melissazietlow
Hello All,
I posted this on another list, but want to share with you as well,
because your insight has been so helpful to me and I'd like different
perspectives.
It has been suggested to me that forcing children to clean up after
themselves is not respectful or healthy, and that having toys, etc.
picked up is a parent's issue. For some time, we have imposed clean
up time once or twice a day and required the girls (3 & 5yo now) to
put away toys in the living room and throughout the house. Of course,
they have never wanted to do so at any time, and in the past we have
used punishment as an 'incentive' but have decided, after seriously
questioning our lifestyle that we don't want to coerce this any more
either.
Our house is very small and our humble livingroom is the only place
toys can be kept. So it gets out of control to the point that I
cannot stand the clutter/lack of floor and sitting space. If left
unchecked, it spills over into the kitchen and diningroom and starts
to choke out the entire house. At times before we would help the
kids clean up, and try to make the chore a game by singing songs,
etc. Now and then we would get good results, but usually ended up
with two frustrated or angry parents who did most of the work.
At this point, we want good relationships with dds, and are seeing
that perhaps cleaning should be up to us, as we did choose to have
children and provide them with the toys. And a tidy home (key word:
tidy, NOT perfect)is just not a priority that the kids (and not
really to dh, sigh) can understand yet. We have stopped making it a
daily requirement (and I have been trying to let the mess bother me
less) and have been saying, "I would like to get these toys put away
today" instead of "time for you to clean up". Then one or both of us
does the job and casually asks the kids for help. When they refuse
(act deaf) we have been trying to let this go, BUT...I (more so than
dh) still feel, deep down, anger and resentment at times when I
am 'stuck' cleaning up after them while they sit and watch or go
merrily on their way. Hmmm...is this how they felt when I made them
do it alone?
I have been feeling selfish - it really upsets me that I do so much
for the family and no one (not even dh, really, but he tries to keep
the peace)wants to help me take care of things that are important to
me now and then. I have been controlling in the past, so perhaps that
is part of the issue right now, but as we have relaxed our parenting
over the last few months, I wonder is anyone appreciative at
all? I am almost 9 months pregnant and cannot physically keep up
with all that I usually do. I have been skimming the surface and
leaving the toys, but after several days, it needs an overhaul so we
can utilize the house comfortably! I just wanted to cry today as I
was bending over (difficult task) doing it myself again before
company came. It didn't bother anyone else but me.
Help me see the light? Or get my head out of the sand (or at least
above water)? Or do I just need a hormone adjustment?
Melissa Z.
I posted this on another list, but want to share with you as well,
because your insight has been so helpful to me and I'd like different
perspectives.
It has been suggested to me that forcing children to clean up after
themselves is not respectful or healthy, and that having toys, etc.
picked up is a parent's issue. For some time, we have imposed clean
up time once or twice a day and required the girls (3 & 5yo now) to
put away toys in the living room and throughout the house. Of course,
they have never wanted to do so at any time, and in the past we have
used punishment as an 'incentive' but have decided, after seriously
questioning our lifestyle that we don't want to coerce this any more
either.
Our house is very small and our humble livingroom is the only place
toys can be kept. So it gets out of control to the point that I
cannot stand the clutter/lack of floor and sitting space. If left
unchecked, it spills over into the kitchen and diningroom and starts
to choke out the entire house. At times before we would help the
kids clean up, and try to make the chore a game by singing songs,
etc. Now and then we would get good results, but usually ended up
with two frustrated or angry parents who did most of the work.
At this point, we want good relationships with dds, and are seeing
that perhaps cleaning should be up to us, as we did choose to have
children and provide them with the toys. And a tidy home (key word:
tidy, NOT perfect)is just not a priority that the kids (and not
really to dh, sigh) can understand yet. We have stopped making it a
daily requirement (and I have been trying to let the mess bother me
less) and have been saying, "I would like to get these toys put away
today" instead of "time for you to clean up". Then one or both of us
does the job and casually asks the kids for help. When they refuse
(act deaf) we have been trying to let this go, BUT...I (more so than
dh) still feel, deep down, anger and resentment at times when I
am 'stuck' cleaning up after them while they sit and watch or go
merrily on their way. Hmmm...is this how they felt when I made them
do it alone?
I have been feeling selfish - it really upsets me that I do so much
for the family and no one (not even dh, really, but he tries to keep
the peace)wants to help me take care of things that are important to
me now and then. I have been controlling in the past, so perhaps that
is part of the issue right now, but as we have relaxed our parenting
over the last few months, I wonder is anyone appreciative at
all? I am almost 9 months pregnant and cannot physically keep up
with all that I usually do. I have been skimming the surface and
leaving the toys, but after several days, it needs an overhaul so we
can utilize the house comfortably! I just wanted to cry today as I
was bending over (difficult task) doing it myself again before
company came. It didn't bother anyone else but me.
Help me see the light? Or get my head out of the sand (or at least
above water)? Or do I just need a hormone adjustment?
Melissa Z.
Julie Bogart
--- In [email protected], "melissazietlow" <Zietlowfamily@w...>
wrote:
months pregnancy does make it more difficult to clean up.
Can you just not have anyone over right now? Eliminate the need for a really neat home by
not entertaining.
I am almost 9 months pregnant and cannot physically keep up
and take your time? One of the problems with cleaning when you have little kids is trying
to get things "back to order" quickly before they are in disorder again.
Perhaps you can simply clear a path to walk in, or you can put up toys that have too many
little pieces. You might want to let your kids know that if you are going to keep cleaning
up, then you need to make clean up easier on you by eliminating the number of items to
clean up until your body is smaller and more agile again.
One of the difficulties of removing coercion is that there is a lengthy backlash. Kids will be
so relieved not to "have to" that they don't have empathy for your feelings for a long time.
Modelling and genuine service to them comes first and takes awhile to produce
reciprocity.
Sandra often says to change how you do things: with a smile, with music, with thoughts of
affection for the people you're serving. It really does make a difference.
And when I get overwhelmed with too much to do, I try to remember that I don't have to
do it all right now or really fast. I can wipe up one mess in the refrigerator, not all of them.
I can clear a path in the living room. I can stack the books on the coffee table instead of
hauling them down to the basement. I can throw clean clothes in a lanudry basket and
leave them there for people to sort through when they need clothes.
Lower the demands on yourself while you are finishing up pregnancy.
Julie B
wrote:
>Focus less on how they perceive you amd more on how you can streamline your life. Nine
> I have been feeling selfish - it really upsets me that I do so much
> for the family and no one (not even dh, really, but he tries to keep
> the peace)wants to help me take care of things that are important to
> me now and then. I have been controlling in the past, so perhaps that
> is part of the issue right now, but as we have relaxed our parenting
> over the last few months, I wonder is anyone appreciative at
> all?
months pregnancy does make it more difficult to clean up.
Can you just not have anyone over right now? Eliminate the need for a really neat home by
not entertaining.
I am almost 9 months pregnant and cannot physically keep up
> with all that I usually do. I have been skimming the surface andHow quickly do yu try to clean up? Can you spread it out? Turn on some music you like
> leaving the toys, but after several days, it needs an overhaul so we
> can utilize the house comfortably! I just wanted to cry today as I
> was bending over (difficult task) doing it myself again before
> company came. It didn't bother anyone else but me.
and take your time? One of the problems with cleaning when you have little kids is trying
to get things "back to order" quickly before they are in disorder again.
Perhaps you can simply clear a path to walk in, or you can put up toys that have too many
little pieces. You might want to let your kids know that if you are going to keep cleaning
up, then you need to make clean up easier on you by eliminating the number of items to
clean up until your body is smaller and more agile again.
>Probably.
> Help me see the light? Or get my head out of the sand (or at least
> above water)? Or do I just need a hormone adjustment?
One of the difficulties of removing coercion is that there is a lengthy backlash. Kids will be
so relieved not to "have to" that they don't have empathy for your feelings for a long time.
Modelling and genuine service to them comes first and takes awhile to produce
reciprocity.
Sandra often says to change how you do things: with a smile, with music, with thoughts of
affection for the people you're serving. It really does make a difference.
And when I get overwhelmed with too much to do, I try to remember that I don't have to
do it all right now or really fast. I can wipe up one mess in the refrigerator, not all of them.
I can clear a path in the living room. I can stack the books on the coffee table instead of
hauling them down to the basement. I can throw clean clothes in a lanudry basket and
leave them there for people to sort through when they need clothes.
Lower the demands on yourself while you are finishing up pregnancy.
Julie B
melissazietlow
--- In [email protected], "Julie Bogart"
<julie@b...> wrote:
don't have empathy for your feelings for a long time. Modelling and
genuine service to them comes first and takes awhile to produce
reciprocity.
Thank you, this helps a lot, and I will try to keep it in the
forefront of my mind.
demands on yourself while you are finishing up pregnancy.
Yes, when I remember/make myself BREATHE (as Sandra has said) all
goes much better.
<julie@b...> wrote:
> One of the difficulties of removing coercion is that there is alengthy backlash. Kids will be so relieved not to "have to" that they
don't have empathy for your feelings for a long time. Modelling and
genuine service to them comes first and takes awhile to produce
reciprocity.
Thank you, this helps a lot, and I will try to keep it in the
forefront of my mind.
> And when I get overwhelmed with too much to do, I try to rememberthat I don't have to do it all right now or really fast. Lower the
demands on yourself while you are finishing up pregnancy.
Yes, when I remember/make myself BREATHE (as Sandra has said) all
goes much better.
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/7/2004 11:23:15 AM Eastern Standard Time,
julie@... writes:
hauling them down to the basement. I can throw clean clothes in a lanudry
basket and
leave them there for people to sort through when they need clothes<<<
*********************************
Another trick I do...I take a big laundry basket from room to room, and
everything that doesn't belong in that room goes into the basket. When I've been
through all the rooms, I tell everyone to come and get their own stuff out of
the basket and put it where it belongs. Then I stick the basket under the
stairs with the remaining stuff and if anyone's looking for their things I say,
"check under the stairs."
I also REALLY enjoy having a day with nothing else to do, sending the kids
someplace fun with my husband, popping in a book on tape, and going from room to
room tossing stuff and cleaning. And it seems if you can do this once every
6 months or so, it's just easier to have some sort of order, and things just
don't get messy as often. With 10 people in our house, this is just a
necessity.
Nancy B.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
julie@... writes:
>>>I can clear a path in the living room. I can stack the books on the coffeetable instead of
hauling them down to the basement. I can throw clean clothes in a lanudry
basket and
leave them there for people to sort through when they need clothes<<<
*********************************
Another trick I do...I take a big laundry basket from room to room, and
everything that doesn't belong in that room goes into the basket. When I've been
through all the rooms, I tell everyone to come and get their own stuff out of
the basket and put it where it belongs. Then I stick the basket under the
stairs with the remaining stuff and if anyone's looking for their things I say,
"check under the stairs."
I also REALLY enjoy having a day with nothing else to do, sending the kids
someplace fun with my husband, popping in a book on tape, and going from room to
room tossing stuff and cleaning. And it seems if you can do this once every
6 months or so, it's just easier to have some sort of order, and things just
don't get messy as often. With 10 people in our house, this is just a
necessity.
Nancy B.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
the_clevengers
--- In [email protected], "Julie Bogart"
<julie@b...> wrote:
the floor into there at the end of each day. I have one in my bedroom
too (which, for some reason, seems to accumulate the kid's stuff :).
The one in my bedroom is a large picnic hamper, with the flaps that
fold down over the basket part. It looks very cute and neat, even
jammed full of toys :-) When either basket gets too full, they just
get taken upstairs and dumped back into the kids' toy bin - if the
kids feel like sorting them into various places, they can. Makes
cleanups pretty darned quick and painless.
Blue Skies,
-Robin-
<julie@b...> wrote:
> I am almost 9 months pregnant and cannot physically keep upwe
> > with all that I usually do. I have been skimming the surface and
> > leaving the toys, but after several days, it needs an overhaul so
> > can utilize the house comfortably!We keep a big basket in our living room and just throw the toys from
the floor into there at the end of each day. I have one in my bedroom
too (which, for some reason, seems to accumulate the kid's stuff :).
The one in my bedroom is a large picnic hamper, with the flaps that
fold down over the basket part. It looks very cute and neat, even
jammed full of toys :-) When either basket gets too full, they just
get taken upstairs and dumped back into the kids' toy bin - if the
kids feel like sorting them into various places, they can. Makes
cleanups pretty darned quick and painless.
Blue Skies,
-Robin-
[email protected]
--- In [email protected], "melissazietlow"
<Zietlowfamily@w...>
wrote:
I have been controlling in the past, so perhaps that
In a message dated 6/7/2004 11:21:53 AM Eastern Standard Time,
julie@... wrote:
************************************************************
I think when your motivation is being driven by what everyone else is
thinking instead of by the pure delight of living this way there is a tendency
towards martyrdom. And nobody cares too much for a martyr.
If you aren't doing this as much for you as you are for them, take another
look.
Life is challenging for you now and will probably be even more so in the
months to come. Try to relax and do what you can when you can, but realize
everyone has limits.
Ask for help but don't necessarily expect it. Take what you can, be grateful
and breathe....
Linda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<Zietlowfamily@w...>
wrote:
I have been controlling in the past, so perhaps that
> is part of the issue right now, but as we have relaxed our parentingAnd then --------
> over the last few months, I wonder is anyone appreciative at
> all?
In a message dated 6/7/2004 11:21:53 AM Eastern Standard Time,
julie@... wrote:
************************************************************
I think when your motivation is being driven by what everyone else is
thinking instead of by the pure delight of living this way there is a tendency
towards martyrdom. And nobody cares too much for a martyr.
If you aren't doing this as much for you as you are for them, take another
look.
Life is challenging for you now and will probably be even more so in the
months to come. Try to relax and do what you can when you can, but realize
everyone has limits.
Ask for help but don't necessarily expect it. Take what you can, be grateful
and breathe....
Linda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]