So her grandparents bought
her a used car but despite our encouragement she's
shown little interest in learning to drive it.-=-
Do you take her out to drive. Does she need to take driver's ed
where you are? Might she want to anyway? She might have fun there,
meeting people.
-=-She chose dishes and claimed to enjoy
doing them, but she complains about doing the dishes,
and only does them once or twice a week, forcing Tom
and I to tackle the piles out of desperation the rest
of the time, which is at least twice a day. I've
tried making a general list of other chores that need
done and asking her to pick some things off of it to
do, but that didn't work either.
-=-
You could say "You're not fulfilling your contract; it's the same as
not paying your rent. You can only stay here if you do what you
agreed to do. We need more help, or we'd like for you to move."
She's not your daughter. She's not your responsibility. Will her
parents help you pay for this stuff?
-=-The computers are in her room, as well as my sewing
things and my writing desk and other things we need
access to, yet she doesn't rise and leave her room
until 12-2pm each day.-=-
It's not "her room," if your computer and desk are there. I wouldn't
go along with what you're going along with if it were me. Let her
find some out of the way corner to sleep in if she wants to sleep late.
-=-Thomas is celebrating his 9th birthday this Thursday
and two families who are friends of ours are coming
over for a suppertime small party. That's three extra
kids and two extra adults. She asked if she could
lock herself in her room and make it off limits to the
kids while that was ongoing-=-
I hope you said no, no way. His 9th birthday won't come again. She
can either be at the party or be out of the house.
You're sacrificing your own peace and your family's peace for someone
else's convenience, and that's not healthy. You're not defending
your own space and doing your own duty by you immediate family. She
seems to outrank your own kids. That's not good.
Sandra
April
Quite honestly, I wouldn't allow myself or my family to be treated in this
way. I'm all for helping people out. We've had adults of varying ages living
with us for different amounts of time and for a variety of reasons. Some
were family, some were not. It wouldn't matter. I like to help people out,
but I expect to be treated with respect in return. I don't know Nicole,
whether she is just taking advantage of you or if she is depressed or has
some other problem. It wouldn't matter to me, I would still expect respect
and contribution to the family. And if an adult is living in my home, they
better have a job of some kind or at least be contributing to the welfare
and upkeep of the family. If she needs help, I would do what I could to
help her access the help she needs. If she was unwilling to be a part of the
family and contribute in some way, then I would have her find some other
place to live. I don't mean any of this in a mean way. But it really is not
fair to the family and letting her live like this really isn't doing her any
favors.
~April
Mom to Kate-19, Lisa-16, Karl-14, & Ben-10.
*REACH Homeschool Grp, an inclusive group in Oakland County
<http://www.reachhomeschool.com> www.reachhomeschool.com
* Michigan Unschoolers
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/michigan_unschoolers/>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/michigan_unschoolers/
*Check out Chuck's art <http://www.artkunst23.com> www.artkunst23.com
"All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf the Grey
_____
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Nanci Kuykendall
Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 7:03 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Help! Lazy Teen?
Our 19 year old Nicole (will be 20 in spring) seems to
be lazy, or depressed or something. She is fairly
non-communicative, even when asked direct questions,
so it's hard for us to know what's going on with her
inside.
She wants to be treated as an adult but is overly
sensative and emotional and difficult to talk to about
things and doesn't act as a responsible adult. She
had moved out and lived with a boyfriend for a while,
but has been back home about a year.
She doesn't have any friends or any social life
outside of online and her cell phone, all long
distance people mainly met online. She did an
independent study highschool in California (We're in
WA, she's actually my neice) and accellerated herself
to graduate early (at 16) so that she could move up
here and be with us. She had been with us part time
until then.
Nicole spends long hours at night on the computer
playing online games with people, until about 4 in the
morning. She seems addicted to them to me. She also
spends long hours during the day on her cell phone
talking mostly to a guy she met online (27yrs) who
lives in Texas. He came and visited her here last
month for about a week, and she's been having a long
distance relationships with him for about a year now.
She won't take the public transit despite much urging
and encouragement from us. So her grandparents bought
her a used car but despite our encouragement she's
shown little interest in learning to drive it. She
had high honors in school and that combined with being
low income and minority makes her elligible for grants
for school if she chooses to go to college but
although she's looked into the local schools a little,
she has not persued that option. She has had one job
interview and that was one I initiated for her (not to
push her, I just circumstantially stumbled upon an
unadvertised position with someone I know that seemed
perfect for Nicole, who had said when asked that she
was interested in getting a job, so I put them in
touch with each other.) She shows no interest in
moving out and getting her own place either. She
absolutely not interested in moving to Texas either,
but would like to move her guy here to live in her
cabin with her when it's completed. He's currently
unemployed, having been fired from a gas station store
job, and lives with his mother and brother. In his
defense, he is a really nice guy, but lacking in
ambition and self confidence.
She doesn't do much of anything around the house, just
her own laundry and some of her own cooking. She
doesn't usually clean up after she cooks or eats.
Dishes are suposed to be her main chore, because I
have psoriasis in my hands and it's something I can't
do much of. She chose dishes and claimed to enjoy
doing them, but she complains about doing the dishes,
and only does them once or twice a week, forcing Tom
and I to tackle the piles out of desperation the rest
of the time, which is at least twice a day. I've
tried making a general list of other chores that need
done and asking her to pick some things off of it to
do, but that didn't work either.
We got her two cats (which she desperately wanted) and
all their accoutrements and pay for vet and food for
them, but she has to be asked to change the litterbox
when it stinks. She also knows we are extremely tight
financially but she has never offered to give up her
online games, which have monthly fees which we pay, or
to give up other treats we buy for her (like drinking
soda) to offset the cost of her game. We give her
pocket money to spend whenever we can afford to, and
often get her little things (food treats, or other
personal items) just as we do with the younger kids.
Her bedroom must be a public room during the day, as
we live in a very small space, and we made an 8pm
cerfew for her room for everyone else to get out so
that she could have it to herself in the evenings.
The computers are in her room, as well as my sewing
things and my writing desk and other things we need
access to, yet she doesn't rise and leave her room
until 12-2pm each day. She will also often go into
her room periodically between those times (2 and 8pm)
and shut the door to talk on her phone or be alone for
a while. She knew when she moved here that we had
very little space but were happy to share what we had,
however now she seems to want to have that room all to
herself, all the time, despite anyone else's needs.
She also seems to avoid spending time with us, playing
games or talking or being social with us, (unless
there is a power outage and she can't use the
computer) and when she sits at the table in the
kitchen coloring/drawing or reading or doing a puzzle
or something she puts on headphones and hides her face
with her hair.
Thomas is celebrating his 9th birthday this Thursday
and two families who are friends of ours are coming
over for a suppertime small party. That's three extra
kids and two extra adults. She asked if she could
lock herself in her room and make it off limits to the
kids while that was ongoing. Not only did she not
want to participate and be here for a family birthday
party, but she wanted to make one of the 4 rooms in
the house (not counting the bathroom there's the
kitchin, living room, and two bedrooms) unavailable
while we had extra people in the house. We were
anticipating being able to split the kids up to play
if needed with some of them playing computer games in
that room if they wnated to. While I was explaining
the difficulty of this and why it didn't seem a good
idea to do that, she interrupted to say angrily "I
knew it wouldn't be alright. Tom can you take me to
the library at that time?"
We have been building her a studio cabin so that she
can have a little place of her own and we can all have
more space and privacy until out main house is built,
but although she's excited about it, she's done very
little work on it herself and has left it mainly to
us, despite much encouragement from us. We live in a
two bedroom single wide right now and Tom and I gave
her our bedroom when she moved here at 16. We sleep
on a loft we built in the room with the boys.
We're going to try to sit down and talk to her (again)
tonight about some of the things that have been
bothering us. I guess I partly needed to vent and
partly to ask the advice of an unschooling crowd on
this matter. I can easily get the standard kind of
disrespectful parenting advice, but I'm wondering what
to do about this situation from an unschooly point of
view and looking for advice from the good minds here.
We don't want to drive her away. We're feeling taken
advantage of.
Nanci K.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
way. I'm all for helping people out. We've had adults of varying ages living
with us for different amounts of time and for a variety of reasons. Some
were family, some were not. It wouldn't matter. I like to help people out,
but I expect to be treated with respect in return. I don't know Nicole,
whether she is just taking advantage of you or if she is depressed or has
some other problem. It wouldn't matter to me, I would still expect respect
and contribution to the family. And if an adult is living in my home, they
better have a job of some kind or at least be contributing to the welfare
and upkeep of the family. If she needs help, I would do what I could to
help her access the help she needs. If she was unwilling to be a part of the
family and contribute in some way, then I would have her find some other
place to live. I don't mean any of this in a mean way. But it really is not
fair to the family and letting her live like this really isn't doing her any
favors.
~April
Mom to Kate-19, Lisa-16, Karl-14, & Ben-10.
*REACH Homeschool Grp, an inclusive group in Oakland County
<http://www.reachhomeschool.com> www.reachhomeschool.com
* Michigan Unschoolers
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/michigan_unschoolers/>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/michigan_unschoolers/
*Check out Chuck's art <http://www.artkunst23.com> www.artkunst23.com
"All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf the Grey
_____
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Nanci Kuykendall
Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 7:03 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Help! Lazy Teen?
Our 19 year old Nicole (will be 20 in spring) seems to
be lazy, or depressed or something. She is fairly
non-communicative, even when asked direct questions,
so it's hard for us to know what's going on with her
inside.
She wants to be treated as an adult but is overly
sensative and emotional and difficult to talk to about
things and doesn't act as a responsible adult. She
had moved out and lived with a boyfriend for a while,
but has been back home about a year.
She doesn't have any friends or any social life
outside of online and her cell phone, all long
distance people mainly met online. She did an
independent study highschool in California (We're in
WA, she's actually my neice) and accellerated herself
to graduate early (at 16) so that she could move up
here and be with us. She had been with us part time
until then.
Nicole spends long hours at night on the computer
playing online games with people, until about 4 in the
morning. She seems addicted to them to me. She also
spends long hours during the day on her cell phone
talking mostly to a guy she met online (27yrs) who
lives in Texas. He came and visited her here last
month for about a week, and she's been having a long
distance relationships with him for about a year now.
She won't take the public transit despite much urging
and encouragement from us. So her grandparents bought
her a used car but despite our encouragement she's
shown little interest in learning to drive it. She
had high honors in school and that combined with being
low income and minority makes her elligible for grants
for school if she chooses to go to college but
although she's looked into the local schools a little,
she has not persued that option. She has had one job
interview and that was one I initiated for her (not to
push her, I just circumstantially stumbled upon an
unadvertised position with someone I know that seemed
perfect for Nicole, who had said when asked that she
was interested in getting a job, so I put them in
touch with each other.) She shows no interest in
moving out and getting her own place either. She
absolutely not interested in moving to Texas either,
but would like to move her guy here to live in her
cabin with her when it's completed. He's currently
unemployed, having been fired from a gas station store
job, and lives with his mother and brother. In his
defense, he is a really nice guy, but lacking in
ambition and self confidence.
She doesn't do much of anything around the house, just
her own laundry and some of her own cooking. She
doesn't usually clean up after she cooks or eats.
Dishes are suposed to be her main chore, because I
have psoriasis in my hands and it's something I can't
do much of. She chose dishes and claimed to enjoy
doing them, but she complains about doing the dishes,
and only does them once or twice a week, forcing Tom
and I to tackle the piles out of desperation the rest
of the time, which is at least twice a day. I've
tried making a general list of other chores that need
done and asking her to pick some things off of it to
do, but that didn't work either.
We got her two cats (which she desperately wanted) and
all their accoutrements and pay for vet and food for
them, but she has to be asked to change the litterbox
when it stinks. She also knows we are extremely tight
financially but she has never offered to give up her
online games, which have monthly fees which we pay, or
to give up other treats we buy for her (like drinking
soda) to offset the cost of her game. We give her
pocket money to spend whenever we can afford to, and
often get her little things (food treats, or other
personal items) just as we do with the younger kids.
Her bedroom must be a public room during the day, as
we live in a very small space, and we made an 8pm
cerfew for her room for everyone else to get out so
that she could have it to herself in the evenings.
The computers are in her room, as well as my sewing
things and my writing desk and other things we need
access to, yet she doesn't rise and leave her room
until 12-2pm each day. She will also often go into
her room periodically between those times (2 and 8pm)
and shut the door to talk on her phone or be alone for
a while. She knew when she moved here that we had
very little space but were happy to share what we had,
however now she seems to want to have that room all to
herself, all the time, despite anyone else's needs.
She also seems to avoid spending time with us, playing
games or talking or being social with us, (unless
there is a power outage and she can't use the
computer) and when she sits at the table in the
kitchen coloring/drawing or reading or doing a puzzle
or something she puts on headphones and hides her face
with her hair.
Thomas is celebrating his 9th birthday this Thursday
and two families who are friends of ours are coming
over for a suppertime small party. That's three extra
kids and two extra adults. She asked if she could
lock herself in her room and make it off limits to the
kids while that was ongoing. Not only did she not
want to participate and be here for a family birthday
party, but she wanted to make one of the 4 rooms in
the house (not counting the bathroom there's the
kitchin, living room, and two bedrooms) unavailable
while we had extra people in the house. We were
anticipating being able to split the kids up to play
if needed with some of them playing computer games in
that room if they wnated to. While I was explaining
the difficulty of this and why it didn't seem a good
idea to do that, she interrupted to say angrily "I
knew it wouldn't be alright. Tom can you take me to
the library at that time?"
We have been building her a studio cabin so that she
can have a little place of her own and we can all have
more space and privacy until out main house is built,
but although she's excited about it, she's done very
little work on it herself and has left it mainly to
us, despite much encouragement from us. We live in a
two bedroom single wide right now and Tom and I gave
her our bedroom when she moved here at 16. We sleep
on a loft we built in the room with the boys.
We're going to try to sit down and talk to her (again)
tonight about some of the things that have been
bothering us. I guess I partly needed to vent and
partly to ask the advice of an unschooling crowd on
this matter. I can easily get the standard kind of
disrespectful parenting advice, but I'm wondering what
to do about this situation from an unschooly point of
view and looking for advice from the good minds here.
We don't want to drive her away. We're feeling taken
advantage of.
Nanci K.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Nanci K.
>I wanted to clarify forRight, but she is a lot like my eldest child. I had her from 2-6,
> anyone who might have read it quickly that this is NOT about an
> unschooler, and not about a teen who's the age of compulsory
> schooling, either.
and then only partial time (visits) until she was 16. She was in an
independent study HS, which is different than regular school, but
that's still not Unschooling. She's been out of any kind of school
for going on 4 years now, and not had any kind of job either. Part
of that time she was living with a boyfriend.
>Is it her computer or yours?It's mine.
>It's one thing to do dishes for your own child and share aPart of the problem (as in my problem knowing just how to address
>computer with your own child, but with a legal adult who
> has asked to come and live with you, you can easily ask for
>services and assistance in return.
this) is that she is very much like my own child. She also was 16
when she came to live here full time, not an adult then. But she is
now.
> Is she depressed? If you enable her, what will inspire her toVery good point. I'll have to think on that.
>get help or to find cheer?
> Are you paying for the phone calls?Absolutely not. But we do pay for a cell phone and she calls, or
they call her, during her free time on that phone. The cell phone
is on contract (so can't stop paying for it without big penalties
for us.)
> Do you take her out to drive.I offer, I also encourage her to schedule time with me, once I just
TOLD her I was taking her out, and she did practice driving that
time.
> Does she need to take driver's ed where you are? Might she wantI can teach her here. I did offer classes, in case she wasn't
>to anyway? She might have fun there, meeting people.
comfortable learning from me, but she said no. Classes also cost a
good deal of money we cannot really afford when there is a free
option of us teaching her.
> You could say "You're not fulfilling your contract; it's the sameIndeed I could do that.
>as not paying your rent.
>Will her parents help you pay for this stuff?LOL....no. Her parents and I have not been on speaking terms for
years. They don't have the means to help her, or the inclination.
She comes from an abusive background, and partly that was why I was
trying not to press too much. But so what? So do I (come from an
abusive background) and no one carried me like she's being carried
now.
> It's not "her room," if your computer and desk are there.We were calling it the library, or the computer room, but she
persists in calling it her room, and in teaching the boys to call it
her room.
>I wouldn't go along with what you're going along with if it wereme. Let her find some out of the way corner to sleep in if she
>wants to sleep late.She's a light sleeper (rolling my eyes.) As it is she complains
about the noise the boys make in the mornings, just being boys. I
don't bother to try to keep them quiet much, but it makes me feel
tense knowing that she's trying to sleep when they're noisy and that
she'll be irritated about it. Not that she cows me, I just don't
like the tension, and that makes me tense.
> I hope you said no, no way. His 9th birthday won't come again.We'll be talking to her about it tonight. I need to go in the other
>She can either be at the party or be out of the house.
room and talk to her now in fact.
> You're sacrificing your own peace and your family's peace fordefending your own space and doing your own duty by you immediate
>someone else's convenience, and that's not healthy. You're not
>family.She is also my immediate family. Just think of her as my oldest
child. She thinks of herself that way. It would be the same as if
I adopted her, or had shared custody of her when she was younger and
then full custody as a teen. I do agree with you though. I think
she's a lot younger developmentally than her chronological age.
Strange, but she used to be more self sufficient, more motivated and
more mature. She fought to get her own placement into that
independent study school. She used to help a lot more around here.
She seems to be regressing, and I have been thinking that being in
our safe home hads allowed her to be the carefree younger teen she
didn't get the chance to be before. She was primary caretaker for
her twin sisters, who are Thomas' age, because her parents were drug
addicts. It's gotten to the point though, where we feel it's just
all too much, and she's taking advantage of us. She wants to act
like a child now, but have adult perogatives and priveleges (sp?),
and get respect while not giving it in return.
Thank you for your thoughts.
Nanci K.
Pamela Sorooshian
"The Parent-Teen Breakthrough: A Relationship Approach," by Myra
Kirschenbaum.
And - do you have insurance so that you can get a few sessions of
counseling? She sounds depressed. Is she willing to even consider the
possibility that she's depressed? If so, maybe try St. John's Wort
right away, while you're figuring out if she can get any therapy,
etc. - it is commonly used in Europe for mild to moderate depression
and I've had really excellent experience with it.
-pam
Kirschenbaum.
And - do you have insurance so that you can get a few sessions of
counseling? She sounds depressed. Is she willing to even consider the
possibility that she's depressed? If so, maybe try St. John's Wort
right away, while you're figuring out if she can get any therapy,
etc. - it is commonly used in Europe for mild to moderate depression
and I've had really excellent experience with it.
-pam
On Dec 27, 2005, at 7:54 PM, Nanci K. wrote:
> She wants to act
> like a child now, but have adult perogatives and priveleges (sp?),
> and get respect while not giving it in return.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
On Dec 27, 2005, at 8:54 PM, Nanci K. wrote:
If it's not a question of expense, though, what's the difference
between local and long distance? If it's not costing extra, is it
just an irritation for you? Or are you just irritated because your
parents would have been irritated with you?
I know sometimes when I'm already stressed the granny/mamaw voices
can come up inside me.
Sandra
> -=-But we do pay for a cell phone and she calls, or--------------------------------------
> they call her, during her free time on that phone. The cell phone
> is on contract (so can't stop paying for it without big penalties
> for us.)-=-
If it's not a question of expense, though, what's the difference
between local and long distance? If it's not costing extra, is it
just an irritation for you? Or are you just irritated because your
parents would have been irritated with you?
I know sometimes when I'm already stressed the granny/mamaw voices
can come up inside me.
Sandra
Sandra Dodd
On Dec 27, 2005, at 8:54 PM, Nanci K. wrote:
No. If you adopted her when you already had younger kids and she
bullied them, that would not be any good either.
Custody of someone else's biological child should NOT trump the needs
of your own biological children, and I speak from the experience of
having had two cousins live with me (parents had custody) from the
time I was seven (when one came) and eight (when the second one came
to live with us).
Your obligation to your husband's children outweighs your obligation
to another person's child. She might be able to go second, but NOT
(not, not, not) first, over them.
-=-As it is she complains
about the noise the boys make in the mornings, just being boys. I
don't bother to try to keep them quiet much, but it makes me feel
tense knowing that she's trying to sleep when they're noisy and that
she'll be irritated about it. Not that she cows me, I just don't
like the tension, and that makes me tense.-=-
I'm going to boil that down to this:
complains
tense
irritated
tension
tense
You cannot reclaim this year.
You cannot keep your children young while your niece wallows in angst.
Every day your children are getting older, and you shouldn't risk
missing that because someone else's child is stretched out between
you and your children, between you and your computer, between your
son and the full enjoyment of his birthday.
Sandra
> She is also my immediate family. Just think of her as my oldest=============================
> child. She thinks of herself that way. It would be the same as if
> I adopted her, or had shared custody of her when she was younger and
> then full custody as a teen.
No. If you adopted her when you already had younger kids and she
bullied them, that would not be any good either.
Custody of someone else's biological child should NOT trump the needs
of your own biological children, and I speak from the experience of
having had two cousins live with me (parents had custody) from the
time I was seven (when one came) and eight (when the second one came
to live with us).
Your obligation to your husband's children outweighs your obligation
to another person's child. She might be able to go second, but NOT
(not, not, not) first, over them.
-=-As it is she complains
about the noise the boys make in the mornings, just being boys. I
don't bother to try to keep them quiet much, but it makes me feel
tense knowing that she's trying to sleep when they're noisy and that
she'll be irritated about it. Not that she cows me, I just don't
like the tension, and that makes me tense.-=-
I'm going to boil that down to this:
complains
tense
irritated
tension
tense
You cannot reclaim this year.
You cannot keep your children young while your niece wallows in angst.
Every day your children are getting older, and you shouldn't risk
missing that because someone else's child is stretched out between
you and your children, between you and your computer, between your
son and the full enjoyment of his birthday.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/27/2005 11:43:45 PM Central Standard Time,
Sandra@... writes:
If it's not a question of expense, though, what's the difference
between local and long distance? If it's not costing extra, is it
just an irritation for you? Or are you just irritated because your
parents would have been irritated with you?
~~~
I'd guess it's irritating because she's not working and she's not
contributing and it's obvious that the phone calls are a great motivating factor for
the her, which motivation could be used in more productive ways that don't piss
off the rest of the family.
Nanci said she's shutting the door and being snooty about her phone calls.
She just hasn't earned that kind of consideration. That's irritating.
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra@... writes:
If it's not a question of expense, though, what's the difference
between local and long distance? If it's not costing extra, is it
just an irritation for you? Or are you just irritated because your
parents would have been irritated with you?
~~~
I'd guess it's irritating because she's not working and she's not
contributing and it's obvious that the phone calls are a great motivating factor for
the her, which motivation could be used in more productive ways that don't piss
off the rest of the family.
Nanci said she's shutting the door and being snooty about her phone calls.
She just hasn't earned that kind of consideration. That's irritating.
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Michael Alexander
This is tangential, but I feel like there was a study
within the past year that concluded that St. John's
Wort actually has no effect - it's just a placebo.
(If that works, fantastic, but maybe it would be
better to find a cheaper placebo!) Worth looking into
before buying an expensive bottle of St. John's Wort.
Agreed that she sounds depressed and therapy could be
helpful; also understood about her needing to be a
child again. I and a lot of people I know, who are
also from abusive or otherwise traumatic backgrounds,
have needed that and benefitted greatly from being
able to do so, but not like Nicole's doing. There's
nothing wrong with needing to reclaim a lost
childhood, and it's probably really healthy for her to
regress to some extent and do that, but NOT at the
expense of anyone else. You and she need to find a
middle ground where she can feel safe and get her
developmental needs met but is not causing tension and
bad feeling in your family, or taking advantage of
others' kindness without doing anything herself.
Therapy could be an ideal outlet for some of her more
childlike needs, as well as helping her deal with her
depression. (Just from the little you've said about
where she's coming from, I'd sure be depressed if that
were me.)
Michael
--- Pamela Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...>
wrote:
"Most people will never know anything beyond what they see with their own two eyes."
Nightcrawler: They say you can imitate anyone? Even their voice?
Mystique [in Nightcrawler's voice]: Even their voice.
Nightcrawler: Then why not be in disguise all the time? You know? Look like everyone else?
Mystique: Because we shouldn't have to.
--all from "X2: X-Men United"
"Maybe that's all that we need, is to meet in the middle of impossibility ..."
--Indigo Girls, "Mystery"
"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best, night and day, to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight; and never stop fighting."
--e.e. cummings
"The worst loneliness is not to be comfortable with yourself."
- Mark Twain
___________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
within the past year that concluded that St. John's
Wort actually has no effect - it's just a placebo.
(If that works, fantastic, but maybe it would be
better to find a cheaper placebo!) Worth looking into
before buying an expensive bottle of St. John's Wort.
Agreed that she sounds depressed and therapy could be
helpful; also understood about her needing to be a
child again. I and a lot of people I know, who are
also from abusive or otherwise traumatic backgrounds,
have needed that and benefitted greatly from being
able to do so, but not like Nicole's doing. There's
nothing wrong with needing to reclaim a lost
childhood, and it's probably really healthy for her to
regress to some extent and do that, but NOT at the
expense of anyone else. You and she need to find a
middle ground where she can feel safe and get her
developmental needs met but is not causing tension and
bad feeling in your family, or taking advantage of
others' kindness without doing anything herself.
Therapy could be an ideal outlet for some of her more
childlike needs, as well as helping her deal with her
depression. (Just from the little you've said about
where she's coming from, I'd sure be depressed if that
were me.)
Michael
--- Pamela Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...>
wrote:
> "The Parent-Teen Breakthrough: A RelationshipApproach," by Myra
> Kirschenbaum.few sessions of
>
> And - do you have insurance so that you can get a
> counseling? She sounds depressed. Is she willing toeven consider the
> possibility that she's depressed? If so, maybe trySt. John's Wort
> right away, while you're figuring out if she can getany therapy,
> etc. - it is commonly used in Europe for mild tomoderate depression
> and I've had really excellent experience with it."Did you try not being a mutant?"
>
> -pam
"Most people will never know anything beyond what they see with their own two eyes."
Nightcrawler: They say you can imitate anyone? Even their voice?
Mystique [in Nightcrawler's voice]: Even their voice.
Nightcrawler: Then why not be in disguise all the time? You know? Look like everyone else?
Mystique: Because we shouldn't have to.
--all from "X2: X-Men United"
"Maybe that's all that we need, is to meet in the middle of impossibility ..."
--Indigo Girls, "Mystery"
"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best, night and day, to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight; and never stop fighting."
--e.e. cummings
"The worst loneliness is not to be comfortable with yourself."
- Mark Twain
___________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
[email protected]
I completely agree with Sandra and Karen. I would agree even if she were your own child. You are being taken advantage of. She has the choice to live where, how and with whom she pleases. She doesn't have the right to discount the feelings of other family members. She may not be doing it on purpose. Some people only kind of dimly perceive the world around them. Those people NEED somebody to say "Hey, bud, you just stepped over the line. We need to talk."
Julie S.---who has a dimly perceiving son <grin>
Julie S.---who has a dimly perceiving son <grin>
----- Original Message -----
From: Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
Date: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 7:54 pm
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Help! Lazy Teen?
>
> On Dec 27, 2005, at 5:03 PM, Nanci Kuykendall wrote:
>
> -=- (We're in
> WA, she's actually my neice) and accellerated herself
> to graduate early (at 16) so that she could move up
> here and be with us. She had been with us part time
> until then. -=-
>
> If she wasn't unschooled, it's not really an unschooling question.
> I
> can see wanting the advice of this group, but I wanted to clarify
> for
> anyone who might have read it quickly that this is NOT about an
> unschooler, and not about a teen who's the age of compulsory
> schooling, either.
>
> Lots of 19 year olds feel lost. You could press her to get a job.
>
> You could ask her to do chores before playing video games. Is it
> her
> computer or yours? It's one thing to do dishes for your own child
>
> and share a computer with your own child, but with a legal adult
> who
> has asked to come and live with you, you can easily ask for
> services
> and assistance in return.
>
> Is she depressed? If you enable her, what will inspire her to get
>
> help or to find cheer?
>
>
> -=-She doesn't have any friends or any social life
> outside of online and her cell phone, all long
> distance people mainly met online. -=-
>
> Are you paying for the phone calls? That's no good if so.
> Tell her to use IM instead of phone, if you're paying for it.
>
> -=-So her grandparents bought
> her a used car but despite our encouragement she's
> shown little interest in learning to drive it.-=-
>
> Do you take her out to drive. Does she need to take driver's ed
> where you are? Might she want to anyway? She might have fun
> there,
> meeting people.
>
> -=-She chose dishes and claimed to enjoy
> doing them, but she complains about doing the dishes,
> and only does them once or twice a week, forcing Tom
> and I to tackle the piles out of desperation the rest
> of the time, which is at least twice a day. I've
> tried making a general list of other chores that need
> done and asking her to pick some things off of it to
> do, but that didn't work either.
> -=-
>
> You could say "You're not fulfilling your contract; it's the same
> as
> not paying your rent. You can only stay here if you do what you
> agreed to do. We need more help, or we'd like for you to move."
>
>
>
> She's not your daughter. She's not your responsibility. Will her
>
> parents help you pay for this stuff?
>
> -=-The computers are in her room, as well as my sewing
> things and my writing desk and other things we need
> access to, yet she doesn't rise and leave her room
> until 12-2pm each day.-=-
>
> It's not "her room," if your computer and desk are there. I
> wouldn't
> go along with what you're going along with if it were me. Let her
>
> find some out of the way corner to sleep in if she wants to sleep
> late.
> -=-Thomas is celebrating his 9th birthday this Thursday
> and two families who are friends of ours are coming
> over for a suppertime small party. That's three extra
> kids and two extra adults. She asked if she could
> lock herself in her room and make it off limits to the
> kids while that was ongoing-=-
>
> I hope you said no, no way. His 9th birthday won't come again.
> She
> can either be at the party or be out of the house.
>
> You're sacrificing your own peace and your family's peace for
> someone
> else's convenience, and that's not healthy. You're not defending
> your own space and doing your own duty by you immediate family.
> She
> seems to outrank your own kids. That's not good.
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
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Kathleen Gehrke
Nancy,
This may be an identity issue. My kids, who are adopted really have
struggled in their teen years deciding who they will be. If my birth
parent was __________ will I be ________. My daughter once said to
me, "Not only do I have to figure out how I feel about you and dad,
but about my birthparents." They were drug addicts one of whom is
dead and one of whom is functioning on the level of a three year old
thanks to the drugs. Kids have a lot of feelings about that stuff,
but better to work through it now than save it for later.;]
I understand giving her the cushion, but at 19 its time to help her
grown up. I raised my sister who came from hell and she is 30 year
old mother of four doing very well. Maybe helping her set her goals
and holding her accountable for them. Help her set her own goals.
Does she want to drive? If so what days is she willing to learn?
What times? Put it on your calender and get out there. Act like not
doing it is not an option. It is a commitment. Does she want to
move into the room you are working on for her? What is she willing
to do to get it done? Let her know you want her to have her space,
but giving her family space when it is in such short demand does not
work for everyone else in the family. Does she want to work? Does
she want money for her own expenses? Is she afraid that if she gets
a job she will have to move and lose you guys? Help her by creating
a concrete list and plan, a timetable for those goals. When she
achieves one celebrate with her. When she fails at meeting a goal,
perhaps she needs to choose a new one, maybe that goal is not one
she really wants. So then what is it she wants and how can that
happen? About the birthday I would let her know that it is a family
commitment and your planning on her being there and then ask her
where she thinks you should have the party if her room is off
limits. Help her think through what she is really asking. Maybe what
she is wanting to know is how important she is.
I am sure she is terrified. Many 19 year olds from "normal" families
are. It is a frightenning time setting out on defining yourself.
Good Luck,
kathleen
This may be an identity issue. My kids, who are adopted really have
struggled in their teen years deciding who they will be. If my birth
parent was __________ will I be ________. My daughter once said to
me, "Not only do I have to figure out how I feel about you and dad,
but about my birthparents." They were drug addicts one of whom is
dead and one of whom is functioning on the level of a three year old
thanks to the drugs. Kids have a lot of feelings about that stuff,
but better to work through it now than save it for later.;]
I understand giving her the cushion, but at 19 its time to help her
grown up. I raised my sister who came from hell and she is 30 year
old mother of four doing very well. Maybe helping her set her goals
and holding her accountable for them. Help her set her own goals.
Does she want to drive? If so what days is she willing to learn?
What times? Put it on your calender and get out there. Act like not
doing it is not an option. It is a commitment. Does she want to
move into the room you are working on for her? What is she willing
to do to get it done? Let her know you want her to have her space,
but giving her family space when it is in such short demand does not
work for everyone else in the family. Does she want to work? Does
she want money for her own expenses? Is she afraid that if she gets
a job she will have to move and lose you guys? Help her by creating
a concrete list and plan, a timetable for those goals. When she
achieves one celebrate with her. When she fails at meeting a goal,
perhaps she needs to choose a new one, maybe that goal is not one
she really wants. So then what is it she wants and how can that
happen? About the birthday I would let her know that it is a family
commitment and your planning on her being there and then ask her
where she thinks you should have the party if her room is off
limits. Help her think through what she is really asking. Maybe what
she is wanting to know is how important she is.
I am sure she is terrified. Many 19 year olds from "normal" families
are. It is a frightenning time setting out on defining yourself.
Good Luck,
kathleen