Michele Sears

Hello,

I've been offline for awhile - but I have a question and wonder if anyone
has any insight/suggestions.

My ds would like to read - he is motivated by his gameboy and by the fact
that he would like to learn magic and surprise us with it, but he can't read
the book. His dad plays gameboy with him alot and obviously reads for him,
me and my dd are also asked several times daily to help read his game for
him. My dd has also helped him with the magic - but he is really wanting to
read himself and not rely on us.

I have tried a reading program with him (at his request) that worked very
quickly for his sister, but he is so obviously different in his learning
style, or perhaps readiness, that he gets frustrated with it. He has
trouble remembering the phonetic sounds once we sit down and look at words -
he excels at the flashcards, but once we look at words - he struggles with
remembering the sounds. He understands about stringing them together - once
he remembers (or I remind him) the sound - then he "reads" the words easily.
It's the remembering part that seems so difficult for him.

I'm not sure how to proceed - he's a happy kid, very glad not to be in
school, but still seems very interested in reading.
Would you suggest a different approach/program? If so, which one? Would
you suggest continuing to read to him (which we do daily) and his ability
will catch up to his desire one day?

Because he has a hard time remembering, he will say "I always forget" and
"I'll never learn how to read". I empathize with his frustration, etc. but
have not yet encountered this with my daughter. Of course, they're
different!

I look forward to any replies.

Michele

mamaaj2000

--- In [email protected], "Michele Sears"
<brewstersears@s...> wrote:
He understands about stringing them together - once
> he remembers (or I remind him) the sound - then he "reads" the
words easily.
> It's the remembering part that seems so difficult for him.

Michele, how old is he?

Maybe giving him letters and letting him put them together might
help. Ds' Reader Rabbit Kindergarten software has a game where you
have to fill in the blank: _at and he's supposed to pick the 'c'.
There are other games online, at Playhouse Disney--JoJo's letter game
and such that play with phonics but aren't quite "put these sounds
together into a word."

Or you could label lots of household items with words. If he
memorizes a bunch of words, it might help him to relax about reading.

--aj

mamaaj2000

LOL, I obviously read the message w/o noticing the subject line...eek!

Sorry,
aj

Nicole Willoughby

I dont know exactly what his level is now but the leapfrog videos are helping my daughter a lot. One introduces letter sounds in a fun way ....for example the h's are in a very hot room and sweat and say h h like they are hot
. The t's are tapping t's etc. The next one starts making 3 letter words with short vowels and the last one starts covering long vowels, a few blends such as sh, and common rules like silent e and when 2 vowels go walking the first does the talking.

Nicole

btw if you havent seen them these are regular dvs or vhs tapes nothing that requires a special leap frog toy to use

Michele Sears <brewstersears@...> wrote:

Hello,

I've been offline for awhile - but I have a question and wonder if anyone
has any insight/suggestions.

My ds would like to read - he is motivated by his gameboy and by the fact
that he would like to learn magic and surprise us with it, but he can't read
the book. His dad plays gameboy with him alot and obviously reads for him,
me and my dd are also asked several times daily to help read his game for
him. My dd has also helped him with the magic - but he is really wanting to
read himself and not rely on us.

I have tried a reading program with him (at his request) that worked very
quickly for his sister, but he is so obviously different in his learning
style, or perhaps readiness, that he gets frustrated with it. He has
trouble remembering the phonetic sounds once we sit down and look at words -
he excels at the flashcards, but once we look at words - he struggles with
remembering the sounds. He understands about stringing them together - once
he remembers (or I remind him) the sound - then he "reads" the words easily.
It's the remembering part that seems so difficult for him.

I'm not sure how to proceed - he's a happy kid, very glad not to be in
school, but still seems very interested in reading.
Would you suggest a different approach/program? If so, which one? Would
you suggest continuing to read to him (which we do daily) and his ability
will catch up to his desire one day?

Because he has a hard time remembering, he will say "I always forget" and
"I'll never learn how to read". I empathize with his frustration, etc. but
have not yet encountered this with my daughter. Of course, they're
different!

I look forward to any replies.

Michele







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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

queenjane555

I don't have any insight as to what kind of "program" to use, but
would it help him to let him know that lots of unschoolers arent
reading proficiently at his age? My son needed alot more help at age
7 with videogames, than he does now at age 8 (needs very little
now)...can you find a magic book that has clear pictures, so that he
doesnt really need to read in order to do the trick? Or maybe a
video about magic tricks that he could play when you're not in the
room, so he can suprise you with the trick? My son learned a really
neat trick off of the Disney Channel.

As far as "sounding out" words, and reading phonetically, my son
seems to look at the whole word and "just know" what it is, and he
seems to be able to pronounce words just fine that dont at all sound
like how theyre spelled.


Katherine

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/24/2005 6:36:13 PM Central Standard Time,
brewstersears@... writes:

I'm not sure how to proceed - he's a happy kid, very glad not to be in
school, but still seems very interested in reading.
Would you suggest a different approach/program? If so, which one? Would
you suggest continuing to read to him (which we do daily) and his ability
will catch up to his desire one day?



~~~

I suggest gently encouraging him and holding the firm belief that his brain
will develop to the point of learning to read, and believing that only then
will he read. Reading, like learning to ride a bike or being a father or being
responsible enough to stay home by yourself, is a "some day" kind of thing.

As in, "some day" you'll be able to jump and touch the top of the door
frame. "Some day" you'll be able to ride your bike the store by yourself. "Some
day" you'll be able to cook dinner for the family.

It's a hopeful and matter-of-fact way of looking at it. Recognizing that
the brain develops as the body does, and not every body develops at the same
rate; nor does every brain. His body and brain are changing and developing and
he's different than anyone else. Some read later, some earlier. He *will*
read. When he's ready.

Pass this idea on to him. He could be lamenting that he can't touch the top
of the door frame by jumping. Start by jumping to touch the top of the
fence, the net on the basketball goal, the edge of the stop sign on the corner.
My eldest son, at 6, cried because he didn't have as many trophies as his dad
did. "But you will, son. You will." (He did.)

My youngest son just happened to learn to read at 7. Having discovered
unschooling when he was a baby, I'd never had anything but confidence in his
ability to learn the things he wanted to learn when his developing brain and body
were ready. He grew up with that reality. I don't believe that's why he
learned at 7 over any other age. But I believe that's why he never had any
anxiety about it or frustration that he couldn't do it, yet.

Be hopeful and encouraging. Don't focus on the can't. Focus on the will.

Karen

www.thanksmom.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

soggyboysmom

--- In [email protected], "queenjane555"
<queenjane555@y...> wrote:
>
>>
> As far as "sounding out" words, and reading phonetically, my son
> seems to look at the whole word and "just know" what it is, and he
> seems to be able to pronounce words just fine that dont at all
> sound like how they're spelled.
>
> Katherine

Just wanted to second this one. That is kind of how DS reads.
He "absorbs" words whole, then applies things he's learned from them
to new words he meets. Can't say exactly how, it just is. From what
MIL says, that's how DH learned to read too (before he started
school).

One thing we did that might be helpful (or not) is "buddy reading".
I'd pick out a word in a book DS chose (something common and
repeated like good or run or dog) and that was "his" word. I'd read
along until we got to that word, then he'd say his word and we'd
move on. We moved up gradually to multiple words (2 or 3 in one
story). Then we'd alternate words, then sentences. If DS got to a
word that didn't fit what he already knew, we'd stop and look at it,
then move on. For example (since it's hard to explain), he
knew "water". Then he got a book on "weather". Apply what he already
knew "w"+"at"+"er" but that didn't fit. So we touched on "ea"
and "th". Now he's got 5 "building blocks" instead of just 3,
without trying to memorize rules with more exceptions than
regularities (ah the joys of the English language!lol). One key (I
think) to this was knowing the letters and sounds and picking up
basic sight words first to provide a foundation to work from. We
didn't use any of the standard "lists of sight words" - just
whatever words we came across a lot "Exit", "Stop", "Thank
you", "Blue's Clues" "Go, Dog, Go" and suchlike.

One video that was helpful was Sesame Street's Do the Alphabet - a
particularly good part was that the main character (Baby Bear)
wanted help because he kept forgetting the letters - he'd go A,B,C,D
and get lost. So Big Bird and the gang helped with letters and
sounds. And in the end, Baby Bear did it! It helped DS to have
confidence that he'd eventually get it, didn't have to have it all
right away. Admittedly, that might be a little young for your 7 yr
old. I liked that they used a different tune for the alphabet song
so it avoided the "lmnop" all as one "letter".

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/24/05 9:28:58 PM, queenjane555@... writes:

<< I don't have any insight as to what kind of "program" to use, but

would it help him to let him know that lots of unschoolers arent

reading proficiently at his age? >>

A lot of kids at school aren't either.
When I taught 7th grade, only maybe a third of them were REALLY readers,
another third could read but their comprehension wasn't so good because (I thought
at the time, maybe) they were reading in a cloud of resistent frustration,
and the other third were hesitant readers, afraid of making mistakes if they
read aloud, unsure of "rules," avoided reading to themselves because of a wad of
fears, etc.

So it's not just that unschoolers might not read at six (the boy is six;
"almost 7" doesn't change that, "almost 7" or even "just turned 7" is sixish,
first grade age). MOST six year olds aren't reading. Most of those who've been
told they are reading are only reading "graded readers" which are books with
carefully chosen words they've already seen lots before. Their other textbooks
and directions are "written at first grade level" too which means reading
specialists have looked at sentence length and word length and never used a bigger
word when a smaller one would do.

-=-can you find a magic book that has clear pictures, so that he

doesnt really need to read in order to do the trick? Or maybe a

video about magic tricks that he could play when you're not in the

room, so he can suprise you with the trick? My son learned a really

neat trick off of the Disney Channel. -=-

There's an older video that might still be available. Shari Lewis, 101
Things to Do, I think it's called, and there are some tricky things of all sorts
mixed in there.

My advice is to only do things that are like playing around with words,
nothing like "reading lessons." The same discouraging damage reading classes do
at school can be done at home.

http://sandradodd.com/reading
We found some unexpected advantages to Holly's late reading, and there's a
little piece of writing on that there.

Sandra

Heidi

When I get worried about my 10 year old not reading yet, I think
about the variety of reading levels and interests in my family. I
taught myself to read in Kindergarten (reading wasn't taught under
first grade, when I was five). (This ability, btw, torqued my first
grade teacher, who hated me) And I've loved reading ever since. I was
the kid you see walking down the street with her nose in a book.

My brother was reading by second grade, I'm pretty sure, but he never
loved it like I did. Favorite books for him were the "...Do the
Strangest Things" series and the "Meet George Wasington et al" To
this day, he isn't a reader of novels. Magazines? I think so.

My sister enjoys reading, and is involved in a book discussion group.
But I think she reads those books because being in a book group
is "the thing to do" more than just reading for sheer pleasure.

My mom: a pleasure reader.

My dad: a novel-once-a-year, with Smithsonian level magazines in
between his Michener binges.

My oldest child, now 24, was in second grade when reading clicked for
him. He reads when he has to, but isn't a novel or even a magazine
reader.

In my own home, I and my 17 year old are the voracious readers. My 12
year old boy reads now and then. He is perfectly capable, but reading
isn't his main brain stimulus.

My husband, who has dyslexia and has a brain injury, is a slow and
plodding reader, with many starts and stops. I have no idea if this
is from the dyslexia or the brain injury. But he is capable of
reading, and started reading late, according to his mother. He
doesn't remember what age he was when he started reading, but it
wasn't by age 7. He doesn't read novels, but gobbles up the Popular
Science and Pop Mechanics, as well as religious books.

And there's my 10 year old, who wants to read VERY much, for whom it
is just not clicking yet. Who has had phonics and sight reading cards
and many other helps. For whom it STILL is not clicking, yet. I
suspect hers is a spatial brain, like her dad's. (aka dyslexia) She
listens to books on tape, watches videos about things that interest
her (big cats are her passion. And birds, right now) and I read to
her sometimes.

The blessing is, she hasn't had to deal with frustration
and "failure" in the context of the classroom. She hasn't had other
kids giving her grief. Or teachers, for that matter.

Blessings, HeidiC


--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 2/24/05 9:28:58 PM, queenjane555@y... writes:
>
> << I don't have any insight as to what kind of "program" to use,
but
>
> would it help him to let him know that lots of unschoolers arent
>
> reading proficiently at his age? >>
>
> A lot of kids at school aren't either.
> When I taught 7th grade, only maybe a third of them were REALLY
readers,
> another third could read but their comprehension wasn't so good
because (I thought
> at the time, maybe) they were reading in a cloud of resistent
frustration,
> and the other third were hesitant readers, afraid of making
mistakes if they
> read aloud, unsure of "rules," avoided reading to themselves
because of a wad of
> fears, etc.

Sandra

Pam Sorooshian

On Feb 25, 2005, at 6:17 AM, tuckervill2@... wrote:

> Be hopeful and encouraging. Don't focus on the can't. Focus on the
> will.

This is such good advice!!! And - I'd add - if he expresses impatience
that he's not reading yet, I'd just say things like, "I know - I bet
you're really looking forward to it." It is possible to empathize
without making it sound like he's slow or behind or late.

Karen's idea of relating it to other activities is a good one, too,
especially if there is something he had to sort of wait on and if he
remembers that. "Remember how much you wanted to ride a 2-wheel bike
and then finally you could do it and look how good you are at it now!"
"It can be hard to wait, though, I know."

-pam

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/25/2005 7:19:55 AM Mountain Standard Time,
tuckervill2@... writes:

I'd never had anything but confidence in his
ability to learn the things he wanted to learn when his developing brain
and body
were ready. He grew up with that reality. I don't believe that's why he
learned at 7 over any other age. But I believe that's why he never had any
anxiety about it or frustration that he couldn't do it, yet.




--------------------

Karen's advice was sterling, and I've saved it here:
_http://sandradodd.com/r/encouragment_ (http://sandradodd.com/r/encouragment)
and linked it to the reading page
_http://sandradodd.com/reading_ (http://sandradodd.com/reading)

We've used this "someday you will" or "you just don't yet" about all kinds
of things, from reading to caring about the opposite sex to foods. Holly
doesn't like green chile yet. SHe figures she will ("When my taste buds die"
she jokes), because her brothers didn't used to and now they do. Kirby lately
started liking mushrooms. Marty still doesn't like spinach yet, but we
haven't branded him "a spinach hater," and I don't think anyone should consider a
child "a non reader," just one who "doesn't read yet."


Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

kayb85

> As far as "sounding out" words, and reading phonetically, my son
> seems to look at the whole word and "just know" what it is, and he
> seems to be able to pronounce words just fine that dont at all
sound
> like how theyre spelled.

My 11 year old daughter and I played Scrabble last night, and my 7
year old watched us for a little while. She was challenging the
word "ax" that I made because she thought it was spelled "axe" (she
looked it up to prove me wrong and found out that it can be spelled
either way). But anyway...

My 7 year old took her side and said, "Yeah, I think axe just looks
more like the way it should be spelled." He can recognize a few
words like mom, dad, go, yes, no, and zoo, but he doesn't read yet.
He didn't seem to be just being silly and taking his sister's side
over his mom for fun. He seemed to be really pondering the way the
word looked.

I found it fascinating that a 7 year old who can't read would ponder
the spelling of a word and decide which spelling looks best to him.

Sheila

nellebelle

>>>>>>>I found it fascinating that a 7 year old who can't read would ponder
the spelling of a word and decide which spelling looks best to him.>>>>>>

That is how I decide on a correct spelling. If I'm not sure, I'll write the word down with variations until I *see* which one looks right.

Mary Ellen

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

soggyboysmom

--- In [email protected], "Heidi"
<bunsofaluminum60@h...> wrote:
>
> I taught myself to read in Kindergarten (reading wasn't taught
>under first grade, when I was five). (This ability, btw, torqued my
>first grade teacher, who hated me)
LOL DH taught himself before he started school. MIL called the
school and asked for assistance in developing this. They told her to
not let him read because he'd learn "wrong". She ignored them. We're
both omnivorous readers (from Sports Illus to Smithsonian to Harry
Potter and Lord of the Rings to The Secret Life of Bees and The
Poisonwood Bible to do a quick random survey). And that's not
including all the stuff we do online.

Heidi

My mil got actually angry at me, when she realized that my littlest
(then about 7, I guess) had learned to write her abc's in only
Capital Letters.

petesakes, she also learned how to write in cursive that same year.
And she still doesn't read. But she's getting there, slow but sure.

HeidiC


> LOL DH taught himself before he started school. MIL called the
> school and asked for assistance in developing this. They told her
to
> not let him read because he'd learn "wrong". She ignored them.
We're
> both omnivorous readers (from Sports Illus to Smithsonian to Harry
> Potter and Lord of the Rings to The Secret Life of Bees and The
> Poisonwood Bible to do a quick random survey). And that's not
> including all the stuff we do online.