thoughts and suggestions needed
Sherri-Lee Pressman
Hello list members:-)
I am not sure this is an unschooling issue, but I sure would appreciate some
insight on how unschoolers might deal with this issue. I am at a loss:
So dd (Hannah) is almost 4.5. When she turned 3, she said she was going
start peeing in the toilet, fine, great! No pressure from us, just a
deadline set by her (her birthday) and then it was done. I thought this was
great. So then one day she was in the bathroom and all of a sudden she was
screaming and crying, so I went running and there she was trying to poo in
the toilet, and had put her hand back to help her look at what was going on
and had gotten her hand covered in it. then all over herself. She was very
upset obviously, I was calm and just tried to soothe her and cleaned her up
and reassured her and we moved on. It was never mentioned again. However,
since that day she will absolutely NOT even try to poo in the toilet again.
So here we are at 4.5 and she goes and gets a pull up and asks me to help
her put it on and then I clean it and put on her panties again when she is
done.
For awhile my husband and his sister were trying to be helpful to get her to
go in the toilet, in their own peculiar way and would comment on how stinky
she was with poo in her diaper, my SIL wouldn't help with the diaper is she
was babysitting etc. all very negative, and what resulted from that was
Hannah holding her BM's for days until she was constipated and in pain. I
told both my dh and my SIL that they were to stop and not say another word
again about it, that she would go in the toilet when she was ready just as
she did with pee.
So I am trying to be patient, but man I wouldn't mind if she went in the
toilet. When she comes to me with a pull up I ask her if she would like to
try in the toilet, sometimes (rarely) she says yes and we go but nothing
happens, she just can't seem to figure out the process. Most of the time she
says no. And I just say ok and leave it at that.
These days though what is happening is that she will put on a pull up and
then won't let me change her for hours! So we are living in a house that
smells like poo for a couple of hours a day. Most unpleasant for us all
except her it seems. I try to ask her to stay in her play room and not get
too close because the smell is unpleasant but she doesn't get it and
continues to come to hug me with the dirty diaper on. By the time she agrees
to having it changed (and the only way she agrees is if I just say I am
getting the wash cloth now. if I ask she will always say no) it is dried and
stuck on her bum. Not a fun job.
The other thing is she will often say she needs to go just as we are about
to crawl into bed and then will take anywhere from 30-60 minutes before she
says she is done. Personally I think this time is a time stalling issue
about going to bed. And through talking about it and being open to her
needs, we have lessened the frequency of it.
But I just don't know what to do. I wouldn't mind her continuing to go in a
diaper until she was ready, IF she didn't insist on having her dirty diaper
on for an hour or two after being done. But that is wearing me thin.
So I am trying to be respectful of her wants and needs but I really feel
that it is beyond reasonable to ask my dh and I to have the smell of poo in
our home for this long each day.
ANY thoughts? And sorry for too much info, I have no one else to ask, dh
says just refuse to do diapers any more. and my other family would take a
harsher approach believe me, not having any respect for children.
So thanks again,
Sherri-Lee
Need safe and natural health products?
http://www.aloeessence.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am not sure this is an unschooling issue, but I sure would appreciate some
insight on how unschoolers might deal with this issue. I am at a loss:
So dd (Hannah) is almost 4.5. When she turned 3, she said she was going
start peeing in the toilet, fine, great! No pressure from us, just a
deadline set by her (her birthday) and then it was done. I thought this was
great. So then one day she was in the bathroom and all of a sudden she was
screaming and crying, so I went running and there she was trying to poo in
the toilet, and had put her hand back to help her look at what was going on
and had gotten her hand covered in it. then all over herself. She was very
upset obviously, I was calm and just tried to soothe her and cleaned her up
and reassured her and we moved on. It was never mentioned again. However,
since that day she will absolutely NOT even try to poo in the toilet again.
So here we are at 4.5 and she goes and gets a pull up and asks me to help
her put it on and then I clean it and put on her panties again when she is
done.
For awhile my husband and his sister were trying to be helpful to get her to
go in the toilet, in their own peculiar way and would comment on how stinky
she was with poo in her diaper, my SIL wouldn't help with the diaper is she
was babysitting etc. all very negative, and what resulted from that was
Hannah holding her BM's for days until she was constipated and in pain. I
told both my dh and my SIL that they were to stop and not say another word
again about it, that she would go in the toilet when she was ready just as
she did with pee.
So I am trying to be patient, but man I wouldn't mind if she went in the
toilet. When she comes to me with a pull up I ask her if she would like to
try in the toilet, sometimes (rarely) she says yes and we go but nothing
happens, she just can't seem to figure out the process. Most of the time she
says no. And I just say ok and leave it at that.
These days though what is happening is that she will put on a pull up and
then won't let me change her for hours! So we are living in a house that
smells like poo for a couple of hours a day. Most unpleasant for us all
except her it seems. I try to ask her to stay in her play room and not get
too close because the smell is unpleasant but she doesn't get it and
continues to come to hug me with the dirty diaper on. By the time she agrees
to having it changed (and the only way she agrees is if I just say I am
getting the wash cloth now. if I ask she will always say no) it is dried and
stuck on her bum. Not a fun job.
The other thing is she will often say she needs to go just as we are about
to crawl into bed and then will take anywhere from 30-60 minutes before she
says she is done. Personally I think this time is a time stalling issue
about going to bed. And through talking about it and being open to her
needs, we have lessened the frequency of it.
But I just don't know what to do. I wouldn't mind her continuing to go in a
diaper until she was ready, IF she didn't insist on having her dirty diaper
on for an hour or two after being done. But that is wearing me thin.
So I am trying to be respectful of her wants and needs but I really feel
that it is beyond reasonable to ask my dh and I to have the smell of poo in
our home for this long each day.
ANY thoughts? And sorry for too much info, I have no one else to ask, dh
says just refuse to do diapers any more. and my other family would take a
harsher approach believe me, not having any respect for children.
So thanks again,
Sherri-Lee
Need safe and natural health products?
http://www.aloeessence.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joan Labbe & Salvatore Genovese
Hey, Sherri,
I just wanted to offer some support and a few ideas. I think the way you
have handled things is fabulous. Firstly, it's not that unusual for kids to
fear pooping in the potty. My daughter, who also did the potty thing
entirely on her own timetable, peed forever before pooping too. It sounds
like you have an additional fear cropping up from her experience getting
covered in poop too, and I think you are entirely right not to push her. It
could be too that your asking her every time if she wants to go feels like
pressure to her too (I know it would to my daughter), so you might want to
consider dropping that, since it is my feeling that she'll come to it in her
own time better with less pressure.
My opinion is that your dh's idea of refusing to do diapers would just make
the situation worse - perhaps cause her to start holding her poop again. I
urge you not to do that.
Here are a few ideas - the straightforward approach: Sometime that is in no
way related to going to the bathroom and when everything is calm and going
well, mention that you are wondering if she still feels scared about that
prior potty experience. Ask her if it would help if she had an alternate
way of checking what's going on without having to reach down there. Maybe a
small mirror? I would put on no pressure, just a suggestion and see if she
has any interest in discussing it. If not, I'd drop it.
Another more indirect idea is that my daughter had lots of fears that were
helped (when she was ready of course) by storytelling. Maybe a similar
story would be a story of a little animal (pick your daughter's favorite)
that fell in a mud puddle one day, got covered in mud, and felt scared by
that. It was so helpful to my daughter to have her feelings reflected, so
I'd go heavy on how the little animal felt seeing the mud suddenly all over
him, but not in a scary way of course. Just to reflect her feelings back.
So the animal avoids the mud at all costs (you can maybe come up with some
funny ways the animal avoids the mud - builds bridges etc...) then one day
sees some of her friends playing in the mud, goes over, the friends tell her
about how much fun it is when you do it the way you like, and she decides to
try it when it's not such a surprise and is glad she did.....Or maybe you
can come up with something that represents her dilemna better. If at any
point the story seems distressing to her, I'd stop. I'd take it as an
indication she's not ready to think about this even in the abstract right
now.
I'm not sure about the nighttime thing - is it a "bedtime" issue? It's hard
to say if that's related to her pooping or if she's letting you know she's
not tired and ready to go to bed. Maybe someone else will have a good idea
about that one.
Hang in there. I can tell you that it was to my great surprise that letting
my daughter potty train in her own time did *not* make it the easy
transition I expected. Not only did it take forever for her to decide to
poop in there, once she got past the interesting novelty of peeing in the
potty and wanting to pee in every different one in every different place, it
just became boring and mundane and not worth interrupting anything over. We
went through a period where she didn't want to go back to diapers, but she
didn't want to interrupt anything she was doing to go to the bathroom.
She'd just pee where she was and cheerily help me clean it up. Oh man!
Having an accident was not a natural deterent to her at all. That was quite
a challenge.
Joan
************************
"I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery than
live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it." ... Harry
Emerson Fosdick
-----Original Message-----
From: Sherri-Lee Pressman [mailto:sherri--lee@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 5:26 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Hello list members:-)
I am not sure this is an unschooling issue, but I sure would appreciate some
insight on how unschoolers might deal with this issue. I am at a loss:
I just wanted to offer some support and a few ideas. I think the way you
have handled things is fabulous. Firstly, it's not that unusual for kids to
fear pooping in the potty. My daughter, who also did the potty thing
entirely on her own timetable, peed forever before pooping too. It sounds
like you have an additional fear cropping up from her experience getting
covered in poop too, and I think you are entirely right not to push her. It
could be too that your asking her every time if she wants to go feels like
pressure to her too (I know it would to my daughter), so you might want to
consider dropping that, since it is my feeling that she'll come to it in her
own time better with less pressure.
My opinion is that your dh's idea of refusing to do diapers would just make
the situation worse - perhaps cause her to start holding her poop again. I
urge you not to do that.
Here are a few ideas - the straightforward approach: Sometime that is in no
way related to going to the bathroom and when everything is calm and going
well, mention that you are wondering if she still feels scared about that
prior potty experience. Ask her if it would help if she had an alternate
way of checking what's going on without having to reach down there. Maybe a
small mirror? I would put on no pressure, just a suggestion and see if she
has any interest in discussing it. If not, I'd drop it.
Another more indirect idea is that my daughter had lots of fears that were
helped (when she was ready of course) by storytelling. Maybe a similar
story would be a story of a little animal (pick your daughter's favorite)
that fell in a mud puddle one day, got covered in mud, and felt scared by
that. It was so helpful to my daughter to have her feelings reflected, so
I'd go heavy on how the little animal felt seeing the mud suddenly all over
him, but not in a scary way of course. Just to reflect her feelings back.
So the animal avoids the mud at all costs (you can maybe come up with some
funny ways the animal avoids the mud - builds bridges etc...) then one day
sees some of her friends playing in the mud, goes over, the friends tell her
about how much fun it is when you do it the way you like, and she decides to
try it when it's not such a surprise and is glad she did.....Or maybe you
can come up with something that represents her dilemna better. If at any
point the story seems distressing to her, I'd stop. I'd take it as an
indication she's not ready to think about this even in the abstract right
now.
I'm not sure about the nighttime thing - is it a "bedtime" issue? It's hard
to say if that's related to her pooping or if she's letting you know she's
not tired and ready to go to bed. Maybe someone else will have a good idea
about that one.
Hang in there. I can tell you that it was to my great surprise that letting
my daughter potty train in her own time did *not* make it the easy
transition I expected. Not only did it take forever for her to decide to
poop in there, once she got past the interesting novelty of peeing in the
potty and wanting to pee in every different one in every different place, it
just became boring and mundane and not worth interrupting anything over. We
went through a period where she didn't want to go back to diapers, but she
didn't want to interrupt anything she was doing to go to the bathroom.
She'd just pee where she was and cheerily help me clean it up. Oh man!
Having an accident was not a natural deterent to her at all. That was quite
a challenge.
Joan
************************
"I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery than
live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it." ... Harry
Emerson Fosdick
-----Original Message-----
From: Sherri-Lee Pressman [mailto:sherri--lee@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 5:26 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Hello list members:-)
I am not sure this is an unschooling issue, but I sure would appreciate some
insight on how unschoolers might deal with this issue. I am at a loss:
Sherri-Lee Pressman
HI Joan,
Thank you for your quick reply, some thoughts your comment brought up:
There is NO WAY I would refuse to put a diaper on her on the off chance it
would help. I am completely sure it would not. Today when I was sleeping she
just put on the pull up herself, so that is good too. The problem comes if
we are out and about. Driving in the van, she says she has to go, ok if we
have a pull up with us, then we have to pull over put one on and sit on the
side of the road for 30 mins? 60 mins? Not always possible. Then changing
her is a challenge. She seems to have an affinity to doing it at home, so if
we are out for the day, she mostly doesn't need to until we get home, but it
does sometimes happen still. Very challenging.
I don't ask her every time she has to go if she wants to try in the toilet,
just occasionally. To be honest, I don't even remember all the time. But
when I do, she says no. I say ok and that is it. She doesn't show any
outward sign of distress.
I liked your idea of the story, I have been getting more and more into tell
her a bedtime story that is in fact our day back to her, she really likes
it. I also use story's to tell her more about what it will be like when the
baby comes etc. As I was reading your suggestion, my first thought WOW good
idea, and then as you moved through it I wondered if it might actually
encourage her to put her fingers in it and play with it more. so might have
to modify that a bit. I have a friend who's son smears it everywhere. and
that is something I just don't think I could handle at all. Not to mention
my dh.
I wondered if the night time thing was about her being not tired. One night
I told her the TV was going to go off whether she poo'd or not. she didn't
poo and had no resistance. Another night I told her she could watch the
shows we had agreed on whether she poo'd or not and she didn't poo and
watched her shows. I have struggled with the night time thing for sure. This
is not something we can let go of yet. She will sit up all night watching TV
no matter how tired she is and we have a cascade of issues that comes from
that. What I noticed though is if I stick to and the TV goes off. she is
asleep within 5 minutes. So she is tired if she can fall asleep that easily.
She never is awake for long after we turn off the light and snuggle down.
When you say it took a long time with your daughter. how old was she when
started going in the toilet?
We have only had a couple of time when she didn't want to stop what she was
doing to go pee in the toilet, her 4th birthday party being one of them. She
is now getting frustrated with wearing a diaper at night so I am back to
changing her in the middle of the night after a year or more not having to
do that, but it irritates her so I do it. That will be fun with the new babe
in the fall. I have told her when she wakes up with a dry diaper for more
mornings than not then she can sleep without one. And he diaper is mostly
soaked in the morning so we are a ways from that too. which is ok with me.
Thanks for your thoughts, I appreciate it, good to hear someone else is/was
in the same boat if nothing else.
Sherri-lee
_____
From: Joan Labbe & Salvatore Genovese [mailto:salgenovese@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 4:15 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Hey, Sherri,
I just wanted to offer some support and a few ideas. I think the way you
have handled things is fabulous. Firstly, it's not that unusual for kids to
fear pooping in the potty. My daughter, who also did the potty thing
entirely on her own timetable, peed forever before pooping too. It sounds
like you have an additional fear cropping up from her experience getting
covered in poop too, and I think you are entirely right not to push her. It
could be too that your asking her every time if she wants to go feels like
pressure to her too (I know it would to my daughter), so you might want to
consider dropping that, since it is my feeling that she'll come to it in her
own time better with less pressure.
My opinion is that your dh's idea of refusing to do diapers would just make
the situation worse - perhaps cause her to start holding her poop again. I
urge you not to do that.
Here are a few ideas - the straightforward approach: Sometime that is in no
way related to going to the bathroom and when everything is calm and going
well, mention that you are wondering if she still feels scared about that
prior potty experience. Ask her if it would help if she had an alternate
way of checking what's going on without having to reach down there. Maybe a
small mirror? I would put on no pressure, just a suggestion and see if she
has any interest in discussing it. If not, I'd drop it.
Another more indirect idea is that my daughter had lots of fears that were
helped (when she was ready of course) by storytelling. Maybe a similar
story would be a story of a little animal (pick your daughter's favorite)
that fell in a mud puddle one day, got covered in mud, and felt scared by
that. It was so helpful to my daughter to have her feelings reflected, so
I'd go heavy on how the little animal felt seeing the mud suddenly all over
him, but not in a scary way of course. Just to reflect her feelings back.
So the animal avoids the mud at all costs (you can maybe come up with some
funny ways the animal avoids the mud - builds bridges etc...) then one day
sees some of her friends playing in the mud, goes over, the friends tell her
about how much fun it is when you do it the way you like, and she decides to
try it when it's not such a surprise and is glad she did.....Or maybe you
can come up with something that represents her dilemna better. If at any
point the story seems distressing to her, I'd stop. I'd take it as an
indication she's not ready to think about this even in the abstract right
now.
I'm not sure about the nighttime thing - is it a "bedtime" issue? It's hard
to say if that's related to her pooping or if she's letting you know she's
not tired and ready to go to bed. Maybe someone else will have a good idea
about that one.
Hang in there. I can tell you that it was to my great surprise that letting
my daughter potty train in her own time did *not* make it the easy
transition I expected. Not only did it take forever for her to decide to
poop in there, once she got past the interesting novelty of peeing in the
potty and wanting to pee in every different one in every different place, it
just became boring and mundane and not worth interrupting anything over. We
went through a period where she didn't want to go back to diapers, but she
didn't want to interrupt anything she was doing to go to the bathroom.
She'd just pee where she was and cheerily help me clean it up. Oh man!
Having an accident was not a natural deterent to her at all. That was quite
a challenge.
Joan
************************
"I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery than
live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it." ... Harry
Emerson Fosdick
-----Original Message-----
From: Sherri-Lee Pressman [mailto:sherri--lee@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 5:26 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Hello list members:-)
I am not sure this is an unschooling issue, but I sure would appreciate some
insight on how unschoolers might deal with this issue. I am at a loss:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Thank you for your quick reply, some thoughts your comment brought up:
There is NO WAY I would refuse to put a diaper on her on the off chance it
would help. I am completely sure it would not. Today when I was sleeping she
just put on the pull up herself, so that is good too. The problem comes if
we are out and about. Driving in the van, she says she has to go, ok if we
have a pull up with us, then we have to pull over put one on and sit on the
side of the road for 30 mins? 60 mins? Not always possible. Then changing
her is a challenge. She seems to have an affinity to doing it at home, so if
we are out for the day, she mostly doesn't need to until we get home, but it
does sometimes happen still. Very challenging.
I don't ask her every time she has to go if she wants to try in the toilet,
just occasionally. To be honest, I don't even remember all the time. But
when I do, she says no. I say ok and that is it. She doesn't show any
outward sign of distress.
I liked your idea of the story, I have been getting more and more into tell
her a bedtime story that is in fact our day back to her, she really likes
it. I also use story's to tell her more about what it will be like when the
baby comes etc. As I was reading your suggestion, my first thought WOW good
idea, and then as you moved through it I wondered if it might actually
encourage her to put her fingers in it and play with it more. so might have
to modify that a bit. I have a friend who's son smears it everywhere. and
that is something I just don't think I could handle at all. Not to mention
my dh.
I wondered if the night time thing was about her being not tired. One night
I told her the TV was going to go off whether she poo'd or not. she didn't
poo and had no resistance. Another night I told her she could watch the
shows we had agreed on whether she poo'd or not and she didn't poo and
watched her shows. I have struggled with the night time thing for sure. This
is not something we can let go of yet. She will sit up all night watching TV
no matter how tired she is and we have a cascade of issues that comes from
that. What I noticed though is if I stick to and the TV goes off. she is
asleep within 5 minutes. So she is tired if she can fall asleep that easily.
She never is awake for long after we turn off the light and snuggle down.
When you say it took a long time with your daughter. how old was she when
started going in the toilet?
We have only had a couple of time when she didn't want to stop what she was
doing to go pee in the toilet, her 4th birthday party being one of them. She
is now getting frustrated with wearing a diaper at night so I am back to
changing her in the middle of the night after a year or more not having to
do that, but it irritates her so I do it. That will be fun with the new babe
in the fall. I have told her when she wakes up with a dry diaper for more
mornings than not then she can sleep without one. And he diaper is mostly
soaked in the morning so we are a ways from that too. which is ok with me.
Thanks for your thoughts, I appreciate it, good to hear someone else is/was
in the same boat if nothing else.
Sherri-lee
_____
From: Joan Labbe & Salvatore Genovese [mailto:salgenovese@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 4:15 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Hey, Sherri,
I just wanted to offer some support and a few ideas. I think the way you
have handled things is fabulous. Firstly, it's not that unusual for kids to
fear pooping in the potty. My daughter, who also did the potty thing
entirely on her own timetable, peed forever before pooping too. It sounds
like you have an additional fear cropping up from her experience getting
covered in poop too, and I think you are entirely right not to push her. It
could be too that your asking her every time if she wants to go feels like
pressure to her too (I know it would to my daughter), so you might want to
consider dropping that, since it is my feeling that she'll come to it in her
own time better with less pressure.
My opinion is that your dh's idea of refusing to do diapers would just make
the situation worse - perhaps cause her to start holding her poop again. I
urge you not to do that.
Here are a few ideas - the straightforward approach: Sometime that is in no
way related to going to the bathroom and when everything is calm and going
well, mention that you are wondering if she still feels scared about that
prior potty experience. Ask her if it would help if she had an alternate
way of checking what's going on without having to reach down there. Maybe a
small mirror? I would put on no pressure, just a suggestion and see if she
has any interest in discussing it. If not, I'd drop it.
Another more indirect idea is that my daughter had lots of fears that were
helped (when she was ready of course) by storytelling. Maybe a similar
story would be a story of a little animal (pick your daughter's favorite)
that fell in a mud puddle one day, got covered in mud, and felt scared by
that. It was so helpful to my daughter to have her feelings reflected, so
I'd go heavy on how the little animal felt seeing the mud suddenly all over
him, but not in a scary way of course. Just to reflect her feelings back.
So the animal avoids the mud at all costs (you can maybe come up with some
funny ways the animal avoids the mud - builds bridges etc...) then one day
sees some of her friends playing in the mud, goes over, the friends tell her
about how much fun it is when you do it the way you like, and she decides to
try it when it's not such a surprise and is glad she did.....Or maybe you
can come up with something that represents her dilemna better. If at any
point the story seems distressing to her, I'd stop. I'd take it as an
indication she's not ready to think about this even in the abstract right
now.
I'm not sure about the nighttime thing - is it a "bedtime" issue? It's hard
to say if that's related to her pooping or if she's letting you know she's
not tired and ready to go to bed. Maybe someone else will have a good idea
about that one.
Hang in there. I can tell you that it was to my great surprise that letting
my daughter potty train in her own time did *not* make it the easy
transition I expected. Not only did it take forever for her to decide to
poop in there, once she got past the interesting novelty of peeing in the
potty and wanting to pee in every different one in every different place, it
just became boring and mundane and not worth interrupting anything over. We
went through a period where she didn't want to go back to diapers, but she
didn't want to interrupt anything she was doing to go to the bathroom.
She'd just pee where she was and cheerily help me clean it up. Oh man!
Having an accident was not a natural deterent to her at all. That was quite
a challenge.
Joan
************************
"I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery than
live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it." ... Harry
Emerson Fosdick
-----Original Message-----
From: Sherri-Lee Pressman [mailto:sherri--lee@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 5:26 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Hello list members:-)
I am not sure this is an unschooling issue, but I sure would appreciate some
insight on how unschoolers might deal with this issue. I am at a loss:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
Sherri-Lee,
I know it is popular to not push children (I did not push mine). My cousin
had this problem with her son. He would not have a bm unless it was in a pull
up. He was almost 5 when they were at her mothers one day and she did not
have one with her. He asked for one and she told him she did not have one and
did he want to try the potty. He was not happy and told her to go buy some.
She tried to explain the store was closed and she was unable. He was furious -
of course - and very cranky - understandable. He did finally go and had a bm
in the potty. After that she did not buy anymore and he was fine. He only
went in the potty when he had no choice.
I know you said your daughter did hold it in and get constipated so this may
not work for you. Good luck.
Lynn
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I know it is popular to not push children (I did not push mine). My cousin
had this problem with her son. He would not have a bm unless it was in a pull
up. He was almost 5 when they were at her mothers one day and she did not
have one with her. He asked for one and she told him she did not have one and
did he want to try the potty. He was not happy and told her to go buy some.
She tried to explain the store was closed and she was unable. He was furious -
of course - and very cranky - understandable. He did finally go and had a bm
in the potty. After that she did not buy anymore and he was fine. He only
went in the potty when he had no choice.
I know you said your daughter did hold it in and get constipated so this may
not work for you. Good luck.
Lynn
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sherri-Lee Pressman
Hi Lynn,
I have thought of this in the past and to be honest, that is one reason why
I haven't made a big effort anymore to worry about carrying a diaper in the
car anymore either. Figured the day would come when we were out and that
would be that and she would just do it.
The other day we were driving home and she said she had to go, I didn't have
one, I said I could stop and she could go in a toilet or wait. She opted to
wait. So when we got home she went in a pull up. And that was that.
Thanks for your thoughts,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: Fiskecnn@... [mailto:Fiskecnn@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 4:57 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Sherri-Lee,
I know it is popular to not push children (I did not push mine). My cousin
had this problem with her son. He would not have a bm unless it was in a
pull
up. He was almost 5 when they were at her mothers one day and she did not
have one with her. He asked for one and she told him she did not have one
and
did he want to try the potty. He was not happy and told her to go buy some.
She tried to explain the store was closed and she was unable. He was
furious -
of course - and very cranky - understandable. He did finally go and had a
bm
in the potty. After that she did not buy anymore and he was fine. He only
went in the potty when he had no choice.
I know you said your daughter did hold it in and get constipated so this may
not work for you. Good luck.
Lynn
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I have thought of this in the past and to be honest, that is one reason why
I haven't made a big effort anymore to worry about carrying a diaper in the
car anymore either. Figured the day would come when we were out and that
would be that and she would just do it.
The other day we were driving home and she said she had to go, I didn't have
one, I said I could stop and she could go in a toilet or wait. She opted to
wait. So when we got home she went in a pull up. And that was that.
Thanks for your thoughts,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: Fiskecnn@... [mailto:Fiskecnn@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 4:57 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Sherri-Lee,
I know it is popular to not push children (I did not push mine). My cousin
had this problem with her son. He would not have a bm unless it was in a
pull
up. He was almost 5 when they were at her mothers one day and she did not
have one with her. He asked for one and she told him she did not have one
and
did he want to try the potty. He was not happy and told her to go buy some.
She tried to explain the store was closed and she was unable. He was
furious -
of course - and very cranky - understandable. He did finally go and had a
bm
in the potty. After that she did not buy anymore and he was fine. He only
went in the potty when he had no choice.
I know you said your daughter did hold it in and get constipated so this may
not work for you. Good luck.
Lynn
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
heather mclean
Sherri-Lee,
Maybe she'd like the book "Everyone Poops" (My Body
Science) by Taro Gomi.
My son was in a similar situation. He was 4.5. I
can't remember exactly what happened, but we had tried
without diapers & he wouldn't poop in the toilet &
would hold it in & get constipated. It was awful. So
we went back to pull-ups with no problems. But, he
was attending a part-time mothers day out at the time
& they said NO MORE diapters. It was winter break &
they said he couldn't come back after the break UNLESS
he was using the toilet only. So we told our ds that.
We didn't pressure him (that I'm aware of). It was
ok with us if he didn't go back. But HE wanted to go
back, because his best friend, Kyle, went. And by the
time winter break was over, he no longer used
pull-ups.
heather m
Maybe she'd like the book "Everyone Poops" (My Body
Science) by Taro Gomi.
My son was in a similar situation. He was 4.5. I
can't remember exactly what happened, but we had tried
without diapers & he wouldn't poop in the toilet &
would hold it in & get constipated. It was awful. So
we went back to pull-ups with no problems. But, he
was attending a part-time mothers day out at the time
& they said NO MORE diapters. It was winter break &
they said he couldn't come back after the break UNLESS
he was using the toilet only. So we told our ds that.
We didn't pressure him (that I'm aware of). It was
ok with us if he didn't go back. But HE wanted to go
back, because his best friend, Kyle, went. And by the
time winter break was over, he no longer used
pull-ups.
heather m
Joan Labbe & Salvatore Genovese
"Driving in the van, she says she has to go, ok if we have a pull up with
us, then we have to pull over put one on and sit on the side of the road for
30 mins? 60 mins? Not always possible."
Can you use pullups for times she has to go on the road and it's not
possible to pull over and wait? Carry them with you and if you get in that
situation, explain and pull one out? Or talk and agree that after a certain
period of time on the potty (like 15 min) on the road, she goes to a pullup
if she's still not done?
"Then changing her is a challenge. She seems to have an affinity to doing it
at home, so if
we are out for the day, she mostly doesn't need to until we get home, but it
does sometimes happen still. Very challenging."
That is a challenge. I have diaper changing challenges on a daily basis
with my 3 1/2 yr old son. The pee pee stuff I let go until the point of
diaper disintigration usually - I do find it's easier to do it when he's
distracted, like watching a video. With the poops, I explain that it's
important to get them changed in a timely way because it can give him diaper
rash - make his bum read and ouchie - if we don't and also because if he's
got poop and pee in there together and the diaper disintigrates it's a
health issue for all of us. Sometimes if he's really having trouble and my
dh is around my son agrees to have dh change him while he is nursing with
me. Sometimes just doing it in a new place in the house seems exciting
enough to get him to do it. I haven't had the problem with being out, but
perhaps if you explained that if it's poop it's important enough to
interrupt her good time to go home to change it - would that give her
incentive? Or do you think there's fear involved?
"I liked your idea of the story, I have been getting more and more into tell
her a bedtime story that is in fact our day back to her, she really likes
it. I also use story's to tell her more about what it will be like when the
baby comes etc. As I was reading your suggestion, my first thought WOW good
idea, and then as you moved through it I wondered if it might actually
encourage her to put her fingers in it and play with it more. so might have
to modify that a bit. I have a friend who's son smears it everywhere. and
that is something I just don't think I could handle at all. Not to mention
my dh."
Right, good point. I guess you need something that's fun if under control
but not so fun if it's not. How about the water hose? Not so fun if you
get sprayed inadvertantly and soaked (which had made my son cry), but fun to
play with once you get it under control with practice?
"When you say it took a long time with your daughter. how old was she when
started going in the toilet?"
This is not a one word, one sentence or even one short paragraph answer. It
sent me back through the journal I keep for my daughter to check cause I
honestly can't remember all the ups and downs! It was far from a linear
experience, that's for sure. I want to first share the following entry with
you since it's pretty funny. When my dd was 2.10 I wrote "I think you may
never potty train. You think being able to pee and poop while you play is
so great that you tell me to get mommy sized diapers so I don't have to stop
playing either to perform these bodily functions. You can't imagine why
everyone wouldn't want to use diapers - it's so convenient. This morning
you realized you couldn't sit to play with your airplane set and poop at the
same time so you said "Momma, we need a table for my airplane set so I can
poop and play at the same time!"
Then she peed in the potty for the first time two weeks after I wrote this.
Go figure. Then she lost interest for 7 months. She decided she was "tired
of wearing diapers" (for peeing) one day when she was 3.5. Only problem was
she got really attached to that one pair of underwear she started out in and
wouldn't wear any of the other pairs, not even for me to wash the one she
loved. She first pooped in a toilet 6 months later when she was 3.11. It
was not at our house and she talked about it in the third person (which is
how she used to handle difficult emotions of hers). I wrote in her journal
that she declared she pooped "because there are no diapers here Mama so Suji
(her name for herself at that time after a cat we had who died when she was
2) just pooped." But two months later at 4.1 she was back in diapers for
pooping because the whole potty thing had lost it's appeal and she was
peeing in her underwear, happily changing it, and asking for a diaper only
when she needed to poop.
I've searched my journal for a time when I wrote we crossed the bridge into
peeing and pooping in the potty regularly and I can't find it. Probably
cause it didn't happen one day all of a sudden. My memory is that this was
something that happened gradually over a period of time - probably between
4.5 and 5 yrs old. Can't be much after 5 since she'd 5.9 and I can't
remember the "old days" anymore. So all in all, from her first peeing till
she was peeing and pooping without much incident, we're talking two years
(2.10 to probably about 4.10).
It was so challenging and I didn't always find "the answer", but I'm so glad
I honored her need for her own timetable enough that she was able to find
her way.
Joan
us, then we have to pull over put one on and sit on the side of the road for
30 mins? 60 mins? Not always possible."
Can you use pullups for times she has to go on the road and it's not
possible to pull over and wait? Carry them with you and if you get in that
situation, explain and pull one out? Or talk and agree that after a certain
period of time on the potty (like 15 min) on the road, she goes to a pullup
if she's still not done?
"Then changing her is a challenge. She seems to have an affinity to doing it
at home, so if
we are out for the day, she mostly doesn't need to until we get home, but it
does sometimes happen still. Very challenging."
That is a challenge. I have diaper changing challenges on a daily basis
with my 3 1/2 yr old son. The pee pee stuff I let go until the point of
diaper disintigration usually - I do find it's easier to do it when he's
distracted, like watching a video. With the poops, I explain that it's
important to get them changed in a timely way because it can give him diaper
rash - make his bum read and ouchie - if we don't and also because if he's
got poop and pee in there together and the diaper disintigrates it's a
health issue for all of us. Sometimes if he's really having trouble and my
dh is around my son agrees to have dh change him while he is nursing with
me. Sometimes just doing it in a new place in the house seems exciting
enough to get him to do it. I haven't had the problem with being out, but
perhaps if you explained that if it's poop it's important enough to
interrupt her good time to go home to change it - would that give her
incentive? Or do you think there's fear involved?
"I liked your idea of the story, I have been getting more and more into tell
her a bedtime story that is in fact our day back to her, she really likes
it. I also use story's to tell her more about what it will be like when the
baby comes etc. As I was reading your suggestion, my first thought WOW good
idea, and then as you moved through it I wondered if it might actually
encourage her to put her fingers in it and play with it more. so might have
to modify that a bit. I have a friend who's son smears it everywhere. and
that is something I just don't think I could handle at all. Not to mention
my dh."
Right, good point. I guess you need something that's fun if under control
but not so fun if it's not. How about the water hose? Not so fun if you
get sprayed inadvertantly and soaked (which had made my son cry), but fun to
play with once you get it under control with practice?
"When you say it took a long time with your daughter. how old was she when
started going in the toilet?"
This is not a one word, one sentence or even one short paragraph answer. It
sent me back through the journal I keep for my daughter to check cause I
honestly can't remember all the ups and downs! It was far from a linear
experience, that's for sure. I want to first share the following entry with
you since it's pretty funny. When my dd was 2.10 I wrote "I think you may
never potty train. You think being able to pee and poop while you play is
so great that you tell me to get mommy sized diapers so I don't have to stop
playing either to perform these bodily functions. You can't imagine why
everyone wouldn't want to use diapers - it's so convenient. This morning
you realized you couldn't sit to play with your airplane set and poop at the
same time so you said "Momma, we need a table for my airplane set so I can
poop and play at the same time!"
Then she peed in the potty for the first time two weeks after I wrote this.
Go figure. Then she lost interest for 7 months. She decided she was "tired
of wearing diapers" (for peeing) one day when she was 3.5. Only problem was
she got really attached to that one pair of underwear she started out in and
wouldn't wear any of the other pairs, not even for me to wash the one she
loved. She first pooped in a toilet 6 months later when she was 3.11. It
was not at our house and she talked about it in the third person (which is
how she used to handle difficult emotions of hers). I wrote in her journal
that she declared she pooped "because there are no diapers here Mama so Suji
(her name for herself at that time after a cat we had who died when she was
2) just pooped." But two months later at 4.1 she was back in diapers for
pooping because the whole potty thing had lost it's appeal and she was
peeing in her underwear, happily changing it, and asking for a diaper only
when she needed to poop.
I've searched my journal for a time when I wrote we crossed the bridge into
peeing and pooping in the potty regularly and I can't find it. Probably
cause it didn't happen one day all of a sudden. My memory is that this was
something that happened gradually over a period of time - probably between
4.5 and 5 yrs old. Can't be much after 5 since she'd 5.9 and I can't
remember the "old days" anymore. So all in all, from her first peeing till
she was peeing and pooping without much incident, we're talking two years
(2.10 to probably about 4.10).
It was so challenging and I didn't always find "the answer", but I'm so glad
I honored her need for her own timetable enough that she was able to find
her way.
Joan
Sherri-Lee Pressman
Hi Heather,
I will have a look at that book, thank you. Someone, mentioned a book called
"Hannah's Potty" which would be cool cause her name is Hannah but I can't
find it.
We don't do any sort of care, but I know if she wanted to go she would have
to be out of diapers. I would use that but I wouldn't want her to go to the
care place even after she mastered this.
Thanks for the ideas,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: heather mclean [mailto:heather@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 5:25 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Sherri-Lee,
Maybe she'd like the book "Everyone Poops" (My Body
Science) by Taro Gomi.
My son was in a similar situation. He was 4.5. I
can't remember exactly what happened, but we had tried
without diapers & he wouldn't poop in the toilet &
would hold it in & get constipated. It was awful. So
we went back to pull-ups with no problems. But, he
was attending a part-time mothers day out at the time
& they said NO MORE diapters. It was winter break &
they said he couldn't come back after the break UNLESS
he was using the toilet only. So we told our ds that.
We didn't pressure him (that I'm aware of). It was
ok with us if he didn't go back. But HE wanted to go
back, because his best friend, Kyle, went. And by the
time winter break was over, he no longer used
pull-ups.
heather m
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I will have a look at that book, thank you. Someone, mentioned a book called
"Hannah's Potty" which would be cool cause her name is Hannah but I can't
find it.
We don't do any sort of care, but I know if she wanted to go she would have
to be out of diapers. I would use that but I wouldn't want her to go to the
care place even after she mastered this.
Thanks for the ideas,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: heather mclean [mailto:heather@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 5:25 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
Sherri-Lee,
Maybe she'd like the book "Everyone Poops" (My Body
Science) by Taro Gomi.
My son was in a similar situation. He was 4.5. I
can't remember exactly what happened, but we had tried
without diapers & he wouldn't poop in the toilet &
would hold it in & get constipated. It was awful. So
we went back to pull-ups with no problems. But, he
was attending a part-time mothers day out at the time
& they said NO MORE diapters. It was winter break &
they said he couldn't come back after the break UNLESS
he was using the toilet only. So we told our ds that.
We didn't pressure him (that I'm aware of). It was
ok with us if he didn't go back. But HE wanted to go
back, because his best friend, Kyle, went. And by the
time winter break was over, he no longer used
pull-ups.
heather m
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
catherine aceto
FWIW, the key for my daughter seemed to be me telling her that she could try the potty but she didn't have to keep using the potty if she didn't want to. She could try it and change her mind and go back to diapers (she was between 3 and 3.5 at the time). She generally resists change and I wondered if the change seemed to be too large and permanent to her. She had a bowel movement in the potty, and never went back to diapers.
-Cat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-Cat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sherri-Lee Pressman
HI Cat,
This might be it. She seems resistant to change sometimes. I know I have
always told her when I asked her if she wanted to try going in the toilet,
that she could just try and if nothing happened, she could still use her
pull up. She goes sits on the toilet. sort of pretends to grunt:-) and then
says nope and put on the pull up.
Thanks for the thoughts,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: catherine aceto [mailto:aceto3@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 9:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
FWIW, the key for my daughter seemed to be me telling her that she could try
the potty but she didn't have to keep using the potty if she didn't want to.
She could try it and change her mind and go back to diapers (she was between
3 and 3.5 at the time). She generally resists change and I wondered if the
change seemed to be too large and permanent to her. She had a bowel
movement in the potty, and never went back to diapers.
-Cat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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This might be it. She seems resistant to change sometimes. I know I have
always told her when I asked her if she wanted to try going in the toilet,
that she could just try and if nothing happened, she could still use her
pull up. She goes sits on the toilet. sort of pretends to grunt:-) and then
says nope and put on the pull up.
Thanks for the thoughts,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: catherine aceto [mailto:aceto3@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 9:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] thoughts and suggestions needed
FWIW, the key for my daughter seemed to be me telling her that she could try
the potty but she didn't have to keep using the potty if she didn't want to.
She could try it and change her mind and go back to diapers (she was between
3 and 3.5 at the time). She generally resists change and I wondered if the
change seemed to be too large and permanent to her. She had a bowel
movement in the potty, and never went back to diapers.
-Cat
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Deb Lewis
***So I am trying to be respectful of her wants and needs but I really
feel
that it is beyond reasonable to ask my dh and I to have the smell of poo
in
our home for this long each day. ***
I haven't read all my mail so if I'm repeating ideas, I'm sorry.
Have you tried a little potty in whatever room she's playing in? Have
you tried staying right with her and keeping her occupied or setting up a
little tray with toys? Could you tuck a pull up into a little potty and
see if she'd go that way?
We declared some song the official potty song and I say, importantly, "we
must have potty music!" and I put that song on and we'd play it over a
few times. <g> Silly.
We'd go potty together. I'd guesstimate the potty ETA and say "I'm going
potty now, do you want to?" We made a point of announcing when we were
going or when we had gone. (man, it's a good thing married people really
like each other. <g>) We made a point of noticing when the cats were
using the potty. etc.
We did lots of talking about poop, we said goodbye and waved goodbye when
he did go on the potty. We told lots of people about poop. Poop became
an interesting subject at home and in the stores. <g> We didn't have
books about poop or pooping but we made up for that by being poop
oriented. We tried to create a poop friendly atmosphere. (without the
flies) The more she thinks about pooping being just part of what
everyone does the more she'll get used to the idea.
Waiting on the side of the road while they go is pretty normal even
without pull ups. We carried our little potty everywhere and if we had
to stop, we stopped. A pick up with a canopy is great for potty stops.
I'm sorry your getting grief from the people who should be helping to
keep things fun and comfortable, that makes it harder on you. But
she'll get there.
Deb
feel
that it is beyond reasonable to ask my dh and I to have the smell of poo
in
our home for this long each day. ***
I haven't read all my mail so if I'm repeating ideas, I'm sorry.
Have you tried a little potty in whatever room she's playing in? Have
you tried staying right with her and keeping her occupied or setting up a
little tray with toys? Could you tuck a pull up into a little potty and
see if she'd go that way?
We declared some song the official potty song and I say, importantly, "we
must have potty music!" and I put that song on and we'd play it over a
few times. <g> Silly.
We'd go potty together. I'd guesstimate the potty ETA and say "I'm going
potty now, do you want to?" We made a point of announcing when we were
going or when we had gone. (man, it's a good thing married people really
like each other. <g>) We made a point of noticing when the cats were
using the potty. etc.
We did lots of talking about poop, we said goodbye and waved goodbye when
he did go on the potty. We told lots of people about poop. Poop became
an interesting subject at home and in the stores. <g> We didn't have
books about poop or pooping but we made up for that by being poop
oriented. We tried to create a poop friendly atmosphere. (without the
flies) The more she thinks about pooping being just part of what
everyone does the more she'll get used to the idea.
Waiting on the side of the road while they go is pretty normal even
without pull ups. We carried our little potty everywhere and if we had
to stop, we stopped. A pick up with a canopy is great for potty stops.
I'm sorry your getting grief from the people who should be helping to
keep things fun and comfortable, that makes it harder on you. But
she'll get there.
Deb
Carrol
> Have you tried a little potty in whatever room she's playing in?Have
> you tried staying right with her and keeping her occupied orsetting up a
> little tray with toys? We'd go potty together.We do this and it really helps. Sometimes dd sits and plays for 20
minutes but then she poops.
Could you tuck a pull up into a little potty and
> see if she'd go that way?This is a great idea! This is what we do in veterinary medicine when
>
we are tackling feline elimination problems - we use the preferred
substrate inside the box! I would seriously give this a try!
A few other thoughts if you think she is still afraind of getting
dirty or scared of germs.
1-give her gloves to wear.
2-Place a loud bell that she can ring in case you're not there so you
can come running to help.
3-discuss good hand washing technique. Give her a special soap or
saop dispenser and a very soft nail brush. Make sure she can
comfortably reach the sink. You could let her paint her own wooeden
step or put stickers on a plastic one. Give her special hand towels.
Just as important, let her know that a minimum amount of time is
sufficient or she may become compulsive and end up with dry, cracked
hands. A good tip is to sig the birthday song once or twice - or make
up your own short song.
4-place diaper wipes in the bathroom for BM's. Maybe she equates them
with getting her cleaner.
My nephew made a choice in the store when her wanted a toy. My SIL
said she had enough money for only the toy or the pull-ups, not both.
She left the decision up to him but he explained that if he chose the
toy, he would have to use the potty until the next week when they had
more money for pull-ups. Then he could switch back if he wanted. He
thought about it for a bit and then chose the toy and never went back
to pull-ups.
Good luck,
Robin
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/8/2004 4:34:15 PM Central Standard Time,
sherri--lee@... writes:
But I just don't know what to do. I wouldn't mind her continuing to go in a
diaper until she was ready, IF she didn't insist on having her dirty diaper
on for an hour or two after being done. But that is wearing me thin
~~~
As I read your post I knew you were going to get to the holding the BM's
part. I could see it coming. That can be really serious and it's good that
she'll use the pull-up instead of that.
I wonder, if she is usually standing when she uses the pull-up? Maybe
that's why she can't seem to "understand the process" when she sits. I'm thinking
it might be worth a try to let her stand on the seat until she has success.
I wouldn't rush this idea, though. I'd observe for several days and see if
she is standing during the actual act, and then in a happy way at a relaxed
time, maybe even while she's doing it, suggest she could stand up on the
toilet, instead.
And what about a potty chair? No water in it, just an empty pot that's
available when she needs it.
And what about a special event coming up where she would be required to (not
by you, but by the circumstances of the event) be able to use the potty?
Vacation bible school, or a Little Farmers class at the zoo or something that
would really interest her? I'd make it months away, and I wouldn't bring up
the potty issue right away. I might mention that the kids there won't be able
to use pull-ups, and express confidence that she won't be using pull-ups for
the rest of her life.
That brings up an important thing, too. It's already obvious she's
motivated by being older--her 3rd birthday goal, for instance. I would really try to
create a vision for her older years and share it with her. Kids love to
hear about themselves. Have a little conversation when you each share what her
future will be like. You have to put it in perspective for a 4 yo...start
with what it's like to be 5, about losing teeth and things like that. Riding
big bikes, or going down the water slide by herself when she's 7 or whatever.
How some day some of the things she likes to play with now will not be so
much fun, but will be replaced with something else new and different. It
really helps if she has older siblings or close cousins who demonstrate these new
and different things for her. It's important to help her see this is a
problem for not just her, and then enlist her help. Don't see her as adversary in
this issue, but foster the idea that you're partners who help each other.
It would help YOU to remember that she won't always be wearing pull-ups,
too. I personally would put the clean-up part under health and safety, and
coerce her into letting me clean her up. I wouldn't wrestle her to the ground or
anything, but I would make fun things a little difficult until I could get
her to submit. Maybe save her bath until after her daily pull-up, and make
bath time really fun?
It won't last forever. A useful mantra for much of parenting. ;)
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sherri--lee@... writes:
But I just don't know what to do. I wouldn't mind her continuing to go in a
diaper until she was ready, IF she didn't insist on having her dirty diaper
on for an hour or two after being done. But that is wearing me thin
~~~
As I read your post I knew you were going to get to the holding the BM's
part. I could see it coming. That can be really serious and it's good that
she'll use the pull-up instead of that.
I wonder, if she is usually standing when she uses the pull-up? Maybe
that's why she can't seem to "understand the process" when she sits. I'm thinking
it might be worth a try to let her stand on the seat until she has success.
I wouldn't rush this idea, though. I'd observe for several days and see if
she is standing during the actual act, and then in a happy way at a relaxed
time, maybe even while she's doing it, suggest she could stand up on the
toilet, instead.
And what about a potty chair? No water in it, just an empty pot that's
available when she needs it.
And what about a special event coming up where she would be required to (not
by you, but by the circumstances of the event) be able to use the potty?
Vacation bible school, or a Little Farmers class at the zoo or something that
would really interest her? I'd make it months away, and I wouldn't bring up
the potty issue right away. I might mention that the kids there won't be able
to use pull-ups, and express confidence that she won't be using pull-ups for
the rest of her life.
That brings up an important thing, too. It's already obvious she's
motivated by being older--her 3rd birthday goal, for instance. I would really try to
create a vision for her older years and share it with her. Kids love to
hear about themselves. Have a little conversation when you each share what her
future will be like. You have to put it in perspective for a 4 yo...start
with what it's like to be 5, about losing teeth and things like that. Riding
big bikes, or going down the water slide by herself when she's 7 or whatever.
How some day some of the things she likes to play with now will not be so
much fun, but will be replaced with something else new and different. It
really helps if she has older siblings or close cousins who demonstrate these new
and different things for her. It's important to help her see this is a
problem for not just her, and then enlist her help. Don't see her as adversary in
this issue, but foster the idea that you're partners who help each other.
It would help YOU to remember that she won't always be wearing pull-ups,
too. I personally would put the clean-up part under health and safety, and
coerce her into letting me clean her up. I wouldn't wrestle her to the ground or
anything, but I would make fun things a little difficult until I could get
her to submit. Maybe save her bath until after her daily pull-up, and make
bath time really fun?
It won't last forever. A useful mantra for much of parenting. ;)
Karen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Aimee
Sherri-Lee Pressman wrote:
Alyssa Satin Capucilli, we have it and the little girl is named Hannah.
We just checked out "You Can Go to the Potty" by the Sears from the
library. I love this book! Mostly, though, not for the potty so much
as it shows AP things, a baby nursing, a baby in bed with its mama, a
baby in cloth diapers, they showed a co-sleeper. It's cute, it takes
the angle that when you were a baby, you needed lots of help from your
parents (nursing, going to sleep, changing your diaper), but now you're
getting older, you can do more things yourself.
My daughter is 3 and a few months, and has been back and forth in
diapers and potty for a while now, more than six months I think. At one
point she had been using the potty for pee and poop all day, only having
a diaper at night and sometimes when we went out, for two whole months.
This prompted me to believe she was nearly "trained" and I gave away
almost all my cloth diapers. Oops. Now, she wears a diaper more than
she doesn't, she pees in the potty maybe once a day, and she pooped in
it one day last week, but mostly she's asking for a diaper when she has
to go. And in disposables after all that time in cloth, sheesh ;)
-Aimee
http://www.hippycrites.com
> Hi Heather,I'm pretty sure it's actually called "The Potty Book for girls" by
>
>
>
> I will have a look at that book, thank you. Someone, mentioned a book called
> "Hannah's Potty" which would be cool cause her name is Hannah but I can't
Alyssa Satin Capucilli, we have it and the little girl is named Hannah.
We just checked out "You Can Go to the Potty" by the Sears from the
library. I love this book! Mostly, though, not for the potty so much
as it shows AP things, a baby nursing, a baby in bed with its mama, a
baby in cloth diapers, they showed a co-sleeper. It's cute, it takes
the angle that when you were a baby, you needed lots of help from your
parents (nursing, going to sleep, changing your diaper), but now you're
getting older, you can do more things yourself.
My daughter is 3 and a few months, and has been back and forth in
diapers and potty for a while now, more than six months I think. At one
point she had been using the potty for pee and poop all day, only having
a diaper at night and sometimes when we went out, for two whole months.
This prompted me to believe she was nearly "trained" and I gave away
almost all my cloth diapers. Oops. Now, she wears a diaper more than
she doesn't, she pees in the potty maybe once a day, and she pooped in
it one day last week, but mostly she's asking for a diaper when she has
to go. And in disposables after all that time in cloth, sheesh ;)
-Aimee
http://www.hippycrites.com
pioneermommy
Hi,
When she comes to me with a pull up I ask her if she would like to
don't know if this will help but my ds had similar problems and still
does if we are not at home and he is 5. I finally after a long road
figured out that toilets are not made for children. It is very
uncomfortable and scary to be on one with nothing to hold onto and
nowhere to put your feet. We have adjusted for this at home. We first
tried potty chairs but they are hard to use for boys(pee everywhere)
and he eventually got too big for it. I believe that we were made for
squatting for this particular bodily function and especially for
children because that is how they do it until they are "potty
trained". Also, he told me the other day that he waits to tell me
when he is done because he says that it bothers him to wipe right
away.
I hope this helps at all. Good luck.
Carrie
When she comes to me with a pull up I ask her if she would like to
> try in the toilet, sometimes (rarely) she says yes and we go butnothing
> happens, she just can't seem to figure out the process.I have just been lurking here but I felt that I had to jump in. I
don't know if this will help but my ds had similar problems and still
does if we are not at home and he is 5. I finally after a long road
figured out that toilets are not made for children. It is very
uncomfortable and scary to be on one with nothing to hold onto and
nowhere to put your feet. We have adjusted for this at home. We first
tried potty chairs but they are hard to use for boys(pee everywhere)
and he eventually got too big for it. I believe that we were made for
squatting for this particular bodily function and especially for
children because that is how they do it until they are "potty
trained". Also, he told me the other day that he waits to tell me
when he is done because he says that it bothers him to wipe right
away.
I hope this helps at all. Good luck.
Carrie
Sherri-Lee Pressman
Hi Carrie,
Thanks for sharing your experiences.
I do have a little soft seat that sits on the toilet that she uses.
Sometimes she uses it sometimes she doesn't. totally up to her. We have a
stool in the bathroom for her, that she can have her feet on while on the
toilet, although she stopped doing that awhile ago and she uses for reaching
the sink as well.
She has never squatted to poo, she has always stood very straight sometimes
with a left tilt, which I found out is the way the colon works and so she
would actually have been opening it up for easier movement with this
position. So she has real problems translating that to sitting action.
I am mulling all this over and perhaps coming up with some ideas just from
all the good suggestion put out there by everyone here.
Today when we got home she said she had to go, so I said, lets try on the
toilet and she made a face, and I immediately said if it doesn't work then
we can put on a pull up right away. She smiled with relief and said yes and
as she went into the toilet I got the pull up. She made what looked like a
couple of pushing efforts then said no and we put on the pull up and she
went there. I told her she was brave to try and that if we tried like that
each day then one day it would work. And she said "I am so excited to poo in
the toilet!" which was just such an amazing thing to hear. So maybe we are
getting somewhere. Maybe just by talking about it here I have released my
stress which might have helped her. Who knows:-)
Thanks again,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: pioneermommy [mailto:owenscr@...]
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 2:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: thoughts and suggestions needed
Hi,
When she comes to me with a pull up I ask her if she would like to
don't know if this will help but my ds had similar problems and still
does if we are not at home and he is 5. I finally after a long road
figured out that toilets are not made for children. It is very
uncomfortable and scary to be on one with nothing to hold onto and
nowhere to put your feet. We have adjusted for this at home. We first
tried potty chairs but they are hard to use for boys(pee everywhere)
and he eventually got too big for it. I believe that we were made for
squatting for this particular bodily function and especially for
children because that is how they do it until they are "potty
trained". Also, he told me the other day that he waits to tell me
when he is done because he says that it bothers him to wipe right
away.
I hope this helps at all. Good luck.
Carrie
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Thanks for sharing your experiences.
I do have a little soft seat that sits on the toilet that she uses.
Sometimes she uses it sometimes she doesn't. totally up to her. We have a
stool in the bathroom for her, that she can have her feet on while on the
toilet, although she stopped doing that awhile ago and she uses for reaching
the sink as well.
She has never squatted to poo, she has always stood very straight sometimes
with a left tilt, which I found out is the way the colon works and so she
would actually have been opening it up for easier movement with this
position. So she has real problems translating that to sitting action.
I am mulling all this over and perhaps coming up with some ideas just from
all the good suggestion put out there by everyone here.
Today when we got home she said she had to go, so I said, lets try on the
toilet and she made a face, and I immediately said if it doesn't work then
we can put on a pull up right away. She smiled with relief and said yes and
as she went into the toilet I got the pull up. She made what looked like a
couple of pushing efforts then said no and we put on the pull up and she
went there. I told her she was brave to try and that if we tried like that
each day then one day it would work. And she said "I am so excited to poo in
the toilet!" which was just such an amazing thing to hear. So maybe we are
getting somewhere. Maybe just by talking about it here I have released my
stress which might have helped her. Who knows:-)
Thanks again,
Sherri-Lee
_____
From: pioneermommy [mailto:owenscr@...]
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 2:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: thoughts and suggestions needed
Hi,
When she comes to me with a pull up I ask her if she would like to
> try in the toilet, sometimes (rarely) she says yes and we go butnothing
> happens, she just can't seem to figure out the process.I have just been lurking here but I felt that I had to jump in. I
don't know if this will help but my ds had similar problems and still
does if we are not at home and he is 5. I finally after a long road
figured out that toilets are not made for children. It is very
uncomfortable and scary to be on one with nothing to hold onto and
nowhere to put your feet. We have adjusted for this at home. We first
tried potty chairs but they are hard to use for boys(pee everywhere)
and he eventually got too big for it. I believe that we were made for
squatting for this particular bodily function and especially for
children because that is how they do it until they are "potty
trained". Also, he told me the other day that he waits to tell me
when he is done because he says that it bothers him to wipe right
away.
I hope this helps at all. Good luck.
Carrie
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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