like-minded
Schuyler Waynforth <[email protected]>
I'm writing more out of a need to vent than from anything else.
We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
darkness.
When we first arrived there seemed to be no homeschoolers in our
area so we'd drive the long drive to Newcastle to meet up with the
group there. For about the last month a group has begun forming in
our area. It is slow and very committee minded. Everyone concerned
that it functions as a democracy, something I must admit to being
only nominally interested in. Fortunately I am vocal and pushy and
am able to be somewhat effective in molding the group to fit my
needs. All I want is a group that meets regularly and that gives my
kids some other kids to play with. At least that is what I profess
to wanting. I find, however, as time goes by that what I really
want is a group of unschoolers who hang out and trust that children
learn what they need to learn as they need to learn it. It isn't
going to happen. Many of the other people involved in this
fledgling organization have children who are still in school; are
very concerned with educational opportunities; are incredibly
curriculum minded. There are a couple of yahoo lists to help
organize meetings in the area and the level of discussion about
curriculum is so very discouraging. There is a trip planned for
today to some Roman ruins and one mother of a 4 and 2 year old has a
couple of worksheets for them to do most specifically on Roman
numerals. I don't understand it. I don't know Roman Numerals. I
can get to about 39. And the only time I am really curious or in
need is doing crossword puzzles or trying to figure out the
copyright on some old movie.
The other day we wrote out words using Braille coding. Simon wanted
to know what Braille was so I looked on line for an alphabet and
then we did a few words in Braille. He can't read or write with the
English alphabet, but it didn't stop him from writing mom and Simon
and Linnaea in Braille. And then he got bored. I wrote a brief
paragraph because it fascinated me, but by the time I was done he
was typing out math problems on the typewriter. As I write this it
sounds like such an academic pursuit. But most days we sit and
watch a lot of television. We watch DVDs on the computer, we play
Harry Potter II, we play Reader Rabbit (which I loathe but they
love) we staple paper to paper to make picture frames (okay, so that
just happened yesterday and today and Simon taught me how to do it)
we play a game on occasion, we read books, we build card houses, we
walk the dog. But the Braille was his curiosity. And there was no
testing and there were no worksheets and when he was done he was
done.
And that isn't the problem. I don't mind how Simon learns or how
Linnaea learns. What I mind is how little trust these people have
in their children. I realized recently that I am a real, at my
core, evolutionist. I believe that what they need to know they will
master. If reading is something they have to have to get by in life
they will have reading. If math makes a difference for them they
will have math. And I believe that those things are necessary for
quality of life. Since they are likely to live in a world similar
to mine, they will acquire those skills as they move through life.
But whether or not they know Roman numerals or whether or not they
passed their GCSE's or whatever tests they have to take seems moot.
And mere dressing. I think dressing is a wonderful thing, I have of
lots of dressing, the best stories are made up primarily of
dressing, but what dressing you get and how you get that dressing is
surely an individuals own choice.
It's not even that I consider myself a very good unschooler. I have
moments of "screw their choices, what about me." Moments of "if they
just did what they were told to do this wouldn't take so long." And
I have to read and reread posts at unschooling.com and at chat
groups. I don't post, I don't trust enough that I know what I am
doing to know what I am describing. But, I absolutely, without
question (well without more than the occasional question) believe
that they will learn without being taught. And so will I. And in
the U.S. we spent most of our time with schooling homeschoolers or
with schooled children. It just wasn't such an issue, and they were
far more relaxed about their children's education. And the only
concern was how well they got along. And unschooling is a more
common concept in the US. Once you've announced that you don't
school you have fewer conversations about what curriculum you are
using. Everyone here is scared about testing. Testing in the UK is
how you know your child is going to succeed in the world. If they
can't pass the tests they can't get into University. If they don't
get into University they won't have any kind of future. And once
the world is defined in those boxes it is hard to see around them.
How do I live in a world full of boxes I don't believe in? Sigh
Anyhow, I am just feeling bogged down in a world with too few like-
minded individuals.
Schuyler
We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
darkness.
When we first arrived there seemed to be no homeschoolers in our
area so we'd drive the long drive to Newcastle to meet up with the
group there. For about the last month a group has begun forming in
our area. It is slow and very committee minded. Everyone concerned
that it functions as a democracy, something I must admit to being
only nominally interested in. Fortunately I am vocal and pushy and
am able to be somewhat effective in molding the group to fit my
needs. All I want is a group that meets regularly and that gives my
kids some other kids to play with. At least that is what I profess
to wanting. I find, however, as time goes by that what I really
want is a group of unschoolers who hang out and trust that children
learn what they need to learn as they need to learn it. It isn't
going to happen. Many of the other people involved in this
fledgling organization have children who are still in school; are
very concerned with educational opportunities; are incredibly
curriculum minded. There are a couple of yahoo lists to help
organize meetings in the area and the level of discussion about
curriculum is so very discouraging. There is a trip planned for
today to some Roman ruins and one mother of a 4 and 2 year old has a
couple of worksheets for them to do most specifically on Roman
numerals. I don't understand it. I don't know Roman Numerals. I
can get to about 39. And the only time I am really curious or in
need is doing crossword puzzles or trying to figure out the
copyright on some old movie.
The other day we wrote out words using Braille coding. Simon wanted
to know what Braille was so I looked on line for an alphabet and
then we did a few words in Braille. He can't read or write with the
English alphabet, but it didn't stop him from writing mom and Simon
and Linnaea in Braille. And then he got bored. I wrote a brief
paragraph because it fascinated me, but by the time I was done he
was typing out math problems on the typewriter. As I write this it
sounds like such an academic pursuit. But most days we sit and
watch a lot of television. We watch DVDs on the computer, we play
Harry Potter II, we play Reader Rabbit (which I loathe but they
love) we staple paper to paper to make picture frames (okay, so that
just happened yesterday and today and Simon taught me how to do it)
we play a game on occasion, we read books, we build card houses, we
walk the dog. But the Braille was his curiosity. And there was no
testing and there were no worksheets and when he was done he was
done.
And that isn't the problem. I don't mind how Simon learns or how
Linnaea learns. What I mind is how little trust these people have
in their children. I realized recently that I am a real, at my
core, evolutionist. I believe that what they need to know they will
master. If reading is something they have to have to get by in life
they will have reading. If math makes a difference for them they
will have math. And I believe that those things are necessary for
quality of life. Since they are likely to live in a world similar
to mine, they will acquire those skills as they move through life.
But whether or not they know Roman numerals or whether or not they
passed their GCSE's or whatever tests they have to take seems moot.
And mere dressing. I think dressing is a wonderful thing, I have of
lots of dressing, the best stories are made up primarily of
dressing, but what dressing you get and how you get that dressing is
surely an individuals own choice.
It's not even that I consider myself a very good unschooler. I have
moments of "screw their choices, what about me." Moments of "if they
just did what they were told to do this wouldn't take so long." And
I have to read and reread posts at unschooling.com and at chat
groups. I don't post, I don't trust enough that I know what I am
doing to know what I am describing. But, I absolutely, without
question (well without more than the occasional question) believe
that they will learn without being taught. And so will I. And in
the U.S. we spent most of our time with schooling homeschoolers or
with schooled children. It just wasn't such an issue, and they were
far more relaxed about their children's education. And the only
concern was how well they got along. And unschooling is a more
common concept in the US. Once you've announced that you don't
school you have fewer conversations about what curriculum you are
using. Everyone here is scared about testing. Testing in the UK is
how you know your child is going to succeed in the world. If they
can't pass the tests they can't get into University. If they don't
get into University they won't have any kind of future. And once
the world is defined in those boxes it is hard to see around them.
How do I live in a world full of boxes I don't believe in? Sigh
Anyhow, I am just feeling bogged down in a world with too few like-
minded individuals.
Schuyler
Kelli Traaseth
Schuyley,
I'm sorry you are feeling so alone, I know how it feels.
There is a poster on this list who might have some reassuring words though!
SHYRLEY!!!!!!!
I don't think she's up though. She is originally from England, lives in the States now. Maybe she'll have some suggestions.
You just might have to wait an hour or so. <g>
Kelli
"Schuyler Waynforth <dwaynf@...>" <dwaynf@...> wrote:I'm writing more out of a need to vent than from anything else.
We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
darkness.
When we first arrived there seemed to be no homeschoolers in our
area so we'd drive the long drive to Newcastle to meet up with the
group there. For about the last month a group has begun forming in
our area. It is slow and very committee minded. Everyone concerned
that it functions as a democracy, something I must admit to being
only nominally interested in. Fortunately I am vocal and pushy and
am able to be somewhat effective in molding the group to fit my
needs. All I want is a group that meets regularly and that gives my
kids some other kids to play with. At least that is what I profess
to wanting. I find, however, as time goes by that what I really
want is a group of unschoolers who hang out and trust that children
learn what they need to learn as they need to learn it. It isn't
going to happen. Many of the other people involved in this
fledgling organization have children who are still in school; are
very concerned with educational opportunities; are incredibly
curriculum minded. There are a couple of yahoo lists to help
organize meetings in the area and the level of discussion about
curriculum is so very discouraging. There is a trip planned for
today to some Roman ruins and one mother of a 4 and 2 year old has a
couple of worksheets for them to do most specifically on Roman
numerals. I don't understand it. I don't know Roman Numerals. I
can get to about 39. And the only time I am really curious or in
need is doing crossword puzzles or trying to figure out the
copyright on some old movie.
The other day we wrote out words using Braille coding. Simon wanted
to know what Braille was so I looked on line for an alphabet and
then we did a few words in Braille. He can't read or write with the
English alphabet, but it didn't stop him from writing mom and Simon
and Linnaea in Braille. And then he got bored. I wrote a brief
paragraph because it fascinated me, but by the time I was done he
was typing out math problems on the typewriter. As I write this it
sounds like such an academic pursuit. But most days we sit and
watch a lot of television. We watch DVDs on the computer, we play
Harry Potter II, we play Reader Rabbit (which I loathe but they
love) we staple paper to paper to make picture frames (okay, so that
just happened yesterday and today and Simon taught me how to do it)
we play a game on occasion, we read books, we build card houses, we
walk the dog. But the Braille was his curiosity. And there was no
testing and there were no worksheets and when he was done he was
done.
And that isn't the problem. I don't mind how Simon learns or how
Linnaea learns. What I mind is how little trust these people have
in their children. I realized recently that I am a real, at my
core, evolutionist. I believe that what they need to know they will
master. If reading is something they have to have to get by in life
they will have reading. If math makes a difference for them they
will have math. And I believe that those things are necessary for
quality of life. Since they are likely to live in a world similar
to mine, they will acquire those skills as they move through life.
But whether or not they know Roman numerals or whether or not they
passed their GCSE's or whatever tests they have to take seems moot.
And mere dressing. I think dressing is a wonderful thing, I have of
lots of dressing, the best stories are made up primarily of
dressing, but what dressing you get and how you get that dressing is
surely an individuals own choice.
It's not even that I consider myself a very good unschooler. I have
moments of "screw their choices, what about me." Moments of "if they
just did what they were told to do this wouldn't take so long." And
I have to read and reread posts at unschooling.com and at chat
groups. I don't post, I don't trust enough that I know what I am
doing to know what I am describing. But, I absolutely, without
question (well without more than the occasional question) believe
that they will learn without being taught. And so will I. And in
the U.S. we spent most of our time with schooling homeschoolers or
with schooled children. It just wasn't such an issue, and they were
far more relaxed about their children's education. And the only
concern was how well they got along. And unschooling is a more
common concept in the US. Once you've announced that you don't
school you have fewer conversations about what curriculum you are
using. Everyone here is scared about testing. Testing in the UK is
how you know your child is going to succeed in the world. If they
can't pass the tests they can't get into University. If they don't
get into University they won't have any kind of future. And once
the world is defined in those boxes it is hard to see around them.
How do I live in a world full of boxes I don't believe in? Sigh�
Anyhow, I am just feeling bogged down in a world with too few like-
minded individuals.
Schuyler
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'm sorry you are feeling so alone, I know how it feels.
There is a poster on this list who might have some reassuring words though!
SHYRLEY!!!!!!!
I don't think she's up though. She is originally from England, lives in the States now. Maybe she'll have some suggestions.
You just might have to wait an hour or so. <g>
Kelli
"Schuyler Waynforth <dwaynf@...>" <dwaynf@...> wrote:I'm writing more out of a need to vent than from anything else.
We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
darkness.
When we first arrived there seemed to be no homeschoolers in our
area so we'd drive the long drive to Newcastle to meet up with the
group there. For about the last month a group has begun forming in
our area. It is slow and very committee minded. Everyone concerned
that it functions as a democracy, something I must admit to being
only nominally interested in. Fortunately I am vocal and pushy and
am able to be somewhat effective in molding the group to fit my
needs. All I want is a group that meets regularly and that gives my
kids some other kids to play with. At least that is what I profess
to wanting. I find, however, as time goes by that what I really
want is a group of unschoolers who hang out and trust that children
learn what they need to learn as they need to learn it. It isn't
going to happen. Many of the other people involved in this
fledgling organization have children who are still in school; are
very concerned with educational opportunities; are incredibly
curriculum minded. There are a couple of yahoo lists to help
organize meetings in the area and the level of discussion about
curriculum is so very discouraging. There is a trip planned for
today to some Roman ruins and one mother of a 4 and 2 year old has a
couple of worksheets for them to do most specifically on Roman
numerals. I don't understand it. I don't know Roman Numerals. I
can get to about 39. And the only time I am really curious or in
need is doing crossword puzzles or trying to figure out the
copyright on some old movie.
The other day we wrote out words using Braille coding. Simon wanted
to know what Braille was so I looked on line for an alphabet and
then we did a few words in Braille. He can't read or write with the
English alphabet, but it didn't stop him from writing mom and Simon
and Linnaea in Braille. And then he got bored. I wrote a brief
paragraph because it fascinated me, but by the time I was done he
was typing out math problems on the typewriter. As I write this it
sounds like such an academic pursuit. But most days we sit and
watch a lot of television. We watch DVDs on the computer, we play
Harry Potter II, we play Reader Rabbit (which I loathe but they
love) we staple paper to paper to make picture frames (okay, so that
just happened yesterday and today and Simon taught me how to do it)
we play a game on occasion, we read books, we build card houses, we
walk the dog. But the Braille was his curiosity. And there was no
testing and there were no worksheets and when he was done he was
done.
And that isn't the problem. I don't mind how Simon learns or how
Linnaea learns. What I mind is how little trust these people have
in their children. I realized recently that I am a real, at my
core, evolutionist. I believe that what they need to know they will
master. If reading is something they have to have to get by in life
they will have reading. If math makes a difference for them they
will have math. And I believe that those things are necessary for
quality of life. Since they are likely to live in a world similar
to mine, they will acquire those skills as they move through life.
But whether or not they know Roman numerals or whether or not they
passed their GCSE's or whatever tests they have to take seems moot.
And mere dressing. I think dressing is a wonderful thing, I have of
lots of dressing, the best stories are made up primarily of
dressing, but what dressing you get and how you get that dressing is
surely an individuals own choice.
It's not even that I consider myself a very good unschooler. I have
moments of "screw their choices, what about me." Moments of "if they
just did what they were told to do this wouldn't take so long." And
I have to read and reread posts at unschooling.com and at chat
groups. I don't post, I don't trust enough that I know what I am
doing to know what I am describing. But, I absolutely, without
question (well without more than the occasional question) believe
that they will learn without being taught. And so will I. And in
the U.S. we spent most of our time with schooling homeschoolers or
with schooled children. It just wasn't such an issue, and they were
far more relaxed about their children's education. And the only
concern was how well they got along. And unschooling is a more
common concept in the US. Once you've announced that you don't
school you have fewer conversations about what curriculum you are
using. Everyone here is scared about testing. Testing in the UK is
how you know your child is going to succeed in the world. If they
can't pass the tests they can't get into University. If they don't
get into University they won't have any kind of future. And once
the world is defined in those boxes it is hard to see around them.
How do I live in a world full of boxes I don't believe in? Sigh�
Anyhow, I am just feeling bogged down in a world with too few like-
minded individuals.
Schuyler
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Shyrley
"Schuyler Waynforth " wrote:
lists like Fluff and UK-HE?
Going to hesfes?
Let me know where abouts you are and I'll see if I know anyone there.
Shyrley
> I'm writing more out of a need to vent than from anything else.You sound like you need to meet unschoolers in the UK. Are you on the UK
> We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
> slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
> darkness.
>
lists like Fluff and UK-HE?
Going to hesfes?
Let me know where abouts you are and I'll see if I know anyone there.
Shyrley
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/28/03 5:42:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, dwaynf@...
writes:
I am in only a few years back. This group is very curriculum oriented but
they have evolved into smaller groups with direction. There is one person
who organizes a certain activity etc. And the one that we participate in is
the play group. Originally organized by one of the moms. It is a very
relaxed group because the "agenda" is for the children to have free time to
play. For them it is like recess at their "homeschool". My boys get to play
with other children. I choose not to participate in the more "schooly" like
activities. When they go on a field trip we go if it is interesting for us.
We throw the worksheets in the back and we meander away from the group to see
what we want to see. It allows us to get into places for a reduced rate but
we don't feel like we have to participate the way the rest of the group does.
And I have a couple of unschooling lists that I enjoy for the unschooling
chatter. Hang in there.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
writes:
> How do I live in a world full of boxes I don't believe in? Sigh…It should get better. The new group you are describing sounds like the group
>
> Anyhow, I am just feeling bogged down in a world with too few like-
> minded individuals.
>
>
I am in only a few years back. This group is very curriculum oriented but
they have evolved into smaller groups with direction. There is one person
who organizes a certain activity etc. And the one that we participate in is
the play group. Originally organized by one of the moms. It is a very
relaxed group because the "agenda" is for the children to have free time to
play. For them it is like recess at their "homeschool". My boys get to play
with other children. I choose not to participate in the more "schooly" like
activities. When they go on a field trip we go if it is interesting for us.
We throw the worksheets in the back and we meander away from the group to see
what we want to see. It allows us to get into places for a reduced rate but
we don't feel like we have to participate the way the rest of the group does.
And I have a couple of unschooling lists that I enjoy for the unschooling
chatter. Hang in there.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Schuyler Waynforth <[email protected]>
We are in Durham and are planning to go to HESFES. I need to make
arrangements to do so, but the plans are in place. No, I'm not on
the UK lists like Fluff and UK-HE. Just on the EO ones. Where can
I join up? I am definitely in need of people here to talk to!!!
Thanks.
Schuyler
--- In [email protected], Shyrley
<shyrley.williams@v...> wrote:
arrangements to do so, but the plans are in place. No, I'm not on
the UK lists like Fluff and UK-HE. Just on the EO ones. Where can
I join up? I am definitely in need of people here to talk to!!!
Thanks.
Schuyler
--- In [email protected], Shyrley
<shyrley.williams@v...> wrote:
>the UK
>
> "Schuyler Waynforth " wrote:
>
> > I'm writing more out of a need to vent than from anything else.
> > We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
> > slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
> > darkness.
> >
>
> You sound like you need to meet unschoolers in the UK. Are you on
> lists like Fluff and UK-HE?there.
> Going to hesfes?
> Let me know where abouts you are and I'll see if I know anyone
>
> Shyrley
Shyrley
"Schuyler Waynforth " wrote:
and there is also UKFamilies-HomeEd which is also a Yahoo group.
You should find like-minded people there, especially if you are Durham
(pronounced Duh-ram...for the all the Americams on the list...)
Hesfes is a wonderful chance to meet people. Look out for me in a huge blue
and green tent.
Shyrley
> We are in Durham and are planning to go to HESFES. I need to makeFluff is at [email protected]
> arrangements to do so, but the plans are in place. No, I'm not on
> the UK lists like Fluff and UK-HE. Just on the EO ones. Where can
> I join up? I am definitely in need of people here to talk to!!!
>
> Thanks.
> Schuyler
>
and there is also UKFamilies-HomeEd which is also a Yahoo group.
You should find like-minded people there, especially if you are Durham
(pronounced Duh-ram...for the all the Americams on the list...)
Hesfes is a wonderful chance to meet people. Look out for me in a huge blue
and green tent.
Shyrley
Alan & Brenda Leonard
2/28/03 16:41:
Your Roman numerals story made me laugh. My son got a terrific book out of
the library on Roman numerals. It was really, really funny. So he has
learned them. And he's taught them to me, or at least he's tried. I don't
get into them as much as he does, so 50 and 500 aren't sticking. One is D,
one is L, and I still can't remember which. My poor little teacher, his
student isn't very good at this!
I don't have an answer to the school for the future, to get ready for
university mentality. Hmmm, is it possible to smile sweetly and announce
that many colleges in the states will take you so long as you can pay for
your education, so you just don't care about your kids passing the tests? I
suppose that doesn't help you find friends, but it might ferret out a few
(undercover) like-minded people!
Hang in there...
brenda
> Anyhow, I am just feeling bogged down in a world with too few like-Bummer. Sounds frustrating.
> minded individuals.
Your Roman numerals story made me laugh. My son got a terrific book out of
the library on Roman numerals. It was really, really funny. So he has
learned them. And he's taught them to me, or at least he's tried. I don't
get into them as much as he does, so 50 and 500 aren't sticking. One is D,
one is L, and I still can't remember which. My poor little teacher, his
student isn't very good at this!
I don't have an answer to the school for the future, to get ready for
university mentality. Hmmm, is it possible to smile sweetly and announce
that many colleges in the states will take you so long as you can pay for
your education, so you just don't care about your kids passing the tests? I
suppose that doesn't help you find friends, but it might ferret out a few
(undercover) like-minded people!
Hang in there...
brenda
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/28/03 5:50:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,
abtleo@... writes:
My son is into a game called Age of Mythology and he keeps running into Roman
Numerals and so we looked them all up yesterday.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
abtleo@... writes:
> I don'tL=50 and D=500
> get into them as much as he does, so 50 and 500 aren't sticking. One is D,
> one is L, and I still can't remember which.
My son is into a game called Age of Mythology and he keeps running into Roman
Numerals and so we looked them all up yesterday.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kate Green
I love Durham -- that's where my grandmothers folks were from. The
cathedral is lovely isn't it. BUT the winters suck and I know what you mean
by the darkness. My last year in the UK I had 4 and 2 year old and I
suffered from terrible seasonal depression. It really sucked. Take every
advantage of any good days you get plus hang out with the group even if you
don't always agree or enjoy it because just getting out helps to make the
winter pass faster. Soon it will be lovely and light and sometimes sunny
and blue:)
My brother is currently working near Durham at a country estate. He is a
chef there. He unschooled thru his high school years.
Kate
At 06:33 PM 2/28/03 +0000, you wrote:
cathedral is lovely isn't it. BUT the winters suck and I know what you mean
by the darkness. My last year in the UK I had 4 and 2 year old and I
suffered from terrible seasonal depression. It really sucked. Take every
advantage of any good days you get plus hang out with the group even if you
don't always agree or enjoy it because just getting out helps to make the
winter pass faster. Soon it will be lovely and light and sometimes sunny
and blue:)
My brother is currently working near Durham at a country estate. He is a
chef there. He unschooled thru his high school years.
Kate
At 06:33 PM 2/28/03 +0000, you wrote:
> I need to make
> No, I'm not on
> Where can
> I am definitely in need of people here to talk to!!!
>
> Thanks.
> Schuyler
>
>
> --- In [email protected], Shyrley
><> wrote:
>>
>>
>>"" wrote:
>>
>>> I'm writing more out of a need to vent than from anything else.
>>> We've just moved to the north of England from Albuquerque and are
>>> slowly moving through our sense of isolation and the interminable
>>> darkness.
>>>
>>
>> You sound like you need to meet unschoolers in the UK. Are you on
> the UK
>> lists like Fluff and UK-HE?
>> Going to hesfes?
>> Let me know where abouts you are and I'll see if I know anyone
> there.
>>
>> Shyrley
>
>
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