Community education
mozafamily
I should state up front that I feel part of my purpose in life
is to help others better understand their children's needs, and I
myslef am learning more about understanding them daily! That said I
think that for a child's education to include his/her community is
important, I would like for my child to actually have more community
opportunitites.
But how do I help with this? Unfortunately I'm not the greatest
friend maker in the world so getting someone to listen to my point
of view is a rare experience, unless you count the poeple who arn't
my friends who just happen to be treating my child or their children
so poorly that I just have to speak up and share. How can I let my
child be partially educated by the community when the neighbors up
the street are drugging their children, starving them and forcing
them to "get out of their hair" ie go to school from 7 - 6 pm -
(That TUTORING is so important to them! They don't care that their
children are truely drop dead tired plus they are sick of being told
how stupid they are that they need constant tutoring!), or the crack
neighbors who just don't know where their children are, or the older
neighborhood child who has been raised with no form of caring and
constantly shows it with all of his disregard for everyone else
through his anger, cursing and destroying. I live in what I would
consider a middle-class neighborhood - and yes sometimes I wish I
lived in the country far away from everyone!Although I am certaily
happier than if I lived in the projects so I probably shouldn't
complain.
So how is my community going to help with my son's education???
I can't imagine being the constant "neighbor guard" all my life,
ie. - "that's not the way you should treat people, you should treat
others the way you want to be treated, if you need something then
ask and I will work with you to get it, just because your friend
stole something doesn't mean that it's okey for you to, using
cursing words can hurt just as much as any other kind of words - you
can use any words you like around me but don't think I won't be
upset if you tell me to **** **** whatever, Yes Mom knows all the
words but I also know that they can make someone fell bad so that's
why I have resigned to use those words only on rare occasions or not
at all". Those are just examples, what I am trying to get
information on is how can the community be helpful in educating my
son - preferably other than "don't do that!" or "can you see what he
did wrong?"
Everyday is a struggle! Just for me to go out into my community
with my child means that someone will probably treat him
disrespectfully, other than the - what grade are you in school? Why
arn't you in school now? My son may be a little big for his age, but
he isn't even the "compulsory" school age of 7 in my state - Just
because many parents send their kids starting at 3 (when the public
funding kicks in)! Or to see another child being treated poorly on
an outing is almost inevitable if there are children around! I am
the kind of person who dislikes being a homebody so this is such a
struggle for me! Where is this community that I would trust to help
with my child's education??? Do others of you feel this same way?
is to help others better understand their children's needs, and I
myslef am learning more about understanding them daily! That said I
think that for a child's education to include his/her community is
important, I would like for my child to actually have more community
opportunitites.
But how do I help with this? Unfortunately I'm not the greatest
friend maker in the world so getting someone to listen to my point
of view is a rare experience, unless you count the poeple who arn't
my friends who just happen to be treating my child or their children
so poorly that I just have to speak up and share. How can I let my
child be partially educated by the community when the neighbors up
the street are drugging their children, starving them and forcing
them to "get out of their hair" ie go to school from 7 - 6 pm -
(That TUTORING is so important to them! They don't care that their
children are truely drop dead tired plus they are sick of being told
how stupid they are that they need constant tutoring!), or the crack
neighbors who just don't know where their children are, or the older
neighborhood child who has been raised with no form of caring and
constantly shows it with all of his disregard for everyone else
through his anger, cursing and destroying. I live in what I would
consider a middle-class neighborhood - and yes sometimes I wish I
lived in the country far away from everyone!Although I am certaily
happier than if I lived in the projects so I probably shouldn't
complain.
So how is my community going to help with my son's education???
I can't imagine being the constant "neighbor guard" all my life,
ie. - "that's not the way you should treat people, you should treat
others the way you want to be treated, if you need something then
ask and I will work with you to get it, just because your friend
stole something doesn't mean that it's okey for you to, using
cursing words can hurt just as much as any other kind of words - you
can use any words you like around me but don't think I won't be
upset if you tell me to **** **** whatever, Yes Mom knows all the
words but I also know that they can make someone fell bad so that's
why I have resigned to use those words only on rare occasions or not
at all". Those are just examples, what I am trying to get
information on is how can the community be helpful in educating my
son - preferably other than "don't do that!" or "can you see what he
did wrong?"
Everyday is a struggle! Just for me to go out into my community
with my child means that someone will probably treat him
disrespectfully, other than the - what grade are you in school? Why
arn't you in school now? My son may be a little big for his age, but
he isn't even the "compulsory" school age of 7 in my state - Just
because many parents send their kids starting at 3 (when the public
funding kicks in)! Or to see another child being treated poorly on
an outing is almost inevitable if there are children around! I am
the kind of person who dislikes being a homebody so this is such a
struggle for me! Where is this community that I would trust to help
with my child's education??? Do others of you feel this same way?
nellebelle
>>>Everyday is a struggle! Just for me to go out into my communitywith my child means that someone will probably treat him
disrespectfully, . . . Where is this community that I would trust to help
with my child's education???>>>>>
Wow, have you considered moving? Although I run into bummer people now and then, for the most part our community is friendly and people are generally accepting of homeschoolers.
Mary Ellen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/12/2004 2:17:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mozafamily@... writes:
So how is my community going to help with my son's education??? <<<<
Change your community.
That doesn't mean you have to move. It just means that you have to seek out
those you'd like to associate with.
Our *neighborhood* is made of of lots of retirees who keep to themselves,
parents of older kids who believe in school, but not necessarily in *our*
district (none of the kids go to school here where they're *supposed* to go! <g>),
lots and lots of Christians (one's delightful daughter is going straight to
hell because she's a lesbian)---and everyone pretty much keeps to himself.
Our *community* is made of a college professors, professional magicians,
artists, actors, a theatre owner, a massage therapist, a dietician, several dog
breeders, a welder, an advertising exec, college students, a banker, and a
private school principal. We've sought these folks out because they're
interesting and interested. THEY are our community.
Cameron's doing his own community builiding. Many of his newer friends are
in their twenties. A few are in their forties. He has a five year old that he
spends time with---not paid, but just because they like each other. Most share
common interests of music or film-making or travel.
I'd say to start hanging out with people with similar interests.
When your child shows an interest in something new, make an effort to hook
up with someone in that field---that person could become a life-long friend.
Due to shared interests.
A neighborhood is VERY different from a community. They could be one in the
same, but I bet that's rare.
"If you want to marry a doctor, hang out around the medical school."
Hang out where the interesting folk ARE.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mozafamily@... writes:
So how is my community going to help with my son's education??? <<<<
Change your community.
That doesn't mean you have to move. It just means that you have to seek out
those you'd like to associate with.
Our *neighborhood* is made of of lots of retirees who keep to themselves,
parents of older kids who believe in school, but not necessarily in *our*
district (none of the kids go to school here where they're *supposed* to go! <g>),
lots and lots of Christians (one's delightful daughter is going straight to
hell because she's a lesbian)---and everyone pretty much keeps to himself.
Our *community* is made of a college professors, professional magicians,
artists, actors, a theatre owner, a massage therapist, a dietician, several dog
breeders, a welder, an advertising exec, college students, a banker, and a
private school principal. We've sought these folks out because they're
interesting and interested. THEY are our community.
Cameron's doing his own community builiding. Many of his newer friends are
in their twenties. A few are in their forties. He has a five year old that he
spends time with---not paid, but just because they like each other. Most share
common interests of music or film-making or travel.
I'd say to start hanging out with people with similar interests.
When your child shows an interest in something new, make an effort to hook
up with someone in that field---that person could become a life-long friend.
Due to shared interests.
A neighborhood is VERY different from a community. They could be one in the
same, but I bet that's rare.
"If you want to marry a doctor, hang out around the medical school."
Hang out where the interesting folk ARE.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Penn Acres
I wonder if the term "Community" might sometimes be taken to mean-"the people in your neighborhood", or " many of the people in your town", or your church.
Depending on your outlook on life it might mean- "the supportive members of your family", the supportive or like-thinking members of your neighbourhood, town or church. parents group, park group, childrens activities groups.
Personally, I don.t think it is of any value for our kids or family to spend much time around non-supportive people or people who won't mind their own business about something that I didn.t initiate into a conversation.
Of course there always will be people who ask the standard questions. Why arent you in school today? What grade are you in?
I think it is my job to "field the flack"
This often means a bright "we're so lucky, we homeschool!"
I don't let others lead the conversation where I don't feel like going. ( At least I try , but sometimes stuff comes from where you least expect it-or i am caught off balance)
For us, right now, (rural lifestyle, family and I that much prefers few trips to town for general stuff) lots of trips there for the girls chosen activities)
Our "supportive" community is my husband and I, other members of the family that don.t buy into home or unschooling but are never the less kind, non judgmental people at least when we are around.
It includes the leaders , instructors, of the groups they are in, figure skating, dance, our library staff, many of the local store owners who don,t know, don,t care and if they ask are pleasant and mildly or quite supportive.Parents of the few kids they like to play with , some of whom have teacher parents.
Our situation differs dramatically from many on the list but I believe that many of us as unschoolers would feel they are get to decide who the community will be that we will be part of.
Grace
rather hidden in the beautiful mountains of BC.-with snow on the back ranges!!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Depending on your outlook on life it might mean- "the supportive members of your family", the supportive or like-thinking members of your neighbourhood, town or church. parents group, park group, childrens activities groups.
Personally, I don.t think it is of any value for our kids or family to spend much time around non-supportive people or people who won't mind their own business about something that I didn.t initiate into a conversation.
Of course there always will be people who ask the standard questions. Why arent you in school today? What grade are you in?
I think it is my job to "field the flack"
This often means a bright "we're so lucky, we homeschool!"
I don't let others lead the conversation where I don't feel like going. ( At least I try , but sometimes stuff comes from where you least expect it-or i am caught off balance)
For us, right now, (rural lifestyle, family and I that much prefers few trips to town for general stuff) lots of trips there for the girls chosen activities)
Our "supportive" community is my husband and I, other members of the family that don.t buy into home or unschooling but are never the less kind, non judgmental people at least when we are around.
It includes the leaders , instructors, of the groups they are in, figure skating, dance, our library staff, many of the local store owners who don,t know, don,t care and if they ask are pleasant and mildly or quite supportive.Parents of the few kids they like to play with , some of whom have teacher parents.
Our situation differs dramatically from many on the list but I believe that many of us as unschoolers would feel they are get to decide who the community will be that we will be part of.
Grace
rather hidden in the beautiful mountains of BC.-with snow on the back ranges!!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Penn Acres
This is my own outlook and not in any way attempting to question the validity of the following posters concerns'
For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)
If that loving , respectful, and happy relationship is seen in public by other parents that would be a good thing and supportive of good parenting , i think.
If I can relate to other children in the same way I do my own I think that woud be supportive of them . and a good thing.
And as far as wanting my kids to be any part of the type of local" Community" as described below....
:-)..."no way..Jose".
I would of course be trying to explain what is going on in some of these instances and trying to dialogue with them how people make choices on what to include in their lives. (and no, i am not great at this, but i keep trying.)
grace
..............................................................................................................................................
.....----- Original Message -----
From: mozafamily
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 12:16 PM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Community education
I should state up front that I feel part of my purpose in life
is to help others better understand their children's needs, and I
myslef am learning more about understanding them daily! That said I
think that for a child's education to include his/her community is
important, I would like for my child to actually have more community
opportunitites.
But how do I help with this? Unfortunately I'm not the greatest
friend maker in the world so getting someone to listen to my point
of view is a rare experience, unless you count the poeple who arn't
my friends who just happen to be treating my child or their children
so poorly that I just have to speak up and share. How can I let my
child be partially educated by the community when the neighbors up
the street are drugging their children, starving them and forcing
them to "get out of their hair" ie go to school from 7 - 6 pm -
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)
If that loving , respectful, and happy relationship is seen in public by other parents that would be a good thing and supportive of good parenting , i think.
If I can relate to other children in the same way I do my own I think that woud be supportive of them . and a good thing.
And as far as wanting my kids to be any part of the type of local" Community" as described below....
:-)..."no way..Jose".
I would of course be trying to explain what is going on in some of these instances and trying to dialogue with them how people make choices on what to include in their lives. (and no, i am not great at this, but i keep trying.)
grace
..............................................................................................................................................
.....----- Original Message -----
From: mozafamily
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 12:16 PM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Community education
I should state up front that I feel part of my purpose in life
is to help others better understand their children's needs, and I
myslef am learning more about understanding them daily! That said I
think that for a child's education to include his/her community is
important, I would like for my child to actually have more community
opportunitites.
But how do I help with this? Unfortunately I'm not the greatest
friend maker in the world so getting someone to listen to my point
of view is a rare experience, unless you count the poeple who arn't
my friends who just happen to be treating my child or their children
so poorly that I just have to speak up and share. How can I let my
child be partially educated by the community when the neighbors up
the street are drugging their children, starving them and forcing
them to "get out of their hair" ie go to school from 7 - 6 pm -
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mozafamily
Thank you for your responses so far I think I am starting to see
some alternatives to my current thinking. So could you help me now
with some ideas on what to say when my kid wants to go next door? I
will have to work harder to help him make his own community (he is
only 6 so I don't think he's going to meet that many people on his
own.) and NO I don't want to move - We have put so much work into
our house (it's worth 1 1/2X now what it was when we bought it
because of our remodeling efforts), this is the first house we've
owned and I don't want to move just because of the neighbors - many
of whom are renters anyhow! How do you keep from being depressed by
the treatment of the children in this world who's parents treat them
so poorly? I was an optimist until I got pregnant and I think I have
been on anxiety/pessimism overload since then, I'm sure it's some
natual inbuilt protective mechanism but how can I use it to my
advantage for my son?
I think I will just try to imagine my "community" as the people
who I can trust to treat me and my son with respect and otherwise
they are not allowed into that part of our lives, that we will just
deal with them the best we can, but be cautious of them. I do wish
there were more unschoolers that lived closer to us.
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense?
--- In [email protected], "Penn Acres" <pennacres@r...>
wrote:
of good parenting , i think.
make choices on what to include in their lives. (and no, i am not
great at this, but i keep trying.)
......
some alternatives to my current thinking. So could you help me now
with some ideas on what to say when my kid wants to go next door? I
will have to work harder to help him make his own community (he is
only 6 so I don't think he's going to meet that many people on his
own.) and NO I don't want to move - We have put so much work into
our house (it's worth 1 1/2X now what it was when we bought it
because of our remodeling efforts), this is the first house we've
owned and I don't want to move just because of the neighbors - many
of whom are renters anyhow! How do you keep from being depressed by
the treatment of the children in this world who's parents treat them
so poorly? I was an optimist until I got pregnant and I think I have
been on anxiety/pessimism overload since then, I'm sure it's some
natual inbuilt protective mechanism but how can I use it to my
advantage for my son?
I think I will just try to imagine my "community" as the people
who I can trust to treat me and my son with respect and otherwise
they are not allowed into that part of our lives, that we will just
deal with them the best we can, but be cautious of them. I do wish
there were more unschoolers that lived closer to us.
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense?
--- In [email protected], "Penn Acres" <pennacres@r...>
wrote:
> This is my own outlook and not in any way attempting toquestion the validity of the following posters concerns'
>(and I fail lots of times,)
> For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well as I can,
> If that loving , respectful, and happy relationship is seenin public by other parents that would be a good thing and supportive
of good parenting , i think.
> If I can relate to other children in the same way I do my own Ithink that woud be supportive of them . and a good thing.
> And as far as wanting my kids to be any part of the type oflocal" Community" as described below....
> :-)..."no way..Jose".some of these instances and trying to dialogue with them how people
> I would of course be trying to explain what is going on in
make choices on what to include in their lives. (and no, i am not
great at this, but i keep trying.)
> grace.....................................................................
>
>
>
> ...................................................................
......
> .....----- Original Message -----life
> From: mozafamily
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 12:16 PM
> Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Community education
>
>
> I should state up front that I feel part of my purpose in
> is to help others better understand their children's needs, andI
> myslef am learning more about understanding them daily! Thatsaid I
> think that for a child's education to include his/her communityis
> important, I would like for my child to actually have morecommunity
> opportunitites.greatest
> But how do I help with this? Unfortunately I'm not the
> friend maker in the world so getting someone to listen to mypoint
> of view is a rare experience, unless you count the poeple whoarn't
> my friends who just happen to be treating my child or theirchildren
> so poorly that I just have to speak up and share. How can I letmy
> child be partially educated by the community when the neighborsup
> the street are drugging their children, starving them andforcing
> them to "get out of their hair" ie go to school from 7 - 6 pm -
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/12/2004 4:06:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mozafamily@... writes:
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
Not really. Want to rephrase?
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mozafamily@... writes:
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
Not really. Want to rephrase?
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Barbara Chase
> You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as wellJust because a child grows up doesn't mean we won't still be relating to
>as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
>but what happens when the kid grow up?
them as well as we can ;-)
--bc--
Sondra Carr
It made perfect sense to me - which part didn't you understand? It seemed
that she was referring to a balance between her role as a mother to her
children and her self, separate from that role.
Sondra
-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@... [mailto:kbcdlovejo@...]
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 5:16 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Community education
In a message dated 9/12/2004 4:06:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mozafamily@... writes:
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
Not really. Want to rephrase?
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
that she was referring to a balance between her role as a mother to her
children and her self, separate from that role.
Sondra
-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@... [mailto:kbcdlovejo@...]
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 5:16 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Community education
In a message dated 9/12/2004 4:06:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mozafamily@... writes:
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
Not really. Want to rephrase?
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sondra Carr
Very true, but the relationship does change and become less a part of your
everyday experience (and theirs) as they grow up and away. Ideally, I think,
in an unschooling situation we tend to evolve into a friendship with our
children - with all the respect and equality that implies - a lot faster
than in "normal" growing situations, however, there still will be a shift
toward peers, careers, and the child's new family as they age. It seemed to
me that the original poster was simply stating that she found that balancing
this relationship between the self as mother and the individual self early
on was a healthy choice.
Sondra
-----Original Message-----
From: Barbara Chase [mailto:barb@...]
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 5:27 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Community education
them as well as we can ;-)
--bc--
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
everyday experience (and theirs) as they grow up and away. Ideally, I think,
in an unschooling situation we tend to evolve into a friendship with our
children - with all the respect and equality that implies - a lot faster
than in "normal" growing situations, however, there still will be a shift
toward peers, careers, and the child's new family as they age. It seemed to
me that the original poster was simply stating that she found that balancing
this relationship between the self as mother and the individual self early
on was a healthy choice.
Sondra
-----Original Message-----
From: Barbara Chase [mailto:barb@...]
Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 5:27 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Community education
> You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as wellJust because a child grows up doesn't mean we won't still be relating to
>as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
>but what happens when the kid grow up?
them as well as we can ;-)
--bc--
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[email protected]
In a message dated 9/12/2004 4:19:42 PM Central Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
mozafamily@... writes:
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
Not really. Want to rephrase?
~~~
It made sense to me. While raising children, it is worthy and noble to
treat them respectfully and as well as possible. But there is life after
children, when they won't be a part of the day to day. A mother of grown children
shouldn't sit around waiting for their children to call and come by so she can
pursue her "life's goal". Makes for one very unhappy mother, and would be
rather guilt producing in the children, don't you think?
She needs something else, more overarching than just something that applies
to her own children. Child raising is just a season of life. The principle
of treating children well can and should be practiced for a lifetime. But if
your "entire purpose in life is to treat your children well", eventually you
could be left with no reason to live.
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
mozafamily@... writes:
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
Not really. Want to rephrase?
~~~
It made sense to me. While raising children, it is worthy and noble to
treat them respectfully and as well as possible. But there is life after
children, when they won't be a part of the day to day. A mother of grown children
shouldn't sit around waiting for their children to call and come by so she can
pursue her "life's goal". Makes for one very unhappy mother, and would be
rather guilt producing in the children, don't you think?
She needs something else, more overarching than just something that applies
to her own children. Child raising is just a season of life. The principle
of treating children well can and should be practiced for a lifetime. But if
your "entire purpose in life is to treat your children well", eventually you
could be left with no reason to live.
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Elizabeth Hill
**
So could you help me now
with some ideas on what to say when my kid wants to go next door? **
If the neighboring parents are crabby, inviting their kid(s) over to your house is usually a more attractive choice.
Betsy
So could you help me now
with some ideas on what to say when my kid wants to go next door? **
If the neighboring parents are crabby, inviting their kid(s) over to your house is usually a more attractive choice.
Betsy
Deb Lewis
***Where is this community that I would trust to help with my child's
education??? ***
I think worrying about your neighborhood, town, and your child's
"education" is a lot of worry and you'd feel better if you could relax.
First, all of us face some of these same issues. All our kids probably
get those "why aren't you in school" questions. It gets easier. After
awhile more people will know you and fewer will ask. After awhile you'll
care less what other people are thinking and saying.
Your son is very young. Instead of worrying about his education try
thinking about today. How is he today?
What can you do with him today that he would like? If your goal is a
happy today you'll find facing each day easier.
If your neighbors aren't particularly nice you don't have to spend time
with them. If you know the lady at the corner store *is* nice, stop in
there and say hello when you're going by.
We live in a small town. There are a few homeschoolers here but they
stay inside during school hours. The result of that is that most of the
people in the community don't know they know many homeschoolers. But
they know us. <g>
The people at the grocery store know Dylan by name and know he doesn't go
to school. There are no more questions from them about why he's not is
school or what he's studying. The people at the library, video store,
variety store, antique store post office, book shop, coffee house and
green house know he doesn't go to school.
When he goes into the library our Librarian talks to him the way she
talks to everyone. She tells him about new books by authors he likes.
She informs him when there are new books about WWII. She shows him new
jazz cd's or new graphic novels.
When he goes to the book shop they let him into the back room to snoop
through the used science fiction books they don't have room for out
front. The set aside any old Peanuts books they come across and check to
see if he wants them. They don't ask what he's learning in school.
When he goes to the video store they don't ask me anymore if he's
"allowed" to rent this or that movie. <g>
We've been to the county extension agent so many times over the years
with different bugs that even after the guy retired he told Dylan to call
him if he had something interesting.
The vet has called on several occasions to invite Dylan to come see some
especially unusual critter or condition.
We go to town meetings. We go to plays. We go to concerts and garage
sales. And though sometimes someone new asks the same old questions,
more and more no one's new and they're finding other things to talk
about. <g>
Until an unschooling revolution changes the world we all will have to
deal with stupid people but the up side of that is once you know who the
really stupid ones are you can avoid them and go on to the interesting,
engaging, smart ones. <g>
Deb L
"Children do not need to be made to learn to be better, told what to do
or shown how. If they are given access to enough of the world, they will
see clearly enough what things are truly important to themselves and to
others, and they will make for themselves a better path into that world
then anyone else could make for them"
~John Holt~ "How Children Fail"
education??? ***
I think worrying about your neighborhood, town, and your child's
"education" is a lot of worry and you'd feel better if you could relax.
First, all of us face some of these same issues. All our kids probably
get those "why aren't you in school" questions. It gets easier. After
awhile more people will know you and fewer will ask. After awhile you'll
care less what other people are thinking and saying.
Your son is very young. Instead of worrying about his education try
thinking about today. How is he today?
What can you do with him today that he would like? If your goal is a
happy today you'll find facing each day easier.
If your neighbors aren't particularly nice you don't have to spend time
with them. If you know the lady at the corner store *is* nice, stop in
there and say hello when you're going by.
We live in a small town. There are a few homeschoolers here but they
stay inside during school hours. The result of that is that most of the
people in the community don't know they know many homeschoolers. But
they know us. <g>
The people at the grocery store know Dylan by name and know he doesn't go
to school. There are no more questions from them about why he's not is
school or what he's studying. The people at the library, video store,
variety store, antique store post office, book shop, coffee house and
green house know he doesn't go to school.
When he goes into the library our Librarian talks to him the way she
talks to everyone. She tells him about new books by authors he likes.
She informs him when there are new books about WWII. She shows him new
jazz cd's or new graphic novels.
When he goes to the book shop they let him into the back room to snoop
through the used science fiction books they don't have room for out
front. The set aside any old Peanuts books they come across and check to
see if he wants them. They don't ask what he's learning in school.
When he goes to the video store they don't ask me anymore if he's
"allowed" to rent this or that movie. <g>
We've been to the county extension agent so many times over the years
with different bugs that even after the guy retired he told Dylan to call
him if he had something interesting.
The vet has called on several occasions to invite Dylan to come see some
especially unusual critter or condition.
We go to town meetings. We go to plays. We go to concerts and garage
sales. And though sometimes someone new asks the same old questions,
more and more no one's new and they're finding other things to talk
about. <g>
Until an unschooling revolution changes the world we all will have to
deal with stupid people but the up side of that is once you know who the
really stupid ones are you can avoid them and go on to the interesting,
engaging, smart ones. <g>
Deb L
"Children do not need to be made to learn to be better, told what to do
or shown how. If they are given access to enough of the world, they will
see clearly enough what things are truly important to themselves and to
others, and they will make for themselves a better path into that world
then anyone else could make for them"
~John Holt~ "How Children Fail"
Elizabeth Hill
**
When he goes to the book shop they let him into the back room to snoop
through the used science fiction books they don't have room for out
front.**
(that reminds me...)
I'm interested in SciFi book recommendations for a 10 year old boy who really likes Harry Potter and Edward Eager and Mercedes Lackey. He likes the Star Trek TNG novels about when the characters went to school. <g> (Starfleet Academy) I'd probably read them aloud, so difficult vocabulary is not a problem.
He liked Ender's Game, but other than that we haven't done "adult level" sci fi books. The only "juvenille" SciFi that leaps to mind is Heinlein, and the science in those is pretty outdated.
Any ideas? He really likes books about animals and dragons, so he might really like non-humanoid aliens.
Betsy
When he goes to the book shop they let him into the back room to snoop
through the used science fiction books they don't have room for out
front.**
(that reminds me...)
I'm interested in SciFi book recommendations for a 10 year old boy who really likes Harry Potter and Edward Eager and Mercedes Lackey. He likes the Star Trek TNG novels about when the characters went to school. <g> (Starfleet Academy) I'd probably read them aloud, so difficult vocabulary is not a problem.
He liked Ender's Game, but other than that we haven't done "adult level" sci fi books. The only "juvenille" SciFi that leaps to mind is Heinlein, and the science in those is pretty outdated.
Any ideas? He really likes books about animals and dragons, so he might really like non-humanoid aliens.
Betsy
AlysonRR
You didn't mention a couple of my favorite authors: Anne McCaffery
(some books are juvenile, some are NOT), Lois McMaster Bujold (her
character Miles was our inspiration for naming our son), Tamora Pierce
(I think all hers are juvenile). That's all that springs to mind at the
moment - hope it helps!
Alyson
-----Original Message-----
From: Elizabeth Hill
. He liked Ender's Game, but other than that we haven't done "adult
level" sci fi books. The only "juvenille" SciFi that leaps to mind is
Heinlein, and the science in those is pretty outdated.
Any ideas? He really likes books about animals and dragons, so he might
really like non-humanoid aliens.
Betsy
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
(some books are juvenile, some are NOT), Lois McMaster Bujold (her
character Miles was our inspiration for naming our son), Tamora Pierce
(I think all hers are juvenile). That's all that springs to mind at the
moment - hope it helps!
Alyson
-----Original Message-----
From: Elizabeth Hill
. He liked Ender's Game, but other than that we haven't done "adult
level" sci fi books. The only "juvenille" SciFi that leaps to mind is
Heinlein, and the science in those is pretty outdated.
Any ideas? He really likes books about animals and dragons, so he might
really like non-humanoid aliens.
Betsy
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
carelia
> I'm interested in SciFi book recommendations for a 10 year old boy whoHas he read the Artemis Fowl series? Not SF as such but they have
> really likes Harry Potter and Edward Eager and Mercedes Lackey.
techie-elves and stuff in them. :)
Or the rest in the Ender's Game series? DH says anything by Terry
Pratchett, and the Wrinkle in Time series, DS (13) says Pern. :)
HTH.
C.
Paula Sjogerman
You knew I'd answer this one, didn't ya? <g>
There's the Foundation Trilogy by Isaac Asimov. The science will be outdated
but still interesting. Also the stories in I, Robot (they're not like the
movie).
There's Marion Zimmer Bradley - I loved those.
But is the science part important?
Otherwise, there's Bruce Coville's books which have terrible titles but are
really fun ("An Alien Ate MY Homework" is one).
Ray Bradbury
Harlan Ellison (some of his stories are a bit grim)
Patricia Wrede has a whole series of dragon books, as does Anne McCaffrey
(sp?)
All of Tamara Pierce's books are good - dragons, talking animals,
medievalish villians and magic.
Douglas Adams
I'll keep thinking.
Paula
There's the Foundation Trilogy by Isaac Asimov. The science will be outdated
but still interesting. Also the stories in I, Robot (they're not like the
movie).
There's Marion Zimmer Bradley - I loved those.
But is the science part important?
Otherwise, there's Bruce Coville's books which have terrible titles but are
really fun ("An Alien Ate MY Homework" is one).
Ray Bradbury
Harlan Ellison (some of his stories are a bit grim)
Patricia Wrede has a whole series of dragon books, as does Anne McCaffrey
(sp?)
All of Tamara Pierce's books are good - dragons, talking animals,
medievalish villians and magic.
Douglas Adams
I'll keep thinking.
Paula
Robyn Coburn
He may like the Dragon Riders of Pern series by Anne McCaffrey. Also
"Decision at Doona" & sequels by the same author (feline aliens and humans
co-existing)
Robyn L. Coburn
<<< Any ideas? He really likes books about animals and dragons, so he might
really like non-humanoid aliens. >>>>>
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"Decision at Doona" & sequels by the same author (feline aliens and humans
co-existing)
Robyn L. Coburn
<<< Any ideas? He really likes books about animals and dragons, so he might
really like non-humanoid aliens. >>>>>
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Elizabeth Hill
**
Or the rest in the Ender's Game series? DH says anything by Terry
Pratchett, and the Wrinkle in Time series, DS (13) says Pern. **
Oh, yeah. I requested Dragonflight on tape from the library and it came in this week, but the library FROZE my card because of some magazines that I returned that got misplaced. So I had to go home empty handed.
Curses, foiled again. <g>
I'm making a list of book reqs here, thanks. Thanks everyone.
Betsy
Or the rest in the Ender's Game series? DH says anything by Terry
Pratchett, and the Wrinkle in Time series, DS (13) says Pern. **
Oh, yeah. I requested Dragonflight on tape from the library and it came in this week, but the library FROZE my card because of some magazines that I returned that got misplaced. So I had to go home empty handed.
Curses, foiled again. <g>
I'm making a list of book reqs here, thanks. Thanks everyone.
Betsy
Elizabeth Hill
**
Lois McMaster Bujold (her
character Miles was our inspiration for naming our son)**
Oh, I LOVE Lois McM. B., but the first book in that series, Shards of Honor, has sexual torture as a fairly major plot element, so I would think it's not for anyone under 14, or anyone who finds fiction overwhelmingly real.
Betsy
Lois McMaster Bujold (her
character Miles was our inspiration for naming our son)**
Oh, I LOVE Lois McM. B., but the first book in that series, Shards of Honor, has sexual torture as a fairly major plot element, so I would think it's not for anyone under 14, or anyone who finds fiction overwhelmingly real.
Betsy
mozafamily
Yes - Let me rephrase it, my husband helped me to clarify what I
was trying to state, so I have to give him a pat on the back for at
least trying to understand me! LOL anyhow to rephrase: ONE of the
purposes in my life can be to treat my child as well as I can but I
don't believe it to be my ONLY purpose in life.
Now I have to read the rest of the comments that have been made
since I last posted. Thanks again for everybody's input - Moza
was trying to state, so I have to give him a pat on the back for at
least trying to understand me! LOL anyhow to rephrase: ONE of the
purposes in my life can be to treat my child as well as I can but I
don't believe it to be my ONLY purpose in life.
Now I have to read the rest of the comments that have been made
since I last posted. Thanks again for everybody's input - Moza
--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 9/12/2004 4:06:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mozafamily@y... writes:
>
> You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
> as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good
purpose
> but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose
for
> my life on something that at most will probably last about 12
more
> years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part
of
> my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
> worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
> that make sense? <<<
>
> Not really. Want to rephrase?
>
> ~Kelly
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Penn Acres
You said "For me, my purpose in life is to treat my kids as well
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
........................................................................................................................................
When I wrote that:- "for me, etc.... it was in the context of the original post which I read as questioning how to include her young child in the local "community" given that she felt it was her lifes interest to help parents treat their children in better ways. The poster then included descriptions of members of her "community" which sounded pretty toxic to me. My reply was based on this being an unschooling list and addressing an approach that I take with my gg.ds in Community involvement in an unschooling way.
I wouldn't dream of replying to a post about someones life goals, it is of no interest to me other than the unschooling children aspect. Of course I have other "purposes in life"-being 65 and having raised 5 adult children and an adopted grandaughter and now my great grandaughters-thats 50 years of parenting life.Thats a lot of water under a lot of bridges ;-)
Sorry if I misunderstood the original focus of the post.
Grace
where the girls are now getting "married" again on Harvest Moon and deeply involved...and I'm going to bed to read....actually David Alberts new book-Homeschooling and the voyage of Self Discovery...
Hmmm maybe I don,t have a real life....oh, right, I have to get up early as I have customers from Seattle arriving in the morning with their dogs while they hike in Lake Louise-whewwww--was worried there for a minute.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
as I can, (and I fail lots of times,)" - this is a good purpose
but what happens when the kid grow up? I can't base the purpose for
my life on something that at most will probably last about 12 more
years, I feel the need for a LIFE goal, sure my own kid is a part of
my goal but not the whole thing - I don't think my whole life's
worth is based on my child although it is a big part of it. Does
that make sense? <<<
........................................................................................................................................
When I wrote that:- "for me, etc.... it was in the context of the original post which I read as questioning how to include her young child in the local "community" given that she felt it was her lifes interest to help parents treat their children in better ways. The poster then included descriptions of members of her "community" which sounded pretty toxic to me. My reply was based on this being an unschooling list and addressing an approach that I take with my gg.ds in Community involvement in an unschooling way.
I wouldn't dream of replying to a post about someones life goals, it is of no interest to me other than the unschooling children aspect. Of course I have other "purposes in life"-being 65 and having raised 5 adult children and an adopted grandaughter and now my great grandaughters-thats 50 years of parenting life.Thats a lot of water under a lot of bridges ;-)
Sorry if I misunderstood the original focus of the post.
Grace
where the girls are now getting "married" again on Harvest Moon and deeply involved...and I'm going to bed to read....actually David Alberts new book-Homeschooling and the voyage of Self Discovery...
Hmmm maybe I don,t have a real life....oh, right, I have to get up early as I have customers from Seattle arriving in the morning with their dogs while they hike in Lake Louise-whewwww--was worried there for a minute.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mozafamily
If only it was that easy! I do try and invite the kids over here
but the kids don't magically transform once they enter our home -
they still have a lot of negatives that it is impossible for me to
even break the "ice" on because they have drilled in "public school
and do what your parents tell you without question", and once they
see how much freedom my son has the situation almost always turns
abusive!!! And although I try to be as present, supportive and
explicative as I can it frankly just doesn't do well for my son to
have mom constantly butting in when he finally gets a friend over!
We went through a terrible ordeal with neighbor children stealing
food this summer - I explained it on one of the lists I frequent but
I don't think it was this one. But the kids made excuses to come in
and then took food and left, usually proclaiming they wanted to play
with ds but usually just wanting a snack and leaving as soon as they
secured one - imagine how that made my son feel! I tried to talk
with him about it and I think towards the end of the summer he
understood that they weren't really being his friend when they did
that, but it still doesn't make it easier for him to not want to go
play with them when he sees them playing in their yards. Finally
what we do now when kids do come over we offer them a snack just
about as soon as they walk in the door - so if they're just there
for the snack then they can take it and go, there's no need to
pretend that they want to play. I'm not sure if they cought on to
that or the fact that they're now back in school but they haven't
been over in about 2 weeks. Anyhow as much as I would love to be
able to make these kids understand some things I can't because
they're not interested in learning them! And they get this not
willingness to understand things from their parents because I have
talked to them as well! Anyhow I am going to try and just find more
like - minded parents and their kids for my child to play with, to
be our community, but frankly it's definately not easy! However I'm
not going to stop trying to "educate" my neighbors about the child-
led mentality either, perhaps some may catch on, but until then I am
going to have my guard up to protect my child! I should also say I
will be there for my child when he gets hurt because as much as I
want to protect him, I know when he asks to go to the neighbors and
even though I've explained to him why it may not be the best
decision, I know he may decide to go and find for himself and
because I trust him I will let him.
--- In [email protected], Elizabeth Hill
<ecsamhill@e...> wrote:
but the kids don't magically transform once they enter our home -
they still have a lot of negatives that it is impossible for me to
even break the "ice" on because they have drilled in "public school
and do what your parents tell you without question", and once they
see how much freedom my son has the situation almost always turns
abusive!!! And although I try to be as present, supportive and
explicative as I can it frankly just doesn't do well for my son to
have mom constantly butting in when he finally gets a friend over!
We went through a terrible ordeal with neighbor children stealing
food this summer - I explained it on one of the lists I frequent but
I don't think it was this one. But the kids made excuses to come in
and then took food and left, usually proclaiming they wanted to play
with ds but usually just wanting a snack and leaving as soon as they
secured one - imagine how that made my son feel! I tried to talk
with him about it and I think towards the end of the summer he
understood that they weren't really being his friend when they did
that, but it still doesn't make it easier for him to not want to go
play with them when he sees them playing in their yards. Finally
what we do now when kids do come over we offer them a snack just
about as soon as they walk in the door - so if they're just there
for the snack then they can take it and go, there's no need to
pretend that they want to play. I'm not sure if they cought on to
that or the fact that they're now back in school but they haven't
been over in about 2 weeks. Anyhow as much as I would love to be
able to make these kids understand some things I can't because
they're not interested in learning them! And they get this not
willingness to understand things from their parents because I have
talked to them as well! Anyhow I am going to try and just find more
like - minded parents and their kids for my child to play with, to
be our community, but frankly it's definately not easy! However I'm
not going to stop trying to "educate" my neighbors about the child-
led mentality either, perhaps some may catch on, but until then I am
going to have my guard up to protect my child! I should also say I
will be there for my child when he gets hurt because as much as I
want to protect him, I know when he asks to go to the neighbors and
even though I've explained to him why it may not be the best
decision, I know he may decide to go and find for himself and
because I trust him I will let him.
--- In [email protected], Elizabeth Hill
<ecsamhill@e...> wrote:
>**
>
> **
>
> So could you help me now
> with some ideas on what to say when my kid wants to go next door?
>to your house is usually a more attractive choice.
> If the neighboring parents are crabby, inviting their kid(s) over
>
> Betsy
[email protected]
On Sun, 12 Sep 2004 17:22:52 -0700 Elizabeth Hill
<ecsamhill@...> writes:
would read next, because it's chronologically simultaneous, although it
wasn't the one that came out next. It's also a bit easier to read than
most of the others.
Asimov is another option. Rain read "I, Robot" right after "Ender's
Game", as I recall. Just don't think about the &*$% movie.
I suppose Princess Bride ("PB" to our crowd) is more fantasy than scifi,
but it's a good read.
Dar
<ecsamhill@...> writes:
>There were lots of sequels to this. "Ender's Shadow" would be the one I
> He liked Ender's Game, but other than that we haven't done "adult
> level" sci fi books. The only "juvenille" SciFi that leaps to mind
> is Heinlein, and the science in those is pretty outdated.
would read next, because it's chronologically simultaneous, although it
wasn't the one that came out next. It's also a bit easier to read than
most of the others.
Asimov is another option. Rain read "I, Robot" right after "Ender's
Game", as I recall. Just don't think about the &*$% movie.
I suppose Princess Bride ("PB" to our crowd) is more fantasy than scifi,
but it's a good read.
Dar
mozafamily
Tom Swift series - that's the only one I can think of that hasn't
already been mentioned!
already been mentioned!
mozafamily
Thank you for your post! I think I will try to concentrate on
the "today" aspect you gave. But as for the neighbors it's kind of
hard to not somehow spend time with them - whether it's just them
dropping by to see if ds wants to go to "church" with them (they
should really understand by now that we don't and they have gotten
my son's hopes up that they were coming to play with him!URGH! Just
happened yesturday - I do know I need to relax more - didn't I just
write somewhere that when I got pregnant that I went into hyper
cautious mode and haven't left it yet!!! <g>) or when they see my ds
doing something fun in the yard they hop over and insist that they
be allowed do join, I refuse to hide from them but sometimes I think
it would be easier, I don't think they've ever asked my son to come
over to their house and play! Oh well more time that he can spend
perfecting his latest computer game or wrestling with dad, etc. But
I think you are right about us concentrating more on the more
helpful side of our community. Moza
--- In [email protected], Deb Lewis <ddzimlew@j...>
wrote:
the "today" aspect you gave. But as for the neighbors it's kind of
hard to not somehow spend time with them - whether it's just them
dropping by to see if ds wants to go to "church" with them (they
should really understand by now that we don't and they have gotten
my son's hopes up that they were coming to play with him!URGH! Just
happened yesturday - I do know I need to relax more - didn't I just
write somewhere that when I got pregnant that I went into hyper
cautious mode and haven't left it yet!!! <g>) or when they see my ds
doing something fun in the yard they hop over and insist that they
be allowed do join, I refuse to hide from them but sometimes I think
it would be easier, I don't think they've ever asked my son to come
over to their house and play! Oh well more time that he can spend
perfecting his latest computer game or wrestling with dad, etc. But
I think you are right about us concentrating more on the more
helpful side of our community. Moza
--- In [email protected], Deb Lewis <ddzimlew@j...>
wrote:
>child's
> ***Where is this community that I would trust to help with my
> education??? ***relax.
>
> I think worrying about your neighborhood, town, and your child's
> "education" is a lot of worry and you'd feel better if you could
> First, all of us face some of these same issues. All our kidsprobably
> get those "why aren't you in school" questions. It gets easier.After
> awhile more people will know you and fewer will ask. After awhileyou'll
> care less what other people are thinking and saying.try
>
> Your son is very young. Instead of worrying about his education
> thinking about today. How is he today?is a
> What can you do with him today that he would like? If your goal
> happy today you'll find facing each day easier.time
>
> If your neighbors aren't particularly nice you don't have to spend
> with them. If you know the lady at the corner store *is* nice,stop in
> there and say hello when you're going by.they
>
> We live in a small town. There are a few homeschoolers here but
> stay inside during school hours. The result of that is that mostof the
> people in the community don't know they know many homeschoolers.But
> they know us. <g>doesn't go
>
> The people at the grocery store know Dylan by name and know he
> to school. There are no more questions from them about why he'snot is
> school or what he's studying. The people at the library, videostore,
> variety store, antique store post office, book shop, coffee houseand
> green house know he doesn't go to school.she
>
> When he goes into the library our Librarian talks to him the way
> talks to everyone. She tells him about new books by authors helikes.
> She informs him when there are new books about WWII. She showshim new
> jazz cd's or new graphic novels.snoop
>
> When he goes to the book shop they let him into the back room to
> through the used science fiction books they don't have room for outcheck to
> front. The set aside any old Peanuts books they come across and
> see if he wants them. They don't ask what he's learning inschool.
>years
> When he goes to the video store they don't ask me anymore if he's
> "allowed" to rent this or that movie. <g>
>
> We've been to the county extension agent so many times over the
> with different bugs that even after the guy retired he told Dylanto call
> him if he had something interesting.see some
>
> The vet has called on several occasions to invite Dylan to come
> especially unusual critter or condition.garage
>
> We go to town meetings. We go to plays. We go to concerts and
> sales. And though sometimes someone new asks the same oldquestions,
> more and more no one's new and they're finding other things to talkto
> about. <g>
>
> Until an unschooling revolution changes the world we all will have
> deal with stupid people but the up side of that is once you knowwho the
> really stupid ones are you can avoid them and go on to theinteresting,
> engaging, smart ones. <g>to do
>
> Deb L
>
> "Children do not need to be made to learn to be better, told what
> or shown how. If they are given access to enough of the world,they will
> see clearly enough what things are truly important to themselvesand to
> others, and they will make for themselves a better path into thatworld
> then anyone else could make for them"
> ~John Holt~ "How Children Fail"
Fetteroll
on 9/12/04 8:58 PM, Paula Sjogerman at sjogy@... wrote:
particular about what sex their partners were. Seems to me the sex had a
gratuitous feeling to it or characters that treated sexual relations too
casually or something that just irritated me.
Whatever it was, a 10 yo boy might find it ookie. ;-)
(But maybe someone has a fresher than 20 yo memory of her books and can give
better information.)
Joyce
> There's Marion Zimmer Bradley - I loved those.I'm vaguely remembering sex in her books and the characters not being
particular about what sex their partners were. Seems to me the sex had a
gratuitous feeling to it or characters that treated sexual relations too
casually or something that just irritated me.
Whatever it was, a 10 yo boy might find it ookie. ;-)
(But maybe someone has a fresher than 20 yo memory of her books and can give
better information.)
Joyce
Carla Tucker
Piers Anthony has some great books for young adults (Xanth Series), and some
of his other series may be aimed at an older audience, but could be
interesting to a younger reader (Incarnations of Immortality series.I read
these in high school.don't remember being particularly shocked but that WAS
many years ago, so maybe you should read them yourself first! :-))
Also, someone mentioned Heinlein.some of his books are very racy.
Gosh.I loved SF/Fantasy as a tween/teen. How come I can't remember
specifics? Maybe it's that quarter century of time that's passed since
then? Or maybe it's all that I've read since then and it's clogging my
brain!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
of his other series may be aimed at an older audience, but could be
interesting to a younger reader (Incarnations of Immortality series.I read
these in high school.don't remember being particularly shocked but that WAS
many years ago, so maybe you should read them yourself first! :-))
Also, someone mentioned Heinlein.some of his books are very racy.
Gosh.I loved SF/Fantasy as a tween/teen. How come I can't remember
specifics? Maybe it's that quarter century of time that's passed since
then? Or maybe it's all that I've read since then and it's clogging my
brain!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/13/2004 12:56:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mozafamily@... writes:
If only it was that easy! I do try and invite the kids over here
but the kids don't magically transform once they enter our home -
they still have a lot of negatives that it is impossible for me to
even break the "ice" on because they have drilled in "public school
and do what your parents tell you without question", and once they
see how much freedom my son has the situation almost always turns
abusive!!! <<<<
My sons have a friend like that. What I did was to find other children
their age that we could meet up with during school hours, homeschoolers. So I
didn't have to interfere with the other friendship. We kept meeting up with
these same homeschoolers and over time my boys developed more friendships with
different children. That gives them more choices as far as friends go. And
now that they have a wider range of friendships they have themselves made the
choice not to see this other boy again. They have not verbally said that
but they choose the newer friends to do things with and to go visit and to have
over. It has been their choice but a choice made with the information that
all people are not the same and they can decide who they want to hang around
with.
Just my thoughts,
Pam G
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mozafamily@... writes:
If only it was that easy! I do try and invite the kids over here
but the kids don't magically transform once they enter our home -
they still have a lot of negatives that it is impossible for me to
even break the "ice" on because they have drilled in "public school
and do what your parents tell you without question", and once they
see how much freedom my son has the situation almost always turns
abusive!!! <<<<
My sons have a friend like that. What I did was to find other children
their age that we could meet up with during school hours, homeschoolers. So I
didn't have to interfere with the other friendship. We kept meeting up with
these same homeschoolers and over time my boys developed more friendships with
different children. That gives them more choices as far as friends go. And
now that they have a wider range of friendships they have themselves made the
choice not to see this other boy again. They have not verbally said that
but they choose the newer friends to do things with and to go visit and to have
over. It has been their choice but a choice made with the information that
all people are not the same and they can decide who they want to hang around
with.
Just my thoughts,
Pam G
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Paula Sjogerman
on 9/13/04 12:55 AM, Fetteroll at fetteroll@... wrote:
Paula
> (But maybe someone has a fresher than 20 yo memory of her books and can giveThat wouldn't be me <gg>.
> better information.)
Paula