Control Issues
mom2ckm
Wow, reading all the posts about food issues, etc has gotten me
thinking about how unschooling really isn't just about "learning
without schooling" It's so much bigger! Now I need advice!! Here's
my story ...
My husband is okay with us not "doing school" anymore. I have talked
to him about throwing out the curriculum and providing our family
(Mom and Dad included) with a rich environment to learn from, and
we're both on the same page with that. But to be quite honest, until
the food discussion started on this list I hadn't really thought
about how to incorporate the unschooling philosophy to our whole
life - thus far the only thing that we've changed is I'm not forcing
the kids to do math workbooks or write sentences, and I'm not
looking for "teachable moments". But in all other aspects of our
daily life not much has changed.
But now that I look at the big picture I realize that all of
our "problems" with the kids are really control issues. DH and I
have really been having difficulties as far as conflicting parenting
styles - he was raised with "the Fear of Dad" if Dad says "do this"
you do it, if Dad says "eat this" you eat it, no questions, no
negotiation, all dissenters will be punished. Dad was the boss,
everything went Dad's way. So now dh has a serious need to be "in
charge" Whenever a kid questions his authority he hits the roof! He
sees all the problems as my fault, I am not running a tight enough
ship. And naturally with that idea planted in my head I feel totally
conflicted and overwhelmed. I find myself trying to make my
kids "toe the line" but I want them to be independent thinksers who
can make their own decisions. I hate being a mom who uses threats
and guilt to get people to eat their vegetables or clean their room!
In my house Mom and Dad tried to accomodate everyone's needs as much
as possible - if Mom made lamb for dinner, she knew I didn't like
it, so I got a PB&J sandwich instead. I honestly don't remember ever
having conflicts with my parents about food, tv watching, room
cleaning. After I had kids I asked my Mom how she did such a good
job raising her kids, her answer: "I led by example." This sounds
so simple, yet for me it is a very HUGE idea!
I will admit that I have not always been the best example for my
kids. I have yelled, I have spanked, I have even thrown temper
tantrums! I don't make my bed everyday, sometimes I go to bed
without brushing my teeth, sometimes I watch tv all day and eat too
much junk food, I have been known to talk with my mouth full of
food... Dh has done all of these things too. So how can we expect
our kids to be "perfect"?
So here's my problem... I understand that changes need to be made.
That we need to stop being dictators and be role models. We need to
come up with more creative solutions to address everyone's needs
instead of making everyone conform to what Mom and Dad say
is "right" and "good". But how do I get my darling husband with his
humungous control issues to see this point?
Thanks in advance for any advice you might have,
Sarah
thinking about how unschooling really isn't just about "learning
without schooling" It's so much bigger! Now I need advice!! Here's
my story ...
My husband is okay with us not "doing school" anymore. I have talked
to him about throwing out the curriculum and providing our family
(Mom and Dad included) with a rich environment to learn from, and
we're both on the same page with that. But to be quite honest, until
the food discussion started on this list I hadn't really thought
about how to incorporate the unschooling philosophy to our whole
life - thus far the only thing that we've changed is I'm not forcing
the kids to do math workbooks or write sentences, and I'm not
looking for "teachable moments". But in all other aspects of our
daily life not much has changed.
But now that I look at the big picture I realize that all of
our "problems" with the kids are really control issues. DH and I
have really been having difficulties as far as conflicting parenting
styles - he was raised with "the Fear of Dad" if Dad says "do this"
you do it, if Dad says "eat this" you eat it, no questions, no
negotiation, all dissenters will be punished. Dad was the boss,
everything went Dad's way. So now dh has a serious need to be "in
charge" Whenever a kid questions his authority he hits the roof! He
sees all the problems as my fault, I am not running a tight enough
ship. And naturally with that idea planted in my head I feel totally
conflicted and overwhelmed. I find myself trying to make my
kids "toe the line" but I want them to be independent thinksers who
can make their own decisions. I hate being a mom who uses threats
and guilt to get people to eat their vegetables or clean their room!
In my house Mom and Dad tried to accomodate everyone's needs as much
as possible - if Mom made lamb for dinner, she knew I didn't like
it, so I got a PB&J sandwich instead. I honestly don't remember ever
having conflicts with my parents about food, tv watching, room
cleaning. After I had kids I asked my Mom how she did such a good
job raising her kids, her answer: "I led by example." This sounds
so simple, yet for me it is a very HUGE idea!
I will admit that I have not always been the best example for my
kids. I have yelled, I have spanked, I have even thrown temper
tantrums! I don't make my bed everyday, sometimes I go to bed
without brushing my teeth, sometimes I watch tv all day and eat too
much junk food, I have been known to talk with my mouth full of
food... Dh has done all of these things too. So how can we expect
our kids to be "perfect"?
So here's my problem... I understand that changes need to be made.
That we need to stop being dictators and be role models. We need to
come up with more creative solutions to address everyone's needs
instead of making everyone conform to what Mom and Dad say
is "right" and "good". But how do I get my darling husband with his
humungous control issues to see this point?
Thanks in advance for any advice you might have,
Sarah
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/2/2004 11:28:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
sarah_smile@... writes:
So here's my problem... I understand that changes need to be made.
That we need to stop being dictators and be role models. We need to
come up with more creative solutions to address everyone's needs
instead of making everyone conform to what Mom and Dad say
is "right" and "good". But how do I get my darling husband with his
humungous control issues to see this point? <<<<<Send him that e-mail?Sometimes with a more "authoritative" person, you can have trouble explaining yourself----because he'll cut you off before you get too far. I'd write it all down----just like what you wrote to us---and be more specific.Ask him to read it----and maybe even write you back. It's often easier to put your thoughts down on paper without blowing up. PLUS, it can give a cooling off period for you to erase what's too inflammatory! <g>Taking the time to read it may actually hit home with him----how would he feel if.....Joyce? Joyce? You there? <g> Joyce has some great anologies for times like this! I hope she'll chime in.~Kelly
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/2/2004 11:52:32 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
Taking the time to read it may actually hit home with him----how would he feel if.....<<<<And I'll add to that----how did he feel WHEN.... his father treated him like that?~Kelly
Tina
<<But now that I look at the big picture I realize that all of
our "problems" with the kids are really control issues. DH and I
have really been having difficulties as far as conflicting parenting
styles - he was raised with "the Fear of Dad" if Dad says "do this"
you do it, if Dad says "eat this" you eat it, no questions, no
negotiation, all dissenters will be punished. Dad was the boss,
everything went Dad's way. So now dh has a serious need to be "in
charge" Whenever a kid questions his authority he hits the roof! He
sees all the problems as my fault, I am not running a tight enough
ship. And naturally with that idea planted in my head I feel totally
conflicted and overwhelmed. I find myself trying to make my
kids "toe the line" but I want them to be independent thinksers who
can make their own decisions. I hate being a mom who uses threats
and guilt to get people to eat their vegetables or clean their room!>>
**WOW!! Can I relate to you! This is VERY similar to what is being
discussed on another thread, and it is EXACTLY what I am dealing with
in my personal situation at home. It is beyond frustrating!
Unfortunately, I can offer no real advice at this time being that I'm
in the same exact situation myself. All I can say is to be
persistent. I have tried the letter writing thing for communication
that was suggested previously by someone else. I say it's worth a
shot, but don't get your hopes up too high. In my experience,
sometimes it works a little, sometimes it doesn't work at all and
other times it may make a difference temporarily and other times it
may make no difference at all. In my personal experience it never
made a huge difference. Everyone is different, so definately try it.
It is worth a shot.
It really is much easier to communicate on paper. The difficulty
comes in when the other person doesn't like to write. If nothing
else, it has the potential to be a good thought provoker and
conversation starter. I just wanted to caution you to not have your
expectations set real high. In my experience, it's easier to go into
it knowing that it may have little to no effect on the situation than
it is to have these grand expectations, having it flop and facing
major disappointment.
One other helpful bit, that you probably have figured out already
given your situation, is to be aware of timing. With your husband's
personality timing is everything. Definately be aware of his day and
current mood before handing him a letter or starting up a serious
conversation about the topic at hand.
Well, that's all of my wonderful wisdom and experience. I really
feel for you and am right there with you. If/when you learn anything
along the way please do share. I promise to do the same.
My best to you - Tina
our "problems" with the kids are really control issues. DH and I
have really been having difficulties as far as conflicting parenting
styles - he was raised with "the Fear of Dad" if Dad says "do this"
you do it, if Dad says "eat this" you eat it, no questions, no
negotiation, all dissenters will be punished. Dad was the boss,
everything went Dad's way. So now dh has a serious need to be "in
charge" Whenever a kid questions his authority he hits the roof! He
sees all the problems as my fault, I am not running a tight enough
ship. And naturally with that idea planted in my head I feel totally
conflicted and overwhelmed. I find myself trying to make my
kids "toe the line" but I want them to be independent thinksers who
can make their own decisions. I hate being a mom who uses threats
and guilt to get people to eat their vegetables or clean their room!>>
**WOW!! Can I relate to you! This is VERY similar to what is being
discussed on another thread, and it is EXACTLY what I am dealing with
in my personal situation at home. It is beyond frustrating!
Unfortunately, I can offer no real advice at this time being that I'm
in the same exact situation myself. All I can say is to be
persistent. I have tried the letter writing thing for communication
that was suggested previously by someone else. I say it's worth a
shot, but don't get your hopes up too high. In my experience,
sometimes it works a little, sometimes it doesn't work at all and
other times it may make a difference temporarily and other times it
may make no difference at all. In my personal experience it never
made a huge difference. Everyone is different, so definately try it.
It is worth a shot.
It really is much easier to communicate on paper. The difficulty
comes in when the other person doesn't like to write. If nothing
else, it has the potential to be a good thought provoker and
conversation starter. I just wanted to caution you to not have your
expectations set real high. In my experience, it's easier to go into
it knowing that it may have little to no effect on the situation than
it is to have these grand expectations, having it flop and facing
major disappointment.
One other helpful bit, that you probably have figured out already
given your situation, is to be aware of timing. With your husband's
personality timing is everything. Definately be aware of his day and
current mood before handing him a letter or starting up a serious
conversation about the topic at hand.
Well, that's all of my wonderful wisdom and experience. I really
feel for you and am right there with you. If/when you learn anything
along the way please do share. I promise to do the same.
My best to you - Tina
Alyce
--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@a... wrote:
husband grew up the same way... thank god he's willing to listen to
me... and I did point out to him... how did you feel when your dad
did that. That's what drove it home. Just because you grew up that
way doesn't mean it's the only way to do things. Tight ships are
mighty restrictive places to live. Think about it. Who wouldn't
want to break free and rebel? God knows I did... and my husband?
Forget it. He was a nightmare back then. I knew him. He was the
classic rebellious in-trouble teenage boy. Good grief. hehe.
Alyce
> And I'll add to that----how did he feel WHEN.... his fathertreated him like
> that?Excellent point. I certainly had some work to do on myself, but my
> ~Kelly
husband grew up the same way... thank god he's willing to listen to
me... and I did point out to him... how did you feel when your dad
did that. That's what drove it home. Just because you grew up that
way doesn't mean it's the only way to do things. Tight ships are
mighty restrictive places to live. Think about it. Who wouldn't
want to break free and rebel? God knows I did... and my husband?
Forget it. He was a nightmare back then. I knew him. He was the
classic rebellious in-trouble teenage boy. Good grief. hehe.
Alyce
Joanne Watson
> So here's my problem... I understand that changes need to be made.I have been on this page for a while. I see it as being an issue that
> That we need to stop being dictators and be role models. We need to
> come up with more creative solutions to address everyone's needs
> instead of making everyone conform to what Mom and Dad say
> is "right" and "good". But how do I get my darling husband with his
> humungous control issues to see this point?
>
is
ego-driven, this need to be right all the time. I don't relate to it,
and I
find myself pointing out to my dh that it just isn't part of my style or
one of my needs. He just doesn't get it. To him, this is the whole
crux of parenting. He sees everything as being about respecting
authority and proper chain of command. I want to teach respect.
I also want to question authority when it makes no sense. I am
most into peaceful ways of resolving issues, not these violent
outbursts of ego. Is it a Mars/Venus thing???
Joanne
mom2ckm
--- In [email protected], "Tina" <zoocrew@w...>
wrote:
I just realized that your "Family Dynamics Question" thread IS very
similar to my "Control Issues" thread. Yes, it does sound like we're
dealing with the same sort of home situation.
Thanks to all who have put their 2 cents in on my (and Tina's)
questions. As usual your advice helps me to realize that I do know
what to do to fix my problems, I just need a little moral support to
trust my instincts.
I will keep you all posted on how things go. I have already talked
to my sister-in-law about watching the kids for a bit so my husband
and I can have an uninterrupted conversation about this. Hopefully
he's in a good, open-minded mood tonight when he gets home and we
can have a nice discussion :o)
Thanks Again,
Sarah
wrote:
>being
> **WOW!! Can I relate to you! This is VERY similar to what is
> discussed on another thread, and it is EXACTLY what I am dealingwith
> in my personal situation at home.Hi Tina,
I just realized that your "Family Dynamics Question" thread IS very
similar to my "Control Issues" thread. Yes, it does sound like we're
dealing with the same sort of home situation.
Thanks to all who have put their 2 cents in on my (and Tina's)
questions. As usual your advice helps me to realize that I do know
what to do to fix my problems, I just need a little moral support to
trust my instincts.
I will keep you all posted on how things go. I have already talked
to my sister-in-law about watching the kids for a bit so my husband
and I can have an uninterrupted conversation about this. Hopefully
he's in a good, open-minded mood tonight when he gets home and we
can have a nice discussion :o)
Thanks Again,
Sarah
[email protected]
<<<But now that I look at the big picture I realize that all of
our "problems" with the kids are really control issues. DH and I
have really been having difficulties as far as conflicting parenting
styles - he was raised with "the Fear of Dad" if Dad says "do this"
you do it, if Dad says "eat this" you eat it, no questions, no
negotiation, all dissenters will be punished. Dad was the boss,
everything went Dad's way. So now dh has a serious need to be "in
charge" Whenever a kid questions his authority he hits the roof! He
sees all the problems as my fault, I am not running a tight enough
ship. And naturally with that idea planted in my head I feel totally
conflicted and overwhelmed. I find myself trying to make my
kids "toe the line" but I want them to be independent thinksers who
can make their own decisions. I hate being a mom who uses threats
and guilt to get people to eat their vegetables or clean their room!>>>
I don't know if this is the case in your home, but it may be, and if your like me, you may not even be aware of it.
This very thing has been happening with us. Jason so gets unschooling, he got it before me, as long as it pertains to school. And he has no problem with food restriction, because he wasn't raised with any. But the rest, has been a battle between us for years.
We were spankers, and yellers. I've moved past spanking and I'm trying to move past yelling. Jason is trying to let go of the spanking but is haveing a harder time with it than I am. He had pretty much gotten past it, until we moved. (A move that was for him to go to school-as per my request for a more finanical stable future-he was not interested in going to this school very much) Last week I started reading Wishcaft and something hit me that I honestly hadn't noticed before.
Jason isn't happy. He hasn't been happy in years. And his need to control the kids is directly related to his unhappiness. And the reason he isn't happy is me. I've been forcing him to live a life that I keep thinking that I want and he, out of his love for me, is doing everything that I ask of him, even when it makes him misrable.
We started talking about this this weekend. And the more I can come to terms with my part in his unhappiness and we figure out what we need to do to help him find his happiness, he is starting to let go of his control. He's finding his way to let go of his control over the kids, as I let go of mine over him.
This may not have anything to do with you and your husband, but htis has been such a revalation to me, and sometihng that 2 weeks ago I never would have concidered, I wanted to share it with you.
I understand where you are, I've been there, and just now starting to climb my way out of it. If you need to talk, I'm here :)
~Rebecca
--
You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocketship underpants don't help."
-Calvin
our "problems" with the kids are really control issues. DH and I
have really been having difficulties as far as conflicting parenting
styles - he was raised with "the Fear of Dad" if Dad says "do this"
you do it, if Dad says "eat this" you eat it, no questions, no
negotiation, all dissenters will be punished. Dad was the boss,
everything went Dad's way. So now dh has a serious need to be "in
charge" Whenever a kid questions his authority he hits the roof! He
sees all the problems as my fault, I am not running a tight enough
ship. And naturally with that idea planted in my head I feel totally
conflicted and overwhelmed. I find myself trying to make my
kids "toe the line" but I want them to be independent thinksers who
can make their own decisions. I hate being a mom who uses threats
and guilt to get people to eat their vegetables or clean their room!>>>
I don't know if this is the case in your home, but it may be, and if your like me, you may not even be aware of it.
This very thing has been happening with us. Jason so gets unschooling, he got it before me, as long as it pertains to school. And he has no problem with food restriction, because he wasn't raised with any. But the rest, has been a battle between us for years.
We were spankers, and yellers. I've moved past spanking and I'm trying to move past yelling. Jason is trying to let go of the spanking but is haveing a harder time with it than I am. He had pretty much gotten past it, until we moved. (A move that was for him to go to school-as per my request for a more finanical stable future-he was not interested in going to this school very much) Last week I started reading Wishcaft and something hit me that I honestly hadn't noticed before.
Jason isn't happy. He hasn't been happy in years. And his need to control the kids is directly related to his unhappiness. And the reason he isn't happy is me. I've been forcing him to live a life that I keep thinking that I want and he, out of his love for me, is doing everything that I ask of him, even when it makes him misrable.
We started talking about this this weekend. And the more I can come to terms with my part in his unhappiness and we figure out what we need to do to help him find his happiness, he is starting to let go of his control. He's finding his way to let go of his control over the kids, as I let go of mine over him.
This may not have anything to do with you and your husband, but htis has been such a revalation to me, and sometihng that 2 weeks ago I never would have concidered, I wanted to share it with you.
I understand where you are, I've been there, and just now starting to climb my way out of it. If you need to talk, I'm here :)
~Rebecca
--
You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocketship underpants don't help."
-Calvin
Tina
<<I've moved past spanking and I'm trying to move past yelling.>>
I can totall respect this. I never was much of a spanker. I just
didn't feel comfortable with it, but I have struggled with the whole
yelling thing. For some reason it goes in waves. I make a
completely conscious effort to maintain my voice level. It is a
constant effort that I have to continue working on. I have made a
lot of progress in this area, thankfully.
One thing that I know directly effects my ability to maintain is my
relationship status with Pat. We directly effect each other's
attitudes. I'm sure you can relate to this judging by your personal
post. I continue forward in spite of this difficulty and believe
that we are all much better off for it.
I have a question about the book "Wishcraft" that everyone keeps
talking about. Could you possibly tell me a little more about it?
The title itself keeps me at bay. I'm not really into the whole New
Age thing, and I'm wondering if it's that type of slant.
Thanks for sharing...
Tina
I can totall respect this. I never was much of a spanker. I just
didn't feel comfortable with it, but I have struggled with the whole
yelling thing. For some reason it goes in waves. I make a
completely conscious effort to maintain my voice level. It is a
constant effort that I have to continue working on. I have made a
lot of progress in this area, thankfully.
One thing that I know directly effects my ability to maintain is my
relationship status with Pat. We directly effect each other's
attitudes. I'm sure you can relate to this judging by your personal
post. I continue forward in spite of this difficulty and believe
that we are all much better off for it.
I have a question about the book "Wishcraft" that everyone keeps
talking about. Could you possibly tell me a little more about it?
The title itself keeps me at bay. I'm not really into the whole New
Age thing, and I'm wondering if it's that type of slant.
Thanks for sharing...
Tina
letty312003
i just finished reading your post. i don't have any advice or
anything like that for you. i just wanted you to know that there are
people out here living the exact same way. dh and i stuggle with
these same issues. thank you for being so open. maybe we will both
get some good advice from you post.
collette
anything like that for you. i just wanted you to know that there are
people out here living the exact same way. dh and i stuggle with
these same issues. thank you for being so open. maybe we will both
get some good advice from you post.
collette
stephanie s
Hi! I am new to this group. This is actually my first group and post. I've had the same issues with my husband reguarding discipline, parenting and unschooling. But we have been more and more on the same page. Something that really helped was when I shared with him an audio or video clip speaking on the subjects of unschooling, not punishing, etc. It was as if when I said it he was immediately defensive but when he heard someone else he was reseptive. Good luck!--- In [email protected], "letty312003" <letty312003@...> wrote:
>
> i just finished reading your post. i don't have any advice or
> anything like that for you. i just wanted you to know that there are
> people out here living the exact same way. dh and i stuggle with
> these same issues. thank you for being so open. maybe we will both
> get some good advice from you post.
>
> collette
>