Whoops, forgot my intro
Roberta Carl
Hi, I've posted a couple times without telling who I
was -- sorry, I'm getting absent minded.
My name is Roberta and I have 5 girls -- 2 that are
16, one 14, one 12, and the "baby" is 9. I am new to
unschooling. Just pulled my 2 youngest out of school
in January. Would love to remove all of them from
school, but the two oldest are almost out of 10th and
don't want to homeschool (except they are jealous that
the others don't have homework) and the 14 yo is in a
special school since she is bipolar and has
Aspberger's (form of Autism).
I have been lurking for about 2 months now and I have
to admit that some of the things I have read here have
really made me stop and think about "why" we do
things. I have tried and am trying to relax on a lot
of the things I used to do and say. And now I find
myself having to stop and think about what I want to
say and how I want to phrase it (so as not to seem
rude or insensitive). I have to admit that I have a
long way to go <g>, but am trying to change.
I have 2 questions:
Any advice on how to find local unschoolers? I live in
San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,
but they look at me strange when I mention
unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.
Also, I am needing advice on what to tell my 12 yo
(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?
BTW - It sure is helpful having a list like this to
read and the references, articles, etc available. I'm
sure it takes a lot of time to run a list this size,
but it really is appreciated :-).
Roberta
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
http://mail.yahoo.com
was -- sorry, I'm getting absent minded.
My name is Roberta and I have 5 girls -- 2 that are
16, one 14, one 12, and the "baby" is 9. I am new to
unschooling. Just pulled my 2 youngest out of school
in January. Would love to remove all of them from
school, but the two oldest are almost out of 10th and
don't want to homeschool (except they are jealous that
the others don't have homework) and the 14 yo is in a
special school since she is bipolar and has
Aspberger's (form of Autism).
I have been lurking for about 2 months now and I have
to admit that some of the things I have read here have
really made me stop and think about "why" we do
things. I have tried and am trying to relax on a lot
of the things I used to do and say. And now I find
myself having to stop and think about what I want to
say and how I want to phrase it (so as not to seem
rude or insensitive). I have to admit that I have a
long way to go <g>, but am trying to change.
I have 2 questions:
Any advice on how to find local unschoolers? I live in
San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,
but they look at me strange when I mention
unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.
Also, I am needing advice on what to tell my 12 yo
(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?
BTW - It sure is helpful having a list like this to
read and the references, articles, etc available. I'm
sure it takes a lot of time to run a list this size,
but it really is appreciated :-).
Roberta
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
http://mail.yahoo.com
Robyn Coburn
<<Any advice on how to find local unschoolers? I live in
San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,
but they look at me strange when I mention
unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.>>
My local group has some members who are pretty vocally anti-unschooling
because they have "educational goals" for their children. It took me a long
time to "come out" as an unschooler because I feared they would not welcome
Jayn to play. That has turned out to be groundless. I simply walk away from
the curriculum conversations, and now it seems there are two other
unschooling families in the group (I may be the only Radical Unschooler). It
is the almost universal focus on gentler parenting that keeps me in the
group, especially amongst the longer term members. I don't proselytize
unschooling, but do answer questions when asked. If someone talks about how
they "do" x pages or hours or starts complaining about the time it takes, I
just go away. Sometimes I just say "I don't know. I'm an unschooler so I
don't use any curriculum."
My point is that we are in the group for Jayn's sake, not mine - having
other gently parented children to play with in a non-judgmental free-play
situation without the excessive parental mediation in their activities and
interactions that so characterizes ordinary park visit experiences. I have
made some friends that we see outside of the group too. I sometimes feel
like they look upon me with humor - as if I was the local harmless eccentric
crackpot.
<<Also, I am needing advice on what to tell my 12 yo
(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?>>
I may be in a minority here but my suggestion is that if the friend is
saying things that you object to, in your hearing, it is OK to speak to her
about it, in a light manner. It sounds clear to me that she is already
feeling jealous on several levels, and finding it hard to adjust to a major
change in her circumstances. The balance of power at school is no doubt
altered without Suzi, and the friend is speaking from her needs, not Suzi's
best interest. No one needs to have "friends" who see it as their job to
pull you down, criticize you and hurt your feelings. I think saying personal
disparagments like "you're going to be dumb" crosses a line, beyond
expressing doubts about colleges - the latter can be easily refuted with
information, which may reassure Suzi.
I am not above using the fact that other children are rule-bound and
brainwashed by saying something along the lines of "respecting the house
rules" - even though we don't actually have any! We had to speak to Jayn's
friend about not trying to draw Jayn into schemes to hide candy, and I have
told her to change her blackmailing type behavior or go home in the past
also.
Suzi is still deschooling. She is having to change from a peer dominated
reality fraught with manipulations, to a family centered one. My immediate
knee jerk reaction would be to find ways to lessen the time the other girl
is spending with her for now - by going on interesting outings so you aren't
home in the afternoon, for example. It should not be your responsibility to
care for her (as a latchkey kid as you mention) if it is detrimental to your
own daughter.
BTW, there are several other families unschooling Asperger's and Autism
spectrum children. See the message boards at Unschooling.com for more.
Robyn L. Coburn
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Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,
but they look at me strange when I mention
unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.>>
My local group has some members who are pretty vocally anti-unschooling
because they have "educational goals" for their children. It took me a long
time to "come out" as an unschooler because I feared they would not welcome
Jayn to play. That has turned out to be groundless. I simply walk away from
the curriculum conversations, and now it seems there are two other
unschooling families in the group (I may be the only Radical Unschooler). It
is the almost universal focus on gentler parenting that keeps me in the
group, especially amongst the longer term members. I don't proselytize
unschooling, but do answer questions when asked. If someone talks about how
they "do" x pages or hours or starts complaining about the time it takes, I
just go away. Sometimes I just say "I don't know. I'm an unschooler so I
don't use any curriculum."
My point is that we are in the group for Jayn's sake, not mine - having
other gently parented children to play with in a non-judgmental free-play
situation without the excessive parental mediation in their activities and
interactions that so characterizes ordinary park visit experiences. I have
made some friends that we see outside of the group too. I sometimes feel
like they look upon me with humor - as if I was the local harmless eccentric
crackpot.
<<Also, I am needing advice on what to tell my 12 yo
(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?>>
I may be in a minority here but my suggestion is that if the friend is
saying things that you object to, in your hearing, it is OK to speak to her
about it, in a light manner. It sounds clear to me that she is already
feeling jealous on several levels, and finding it hard to adjust to a major
change in her circumstances. The balance of power at school is no doubt
altered without Suzi, and the friend is speaking from her needs, not Suzi's
best interest. No one needs to have "friends" who see it as their job to
pull you down, criticize you and hurt your feelings. I think saying personal
disparagments like "you're going to be dumb" crosses a line, beyond
expressing doubts about colleges - the latter can be easily refuted with
information, which may reassure Suzi.
I am not above using the fact that other children are rule-bound and
brainwashed by saying something along the lines of "respecting the house
rules" - even though we don't actually have any! We had to speak to Jayn's
friend about not trying to draw Jayn into schemes to hide candy, and I have
told her to change her blackmailing type behavior or go home in the past
also.
Suzi is still deschooling. She is having to change from a peer dominated
reality fraught with manipulations, to a family centered one. My immediate
knee jerk reaction would be to find ways to lessen the time the other girl
is spending with her for now - by going on interesting outings so you aren't
home in the afternoon, for example. It should not be your responsibility to
care for her (as a latchkey kid as you mention) if it is detrimental to your
own daughter.
BTW, there are several other families unschooling Asperger's and Autism
spectrum children. See the message boards at Unschooling.com for more.
Robyn L. Coburn
---
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Deborah Lewis
***Any advice on how to find local unschoolers? I live in
San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,
but they look at me strange when I mention
unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.***
There is an e-mail list for Round Rock. I know that's not exactly close,
but maybe some members are nearer you. It's a yahoo group called RRun if
you want to look for it. I think it's a smaller list. The owner used to
be and maybe still is, on the Montana list as I think her family travels
between the two states several times a year. If you don't find the list
let me know and I might be able to get better information.
Deb Lewis
"What we call education and culture is for the most part nothing but the
substitution
of reading for experience, of literature for life, of the obsolete
fictitious for the contemporary real"
~George Bernard Shaw~
San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,
but they look at me strange when I mention
unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.***
There is an e-mail list for Round Rock. I know that's not exactly close,
but maybe some members are nearer you. It's a yahoo group called RRun if
you want to look for it. I think it's a smaller list. The owner used to
be and maybe still is, on the Montana list as I think her family travels
between the two states several times a year. If you don't find the list
let me know and I might be able to get better information.
Deb Lewis
"What we call education and culture is for the most part nothing but the
substitution
of reading for experience, of literature for life, of the obsolete
fictitious for the contemporary real"
~George Bernard Shaw~
Tracey Inman
<<Also, I am needing advice on what to tell my 12 yo
(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?>>
I agree with Robyn about speaking with the child who is making such comments
to your daughter. I do quite a bit of this. Children can be so mean at
times. But the question I would ask this child is why she feels
like..(whatever the comment she has made). I love to ask the why question.
It gives the child the opportunity to think. (novel thought!) Most of the
time they are just repeating what they have heard and really don't have a
real opinion. Asking why gives them an opportunity to find their opinion
and know why they feel the way they do. I wish someone had taught me how to
really think about things when I was young. I hope that makes sense. This
will also empower your child to see you step to the plate in support of her.
~Tracey I.
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?>>
I agree with Robyn about speaking with the child who is making such comments
to your daughter. I do quite a bit of this. Children can be so mean at
times. But the question I would ask this child is why she feels
like..(whatever the comment she has made). I love to ask the why question.
It gives the child the opportunity to think. (novel thought!) Most of the
time they are just repeating what they have heard and really don't have a
real opinion. Asking why gives them an opportunity to find their opinion
and know why they feel the way they do. I wish someone had taught me how to
really think about things when I was young. I hope that makes sense. This
will also empower your child to see you step to the plate in support of her.
~Tracey I.
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.622 / Virus Database: 400 - Release Date: 3/13/2004
J. Stauffer
<<<<Any advice on how to find local unschoolers? I live in
Actually we live in Bulverde. We have a couple of unschooler friendly
groups in the area. Email me off list and we will talk.
Julie S.
> San Antonio, TX. I joined a local homeschoolers group,San Antonio unschooler waving back!!!!
> but they look at me strange when I mention
> unschooling, so I'm not exactly comfortable with them.>>>>
Actually we live in Bulverde. We have a couple of unschooler friendly
groups in the area. Email me off list and we will talk.
Julie S.
Lisa H
When my dd's were younger someone in our homeschooling community sponsored an unschooling support group. It lasted for a few years but was a wonderful way to meet other unschoolers within the larger community of homeschooling folks and to get a good handle on our own ideas of parenting lifestyle choices etc.
So if your looking for other unschoolers - how about starting an unschoolers support group in your area. It doesn't have to preclude attending other homeschooler events. Even if it starts with two families...eventually it may grow and it will certainly attract some curiosity seekers.
Lisa H.
So if your looking for other unschoolers - how about starting an unschoolers support group in your area. It doesn't have to preclude attending other homeschooler events. Even if it starts with two families...eventually it may grow and it will certainly attract some curiosity seekers.
Lisa H.
----- Original Message -----
From: Tracey Inman
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 8:25 AM
Subject: RE: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Whoops, forgot my intro
<<Also, I am needing advice on what to tell my 12 yo
(Suzi). Suzi's best friend comes over everyday
(instead of being a latchkey kid) and frequently says
things to Suzi such as "you're not going to learn
anything", "you should go back to school", "how are
you ever going to get into college/scholarships etc",
and "you're going to be dumb". I try to reassure Suzi
that she will learn as much as or more (though not in
the same order) as the kids in school and we have had
talks about what she wants (doesn't want to go back to
school, doesn't want to stick her nose in a book all
day). I also tell her not to worry, that she doesn't
have to explain to her friend and that not everyone is
going to be okay with our decision, but that is their
problem, not ours, but she's still uncomfortable.
So... anyone have ideas on what she should/could say
or what I can say to her to help?>>
I agree with Robyn about speaking with the child who is making such comments
to your daughter. I do quite a bit of this. Children can be so mean at
times. But the question I would ask this child is why she feels
like..(whatever the comment she has made). I love to ask the why question.
It gives the child the opportunity to think. (novel thought!) Most of the
time they are just repeating what they have heard and really don't have a
real opinion. Asking why gives them an opportunity to find their opinion
and know why they feel the way they do. I wish someone had taught me how to
really think about things when I was young. I hope that makes sense. This
will also empower your child to see you step to the plate in support of her.
~Tracey I.
---
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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.622 / Virus Database: 400 - Release Date: 3/13/2004
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[email protected]
In a message dated 3/20/2004 1:56:05 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Lmanathome@... writes:
So if your looking for other unschoolers - how about starting an unschoolers
support group in your area. It doesn't have to preclude attending other
homeschooler events. Even if it starts with two families...eventually it may grow
and it will certainly attract some curiosity seekers.<<<<<<<<<<<
Our inclusive group led to two unschooling families' starting an unschooling
support group ---kind of a spin-off. It eventually led to hosting the first
and second national unschooling conferences, as well as spin-off groups in NC
and GA.
It's a powerful and empowering move to make.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Lmanathome@... writes:
So if your looking for other unschoolers - how about starting an unschoolers
support group in your area. It doesn't have to preclude attending other
homeschooler events. Even if it starts with two families...eventually it may grow
and it will certainly attract some curiosity seekers.<<<<<<<<<<<
Our inclusive group led to two unschooling families' starting an unschooling
support group ---kind of a spin-off. It eventually led to hosting the first
and second national unschooling conferences, as well as spin-off groups in NC
and GA.
It's a powerful and empowering move to make.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]