Controlling Food and TV and whatever...
Andrea Burlingame
Hi all,
I just want to say thank you for all the thoughtful responses to my posts. I was so happy to find these when I got up this morning. A lightbulb is coming on and I can see that I need to take a leap of faith with regards to my children and the choices they need to be able to make for themselves. I get the bicycle analogy. I won't know until I just let go, give it more than a try and see what happens with my children.
I want to respond to some of the posts in more detail, but my children are up and need me to be with them, so that will have to wait until I have more time. I do have so many questions in my head, but I will try to try things first instead of asking you, "what if" questions.
I do want to tell you about this morning--I'm pleased with the way the morning is going, although I do have some questions in my mind as a result of the way I handled things today. (Also I want to tell you of some successes!) Stella, my 4 yo, got up and after cruising the kitchen said, "Mommy, why are those chocolate chip cookies on the counter?" (This is her round about way to getting to "Can I have one?" I think.) I answered, "Because Sarah (the 10 year old) and I ate some last night and I didn't put them away." Stella didn't say anything, but I could see that she wanted one, but was resisting asking because she thought I would tell her (in possibly an annoyed voice), "Stella, you need to eat something healthy first before eating snack food like this. Let's have breakfast first." or something to that effect. Because I could see that she wanted one, I said, "You look like you'd like one of those." She nodded vigorously. I said, "Go ahead. Would you like something else, too, or just cookies?" She thought about that for awhile and said she wanted "regular breakfast stuff too." I asked her what she wanted for breakfast. She wanted cereal, and I knew that she meant cold, boxed cereal that we seldom have in the house. I said, "We only have hot cereal in the house today. Is that okay?" She said "yes," but I remembered that she had been asking for boiled eggs alot lately, but noone else wanted them, so I haven't made any. I said, "oh, I could also make boiled eggs if you want." At first she said no, but then decided she wanted boiled eggs and no cereal. I said okay and she ate a cookie, then she asked for another cookie. I said, "Yes, if you are still hungry for a cookie."
Now here I have a couple of questtions:
1- How do I subtly let her know the choice is hers, and that I'm not controlling that choice. She is so used to asking me first, and so am I, because I have been the controlling authority. If I am really giving her control over what she eats, then she should just be able to go and eat cookies anytime. Right? So should I say to her, Which leads to another problem for me.
2- I am on a very limited income right now and I have 4 children and myself to feed, and then my husband when he is here on the weekends. So, if, for example, Stella gets up first in the morning after me, which is usually the case, and eats all the cookies, which is pretty much what was happening this morning, not only is there nothing left for anyone else, but I can't afford to keep buying more. I don't really want her just going into the cabinets to get whatever she wants, whenever she wants, because I need to be able to plan meals and meet the needs of all of us. My answer would be to have certain foods that can be accessed anytime, and I usually make sure there is always some fruit and some veggies and some kind of snacky food like pretzels filled with peanut butter or whatever. I can see giving them more choice about what's on hand, but what about the amount they eat? And what if what they want uses up too much of the grocery budget for what it actually offers in both quality and quantity? (ie: Stella really wants me to buy the mixed fruit that is already cut up and in a plastic container that is in the produce section. They want a ridiculous amount of money for that. Not only is it something that would be fresher and more abundant if I just bought the fruit and made it myself, but it would cost less per pound. Still, even after I explain this to her, she still wants that plastic bowl of fruit. If I had more money, I would probably just buy it and let her get it out of her system, but I am truly on a budget. Our family is experiencing some financial difficulties right now. I get so tired of saying no, but I often have to.
I suppose I could just let them eat whatever they want fromt the snack foods and when they are gone, they are gone until the next time I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No" as well. This already happens when I am the one deciding when and how much snack food they get. Sigh...sometimes it is so hard to be aware...I mean, it's easy to be aware, but it hurts my heart sometimes when I can't be exactly how I'd like to be.
Anyway, back to what happened at breakfast this morning:
The other girls, Sarah (10) and Annie (3), woke up and each wanted something different for breakfast. I said that I could do that, but some people would get their food before others, because of cooking times and available pots. I also said that there may be some mornings when I won't feel like cooking so many different things. They understood. Stella wanted boiled eggs and didn't want any hot cereal with it. Annie wanted hot cereal alone. Sarah and I both wanted poached eggs on toast. Evan, the baby who is 1 today, had a combination of all--some cereal, an egg yolk and a bit of toast. It was fun to be able to give everyone what they wanted, and when I started to feel overwhelmed with all their choices (and my worries that it would be like this every morning), I brought myself back to the moment by breathing. It worked amazingly well, and I stayed connected with everyone and with what I was doing. Amazingly everything came out perfectly, AND I even thought of ways to make it easier in the future (putting more eggs in to boil, in case someone else wanted one now or tomorrow morning for example.) Stella ended up wanting hot cereal too after I had already finished making only enough for Annie and the baby (after asking her if she wanted some too), and I told her that she could have a couple of bites of Evan's, and I could make her some for another meal, but I wouldn't make more at that moment, because I was already feeding Evan and juggling the other meals that were still cooking. She seemed okay with that.
Well, I'm not sure why I posted all that. I guess I just want to get feedback and reassurance. I can see that this will take a while to become natural for me. I do tend to want to control things.
~Andrea
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I just want to say thank you for all the thoughtful responses to my posts. I was so happy to find these when I got up this morning. A lightbulb is coming on and I can see that I need to take a leap of faith with regards to my children and the choices they need to be able to make for themselves. I get the bicycle analogy. I won't know until I just let go, give it more than a try and see what happens with my children.
I want to respond to some of the posts in more detail, but my children are up and need me to be with them, so that will have to wait until I have more time. I do have so many questions in my head, but I will try to try things first instead of asking you, "what if" questions.
I do want to tell you about this morning--I'm pleased with the way the morning is going, although I do have some questions in my mind as a result of the way I handled things today. (Also I want to tell you of some successes!) Stella, my 4 yo, got up and after cruising the kitchen said, "Mommy, why are those chocolate chip cookies on the counter?" (This is her round about way to getting to "Can I have one?" I think.) I answered, "Because Sarah (the 10 year old) and I ate some last night and I didn't put them away." Stella didn't say anything, but I could see that she wanted one, but was resisting asking because she thought I would tell her (in possibly an annoyed voice), "Stella, you need to eat something healthy first before eating snack food like this. Let's have breakfast first." or something to that effect. Because I could see that she wanted one, I said, "You look like you'd like one of those." She nodded vigorously. I said, "Go ahead. Would you like something else, too, or just cookies?" She thought about that for awhile and said she wanted "regular breakfast stuff too." I asked her what she wanted for breakfast. She wanted cereal, and I knew that she meant cold, boxed cereal that we seldom have in the house. I said, "We only have hot cereal in the house today. Is that okay?" She said "yes," but I remembered that she had been asking for boiled eggs alot lately, but noone else wanted them, so I haven't made any. I said, "oh, I could also make boiled eggs if you want." At first she said no, but then decided she wanted boiled eggs and no cereal. I said okay and she ate a cookie, then she asked for another cookie. I said, "Yes, if you are still hungry for a cookie."
Now here I have a couple of questtions:
1- How do I subtly let her know the choice is hers, and that I'm not controlling that choice. She is so used to asking me first, and so am I, because I have been the controlling authority. If I am really giving her control over what she eats, then she should just be able to go and eat cookies anytime. Right? So should I say to her, Which leads to another problem for me.
2- I am on a very limited income right now and I have 4 children and myself to feed, and then my husband when he is here on the weekends. So, if, for example, Stella gets up first in the morning after me, which is usually the case, and eats all the cookies, which is pretty much what was happening this morning, not only is there nothing left for anyone else, but I can't afford to keep buying more. I don't really want her just going into the cabinets to get whatever she wants, whenever she wants, because I need to be able to plan meals and meet the needs of all of us. My answer would be to have certain foods that can be accessed anytime, and I usually make sure there is always some fruit and some veggies and some kind of snacky food like pretzels filled with peanut butter or whatever. I can see giving them more choice about what's on hand, but what about the amount they eat? And what if what they want uses up too much of the grocery budget for what it actually offers in both quality and quantity? (ie: Stella really wants me to buy the mixed fruit that is already cut up and in a plastic container that is in the produce section. They want a ridiculous amount of money for that. Not only is it something that would be fresher and more abundant if I just bought the fruit and made it myself, but it would cost less per pound. Still, even after I explain this to her, she still wants that plastic bowl of fruit. If I had more money, I would probably just buy it and let her get it out of her system, but I am truly on a budget. Our family is experiencing some financial difficulties right now. I get so tired of saying no, but I often have to.
I suppose I could just let them eat whatever they want fromt the snack foods and when they are gone, they are gone until the next time I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No" as well. This already happens when I am the one deciding when and how much snack food they get. Sigh...sometimes it is so hard to be aware...I mean, it's easy to be aware, but it hurts my heart sometimes when I can't be exactly how I'd like to be.
Anyway, back to what happened at breakfast this morning:
The other girls, Sarah (10) and Annie (3), woke up and each wanted something different for breakfast. I said that I could do that, but some people would get their food before others, because of cooking times and available pots. I also said that there may be some mornings when I won't feel like cooking so many different things. They understood. Stella wanted boiled eggs and didn't want any hot cereal with it. Annie wanted hot cereal alone. Sarah and I both wanted poached eggs on toast. Evan, the baby who is 1 today, had a combination of all--some cereal, an egg yolk and a bit of toast. It was fun to be able to give everyone what they wanted, and when I started to feel overwhelmed with all their choices (and my worries that it would be like this every morning), I brought myself back to the moment by breathing. It worked amazingly well, and I stayed connected with everyone and with what I was doing. Amazingly everything came out perfectly, AND I even thought of ways to make it easier in the future (putting more eggs in to boil, in case someone else wanted one now or tomorrow morning for example.) Stella ended up wanting hot cereal too after I had already finished making only enough for Annie and the baby (after asking her if she wanted some too), and I told her that she could have a couple of bites of Evan's, and I could make her some for another meal, but I wouldn't make more at that moment, because I was already feeding Evan and juggling the other meals that were still cooking. She seemed okay with that.
Well, I'm not sure why I posted all that. I guess I just want to get feedback and reassurance. I can see that this will take a while to become natural for me. I do tend to want to control things.
~Andrea
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mamaaj2000
--- In [email protected], "Andrea Burlingame"
<aburlingame@c...> wrote:
plan meals and meet the needs of all of us.
Stella doesn't exist in a vacuum. If she eats all the cookies,
everyone else tells her they are sad/mad/whatever that she ate all
the cookies. If you are worried about how her siblings will respond,
you just tell her what you're thinking and feeling. It was hard at
first for me to express my thoughts and feelings without trying to
manipulate, but I'm getting better. They are my thoughts and feelings
and I want to be able to share them...sometimes, in some situations.
And what if what they want uses up too much of the grocery budget for
what it actually offers in both quality and quantity? >
I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm
sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No"
as well.
Or it's letting them see the cause and effect. You have to figure out
how much you can spend on groceries and then you can discuss the
different ways of spending it. A few expensive treats that are gone
in a day or lots of inexpensive treats that last until the next
shopping trip. Is one of these options wrong?? I don't think so, tho'
I definitely know which one I'd choose.
Hey, or maybe they'd rather have food treats than...toys
occasionally, or something else you spend money on. Who knows until
you ask??
--aj
<aburlingame@c...> wrote:
> 2- I don't really want her just going into the cabinets to getwhatever she wants, whenever she wants, because I need to be able to
plan meals and meet the needs of all of us.
Stella doesn't exist in a vacuum. If she eats all the cookies,
everyone else tells her they are sad/mad/whatever that she ate all
the cookies. If you are worried about how her siblings will respond,
you just tell her what you're thinking and feeling. It was hard at
first for me to express my thoughts and feelings without trying to
manipulate, but I'm getting better. They are my thoughts and feelings
and I want to be able to share them...sometimes, in some situations.
And what if what they want uses up too much of the grocery budget for
what it actually offers in both quality and quantity? >
> I suppose I could just let them eat whatever they want fromt thesnack foods and when they are gone, they are gone until the next time
I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm
sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No"
as well.
Or it's letting them see the cause and effect. You have to figure out
how much you can spend on groceries and then you can discuss the
different ways of spending it. A few expensive treats that are gone
in a day or lots of inexpensive treats that last until the next
shopping trip. Is one of these options wrong?? I don't think so, tho'
I definitely know which one I'd choose.
Hey, or maybe they'd rather have food treats than...toys
occasionally, or something else you spend money on. Who knows until
you ask??
--aj
Dawn Adams
Andrea writes:
Now here I have a couple of questtions:
1- How do I subtly let her know the choice is hers, and that I'm not controlling that choice. She is so used to asking me first, and so am I, because I have been the controlling authority. If I am really giving her control over what she eats, then she should just be able to go and eat cookies anytime. Right? So should I say to her, Which leads to another problem for me.
2- I am on a very limited income right now and I have 4 children and myself to feed, and then my husband when he is here on the weekends. So, if, for example, Stella gets up first in the morning after me, which is usually the case, and eats all the cookies, which is pretty much what was happening this morning, not only is there nothing left for anyone else, but I can't afford to keep buying more.
I don't really want her just going into the cabinets to get whatever she wants, whenever she wants, because I need to be able to plan meals and meet the needs of all of us.
My answer would be to have certain foods that can be accessed anytime, and I usually make sure there is always some fruit and some veggies and some kind of snacky food like pretzels filled with peanut butter or whatever. I can see giving them more choice about what's on hand, but what about the amount they eat?
And what if what they want uses up too much of the grocery budget fo r what it actually offers in both quality and quantity? (ie: Stella really wants me to buy the mixed fruit that is already cut up and in a plastic container that is in the produce section. They want a ridiculous amount of money for that. Not only is it something that would be fresher and more abundant if I just bought the fruit and made it myself, but it would cost less per pound.
Still, even after I explain this to her, she still wants that plastic bowl of fruit.
If I had more money, I would probably just buy it and let her get it out of her system, but I am truly on a budget. Our family is experiencing some financial difficulties right now. I get so tired of saying no, but I often have to.
I suppose I could just let them eat whatever they want fromt the snack foods and when they are gone, they are gone until the next time I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No" as well. This already happens when I am the one deciding when and how much snack food they get. Sigh...sometimes it is so hard to be aware...I mean, it's easy to be aware, but it hurts my heart sometimes when I can't be exactly how I'd like to be.
Anyway, back to what happened at breakfast this morning:
The other girls, Sarah (10) and Annie (3), woke up and each wanted something different for breakfast. I said that I could do that, but some people would get their food before others, because of cooking times and available pots. I also said that there may be some mornings when I won't feel like cooking so many different things. They understood. Stella wanted boiled eggs and didn't want any hot cereal with it. Annie wanted hot cereal alone. Sarah and I both wanted poached eggs on toast. Evan, the baby who is 1 today, had a combination of all--some cereal, an egg yolk and a bit of toast. It was fun to be able to give everyone what they wanted, and when I started to feel overwhelmed with all their choices (and my worries that it would be like this every morning), I brought myself back to the moment by breathing. It worked amazingly well, and I stayed connected with everyone and with what I was doing. Amazingly everything came out perfectly, AND I even thought of ways to make it easier in the future (putting more eggs in to boil, in case someone else wanted one now or tomorrow morning for example.) Stella ended up wanting hot cereal too after I had already finished making only enough for Annie and the baby (after asking her if she wanted some too), and I told her that she could have a couple of bites of Evan's, and I could make her some for another meal, but I wouldn't make more at that moment, because I was already feeding Evan and juggling the other meals that were still cooking. She seemed okay with that.
Dawn (in NS)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Now here I have a couple of questtions:
1- How do I subtly let her know the choice is hers, and that I'm not controlling that choice. She is so used to asking me first, and so am I, because I have been the controlling authority. If I am really giving her control over what she eats, then she should just be able to go and eat cookies anytime. Right? So should I say to her, Which leads to another problem for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I'd guess I would just say 'sure' for awhile. Someone else will have a better answer than me.
2- I am on a very limited income right now and I have 4 children and myself to feed, and then my husband when he is here on the weekends. So, if, for example, Stella gets up first in the morning after me, which is usually the case, and eats all the cookies, which is pretty much what was happening this morning, not only is there nothing left for anyone else, but I can't afford to keep buying more.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Can you bake them? Cooking, math and Mommy time all rolled up into one activity for Stella.
I don't really want her just going into the cabinets to get whatever she wants, whenever she wants, because I need to be able to plan meals and meet the needs of all of us.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Involves her in the meal planning so she knows what is needed for meals and what's not. And really, she's four. Is her appetite really going to lead her to devour everything you need for meals? :)
My answer would be to have certain foods that can be accessed anytime, and I usually make sure there is always some fruit and some veggies and some kind of snacky food like pretzels filled with peanut butter or whatever. I can see giving them more choice about what's on hand, but what about the amount they eat?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>It's up to them. If they eat all the apples before you have money to replace them let them know that. Have them help you plan the groc. lists.
And what if what they want uses up too much of the grocery budget fo r what it actually offers in both quality and quantity? (ie: Stella really wants me to buy the mixed fruit that is already cut up and in a plastic container that is in the produce section. They want a ridiculous amount of money for that. Not only is it something that would be fresher and more abundant if I just bought the fruit and made it myself, but it would cost less per pound.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>It would also be more fun for Stella if you involve her in making it. If you can't afford the other stuff, let her know.
Still, even after I explain this to her, she still wants that plastic bowl of fruit.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Could you buy it once and then refill that bowl with homemade stuff?
If I had more money, I would probably just buy it and let her get it out of her system, but I am truly on a budget. Our family is experiencing some financial difficulties right now. I get so tired of saying no, but I often have to.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Me too. But they are reasonable no's and come with a reasonable explanation of why I gave them and the offer to consider any solution my children might come up with.
I suppose I could just let them eat whatever they want fromt the snack foods and when they are gone, they are gone until the next time I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No" as well. This already happens when I am the one deciding when and how much snack food they get. Sigh...sometimes it is so hard to be aware...I mean, it's easy to be aware, but it hurts my heart sometimes when I can't be exactly how I'd like to be.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>My daughter is a lot more willing to accept that we don't have something and can't get it right away now that she helps with the groc. list, shopping and such.
Anyway, back to what happened at breakfast this morning:
The other girls, Sarah (10) and Annie (3), woke up and each wanted something different for breakfast. I said that I could do that, but some people would get their food before others, because of cooking times and available pots. I also said that there may be some mornings when I won't feel like cooking so many different things. They understood. Stella wanted boiled eggs and didn't want any hot cereal with it. Annie wanted hot cereal alone. Sarah and I both wanted poached eggs on toast. Evan, the baby who is 1 today, had a combination of all--some cereal, an egg yolk and a bit of toast. It was fun to be able to give everyone what they wanted, and when I started to feel overwhelmed with all their choices (and my worries that it would be like this every morning), I brought myself back to the moment by breathing. It worked amazingly well, and I stayed connected with everyone and with what I was doing. Amazingly everything came out perfectly, AND I even thought of ways to make it easier in the future (putting more eggs in to boil, in case someone else wanted one now or tomorrow morning for example.) Stella ended up wanting hot cereal too after I had already finished making only enough for Annie and the baby (after asking her if she wanted some too), and I told her that she could have a couple of bites of Evan's, and I could make her some for another meal, but I wouldn't make more at that moment, because I was already feeding Evan and juggling the other meals that were still cooking. She seemed okay with that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Maybe in the future you could ask Sarah and even Stella for a hand getting the stuff ready?
Dawn (in NS)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
christy_imnotred
--- In [email protected], "Andrea Burlingame"
<aburlingame@c...> wrote:
so am I, because I have been the controlling authority. If I am
really giving her control over what she eats, then she should just be
able to go and eat cookies anytime. Right? So should I say to her,
Which leads to another problem for me.
I would start by just saying yes more, or offering things you know
they like but are usually restricted. My son still asks most of the
time before he eats something and he has never been restricted. I
guess usually he wants me to get it for him. He has just recently
started helping himself to stuff out of the refrigerator.
weekends. So, if, for example, Stella gets up first in the morning
after me, which is usually the case, and eats all the cookies, which
is pretty much what was happening this morning, not only is there
nothing left for anyone else, but I can't afford to keep buying
more.
We go to Costco once a month and get a few things my son really
likes, like Gogurt and bagel dogs. He can eat as much of those as he
wants in a given day, but when they are gone he has to wait until the
next time we go to Costco to get more. I've explained it to him and
he understands. If he chooses to eat all the Gogurts in a week, I
just tell him we are out and won't get more until the next time we go
to Costco. He is disappointed but he does understand. Usually he
will eat a lot of whatever we got the first few days after we shop
and then he will slow down on eating them.
Christy
<aburlingame@c...> wrote:
> Now here I have a couple of questtions:not controlling that choice. She is so used to asking me first, and
>
> 1- How do I subtly let her know the choice is hers, and that I'm
so am I, because I have been the controlling authority. If I am
really giving her control over what she eats, then she should just be
able to go and eat cookies anytime. Right? So should I say to her,
Which leads to another problem for me.
I would start by just saying yes more, or offering things you know
they like but are usually restricted. My son still asks most of the
time before he eats something and he has never been restricted. I
guess usually he wants me to get it for him. He has just recently
started helping himself to stuff out of the refrigerator.
> 2- I am on a very limited income right now and I have 4 childrenand myself to feed, and then my husband when he is here on the
weekends. So, if, for example, Stella gets up first in the morning
after me, which is usually the case, and eats all the cookies, which
is pretty much what was happening this morning, not only is there
nothing left for anyone else, but I can't afford to keep buying
more.
We go to Costco once a month and get a few things my son really
likes, like Gogurt and bagel dogs. He can eat as much of those as he
wants in a given day, but when they are gone he has to wait until the
next time we go to Costco to get more. I've explained it to him and
he understands. If he chooses to eat all the Gogurts in a week, I
just tell him we are out and won't get more until the next time we go
to Costco. He is disappointed but he does understand. Usually he
will eat a lot of whatever we got the first few days after we shop
and then he will slow down on eating them.
Christy
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/4/04 1:51:52 PM, mamaaj2000@... writes:
<< I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm
sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No"
as well. >>
The "no" that is a problem is when the cookies are sitting right there and
the mom says no. It's impossible for a child to eat what's not there, so it's
not the same kind of "no."
Sandra
<< I can stock up, but then I have to spend several days saying, "I'm
sorry, but we are out of that right now." This is essentially "No"
as well. >>
The "no" that is a problem is when the cookies are sitting right there and
the mom says no. It's impossible for a child to eat what's not there, so it's
not the same kind of "no."
Sandra
pam sorooshian
On Jun 4, 2004, at 12:00 PM, Andrea Burlingame wrote:
close to the edge of the counter or put them on a table so my daughter
could have all she wanted. BUT - I'd also have pulled out another plate
and said, "How many shall we make sure to save for other people? Let's
see, maybe 2 for your sister and 2 for your brother and 2 for dad and 2
for me, for later?"
And the kitchen cupboards NOT open to everybody in the family to find
whatever they might want to eat? That's odd, to me. Maybe you can put
the things you're planning to use for specific meals all in a certain
cupboard and leave the rest of the cupboards open to all? Or they could
just ask, "Mom? Are you planning to use the baked beans or can I have
them now?" Couldn't they?
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> I do tend to want to control things.I could hear that in your description. I'd have pulled the cookies
close to the edge of the counter or put them on a table so my daughter
could have all she wanted. BUT - I'd also have pulled out another plate
and said, "How many shall we make sure to save for other people? Let's
see, maybe 2 for your sister and 2 for your brother and 2 for dad and 2
for me, for later?"
And the kitchen cupboards NOT open to everybody in the family to find
whatever they might want to eat? That's odd, to me. Maybe you can put
the things you're planning to use for specific meals all in a certain
cupboard and leave the rest of the cupboards open to all? Or they could
just ask, "Mom? Are you planning to use the baked beans or can I have
them now?" Couldn't they?
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
Andrea Burlingame
On Jun 4, 2004, at 12:00 PM, Andrea Burlingame wrote:
have all she wanted. After she had eaten 2or 3, I said, "Annie and Sarah
might want cookies too when they wake up and there are 5 left." She left 3
for them on her own. Also, and this surprized me, she left more than half
of the last one she started eating, and told me, without my asking, that she
was tired of eating cookies. (!!) She ate it a little while later when the
other girls ate some cookies, but still, I was a little surprized to see her
stop when she felt full. In the recent past, she hasn't done that. If she
was "allotted a certain amount of some sugary treat, she would eat it all
even if she was full. She's actually told me, "I'm really kind of full,
Mommy, but I don't want to miss out of this ice cream." or something to
that effect. Thinking about that now, I can see that she felt like she
might not get it again soon, so she ate it up. Already even a little
freedom with regards to sugar has made her a little less greedy about it!
While I expect it will take some time before she no longer feels that threat
of missing out on something, I do have hope that she will eventually eat
only when she is hungry.
want to eat, I hadn't thought about this. I cook mostly from scratch and I
don't buy a lot of "ready to pop in your mouth" kind of foods that would be
easy to eat, except for fruit and things like baby carrots (and they have
full access to these anytime and they know it), so what usually happens is
they will ask me to make popcorn, for instance, or cook some other
particular meal they like, like the boxed macaroni and cheese, which is
something I wouldn't really choose, but that they like, so I keep it on hand
most of the time. They couldn't even reach the cabinets where the food is
in this house, except by climbing on the counters. I think at their age,
it's fine for them to just ask me to get something down. My older son, who
is fifteen and who now lives with his dad, always had full access to the
food once he could get inside the cabinets, now that I think about it.
(Actually, I was so much more relaxed about everything with him....I was
young and didn't worry about much. He was one really mellow boy. We lived
in a cabin in Homer, AK where I chopped wood for heat and hauled my own
water. We went to the beach all the time, where we were surrounded by
mountains and glaciers across Kachemak Bay, and seals popped out of the
water to look at us. It was a pretty charmed existence, even though there
were some rough patches. I was just WAY more energetic. Hmmm...and I had
healthier teeth and weighed less...and I had no pain in my joints. Hey!
HOW did I get from there to here?! <g>)
>On Saturday, June 05, 2004 1:45 AM, pam sorooshian replied:
> > I do tend to want to control things.
> I could hear that in your description. I'd have pulled the cookiesActually, I did leave the cookies where she could reach them and
> close to the edge of the counter or put them on a table so my daughter
> could have all she wanted. BUT - I'd also have pulled out another plate
> and said, "How many shall we make sure to save for other people? Let's
> see, maybe 2 for your sister and 2 for your brother and 2 for dad and 2
> for me, for later?"
have all she wanted. After she had eaten 2or 3, I said, "Annie and Sarah
might want cookies too when they wake up and there are 5 left." She left 3
for them on her own. Also, and this surprized me, she left more than half
of the last one she started eating, and told me, without my asking, that she
was tired of eating cookies. (!!) She ate it a little while later when the
other girls ate some cookies, but still, I was a little surprized to see her
stop when she felt full. In the recent past, she hasn't done that. If she
was "allotted a certain amount of some sugary treat, she would eat it all
even if she was full. She's actually told me, "I'm really kind of full,
Mommy, but I don't want to miss out of this ice cream." or something to
that effect. Thinking about that now, I can see that she felt like she
might not get it again soon, so she ate it up. Already even a little
freedom with regards to sugar has made her a little less greedy about it!
While I expect it will take some time before she no longer feels that threat
of missing out on something, I do have hope that she will eventually eat
only when she is hungry.
> And the kitchen cupboards NOT open to everybody in the family to findSince we have so few things in the cupboards that my young children would
> whatever they might want to eat? That's odd, to me. Maybe you can put
> the things you're planning to use for specific meals all in a certain
> cupboard and leave the rest of the cupboards open to all? Or they could
> just ask, "Mom? Are you planning to use the baked beans or can I have
> them now?" Couldn't they?
want to eat, I hadn't thought about this. I cook mostly from scratch and I
don't buy a lot of "ready to pop in your mouth" kind of foods that would be
easy to eat, except for fruit and things like baby carrots (and they have
full access to these anytime and they know it), so what usually happens is
they will ask me to make popcorn, for instance, or cook some other
particular meal they like, like the boxed macaroni and cheese, which is
something I wouldn't really choose, but that they like, so I keep it on hand
most of the time. They couldn't even reach the cabinets where the food is
in this house, except by climbing on the counters. I think at their age,
it's fine for them to just ask me to get something down. My older son, who
is fifteen and who now lives with his dad, always had full access to the
food once he could get inside the cabinets, now that I think about it.
(Actually, I was so much more relaxed about everything with him....I was
young and didn't worry about much. He was one really mellow boy. We lived
in a cabin in Homer, AK where I chopped wood for heat and hauled my own
water. We went to the beach all the time, where we were surrounded by
mountains and glaciers across Kachemak Bay, and seals popped out of the
water to look at us. It was a pretty charmed existence, even though there
were some rough patches. I was just WAY more energetic. Hmmm...and I had
healthier teeth and weighed less...and I had no pain in my joints. Hey!
HOW did I get from there to here?! <g>)
pam sorooshian
On Jun 5, 2004, at 7:54 AM, Andrea Burlingame wrote:
eat another brownie now, just because they are available, that there
will be something yummy available again, next time I really want it.
This very obviously comes from having had food restrictions as a child
and therefore wanting to eat whatever is available WHEN it is
available.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> She's actually told me, "I'm really kind of full,At 52 years old, I have to REPEATEDLY tell myself that I do NOT have to
> Mommy, but I don't want to miss out of this ice cream." or something
> to
> that effect. Thinking about that now, I can see that she felt like she
> might not get it again soon, so she ate it up.
eat another brownie now, just because they are available, that there
will be something yummy available again, next time I really want it.
This very obviously comes from having had food restrictions as a child
and therefore wanting to eat whatever is available WHEN it is
available.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/5/2004 11:45:10 PM Eastern Standard Time,
pamsoroosh@... writes:
an adult I learned to eat much more than necessary because I feel like I never
had the choice as a kid. It's funny how kids seem to eat when they are
hungry and adults tend to eat just because.
Pamela
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
pamsoroosh@... writes:
> This very obviously comes from having had food restrictions as a childThat's what I was asking in my post awhile back. I think that too. That as
> and therefore wanting to eat whatever is available WHEN it is
> available.
an adult I learned to eat much more than necessary because I feel like I never
had the choice as a kid. It's funny how kids seem to eat when they are
hungry and adults tend to eat just because.
Pamela
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
pamsoroosh@... writes:
programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even an
completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful help
learning to cope with it.
Which probably means it'll be that much harder to handle for a shamed
or punished child. JJ
http://www.time.com/time/2004/obesity/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > She's actually told me, "I'm really kind of full,The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -
> > Mommy, but I don't want to miss out of this ice cream." or something
> > to
> > that effect. Thinking about that now, I can see that she felt like she
> > might not get it again soon, so she ate it up.
>
> At 52 years old, I have to REPEATEDLY tell myself that I do NOT have to
> eat another brownie now, just because they are available, that there
> will be something yummy available again, next time I really want it.
>
> This very obviously comes from having had food restrictions as a child
> and therefore wanting to eat whatever is available WHEN it is
> available.
>
>
programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even an
completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful help
learning to cope with it.
Which probably means it'll be that much harder to handle for a shamed
or punished child. JJ
http://www.time.com/time/2004/obesity/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Fetteroll
on 6/6/04 8:31 AM, jrossedd@... at jrossedd@... wrote:
fear that they can't easily get more (or more in the near future when mom
goes shopping again) why would they end up with the urge to eat more than
they need? And I'm not seeing anyone saying that happens with 4 yos who have
the freedom to regulate what they eat.
Joyce
> The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -If a 4 yo is confident they can eat as much as they want without a sense of
> programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even an
> completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful
> help
> learning to cope with it.
fear that they can't easily get more (or more in the near future when mom
goes shopping again) why would they end up with the urge to eat more than
they need? And I'm not seeing anyone saying that happens with 4 yos who have
the freedom to regulate what they eat.
Joyce
[email protected]
In a message dated 06/06/2004 9:27:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
fetteroll@... writes:
nurture.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
fetteroll@... writes:
> on 6/6/04 8:31 AM, jrossedd@... at jrossedd@... wrote:For me what works is to consider all I can learn about both nature and
>
> > The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -
> > programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even
> an
> > completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful
> > help
> > learning to cope with it.
>
> If a 4 yo is confident they can eat as much as they want without a sense of
> fear that they can't easily get more (or more in the near future when mom
> goes shopping again) why would they end up with the urge to eat more than
> they need? And I'm not seeing anyone saying that happens with 4 yos who have
> the freedom to regulate what they eat.
>
> Joyce
>
nurture.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/6/04 7:15:31 AM, jrossedd@... writes:
<< The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -
programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even an
completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful
help
learning to cope with it. >>
Did they have any test groups where food was plentiful but not limited or
forced?
I'm kinda guessing "no."
We're doing something that I don't think has been done every before. I could
be wrong, but I think this idea of food-freedom for kids is quite new. I
first read about it in Mothering Magazine, mid-80's. Does anyone know who wrote
that article? I gave all my issues away in box one day to a parenting
library.
I grew up with food being rationed out, counted, measured. It was no fun.
When I left home, I ate for comfort, I ate to reward myself, I ate if I was sad.
The other day I was helping Holly pack for a camping trip and was
recommending maybe she take some snacks in her stuff to have in her own tent, in case she
got stressed.
I said it without even thinking. She said, "I eat when I'm stressed?!"
She thought I was being mindful and observant. No, I was running at the
mouth without a filter.
I said, "No, you don't. I guess sometimes *I* do," and I laughed.
She really doesn't eat when she's stressed. She doesn't reward herself with
food. She doesn't eat lots in case it will be gone later.
Sandra
<< The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -
programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even an
completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful
help
learning to cope with it. >>
Did they have any test groups where food was plentiful but not limited or
forced?
I'm kinda guessing "no."
We're doing something that I don't think has been done every before. I could
be wrong, but I think this idea of food-freedom for kids is quite new. I
first read about it in Mothering Magazine, mid-80's. Does anyone know who wrote
that article? I gave all my issues away in box one day to a parenting
library.
I grew up with food being rationed out, counted, measured. It was no fun.
When I left home, I ate for comfort, I ate to reward myself, I ate if I was sad.
The other day I was helping Holly pack for a camping trip and was
recommending maybe she take some snacks in her stuff to have in her own tent, in case she
got stressed.
I said it without even thinking. She said, "I eat when I'm stressed?!"
She thought I was being mindful and observant. No, I was running at the
mouth without a filter.
I said, "No, you don't. I guess sometimes *I* do," and I laughed.
She really doesn't eat when she's stressed. She doesn't reward herself with
food. She doesn't eat lots in case it will be gone later.
Sandra
the_clevengers
--- In [email protected], jrossedd@a... wrote:
they need/want, and haven't at any age. But I'm also thinking that a
child overeating (not through anything the parents have taught it) is
not outside the range of possibilities. A few years back, we had a
dog that would overeat, which was always so surprising to me. With
all of the other dogs I've ever had in my life, you could put a big
bowl of food out, and they would just eat as much as they needed to,
but this dog just didn't seem to have any internal shut-off
mechanism. She would literally eat herself sick. We also had to pick
up all the green apples that fell off of our apple tree because she
would eat *those* until she got really sick to her stomach. She would
eat blackberries too, picking them off with her teeth. I've only met
one other dog like that, and this other one is worse. It eats rocks
and other weird stuff. Just as with these dogs, I do think that
occasionally, from time to time, it's possible for people to exist
who just don't have whatever it takes to regulate their eating.
People are also born without eyes or legs, or the ability to speak,
or whatever, so I can't imagine it would be impossible. Unlikely yes,
impossible no. I think it's important to remember that all the advice
on this list is just anecdotal - it's what works with our kids, it's
what we've seen and what we describe from our personal experience. It
will most likely work with most kids out there. I'm not convinced
that any one piece of advice will work for everyone. It's quite
possible that there are kids out there who will not self-regulate
their eating. I've never met one, but it's totally possible.
Blue Skies,
-Robin-
> > If a 4 yo is confident they can eat as much as they want withouta sense of
> > fear that they can't easily get more (or more in the near futurewhen mom
> > goes shopping again) why would they end up with the urge to eatmore than
> > they need? And I'm not seeing anyone saying that happens with 4yos who have
> > the freedom to regulate what they eat.I'm not saying you're wrong, Joyce. Neither of my kids eats more than
they need/want, and haven't at any age. But I'm also thinking that a
child overeating (not through anything the parents have taught it) is
not outside the range of possibilities. A few years back, we had a
dog that would overeat, which was always so surprising to me. With
all of the other dogs I've ever had in my life, you could put a big
bowl of food out, and they would just eat as much as they needed to,
but this dog just didn't seem to have any internal shut-off
mechanism. She would literally eat herself sick. We also had to pick
up all the green apples that fell off of our apple tree because she
would eat *those* until she got really sick to her stomach. She would
eat blackberries too, picking them off with her teeth. I've only met
one other dog like that, and this other one is worse. It eats rocks
and other weird stuff. Just as with these dogs, I do think that
occasionally, from time to time, it's possible for people to exist
who just don't have whatever it takes to regulate their eating.
People are also born without eyes or legs, or the ability to speak,
or whatever, so I can't imagine it would be impossible. Unlikely yes,
impossible no. I think it's important to remember that all the advice
on this list is just anecdotal - it's what works with our kids, it's
what we've seen and what we describe from our personal experience. It
will most likely work with most kids out there. I'm not convinced
that any one piece of advice will work for everyone. It's quite
possible that there are kids out there who will not self-regulate
their eating. I've never met one, but it's totally possible.
Blue Skies,
-Robin-
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/6/04 10:12:21 AM, tri_mom@... writes:
<< Just as with these dogs, I do think that
occasionally, from time to time, it's possible for people to exist
who just don't have whatever it takes to regulate their eating. >>
This is an example of "the exception proves the rule."
Because most dogs are NOT that way, because most people are NOT that way, it
means most people are the other way.
-=-I think it's important to remember that all the advice
on this list is just anecdotal - it's what works with our kids, it's
what we've seen and what we describe from our personal experience. It
will most likely work with most kids out there. I'm not convinced
that any one piece of advice will work for everyone.-=-
I agree. The mainstream advice doesn't work for everyone either, but works
for lots (depending on the criteria an individual uses to agree to "works"),
and school works for some but not all.
So we're offering alternatives and reports of success with alternatives.
This, Newsweek, CNN, BBC news, church, channeling, vision quests... NOTHING
should take the place of thinking. Ever. Not even a little bit.
-=-It's quite
possible that there are kids out there who will not self-regulate
their eating.-=-
There are kids out there who are stone deaf, but I will continue to play
music at my house.
Sandra
<< Just as with these dogs, I do think that
occasionally, from time to time, it's possible for people to exist
who just don't have whatever it takes to regulate their eating. >>
This is an example of "the exception proves the rule."
Because most dogs are NOT that way, because most people are NOT that way, it
means most people are the other way.
-=-I think it's important to remember that all the advice
on this list is just anecdotal - it's what works with our kids, it's
what we've seen and what we describe from our personal experience. It
will most likely work with most kids out there. I'm not convinced
that any one piece of advice will work for everyone.-=-
I agree. The mainstream advice doesn't work for everyone either, but works
for lots (depending on the criteria an individual uses to agree to "works"),
and school works for some but not all.
So we're offering alternatives and reports of success with alternatives.
This, Newsweek, CNN, BBC news, church, channeling, vision quests... NOTHING
should take the place of thinking. Ever. Not even a little bit.
-=-It's quite
possible that there are kids out there who will not self-regulate
their eating.-=-
There are kids out there who are stone deaf, but I will continue to play
music at my house.
Sandra
[email protected]
Sandra to JJ:
<< The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -
programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even a
completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful
help learning to cope with it. >>
Did they have any test groups where food was plentiful but not limited or
forced?
I'm kinda guessing "no."
We're doing something that I don't think has been done every before. I could
be wrong, but I think this idea of food-freedom for kids is quite new. I
first read about it in Mothering Magazine, mid-80's.
I know almost nothing about it, but I'm interested in learning more.
The summit just ended Friday and seems to be news; it was being discussed on
NPR today as our family went to see the new Harry Potter. The movie made me cry
btw, but everything does these days -- that's another story. <grin>
Because this list was speaking particularly of four-year-olds, it was
odd to hear one participant -- the author of a book called "Fatland" I think
-- say that obesity research shows a difference between age three and age five!
I didn't hear anything about limits or conditioning either way, just that
three-year-olds naturally self-regulate when food is plentiful (stop when full)
but five-year-olds keep eating past that point.
The clear implication from what I heard was that the research keyed in
on some developmental change at about age four, not any conditioning effect
of limits or plenty.
As I said, I don't know much but I'd love to know more about this or
anything that might contradict it, from Mothering Magazine or elsewhere.
But I can't imagine any research finding that would nullify the value
of what unschoolers here have experienced and advised! Or the importance of
each person thinking through any research, idea, story or advice in the context
of one's own family and unschooling. Nothing I post is meant any other way. :)
JJ
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<< The Summit on Obesity this week called this response evolutionary -
programmed into us as a species for prehistoric survival. So it seems even a
completely unrestricted four-year-old may feel this urge, and need mindful
help learning to cope with it. >>
Did they have any test groups where food was plentiful but not limited or
forced?
I'm kinda guessing "no."
We're doing something that I don't think has been done every before. I could
be wrong, but I think this idea of food-freedom for kids is quite new. I
first read about it in Mothering Magazine, mid-80's.
I know almost nothing about it, but I'm interested in learning more.
The summit just ended Friday and seems to be news; it was being discussed on
NPR today as our family went to see the new Harry Potter. The movie made me cry
btw, but everything does these days -- that's another story. <grin>
Because this list was speaking particularly of four-year-olds, it was
odd to hear one participant -- the author of a book called "Fatland" I think
-- say that obesity research shows a difference between age three and age five!
I didn't hear anything about limits or conditioning either way, just that
three-year-olds naturally self-regulate when food is plentiful (stop when full)
but five-year-olds keep eating past that point.
The clear implication from what I heard was that the research keyed in
on some developmental change at about age four, not any conditioning effect
of limits or plenty.
As I said, I don't know much but I'd love to know more about this or
anything that might contradict it, from Mothering Magazine or elsewhere.
But I can't imagine any research finding that would nullify the value
of what unschoolers here have experienced and advised! Or the importance of
each person thinking through any research, idea, story or advice in the context
of one's own family and unschooling. Nothing I post is meant any other way. :)
JJ
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/6/2004 5:01:13 PM Mountain Daylight Time,
jrossedd@... writes:
The clear implication from what I heard was that the research keyed in
on some developmental change at about age four, not any conditioning effect
of limits or plenty.
==============
If they don't have controlled test groups, they're just observing the
prevailing culture,aren't they?
Even if it was cross-cultural, many cultures are not living with plenty.
And those with more food tend toward controlling when, where and how much to
eat.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jrossedd@... writes:
The clear implication from what I heard was that the research keyed in
on some developmental change at about age four, not any conditioning effect
of limits or plenty.
==============
If they don't have controlled test groups, they're just observing the
prevailing culture,aren't they?
Even if it was cross-cultural, many cultures are not living with plenty.
And those with more food tend toward controlling when, where and how much to
eat.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/6/2004 7:01:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jrossedd@... writes:
I didn't hear anything about limits or conditioning either way, just that
three-year-olds naturally self-regulate when food is plentiful (stop when
full)
but five-year-olds keep eating past that point.
<<<<<<
Sounds as if the children had started attending school at four! <G>
Eat breakfast---FAST, because the bus will be here any minute.
Snacktime at 10:00, whether you're hungry or not.
Lunch at 12:00, whether you're hungry or not----and NO talking! Lunch is NOT
a time for socialization; it's a time to eat----and you only have twenty
minutes, anyway, so EAT!
Supper at 6:00 with the family because it's the time to reconnect with Dad,
whom you haven't seen all day. Clean your plate---or no dessert.
I don't know. I think it's an imposed reality, not a natural one.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jrossedd@... writes:
I didn't hear anything about limits or conditioning either way, just that
three-year-olds naturally self-regulate when food is plentiful (stop when
full)
but five-year-olds keep eating past that point.
<<<<<<
Sounds as if the children had started attending school at four! <G>
Eat breakfast---FAST, because the bus will be here any minute.
Snacktime at 10:00, whether you're hungry or not.
Lunch at 12:00, whether you're hungry or not----and NO talking! Lunch is NOT
a time for socialization; it's a time to eat----and you only have twenty
minutes, anyway, so EAT!
Supper at 6:00 with the family because it's the time to reconnect with Dad,
whom you haven't seen all day. Clean your plate---or no dessert.
I don't know. I think it's an imposed reality, not a natural one.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
JJ wrote:
<<<<< The movie made me cry btw, but everything does these days --
that's another story. <grin>
insight!) <eg>
<<<<< but five-year-olds keep eating past that point. >>>>>
School?
Mercedes
who has hot flashes and continues eating when full. . . .
<<<<< The movie made me cry btw, but everything does these days --
that's another story. <grin>
>>>>>So, JJ, are you also having hot flashes? (and I don't mean of
insight!) <eg>
<<<<< but five-year-olds keep eating past that point. >>>>>
School?
Mercedes
who has hot flashes and continues eating when full. . . .
[email protected]
Andrea writes:
***** She is so used to asking me first, and so am I, because I have
been the controlling authority. If I am really giving her control
over what she eats, then she should just be able to go and eat
cookies anytime. *****
In the archives is a really sweet post by, I think, Brenda (who lived
in Germany but doesn't post anymore.)
She said (paraphrasing here) that she noticed she was getting
impatient with her son because he always asked her - even though she
always said yes. One day she was a bit irritated and asked him why
did he always ask when he already knew she would say yes. His reply
(he was 6 or 7 - young) was that he was just checking to make sure
someone else didn't want or need what he wanted.
He wasn't asking permission - he was offering what he wanted to
others.
Brought tears to my eyes.
Mercedes
who didn't retell this story as sweetly as it was first posted
***** She is so used to asking me first, and so am I, because I have
been the controlling authority. If I am really giving her control
over what she eats, then she should just be able to go and eat
cookies anytime. *****
In the archives is a really sweet post by, I think, Brenda (who lived
in Germany but doesn't post anymore.)
She said (paraphrasing here) that she noticed she was getting
impatient with her son because he always asked her - even though she
always said yes. One day she was a bit irritated and asked him why
did he always ask when he already knew she would say yes. His reply
(he was 6 or 7 - young) was that he was just checking to make sure
someone else didn't want or need what he wanted.
He wasn't asking permission - he was offering what he wanted to
others.
Brought tears to my eyes.
Mercedes
who didn't retell this story as sweetly as it was first posted
Michelle
How very sweet. Your retelling brought tears to my eyes. I am letting go of my control over food with my son, but still see him asking permission. I never really thought about why he does it.
Michelle
mulwiler@... wrote:
He wasn't asking permission - he was offering what he wanted to
others.
Brought tears to my eyes.
Mercedes
who didn't retell this story as sweetly as it was first posted
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Michelle
mulwiler@... wrote:
He wasn't asking permission - he was offering what he wanted to
others.
Brought tears to my eyes.
Mercedes
who didn't retell this story as sweetly as it was first posted
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[email protected]
Robin wrote:
<<<< A few years back, we had a dog that would overeat, which was
always so surprising to me. >>>>>
Just out of curiosity, do you know the dog's background? Weaned
too early? Separated from mom?
Did the dog come from an abundant puppyhood? <g>
<<<<<<<< Just as with these dogs, I do think that occasionally, from
time to time, it's possible for people to exist who just don't have
whatever it takes to regulate their eating. >>>>>>>>
My intellect tells me this must be so. But if someone like this were
found, it would be interesting to know if there were other areas in
their lives that were being controlled. Or areas, with children
especially, where they maybe felt "out of" control.
Could they then using food as a response to that which is not related
to food?
Mercedes
4-months into de-fooding herself . . . . .
<<<< A few years back, we had a dog that would overeat, which was
always so surprising to me. >>>>>
Just out of curiosity, do you know the dog's background? Weaned
too early? Separated from mom?
Did the dog come from an abundant puppyhood? <g>
<<<<<<<< Just as with these dogs, I do think that occasionally, from
time to time, it's possible for people to exist who just don't have
whatever it takes to regulate their eating. >>>>>>>>
My intellect tells me this must be so. But if someone like this were
found, it would be interesting to know if there were other areas in
their lives that were being controlled. Or areas, with children
especially, where they maybe felt "out of" control.
Could they then using food as a response to that which is not related
to food?
Mercedes
4-months into de-fooding herself . . . . .
[email protected]
Age 4-5....isn't that the time most kids enter preschool or kindergarten? I wonder if they even looked at that fact?
I know in the schools I went to you had a set time to eat, and you HAD to eat as much as you could then, because you didn't get another chance.
I'm guessing that most preschools/kindergartens aren't as strict as elementry on up, but you still have set snack and lunch times.
~Rebecca
--
You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocketship underpants don't help."
-Calvin
I know in the schools I went to you had a set time to eat, and you HAD to eat as much as you could then, because you didn't get another chance.
I'm guessing that most preschools/kindergartens aren't as strict as elementry on up, but you still have set snack and lunch times.
~Rebecca
--
You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocketship underpants don't help."
-Calvin
> Because this list was speaking particularly of four-year-olds, it was
> odd to hear one participant -- the author of a book called "Fatland" I think
> -- say that obesity research shows a difference between age three and age five!
> I didn't hear anything about limits or conditioning either way, just that
> three-year-olds naturally self-regulate when food is plentiful (stop when full)
> but five-year-olds keep eating past that point.
>
> The clear implication from what I heard was that the research keyed in
> on some developmental change at about age four, not any conditioning effect
> of limits or plenty.
Andrea Burlingame
Mercedes said:
they would start thinking of others when they make their food choices. (I
don't expect it right away, though they might surprize me!)
Andrea
> In the archives is a really sweet post by, I think, Brenda (who livedThis is sweet, and good for me to hear, because I have been wondering when
> in Germany but doesn't post anymore.)
>
> She said (paraphrasing here) that she noticed she was getting
> impatient with her son because he always asked her - even though she
> always said yes. One day she was a bit irritated and asked him why
> did he always ask when he already knew she would say yes. His reply
> (he was 6 or 7 - young) was that he was just checking to make sure
> someone else didn't want or need what he wanted.
they would start thinking of others when they make their food choices. (I
don't expect it right away, though they might surprize me!)
Andrea