RE: [AlwaysLearning] Family conflict over unschooling
Darlene Navarre
I am new to unschooling and alternative non disciplinarian approaches yet I am a total believer and practice being peaceful and loving to everyone especially my children. I am more respect full of everyone and I feel that I have hit the jackpot of life just finding unschooling and all that Intel's. I am so happy and my children and more happy also. The problem comes with my husband. He is an amazing person and for the most part he is an open person to alternative ideas Except now, and maybe when I choose to do an unassisted birth which he finally agreed to.
Whether its because I wont encourage my son (14 yrs that's in school by choice) to get a better grade in spanish (he has a D with the rest A's and B's which I believe is up to him not me), dont want to force or encourage my 5yr old son to do a reading program, or force my kids to do chores or as he puts it that I let my kids just "walk all over me"or the big one that we have failed our 17 yr old daughter because she did not live up to his expectations because she is "only" a manager for a fast food place (I believe she is amazing and a driven hard worker still searching for what she wants to do in life), he says "why should we not have expectations of our children and push them to suceed?". He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.
This is a man that use to joke and have fun all the time. I use to learn and long to be as good of a parent as he was. He is angry with himself right now, I believe hes going through some midlife crisis (if there is such a thing) and I believe he is taking it out on this situation and me. He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be devastated, they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to do to help him?
Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.
Peace and Love,
Darlene
---------------------------------
Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Whether its because I wont encourage my son (14 yrs that's in school by choice) to get a better grade in spanish (he has a D with the rest A's and B's which I believe is up to him not me), dont want to force or encourage my 5yr old son to do a reading program, or force my kids to do chores or as he puts it that I let my kids just "walk all over me"or the big one that we have failed our 17 yr old daughter because she did not live up to his expectations because she is "only" a manager for a fast food place (I believe she is amazing and a driven hard worker still searching for what she wants to do in life), he says "why should we not have expectations of our children and push them to suceed?". He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.
This is a man that use to joke and have fun all the time. I use to learn and long to be as good of a parent as he was. He is angry with himself right now, I believe hes going through some midlife crisis (if there is such a thing) and I believe he is taking it out on this situation and me. He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be devastated, they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to do to help him?
Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.
Peace and Love,
Darlene
---------------------------------
Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
NANCY OWENS
Darlene Navarre <dknbhn@...> wrote:
***I am new to unschooling and alternative non disciplinarian approaches yet I am a total believer and practice being peaceful and loving to everyone especially my children.
<snip>
He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.***
OUCH! I think you will only have to give him his time. Be as peaceful and loving to him as you are to the kids. Tell him his words really hurt though. But give him some time.
***He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be devastated, they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to do to help him?***
You're not going to budge, he's gonna read your full of c@#% books but not change his mind...
IMO, marriage is based on love and compromise (and lots of other things...) and maybe you might have to put unschooling on the back burner for a while. You can continue to be a wonderful parent. Get some counseling (gonna be hard with him being a trucker. I know mine is too.), work on the issues that are behind his feelings, and yours too, about unschooling, about life. Try to ease into it slowly, jumping in both feet first is going to be a shock for him and you too.
He is out there worried about his load. Does he have enough hours to drive? What does the load pay? What is the cost of fuel? Can he fudge that 34hr. restart? Is he going to have to throw chains? Is he going to get home to you and the kids?
Are you adding to his worries by insisting things change right now, when he has no time to adjust?
Let him know there are others out their just like him. Darin and I took the kids with us for a year. The kids were on the truck for a total of seven months last year. They spent time off, visiting family, we didn't think it was fair to keep them on the truck all the time. But tell him to look around at the next few truck stops. Not all of those guys have the kids on the truck for just this load. Some live on that truck. I met at least 20 other families last year, with kids from just born to teenagers on the truck with them. I'm NOT suggesting you load up with him and the kids, just suggesting that he look around and see that there are nontraditional families out there, and he can see them even on the road. ;o)And he can talk to them too. I did. I never found another unschooling family, but I found plenty of homeschooling folks, and I think I might have changed one families thoughts.
I'm not trying to tell you not to unschool. I am trying to help you see where your dh is coming from, and see that he needs some adjustment time, some deschooling time, too. He's gone most of the week, or longer, when he comes home he wants normalcy, comfort, not a challenge. Take it slowly, baby steps. Breathe.
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
***I am new to unschooling and alternative non disciplinarian approaches yet I am a total believer and practice being peaceful and loving to everyone especially my children.
<snip>
He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.***
OUCH! I think you will only have to give him his time. Be as peaceful and loving to him as you are to the kids. Tell him his words really hurt though. But give him some time.
***He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be devastated, they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to do to help him?***
You're not going to budge, he's gonna read your full of c@#% books but not change his mind...
IMO, marriage is based on love and compromise (and lots of other things...) and maybe you might have to put unschooling on the back burner for a while. You can continue to be a wonderful parent. Get some counseling (gonna be hard with him being a trucker. I know mine is too.), work on the issues that are behind his feelings, and yours too, about unschooling, about life. Try to ease into it slowly, jumping in both feet first is going to be a shock for him and you too.
He is out there worried about his load. Does he have enough hours to drive? What does the load pay? What is the cost of fuel? Can he fudge that 34hr. restart? Is he going to have to throw chains? Is he going to get home to you and the kids?
Are you adding to his worries by insisting things change right now, when he has no time to adjust?
Let him know there are others out their just like him. Darin and I took the kids with us for a year. The kids were on the truck for a total of seven months last year. They spent time off, visiting family, we didn't think it was fair to keep them on the truck all the time. But tell him to look around at the next few truck stops. Not all of those guys have the kids on the truck for just this load. Some live on that truck. I met at least 20 other families last year, with kids from just born to teenagers on the truck with them. I'm NOT suggesting you load up with him and the kids, just suggesting that he look around and see that there are nontraditional families out there, and he can see them even on the road. ;o)And he can talk to them too. I did. I never found another unschooling family, but I found plenty of homeschooling folks, and I think I might have changed one families thoughts.
I'm not trying to tell you not to unschool. I am trying to help you see where your dh is coming from, and see that he needs some adjustment time, some deschooling time, too. He's gone most of the week, or longer, when he comes home he wants normalcy, comfort, not a challenge. Take it slowly, baby steps. Breathe.
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/9/05 11:45:37 PM, dknbhn@... writes:
For you to think there's no such thing would be like a man snorting about
feminine discomfort of one sort or another, or denying there's any such thing as
depression or whatever.
For him to think that what you're reading is full of shit, that goes back
behind the time you got the books. Ease up. SHOW him, with successes in your
home.
When he was 17, what was he doing? I think a 17 year old shif manager isn't
so bad at all. Lots of 17 year olds have never had a job yet, or wouldn't
be handed a key for ANYthing.
-=-He knows I will not budge-=-
That doesn't sound like a healthy position to be in. Having a good marriage
is good and the best for your children, and you should do that 100%.
-=- I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise
children-=-
The true way!?
The One-True-Way?
Your inflexibility isn't good for the situation. It sounds more hostile
than persuasive.
-=-This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be
devastated-=-
NO SHIT.
It would be better to put them in SCHOOL than to have a divorce, but those
aren't your only options.
-=-they all think the world of him and so do I.-=-
Apparently you don't. You shut him out of what you were doing and gave him
an ultimatum, it sounds like, and not in a very loving or gentle way.
-=-I don't know how to help him "see the light".-=-
If he can't see it from the kids' happiness and if he can't see them
learning, there IS no light. If it's "the light" it will be glowing out of all of
you.
-=-He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck
driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I
don't know what to do to help him?-=-
#1, how's your sex life? Midlife frustrations and being gone 6 to 7 days a
week... bad combination. Try to arrange for the kids to be gone and the
candles to be lit when he's coming home, and don't tell him what's leaking or
broken or anything about kids for an hour or two. SERIOUSLY. Forget all else
if you don't think that's important.
#2, this is not a personal issue for him. If you insist that it's all his
problem and none of yours, you're deluding yourself right into a divorce, and
with that divorce might come a court order to put your kids in school.
-=-Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.-=-
Have you seen The Truman Show?
Turn off the storm machine.
Cue the sun.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> -=-He is angry with himself right now, I believe hes going through someOh, there is.
> midlife crisis (if there is such a thing) -=-
>
For you to think there's no such thing would be like a man snorting about
feminine discomfort of one sort or another, or denying there's any such thing as
depression or whatever.
For him to think that what you're reading is full of shit, that goes back
behind the time you got the books. Ease up. SHOW him, with successes in your
home.
When he was 17, what was he doing? I think a 17 year old shif manager isn't
so bad at all. Lots of 17 year olds have never had a job yet, or wouldn't
be handed a key for ANYthing.
-=-He knows I will not budge-=-
That doesn't sound like a healthy position to be in. Having a good marriage
is good and the best for your children, and you should do that 100%.
-=- I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise
children-=-
The true way!?
The One-True-Way?
Your inflexibility isn't good for the situation. It sounds more hostile
than persuasive.
-=-This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be
devastated-=-
NO SHIT.
It would be better to put them in SCHOOL than to have a divorce, but those
aren't your only options.
-=-they all think the world of him and so do I.-=-
Apparently you don't. You shut him out of what you were doing and gave him
an ultimatum, it sounds like, and not in a very loving or gentle way.
-=-I don't know how to help him "see the light".-=-
If he can't see it from the kids' happiness and if he can't see them
learning, there IS no light. If it's "the light" it will be glowing out of all of
you.
-=-He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck
driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I
don't know what to do to help him?-=-
#1, how's your sex life? Midlife frustrations and being gone 6 to 7 days a
week... bad combination. Try to arrange for the kids to be gone and the
candles to be lit when he's coming home, and don't tell him what's leaking or
broken or anything about kids for an hour or two. SERIOUSLY. Forget all else
if you don't think that's important.
#2, this is not a personal issue for him. If you insist that it's all his
problem and none of yours, you're deluding yourself right into a divorce, and
with that divorce might come a court order to put your kids in school.
-=-Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.-=-
Have you seen The Truman Show?
Turn off the storm machine.
Cue the sun.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Darlene Navarre
My husband did originally agree to unschooling yet all the sudden he changed his mind and is scared that my 5 yr old will never read and that he will be so far behind and he has so much expectations for him that by not doing homeschool with curriculum that he will fail. I told him that I would compromise and he could do a curriculum with him. I am not sure I can force myself to do it, something I always hated with my older children when I homeschooled them. Forcing them to do something they were very unhappy doing.
Our biggest issue is dissapline and lack there of. I want to work with the kids to accomplish our goals and he feels that we are the parents and that means do what we say. He also hates that I dont make them do chores anymore. One day my 5 year old was acting up and he said "I know mommy doesnt want me to spank you but if you dont stop I m going to spank you anyways."
Truck driving he drives for Fedex Frieght and so it is not an option to come with him. He gets home on a saturday day or night and then has to go out Sunday night. He can take 34hours yet he wants to make the money and because he is not on a set run he is at their mercy for assignments.
I have desperately tried to comprise but he just tells me that is not good enough "we need to be on the same page with everything has parents. I try so hard to not talk or say anything schooling or nondisapline, just hoping the will just work it out over time but he says we need to talk and agree with things now and then as hard as I try to talk peacefully but then we just end up making it personal.
Thanks for your help,
Peace,
Darlene
NANCY OWENS <nancy-owens@...> wrote:
Darlene Navarre <dknbhn@...> wrote:
***I am new to unschooling and alternative non disciplinarian approaches yet I am a total believer and practice being peaceful and loving to everyone especially my children.
<snip>
He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.***
OUCH! I think you will only have to give him his time. Be as peaceful and loving to him as you are to the kids. Tell him his words really hurt though. But give him some time.
***He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be devastated, they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to do to help him?***
You're not going to budge, he's gonna read your full of c@#% books but not change his mind...
IMO, marriage is based on love and compromise (and lots of other things...) and maybe you might have to put unschooling on the back burner for a while. You can continue to be a wonderful parent. Get some counseling (gonna be hard with him being a trucker. I know mine is too.), work on the issues that are behind his feelings, and yours too, about unschooling, about life. Try to ease into it slowly, jumping in both feet first is going to be a shock for him and you too.
He is out there worried about his load. Does he have enough hours to drive? What does the load pay? What is the cost of fuel? Can he fudge that 34hr. restart? Is he going to have to throw chains? Is he going to get home to you and the kids?
Are you adding to his worries by insisting things change right now, when he has no time to adjust?
Let him know there are others out their just like him. Darin and I took the kids with us for a year. The kids were on the truck for a total of seven months last year. They spent time off, visiting family, we didn't think it was fair to keep them on the truck all the time. But tell him to look around at the next few truck stops. Not all of those guys have the kids on the truck for just this load. Some live on that truck. I met at least 20 other families last year, with kids from just born to teenagers on the truck with them. I'm NOT suggesting you load up with him and the kids, just suggesting that he look around and see that there are nontraditional families out there, and he can see them even on the road. ;o)And he can talk to them too. I did. I never found another unschooling family, but I found plenty of homeschooling folks, and I think I might have changed one families thoughts.
I'm not trying to tell you not to unschool. I am trying to help you see where your dh is coming from, and see that he needs some adjustment time, some deschooling time, too. He's gone most of the week, or longer, when he comes home he wants normalcy, comfort, not a challenge. Take it slowly, baby steps. Breathe.
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SPONSORED LINKS
Unschooling Attachment parenting John holt Parenting magazine Single parenting
---------------------------------
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Visit your group "AlwaysLearning" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Our biggest issue is dissapline and lack there of. I want to work with the kids to accomplish our goals and he feels that we are the parents and that means do what we say. He also hates that I dont make them do chores anymore. One day my 5 year old was acting up and he said "I know mommy doesnt want me to spank you but if you dont stop I m going to spank you anyways."
Truck driving he drives for Fedex Frieght and so it is not an option to come with him. He gets home on a saturday day or night and then has to go out Sunday night. He can take 34hours yet he wants to make the money and because he is not on a set run he is at their mercy for assignments.
I have desperately tried to comprise but he just tells me that is not good enough "we need to be on the same page with everything has parents. I try so hard to not talk or say anything schooling or nondisapline, just hoping the will just work it out over time but he says we need to talk and agree with things now and then as hard as I try to talk peacefully but then we just end up making it personal.
Thanks for your help,
Peace,
Darlene
NANCY OWENS <nancy-owens@...> wrote:
Darlene Navarre <dknbhn@...> wrote:
***I am new to unschooling and alternative non disciplinarian approaches yet I am a total believer and practice being peaceful and loving to everyone especially my children.
<snip>
He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.***
OUCH! I think you will only have to give him his time. Be as peaceful and loving to him as you are to the kids. Tell him his words really hurt though. But give him some time.
***He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be devastated, they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to do to help him?***
You're not going to budge, he's gonna read your full of c@#% books but not change his mind...
IMO, marriage is based on love and compromise (and lots of other things...) and maybe you might have to put unschooling on the back burner for a while. You can continue to be a wonderful parent. Get some counseling (gonna be hard with him being a trucker. I know mine is too.), work on the issues that are behind his feelings, and yours too, about unschooling, about life. Try to ease into it slowly, jumping in both feet first is going to be a shock for him and you too.
He is out there worried about his load. Does he have enough hours to drive? What does the load pay? What is the cost of fuel? Can he fudge that 34hr. restart? Is he going to have to throw chains? Is he going to get home to you and the kids?
Are you adding to his worries by insisting things change right now, when he has no time to adjust?
Let him know there are others out their just like him. Darin and I took the kids with us for a year. The kids were on the truck for a total of seven months last year. They spent time off, visiting family, we didn't think it was fair to keep them on the truck all the time. But tell him to look around at the next few truck stops. Not all of those guys have the kids on the truck for just this load. Some live on that truck. I met at least 20 other families last year, with kids from just born to teenagers on the truck with them. I'm NOT suggesting you load up with him and the kids, just suggesting that he look around and see that there are nontraditional families out there, and he can see them even on the road. ;o)And he can talk to them too. I did. I never found another unschooling family, but I found plenty of homeschooling folks, and I think I might have changed one families thoughts.
I'm not trying to tell you not to unschool. I am trying to help you see where your dh is coming from, and see that he needs some adjustment time, some deschooling time, too. He's gone most of the week, or longer, when he comes home he wants normalcy, comfort, not a challenge. Take it slowly, baby steps. Breathe.
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SPONSORED LINKS
Unschooling Attachment parenting John holt Parenting magazine Single parenting
---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
Visit your group "AlwaysLearning" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Darlene Navarre
SandraDodd@... wrote:
In a message dated 11/9/05 11:45:37 PM, dknbhn@... writes:
For you to think there's no such thing would be like a man snorting about
feminine discomfort of one sort or another, or denying there's any such thing as
depression or whatever.
I am not really dening because he use to be open to things even telling me when we first met that that is what is loved about me was that I was different and now he seems to hate it.
For him to think that what you're reading is full of shit, that goes back
behind the time you got the books. Ease up. SHOW him, with successes in your
home.
Your right yet I know better than show him anything I think he would throw it at me. He really is or was a funny guy.LOL
When he was 17, what was he doing? I think a 17 year old shif manager isn't
so bad at all. Lots of 17 year olds have never had a job yet, or wouldn't
be handed a key for ANYthing.
I know and yet not good enough for him and he was racing motorcycles and working at a truck stop washing dishes at 17 years old, I guess to him that seems more important.
-=-He knows I will not budge-=-
That doesn't sound like a healthy position to be in. Having a good marriage
is good and the best for your children, and you should do that 100%.
I realize this and I have offered to compromise and he says no we need to be on the same page about everything. It is not that he wants our 5 year old to go to school he just wants me to use curriculum and I asked him if he would like to use curriculum then he could when he was home. For heaven sakes he is only 5. I honestly do not shove it down his throat and its not the unschooling or wasnt I should say because at first he said it sounded good. It is more the non disapline I am not doing all I asked of him was that we do not spank or verbally abuse the kids which he said that he ageed with and then a week later spanked my 5 year old (I said nothing).
-=- I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise
children-=-
The true way!?
The One-True-Way?
Your inflexibility isn't good for the situation. It sounds more hostile
than persuasive.
It has become hostile, you are correct and verbally bloody and hateful. I offer flexibility and for some reason that is not good enough.
-=-This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be
devastated-=-
NO SHIT.
It would be better to put them in SCHOOL than to have a divorce, but those
aren't your only options.
He is not asking for my 5 year old to go to school but yet he wants school at home and me to do it. I said I do do a lot of reading and games and puzzles and etc with them and that is learing. He agrees one minuete and then insists that making him do work books and such is not that bad and wont hurt him and making him read wont hurt him.
-=-they all think the world of him and so do I.-=-
Apparently you don't. You shut him out of what you were doing and gave him
an ultimatum, it sounds like, and not in a very loving or gentle way.
I have never given him an ultimatum it is he that keeps threatening divorce and it does not seem to matter what I say whether its compromise or work things out it seems not to please him no matter what I say even lovingly.
-=-I don't know how to help him "see the light".-=-
If he can't see it from the kids' happiness and if he can't see them
learning, there IS no light. If it's "the light" it will be glowing out of all of
you.
I only wish he could look for it or her it out of our excitement about what we are doing and how much fun learning is and maybe this is what is truely bothering him that he is not here very much and maybe he is envious. I did ask him this but he says its not true but then I dont think he would give me an honest answer.
-=-He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck
driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I
don't know what to do to help him?-=-
#1, how's your sex life? Midlife frustrations and being gone 6 to 7 days a
week... bad combination. Try to arrange for the kids to be gone and the
candles to be lit when he's coming home, and don't tell him what's leaking or
broken or anything about kids for an hour or two. SERIOUSLY. Forget all else
if you don't think that's important.
Thats the one thing that has been great and more than usual. I am always a willing party it is usually he that is never up to it. During all this turmoil this past 2 months our sex life has defenantly been more frequent and great.
#2, this is not a personal issue for him. If you insist that it's all his
problem and none of yours, you're deluding yourself right into a divorce, and
with that divorce might come a court order to put your kids in school.
Your right, it is not only his problem, its just that I just went through some major counceling and forgiveness work myself and I have just learned to truely love myself and I have never felt better. Even the mean things he says lastly I dont take personal (like I use to). Lately he's been talking about being a failure to our family and how badly he screwed up and how unhappy he is with himself and our 2 older children (17 year old with job and 14 year having fun choosing to go to high school getting all A and B except one D). I keep letting him know that I love him unconditionaly and I dont believe those things are mistakes just learning what worked and what doesnt. I am not sure if he even hears me.
-=-Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.-=-
Have you seen The Truman Show?
Turn off the storm machine.
Cue the sun.
Sandra
Thank You,
Peace,
Darlene
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 11/9/05 11:45:37 PM, dknbhn@... writes:
> -=-He is angry with himself right now, I believe hes going through someOh, there is.
> midlife crisis (if there is such a thing) -=-
>
For you to think there's no such thing would be like a man snorting about
feminine discomfort of one sort or another, or denying there's any such thing as
depression or whatever.
I am not really dening because he use to be open to things even telling me when we first met that that is what is loved about me was that I was different and now he seems to hate it.
For him to think that what you're reading is full of shit, that goes back
behind the time you got the books. Ease up. SHOW him, with successes in your
home.
Your right yet I know better than show him anything I think he would throw it at me. He really is or was a funny guy.LOL
When he was 17, what was he doing? I think a 17 year old shif manager isn't
so bad at all. Lots of 17 year olds have never had a job yet, or wouldn't
be handed a key for ANYthing.
I know and yet not good enough for him and he was racing motorcycles and working at a truck stop washing dishes at 17 years old, I guess to him that seems more important.
-=-He knows I will not budge-=-
That doesn't sound like a healthy position to be in. Having a good marriage
is good and the best for your children, and you should do that 100%.
I realize this and I have offered to compromise and he says no we need to be on the same page about everything. It is not that he wants our 5 year old to go to school he just wants me to use curriculum and I asked him if he would like to use curriculum then he could when he was home. For heaven sakes he is only 5. I honestly do not shove it down his throat and its not the unschooling or wasnt I should say because at first he said it sounded good. It is more the non disapline I am not doing all I asked of him was that we do not spank or verbally abuse the kids which he said that he ageed with and then a week later spanked my 5 year old (I said nothing).
-=- I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true way to raise
children-=-
The true way!?
The One-True-Way?
Your inflexibility isn't good for the situation. It sounds more hostile
than persuasive.
It has become hostile, you are correct and verbally bloody and hateful. I offer flexibility and for some reason that is not good enough.
-=-This is something I do not want especially for my children, they would be
devastated-=-
NO SHIT.
It would be better to put them in SCHOOL than to have a divorce, but those
aren't your only options.
He is not asking for my 5 year old to go to school but yet he wants school at home and me to do it. I said I do do a lot of reading and games and puzzles and etc with them and that is learing. He agrees one minuete and then insists that making him do work books and such is not that bad and wont hurt him and making him read wont hurt him.
-=-they all think the world of him and so do I.-=-
Apparently you don't. You shut him out of what you were doing and gave him
an ultimatum, it sounds like, and not in a very loving or gentle way.
I have never given him an ultimatum it is he that keeps threatening divorce and it does not seem to matter what I say whether its compromise or work things out it seems not to please him no matter what I say even lovingly.
-=-I don't know how to help him "see the light".-=-
If he can't see it from the kids' happiness and if he can't see them
learning, there IS no light. If it's "the light" it will be glowing out of all of
you.
I only wish he could look for it or her it out of our excitement about what we are doing and how much fun learning is and maybe this is what is truely bothering him that he is not here very much and maybe he is envious. I did ask him this but he says its not true but then I dont think he would give me an honest answer.
-=-He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck
driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). I know this is a personal issue for him yet I
don't know what to do to help him?-=-
#1, how's your sex life? Midlife frustrations and being gone 6 to 7 days a
week... bad combination. Try to arrange for the kids to be gone and the
candles to be lit when he's coming home, and don't tell him what's leaking or
broken or anything about kids for an hour or two. SERIOUSLY. Forget all else
if you don't think that's important.
Thats the one thing that has been great and more than usual. I am always a willing party it is usually he that is never up to it. During all this turmoil this past 2 months our sex life has defenantly been more frequent and great.
#2, this is not a personal issue for him. If you insist that it's all his
problem and none of yours, you're deluding yourself right into a divorce, and
with that divorce might come a court order to put your kids in school.
Your right, it is not only his problem, its just that I just went through some major counceling and forgiveness work myself and I have just learned to truely love myself and I have never felt better. Even the mean things he says lastly I dont take personal (like I use to). Lately he's been talking about being a failure to our family and how badly he screwed up and how unhappy he is with himself and our 2 older children (17 year old with job and 14 year having fun choosing to go to high school getting all A and B except one D). I keep letting him know that I love him unconditionaly and I dont believe those things are mistakes just learning what worked and what doesnt. I am not sure if he even hears me.
-=-Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.-=-
Have you seen The Truman Show?
Turn off the storm machine.
Cue the sun.
Sandra
Thank You,
Peace,
Darlene
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 11/10/05 9:30:58 PM, dknbhn@... writes:
Find a curriculum, or find a checklist, and compromise. Just because you
have a curriculum doesn't mean you have to use in its most horrible form.
Maybe use the worldbook checklist (could someone put that link here please?).
Using a curriculum for a year or two could give you time to show him lots of
examples of natural learning, and give your husband time.
If you get divorced, it will all be over, and horrible. Your child could
end up with steparents who were against homeschooling. Don't go that way.
Unschooling is not worth the loss of a family, and honestly, with the loss of
the family, unschooling is almost always gone forever as well.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> -=-I just went through some major counceling and forgiveness work myselfThat sounds good!
> and I have just learned to truely love myself and I have never felt better.
> Even the mean things he says lastly I dont take personal (like I use to).-=-
>
Find a curriculum, or find a checklist, and compromise. Just because you
have a curriculum doesn't mean you have to use in its most horrible form.
Maybe use the worldbook checklist (could someone put that link here please?).
Using a curriculum for a year or two could give you time to show him lots of
examples of natural learning, and give your husband time.
If you get divorced, it will all be over, and horrible. Your child could
end up with steparents who were against homeschooling. Don't go that way.
Unschooling is not worth the loss of a family, and honestly, with the loss of
the family, unschooling is almost always gone forever as well.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandrewmama
On Nov 10, 2005, at 10:41 PM, SandraDodd@... wrote:
Chris in IA
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IAUnschoolers/
> Find a curriculum, or find a checklist, and compromise. Justhttp://www.worldbook.com/wc/browse?id=pa/tcs
> because you
> have a curriculum doesn't mean you have to use in its most horrible
> form.
> Maybe use the worldbook checklist (could someone put that link here
> please?).
Chris in IA
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IAUnschoolers/
Pamela Sorooshian
I was thinking - maybe buy the "What Your 1st Grader Should Know" --
whatever level seems appropriate. Just read together for 15 minutes
every day - either directly from the book or from something based on
that book. In other words, if it is about Ancient Egypt, you could
either just read the stuff on ancient Egypt from the book, or you
could get something else from the library or bookstore. Maybe one of
those little kits. Or go to a museum and see some mummies. Use the
books LOOSELY - don't TEST - enjoy it and keep it VERY minimal. Those
books might be VERY reassuring to your husband.
-pam
whatever level seems appropriate. Just read together for 15 minutes
every day - either directly from the book or from something based on
that book. In other words, if it is about Ancient Egypt, you could
either just read the stuff on ancient Egypt from the book, or you
could get something else from the library or bookstore. Maybe one of
those little kits. Or go to a museum and see some mummies. Use the
books LOOSELY - don't TEST - enjoy it and keep it VERY minimal. Those
books might be VERY reassuring to your husband.
-pam
On Nov 10, 2005, at 8:41 PM, SandraDodd@... wrote:
> Find a curriculum, or find a checklist, and compromise.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
When people say things like "it is important we are on the same page" I usually remind them that I agree but that doesn't mean THEY get to pick the page.
Julie S.
Julie S.
----- Original Message -----
From: Darlene Navarre <dknbhn@...>
Date: Thursday, November 10, 2005 9:53 pm
Subject: RE: [AlwaysLearning] Family conflict over unschooling
> My husband did originally agree to unschooling yet all the sudden
> he changed his mind and is scared that my 5 yr old will never read
> and that he will be so far behind and he has so much expectations
> for him that by not doing homeschool with curriculum that he will
> fail. I told him that I would compromise and he could do a
> curriculum with him. I am not sure I can force myself to do it,
> something I always hated with my older children when I
> homeschooled them. Forcing them to do something they were very
> unhappy doing.
> Our biggest issue is dissapline and lack there of. I want to work
> with the kids to accomplish our goals and he feels that we are the
> parents and that means do what we say. He also hates that I dont
> make them do chores anymore. One day my 5 year old was acting up
> and he said "I know mommy doesnt want me to spank you but if you
> dont stop I m going to spank you anyways."
> Truck driving he drives for Fedex Frieght and so it is not an
> option to come with him. He gets home on a saturday day or night
> and then has to go out Sunday night. He can take 34hours yet he
> wants to make the money and because he is not on a set run he is
> at their mercy for assignments.
> I have desperately tried to comprise but he just tells me that is
> not good enough "we need to be on the same page with everything
> has parents. I try so hard to not talk or say anything schooling
> or nondisapline, just hoping the will just work it out over time
> but he says we need to talk and agree with things now and then as
> hard as I try to talk peacefully but then we just end up making it
> personal.
>
> Thanks for your help,
> Peace,
> Darlene
>
> NANCY OWENS <nancy-owens@...> wrote:
>
>
> Darlene Navarre <dknbhn@...> wrote:
> ***I am new to unschooling and alternative non disciplinarian
> approaches yet I am a total believer and practice being peaceful
> and loving to everyone especially my children.
>
> <snip>
>
> He tells me I better not fail his babies and that he will read my
> full of shit books but that does not mean he will ever agree.***
> OUCH! I think you will only have to give him his time. Be as
> peaceful and loving to him as you are to the kids. Tell him his
> words really hurt though. But give him some time.
>
>
> ***He knows I will not budge because when I believe it something
> that is all about being good and the best for my children I do it
> 100%. I have told him that I know and feel that this is the true
> way to raise children, out of love and respect. For the past
> couple of days he is threatening divorce. This is something I do
> not want especially for my children, they would be devastated,
> they all think the world of him and so do I. I don't know how to
> help him "see the light". He has agreed to counseling for he and I
> yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week).
> I know this is a personal issue for him yet I don't know what to
> do to help him?***
>
>
>
> You're not going to budge, he's gonna read your full of c@#% books
> but not change his mind...
>
> IMO, marriage is based on love and compromise (and lots of other
> things...) and maybe you might have to put unschooling on the back
> burner for a while. You can continue to be a wonderful parent. Get
> some counseling (gonna be hard with him being a trucker. I know
> mine is too.), work on the issues that are behind his feelings,
> and yours too, about unschooling, about life. Try to ease into it
> slowly, jumping in both feet first is going to be a shock for him
> and you too.
>
> He is out there worried about his load. Does he have enough hours
> to drive? What does the load pay? What is the cost of fuel? Can he
> fudge that 34hr. restart? Is he going to have to throw chains? Is
> he going to get home to you and the kids?
>
> Are you adding to his worries by insisting things change right
> now, when he has no time to adjust?
>
>
>
> Let him know there are others out their just like him. Darin and I
> took the kids with us for a year. The kids were on the truck for a
> total of seven months last year. They spent time off, visiting
> family, we didn't think it was fair to keep them on the truck all
> the time. But tell him to look around at the next few truck stops.
> Not all of those guys have the kids on the truck for just this
> load. Some live on that truck. I met at least 20 other families
> last year, with kids from just born to teenagers on the truck with
> them. I'm NOT suggesting you load up with him and the kids, just
> suggesting that he look around and see that there are
> nontraditional families out there, and he can see them even on the
> road. ;o)And he can talk to them too. I did. I never found another
> unschooling family, but I found plenty of homeschooling folks, and
> I think I might have changed one families thoughts.
>
>
>
> I'm not trying to tell you not to unschool. I am trying to help
> you see where your dh is coming from, and see that he needs some
> adjustment time, some deschooling time, too. He's gone most of the
> week, or longer, when he comes home he wants normalcy, comfort,
> not a challenge. Take it slowly, baby steps. Breathe.
>
> ~Nancy
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
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Betsy Hill
**
Oh, there is.
For you to think there's no such thing would be like a man snorting about
feminine discomfort of one sort or another, or denying there's any such thing as depression or whatever.**
There was even a recent announcement of a scientific study identifying a drop in a particular brain chemical (something like serotonin?) that correlates with the male midlife crisis. Sorry that I don't remember the source.
(new poster)
**He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). **
How about Dr. Phil's Relationship Rescue book on tape or CD that he can listen to while driving? I'm not suggesting it's the best thing, but it might be the most convenient thing. And it has got a male perspective.
**
Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.**
It's the flexible, bendy trees that don't break in strong wind.
Betsy
Oh, there is.
For you to think there's no such thing would be like a man snorting about
feminine discomfort of one sort or another, or denying there's any such thing as depression or whatever.**
There was even a recent announcement of a scientific study identifying a drop in a particular brain chemical (something like serotonin?) that correlates with the male midlife crisis. Sorry that I don't remember the source.
(new poster)
**He has agreed to counseling for he and I yet he works all the time (truck driver gone 6 to 7 days a week). **
How about Dr. Phil's Relationship Rescue book on tape or CD that he can listen to while driving? I'm not suggesting it's the best thing, but it might be the most convenient thing. And it has got a male perspective.
**
Thank you for any advise you could offer to help me weather the storm.**
It's the flexible, bendy trees that don't break in strong wind.
Betsy
readlearnlove
Hi,
I have two cents about the curriculum request. My husband is not
comfortable with homeschooling (forget about unschooling) and he is
very concerned about reading, writing, and math. I agreed to use a
more formal style for teaching those subjects and he agreed to let me
handle it.
I tell my son (age 5) that we have to produce enough workbook pages to
help Daddy feel comfortable with homeschooling. I use workbooks as our
curriculum. We spend less than a half an hour a week producing busy
work that helps my husband feel comfortable. For me it is worth it.
I also find that as long as my husband thinks that I am teaching
reading, writing, and math, he doesn't want to know what my son is
learning. For him that is why kids go to public school, to learn so
he doesn't have to think about it. I addressed my husbands immediate
concerns, I report positive progress, he sees progress. I do not tell
him more than he wants to know. We are both happy.
Another thing that I did was to write a mission statement for
our "homeschool program". I took his ideas and mine and wrote down a
general goal and plan. It makes my husband feel comfortable and gives
me the freedom to do what I think is right.
Gee I didn't mean to be so long winded.
Mariellen
I have two cents about the curriculum request. My husband is not
comfortable with homeschooling (forget about unschooling) and he is
very concerned about reading, writing, and math. I agreed to use a
more formal style for teaching those subjects and he agreed to let me
handle it.
I tell my son (age 5) that we have to produce enough workbook pages to
help Daddy feel comfortable with homeschooling. I use workbooks as our
curriculum. We spend less than a half an hour a week producing busy
work that helps my husband feel comfortable. For me it is worth it.
I also find that as long as my husband thinks that I am teaching
reading, writing, and math, he doesn't want to know what my son is
learning. For him that is why kids go to public school, to learn so
he doesn't have to think about it. I addressed my husbands immediate
concerns, I report positive progress, he sees progress. I do not tell
him more than he wants to know. We are both happy.
Another thing that I did was to write a mission statement for
our "homeschool program". I took his ideas and mine and wrote down a
general goal and plan. It makes my husband feel comfortable and gives
me the freedom to do what I think is right.
Gee I didn't mean to be so long winded.
Mariellen