Erin

With over 2000 members I thought this list would be really active. Is
it normal for there to be so little activity?

Kelly Lovejoy

-----Original Message-----


From: Erin <theburkemommy@...>



With over 2000 members I thought this list would be really active. Is
it normal for there to be so little activity?  




-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Below is the number of posts per month since the group was formed in May of 2004.

My only warning is to be careful what you wish for. <G>

Typically, the lists ebb and flow. I kind of look forward to the quiet days. <g> So far, 

this has been an abnormally slow month. But inevitably, someone will ask about discipline or

reading or bedtimes or math, and it will pick up. <G>

I suggest to just enjoy the down time. <BWG>

But if you have something you'd like addressed, please post!











Jan

Feb

Mar

Apr

May

Jun

Jul

Aug

Sep

Oct

Nov

Dec



2008

579

1077

1108

852

1011

973

728

622

664

353







2007

984

630

1115

627

629

659

583

686

496

892

670

560



2006

1028

647

887

1448

1154

1362

871

940

669

1034

743

709



2005

317

139

380

94

105

140

221

543

476

429

685

628



2004









138

1145

1121

600

370

536

293

308




~Kelly















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

April Driggers

I was thinking the same thing



_____

From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Erin
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 11:26 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Is this normal?



With over 2000 members I thought this list would be really active. Is
it normal for there to be so little activity?





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Nicole Willoughby

I think there are at lot like me that do a lot more reading than talking :)

Posts seem to come in waves though.


Nicole

Don't worry that children never listen to you : worry that they are always watching you--Robert Fulghum



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelly Lovejoy

-----Original Message-----
From: April Driggers <aprildriggers@...>








I was thinking the same thing



-=-=-=-=-

A list is only as active as its members.

Do you have a question? Concern?

Are you pro-spanking? Pro-control?

Are you struggling with bedtimes? With food issues?

Are you looking for a conference? Unschooling friends?

Do you have a husband who is not on board? Do your in-laws just not understand?

Do you think children need to be taught responsibility?

What about math? Reading? Socialization?

Can you see the learning in everything? Maybe everyone understands unschooling, and 

we're not needed any more? <g>




Start a topic. People will respond.




Keep in mind, though, that some are busy traveling. Some are cleaning out closets and sorting

summer/winter clothes. Some are gardening. Some are planning conferences or gatherings. Some 

are playing YuGiOh! or Barbies with their kids. Some are designing and making Halloween

costumes. Some are baking gingerbread. Some have a new puppy or a new rat. Some are raking 

up giant piles of leaves to jump in. Some are painting a mural.




But...if there's an interesting topic, they'll stop and post. I promise. <G>




~Kelly








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelly Lovejoy

-----Original Message-----

From: April Driggers <aprildriggers@...>











I was thinking the same thing



-=-=-=-=-

A list is only as active as its members.

Do you have a question? Concern?

Are you pro-spanking? Pro-control?

Are you struggling with bedtimes? With food issues?

Are you looking for a conference? Unschooling friends?

Do you have a husband who is not on board? Do your in-laws just not understand?

Do you think children need to be taught responsibility?

What about math? Reading? Socialization?

Can you see the learning in everything? Maybe everyone understands unschooling, and 

we're not needed any more? <g>




Start a topic. People will respond.




Keep in mind, though, that some are busy traveling. Some are cleaning out closets and sorting

summer/winter clothes. Some are gardening. Some are planning conferences or gatherings. Some 

are playing YuGiOh! or Barbies with their kids. Some are designing and making Halloween

costumes. Some are baking gingerbread. Some have a new puppy or a new rat. Some are raking 

up giant piles of leaves to jump in. Some are painting a mural.




But...if there's an interesting topic, they'll stop and post. I promise. <G>




~Kelly









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tammy Curry

I have seen this list swamp me with email and other times it is quiet. I know for us we have a bout of the flu going around and have been resting today anyway, I am only online because I have my own classes to log into today to turn in a project. Is it possible to let college prof's in on the unschooling method?

Tammy




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Meredith

FWIW, some of the other "high volume" boards are quiet too, right now.
Something in the solar wind I suppose ;)
---Meredith

Nelson and Kelly

I am new to this group, let me introduce my family.

My name is Kelly, my husband, Nelson and I have been married for 17 years.
We have 3 boys, Anthony 13yrs old, Benjamin and Christopher are 11 yrs old.

Our boys have always been in public school until March of 2007. Anthony was
finishing up 6th grade, Benjamin and Christopher were in 3rd grade. We had
been praying for months about taking them out of school and homeschooling.
After our twins were crying for several nights and several mornings before
school, we knew that we had to do something about their misery. WE pulled
them out and unschooled for many, many months! It was very freeing and
relaxing. I was recovering from a total hysterectomy. Lots of changes in
our home!!

Our twins have really suffered from learning disabilities, I would rather
say they just learn things differently! They were crying every night and
morning before school because they were being told that if they did not
learn their multiplication facts they would fail 4th grade! HELLO!! They
were still in 3rd and they are telling them they are going to fail the
FOLLOWING year!

We have recently started researching unschooling, what a wonderful concept!
I have been leaning towards this method for quite some time without
realizing it, but have begun to search and read more about it, how it works
and the outcomes.



How do our more experienced unschoolers introduce new concepts?
How do you deal with video games? If I allowed my boys they would be on
24/7!! My oldest has a new passion from his xbox game forza, he is
phenomenal with cars, their makes, models, capabilities, but how do I
guarantee that he is getting a "real" education? How can I build off of this
passion in the things he NEEDS to know to go to college and make it in this
society?

My twins really struggle academically, but in the outdoors they excel. They
love to build camp fires and are very good at problem solving, but math!,
forget it! They HATE IT!

I want my boys to have a renewed love for learning, they are better than
when they were in PS, but still we live in the city, not lots of space.

They would LOVE to be out in wide open spaces with lots of options for
airsoft wars, army guys and camping.



I have really enjoyed reading about your lives and how you unschool.

I would LOVE to get some input and advice on how to begin this new, totally
unfamiliar territory.



God bless,

Kelly in FL



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

k

For math, read here:
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/academics/math/unschoolingmath.html

A couple of places for reading about video games (to start with; there's
lots more than this):
http://tinyurl.com/6mu72a
http://sandradodd.com/ifilet
http://sandradodd.com/videogames

And welcome to unschooling, Kelly. You gonna love it.

~Katherine




On 10/22/08, Nelson and Kelly <nel-kel@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> I am new to this group, let me introduce my family.
>
> My name is Kelly, my husband, Nelson and I have been married for 17 years.
> We have 3 boys, Anthony 13yrs old, Benjamin and Christopher are 11 yrs old.
>
> Our boys have always been in public school until March of 2007. Anthony was
> finishing up 6th grade, Benjamin and Christopher were in 3rd grade. We had
> been praying for months about taking them out of school and homeschooling.
> After our twins were crying for several nights and several mornings before
> school, we knew that we had to do something about their misery. WE pulled
> them out and unschooled for many, many months! It was very freeing and
> relaxing. I was recovering from a total hysterectomy. Lots of changes in
> our home!!
>
> Our twins have really suffered from learning disabilities, I would rather
> say they just learn things differently! They were crying every night and
> morning before school because they were being told that if they did not
> learn their multiplication facts they would fail 4th grade! HELLO!! They
> were still in 3rd and they are telling them they are going to fail the
> FOLLOWING year!
>
> We have recently started researching unschooling, what a wonderful concept!
> I have been leaning towards this method for quite some time without
> realizing it, but have begun to search and read more about it, how it works
> and the outcomes.
>
> How do our more experienced unschoolers introduce new concepts?
> How do you deal with video games? If I allowed my boys they would be on
> 24/7!! My oldest has a new passion from his xbox game forza, he is
> phenomenal with cars, their makes, models, capabilities, but how do I
> guarantee that he is getting a "real" education? How can I build off of
> this
> passion in the things he NEEDS to know to go to college and make it in this
> society?
>
> My twins really struggle academically, but in the outdoors they excel. They
> love to build camp fires and are very good at problem solving, but math!,
> forget it! They HATE IT!
>
> I want my boys to have a renewed love for learning, they are better than
> when they were in PS, but still we live in the city, not lots of space.
>
> They would LOVE to be out in wide open spaces with lots of options for
> airsoft wars, army guys and camping.
>
> I have really enjoyed reading about your lives and how you unschool.
>
> I would LOVE to get some input and advice on how to begin this new, totally
> unfamiliar territory.
>
> God bless,
>
> Kelly in FL
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mike and Michelle

Hi Everyone!
I am also new to the group. My name is Michelle and I am Mom to 7 awesome children. We currently have two graduating this year :(, one in 4th grade, one in 6th grade, 2 1/2 year old twins and a 1 year old. We currently only homeschool one of the seniors, Andrea. Our 4th and 6th graders live with my ex-husband during the school year and attend a public school. I tried to talk my ex-husband into letting me homeschool them (we homeschooled while we were married), but he wouldn't go for it :( I have gone from an EXTREMELY structured packaged curriculum, to Charlotte Mason with Andrea. We both disliked (I don't think that word is quite strong enough) the structured method. She isn't minding the Charlotte Mason approach this year, but she can't stand the structured math, government, etc. She is to the point where she doesn't even do it anymore! I have actually stopped hounding her about it and am feeling better and better about that decision the more I read about unschooling. She will, however, work on the area's she does enjoy like psychology, french, citizenship (Charlotte Mason's book Ourselves) and bible study (which she gets up and does every morning). We had considered the classical method with the younger three and are currently using some of the montessori method with them ( in an informal way).
What's really funny is, now that I'm reading everything I can get my hands on about unschooling, I'm seeing everything my kids do in a different light. I have moved some of the montessori out and about for them to use without "presentations" as they wish. And like I said I'm not hounding my daughter anymore. I feel so much better, so relaxed! I'm actually enjoying myself with all 4 that are home with me during the day :)
I just checked out another book tonight, so I'm going to go read more. The only thing that concerns me is getting daddy on board! He may be a little harder to convince, we'll see!
Well, sorry this was so long! I'm really excited about this and can't wait to see where it leads us as a family! Hopefully you ladies (and gents) won't mind my questions:)
I'm off to do some more reading!
Michelle



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robin Bentley

Welcome, Michelle,

Maybe some of your questions will be answered here:

http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/unschooling/firstquestions.html
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/unschooling/howto.html

or here (on Sandra Dodd's great site, but written by this list's co-
owner):

http://sandradodd.com/kellylovejoy/stages

For an excellent book that is easy to read and *get*, especially for
spouses, I'd recommend "Parenting a Free Child - An Unschooled Life"
by Rue Kream (a moderator of this list <g>). http://
www.freechild.info/.

I would also suggest just reading here at the group for awhile, say a
couple of weeks or so. If there isn't enough "traffic," search the
archives on the Yahoo site for issues you might like some discussion
on. It's a handy strategy for any newbie, to get the flavor of the list.

Then, fire away with your questions!

Robin B.


On Oct 22, 2008, at 6:01 PM, Mike and Michelle wrote:

>
> Hi Everyone!
> I am also new to the group. My name is Michelle and I am Mom to 7
> awesome children. We currently have two graduating this year :(, one
> in 4th grade, one in 6th grade, 2 1/2 year old twins and a 1 year
> old. We currently only homeschool one of the seniors, Andrea. Our
> 4th and 6th graders live with my ex-husband during the school year
> and attend a public school. I tried to talk my ex-husband into
> letting me homeschool them (we homeschooled while we were married),
> but he wouldn't go for it :( I have gone from an EXTREMELY
> structured packaged curriculum, to Charlotte Mason with Andrea. We
> both disliked (I don't think that word is quite strong enough) the
> structured method. She isn't minding the Charlotte Mason approach
> this year, but she can't stand the structured math, government, etc.
> She is to the point where she doesn't even do it anymore! I have
> actually stopped hounding her about it and am feeling better and
> better about that decision the more I read about unschooling. She
> will, however, work on the area's she does enjoy like psychology,
> french, citizenship (Charlotte Mason's book Ourselves) and bible
> study (which she gets up and does every morning). We had considered
> the classical method with the younger three and are currently using
> some of the montessori method with them ( in an informal way).
> What's really funny is, now that I'm reading everything I can get my
> hands on about unschooling, I'm seeing everything my kids do in a
> different light. I have moved some of the montessori out and about
> for them to use without "presentations" as they wish. And like I
> said I'm not hounding my daughter anymore. I feel so much better, so
> relaxed! I'm actually enjoying myself with all 4 that are home with
> me during the day :)
> I just checked out another book tonight, so I'm going to go read
> more. The only thing that concerns me is getting daddy on board! He
> may be a little harder to convince, we'll see!
> Well, sorry this was so long! I'm really excited about this and
> can't wait to see where it leads us as a family! Hopefully you
> ladies (and gents) won't mind my questions:)
> I'm off to do some more reading!
> Michelle
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kathleen Gehrke

--- In [email protected], "Nelson and Kelly" <nel-
kel@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> My oldest has a new passion from his xbox game forza, he is
> phenomenal with cars, their makes, models, capabilities, but how do
I
> guarantee that he is getting a "real" education?

First let me tell you some of my kids learned to read and then write
from video games.

The key for us to to have a passion about the information we are
taking in. Then you want to take it to the next level, meaning get as
much information as possible, or perhaps go onto to another interest.

What we have found is that life and a real education are really one
in the same. My kids can talk politics, the environment. They can
cook gourmet, play the guitar, do crafting like no ones business.
They appreciate art, history and sciences. BUT they are not seperated
out. They are a reflection of a full life. That is the real education.

I also have several children that would be identified as special
needs. I choose to identify all my children as individuals. There is
no perfect time to learn AB or C. Each of them have perfect, perfect
perfect timing for them.

Oh and by the way they might initially play video games 24/7. When no
one is rushing them off. They might learn really important concepts
there. Then they might jump on a trampoline or watch the stars or
build a fire. They might meet new friends at the park or train a dog,
or dance like the guy on YouTube.

An unschooling life is RICH. It is a perfect education.

WELCOME,
Kathleen

cary.seston

Maybe everyone understands unschooling, and 
>
> we're not needed any more? <g>
>

Kelly~
This is not a funny joke.

Cary <g>
rookie RUer since Feb 2008

Joyce Fetteroll

On Oct 22, 2008, at 6:42 PM, Nelson and Kelly wrote:

> How do our more experienced unschoolers introduce new concepts?

How do you introduce something to a friend?

For one, I'm betting you're not thinking "This would be good for her.
She needs this for life. How can I get this into her?" as parents do
with kids.

For another, if she shows no interest, you might be disappointed but
I bet you move on. Perhaps find another friend who will like it.

There are a million ideas and things to do and things to see and
experience out there in the world. If they choose one, like spiders,
they're not doing another, like Abraham Lincoln and whales and Legos
and Hardy Boys.

Treat anything new like a new video game. Show it to them. If they're
interested, pursue it. If not, move on. Don't get personally invested
in anyone thing. If it's important, the opportunity will come again.
If it doesn't show up again, then it's not really a part of life, is it?

Think of it this way. Kids will give us a few opportunities to
pressure them into trying something. The more often they like what we
urged them to try, the more they'll trust us and give us the benefit
of the doubt when we say "I think you'll like this." But if we blow
it on something we think is important and turns out dull, they're
going to trust us less the next time.

They'll give you a handful of Trust Mes. Don't squander them ;-) And
the bonus is if you nail a Trust Me, they'll give you more. :-)

> How do you deal with video games? If I allowed my boys they would
> be on
> 24/7!!

Read here:

http://sandradodd.com/ifilet

Yes, I know it's an exaggeration. Yes, I know you're convinced they
would play from the moment they get up to the moment they fall over
exhausted.

But what I know (not just guess!) from the personal experience of
hundreds of unschoolers who were just as convinced by their
children's behavior is that you are creating that hunger by limiting
video games.

If you lift the controls, yes, they will play for hours and hours for
days. They will fear the controls will return so they will need to
gorge on what was limited. But if you hold on through the hard part,
they will slow down. Once they are confident they can set the game
down and then pick it up anytime they want, they will be able to let
go. They will move onto other things. They won't give up games
entirely. The may play more, perhaps a lot more, than you would let
them. (Prepuberty years tend to be the time when they do play video
games a lot and watch a lot of tv. It's a mental transition period
between child interests and more grown up interests.) A new game will
get them excited again.

> My oldest has a new passion from his xbox game forza, he is
> phenomenal with cars, their makes, models, capabilities, but how do I
> guarantee that he is getting a "real" education?

How do you know it isn't a real education?

How do you know that schools provide real educations?

Those sound like idiotic questions, but once you've stepped far
enough away from schoolish methods and have seen what real learning
looks like -- and trusted it! --, school looks like kids being force
fed predigested pabulum and real learning looks like a smorgasbord
that's out all the time for them to explore a world of food from.

How easily did your kids pick up English as toddlers? How easily did
you pick up a foreign language in school? Which was real learning?

> How can I build off of this
> passion in the things he NEEDS to know to go to college and make it
> in this
> society?

Does he need what schools provide to get into college?

That's something most people don't even question. We assume that
colleges are dictating what they want kids to know. But really
colleges are complaining that kids aren't prepared!

What colleges *really* want -- but can't get from kids coming out of
high school -- are kids who are passionate about their field of
study. What they want are kids who do have the ability to absorb
knowledge the way colleges present it. The first is the most
important since it will drive kids past the tedious parts of the second.

Why try to make your kids look like schooled kids when you can help
them explore their passions and they'll stand out even more?

> My twins really struggle academically, but in the outdoors they
> excel. They
> love to build camp fires and are very good at problem solving, but
> math!,
> forget it! They HATE IT!

I bet they know more math than you can see. I bet what they hate is
math that's pulled out of context and being forced to do problems
that have no meaning.

If you're in a store with $22 and want to feed the family dinner with
enough left over for a latte you haven't had for 3 weeks, *that's*
real math. If you're told to do 22-4.95-8.32-3.99 that's a problem
that ends in the trash whether you get the answer right or not. Even
if those numbers were one of the options you ran through for the
first scenario, with the second you aren't buying real food, there
won't be a real latte at the end, you won't get to decide if you'd
rather have the asparagus and skip the syrup or the green beans and
get the syrup.

Down below is something I wrote yesterday about math for a local list.

> I want my boys to have a renewed love for learning, they are better
> than
> when they were in PS, but still we live in the city, not lots of
> space.
>
> They would LOVE to be out in wide open spaces with lots of options for
> airsoft wars, army guys and camping.

People move to different towns to get their talented kids on better
sports teams.

If you lived out in the boonies and your kids were showing monstrous
talent for classical piano with only one old lady teacher within 100
miles, wouldn't that seem incentive to move?

Your kids have one chance at childhood. If they're genius lies in the
outdoors, isn't it the same as trapping them far from people with
talent and resources who could nurture their talents?

I think we all have it in the back of our minds that the only reason
to move is for dad or mom to get a job. But why should that be? We
only get one chance at life. Why should that chance be as a slave to
the location of a company that said yes, come work for us? Why can't
dreams be the driving force? Mostly because society says, no, don't
take chances. Take the safe route. And at the end of the safe route
we get to say "I survived life until it ended." Is getting through
life safely the point?

You don't need to tell me why that won't work. The list is about
ideas. You don't need a list to support "No, I can't." But if the
idea intrigues you and you'd like to explore it, I'm sure there are
plenty of people here who have the wisdom of experience for "I did do
it."

=============
The math post from another list:

The problem with school type math (like workbooks) is that it begins
with the abstract with the hope that kids will grasp the concrete.
It's not that educators want to be difficult. It's that it's really
hard to teach how numbers are fluid, how math is just a way of
describing the world. And it's even harder to test. (And schools must
test in order to prove to the state and parents that they're
accomplishing something.) So educators *can't* teach in ways that
help kids grasp how numbers work because they have to test :-/

Unfortunately lots of software just takes school math and jazzes it
up because the goal for most parents isn't understanding math but to
boost kids grades. Not, of course, because parents don't care but
because they assume understanding and good grades are the same thing.
(Why wouldn't they? I'm sure math teachers are just as convinced.)

An analogy I often use is that school math is like teaching kids
sentence structure and vocabulary of a language they've never heard.
When math is taken out of context, it becomes little more than a
bunch of rules and memorization divorced from the real world.

That's why lots of people have problems with math in school. Not
because they're dumb. Not because they don't apply themselves. Not
even because math is hard! (It isn't.) But because schools need to
use a method that's practically impossible to learn from in order to
test.

(BTW, I don't say that because I hated math. I actually liked school
math. It was like puzzles to me. I went on to get a degree in
engineering because I liked and was good at school math. I was
absolutely convinced that the math I went through couldn't be learned
by living life. It wasn't until my daughter was middle schoolish age
and I could see how she was using math in her play that I finally
grasped the difference between abstract contextless school math and
real world math.)

With only the example of school to go by, people are absolutely
positively convinced that learning math takes hours a week. So it's
useful to know that unschooled kids spend minutes a week and learn
math anyway. That's because unschooled kids use math concepts as
tools to pull information they need out of their worlds. They learn
math as a side effect of using it. Just as they learned how to speak,
just by using it as a tool to get what they wanted.

My daughter learned percentages not by studying them as an abstract
concept and practicing with contextless problems (eg, what's 17.4% of
193?) but by seeing them used and using them to extract information
she needed. I honestly can't say enough good about video games and
math :-) Art programs. Allowance. Measuring. Sorting and ordering
collections. Shopping. Cooking. None of this was done to teach math.
Math was just used in the process. The purpose of cooking was to make
cookies and such :-) In the process sometimes we'd be doubling or a
measuring cup was dirty and we needed to cobble together a half cup
with only a quarter cup measure available and so on. Math was never a
goal but it was very often a tool that got used.

At 13 she decided to take the college statistics course her dad
teaches. While she did have him available to ask for help on
homework, she did the tests like everyone else and was at the top of
her class. She took 4 more college classes (two without him. though
again he helped with homework) and also did very well. That's *not*
meant to imply that anyone can plunk their kid down in front of video
games and have them take college math at 13 ;-) The goal of
unschooling is for kids to explore what they enjoy, not to ace
college courses. And yet that can happen anyway. It does mean that
with nothing more than using math as a tool over the years, that my
daughter was able to apply her knowledge in a math course when lots
of the kids with 12+ years of school math couldn't. She's not a math
head, doing math puzzles under the covers at night ;-) She's more of
an art head but she did think it was fun.

I don't throw that out there to convince you to drop all math
programs. Unless someone has fully embraced unschooling, unschooling
math is probably a recipe for ulcers ;-) I do throw it out because
without that information, it seems like schools hold the only truth
there is about teaching math: that it's hard and takes hours. Nothing
could be further from the truth. What schools do is practically
impossible and it's no wonder that they not only don't do well but
churn out loads of kids that hate and fear math. Math isn't as hard
as schools make it. Unfortunately learning math by living life looks
nothing like doing school math -- it looks way more like playing
video games ;-) -- so it can make parents nervous.

(The amount of math and the depth of math needed for video games is
incredible. Schools can't touch the type of math (strategy in
particular) that video games use because it's hard to test. The
foundation of video games is math. The strategies necessary to beat
them use mathematical thinking. It doesn't look like school math
because it's real math :-) Of course video games are more than just
math. They're more like microcosms of the world where all sorts of
tools get used ;-) Sandra Dodd has collected a lot of good
information about video games if anyone's curious:

http://sandradodd.com/videogames)

Finally I can get to recommendations. There are several math programs
used by relaxed homeschoolers at:

http://www.fun-books.com/mathematics.htm

Miquon workbooks -- I like the layout of these. They do a decent job
of presenting the idea of numbers as fluid and that there being more
than one way to arrive at an answer. Lots of relaxed homeschoolers
use them. (Kat did a couple of pages but was never one for "Here, do
this," kind of work so, except for 2 months of 2nd grade, those few
page were the extent of her formal math. ;-)

Zoombinis - Just a wonderful piece of software. And not a single
number! Kids play with math concepts and come up with strategies to
move the Zoombinis along to a safe place. There are at least two of
programs, both equally wonderful. You don't need one to play the other.

Children's science museum in Acton. They've got great math toys :-)

If anyone's curious about the fun of math (as well as unschooling
math), Sandra Dodd has a really good page:

http://sandradodd.com/math/

I have some stuff too, answers to common questions about math (and
other stuff):

http://joyfullyrejoycing.com

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

amberlee_b

Let me give you an example of video games and movies as a jumping off
point. My oldest is almost 13 and is completely obsessed with
superheros and comic books. He loves the spiderman video game and
when we decided to unschool everything and not just what they were
learning he wanted to play 24/7. The only reason he chose not to was
he felt it was fair to let his younger siblings have the opportunity
to use the PS2. They worked out a plan among themselves. If one of
the others wished to play they would let him finish or pass what he
was trying to do first.

If it wasn't the video games it was movies. We have watched (some
multiple times) Spiderman I and II, X-Men I and II, Hellboy, Iron Man,
and a handful of other movies. After watching Iron Man 3 times (once
in the cheap seats theater)the change happened. No, I don't mean his
voice dropped, although he is working on that one. He stopped
watching movies. For the last 2 weeks he has been creating, building,
recycling. I can't wait to take photos and put them on the RUN ning
to show you what he has created. I am amazed. It began with an Iron
Man suit, he only got part of it finished when he found an Optimus
Prime mask at the thrift store for $3. It still works!! This week he
worked endlessly building the suit out of cardboard for his Halloween
costume. I haven't done anything on it, wouldn't have the first clue
how to do it...but he has been working on it, details and all. We
plan to start base painting it so we can spray paint it metallic
colors. All those times watching the movies and old TV episodes via
YouTube have him using engineering, creativity, measuring, math and
more for the coolest project I have had the experience to witness.

Did he completely stop with movies this week? No-the Hulk came out on
Redbox so his dad and I watched together (it gave him a break from
tape and cardboard). His mind is spinning in a different direction
with it now. He has to create till it is finished with limited breaks
or he will forget what he wants to do and how.

This is how the brain works. Some people need multiple breaks, others
thrive on uninterrupted sessions hours on end. He wouldn't get that
in school. Every 50 minutes something new. He wouldn't do well in
spurts like that. Just as he would start wrapping his brain around
something POOF and on to the next subject.

Today he is volunteering at the library...he also thanked me for the
time he has had to create. it is pretty cool... :)

Hang in there and let them wear themselves out with the games. It
will lead to other things.

Huggs,
Amberlee

Dawn Booth

Hello Amberlee, Gosh your attitude towards your child's self learning is contagious, and I thank you for that.
I have a 13 year boy, and he learns so much through ps2, I am amazed at his reading ability and I am proud
to say hes done it all himself.
He hates writing BUT- I do see him on odd occasions searching the internet for the cheats, and when some sites don't print out what he wants, he will write them down, so there are alternatives to them getting to experience
writing skills, And in New Zealand we have the wonderful online auctions called trade me which is similar to your E-Bay, anyway there's reading , budgeting skills they learn , not to mention finding info on their favourite items.
Its so sad to know just how much conditioning everyone carries with us from our upbringings.
I am learning everyday through my own life experiences where and when to cut the cords to all that conditioning. and to develope new skills for myself and my boy.
We are so lucky in life to be able to offer our kids the chance to be Unschooled.
Smiles and happiness to those who unschool.
from Dawn Booth of New Zealand


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Meredith

--- In [email protected], "Nelson and Kelly" <nel-
kel@...> wrote:
>How can I build off of this
> passion in the things he NEEDS to know to go to college and make
it in this
> society?

This is tricky - you want to inspire and support a love of learning,
right? but every time to start thinking "okay, how can I "build" on
this so that..." you step right in between learning and love. Take a
breath and step back instead. Look at the learning that's happening
Right Now - don't worry if it seems to be something small or
disconnected from "academic" learning. Ultimately all learning is
about making hundreds of thousands of tiny connections. Before your
kids ever went to school you may have watched them learn and learn
and learn a thousand tiny things a day and were amazed - but school
shattered that process into dull memorization of random glop. Now
you have the wonderful opportunity to see that magic again - but to
*see* it, you have to believe its possible for your kids to learn as
effortlessly as they did when they were babies. It *is* possible!
They're doing it now.

Passion is one of the responses to that effortless learning process.
Hooray! Your kids are still passionate! They still remember the most
important thing about learning - that its fun and exciting and
stimulating. That it can absorb them for hours. Woopee! See what
excites them and look for ways to support it. Right now that might
simply mean bringing snacks to your gamer and sitting and watching
him play now and then so you can talk sensibly with him about his
passion.

> My twins really struggle academically, but in the outdoors they
excel. They
> love to build camp fires and are very good at problem solving

Wow, problem solving - do you know how many teachers, especially
math teachers, would Loooooove to be able to say their students were
learning how to solve problems well? How lucky you are to have such
fabulous kids!

What do most adults do when they run into a problem they can't
handle? ask a friend or a sales clerk or hire a professional for
help. *That's* probably one of the most valuble pieces of problem
solving to learn - who to ask when you can't figure something out.
Now that your kids aren't in school, you get to help them do that,
grown-up style. Mom, how do I do this? Well, this is what *I* do. -
Or- Um...I dunno, lets call dad at work and see if he knows. -Or-
Hmmm, maybe we can google it.... You don't have to turn it into some
kind of teaching moment - like Joyce said about "introducing"
things: do what you'd do with a friend.

>I would rather
> say they just learn things differently!

Yes!
If you want more ideas about some of the different ways people learn
here's a page on the Theory of Multiple Intelligences:
http://sandradodd.com/intelligences/

> They would LOVE to be out in wide open spaces with lots of options
for
> airsoft wars, army guys and camping.

This seems like the biggest thing you need to actively work on -
finding more ways for them to fill their "outdoors" cup. I have the
opposite challenge, I live deep in the country with a teen who loves
to socialize. So we work to find him ways and places to meet and
hang out and get his social needs met. It helps me, especially when
gas prices soar and everthing Ray wants to do involves driving
somewhere, to remember that this is how he best learns about the
world. You can look at going camping (or whatever you choose to do)
in the same way - this is what your guys need so they can be
learning at their absolute best.

Check your local lists for any fall/winter unschoolers camping
trips!

---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)