Unschooling and Forcing Kids to do Things They Clearly Don't Want To Do
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/12/2006 3:00:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
pamsoroosh@... writes:
bet that if you simply stop going out so much, don't have other
kids over, and your husband doesn't "handle" her - constrain her,
make her do things, etc., that she'll stop hitting within 6 months to
a year.
How does one get a two and a half year old to willingly let her Mommy apply
sunscreen or at least keep her hat on? She won't let me without force and she
refuses to apply the stick herself. I prefer the chemical free natural
sunscreens which the rest of the family uses but for the resistant baby we've tried
all flavors, colors, scents, creams, solids, etc. We've called it makeup,
candy for her face and everything else we can think of. I bought a full body red
UV suit that goes over her clothes but she really does not like that. I give
her the choice of the suit or the cream and she screams and runs away.
My issues:
Our family has sensitive, freckly skin (all strawberry blondes) and my 9 year
old just had three atypical moles removed from her head leaving 28 stitches.
Atypical means that the cells were changing to cancer. She had the moles for
years but they started getting dark around the edges and one had a bloody,
crusty center so they took them off. She goes back in next month to have two
more removed. We were told by the dermatologist and the surgeon that we should
expect to be doing these removals every couple of years at most and that our
kids should all have annual body checks.
We have the UV suits, and tons of other bells and whistle including wide
brimmed hats. We also live in Cape Cod near the shore and have a heated pool that
is already opened. We love the beach so we often go later in the day, etc.,
but we spend all day, all summer, in our pool. We have a huge market umbrella
that was great last year when she was one and clung to me more but I know she
won't be clinging so much this year.
I feel like I'm abusing her by not using the sunscreen and I know I'm abusing
her when we force her to wear it. My husband tried to scare her by telling
her that she might have to go to the hospital if she doesn't wear it. That's
worse for me than holding her down to apply it.
How do others handle this?
Thanks,
Robin, glad that there is no sun today. Warped, eh?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
pamsoroosh@... writes:
bet that if you simply stop going out so much, don't have other
kids over, and your husband doesn't "handle" her - constrain her,
make her do things, etc., that she'll stop hitting within 6 months to
a year.
How does one get a two and a half year old to willingly let her Mommy apply
sunscreen or at least keep her hat on? She won't let me without force and she
refuses to apply the stick herself. I prefer the chemical free natural
sunscreens which the rest of the family uses but for the resistant baby we've tried
all flavors, colors, scents, creams, solids, etc. We've called it makeup,
candy for her face and everything else we can think of. I bought a full body red
UV suit that goes over her clothes but she really does not like that. I give
her the choice of the suit or the cream and she screams and runs away.
My issues:
Our family has sensitive, freckly skin (all strawberry blondes) and my 9 year
old just had three atypical moles removed from her head leaving 28 stitches.
Atypical means that the cells were changing to cancer. She had the moles for
years but they started getting dark around the edges and one had a bloody,
crusty center so they took them off. She goes back in next month to have two
more removed. We were told by the dermatologist and the surgeon that we should
expect to be doing these removals every couple of years at most and that our
kids should all have annual body checks.
We have the UV suits, and tons of other bells and whistle including wide
brimmed hats. We also live in Cape Cod near the shore and have a heated pool that
is already opened. We love the beach so we often go later in the day, etc.,
but we spend all day, all summer, in our pool. We have a huge market umbrella
that was great last year when she was one and clung to me more but I know she
won't be clinging so much this year.
I feel like I'm abusing her by not using the sunscreen and I know I'm abusing
her when we force her to wear it. My husband tried to scare her by telling
her that she might have to go to the hospital if she doesn't wear it. That's
worse for me than holding her down to apply it.
How do others handle this?
Thanks,
Robin, glad that there is no sun today. Warped, eh?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pampered Chef Michelle
On 5/12/06, ohpurple1@... <ohpurple1@...> wrote:
that I would tackle. It could be the smell, the way it feels on her skin,
the time it takes to put on, etc. Find the reason behind it and you will
find the solution to helping her get the protection she needs. Also, does
she see you putting on sunscreen? Maybe have her do it with you. Both of
you "lather up" each morning together. My kids have just come to appreciate
wearing a hat. I never had a "hat baby" and all hats ended up on the floor
within seconds of putting them on their heads. In fact Emily hated hats so
much that just 3 hours old she was squirming out of her stocking cap at the
hospital. She would push on them until they came off. So I found other
ways to keep my kids protected from the sun. They weren't as good as hats,
but they at least were something.
--
Michelle
Independent Kitchen Consultant #413652
The Pampered Chef
850-474-0817
http://www.pamperedchef.biz/michellelr
Ask me how you can save 60% on some of our most favorite products!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>What does she not like about the sunscreen? That would be the first thing
>
>
> I feel like I'm abusing her by not using the sunscreen and I know I'm
> abusing
> her when we force her to wear it. My husband tried to scare her by
> telling
> her that she might have to go to the hospital if she doesn't wear
> it. That's
> worse for me than holding her down to apply it.
>
> How do others handle this?
that I would tackle. It could be the smell, the way it feels on her skin,
the time it takes to put on, etc. Find the reason behind it and you will
find the solution to helping her get the protection she needs. Also, does
she see you putting on sunscreen? Maybe have her do it with you. Both of
you "lather up" each morning together. My kids have just come to appreciate
wearing a hat. I never had a "hat baby" and all hats ended up on the floor
within seconds of putting them on their heads. In fact Emily hated hats so
much that just 3 hours old she was squirming out of her stocking cap at the
hospital. She would push on them until they came off. So I found other
ways to keep my kids protected from the sun. They weren't as good as hats,
but they at least were something.
--
Michelle
Independent Kitchen Consultant #413652
The Pampered Chef
850-474-0817
http://www.pamperedchef.biz/michellelr
Ask me how you can save 60% on some of our most favorite products!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
It ain't sunscreen but.....
My youngest son has hepatitis C and when he was 3, he had to have lots
of tests so we could determine the best way to handle his situation
(treat or not, with treatment being a year of daily injections at the
time). He had to have blood drawn monthly, had to have a liver biopsy
and stay very still in the hospital, etc.. As you can imagine, he
hated it. I hated it too, but the problem with Hepatitis C is by the
time you have symptoms, you are extremely sick. Danny had no way of
knowing or understanding that he was ill. He felt fine and Mama was
doing this to him. We both cried a lot.
It didn't fix the problem but what helped was me talking with Danny
about how I hated it too, about how I didn't want them to put the
needles in him either but that we had no choice. Rather than working
with the doctors against Danny, I let the doctors be the bad guys, made
them be the ones to hold him down, and I just hugged and supported
Danny. Sometimes we made up "mean" songs about the doctors or the
needles. Sometimes we hollered and made threatening faces.
Due to circumstances beyond our control, it was something that Danny
really needed to do for his health that he didn't understand because of
his age. I wanted to not be mad at him for his anger but to be his
ally in handling his anger.
Julie S.
My youngest son has hepatitis C and when he was 3, he had to have lots
of tests so we could determine the best way to handle his situation
(treat or not, with treatment being a year of daily injections at the
time). He had to have blood drawn monthly, had to have a liver biopsy
and stay very still in the hospital, etc.. As you can imagine, he
hated it. I hated it too, but the problem with Hepatitis C is by the
time you have symptoms, you are extremely sick. Danny had no way of
knowing or understanding that he was ill. He felt fine and Mama was
doing this to him. We both cried a lot.
It didn't fix the problem but what helped was me talking with Danny
about how I hated it too, about how I didn't want them to put the
needles in him either but that we had no choice. Rather than working
with the doctors against Danny, I let the doctors be the bad guys, made
them be the ones to hold him down, and I just hugged and supported
Danny. Sometimes we made up "mean" songs about the doctors or the
needles. Sometimes we hollered and made threatening faces.
Due to circumstances beyond our control, it was something that Danny
really needed to do for his health that he didn't understand because of
his age. I wanted to not be mad at him for his anger but to be his
ally in handling his anger.
Julie S.
Deb Lewis
***I feel like I'm abusing her by not using the sunscreen and I know I'm
abusing
her when we force her to wear it. ***
Let it go. She'll use it when she understands it's a good idea. Have
you let her put it on herself? Have you tried the kind that's a spray
on. Over time if she sees you using it she may feel like trying it. If
she applies it herself you'll run out sooner, but...<g>
***My husband tried to scare her by telling
her that she might have to go to the hospital if she doesn't wear it. ***
My mom tried to plant the fear of the remotely possible in her kids and
today my mom is a joke to us. Your husband probably wouldn't like the
thought of being a joke to his kids.
***That's worse for me than holding her down to apply it.***
Maybe you were exaggerating about holding her down to apply it but no
wonder she hates it! If anyone tried to hold me down and do something to
me I didn't want, boy howdy, they'd be in world of hurt. <g> Do you
want a daughter who will let people hold her down and do stuff to her?
Step back and take a deep breath. The most important thing in her life
today is not sun screen or the lack of it. It's you. She needs you on
her side. I know it's easy to let fear take you, especially since you've
had one scare already. Don't let your fear get so big it blocks the
view of your daughter.
Deb Lewis
abusing
her when we force her to wear it. ***
Let it go. She'll use it when she understands it's a good idea. Have
you let her put it on herself? Have you tried the kind that's a spray
on. Over time if she sees you using it she may feel like trying it. If
she applies it herself you'll run out sooner, but...<g>
***My husband tried to scare her by telling
her that she might have to go to the hospital if she doesn't wear it. ***
My mom tried to plant the fear of the remotely possible in her kids and
today my mom is a joke to us. Your husband probably wouldn't like the
thought of being a joke to his kids.
***That's worse for me than holding her down to apply it.***
Maybe you were exaggerating about holding her down to apply it but no
wonder she hates it! If anyone tried to hold me down and do something to
me I didn't want, boy howdy, they'd be in world of hurt. <g> Do you
want a daughter who will let people hold her down and do stuff to her?
Step back and take a deep breath. The most important thing in her life
today is not sun screen or the lack of it. It's you. She needs you on
her side. I know it's easy to let fear take you, especially since you've
had one scare already. Don't let your fear get so big it blocks the
view of your daughter.
Deb Lewis
Melissa
I understand your fear, my grandmother had skin cancer, and we are
all very fair skin, blond hair, blue eyes. Fear can't rule your life
though....The good news is that you had preexisting moles that
turned, rather than the creation of new blemishes. That's very
controllable, and less likely to create skin cancer. Hm, that's odd
too because my friend maybe two years ago went thru the bloody moles,
and they removed them and said that the moles were benign, but the
sign of the changing was indicative of too much sun exposure (or
something like that)
What about leaving it down on her level and just hoping that she'll
use it? We have in our family Emily, who is very sensitive to
sunblock, the feel is slimy, the smell is strong. So she really has
to approach it on her own terms. She needs to be strong enough
emotionally and be in control of it, or she really can't handle it.
It helps that she physically gags, before unschooling came into our
lives I probably would have ignored her more subtle ways of saying
she doesn't like it. As well, Sam and Dan are both two boys who need
control. They do NOT like someone else in their space telling them
what to do. They have been unschooled a majority of their lives (or
at least, *I* have been more of an unschooler on restrictions and
such, even tho we started unschooling about nine months ago)
So leaving the sunblock and hats on the table by the door and saying
"We're leaving soon, we'll be ready when everyone gets sunblock." Or
maybe if you are very concerned about her medically, she doesn't want
sunblock, you don't go. It sounds very exciting to live right by all
that water and fun sun, but maybe it's not important enough for her?
Maybe take her to the store and let her smell all the different
brands and see if one is better. And I totally agree that she should
be seeing EVERYONE put it on frequently. What about making it part of
a routine? If you could bath her in the am, then have it be a lotion
that she puts on. That gives her some protection for eight hours or
so (if not swimming of course).
After saying "May I put some sunblock on you?" and if she says no,
i'd ask if she wants to do it herself. If she says no again, I would
say "Would you let me know when it's okay to do it?" and then wait.
You could say sunblock is important to our family, and we'll leave
when it on, but that sounds controlling. But if it's medically
necessary, that's better than manhandling her (and easier, sunblock
is slippery lol!)
Good luck, you're family has been through a lot with this.
Melissa
Mom to Josh (11), Breanna (8), Emily (7), Rachel (6), Sam (4), Dan
(2), and Avari Rose
share our lives at
http://360.yahoo.com/multimomma
all very fair skin, blond hair, blue eyes. Fear can't rule your life
though....The good news is that you had preexisting moles that
turned, rather than the creation of new blemishes. That's very
controllable, and less likely to create skin cancer. Hm, that's odd
too because my friend maybe two years ago went thru the bloody moles,
and they removed them and said that the moles were benign, but the
sign of the changing was indicative of too much sun exposure (or
something like that)
What about leaving it down on her level and just hoping that she'll
use it? We have in our family Emily, who is very sensitive to
sunblock, the feel is slimy, the smell is strong. So she really has
to approach it on her own terms. She needs to be strong enough
emotionally and be in control of it, or she really can't handle it.
It helps that she physically gags, before unschooling came into our
lives I probably would have ignored her more subtle ways of saying
she doesn't like it. As well, Sam and Dan are both two boys who need
control. They do NOT like someone else in their space telling them
what to do. They have been unschooled a majority of their lives (or
at least, *I* have been more of an unschooler on restrictions and
such, even tho we started unschooling about nine months ago)
So leaving the sunblock and hats on the table by the door and saying
"We're leaving soon, we'll be ready when everyone gets sunblock." Or
maybe if you are very concerned about her medically, she doesn't want
sunblock, you don't go. It sounds very exciting to live right by all
that water and fun sun, but maybe it's not important enough for her?
Maybe take her to the store and let her smell all the different
brands and see if one is better. And I totally agree that she should
be seeing EVERYONE put it on frequently. What about making it part of
a routine? If you could bath her in the am, then have it be a lotion
that she puts on. That gives her some protection for eight hours or
so (if not swimming of course).
After saying "May I put some sunblock on you?" and if she says no,
i'd ask if she wants to do it herself. If she says no again, I would
say "Would you let me know when it's okay to do it?" and then wait.
You could say sunblock is important to our family, and we'll leave
when it on, but that sounds controlling. But if it's medically
necessary, that's better than manhandling her (and easier, sunblock
is slippery lol!)
Good luck, you're family has been through a lot with this.
Melissa
Mom to Josh (11), Breanna (8), Emily (7), Rachel (6), Sam (4), Dan
(2), and Avari Rose
share our lives at
http://360.yahoo.com/multimomma
On May 12, 2006, at 8:41 AM, Deb Lewis wrote:
>
> ***I feel like I'm abusing her by not using the sunscreen and I
> know I'm
> abusing
> her when we force her to wear it. ***
>
> Let it go. She'll use it when she understands it's a good idea.
> Have
> you let her put it on herself? Have you tried the kind that's a spray
> on. Over time if she sees you using it she may feel like trying
> it. If
> she applies it herself you'll run out sooner, but...<g>
>
> *
Kiersten Pasciak
Wow, the sunscreen issue, we face it every year too.
This year I felt it was my duty to set the example for our family by
purposely not wearing sunscreen and then getting really burned
shoulders and whining about it for days...NOT.
Oh, it happened, but not on purpose!
We also bought powder sunscreen because Emma's skin "burns" when we
put regular sunscreen on, due to her eczema. It is
called "Sunforgetable" by Colorescience. Cheaper on Ebay than
elsewhere. It looks like a retractable makeup brush.
I try to leave lots of extra time before we head out to put
sunscreen on in the house. I tell them it hurts to have a sunburn
and that we have fair skin and might burn. I ask for their help so
we can go sooner. Actually, I ask for their help or cooperation
often.
Get her input on what would help...
Does she want to do it herself?
Would a spray help it go faster?
Is it smell/ feel etc. bothering her?
There are colored lotions that go on purple and then turn clear,
if "fingerpainting" is an option.
Could you stress the importance and then take her to the store to
help pick one out (she could smell and look at them all)?
Even a neat looking bottle might make the difference.
We do insist. I won't purposely let them get burned.
I am not mean about it. I just put it out there that if you want to
go, you need sunscreen today. Let me know when you are ready...
It usually goes faster if I do mine same time and put my shoes on
for that ready to go out the door look :)
Kiersten
--- In [email protected], Deb Lewis <ddzimlew@...>
wrote:
This year I felt it was my duty to set the example for our family by
purposely not wearing sunscreen and then getting really burned
shoulders and whining about it for days...NOT.
Oh, it happened, but not on purpose!
We also bought powder sunscreen because Emma's skin "burns" when we
put regular sunscreen on, due to her eczema. It is
called "Sunforgetable" by Colorescience. Cheaper on Ebay than
elsewhere. It looks like a retractable makeup brush.
I try to leave lots of extra time before we head out to put
sunscreen on in the house. I tell them it hurts to have a sunburn
and that we have fair skin and might burn. I ask for their help so
we can go sooner. Actually, I ask for their help or cooperation
often.
Get her input on what would help...
Does she want to do it herself?
Would a spray help it go faster?
Is it smell/ feel etc. bothering her?
There are colored lotions that go on purple and then turn clear,
if "fingerpainting" is an option.
Could you stress the importance and then take her to the store to
help pick one out (she could smell and look at them all)?
Even a neat looking bottle might make the difference.
We do insist. I won't purposely let them get burned.
I am not mean about it. I just put it out there that if you want to
go, you need sunscreen today. Let me know when you are ready...
It usually goes faster if I do mine same time and put my shoes on
for that ready to go out the door look :)
Kiersten
--- In [email protected], Deb Lewis <ddzimlew@...>
wrote:
>know I'm
>
> ***I feel like I'm abusing her by not using the sunscreen and I
> abusingHave
> her when we force her to wear it. ***
>
> Let it go. She'll use it when she understands it's a good idea.
> you let her put it on herself? Have you tried the kind that's aspray
> on. Over time if she sees you using it she may feel like tryingit. If
> she applies it herself you'll run out sooner, but...<g>it. ***
>
> ***My husband tried to scare her by telling
> her that she might have to go to the hospital if she doesn't wear
>kids and
> My mom tried to plant the fear of the remotely possible in her
> today my mom is a joke to us. Your husband probably wouldn'tlike the
> thought of being a joke to his kids.no
>
> ***That's worse for me than holding her down to apply it.***
>
> Maybe you were exaggerating about holding her down to apply it but
> wonder she hates it! If anyone tried to hold me down and dosomething to
> me I didn't want, boy howdy, they'd be in world of hurt. <g> Doyou
> want a daughter who will let people hold her down and do stuff toher?
>life
>
> Step back and take a deep breath. The most important thing in her
> today is not sun screen or the lack of it. It's you. She needsyou on
> her side. I know it's easy to let fear take you, especially sinceyou've
> had one scare already. Don't let your fear get so big it blocksthe
> view of your daughter.
>
> Deb Lewis
>
Pamela Sorooshian
On May 12, 2006, at 5:01 AM, ohpurple1@... wrote:
z ups to put over the pool so that they can be in there all day, in
the shade. Put your sunscreen on in front of her, happily, enjoying
the smoothness and softness, sniff it and enjoy the smell. Say, "I
LOVE putting on my sunscreen - makes me know a good day is coming!"
I understand you really want to do things out in the sun, but it
sounds like a bad idea for your family, anyway. So, it won't hurt any
of you to take a year off from doing that. In a year, your 2 1/2 yo
will be 3 1/2 and, IF you haven't turned sunscreen and hats into a
major power struggle, will probably just go along because she'll
understand better that you have good reasons for it.
-pam
Unschooling shirts, cups, bumper stickers, bags...
Live Love Learn
UNSCHOOL!
<http://www.cafepress.com/livelovelearn>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> How does one get a two and a half year old to willingly let herDon't go out so much in the middle of the day. Get a couple of big e-
> Mommy apply
> sunscreen or at least keep her hat on?
z ups to put over the pool so that they can be in there all day, in
the shade. Put your sunscreen on in front of her, happily, enjoying
the smoothness and softness, sniff it and enjoy the smell. Say, "I
LOVE putting on my sunscreen - makes me know a good day is coming!"
I understand you really want to do things out in the sun, but it
sounds like a bad idea for your family, anyway. So, it won't hurt any
of you to take a year off from doing that. In a year, your 2 1/2 yo
will be 3 1/2 and, IF you haven't turned sunscreen and hats into a
major power struggle, will probably just go along because she'll
understand better that you have good reasons for it.
-pam
Unschooling shirts, cups, bumper stickers, bags...
Live Love Learn
UNSCHOOL!
<http://www.cafepress.com/livelovelearn>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
>>How does one get a two and a half year old to willingly let her Mommy apply sunscreen or at least keep her hat on?>>Two things immediately come to mind when I read your dilemma.
1. Maybe a poolside/beach lifestyle is not the best for a family of fair skinned, freckled and potentially skin cancer proned individuals. Just a thought.
2. For those times you do go out, have you tried Coppertone Sport rub free spray? It's been a godsend for my sensitive daughter. You spray it on and it's a fine mist. No need to rub at all. I use it on heads and all over. It protects wonderfully and you can spray it on the run with really little ones so there's no need to hold anyone down.
Okay, commercial over. :o)
--
~Mary
http://zenmommasgarden.blogspot.com/
"The miracle is not to walk on water. The miracle is to walk on the
green earth, dwelling deeply in the present moment and feeling truly
alive."
~Thich Nhat Hanh
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: ohpurple1@...
Pampered Chef Michelle
On 5/12/06, zenmomma@... <zenmomma@...> wrote:
I LOVE the beach and I am (and my family is) fair skinned, freckly and
potentially skin cancer prone.
--
Michelle
Independent Kitchen Consultant #413652
The Pampered Chef
850-474-0817
http://www.pamperedchef.biz/michellelr
Ask me how you can save 60% on some of our most favorite products!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>ROFL! Mary, if it weren't for hurricanes I would live right on the water.
> >>How does one get a two and a half year old to willingly let her Mommy
> apply sunscreen or at least keep her hat on?>>
>
> Two things immediately come to mind when I read your dilemma.
>
> 1. Maybe a poolside/beach lifestyle is not the best for a family of fair
> skinned, freckled and potentially skin cancer proned individuals. Just a
> thought.
I LOVE the beach and I am (and my family is) fair skinned, freckly and
potentially skin cancer prone.
--
Michelle
Independent Kitchen Consultant #413652
The Pampered Chef
850-474-0817
http://www.pamperedchef.biz/michellelr
Ask me how you can save 60% on some of our most favorite products!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]