Ren

"I wonder, in this thread about tantruming, either ourselves or our
parents...is alcoholism or drug use part of these lives? My dad was
the "town drunk" as I was growing up and I know my mom's stress had
its roots in that."

There was zero drug or alcohol use in my home, and my Mum had regular tantrums.
I had it pretty good when I was very little, but once my family had grown
rather large she didn't have much calmness or patience. She was raised by a Dad
that had grown up with an alcoholic mother though, I wonder how many of those
traits filtered through?
My Grandpa left his dysfunctional home at 14y.o. to make it on his own, that's
how bad it was.
My Mum and I had a lot of fighting in the teen years, mainly because she was
trying to control me in ways she should NOT have. How I dressed was a huge
issue, related to the cult I was being brought up in also.
As my mother grew personally, more and more of her joyful side came out. She
eventually was doing work she LOVED and growing and learning to the point that
her and I became very, very close...not just on the surface.
She was a huge advocate for homeschooling and encouraged all of us to be gentle
parents and try to get help for the anger issues and yelling she passed on to
us. She did better than her Dad (her Mum was very calm, although controlling) I
am definitely doing better than her and hopefully this is the final wall for
all this family anger being passed down. I fervently hope for my kids to be the
kind of parents I always wanted to be, from the very beginning.
So do the alcoholic behaviors pass on even when there is no drinking involved
with the next generation? Interesting to ponder....

Ren

[email protected]

In a message dated 11/25/03 8:33:10 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:

<< So do the alcoholic behaviors pass on even when there is no drinking
involved
with the next generation? Interesting to ponder....
>>

There was a book about this. A friend of mind had one; that was her
situation, that her mom was raised by alcoholics and wouldn't touch alcohol, but
treated her children consistently horribly instead of randomly unexpectedly
horribly.

It's out of print, but there are used copies for sale online (I looked on
google for "grandchilden of alcoholics") and here's info about getting it in
"e-book" format.

(BK-001) Grandchildren of Alcoholics: Another Generation of Co-D$8.95 (Health
Communications) 1988 (Out of Print)
Currently available as an e-Book (Crow Internet Services) in Adobe Acrobat
PDF format through Ann Smith Counseling & Training
(BK-001a) To order on CD with Adobe e-Book Reader $7.95 plus S&H
(BK-001b) To order via return e-mail for $5.95. (Once payment is received
with a valid e-mail address, we will e-mail you the entire book in PDF format.)
Print the order form below and send payment using the appropriate item
number.  Your order will be sent upon confirming payment.
Click here to view the first chapter in Adobe PDF format.  This requires
Adobe Acrobat Reader or Adobe e-Book Reader to be installed on your computer.
Family pain can pass through generations, from grandparent, to child, to
grandchild, in sometimes invisible ways.  The "Looking Good Family" is a concept
Ann Smith has developed to describe what happens when dysfunction goes
underground, and issues such as Alcoholism skip a generation.  Things are not always
what they seem and dysfunction can reappear in a new form despite efforts to
bury it.
 

Heidi

> So do the alcoholic behaviors pass on even when there is no
drinking involved
> with the next generation? Interesting to ponder....
>
> Ren

Yes, they do. I'm not an alcoholic, and neither is my husband, but we
both grew up in households with drinking. I, with my jolly dad, he
with a dad who got angry when he was drunk.

We have a hard time with lots of interpersonal stuff, such as eye
contact, open communication, honesty...not that we lie, but that we
have a hard time telling each other when we are either pleased OR
displeased with something the other is doing.

When my oldest son was here, and there was some fighting between him
and my hubby, my oldest daughter (like, six or so at the time) would
get into this incredible co-dependent behavior of trying to be good
enough to make everything better. A child in a home with alcohol
abuse will sometimes try to be SO good that daddy stops drinking or
mommy keeps her promise this time. When daddy DOESN'T stop or mommy
breaks her promise...the good child thinks it's his or her
fault...and so forth.

With neither I nor hubby drinking, when the fights would start, my
little girl would DO this good girl stuff...very alarming. Very much
a behavior from alcoholic homes.

I'll have to wait and see how her parenting is. Will she bring some
co-dependent things into her children's lives, even though there's no
alcohol abuse in our house?

hmmmm

Blessings, HeidiC

[email protected]

I think so. Even if it isn't relations it can pass to another I think.
Personality I think can be learned an inherited also.
Laura
*******************************
<<So do the alcoholic behaviors pass on even when there is no drinking
involved
with the next generation? Interesting to ponder....

Ren


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Marjorie Kirk

HeidiC wrote:

A child in a home with alcohol
> abuse will sometimes try to be SO good that daddy stops drinking or
> mommy keeps her promise this time. When daddy DOESN'T stop or mommy
> breaks her promise...the good child thinks it's his or her
> fault...and so forth.
>
> With neither I nor hubby drinking, when the fights would start, my
> little girl would DO this good girl stuff...very alarming. Very much
> a behavior from alcoholic homes.
>

I was not raised in an alcoholic family, and neither was my husband. Yet
when we argue (which isn't all that often) I notice that all three of my
children, to varying degrees, try to be "good" or take on some of the blame
for the situation, which usually didn't even involve them originally. I
don't think this is a behavior tied to alcohol abuse. I think that children
in uncomfortable situations try anything to make it stop.

Marjorie

[email protected]

My Mom never drank much but when she did (1-2 times a year) she was mean or
cried.
Throughout our child hood she gradually would add words that my Nana would
say like: Maybe I'll just kill myself or use words like slut, brats and what are
you on? It was like she was driving us to make mistakes. Many accusations
where educational well before we even knew what this and that was. She sheltered
us but accused often. But again you wouldn't know it even to this day. Laura
******************************************************************************
***
<< So do the alcoholic behaviors pass on even when there is no drinking
involved
with the next generation? Interesting to ponder....


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 11/25/03 9:51:54 AM, mkirk@... writes:

<< I was not raised in an alcoholic family, and neither was my husband. Yet

when we argue (which isn't all that often) I notice that all three of my

children, to varying degrees, try to be "good" or take on some of the blame

for the situation, which usually didn't even involve them originally. I

don't think this is a behavior tied to alcohol abuse. I think that children

in uncomfortable situations try anything to make it stop.

>>

Maybe the difference is that alcholics and those who pattern after them don't
always know better than to blame the kids for their drinking or their
fighting.

Instead of "No, it's not your fault," they might say things like, "Well why
SHOULD I stop drinking, if this is all I have to look forward to?" So the kids
try even harder.

Alcoholism is like alien possession. The alcohol itself defends its
host-creature's freedom to consume more alcohol, and the alcohol doesn't care about
the kids.

It's very common for children of alcoholics or druggies to have the thought
"My mom loves alcohol more than she loves me." That hurts. I've thought it.
But more objectively, I think the alcohol loved my mom and didn't give a
rat's ass about me.

Sandra

Heidi

Oh, that's interesting. YOu're probably right...it isn'te necessarily
alcohol, but anything scary or ugly to them

hmmm

HeidiC

--- In [email protected], "Marjorie Kirk"
<mkirk@c...> wrote:
>
> HeidiC wrote:
>
> A child in a home with alcohol
> > abuse will sometimes try to be SO good that daddy stops drinking
or
> > mommy keeps her promise this time. When daddy DOESN'T stop or
mommy
> > breaks her promise...the good child thinks it's his or her
> > fault...and so forth.
> >
> > With neither I nor hubby drinking, when the fights would start, my
> > little girl would DO this good girl stuff...very alarming. Very
much
> > a behavior from alcoholic homes.
> >
>
> I was not raised in an alcoholic family, and neither was my
husband. Yet
> when we argue (which isn't all that often) I notice that all three
of my
> children, to varying degrees, try to be "good" or take on some of
the blame
> for the situation, which usually didn't even involve them
originally. I
> don't think this is a behavior tied to alcohol abuse. I think that
children
> in uncomfortable situations try anything to make it stop.
>
> Marjorie

Wife2Vegman

--- Heidi <bunsofaluminum60@...> wrote:
> Oh, that's interesting. YOu're probably right...it
> isn'te necessarily
> alcohol, but anything scary or ugly to them
>
> hmmm
>
> HeidiC


This reminds me of the movie Monsters, Inc. I cried
when Sully scared Boo by mistake. It reminded me of
how my children used to be afraid of getting in
trouble.



=====
--Susan in Sterling, VA

"In our every deliberation we must consider the impact
of our decisions on the next seven generations" -- The
Great Law of the Iroquois Confederacy

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