Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Danger and Fear was: Extreme behavior
[email protected]
danielle.conger@... writes:
Insurance doesn't actually prevent bad things from happening, it just
compensates you for some of the loss. The idea is that it insures against you
being wiped out by whatever trouble finds you.
After the car crash, insurance towed the wreck away, replaced it, and
paid the medical bills. It also paid the post-trauma psychologist to help with
the involuntary panic response I was enduring every time I had to ride in the
car. I guess the airbags that kept it from being worse than it was were a
sort of "insurance" too.
Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
or stop bad things from happening or various fates from befalling us, but it
does help insure that we can handle it all in a healthy way and keep chugging
along. JJ
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Medicine,This made me think of insurance and acturial tables.
> particularly, relies upon fear and statistics to backup that fear.
>
Insurance doesn't actually prevent bad things from happening, it just
compensates you for some of the loss. The idea is that it insures against you
being wiped out by whatever trouble finds you.
After the car crash, insurance towed the wreck away, replaced it, and
paid the medical bills. It also paid the post-trauma psychologist to help with
the involuntary panic response I was enduring every time I had to ride in the
car. I guess the airbags that kept it from being worse than it was were a
sort of "insurance" too.
Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
or stop bad things from happening or various fates from befalling us, but it
does help insure that we can handle it all in a healthy way and keep chugging
along. JJ
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/11/03 7:06:15 AM, jrossedd@... writes:
<< Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
or stop bad things from happening >>
It keeps school from happening to our children.
That is a large set of "happenings" to which they are not exposed if they
don't go to school.
I think maybe you're looking at the end result of unschooling instead of the
moment-to-moment.
Sandra
<< Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
or stop bad things from happening >>
It keeps school from happening to our children.
That is a large set of "happenings" to which they are not exposed if they
don't go to school.
I think maybe you're looking at the end result of unschooling instead of the
moment-to-moment.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/11/03 7:06:15 AM, jrossedd@... writes:
<< Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
or stop bad things from happening or various fates from befalling us, but it
does help insure that we can handle it all in a healthy way and keep chugging
along. >>
I had to come back to this. It's really bothering me.
My children aren't "chugging along."
I am not "chugging along."
We're living laughter-filled days of light and joy.
If something horrible happens to mar that happiness, we will deal with it
somehow, but I can't help but believe it will be better WITHOUT the
considerations of how many days the kids can grieve before they have to go back to school.
Sandra
<< Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
or stop bad things from happening or various fates from befalling us, but it
does help insure that we can handle it all in a healthy way and keep chugging
along. >>
I had to come back to this. It's really bothering me.
My children aren't "chugging along."
I am not "chugging along."
We're living laughter-filled days of light and joy.
If something horrible happens to mar that happiness, we will deal with it
somehow, but I can't help but believe it will be better WITHOUT the
considerations of how many days the kids can grieve before they have to go back to school.
Sandra
[email protected]
I said nothing negative about unschooling or about this list, much
less sending kids back to school! (A BIG shudder)
Quite the contrary.
In a message dated 12/11/2003 2:55:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
less sending kids back to school! (A BIG shudder)
Quite the contrary.
In a message dated 12/11/2003 2:55:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
> In a message dated 12/11/03 7:06:15 AM, jrossedd@... writes:[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> << Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cure anything
>
> or stop bad things from happening or various fates from befalling us, but it
>
> does help insure that we can handle it all in a healthy way and keep
> chugging
> along. >>
>
> I had to come back to this. It's really bothering me.
>
> My children aren't "chugging along."
> I am not "chugging along."
>
> We're living laughter-filled days of light and joy.
>
> If something horrible happens to mar that happiness, we will deal with it
> somehow, but I can't help but believe it will be better WITHOUT the
> considerations of how many days the kids can grieve before they have to go
> back to school.
>
> Sandra
>
pam sorooshian
On Dec 11, 2003, at 10:49 AM, SandraDodd@... wrote:
happening but that, like having insurance, when bad things DO happen,
unschooling families have ways to cope that they wouldn't have
otherwise.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> << Maybe unschooling is like insurance then. Maybe it can't cureI think she meant that unschooling can't keep every bad thing from
> anything
> or stop bad things from happening >>
>
> It keeps school from happening to our children.
> That is a large set of "happenings" to which they are not exposed if
> they
> don't go to school.
>
> I think maybe you're looking at the end result of unschooling instead
> of the
> moment-to-moment.
happening but that, like having insurance, when bad things DO happen,
unschooling families have ways to cope that they wouldn't have
otherwise.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
[email protected]
Yes! Exactly so! :) JJ
pamsoroosh@... writes:
pamsoroosh@... writes:
> I think she meant that unschooling can't keep every bad thing from[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> happening but that, like having insurance, when bad things DO happen,
> unschooling families have ways to cope that they wouldn't have
> otherwise.
>
> -pam
> National Home Education Network
> <www.NHEN.org>
> Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
> through information, networking and public relations.
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/11/2003 2:55:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
If something horrible happens to mar that happiness, we will deal with it
somehow, but I can't help but believe it will be better WITHOUT the
considerations of how many days the kids can grieve before they have to go
back to school.
Sandra
Sandra, that is more profound that one could really imagine. My daughter had
a horrifying event happen when she was in middle school. She was home for a
week sick with grief, unable to function. When she returned to school with
the note saying there had been a death in the family and to please be gentle
with her and allow her to call to be picked up if necessary, all went well except
with the classroom teacher.
He laughed at her, talked about it in class, that she was just being silly
and school was more important because dead is dead. Which of course it is, but
that doesn't mean you can't still have a broken heart and just be sick over
the loss of someone so special to you.
I am SO glad that I will never have to worry about her being treated so less
than by people who feel their importance in her life is much greater than it
should be in some supposedly mandatory place, claiming to be GOOD for the
children!
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
If something horrible happens to mar that happiness, we will deal with it
somehow, but I can't help but believe it will be better WITHOUT the
considerations of how many days the kids can grieve before they have to go
back to school.
Sandra
Sandra, that is more profound that one could really imagine. My daughter had
a horrifying event happen when she was in middle school. She was home for a
week sick with grief, unable to function. When she returned to school with
the note saying there had been a death in the family and to please be gentle
with her and allow her to call to be picked up if necessary, all went well except
with the classroom teacher.
He laughed at her, talked about it in class, that she was just being silly
and school was more important because dead is dead. Which of course it is, but
that doesn't mean you can't still have a broken heart and just be sick over
the loss of someone so special to you.
I am SO glad that I will never have to worry about her being treated so less
than by people who feel their importance in her life is much greater than it
should be in some supposedly mandatory place, claiming to be GOOD for the
children!
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Danielle E. Conger
At 09:55 AM 12/12/2003 -0500, rubyprincesstsg@... wrote:
illness. When I returned to school the following week, my German teacher,
whom I hated, was having us translate sentences. He deliberately looked at
me and told me to translate, "What is your father's name" into German. I
got up and walked out of the class, slamming the door. He wrote a note home
to my mother, telling her that I was "milking my father's death for all it
was worth."
I transferred out of the class, and that was the end of German for me.
Though I went on to learn French and Spanish with some wonderful teachers.
Unfortunately, all it takes is a few bad ones...
--danielle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>When she returned to school withI was in 7th grade when my dad died--after a very long and devastating
>the note saying there had been a death in the family and to please be gentle
>with her and allow her to call to be picked up if necessary, all went well
>except
>with the classroom teacher.
>
>He laughed at her, talked about it in class, that she was just being silly
>and school was more important because dead is dead.
illness. When I returned to school the following week, my German teacher,
whom I hated, was having us translate sentences. He deliberately looked at
me and told me to translate, "What is your father's name" into German. I
got up and walked out of the class, slamming the door. He wrote a note home
to my mother, telling her that I was "milking my father's death for all it
was worth."
I transferred out of the class, and that was the end of German for me.
Though I went on to learn French and Spanish with some wonderful teachers.
Unfortunately, all it takes is a few bad ones...
--danielle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/12/2003 11:21:24 AM Eastern Standard Time,
danielle.conger@... writes:
He wrote a note home
to my mother, telling her that I was "milking my father's death for all it
was worth."
Danielle,
I'm sorry to hear that, it had to be devastating to you. Doesn't it make you
wonder what kind of person, much less teacher would be like that with a
child? They are molding our children's minds, but very often NOT for any
betterment!
I'm so sorry that happened, it probably still stings today to remember it.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
danielle.conger@... writes:
He wrote a note home
to my mother, telling her that I was "milking my father's death for all it
was worth."
Danielle,
I'm sorry to hear that, it had to be devastating to you. Doesn't it make you
wonder what kind of person, much less teacher would be like that with a
child? They are molding our children's minds, but very often NOT for any
betterment!
I'm so sorry that happened, it probably still stings today to remember it.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Elizabeth Roberts
So ya'll know my problems with DSS. The social worker just sent me a packet of information about Head Start. She's trying to convince me that Logan should attend...
What a trip! Under "Head Start Program Options" it says "Center Based Option: ...Families receive montly home visits from a family worker who supports them in identifying and reaching their personal and family goals."
There is also a bit in there about parental involvement...it's also a good one..."Parents participate in decision making and program planning through the Policy Council. Montly meetings at the center give parents an opportunity to share ideas and to get acquainted with other parents in the program. Parents acts as volunteers throughout the program in every setting." It continues on to "Family Services: Our family support staff helps parents access resources within the community. Monthly visits with your family worker provide an opportunity to share information, set goals, and build on the individual strengths of each family."
Great. As if I didn't already have pressure from my mother, social services, and friends who don't understand...yet another way to be pressured into conformity.
And there isn't even one in my town...he'd have to be bused into a neighboring town. At three years old.
Don't think so! Thanks but no thanks...but I gotta play along and look like I'm truly considering all of this, so I suppose we'll schedule a time to take Logan and "drop in" and "check it out."
SIGH.......I don't know if I mentioned it or not, but at the last visit with the social worker, guess what the topic of focus was? Sarah not being in school....and how I must certainly need a break from the kids...the phrase most said was "how do you do it?" and comments like "I'd need a break from my kids and I only have two!" yadda yadda yadda I'm sure you could fill in the rest of the conversation...
So of course, Sarah is asking to go back to school. I've stalled her for the moment by saying Daddy and I would talk about it. We did. For about two minutes. Long enough to agree that it isn't happening at this point.
I gotta go clean house and work off some of the angst from the pressure...
MamaBeth
Everything I need to know, I learned on my own!
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
What a trip! Under "Head Start Program Options" it says "Center Based Option: ...Families receive montly home visits from a family worker who supports them in identifying and reaching their personal and family goals."
There is also a bit in there about parental involvement...it's also a good one..."Parents participate in decision making and program planning through the Policy Council. Montly meetings at the center give parents an opportunity to share ideas and to get acquainted with other parents in the program. Parents acts as volunteers throughout the program in every setting." It continues on to "Family Services: Our family support staff helps parents access resources within the community. Monthly visits with your family worker provide an opportunity to share information, set goals, and build on the individual strengths of each family."
Great. As if I didn't already have pressure from my mother, social services, and friends who don't understand...yet another way to be pressured into conformity.
And there isn't even one in my town...he'd have to be bused into a neighboring town. At three years old.
Don't think so! Thanks but no thanks...but I gotta play along and look like I'm truly considering all of this, so I suppose we'll schedule a time to take Logan and "drop in" and "check it out."
SIGH.......I don't know if I mentioned it or not, but at the last visit with the social worker, guess what the topic of focus was? Sarah not being in school....and how I must certainly need a break from the kids...the phrase most said was "how do you do it?" and comments like "I'd need a break from my kids and I only have two!" yadda yadda yadda I'm sure you could fill in the rest of the conversation...
So of course, Sarah is asking to go back to school. I've stalled her for the moment by saying Daddy and I would talk about it. We did. For about two minutes. Long enough to agree that it isn't happening at this point.
I gotta go clean house and work off some of the angst from the pressure...
MamaBeth
Everything I need to know, I learned on my own!
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wifetovegman2002
--- In [email protected], Elizabeth Roberts
<mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
me that Logan should attend...
you should check out http://www.ahsa-usa.org/
It is an association of homeschool attorneys. they have a yahoo
group too
Also there is a CPS reform yahoo group that might be helpful:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/childprotectionreform/
<mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
>a packet of information about Head Start. She's trying to convince
>
> So ya'll know my problems with DSS. The social worker just sent me
me that Logan should attend...
>Elizabeth,
you should check out http://www.ahsa-usa.org/
It is an association of homeschool attorneys. they have a yahoo
group too
Also there is a CPS reform yahoo group that might be helpful:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/childprotectionreform/
Shay
--- In [email protected], Elizabeth Roberts
<mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
from my kids and I only have two!">>
I'd have to come up w/some stock replies for this junk. Maybe
smthg like, "I can see how you might feel that way, but I feel
differently. I *like* being with my kids a lot."
-Shay
<mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
> >how I must certainly need a break from the kids...the phrase mostsaid was "how do you do it?" and comments like "I'd need a break
from my kids and I only have two!">>
I'd have to come up w/some stock replies for this junk. Maybe
smthg like, "I can see how you might feel that way, but I feel
differently. I *like* being with my kids a lot."
-Shay
Elizabeth Roberts
What I replied was "Attitude counts for alot. I enjoy being with the children, even when we're all having bad days. I look forward to spending the day with them, so it's easy for me."
MamaBeth
Shay <shaysea@...> wrote:
--- In [email protected], Elizabeth Roberts
<mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
from my kids and I only have two!">>
I'd have to come up w/some stock replies for this junk. Maybe
smthg like, "I can see how you might feel that way, but I feel
differently. I *like* being with my kids a lot."
-Shay
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MamaBeth
Shay <shaysea@...> wrote:
--- In [email protected], Elizabeth Roberts
<mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
> >how I must certainly need a break from the kids...the phrase mostsaid was "how do you do it?" and comments like "I'd need a break
from my kids and I only have two!">>
I'd have to come up w/some stock replies for this junk. Maybe
smthg like, "I can see how you might feel that way, but I feel
differently. I *like* being with my kids a lot."
-Shay
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To unsubscribe from this send an email to:
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Wife2Vegman
--- Shay <shaysea@...> wrote:
any time to yourself.
Somehow they have assumed that there are only two
choices, to send the kids away or to be with the kids
24/7. They have also assumed that Elizabeth is making
unhealthy choices for herself. There is a ton of
assuming happening on their part, and you know what
assuming does ;-)
Shay, didn't you write something about CPS before? Or
was that just about VA's CPS? Would it help Elizabeth
at all to read it?
Susan M. in Sterling,VA
wifetovegman
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> --- In [email protected],How about asking them why they assume you never get
> Elizabeth Roberts
> <mamabethuscg@y...> wrote:
> > >how I must certainly need a break from the
> kids...the phrase most
> said was "how do you do it?" and comments like "I'd
> need a break
> from my kids and I only have two!">>
>
> I'd have to come up w/some stock replies for this
> junk. Maybe
> smthg like, "I can see how you might feel that way,
> but I feel
> differently. I *like* being with my kids a lot."
>
> -Shay
>
any time to yourself.
Somehow they have assumed that there are only two
choices, to send the kids away or to be with the kids
24/7. They have also assumed that Elizabeth is making
unhealthy choices for herself. There is a ton of
assuming happening on their part, and you know what
assuming does ;-)
Shay, didn't you write something about CPS before? Or
was that just about VA's CPS? Would it help Elizabeth
at all to read it?
Susan M. in Sterling,VA
wifetovegman
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Tia Leschke
>I like to point out that it's different when they're home with you all the
> > >how I must certainly need a break from the kids...the phrase most
>said was "how do you do it?" and comments like "I'd need a break
>from my kids and I only have two!">>
>
> I'd have to come up w/some stock replies for this junk. Maybe
>smthg like, "I can see how you might feel that way, but I feel
>differently. I *like* being with my kids a lot."
time, rather than coming home worn out from a day at school. It's also a
lot different (in some ways) being home with "school-aged" kids than with
"preschoolers". The younger kids need a different kind of attention. The
older kids are usually starting to move outward more and actually *want*
some time to themselves.
I think it helps to point out the differences so they don't get defensive
about their own choices.
Tia
Elizabeth Roberts
The comments were made "How about asking them why they assume you never get any time to yourself?" and then "Somehow they have assumed that there are only two
choices, to send the kids away or to be with the kids
24/7. They have also assumed that Elizabeth is making
unhealthy choices for herself. There is a ton of
assuming happening on their part, and you know what
assuming does ;-)"
Yeah, they are assuming alot there...I do get time away, I get to sleep in when I need to...it's not that difficult. Yes, I go for two to three days at a stretch all alone, but I can and do handle it well...and if I'm really having a bad day, I have ladies from my church who would gladly drop everything to come by, and after her working hours I have my friend Laura available.
SIGH...it's a mess, but we'll get through it. The good thing, the social worker is at least willing to hear me out about things..although I am incredibly unable to talk coherently sometimes when face to face with someone, especially one in a threatening position. She may be a nice person, but simply by working for DSS that's threatening!!! I have to anticipate possible questions and rehearse myself with possible answers in order to put things together...it's weird how I'm like that because I can get on stage and improv just fine; I enjoy acting and have been involved in community theater, etc. But get me face to face on a personal level and I clam up.
MamaBeth
Everything I need to know, I learned on my own!
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choices, to send the kids away or to be with the kids
24/7. They have also assumed that Elizabeth is making
unhealthy choices for herself. There is a ton of
assuming happening on their part, and you know what
assuming does ;-)"
Yeah, they are assuming alot there...I do get time away, I get to sleep in when I need to...it's not that difficult. Yes, I go for two to three days at a stretch all alone, but I can and do handle it well...and if I'm really having a bad day, I have ladies from my church who would gladly drop everything to come by, and after her working hours I have my friend Laura available.
SIGH...it's a mess, but we'll get through it. The good thing, the social worker is at least willing to hear me out about things..although I am incredibly unable to talk coherently sometimes when face to face with someone, especially one in a threatening position. She may be a nice person, but simply by working for DSS that's threatening!!! I have to anticipate possible questions and rehearse myself with possible answers in order to put things together...it's weird how I'm like that because I can get on stage and improv just fine; I enjoy acting and have been involved in community theater, etc. But get me face to face on a personal level and I clam up.
MamaBeth
Everything I need to know, I learned on my own!
---------------------------------
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