[AlwaysLearning] atheist Boy Scout
heather mclean
Atheist Scout given a week to declare belief.
http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/West/10/31/atheist.scout.ap/index.html
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http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/West/10/31/atheist.scout.ap/index.html
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[email protected]
In a message dated 10/31/02 9:30:02 PM Central Standard Time,
heather_200115@... writes:
On membership applications, Boy Scouts and adult leaders must say they
recognize some higher power, not necessarily religious. "Mother Nature would
be acceptable," Farmer said.
I am beginning to have some serious doubts, even got into an almost argument
with Darin about it the other night, about being a Boy Scout leader and
having Jack in scouts. We finally agreed that we would finish the year out
because we both believe in commitment. Darin was upset because he says I
should have researched this better, sooner. He said Jack enjoys scouts (he
does) and it wouldn't be fair to him to not continue, even after the year is
up. I voiced my concerns about the Boy Scouts stance on homosexuality, god,
and the weird way they are going about leader training in regard to sexual
molestation. (it seemed to me that in the way the training was presented,
that the boy Scouts are maybe fearing something?) He also said, and I quote,
"What does it matter, really?" Which upset me very much. How can I be the
person I am and still do this? Thoughts on my ramble?
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
heather_200115@... writes:
> Atheist Scout given a week to declare belief.The article says the following, but is it really true?
>
On membership applications, Boy Scouts and adult leaders must say they
recognize some higher power, not necessarily religious. "Mother Nature would
be acceptable," Farmer said.
I am beginning to have some serious doubts, even got into an almost argument
with Darin about it the other night, about being a Boy Scout leader and
having Jack in scouts. We finally agreed that we would finish the year out
because we both believe in commitment. Darin was upset because he says I
should have researched this better, sooner. He said Jack enjoys scouts (he
does) and it wouldn't be fair to him to not continue, even after the year is
up. I voiced my concerns about the Boy Scouts stance on homosexuality, god,
and the weird way they are going about leader training in regard to sexual
molestation. (it seemed to me that in the way the training was presented,
that the boy Scouts are maybe fearing something?) He also said, and I quote,
"What does it matter, really?" Which upset me very much. How can I be the
person I am and still do this? Thoughts on my ramble?
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/31/02 10:10:17 PM, Dnowens@... writes:
<< On membership applications, Boy Scouts and adult leaders must say they
recognize some higher power, not necessarily religious. "Mother Nature would
be acceptable," Farmer said. >>
I wonder if he could consider the board of directors of BSA as a higher
power. They do have the power to boot him.
Nancy, just do it the way you want to. Someone who was in AA with my mom
said his higher power was a certain cedar fence post. He had just kind of
imbued this vision of a fence post with having serene, magical powers.
Weird.
Not that they'll throw you out of AA for being atheistic, but I always think
of that "higher power" thing. It is SO WEIRD.
People doing biochemical and brain research have found the place in the brain
where religion is. When people meditate or pray the brains do the same
thing, doesn't matter what religion. And when they have "a religious
experience," the brain does the same thing.
I have been saying for years I don't believe in God but I DO believe in the
usefulness of religion for people to have the experience of awe and
worshipfulness and humility. It's hard to induce those things without props
and stories to go with it.
And if you look at religion from a distance, with eyes blurred, as though
from another planet, the religions have some things in common:
Worship places tend to be high and pointy. A cathedral or a clearing in a
forest, a tipi, same thing.
Candles, stained glass, crystals, altars...
Incense. flowers. things that smell good.
Banners, ribbons, colored wavy things. Even ribbon bookmarks in Bibles.
There's a ribbony thing in many.
Singing or chanting that has a humm. "Ommmmmm" "Ammmmmennnnnn."
You get several people concentrating on doing three or five of those things
in the same place, and the same kind of thing happens. And the justification
for creating these ceremonies is that there is something bigger and (WE HOPE)
smarter, and that being this way, doing these things, gives us goodness and
makes us nicer people.
That could be absolutely and entirely true.
Having those experiences does tend to make people a little calmer and more
compassionate for a while after. Then they might need to... go to church,
meditate, pray... again to reclaim that feeling.
Whether there's a God or not, those things refresh people's souls (whatever
souls might be, if it turns out there's no God).
Maybe my own brain is my higher power. Maybe the field of anthropology is my
higher power. Maybe the fact that there is a group of people I can go to
(like this list) where I can throw out ideas and they will come back polished
and reinforced or tweaked or rejected as flawed is a higher power than my own
individual thinking.
Sandra
<< On membership applications, Boy Scouts and adult leaders must say they
recognize some higher power, not necessarily religious. "Mother Nature would
be acceptable," Farmer said. >>
I wonder if he could consider the board of directors of BSA as a higher
power. They do have the power to boot him.
Nancy, just do it the way you want to. Someone who was in AA with my mom
said his higher power was a certain cedar fence post. He had just kind of
imbued this vision of a fence post with having serene, magical powers.
Weird.
Not that they'll throw you out of AA for being atheistic, but I always think
of that "higher power" thing. It is SO WEIRD.
People doing biochemical and brain research have found the place in the brain
where religion is. When people meditate or pray the brains do the same
thing, doesn't matter what religion. And when they have "a religious
experience," the brain does the same thing.
I have been saying for years I don't believe in God but I DO believe in the
usefulness of religion for people to have the experience of awe and
worshipfulness and humility. It's hard to induce those things without props
and stories to go with it.
And if you look at religion from a distance, with eyes blurred, as though
from another planet, the religions have some things in common:
Worship places tend to be high and pointy. A cathedral or a clearing in a
forest, a tipi, same thing.
Candles, stained glass, crystals, altars...
Incense. flowers. things that smell good.
Banners, ribbons, colored wavy things. Even ribbon bookmarks in Bibles.
There's a ribbony thing in many.
Singing or chanting that has a humm. "Ommmmmm" "Ammmmmennnnnn."
You get several people concentrating on doing three or five of those things
in the same place, and the same kind of thing happens. And the justification
for creating these ceremonies is that there is something bigger and (WE HOPE)
smarter, and that being this way, doing these things, gives us goodness and
makes us nicer people.
That could be absolutely and entirely true.
Having those experiences does tend to make people a little calmer and more
compassionate for a while after. Then they might need to... go to church,
meditate, pray... again to reclaim that feeling.
Whether there's a God or not, those things refresh people's souls (whatever
souls might be, if it turns out there's no God).
Maybe my own brain is my higher power. Maybe the field of anthropology is my
higher power. Maybe the fact that there is a group of people I can go to
(like this list) where I can throw out ideas and they will come back polished
and reinforced or tweaked or rejected as flawed is a higher power than my own
individual thinking.
Sandra
Nancy Wooton
on 10/31/02 9:41 PM, SandraDodd@... at SandraDodd@... wrote:
meditation, the area is suppressed; it's the part of the brain which lets us
distinguish our own self from the rest of existence, and requires a constant
stream of sensory information.
Assignment: Discovery each morning, and this week they've been doing the
Holy Land, major religions, etc. Evidently, some pilgrims to Jerusalem go
nuts while there. The most common manifestation is stealing the white
sheets from one's hotel room to make a toga, then walking nearly nekkid to
all the famous sights, usually preaching to any and all; they'll think they
are a disciple, or Mary, or John the Baptist. See
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/jersynd.html
Nancy
>It's the orientation association area, in the left parietal lobe. In
> People doing biochemical and brain research have found the place in the brain
> where religion is. When people meditate or pray the brains do the same
> thing, doesn't matter what religion. And when they have "a religious
> experience," the brain does the same thing.
meditation, the area is suppressed; it's the part of the brain which lets us
distinguish our own self from the rest of existence, and requires a constant
stream of sensory information.
>Have you ever heard of the "Jerusalem Syndrome"? My kids and I watch
> I have been saying for years I don't believe in God but I DO believe in the
> usefulness of religion for people to have the experience of awe and
> worshipfulness and humility. It's hard to induce those things without props
> and stories to go with it.
>
Assignment: Discovery each morning, and this week they've been doing the
Holy Land, major religions, etc. Evidently, some pilgrims to Jerusalem go
nuts while there. The most common manifestation is stealing the white
sheets from one's hotel room to make a toga, then walking nearly nekkid to
all the famous sights, usually preaching to any and all; they'll think they
are a disciple, or Mary, or John the Baptist. See
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/jersynd.html
Nancy
avgjean
--- In AlwaysLearning@y..., Nancy Wooton <ikonstitcher@c...> wrote:
I would love to read more about this. I am off to Google now, but
do you have any specific books or sites to recommend?
Jean
> on 10/31/02 9:41 PM, SandraDodd@a... at SandraDodd@a... wrote:in the brain
>
>
> >
> > People doing biochemical and brain research have found the place
> > where religion is. When people meditate or pray the brains dothe same
> > thing, doesn't matter what religion. And when they have "areligious
> > experience," the brain does the same thing.In
>
> It's the orientation association area, in the left parietal lobe.
> meditation, the area is suppressed; it's the part of the brainwhich lets us
> distinguish our own self from the rest of existence, and requiresa constant
> stream of sensory information.Sandra? Nancy W?
> >
I would love to read more about this. I am off to Google now, but
do you have any specific books or sites to recommend?
Jean
Nancy Wooton
on 11/1/02 9:41 AM, avgjean at avgjean@... wrote:
Newberg, M.D., Eugene D'Aquili, M.D.,Ph.Dl, and Vince Rause.
Nancy
> --- In AlwaysLearning@y..., Nancy Wooton <ikonstitcher@c...> wrote:_Why God Won't Go Away: Brain Science and the Biology of Belief_ by Andrew
>> on 10/31/02 9:41 PM, SandraDodd@a... at SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> People doing biochemical and brain research have found the place
> in the brain
>>> where religion is. When people meditate or pray the brains do
> the same
>>> thing, doesn't matter what religion. And when they have "a
> religious
>>> experience," the brain does the same thing.
>>
>> It's the orientation association area, in the left parietal lobe.
> In
>> meditation, the area is suppressed; it's the part of the brain
> which lets us
>> distinguish our own self from the rest of existence, and requires
> a constant
>> stream of sensory information.
>>>
>
> Sandra? Nancy W?
>
> I would love to read more about this. I am off to Google now, but
> do you have any specific books or sites to recommend?
>
> Jean
Newberg, M.D., Eugene D'Aquili, M.D.,Ph.Dl, and Vince Rause.
Nancy
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/1/02 10:01:52 AM, ikonstitcher@... writes:
<< Have you ever heard of the "Jerusalem Syndrome"? My kids and I watch
Assignment: Discovery each morning, and this week they've been doing the
Holy Land, major religions, etc. Evidently, some pilgrims to Jerusalem go
nuts while there. The most common manifestation is stealing the white
sheets from one's hotel room to make a toga, then walking nearly nekkid to
all the famous sights, usually preaching to any and all; they'll think they
are a disciple, or Mary, or John the Baptist. See
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/jersynd.html >>
I haven't looked yet, but do you think maybe it's something in the olives?
Do you think that's what happened to Jesus? And it might have happened to
Mary or Joseph, but LUCKILY for them the hotel was full. No sheets in the
barn. (Oh, wait. They weren't in Jerusalem.)
I'll go read that in a while. I'm kind of afraid. It might bring on visions
of The Life of Brian. I wonder if Monty Python knew about this before
writing that?
Sandra
<< Have you ever heard of the "Jerusalem Syndrome"? My kids and I watch
Assignment: Discovery each morning, and this week they've been doing the
Holy Land, major religions, etc. Evidently, some pilgrims to Jerusalem go
nuts while there. The most common manifestation is stealing the white
sheets from one's hotel room to make a toga, then walking nearly nekkid to
all the famous sights, usually preaching to any and all; they'll think they
are a disciple, or Mary, or John the Baptist. See
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/jersynd.html >>
I haven't looked yet, but do you think maybe it's something in the olives?
Do you think that's what happened to Jesus? And it might have happened to
Mary or Joseph, but LUCKILY for them the hotel was full. No sheets in the
barn. (Oh, wait. They weren't in Jerusalem.)
I'll go read that in a while. I'm kind of afraid. It might bring on visions
of The Life of Brian. I wonder if Monty Python knew about this before
writing that?
Sandra
Fetteroll
Oh, I just got my Pentecostal invitation! Now I don't feel left out. They
want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say :-)
Joyce
want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say :-)
Joyce
marji
I just got my SECOND invitation. What are they trying to tell me? They
must know something about me that I don't. Mysterious! Or, maybe they're
just plain desperate. ;-)
Marji
At 08:40 11/7/02 -0500, you wrote:
must know something about me that I don't. Mysterious! Or, maybe they're
just plain desperate. ;-)
Marji
At 08:40 11/7/02 -0500, you wrote:
>Oh, I just got my Pentecostal invitation! Now I don't feel left out. They[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say :-)
>
>Joyce
Deborah Lewis
Well, congratulations! I'm an atheist too, I just figured they'd made a
horrible mistake, but maybe somehow they deemed us worthy.
I got another, a different group, also Christian, but don't remember the
name. Some Chicken Soup thing.
Must be my lucky month!
Deb L
horrible mistake, but maybe somehow they deemed us worthy.
I got another, a different group, also Christian, but don't remember the
name. Some Chicken Soup thing.
Must be my lucky month!
Deb L
> Oh, I just got my Pentecostal invitation! Now I don't feel left out.
> They
> want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say
> :-)
>
> Joyce
[email protected]
Ooh! I got invited to the chicken soup one!
See, I'm wanted too!
Elissa
PS. Marji, you got my invitation I'm sure.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
See, I'm wanted too!
Elissa
PS. Marji, you got my invitation I'm sure.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/2002 8:35:27 AM Eastern Standard Time,
fetteroll@... writes:
Amy Kagey
Christmas gifts:
<A HREF="http://www.ubah.com/ecommerce/default.asp?sid=Z0939&gid=462366"> </A>U<A HREF="http://www.ubah.com/ecommerce/default.asp?sid=Z0939&gid=462366">sborne Books Online Catalog</A>
and
<A HREF="http://hometown.aol.com/amycats2/myhomepage/business.html">Santa Letters for Your Child!</A>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
fetteroll@... writes:
>Got mine today too! LOL
> Oh, I just got my Pentecostal invitation! Now I don't feel left out. They
> want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say :-)
>
Amy Kagey
Christmas gifts:
<A HREF="http://www.ubah.com/ecommerce/default.asp?sid=Z0939&gid=462366"> </A>U<A HREF="http://www.ubah.com/ecommerce/default.asp?sid=Z0939&gid=462366">sborne Books Online Catalog</A>
and
<A HREF="http://hometown.aol.com/amycats2/myhomepage/business.html">Santa Letters for Your Child!</A>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Shyrley
On 7 Nov 02, at 6:44, marji wrote:
tellingme I'd be signed up for 'Jiggling Jezebels', some lesbian
group.
Now I'm waiting for the first posting.....
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
> I just got my SECOND invitation. What are they trying to tell me?This morning I got another Pentecostal one AND an email
> They must know something about me that I don't. Mysterious! Or,
> maybe they're just plain desperate. ;-)
>
> Marji
>
tellingme I'd be signed up for 'Jiggling Jezebels', some lesbian
group.
Now I'm waiting for the first posting.....
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Nancy Wooton
Pam Hartley
I got mine, too.
Pam, in the club <g>
----------
Pam, in the club <g>
----------
>From: Fetteroll <fetteroll@...>
>To: <[email protected]>
>Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Pentecostal invitation
>Date: Thu, Nov 7, 2002, 5:40 AM
>
> Oh, I just got my Pentecostal invitation! Now I don't feel left out. They
> want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say :-)
>
> Joyce
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/02 9:09:44 AM, shyrley.williams@... writes:
<< AND an email
tellingme I'd be signed up for 'Jiggling Jezebels', some lesbian
group.
Now I'm waiting for the first posting.....
Sandra
<< AND an email
tellingme I'd be signed up for 'Jiggling Jezebels', some lesbian
group.
Now I'm waiting for the first posting.....
>>Tell them how you feel about Alan Rickman.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/02 10:18:00 AM Central Standard Time,
ikonstitcher@... writes:
someone post a cute hsing comic. Are these comics regularly hsing based? Do
you subscribe to them?
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ikonstitcher@... writes:
> http://www.unitedmedia.com/comics/grandave/That was cute Nancy. I have a question. This isn't the first time I have seen
someone post a cute hsing comic. Are these comics regularly hsing based? Do
you subscribe to them?
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/02 10:11:17 AM Central Standard Time,
shyrley.williams@... writes:
Chicken Soup Group and a dog lovers group. Today I got one from the Jiggling
Jezebels. Is someone playing a joke on us?
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
shyrley.williams@... writes:
> This morning I got another Pentecostal one AND an emailI got my second invite to the Pentecostals today, two days ago I got one to a
> tellingme I'd be signed up for 'Jiggling Jezebels', some lesbian
> group.
> Now I'm waiting for the first posting.....
>
> Shyrley
Chicken Soup Group and a dog lovers group. Today I got one from the Jiggling
Jezebels. Is someone playing a joke on us?
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/02 7:35:18 AM Central Standard Time,
fetteroll@... writes:
something!
Elizabeth
fetteroll@... writes:
> h, I just got my Pentecostal invitation! Now I don't feel left out. TheyMe too, me too! I'm so excited. I feel so special, so much a part of
> want atheists too! They're a nondiscriminatory bunch, I must say :-)
>
something!
Elizabeth
Nancy Wooton
on 11/7/02 9:20 AM, Dnowens@... at Dnowens@... wrote:
I've seen there, I find it online. Usually, the Houston Chronicle site will
have a link, but I had to google "Grand Avenue."
http://www.chron.com/content/chronicle/comics/archive/showComics.hts
Nancy
>> http://www.unitedmedia.com/comics/grandave/No, this one is a regular in my newspaper. When I want to share a comic
>
> That was cute Nancy. I have a question. This isn't the first time I have seen
> someone post a cute hsing comic. Are these comics regularly hsing based? Do
> you subscribe to them?
I've seen there, I find it online. Usually, the Houston Chronicle site will
have a link, but I had to google "Grand Avenue."
http://www.chron.com/content/chronicle/comics/archive/showComics.hts
Nancy
Shyrley
On 7 Nov 02, at 12:24, Dnowens@... wrote:
wisdom :-)
Including our Alan Rickman musings.
Shyrley the troublemaker
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
> In a message dated 11/7/02 10:11:17 AM Central Standard Time,We should join them all and share our own special brand of
> shyrley.williams@... writes:
>
> > This morning I got another Pentecostal one AND an email
> > tellingme I'd be signed up for 'Jiggling Jezebels', some lesbian
> > group. Now I'm waiting for the first posting.....
> >
> > Shyrley
>
> I got my second invite to the Pentecostals today, two days ago I got
> one to a Chicken Soup Group and a dog lovers group. Today I got one
> from the Jiggling Jezebels. Is someone playing a joke on us? ~Nancy
wisdom :-)
Including our Alan Rickman musings.
Shyrley the troublemaker
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Stephanie Elms
I was wondering what this was...I have gotten two so far...
Stephanie E.
Stephanie E.
Tia Leschke
> I was wondering what this was...I have gotten two so far...I just got my second. Has anyone joined to see what they're all about? Or
to be subversive? <g>
Tia
Heidi Wordhouse-Dykema
Can I have one? They haven't cared to invite me! ...not even once...
although I did get invited to the chicken soup thing. I prefer a good
cheddar soup, or a chowder so I didn't take them up on it.
Speaking of which, It's past lunch time and I'm hungry.
Heidi
At 12:51 PM 11/7/2002 -0800, you wrote:
although I did get invited to the chicken soup thing. I prefer a good
cheddar soup, or a chowder so I didn't take them up on it.
Speaking of which, It's past lunch time and I'm hungry.
Heidi
At 12:51 PM 11/7/2002 -0800, you wrote:
> > I was wondering what this was...I have gotten two so far...
>
>I just got my second. Has anyone joined to see what they're all about? Or
>to be subversive? <g>
>Tia
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>[email protected]
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Tia Leschke
> Can I have one? They haven't cared to invite me! ...not even once...Well I didn't get the chicken soup thing, and I was hungry too.
> although I did get invited to the chicken soup thing. I prefer a good
> cheddar soup, or a chowder so I didn't take them up on it.
<g>
Try [email protected]
Might work.
Tia