How I started out as an unschooler
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/7/2004 4:16:28 PM Mountain Standard Time,
litlrooh@... writes:
I have a question. Hope its not a repeat. I've been reading the articles on
your site. And I know that you started out as a teacher.
When you had your children. Did you start out as an unschooler? Or did you
work your way toward that? Do you have an article that explains how you went
from being a teacher to unschooling?
-----------
It's not all collected in one place. Maybe I should do that.
As with all hindsight and connect-the-dots, sometimes I think of something
else that contributed to making it easier for me to unschool with complete
confidence. Sometimes it's a small thing and sometimes a big one.
I wanted to be a teacher from the time I was six, but looking back I see that
what I really wanted was to be like teachers I knew and liked. They had
read, they laughed, they talked about interesting things, they had travelled, they
were nice to kids. (I saw exceptions, and those are the teachers I didn't
want to be like. Since I had decided I was going to be one, I noticed all the
good things because that was what I wanted to emulate.)
When I went to college I studied English and psychology. I was young.
17-20. I got interested in anthropology too, and folklore. I took education
classes kind of on the side (we were required to have a major and minor and THEN
take the education classes in addition). It was the early 70's and the
professors I had were mostly school-reform advocates, and they talked about all the
latest studies that showed how the schools themselves caused most of the
problems and how these things were being overcome in experimental schools. They had
us read John Holt, who was not yet a homeschooling advocate, but was pretty
radical!
I taught where I had gone to school. Some of the people I taught with had
been my teachers. They liked me and had faith in me and let me be experimental.
Still, it was school.
Things were being difficult in my life outside of school, my mom had become a
fulltime drunk (at the bar from 11:00 a.m. to 2:00 a.m), my dad remarried
twice and then died, my mom had a little boy (my half brother) she wasn't taking
good care of and I had custody of him, I married a friend whose parents had
died and we had custody of his younger brother and sister, so when I was 21 I
had custody of a 10 and 12 year old and soon added a four year old brother. A
lot; all had side issues, we did the best we could, and learned a lot and
things were rough.
Time passed, and not smoothly.
I moved to Albuquerque to go to grad school and be with Keith, who had lived
with me and my first husband for a while.
When I was 31 I was in a whole 'nother situation. Second round of custody of
my brother who was a young teen then (not doing well, fetal alcohol syndrome
featuring lack of conscience, plus poor guy had been with my mom most of that
ensuing time, and I saw more of what not to do; heended up in a juvenile
detention situation,and then I arranged for my mom to regain custody for a while,
learning too much law in the process) .
I had quit teaching when I moved to Albuquerque and for a while I worked in
the records office at the university, and then I worked fulltime as the CEO
(working from my home and travelling to board meetings) of the Society for
Creative Anachronism for a couple of years. So I learned a lot about non-profits
and bulk mailings and printing and management and organization and management,
but also lots about the philosophy of how people can learn in the course of
"just" trying to put on medieval feasts and tournaments. Some people there said
we should, as a non-profit educational organization, be doing community
outreach and teaching the general public about the Middle Ages. I argued that our
existence gave them the opportunity to come and learn if they wanted to, and we
weren't chartered as missionaries, but as studying in order to put on feasts
and tournaments by and for our own membership.
Those discussions clarified a lot for me about natural learning. Being
around people in that organization who were going from zero to professional outside
of school, without certificates, learning it all for fun and many ending up
with real expertise, producing amazing things, put me past ANY doubt that
learning can be just about effortless when it's fun.
Keith and I got married in 1984 (20th anniversary coming, but we were
together six years before we married).
I was going to Adult Children of Alcoholics meetings, had Kirby, went to
La Leche League, and the messages of those two organizations melded to change
me. I didn't need to be my mom; further, I needed in many ways profoundly NOT
to be my mom.
We figured Kirby would go to school when the time came.
Our family was one of several families in a playgroup and babysitting co-op
made up mostly of La Leche League leaders and hardcore members, invitation
only, strictly attachment parenting. Of the dozen to 18 families, four were
homeschoolers. Two structured, two unschooling. I knew their homes, the dads, the
kids. Kids had been at my house without parents. My kids had been to their
houses. That's about as close as it gets to intimate knowledge of how the
kids are with and without their parents around.
By the time Kirby was four, we knew school wasn't going to be a good match
for him. He was zippy yet sensitive. He was brave, and yet clingy. He'd go
quiet and thoughtful, and then way talkative. We decided to keep him home the
kindergarten year with the option the next year of public kindergarten, public
first grade, or continued homeschooling.
I'd seen firsthand the problems in the school-at-home families and also seen
the calm and the happiness in the unschooling families, so I went that way.
All the experiences in my life to that point made me confident.
I still figured Marty might want to go to school, but when the time came he
didn't.
That's about it! I went directly to unschooling, but in a way it was like
being still and letting the waters rise around me, rather than jumping off a
cliff from school into an unknown. I worked up to it over the years, without
knowing what I was working up to.
Much of life is like that, isn't it? That's why unschooling works as well as
it does. If our kids live their rich lives, it works up to something, but we
don't know what until it happens. And if we attach to a moment or a goal,
we'll feel like failures when that passes on by. If my only success would have
been taking care of my mom or my brother, or my first marriage, or teaching, I
would be a many-times failure. But if my success was to keep on learning and
being a good and happy Sandra, then I was successful throughout and still am.
I don't know what I'll be doing in five years, but if I keep focussed on
now, it should be something based naturally on what has gone before.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
litlrooh@... writes:
I have a question. Hope its not a repeat. I've been reading the articles on
your site. And I know that you started out as a teacher.
When you had your children. Did you start out as an unschooler? Or did you
work your way toward that? Do you have an article that explains how you went
from being a teacher to unschooling?
-----------
It's not all collected in one place. Maybe I should do that.
As with all hindsight and connect-the-dots, sometimes I think of something
else that contributed to making it easier for me to unschool with complete
confidence. Sometimes it's a small thing and sometimes a big one.
I wanted to be a teacher from the time I was six, but looking back I see that
what I really wanted was to be like teachers I knew and liked. They had
read, they laughed, they talked about interesting things, they had travelled, they
were nice to kids. (I saw exceptions, and those are the teachers I didn't
want to be like. Since I had decided I was going to be one, I noticed all the
good things because that was what I wanted to emulate.)
When I went to college I studied English and psychology. I was young.
17-20. I got interested in anthropology too, and folklore. I took education
classes kind of on the side (we were required to have a major and minor and THEN
take the education classes in addition). It was the early 70's and the
professors I had were mostly school-reform advocates, and they talked about all the
latest studies that showed how the schools themselves caused most of the
problems and how these things were being overcome in experimental schools. They had
us read John Holt, who was not yet a homeschooling advocate, but was pretty
radical!
I taught where I had gone to school. Some of the people I taught with had
been my teachers. They liked me and had faith in me and let me be experimental.
Still, it was school.
Things were being difficult in my life outside of school, my mom had become a
fulltime drunk (at the bar from 11:00 a.m. to 2:00 a.m), my dad remarried
twice and then died, my mom had a little boy (my half brother) she wasn't taking
good care of and I had custody of him, I married a friend whose parents had
died and we had custody of his younger brother and sister, so when I was 21 I
had custody of a 10 and 12 year old and soon added a four year old brother. A
lot; all had side issues, we did the best we could, and learned a lot and
things were rough.
Time passed, and not smoothly.
I moved to Albuquerque to go to grad school and be with Keith, who had lived
with me and my first husband for a while.
When I was 31 I was in a whole 'nother situation. Second round of custody of
my brother who was a young teen then (not doing well, fetal alcohol syndrome
featuring lack of conscience, plus poor guy had been with my mom most of that
ensuing time, and I saw more of what not to do; heended up in a juvenile
detention situation,and then I arranged for my mom to regain custody for a while,
learning too much law in the process) .
I had quit teaching when I moved to Albuquerque and for a while I worked in
the records office at the university, and then I worked fulltime as the CEO
(working from my home and travelling to board meetings) of the Society for
Creative Anachronism for a couple of years. So I learned a lot about non-profits
and bulk mailings and printing and management and organization and management,
but also lots about the philosophy of how people can learn in the course of
"just" trying to put on medieval feasts and tournaments. Some people there said
we should, as a non-profit educational organization, be doing community
outreach and teaching the general public about the Middle Ages. I argued that our
existence gave them the opportunity to come and learn if they wanted to, and we
weren't chartered as missionaries, but as studying in order to put on feasts
and tournaments by and for our own membership.
Those discussions clarified a lot for me about natural learning. Being
around people in that organization who were going from zero to professional outside
of school, without certificates, learning it all for fun and many ending up
with real expertise, producing amazing things, put me past ANY doubt that
learning can be just about effortless when it's fun.
Keith and I got married in 1984 (20th anniversary coming, but we were
together six years before we married).
I was going to Adult Children of Alcoholics meetings, had Kirby, went to
La Leche League, and the messages of those two organizations melded to change
me. I didn't need to be my mom; further, I needed in many ways profoundly NOT
to be my mom.
We figured Kirby would go to school when the time came.
Our family was one of several families in a playgroup and babysitting co-op
made up mostly of La Leche League leaders and hardcore members, invitation
only, strictly attachment parenting. Of the dozen to 18 families, four were
homeschoolers. Two structured, two unschooling. I knew their homes, the dads, the
kids. Kids had been at my house without parents. My kids had been to their
houses. That's about as close as it gets to intimate knowledge of how the
kids are with and without their parents around.
By the time Kirby was four, we knew school wasn't going to be a good match
for him. He was zippy yet sensitive. He was brave, and yet clingy. He'd go
quiet and thoughtful, and then way talkative. We decided to keep him home the
kindergarten year with the option the next year of public kindergarten, public
first grade, or continued homeschooling.
I'd seen firsthand the problems in the school-at-home families and also seen
the calm and the happiness in the unschooling families, so I went that way.
All the experiences in my life to that point made me confident.
I still figured Marty might want to go to school, but when the time came he
didn't.
That's about it! I went directly to unschooling, but in a way it was like
being still and letting the waters rise around me, rather than jumping off a
cliff from school into an unknown. I worked up to it over the years, without
knowing what I was working up to.
Much of life is like that, isn't it? That's why unschooling works as well as
it does. If our kids live their rich lives, it works up to something, but we
don't know what until it happens. And if we attach to a moment or a goal,
we'll feel like failures when that passes on by. If my only success would have
been taking care of my mom or my brother, or my first marriage, or teaching, I
would be a many-times failure. But if my success was to keep on learning and
being a good and happy Sandra, then I was successful throughout and still am.
I don't know what I'll be doing in five years, but if I keep focussed on
now, it should be something based naturally on what has gone before.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Melissa
--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
<<Those discussions clarified a lot for me about natural learning.
Being around people in that organization who were going from zero to
professional outside of school, without certificates, learning it
all for fun and many ending up with real expertise, producing
amazing things, put me past ANY doubt that learning can be just
about effortless when it's fun.>>
I have worked as the CFO of two companies and as a quasi real estate
agent, all without going to college and without having any formal
education in either area. It was simply something that I learned by
watching others and asking questions. I have always loved math and
numbers so the CFO position was a no brainer as far as I was
concerned. However, as most of you know, I couldn't just walk in
and get a CFO position with no degree or formal education. So, I
started at the bottom and worked my way up, both times. Once the
bosses saw that I really did know what I was talking about and
doing, that was all it took. Of course, to cover their own butts,
an "real" accountant came in and checked my work once a month. He
always told the boss that she was wasting her money having him come
in.
The real estate agent thing was sort of an accident. I needed a
part time job to help with money and met someone (an agent) who was
looking for an office assistant. After working with him a week, he
had me talking to the clients and helping to arrange financing for
them (another numbers job for me). I loved working with him and,
before I knew it (or him, for that matter), I was taking offers and
making counter offers on our listings. The title companies that I
worked with just assumed that I was an agent from out of the area.
I loved that job but ended up leaving because it was taking WAY too
much time away from my DD and DH. I still have friends who call and
ask me to look over contracts before they make an offer on homes.
These are people who have their own agents! They know that I really
do have their best interests at heart. As a matter of fact, I just
suggested to a friend of mine the other day not to make an offer on
a house she had her heart set on.....there was just too much work to
be done and I knew she'd never have the time to do it. Once I
pointed the different things out to her, she said that I was right
and, no big surprise here, her agent didn't point any of these
things our to her.
<<I went directly to unschooling, but in a way it was like
being still and letting the waters rise around me, rather than
jumping off a cliff from school into an unknown.>>
I think it might be a little easier for someone who starts out not
putting their kids in school at all. I knew that I would be
homeschooling my DD before she was born. However, I had no idea
that there were so many different kinds of ways to homeschool. I
started to read about homeschooling and, as soon as I read about
unschooling, something in my brain yelled "Yes, that's it!" I never
looked any further. Then I went to Yahoo Groups and found this
group. I knew that I wanted to unschool as far as education but,
you all have helped me to unschool in all other aspects of life. I
still have my moments but I feel as though I have made great
progress.
Melissa
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/2004 10:19:17 AM Eastern Standard Time,
melissa4123@... writes:
I think it might be a little easier for someone who starts out not
putting their kids in school at all. <<<<<<
Bingo!
I'm so envious of those of you who get/got it early!
Sandra's maybe right about parents who have the "basics" down from a year or
two of schooling---like the arithmatic and reading----'cause those are two
bugaboos. At least they don't feel like it's gnawing at them: "Will they ever
learn to ....?" When they leave school, those two little things are "done"
(well...not exactly, but in their minds).
But at the same time, the damage has been done too.
I have one of each. Cameron had eight years of schooling. Duncan has had
none. So I've been able to see both sides. I got to watch the spark go out in Cam
at school---but it was miraculous to see it come back and then burst into
flames! Duncan just keeps going. Never has been snuffed out. Both are fascinating
to watch from a "sociological/psychological/educational" viewpoint, not to
mention as a parent and unschooling advocate.
I can easily see the "swimming/floating" into schooling as Sandra did----I'm
doing it with Duncan. It's SO easy! The water (and my fat ass) hold me afloat.
But I totally understand the cliff-jumping too! It's more frightening---but
maybe more exciting and rewarding---to realize you have wings and can fly.
Correction: it's DUNCAN who's doing the swimming/floating and CAMERON who's
doing the flying/soaring. Both are amazing! And both are unschooling, but with
different starting points.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
melissa4123@... writes:
I think it might be a little easier for someone who starts out not
putting their kids in school at all. <<<<<<
Bingo!
I'm so envious of those of you who get/got it early!
Sandra's maybe right about parents who have the "basics" down from a year or
two of schooling---like the arithmatic and reading----'cause those are two
bugaboos. At least they don't feel like it's gnawing at them: "Will they ever
learn to ....?" When they leave school, those two little things are "done"
(well...not exactly, but in their minds).
But at the same time, the damage has been done too.
I have one of each. Cameron had eight years of schooling. Duncan has had
none. So I've been able to see both sides. I got to watch the spark go out in Cam
at school---but it was miraculous to see it come back and then burst into
flames! Duncan just keeps going. Never has been snuffed out. Both are fascinating
to watch from a "sociological/psychological/educational" viewpoint, not to
mention as a parent and unschooling advocate.
I can easily see the "swimming/floating" into schooling as Sandra did----I'm
doing it with Duncan. It's SO easy! The water (and my fat ass) hold me afloat.
But I totally understand the cliff-jumping too! It's more frightening---but
maybe more exciting and rewarding---to realize you have wings and can fly.
Correction: it's DUNCAN who's doing the swimming/floating and CAMERON who's
doing the flying/soaring. Both are amazing! And both are unschooling, but with
different starting points.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/2004 9:53:46 AM Central Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
damage to work through. I wish I had always hs'd. I had never heard of hsing
and it never occurred to me though I did try hard to help/save my kids as best
I could think of while they were there.
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
> Sandra's maybe right about parents who have the "basics" down from a yearSome kids go and still don't learn these things, they end up having even more
> or
> two of schooling---like the arithmatic and reading----'cause those are two
> bugaboos. At least they don't feel like it's gnawing at them: "Will they
> ever
> learn to ....?" When they leave school, those two little things are "done"
> (well...not exactly, but in their minds).
>
damage to work through. I wish I had always hs'd. I had never heard of hsing
and it never occurred to me though I did try hard to help/save my kids as best
I could think of while they were there.
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
Wow Sandra,
Thanks for sharing all of that. I've had bits and pieces of "ahah" experiences that have made me realize that learning happens best when in freedom.
I guess for me it is still like jumping off of a cliff. The waters just didn't have enough time to rise high enough to engulf me.
That gives me a lot to think about.
Kristen
Thanks for sharing all of that. I've had bits and pieces of "ahah" experiences that have made me realize that learning happens best when in freedom.
I guess for me it is still like jumping off of a cliff. The waters just didn't have enough time to rise high enough to engulf me.
That gives me a lot to think about.
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: SandraDodd@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2004 3:12 AM
Subject: [UnschoolingDiscussion] How I started out as an unschooler
In a message dated 2/7/2004 4:16:28 PM Mountain Standard Time,
litlrooh@... writes:
I have a question. Hope its not a repeat. I've been reading the articles on
your site. And I know that you started out as a teacher.
When you had your children. Did you start out as an unschooler? Or did you
work your way toward that? Do you have an article that explains how you went
from being a teacher to unschooling?
-----------
It's not all collected in one place. Maybe I should do that.
As with all hindsight and connect-the-dots, sometimes I think of something
else that contributed to making it easier for me to unschool with complete
confidence. Sometimes it's a small thing and sometimes a big one.
I wanted to be a teacher from the time I was six, but looking back I see that
what I really wanted was to be like teachers I knew and liked. They had
read, they laughed, they talked about interesting things, they had travelled, they
were nice to kids. (I saw exceptions, and those are the teachers I didn't
want to be like. Since I had decided I was going to be one, I noticed all the
good things because that was what I wanted to emulate.)
When I went to college I studied English and psychology. I was young.
17-20. I got interested in anthropology too, and folklore. I took education
classes kind of on the side (we were required to have a major and minor and THEN
take the education classes in addition). It was the early 70's and the
professors I had were mostly school-reform advocates, and they talked about all the
latest studies that showed how the schools themselves caused most of the
problems and how these things were being overcome in experimental schools. They had
us read John Holt, who was not yet a homeschooling advocate, but was pretty
radical!
I taught where I had gone to school. Some of the people I taught with had
been my teachers. They liked me and had faith in me and let me be experimental.
Still, it was school.
Things were being difficult in my life outside of school, my mom had become a
fulltime drunk (at the bar from 11:00 a.m. to 2:00 a.m), my dad remarried
twice and then died, my mom had a little boy (my half brother) she wasn't taking
good care of and I had custody of him, I married a friend whose parents had
died and we had custody of his younger brother and sister, so when I was 21 I
had custody of a 10 and 12 year old and soon added a four year old brother. A
lot; all had side issues, we did the best we could, and learned a lot and
things were rough.
Time passed, and not smoothly.
I moved to Albuquerque to go to grad school and be with Keith, who had lived
with me and my first husband for a while.
When I was 31 I was in a whole 'nother situation. Second round of custody of
my brother who was a young teen then (not doing well, fetal alcohol syndrome
featuring lack of conscience, plus poor guy had been with my mom most of that
ensuing time, and I saw more of what not to do; heended up in a juvenile
detention situation,and then I arranged for my mom to regain custody for a while,
learning too much law in the process) .
I had quit teaching when I moved to Albuquerque and for a while I worked in
the records office at the university, and then I worked fulltime as the CEO
(working from my home and travelling to board meetings) of the Society for
Creative Anachronism for a couple of years. So I learned a lot about non-profits
and bulk mailings and printing and management and organization and management,
but also lots about the philosophy of how people can learn in the course of
"just" trying to put on medieval feasts and tournaments. Some people there said
we should, as a non-profit educational organization, be doing community
outreach and teaching the general public about the Middle Ages. I argued that our
existence gave them the opportunity to come and learn if they wanted to, and we
weren't chartered as missionaries, but as studying in order to put on feasts
and tournaments by and for our own membership.
Those discussions clarified a lot for me about natural learning. Being
around people in that organization who were going from zero to professional outside
of school, without certificates, learning it all for fun and many ending up
with real expertise, producing amazing things, put me past ANY doubt that
learning can be just about effortless when it's fun.
Keith and I got married in 1984 (20th anniversary coming, but we were
together six years before we married).
I was going to Adult Children of Alcoholics meetings, had Kirby, went to
La Leche League, and the messages of those two organizations melded to change
me. I didn't need to be my mom; further, I needed in many ways profoundly NOT
to be my mom.
We figured Kirby would go to school when the time came.
Our family was one of several families in a playgroup and babysitting co-op
made up mostly of La Leche League leaders and hardcore members, invitation
only, strictly attachment parenting. Of the dozen to 18 families, four were
homeschoolers. Two structured, two unschooling. I knew their homes, the dads, the
kids. Kids had been at my house without parents. My kids had been to their
houses. That's about as close as it gets to intimate knowledge of how the
kids are with and without their parents around.
By the time Kirby was four, we knew school wasn't going to be a good match
for him. He was zippy yet sensitive. He was brave, and yet clingy. He'd go
quiet and thoughtful, and then way talkative. We decided to keep him home the
kindergarten year with the option the next year of public kindergarten, public
first grade, or continued homeschooling.
I'd seen firsthand the problems in the school-at-home families and also seen
the calm and the happiness in the unschooling families, so I went that way.
All the experiences in my life to that point made me confident.
I still figured Marty might want to go to school, but when the time came he
didn't.
That's about it! I went directly to unschooling, but in a way it was like
being still and letting the waters rise around me, rather than jumping off a
cliff from school into an unknown. I worked up to it over the years, without
knowing what I was working up to.
Much of life is like that, isn't it? That's why unschooling works as well as
it does. If our kids live their rich lives, it works up to something, but we
don't know what until it happens. And if we attach to a moment or a goal,
we'll feel like failures when that passes on by. If my only success would have
been taking care of my mom or my brother, or my first marriage, or teaching, I
would be a many-times failure. But if my success was to keep on learning and
being a good and happy Sandra, then I was successful throughout and still am.
I don't know what I'll be doing in five years, but if I keep focussed on
now, it should be something based naturally on what has gone before.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
I can easily see the "swimming/floating" into schooling as Sandra did----I'm
doing it with Duncan. It's SO easy! The water (and my fat ass) hold me afloat.
But I totally understand the cliff-jumping too! It's more frightening---but
maybe more exciting and rewarding---to realize you have wings and can fly.
++++++++++++++++++
I know exactly what you mean. My oldest two were in school. The oldest till 5th grade, the youngest only till half way through 1st. But the "baby" of the family never went to school and she is SOOOOO easy to unschool. In fact, it was her success that gave me more confidence to unschool the other two.
Kristen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
doing it with Duncan. It's SO easy! The water (and my fat ass) hold me afloat.
But I totally understand the cliff-jumping too! It's more frightening---but
maybe more exciting and rewarding---to realize you have wings and can fly.
++++++++++++++++++
I know exactly what you mean. My oldest two were in school. The oldest till 5th grade, the youngest only till half way through 1st. But the "baby" of the family never went to school and she is SOOOOO easy to unschool. In fact, it was her success that gave me more confidence to unschool the other two.
Kristen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/04 8:53:53 AM, kbcdlovejo@... writes:
<< Sandra's maybe right about parents who have the "basics" down from a year
or
two of schooling---like the arithmatic and reading---- >>
I don't think it will happen in a year or two. I was thinking more of people
whose kids are 12 or 15 and they want to unschool. If they say "My kid reads
all the time," I say "Well then it will be a breeze."
We know one kid who left school in third grade and he was already good at
math and reading, so it's not TOTALLY uncommon. But the pictures in my head when
I wrote were of tall people, not 7 yr olds (just for the record).
Sandra
<< Sandra's maybe right about parents who have the "basics" down from a year
or
two of schooling---like the arithmatic and reading---- >>
I don't think it will happen in a year or two. I was thinking more of people
whose kids are 12 or 15 and they want to unschool. If they say "My kid reads
all the time," I say "Well then it will be a breeze."
We know one kid who left school in third grade and he was already good at
math and reading, so it's not TOTALLY uncommon. But the pictures in my head when
I wrote were of tall people, not 7 yr olds (just for the record).
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/2004 12:32:17 PM Central Standard Time,
litlrooh@... writes:
older one at the end of 4th. They are both very unschooly now but the younger
one is, at least to me like someone who has never been to school.
It has been interesting watching my older boys who all attended school
interact with the younger 2. My 21yro son recently told me he wishes he had been
hs'd. It has been very healing for all of us (the older boys, dh and I) to be
able to talk out a lot of the grief of their school years. I am glad for where
we are today.
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
litlrooh@... writes:
> I know exactly what you mean. My oldest two were in school. The oldestOur situation was similar my youngest did finish first grade, I pulled the
> till 5th grade, the youngest only till half way through 1st.
older one at the end of 4th. They are both very unschooly now but the younger
one is, at least to me like someone who has never been to school.
It has been interesting watching my older boys who all attended school
interact with the younger 2. My 21yro son recently told me he wishes he had been
hs'd. It has been very healing for all of us (the older boys, dh and I) to be
able to talk out a lot of the grief of their school years. I am glad for where
we are today.
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/2004 11:06:10 AM Eastern Standard Time,
BonKnit@... writes:
Some kids go and still don't learn these things, they end up having even more
damage to work through. I wish I had always hs'd. I had never heard of hsing
and it never occurred to me though I did try hard to help/save my kids as
best
I could think of while they were there. <<<<<<
And THAAAA-at is-ah mya Mission-uh! I NEED ayou to-ah beLIEVE and NOW-uh!
There isa no time to aWASTE-uh. You NEED to rePENT-uh and see the LIGHT-uh,
NOW!
Seriously, I *do* so wish I had found unschooling before Cameron went to
school. Sandra's path is wait until they find us. I'm out LOOKING for converts!
<G>
I know that I can't "convert" those that don't want to be unschooled (nor do
I wish to), but I CAN make an effort to be a beacon to those who are
searching. My car is a rolling advertisement for unschooling. I wear it on my sleeve.
I'm MORE than happy to "preach" it when someone's interested. I DO say, "we're
UNschooling," when people ask which school the boys are in. Then I'll tell
them EXACTLY what we do and how.
I understand that people don't know (and many don't care); but if someone,
anyone, had mentioned unschooling to me when Cameron was a baby, I would have
latched on immediately. Instead we floundered in the private school system for
eight years. I thought you *had* to be a right-wing, religious, Abeka/Sonlight
kind of homeschooler. I didn't realize THIS life was possible!
So my mission is the same, but different. <g>
~Kelly, Evangelist
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
BonKnit@... writes:
Some kids go and still don't learn these things, they end up having even more
damage to work through. I wish I had always hs'd. I had never heard of hsing
and it never occurred to me though I did try hard to help/save my kids as
best
I could think of while they were there. <<<<<<
And THAAAA-at is-ah mya Mission-uh! I NEED ayou to-ah beLIEVE and NOW-uh!
There isa no time to aWASTE-uh. You NEED to rePENT-uh and see the LIGHT-uh,
NOW!
Seriously, I *do* so wish I had found unschooling before Cameron went to
school. Sandra's path is wait until they find us. I'm out LOOKING for converts!
<G>
I know that I can't "convert" those that don't want to be unschooled (nor do
I wish to), but I CAN make an effort to be a beacon to those who are
searching. My car is a rolling advertisement for unschooling. I wear it on my sleeve.
I'm MORE than happy to "preach" it when someone's interested. I DO say, "we're
UNschooling," when people ask which school the boys are in. Then I'll tell
them EXACTLY what we do and how.
I understand that people don't know (and many don't care); but if someone,
anyone, had mentioned unschooling to me when Cameron was a baby, I would have
latched on immediately. Instead we floundered in the private school system for
eight years. I thought you *had* to be a right-wing, religious, Abeka/Sonlight
kind of homeschooler. I didn't realize THIS life was possible!
So my mission is the same, but different. <g>
~Kelly, Evangelist
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
J. Stauffer
<<<<<but if someone,
old AOL boards), I think the description I used to a friend was "those
hippies that beat on drums and call it math." The friend and I just laughed
at the silliness of it.
After six years (wow, I can't believe it has been that long)I am constantly
explaining to my school at home friends how music is math but on an auditory
level. LOL
Julie S.
> anyone, had mentioned unschooling to me when Cameron was a baby, I wouldhave
> latched on immediately.>>>>>>After I first came across unschooling (actually it was through Sandra on the
old AOL boards), I think the description I used to a friend was "those
hippies that beat on drums and call it math." The friend and I just laughed
at the silliness of it.
After six years (wow, I can't believe it has been that long)I am constantly
explaining to my school at home friends how music is math but on an auditory
level. LOL
Julie S.
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/04 12:19:03 PM, kbcdlovejo@... writes:
<< Seriously, I *do* so wish I had found unschooling before Cameron went to
school. Sandra's path is wait until they find us. I'm out LOOKING for
converts! >>
But I figure once someone DOES find us, they should do it and not waste any
time waffling and stalling and trying one more time to teach them world history
in chronological order. Once they've found us and asked for help getting
there, I want them to focus for a minute or a day or a week and DO IT!
It probably seems like plain impatience on my part, but it isn't. The sooner
it works, the better it works. The sooner it works, the less deschooling
there will be. The sooner it works, the sooner we have someone else to help us
say "Oh look!! IT WORKS!"
Sandra
<< Seriously, I *do* so wish I had found unschooling before Cameron went to
school. Sandra's path is wait until they find us. I'm out LOOKING for
converts! >>
But I figure once someone DOES find us, they should do it and not waste any
time waffling and stalling and trying one more time to teach them world history
in chronological order. Once they've found us and asked for help getting
there, I want them to focus for a minute or a day or a week and DO IT!
It probably seems like plain impatience on my part, but it isn't. The sooner
it works, the better it works. The sooner it works, the less deschooling
there will be. The sooner it works, the sooner we have someone else to help us
say "Oh look!! IT WORKS!"
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/8/04 1:56:59 PM, jnjstau@... writes:
<< "those
hippies that beat on drums and call it math." >>
That is so funny!
Last night I drove Marty to the ice rink to leave his new skates to be
sharpened. We were listening to the radio, and trying to find something by the drum
part. The first one had tambourine but I accidently said "tangerine" and we
were just laughing, and came to one that had heavy high-hat cymbals, and two
songs later, same pedal-cymbal background. I was thinking (but didn't say
anything) about how hard drum-set stuff is (for rock or jazz) and how totally
beyond me it is, musically and spatially and mathematically.
<<After six years (wow, I can't believe it has been that long)I am constantly
explaining to my school at home friends how music is math but on an auditory
level. LOL>>
Music is math on more levels than that. Notation is totally a graphic
representation of the music, showing the "base" (as in base ten, base twelve, base
two in math, but in music it's more likely to be base four, or three or six),
and the relative lengths of parts, the relative heights and series' and...
But PHYSICALLY it's mathematical. Half a string makes a note twice as high.
[Twice as high? Kind of. But all those can be measured in vibrations per
second, and the notes have physical relationships to one another.]
There's more, but I don't know it all.
Sandra
<< "those
hippies that beat on drums and call it math." >>
That is so funny!
Last night I drove Marty to the ice rink to leave his new skates to be
sharpened. We were listening to the radio, and trying to find something by the drum
part. The first one had tambourine but I accidently said "tangerine" and we
were just laughing, and came to one that had heavy high-hat cymbals, and two
songs later, same pedal-cymbal background. I was thinking (but didn't say
anything) about how hard drum-set stuff is (for rock or jazz) and how totally
beyond me it is, musically and spatially and mathematically.
<<After six years (wow, I can't believe it has been that long)I am constantly
explaining to my school at home friends how music is math but on an auditory
level. LOL>>
Music is math on more levels than that. Notation is totally a graphic
representation of the music, showing the "base" (as in base ten, base twelve, base
two in math, but in music it's more likely to be base four, or three or six),
and the relative lengths of parts, the relative heights and series' and...
But PHYSICALLY it's mathematical. Half a string makes a note twice as high.
[Twice as high? Kind of. But all those can be measured in vibrations per
second, and the notes have physical relationships to one another.]
There's more, but I don't know it all.
Sandra