John & Karen Buxcel

Hello all!
I'm going to try to explain this without getting too wordy. Basically,
here's our situation.
We (dh and I) have 3 sons, 7, 4, 1. We give birth at home, breastfeed,
share sleep, wear our babies, and practice gentle parenting. Naturally,
we've been 'unschooling' since the birth of our first baby boy. Anyway,
here's my dilemma, and what a dilemma it is!

My 4yo son has such a hard time with the bathroom stuff. In a nutshell, he
pees his pants frequently and also poops them. I just wanted to reach out
for help here, as you all are in line with how I feel and parent. I can't
go to a doctor only to be told to 'put him in time out', or 'start a sticker
chart'. YUCK!

So, does anyone out there have any experience with this? Any ideas? I've
been working really, really hard on letting go of 'my' expectations that he
stop this, but I'm worried I'm missing something larger. I'm just so deep
in this, in many ways, that I may be missing something vital that's right in
front of me and I thought some of you might help me to clarify and get to
that point of figuring out some solutions.

Ok, I'm going to stop there. I'm happy to really evaluate this, so please
post what you will! I NEED help here. I don't want him to feel that I'm
losing it with this issue, though sometimes, I feel like I really am.
Having to clean poop off his but, down his leg, out of his underwear, pants,
socks, 3 times a day, while having a crying baby hanging on my legs, well, I
guess that might make anyone lose it?

ok, i'm really stopping now!
looking forward to any wisdom anyone can offer!

thanks!
Karen

S Drag-teine

Okay, one big hug at yah and I while I have 5 1/2 yo son and a 13 m
daughter. We have done the unschooling thing from the beginning with a few
lapses caused by my inability to let things go and my son's suddenly wanting
to go to kindergarten which lasted less then a month.

My son is still working on the potty thing. At age four he wore pull-up more
then he wore underwear. One of the things that helped at his age was a
reminder timer. Also, at some point, I can't tell you exactly what age - I
told him if he was going to make the mess, then he was going to clean it up.

Even now, he has the decision to wear his pull-up or underwear when he gets
up in the morning. At night he wears a pull-up...

I did talk to our doctor and he did some tests, there doesn't keep anything
medically wrong. He didn't ridicule my methods. He told me that he will get
it when he gets it.

Shannon

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-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John & Karen Buxcel
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 6:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] 4 yo potty stuff

Hello all!
I'm going to try to explain this without getting too wordy. Basically,
here's our situation.
We (dh and I) have 3 sons, 7, 4, 1. We give birth at home, breastfeed,
share sleep, wear our babies, and practice gentle parenting. Naturally,
we've been 'unschooling' since the birth of our first baby boy. Anyway,
here's my dilemma, and what a dilemma it is!

My 4yo son has such a hard time with the bathroom stuff. In a nutshell, he
pees his pants frequently and also poops them. I just wanted to reach out
for help here, as you all are in line with how I feel and parent. I can't
go to a doctor only to be told to 'put him in time out', or 'start a sticker
chart'. YUCK!

So, does anyone out there have any experience with this? Any ideas? I've
been working really, really hard on letting go of 'my' expectations that he
stop this, but I'm worried I'm missing something larger. I'm just so deep
in this, in many ways, that I may be missing something vital that's right in
front of me and I thought some of you might help me to clarify and get to
that point of figuring out some solutions.

Ok, I'm going to stop there. I'm happy to really evaluate this, so please
post what you will! I NEED help here. I don't want him to feel that I'm
losing it with this issue, though sometimes, I feel like I really am.
Having to clean poop off his but, down his leg, out of his underwear, pants,
socks, 3 times a day, while having a crying baby hanging on my legs, well, I
guess that might make anyone lose it?

ok, i'm really stopping now!
looking forward to any wisdom anyone can offer!

thanks!
Karen



Yahoo! Groups Links

[email protected]

>>looking forward to any wisdom anyone can offer!>>

Pull Ups! :o)

Seriously, I would just back off from potty learning completely for awhile and maybe try again in 3 or 6 months. I know it can seem like he's so old already when you're also changing a baby's diaper, but he'll get it eventually. He's only 4 and some little ones just take longer to get it than others. I wouldn't worry. My daughter was using Pull Ups for poop until she was 4+. She just had a mental block about using the potty along with complete control to wait for those Pull Ups.


--
~Mary, unschooling mom to Conor (16) and Casey (11)

"Just today I'm going to be utterly present for my children, I'm going to be in their world (not just doing my own thing while they do theirs), I'm going to really hear them, I'm going to prepare myself to be present starting right now."
~Ren Allen




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Danielle Conger

John & Karen Buxcel wrote:

>
> My 4yo son has such a hard time with the bathroom stuff. In a
> nutshell, he
> pees his pants frequently and also poops them. I just wanted to reach out
> for help here, as you all are in line with how I feel and parent. I can't
> go to a doctor only to be told to 'put him in time out', or 'start a
> sticker
> chart'. YUCK!


Hi Karen,

I just posted this to the AlwaysUnschooled list, but thought it might be
helpful here as well:

****At this stage of the game, even though I didn't know EC existed at
the time, I simply did away with the diapers altogether. I felt it was
important for the child to experience the bodily connections between
feeling they needed to go to the bathroom and going; I viewed this as an
important stage in the potty learning process. The child picked out some
special panties to wear and voila.

We just went right to underwear at this transition stage--or no pants at
all. I put down big canvas crib pads on the carpet where necessary, had
a potty in the playroom, cheerfully cleaned up accidents, got lots of
use out of my bissell spot cleaner, etc.

One of my children was comfortable using the potty and could stay clean
long before feeling comfortable going poop in the potty. We had
pull-ups, which we called "park panties" because the parks where we
lived had no bathrooms (I also traveled with a potty in my van for a
long time) and because all my kids were day-time free long before they
were able to go through the whole night--nighttime for all of them
happened at around 4.5. At any rate, my one child would simply go put
on a pull-up to go poop and call me when done for several months before
using the potty felt comfortable. For daytime, one was 19 mos for
everything; one was about 2.5; one was about 2.5 for pee/ 3.5 for poop.
*****

I just think each child is different, and boys, especially, tend to need
a bit more time, anecdotally. I would try not to stress about it or turn
it into a big issue. Just be prepared and give him the space and help to
go through whatever process he needs.



--
~~Danielle
Emily (8), Julia (7), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/1/2006 6:39:47 PM Central Standard Time,
dragteine@... writes:

> Even now, he has the decision to wear his pull-up or underwear when he gets
> up in the morning. At night he wears a pull-up...
>
>

Just to throw in here that every child matures different too... my 8 yr old
goes back in forth with the pullup at night she just went for almost a mnth in
underwear and announced at the store just yesterday mom I need some more
pullups I looked at her and she right away said im really tired I dont sleep as
well when Im thinking all night i might have to go pee. Now my 6yr old son
who totally potty trained himself at 2 is still in pullups at night cause he
pees LIKE ALL NIGHT LONG! I know though its getting better cause up until about
6mnths wed have to set a clock and get up at night to change his pullup or
hed pee through it everywhere! My point is dont fret he will potty train
maybe offer him the pullups and give him the choice.

Chrissy


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

John & Karen Buxcel

on 2/1/06 7:14 PM, zenmomma@... at zenmomma@... wrote:

> Seriously, I would just back off from potty learning completely for awhile
> and maybe try again in 3 or 6 months.


You're right! He seems open to wearing pull-ups, so I guess that's what I
need to do right now. He really could care less if he has pull ups on, or
big boy undies. At least pull ups are *meant* to be thrown away, and much
cheaper to do so than all of his adorable little boxer briefs!

Thanks for your input!

Karen

Manisha Kher

Will he be willing to wear pullups or diapers? It
wasn't clear to me from what you wrote, whether he was
using the bathroom earlier and has had a regression or
whether he never really started using the bathroom. I
have a 4 year old and he started using the toilet very
recently. He's still in a diaper at nighttime.

My daughter was wearing underwear and keeping it clean
when she was 3. But she went back to diapers for a
while after her younger brother arrived. From what I
understand, this kind of regression is quite common.

Manisha

--- John & Karen Buxcel <buxcel@...> wrote:

> Hello all!
> I'm going to try to explain this without getting too
> wordy. Basically,
> here's our situation.
> We (dh and I) have 3 sons, 7, 4, 1. We give birth
> at home, breastfeed,
> share sleep, wear our babies, and practice gentle
> parenting. Naturally,
> we've been 'unschooling' since the birth of our
> first baby boy. Anyway,
> here's my dilemma, and what a dilemma it is!
>
> My 4yo son has such a hard time with the bathroom
> stuff. In a nutshell, he
> pees his pants frequently and also poops them. I
> just wanted to reach out
> for help here, as you all are in line with how I
> feel and parent. I can't
> go to a doctor only to be told to 'put him in time
> out', or 'start a sticker
> chart'. YUCK!
>
> So, does anyone out there have any experience with
> this? Any ideas? I've
> been working really, really hard on letting go of
> 'my' expectations that he
> stop this, but I'm worried I'm missing something
> larger. I'm just so deep
> in this, in many ways, that I may be missing
> something vital that's right in
> front of me and I thought some of you might help me
> to clarify and get to
> that point of figuring out some solutions.
>
> Ok, I'm going to stop there. I'm happy to really
> evaluate this, so please
> post what you will! I NEED help here. I don't want
> him to feel that I'm
> losing it with this issue, though sometimes, I feel
> like I really am.
> Having to clean poop off his but, down his leg, out
> of his underwear, pants,
> socks, 3 times a day, while having a crying baby
> hanging on my legs, well, I
> guess that might make anyone lose it?
>
> ok, i'm really stopping now!
> looking forward to any wisdom anyone can offer!
>
> thanks!
> Karen
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
> [email protected]
>
>
>
>
>
>


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Paige Parr

Danielle Conger <danielle.conger@...> wrote: John & Karen Buxcel wrote:

>



Hi Karen,

I just posted this to the AlwaysUnschooled list, but thought it might be
helpful here as well:

****At this stage of the game, even though I didn't know EC existed at
the time, I simply did away with the diapers altogether. I felt it was
important for the child to experience the bodily connections between
feeling they needed to go to the bathroom and going; I viewed this as an
important stage in the potty learning process. The child picked out some
special panties to wear and voila.

We just went right to underwear at this transition stage--or no pants at
all. I put down big canvas crib pads on the carpet where necessary, had
a potty in the playroom, cheerfully cleaned up accidents, got lots of
use out of my bissell spot cleaner, etc.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Hi Danielle! I know you (well, by name) a bit from the Shine list, so hello to you and yours!

I'm hoping you, and everyone here, can help me out. We have some issues here with the potty, too. I really like the advice above, it's pretty much what I've done with all three older girls, but my youngest, Lolo is giving us a harder time.

Here's the deal: Loryn is three (four in May) and has a diagnosis of autism. More than that, really, is that she doesn't talk yet. I mean, at all...at least, no speech with us. She will sing Wiggles songs, or count with us, or repeat certain words (she likes animal names the best), and once in a while she'll use "bye bye" in correct context. No Mama, Daddy, nurse, milk, and definitely no poop or pee. :-)

My question is: would you recommend that I start potty-training Loryn the same way (i.e. getting rid of diapers, using pull-ups at park or co-op days, etc.)? She has shown no interest in going to the potty, except for one or two times, but she's off again (and running, and giggling) in a second or two. Maybe I shouldn't even be worried about potty-training now? I have to admit, some of this comes from pressure from family and friends, who have all KINDS of advice..."If you get her off the tit...if you get her out of your bed...if you don't carry her, blah, blah, blah. Seems these people think ignoring mother's instincts and children's needs can "fix" anything: talking, potty-training, "tantrums", even autism! LOL Then again, with all that great advice from others (there's that sarcasm again!), I have to admit that it would just be easier (for ME, I know, not necessarily her) if Loryn WERE potty-trained. And speech seems to be a big part of that for me...I have to admit, I'm
skeptical of EC...but I've never tried it, so who knows. And is it too late to go that route?

Many questions, lots of pondering...please excuse my rambling (it's 1:40 am here in the beautiful Shenandoah Valley), and my three youngest are up with me...Loryn and Ashlyn (also diagnosed with Autism) are playing a Blues Clues game on the computer, Tori (my 7 year old) is listening to Harry Potter on tape. My oldest, Shelby (12) has deserted us, and is in her room re-arranging things, packing up Beanie Babies and American Girl dolls because she feels the need to have a "teenage" room. I'm about in tears over this, BTW...LOL...something she feels she needs to do.

Anyway, I learn so much from this group, so thanks in advance for any advice that you all can give.

Thanks again,

Paige




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Patti Channell

Ok. Well I have six year old son who still dosen't go to the bathroom by himself either.
I've heard the kid's bladders don't develop all the way untill they're like 8- 10 years old, mayby that's why many young kids still pee their beds. My son likes little prizes, so when he goes by himself he gets to choose a small prize. When he has help or dosen't go by himself we give him a sticker. When he gets 7 stickers he gets to choose a small prize. This so far has worked well. Try to find your child's motivator and work from there. Good luck! Let me know what works, Patti

John & Karen Buxcel <buxcel@...> wrote:
Hello all!
I'm going to try to explain this without getting too wordy. Basically,
here's our situation.
We (dh and I) have 3 sons, 7, 4, 1. We give birth at home, breastfeed,
share sleep, wear our babies, and practice gentle parenting. Naturally,
we've been 'unschooling' since the birth of our first baby boy. Anyway,
here's my dilemma, and what a dilemma it is!

My 4yo son has such a hard time with the bathroom stuff. In a nutshell, he
pees his pants frequently and also poops them. I just wanted to reach out
for help here, as you all are in line with how I feel and parent. I can't
go to a doctor only to be told to 'put him in time out', or 'start a sticker
chart'. YUCK!

So, does anyone out there have any experience with this? Any ideas? I've
been working really, really hard on letting go of 'my' expectations that he
stop this, but I'm worried I'm missing something larger. I'm just so deep
in this, in many ways, that I may be missing something vital that's right in
front of me and I thought some of you might help me to clarify and get to
that point of figuring out some solutions.

Ok, I'm going to stop there. I'm happy to really evaluate this, so please
post what you will! I NEED help here. I don't want him to feel that I'm
losing it with this issue, though sometimes, I feel like I really am.
Having to clean poop off his but, down his leg, out of his underwear, pants,
socks, 3 times a day, while having a crying baby hanging on my legs, well, I
guess that might make anyone lose it?

ok, i'm really stopping now!
looking forward to any wisdom anyone can offer!

thanks!
Karen


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John & Karen Buxcel

Hi Paige,
Do you get Mothering Magazine? The last issue they published was a special
autism issue and it had some amazing therapies and homeopathic information
in there that had some unbelievable results.
Just wanted to let you know, in case!

It was the Jan/Feb issue of Mothering Magazine.

Good luck on your 'potty adventure', we're there with ya! :)

Karen

Paige Parr

OH, thanks for reminding me, Karen! I read somewhere that Mothering had a feature on autism...I'll have to check it out.

Geez, now I'm hoping I can still find it...February kind of snuck up on me!

Thanks again,

Paige in VA


John & Karen Buxcel <buxcel@...> wrote:
Hi Paige,
Do you get Mothering Magazine? The last issue they published was a special
autism issue and it had some amazing therapies and homeopathic information
in there that had some unbelievable results.
Just wanted to let you know, in case!

It was the Jan/Feb issue of Mothering Magazine.

Good luck on your 'potty adventure', we're there with ya! :)

Karen



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