melissazietlow

Hello Everyone,

Just wondering -- how anyone else goes about managing the household
responsibilities while unschooling? I came across an inspirational
website by a homeschooling couple with 8 children recently, and
ordered their book Managers of the Home because I have long felt
extremely overwhelmed with this facet of life, and have been
searching for a solution that will bring a more organized home and
lifestyle, where the things can be found, company can drop in without
panic, and the finances under control.

The ideas this family shares in this book make a lot of sense, and I
have decided to implement a schedule for our family, with a few
differences. The authors' family has a set schedule for 6 days of
the week -- for household tasks, meals, business, baths, play time,
school time, hobbies, kids'naps, chores, etc. ALL their time is
scheduled, for each family member, even infants.

Since we are trying the unschooling path, this seemed much too rigid
to follow. No spontaneity! And no freedom for learning! So, I
adapted my schedule to include household tasks, business, and an
evening routine, since from dinner time on is usually chaos until my
husband leaves for work at night, and we are never on the same page.
I am tweaking a schedule for shopping, errands, library, etc. All of
this(when followed)is making a positive difference in the state of
our home and bringing peace, and I am excited about it.

However, at first, when I put the schedule together, I was still
stressing over kindergarten starting so I thought I would
schedule "school" time thinking it could be used as time available
to "spend together", without a specific agenda (unschooling school
time, I thought!) Then I of course found out that most of the time
when the scheduled "school" time came, my girls usually were
engrossed in their own play or project and didn't need me to get
involved, and everything was thrown off. So I have adapted a loose
overall schedule to allow for spontaneous moments to be available to
them, based on the way our days naturally flow.

I am finding more and more that the girls (3 & 5yo) are just not
needing me as much and there are days when they often play for hours
without asking me for involvement, other than bathroom help, to help
with a conflict, or for snacks. I just check in on what they are up
to and sometimes comment, or re-direct inappropriate activites, but
then am free to go on my merry way. And I am having a hard time with
this at this point. It does not seem right to my schooled brain. We
are homeschooling -- I should be doing more with them! We should be
sitting down together more! I should not have so much freedom! They
should not have so much freedom! They should be doing something
academically constructive! I should schedule them too!

I do have a few things scheduled for them, things that we feel are
necessary to family life. Like a morning job for each, and an
evening job for each. And a family devotional time in the morning,
as well as our family evening routine. It seems to be working out
well, but I am swinging between content and anxious, as you can see.

Maybe this is not exactly a scheduling issue, but a new unschooler
issue? Either way, thanks for listening. It is great to come here.

MZ

[email protected]

In a message dated 9/17/2004 1:35:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
Zietlowfamily@... writes:

Just wondering -- how anyone else goes about managing the household
responsibilities while unschooling? <<<

Doesn't sound anything like our home.

And your scheduling may prove more and more difficult---and backfire---as
the kids get older.

Have you read here? _http://sandradodd.com/chores_
(http://sandradodd.com/chores)

~Kelly


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robyn Coburn

<<<The ideas this family shares in this book make a lot of sense, and I
have decided to implement a schedule for our family, with a few
differences. The authors' family has a set schedule for 6 days of
the week -- for household tasks, meals, business, baths, play time,
school time, hobbies, kids'naps, chores, etc. ALL their time is
scheduled, for each family member, even infants.

Since we are trying the unschooling path, this seemed much too rigid
to follow. No spontaneity! And no freedom for learning!>>>>

No kidding!

Try this: www.sandradodd.com/chores for many stories from Unschooling
households of varying sizes. No $$ to spend either.

<<< So, I
adapted my schedule to include household tasks, business, and an
evening routine, since from dinner time on is usually chaos until my
husband leaves for work at night, and we are never on the same page.
I am tweaking a schedule for shopping, errands, library, etc. All of
this(when followed)is making a positive difference in the state of
our home and bringing peace, and I am excited about it. >>>>

Some people need schedules to help them get organized. A schedule is an
organizational tool. It should never take on a life of its own and supersede
the needs of the family members. If you are excited, great. It may not be a
good way to get to Unschooling to necessarily expect the same enthusiasm
about a schedule from your children.

<<<<I am finding more and more that the girls (3 & 5yo) are just not
needing me as much and there are days when they often play for hours
without asking me for involvement, other than bathroom help, to help
with a conflict, or for snacks. I just check in on what they are up
to and sometimes comment, or re-direct inappropriate activites, but
then am free to go on my merry way. And I am having a hard time with
this at this point. It does not seem right to my schooled brain. We
are homeschooling -- I should be doing more with them! We should be
sitting down together more! I should not have so much freedom! They
should not have so much freedom! They should be doing something
academically constructive! I should schedule them too! >>>>>

It sounds like you could benefit from some de-schooling (as all of us who
were in school once can). These kinds of ideas are residual "schoolthink",
as I guess you have intuited.
www.sandradodd.com/deschooling

In fact check out the whole site about Unschooling. It is a collection of
many people's enjoyable and challenging writings over time, as well as
Sandra's lucid essays and articles. Also check out the archives here, as
this particular issue (household management) is a perennial topic.

<<<I do have a few things scheduled for them, things that we feel are
necessary to family life. Like a morning job for each, and an
evening job for each.>>>>

Jayn (4.5) has no scheduled chores. However she often spontaneously offers
to help, or does something kind and generous for me or dh. Just seconds ago
she brought me a treat from the kitchen as a surprise. One of the more
challenging aspects of Unschooling is the constant examination of one's
assumptions - such as "scheduling chores is necessary to family life" or the
concept of "inappropriate activities" that need re-direction. (What do you
mean by that anyway?)

The true goal of Unschooling is not merely an education for our children. To
paraphrase Joyce: it is to enhance our relationship with our children so
that they can blossom into their authentic best selves (Anne calls the
SHINING). Learning happens (joyfully) along the way because learning is the
natural activity of the human brain.

Welcome to the journey.

Robyn L. Coburn



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Crystal

Melissa, in a routine, you tend to do the same things every day
because it works well for you and your family. A bedtime routine
can be a great thing when you have little ones who can't tell time.
They know what is to follow because it always happens in that
order. A routine is a natural way of doing things. A schedule is a
rigid, outside way of putting rules on yourself (and others).
Getting ready for bed in a certain order is a routine. Going to bed
at a set time is a schedule. Routines are good and helpful and
safe. Schedules are mean and rigid and bad.

***And I am having a hard time with this at this point. It does not
seem right to my schooled brain. We are homeschooling -- I should be
doing more with them! We should be sitting down together more! I
should not have so much freedom!***

If I were you, I would say, "Can I play, too?" and sit down and play
what they are playing. Then, when you have something to do, you can
say, "do you want to do this with me?". I love playing with my
grandson. He is the funnest, and funniest person I know. You
honestly laugh out loud when you talk to him. I love it when he
brings his box of blocks over to me and say in his little, tiny,
tiny Cindy Lou Who voice, "Grammy, do you want to play with my
toys?" . It melts my heart. I missed my own kids play because I
was doing dishes or other important Mommy stuff that only important
Mommy's do.

Crystal

[email protected]

In a message dated 9/17/2004 8:43:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
crystal.pina@... writes:

Routines are good and helpful and
safe. Schedules are mean and rigid and bad.<<<

Routines *can be* good and helpful and safe. Schedules *can be* mean and
rigid and bad. And vice versa.

~Kelly







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

mamaaj2000

--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 9/17/2004 8:43:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> crystal.pina@v... writes:
>
> Routines are good and helpful and
> safe. Schedules are mean and rigid and bad.<<<
>
> Routines *can be* good and helpful and safe. Schedules *can be*
mean and
> rigid and bad. And vice versa.

It helps me to take it a step further and think about having rhythms,
not even routines. The word routine is too school-ish, too structured
for me right now. Rhythm has a good feeling to it without any
baggage. It's just the way things tend to happen; not better or worse
than doing it another way.



--aj

Crystal

> It helps me to take it a step further and think about having
rhythms, not even routines. --aj

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Oooo, I like this way better than how I said it. We have rhythm!

Crystal

[email protected]

I can't cut and paste right now, sorry!

But I want to add to the schedule conversation. Even though everybody might
be on board in a new schedule environment, at some point most everybody will
need to be reminded or possibly even coerced to stay on schedule. That
means, you, mom!!!

My relationship with my kids, a primary focus of unschooling, diminishes if
I have to police them. Besides, it is tiring to keep up with what everyone
is supposed to do! That starts to become the focus.

Not that I don't wish there was a way to have a tidy house and a joyful,
free life....full-time housekeeper, perhaps?? LOL!

Leslie in SC


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

melissazietlow

--- In [email protected], "Robyn Coburn"
<dezigna@c...> wrote:
>>Some people need schedules to help them get organized. A schedule
is an organizational tool. It should never take on a life of its own
and supersede the needs of the family members. If you are excited,
great. It may not be a good way to get to Unschooling to necessarily
expect the same enthusiasm about a schedule from your children.>>

And I am definitely someone is not organized by nature but really
desires organization! What I really liked about the book I read was
that the authors reiterated that the schedule should be a TOOL not a
TASKMASTER. So I have been using my household schedule as a guide
thus far, and not getting to caught up with times. I am allowing
for lots of flexibility, and so far I am still getting much more done
with less stress.

I knew that scheduling the kids would not work for any of us, but the
unschooling fears are still there... I almost immediately saw the
error of my ways, even though my attempt was only for scheduling
focused time together. I see that it is better to just let that
happen naturally, and allow room on the schedule for that.

>>One of the more challenging aspects of Unschooling is the constant
examination of one's assumptions - such as "scheduling chores is
necessary to family life" or the concept of "inappropriate
activities" that need re-direction. (What do you mean by that anyway?)

It is a challenge, and the chore issue is one that we have been re-
examining for awhile. We have loosened our views quite a bit, for
example to make toy clean-up a family responsibility instead of a
requirement for the kids (used to use a timer). We do ask them to be
involoved and help them by handing them things, etc. but are really
trying to keep it positive. The girls put their clothes away after
we had a family meeting and I said that I cannot keep up with putting
the laundry away, and they agreed to help with the situation. I
bought them their own small baskets, and they have been cheerful
about it. We asked them to help with feeding the animals for the same
reason, and they have been helpful in remembering the task, plus they
seem to be bonding more with the animals since. We do feel that the
assigned "jobs" (we don't call them chores) are fine as long as the
kids are in agreement to the responsibility, and we are not tyrants
about it. If the girls forget or resist, we just *do it for them*.
We talk about the fact that we as a family have a responsibilty to
care for what God has given us and help each other in doing so, but
we are by no means legalistic. The "inappropriate activities" would
be things like making a swimming pool for Barbies with real water in
the middle of the living room carpet (re-directed to kitchen floor),
or seeing if the newly caught frog likes living in the toilet (re-
directed to setting up terrarium).

>>It sounds like you could benefit from some de-schooling (as all of
us who were in school once can). These kinds of ideas are
residual "schoolthink", as I guess you have intuited.>>

I consider myself in the process! Thank you. Your posts are really
inspiring, by the way and ones I try to read first, by the way!
MZ

melissazietlow

--- In [email protected], "mamaaj2000"
<mamaaj2000@y...> wrote:
>>It helps me to take it a step further and think about having
rhythms, not even routines. The word routine is too school-ish, too
structured for me right now. Rhythm has a good feeling to it without
any baggage. It's just the way things tend to happen; not better or
worse than doing it another way.>>

I like this concept too, because of the way the word sounds. But I
needed to have some written goals, to visualize and incorporate into
our rhythm.
MZ

[email protected]

In a message dated 9/18/2004 5:29:25 AM Eastern Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

> Routines are good and helpful and
> safe. Schedules are mean and rigid and bad.<<<
>
> Routines *can be* good and helpful and safe. Schedules *can be*
mean and
> rigid and bad. And vice versa.

It helps me to take it a step further and think about having rhythms,
not even routines. The word routine is too school-ish, too structured
for me right now. Rhythm has a good feeling to it without any
baggage. It's just the way things tend to happen; not better or worse
than doing it another way.





*******************
HA! And when I read this I thought of the word "Ritual." I like the idea of
a Bedtime ritual.
Kathryn


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tina

One thing that I do that works for us is to keep a "TO DO" list on
the marker board in my bedroom. I have a large dry erase board
hanging just inside my bedroom door. I keep important things on
there that we need to remember, shows that we don't want to miss,
phone numbers that we need, what we want to accomplish in a day, etc.

Each day, or so, I write what I would like to accomplish. That way
I don't have to think about it or remember it in my head. If I get
it accomplished I cross it off. If not, I keep it there until the
next day. I even keep a small marker board on the kitchen counter
that lets everyone know what's for dinner, and we use it for
important messages.

Adrian, he is 10, has a similar personality to mine. He actually
requested to make a "reminder list" to hang in his bedroom. He has
a kitten and gerbil that he takes care of, so that's on there. He
even likes to be reminded that he needs to take a shower, make his
bed, etc. These are HIS ideas. He's a neat freak and very
organized all on his own. He even likes me to make him a list of
things to do, that he helps to come up with, on the marker board if
I am going to be gone for any length of time. When I know I have to
leave I ask if he wants a list. The choice is his.

I just thought I'd share the idea of list making as compared to
scheduling. There seems to be a lot of freedom in a list.
It's "just" a list after all...

Keep enjoying the journey. It only gets better and better...

Tina

Robyn Coburn

<<<The "inappropriate activities" would
be things like making a swimming pool for Barbies with real water in
the middle of the living room carpet (re-directed to kitchen floor),
or seeing if the newly caught frog likes living in the toilet (re-
directed to setting up terrarium). >>>>

Thanks for clearing up that question, and clarifying what you mean by
"redirection" - LOL. This is another illustration of how describing real
situations is one of the most helpful tools for explaining unschooling
working.

I will just add that while ever there are "assigned jobs", no matter how
cheerfully agreed to, the surprise of the spontaneous and unassigned
assistance is less likely to blossom.

Progress not perfection.

Robyn L. Coburn

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