diamondlady1025

For some reason, my post did not come through went I emailed it, so
I am reposting it here instead and hopefully this will work....

Sheila,

I do not know if this will help any, but I can tell you of mine and
boys experience of this very thing that just happened the other
night.

We were over at my MIL's house on Saturday night celebrating
Mother's Day a day early, and my BIL had on this rather "sexually
heavy" movie (Bull Durham) that was on the satellite dish in my MIL
home. We were all watching it, yes even my 7 and 6 yo, along with my
13 yo sons. Watching it for them anyway only lasted 3 minutes,
literally, because I was secretly timing it on my watch as my
own "experiment" to see what would happen.

Now mind you, I said nothing, nor did anyone else in the room say
anything about them watching it.....it was my 13 yo ds who took the
lead, as he felt uncomfortable watching it (I mean my 13 yo ds got
uncomfortable just last night when during Everwood when
the "pregnancy" issue came up and he excused himself to go to the
bathroom), I could tell, but I said nothing. I just sat back and let
the situation unfold. My 13 yo ds turned to my 7 yo and said "Do you
want to go play Dr. Mario in Uncle Rob's room?" and my 7 yo
said "sure" and off they went. Then about 5 minutes later my 6 yo,
who was immersed in his gameboy anyway, and was not even watching
the movie, he uses the TV sometimes just for background noise, he
turned to my dh and said, "I am going to go see what Chris and
Matthew are up to" and he left the room.

I was SO proud of them. They self-regulated without me having to say
a word. This was not the first time that my boys have self-
regulated, they do it all the time. It just happened to be the first
time that they did it in front of my MIL and BIL.
So, this was a MAJOR triumph for me, I felt, as my MIL STILL after
all this time, with all of the research I have given her, and the
talks we have had, and her seeing how much my children are learning
hearing it from my own children's mouths (she spent almost 3 hours,
no joke, on the phone with my 7 yo ds just last week, because he
wanted to talk to her, it was his choice because he wanted to tell
her all about what he has been doing and it took him almost 3 hours
to tell her!and this is coming from a what she calls my ds "an
introverted child"), she is still very skeptical of the whole
unschooling issue, but of course, does not say anything to me
personally, she tells my dh her "worries" (oh brother!). At least I
do not have to hear her complain! :)

So after the boys all left the room, a few minutes later, I made a
point of saying out loud to my dh in front of my BIL and MIL "Honey,
did you notice how the boys all self-regulated and left the room
because they felt uncomfortable about our movie choice?". 1,2,3,4,5
points for me and my boys! :)

Alot of times too, I will be watching something and it will have
puns and inuendos in them that my children just do not get unless I
point them out to them. Sometimes I will depending on if they are
really watching it with me or sometimes not, if they are just in
the room with their gameboys or on the computer, or writing or
drawing, and not really paying attention to whatever I am watching.
When I do though, it opens up a dialog for my children to expression
their view points on the matter at hand and for whatever else may
come out of that conversation.

Now, my 13 yo ds is getting better at "catching on" than my other
two, but not always. There are still things that go "over his head
and out the window" as my mother would say. My feeling on that is if
they are ready for it, then they will hear it and they will get it
OR they will ask about it, like....."I did not get what so and so
said Mom, what does that mean" Ergo I would stop the video and
explain it then. Sometimes all they want is a quick on their own
level response, and sometimes they want to hear more and take to
another level, which I am gladly to do either because I strongly
believe that if they are ready to ask the question, then they are
ready to hear the answer, whatever, the equivalent of that answer
they seek is for them at that moment.


I wanted to share this with you Sheila, to let you know that even
though your 11 yo dd wants to see it, maybe she too will self-
regulate and not "hear" per se the puns and inuendos. And if she
does, it could open up a dialog with the two of you regarding it.
It could also set the stage for a talk, if she asks, and or if you
choose to bring up the subject by asking her if she has any
questions about what she is seeing, surrounding the subject of sex.
I do not know how comfortable you are with it, but personally, I
would rather be the one who is comfortable with it and give my
children the information that my children ask for and about, as much
as they ask for, no matter what the topic. Sometimes we have to be
willing to drop our fears and uncomfortablities, in order to provide
our children with the knowledge they seek.

Knowledge is empowering, and hiding that knowledge from them will
only, in my humble opinion, serve to make sex, alcohol, drugs or
whatever "bad thing we want to protect them from", more enticing and
make them want to do it even more. The more they know, the more
informative of a choice they can make. And the more trust you place
in your child, the more likely they are to make what we would see as
the "right" choice.

Just my 2 cents! :) Hope it helps! :)

Patti and the boys (Chris 13, Matthew 7, Anthony 6)
"For no matter where knowledge and learning come from - no matter
what shape, size, or dimension it assumes - it still is what it is,
knowledge and learning. Therefore knowledge and learning should
always be embraced." ~ unknown

-------Original Message-------
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 03:14:57 -0000
From: "kayb85" <sheran@...>
Subject: young, innocent kids wanting to watch sexually heavy movies

I could use some input on the movie "mean girls" and on the general
topic of innocent pre-teens wanting to watch sexually heavy movies.

I was discussing this with some online friends and someone posted a
review of the movie Mean Girls and its sexual content. So I guess my
first question, for those of you who've seen it...just how sexual is
it? For a innocent 11 year old who hasn't been exposed to much
sexuality in movies before, is it a lot to throw at her at once?

Examples of some things I've been told about the movie:
-Regina states that she was half a virgin when she met Aaron.
-A male student tells another that something (presumably sexual) only
counts "if you saw nipple."
-An instructor in a sex-ed class tells his students not to have sex
in the missionary position or standing up (stating that they'll die)
and then tells everyone to take a rubber (he has a container of
them).
-We hear a breakdown of the various student cliques in the cafeteria,
including that of the "sexually active band geeks."
-Regina matter-of-factly asks Cady if she wants to have sex with a
guy who's joined them at school and Cady says, "No thank you."
-Regina calls another girl's mother and acts as if she's from Planned
Parenthood regarding the girl (to get her in trouble).
-We hear that Regina's mom had a "boob job" (as the camera focuses on
her chest) and that they're as hard as rocks (Cady reacts to the feel
of them when the mom hugs her). The mom doesn't then realize that the
small family dog is biting on her clothed nipple.
-Comments are made about a girl still being a virgin and another
being a "dyke."
-Janis tells Cady that she smells like a "baby prostitute."
-A sex-ed instructor tells his students that they'll have urges and
want to take off their clothes, but that they'll then get Chlamydia.

My almost 11 year old daughter REALLY wants to see it. We generally
watch movies on dvd instead of in the theatres, so we won't go and
watch it right now, but it will be out on dvd before long I'm sure.

My concern isn't that I want to be a prude and keep her from seeing
sexual stuff. I want to be open and honest and all that when it
comes to sexuality. I don't want to not let her watch it. As a
matter of fact, not letting her watch something she wants to watch
isn't even an option. She knows the basics about sex but is still
fairly innocent. She saw Freaky Friday and loved the actress (same
one as is in this movie) and saw Mean GIrls advertised and just
thinks it looks awesome. Plus it's about a homeschooled girl. She
won't forget about wanting to watch this, she REALLY wants it. She
wants to buy it and she'll probably watch it several times.

But the stuff I posted above...Wow, she doesn't know much about any
of that at all. Maybe she's curious, maybe she's ready to start
hearing about some of that, and that's cool...but all that thrown
together in one movie?

She's my oldest, so it's my first time dealing with sexual stuff.
Any advice?

Sheila

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/11/04 2:28:10 PM, Diamondlady1025@... writes:

<< My 13 yo ds turned to my 7 yo and said "Do you

want to go play Dr. Mario in Uncle Rob's room?" >>

I'd rather play Dr. Mario than see Kevin Costner ANYtime.

I'm going to start there and move to something that's a few steps removed, so
nobody needs to defend or explain anything. Discuss the ideas all you want
to, but it's not about one family. Sheila wrote lots of great things, I'm just
jumping off from one bit.

<< I made a

point of saying out loud to my dh in front of my BIL and MIL "Honey,

did you notice how the boys all self-regulated and left the room

because they felt uncomfortable about our movie choice?".>>

I hope now you can move past the idea of it being a "regulation" or that
they've "self regulated." When my children choose vegetables over cookies,
they're not "regulating." We haven't declared one thing better than another, and
through all that it has been proven in and by their lives that children will
choose a balanced life in the absence of regulations. It's not that the
children themselves came up with the rules and then regulated themselves. It's a
natural balance and natural preference.

I do understand that you're in the phase of trying to overcome outside
criticism and skepticism, but for your own soul and the continuuing success of the
kids' growth into making their own decisions, try to consider why "self
regulating" as a concept could be in your way. Or could put you in their way.

If in your mind not watching Bull Durham is better than watching it (in the
long run, even at home without relatives there), then when or if one of your
children watches it, will that mean he has stopped self-regulating? Making a
choice is a choice. Had Holly wanted to eat popsicles or cookies yesterday
instead of finishing off the avocado and spinach dip, it would have been just as
much a Holly-choice. She wasn't "regulating."

Young kids usually don't like movies with kissing and mush (they take off, or
they just focus on the Hot Wheels cars on the floor until the huggy chit-chat
passes). I had kids who did that. If I had defined that as "not interested
in sex" then if they got old enough to be willing to sit and watch through
the romance until the action came back, I guess I would be defining that as
"interested in sex."

If the decision making thoughts in my head are more neutral, more in the
middle, then I'm not defining my children by my perception of their sexuality (or
interest therein) and that's a really GOOD thing.

I have a short article on balance that probably explains it better than I can
re-explain it here.

http://www.home-ed-magazine.com/HEM/206/ndunschool.html

-=- maybe she too will self-

regulate and not "hear" per se the puns and inuendos.-=-

If she understands them she will.
If she doesn't understand them she won't.
If she acts shocked or doesn't act shocked, that will probably have more to
do with what she thinks her parents think about what she might think.

There was a song before I was born that my mom used to sing. Some of it goes

"I was looking back to see if she was looking back to see
If I was looking back to see if she was looking back at me."

That's a lot of work, and when one can step out of that kid of
self-consciousness into just accepting and being in the moment, life becomes larger, quieter
and clearer.