[email protected]

And ALOT scared! I know, I joined this list today and it said not to write
for a few weeks, but it seems there are so many members and Sandra on here that
I just could not wait for some input!
We JUST started our journey of unschooling. This came after a very bad
start to being in school this year for my 10 year old, and finally pulling my 5
year old out after a few weeks. Even though at the time all seemed well with
him. I have spent the past 2 months researching and reading (mostly John Holt)
about unschooling. I feel this would fit so well into our life now that I've
quit my job to be home with my guys. And wow, after 3 weeks, it feels so good
to be home. I am trying to get myself to R E L A X and not jump into books,
push the pc or anything else. In other words I feel we are going thru the
adjustment period.
Now, what confuses me is the fact that other people that have claimed to
unschool talk about using books and all the work they are getting done. Should
I or should I not use books, when they are ready of course? And the holidays
are coming up. It seems my brother in law has already decided his son is not
going to come around my kids anymore, and when my boys saw their uncle they
got 50 questions shoved down their throat. "why aren't you in school?" and so
on and so on. Someone even asked me, well, how do you think homeschooling is
going to work for you? (I didn't DARE say we would be unschooling!)
What I really need is some advice on how to handle the questions that are
surely to come over the next few months. Most of our families are behind us
100% , but like their uncle, he could care less and doesn't mind letting us or
the boys know it.
I am also concerned about how long to let them de-school, for lack of a
better word for it. The period from leaving school till ???? I feel like i'm
neglecting them for not sitting them down every day and "teaching" even though I
can see and do keep track daily of the things we do , just in our daily
lives. People keep asking me . how was school? What did you do today? OOOOOO, I
have tried to explain the reason for not schooling at the moment, no one really
listens. But then, 2 months ago I didn't understand any of it myself.
Maybe I just needed someone to listen to me on here that would
understand??!!!!!
Someone even told me I would never be able to teach my 5 year old how to
read! Ha! I taught myself how to read before I was put in school! It isn't to
me that big of a deal.
So, hear I sit. Depressed again this week getting down on myself for not
doing more. Am I doing this right? We have lots of books to read, and i do
read to Isaiah every night. Kaleb, on the other hand, could care less about a
book in his hands!
help help help
Syndi in missouri!!!!!!!!!!!

We worry about what a child will be tomorrow, yet we forget that he
is someone today.
Stacie Tauscher


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Danielle E. Conger

>Depressed again this week getting down on myself for not doing more. Am I
>doing this right?

I certainly don't have the words of wisdom or the years of experience that
so many folks on this list have, but I can relate to the worry that some
people's stories can inspire. Lot's of people excited about unschooling and
eager to share their success stories (especially in the wake of so much
doubt and criticism) can actually send new-comers like us into a depression
spiral. (I'm thinking here of several articles, for example, in HEM.)
People talk about how their child unschooled into opera or fluent Japanese
or whatever. That's terrific, but it sure can make us lowly folks feel like
we're not quite getting it right!

Your quote kind of summed up my own difficulty, the hang up I'm trying to
get past: We worry about what a child will be tomorrow, yet we forget that
he is someone today.

So much of unschooling and TCS (Taking Children Seriously) is dependent on
modelling, on deferred success. It's difficult to let go of the idea of
providing valuable "lessons" in order to achieve immediate results so I
"know" I'm doing the "right" thing. Know what I mean? All this is a round
about way of saying that I'm struggling right along with you, but I think
that it's the struggle that matters in the end.

--danielle
Unschooling mom of Emily (6), Julia (4) and Sam (3)



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

J. Stauffer

Syndi,

Do you remember how you were with your kids back before they ever started
school? How you might show them a connection like mentioning that fog is
like a big cloud that is sitting on the ground? Not making it a big deal,
talking about it more if the kids were interested, not talking more if they
weren't?

That's unschooling and how it works.

Don't even think of yourself and the kids as "deschooling". Just play, have
fun, explore, make connections, pretend that everyday is summer vacation.

Eventually, your kids will find something that ignites a fire in them. That
they talk about all the time, that they love and you will be there to
support them. And lo and behold, you and the kids will be unschooling to
the nth degree.

Relax. Don't worry about the naysayers. They will be there from now on
about something or other. Instead, try to surround yourself with positive
people.

Julie S.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Onesnotenough@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 8:22 PM
Subject: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Hello, New and confused.......


>
>
>
>
>
>
> And ALOT scared! I know, I joined this list today and it said not to
write
> for a few weeks, but it seems there are so many members and Sandra on here
that
> I just could not wait for some input!
> We JUST started our journey of unschooling. This came after a very bad
> start to being in school this year for my 10 year old, and finally pulling
my 5
> year old out after a few weeks. Even though at the time all seemed well
with
> him. I have spent the past 2 months researching and reading (mostly John
Holt)
> about unschooling. I feel this would fit so well into our life now that
I've
> quit my job to be home with my guys. And wow, after 3 weeks, it feels so
good
> to be home. I am trying to get myself to R E L A X and not jump into
books,
> push the pc or anything else. In other words I feel we are going thru the
> adjustment period.
> Now, what confuses me is the fact that other people that have claimed to
> unschool talk about using books and all the work they are getting done.
Should
> I or should I not use books, when they are ready of course? And the
holidays
> are coming up. It seems my brother in law has already decided his son is
not
> going to come around my kids anymore, and when my boys saw their uncle
they
> got 50 questions shoved down their throat. "why aren't you in school?"
and so
> on and so on. Someone even asked me, well, how do you think homeschooling
is
> going to work for you? (I didn't DARE say we would be unschooling!)
> What I really need is some advice on how to handle the questions that
are
> surely to come over the next few months. Most of our families are behind
us
> 100% , but like their uncle, he could care less and doesn't mind letting
us or
> the boys know it.
> I am also concerned about how long to let them de-school, for lack of a
> better word for it. The period from leaving school till ???? I feel like
i'm
> neglecting them for not sitting them down every day and "teaching" even
though I
> can see and do keep track daily of the things we do , just in our daily
> lives. People keep asking me . how was school? What did you do today?
OOOOOO, I
> have tried to explain the reason for not schooling at the moment, no one
really
> listens. But then, 2 months ago I didn't understand any of it myself.
> Maybe I just needed someone to listen to me on here that would
> understand??!!!!!
> Someone even told me I would never be able to teach my 5 year old how to
> read! Ha! I taught myself how to read before I was put in school! It
isn't to
> me that big of a deal.
> So, hear I sit. Depressed again this week getting down on myself for
not
> doing more. Am I doing this right? We have lots of books to read, and i
do
> read to Isaiah every night. Kaleb, on the other hand, could care less
about a
> book in his hands!
> help help help
> Syndi in missouri!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> We worry about what a child will be tomorrow, yet we forget that he
> is someone today.
> Stacie Tauscher
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> "List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
>
> To unsubscribe from this send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
> Visit the Unschooling website and message boards:
http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

[email protected]

I love this!
*************************************************
<<<We worry about what a child will be tomorrow, yet we forget that he
is someone today.
Stacie Tauscher>>>
As to the unschooling start. Sounds to me as if you have a good start. Ignore
the rude family for now. What you are doing is legal and if the uncle wants
to be stuck leave him in the dust.
Relax and enjoy your boys.
Laura
Maine


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

zenmomma2kids

Breathe, Syndi, breathe. :o)

Lots of new unschoolers feel confused and a bit anxious when they
first start out. I compare that feeling to Dorothy in the Wizard of
Oz. You're glad the cyclone of school has finally ended, but now
you've got to make sense of this new world you've stepped into.

Give yourself, and your kids, time to adjust. It's been said that you
should expect at least one month of deschooling for each year of
school. That goes for you too. For me, that was 17 months of
deschooling!! Much more than my kids needed. ;-)

So, use this time to reconnect with one another and just take a break
from schoolthink all together. Go to the movies, bake some cookies,
visit a new restaurant, reread a favorite book or explore a cool
antique shop. Whatever strikes your fancy.

Try reading around www.unschooling.com and www.sandradodd.com. Read
it all. There are many answers to your questions just waiting to be
found.

Life is good.
~Mary

[email protected]

In a message dated 11/14/03 7:29:27 PM, Onesnotenough@... writes:

<< Someone even asked me, well, how do you think homeschooling is
going to work for you? (I didn't DARE say we would be unschooling!)
What I really need is some advice on how to handle the questions that are
surely to come over the next few months. >>

Say "We're just going to do it as long as it's working well for us."

That gives them hope that you will fail. <bwg>
But it also give them hope that you're not going to run it into the parched
and dusty rut of ignorance (which I'm sure they're imagining is possible or
probable).

<<Most of our families are behind us
100% , but like their uncle, he could care less and doesn't mind letting us
or
the boys know it.>>

He probably cares more than any of them, because you're scaring him and
threatening his stability. If he doesn't want his kid around your it's because up
to this time he was probably telling his son "That's just the way it is, we
don't have any choice," and your choice is making him a liar.

<< I am also concerned about how long to let them de-school, for lack of a
better word for it. The period from leaving school till ???? >>

Till they're deschooled.

If you're going to unschool there's not likely to be any difference between
deschooling and unschooling, honestly. You'll see them gradually twitch less
around "educational" stuff," but it's likely that by the time that comes, you
yourself will rejoice less at "educational" so if your deschooling curve meets
theirs at that point, it's going to be a smooth transition.

<< People keep asking me . how was school? What did you do today? OOOOOO, I
have tried to explain the reason for not schooling at the moment, no one
really
listens. But then, 2 months ago I didn't understand any of it myself. >>

I say "What we're doing is probably not what you're envisioning, but it's
going well." or "They learn every day!" or "We don't do school."

<<Someone even told me I would never be able to teach my 5 year old how to
read! Ha! I taught myself how to read before I was put in school! It isn't
to
me that big of a deal. >>

You learned.
You can't teach yourself what you don't know.
And you can't teach someone else, either. But you can help them learn.

This might help with moving from "teaching" ideas to "learning" ideas, and
though it might seem small, a two degree angle seems small right near the
starting point too, but the further it gets the more apparent it is that it's not
going to be so near that baseline.

http://sandradodd.com/wordswords

<<So, hear I sit. Depressed again this week getting down on myself for not
doing more. Am I doing this right? >>

I don't think it's as right as if you had spent that time and energy reading
about what other unschoolers' days are like.

And in your "doing more," don't aim it at your kids. Do more learning and
happy-living by and for yourself. They're right there and will see it. Don't
make them your life. Let them be a big part of your own whole life.

<<We have lots of books to read, and i do
read to Isaiah every night. Kaleb, on the other hand, could care less about
a
book in his hands!>>

http://sandradodd.com/bookandsax

Typical days collection:

http://sandradodd.com/typical

Deschooling:

http://sandradodd.com/deschooling

There's a link directly to the message boards at www.unschooling.com near the
top of this page:

http://sandradodd.com/unschooling

Sandra

zenmomma2kids

>>All this is a round about way of saying that I'm struggling right
along with you, but I think that it's the struggle that matters in
the end.>>

Unschooling is the journey, not the destination. :o)

Life is good.
~Mary

[email protected]

In a message dated 11/14/03 9:32:08 PM, danielle.conger@... writes:

<< So much of unschooling and TCS (Taking Children Seriously) >>

Just for the record, this isn't a TCS list.
A google search (or maybe someone here who has the link handy) could get you
there, but they're doing a particular thing elsewhere.

Sandra

Fetteroll

on 11/14/03 9:22 PM, Onesnotenough@... at Onesnotenough@... wrote:

> What I really need is some advice on how to handle the questions that are
> surely to come over the next few months.

There's a folder on the message boards at Unschooling.com
(http://www.unschooling.com) all about reluctant (and negative) family
members, Dealing with Reluctance
(http://www.unschooling.com/discus/messages/30/30.html?FridayOctober32003081
8pm) that's covered the topic numerous times.

> Now, what confuses me is the fact that other people that have claimed to
> unschool talk about using books and all the work they are getting done.
> Should
> I or should I not use books, when they are ready of course?

Since you're talking about "work" and "using" books I'm guessing you mean
textbooks.

If you *do* mean books for pleasure, then yes, wait until they're ready.
There's nothing magical about books that a person won't get what they need
if they don't like them. Make sure there are books around that they could
enjoy if they were interested. Rotate new ones from the library so they're
available even if they doesn't read them. Offer occasionally a snuggle on
the couch or in bed to read to them. Listen to books on tape. Get magazines
and books that deal with the subjects they're interested in.

If you do mean textbooks and doing school work ... Lots of people use the
word unschooling to mean relaxed homeschooling or eclectic. Maybe the kids
get to pick how they're going to do math, or they encourage activities that
look like academic activities, but the focus is on getting academics into a
child.

But here we discuss it as John Holt did, which is helping a child explore
his or her interests and running the world through their lives so they have
opportunities to expand their interests.

So the concept of being ready for textbooks is foreign.

Goodness! I'm not even sure where to begin! Unschooling is about doing and
living and pursuing interests. Learning happens as a side effect. It's like
working on a huge mural of your own design and filling in the details as you
come to them and need them.

Learning from a textbook is turning that process upside down. It's like
working on details here and there without any idea of what the mural looks
like or any say so in what it will be. It's working on the details of an eye
of something and then moving onto the details of the bark of something and
then moving onto the a piece of a rock and so on. It's all rigorous and
detailed but it's all meaningless because the pieces don't connect to each
other or anything larger. And the more meaningless and disconnected
something is, the less interesting it is and the less likely someone will
want to explore it further -- or even retain it.

> It seems my brother in law has already decided his son is not
> going to come around my kids anymore, and when my boys saw their uncle they
> got 50 questions shoved down their throat.

It's good that he's going to stay away so they aren't bombarded with 50
questions! If he does break his word and questions them, you can tell him
not to corner the kids any more. If he has questions to ask you.

He's probably scared and feels threatened by your decision. That might help
you see his behavior in a new light. (Understanding doesn't mean you need to
put up with it, though!) He is probably terrified that getting kids to turn
out right and getting them what they need is just so chancy that anything
that makes him question the choices he's making for them is going to be
upsetting. Basically people who send their kids to school have to trust that
the school can give kids what they need. Most people have a decent amount of
confidence that it is so. But if someone feels their confidence rattled (say
by troubling reports of schools) and that alternatives are even worse -- if
experts are doing such a poor job, then what does that say for amateurs like
mothers trying to teach their kids! -- then they have to stuff their fears
down and just hope for the best.

By your homeschooling you're throwing it in his face that you're so lacking
confidence in schools that you're willing to do it yourself, despite a lack
of professional training. Your actions are letting his fears come to the
surface and he doesn't want that. He wants to keep them stuffed down because
facing them is overwhelming and something he doesn't feel he has the ability
to tackle.

Joyce

Kelli Traaseth

on 11/14/03 9:22 PM, Onesnotenough@... at Onesnotenough@... wrote:

> What I really need is some advice on how to handle the questions that are
> surely to come over the next few months.


Joyce wrote:

**There's a folder on the message boards at Unschooling.com
(http://www.unschooling.com) all about reluctant (and negative) family
members, Dealing with Reluctance
(http://www.unschooling.com/discus/messages/30/30.html?FridayOctober32003081
8pm) that's covered the topic numerous times.**

I think what Joyce advised is so helpful. I know when I was starting out on my unschooling journey, the more I read there and here--the better. As you get more and more information in your own head and feel more comfortable, dealing with quesions does get easier. It does take some time though.

I also think that in the beginning when answering people's questions, less can sometimes be best. If someone asks how the home 'schooling' is going, I would just say that its going great and you're amazed at how much the kids are learning! You don't have to go into the entire explanation of unschooling or John Holt. I did that a few times and the people ended up looking like a deer in the headlights. <g> I've learned to be selective with whom I share the details. I know alot of times people just ask because they don't have the "how is school going" question to ask. As you get more comfortable with what you are doing and feel more at ease with talking about it, go for it. Especially if someone genuinely wants to know details.


> Now, what confuses me is the fact that other people that have claimed to
> unschool talk about using books and all the work they are getting done.
> Should
> I or should I not use books, when they are ready of course?


An example of how we were using a book yesterday. Which I would never have guessed we would be doing. :)
We ended up reading Macbeth! My 9 yr old dd and I! At her request. How does that happen?

We started with playing 'go fish'. We had just received a new deck of cards as a gift from a friend who had been to London. They were cards with pictures of flowers on them. The flowers were flowers that have been used in lines of Shakespears plays.

So we are playing go fish and Abbi decides that each time you draw a new card or when you have a card someone asks for, you have to read the quote and the other person has to guess what Shakespeare play its from. (Her idea) I'm like,,, OK. I think she's maybe familiar with 4 Shakespeare plays right now, so I'm hesistant (inside me) because she won't know many names to guess. But that's OK, I just go with it. We had so much fun. :) I did study Shakespeare in college so I'm somewhat familiar with the plays. So when she's read me one and we'd come to the play, we'd talk about what it was about. (If I could remember) Most of the quotes I had no idea, though.

Anyway, we came to a quote from Macbeth, "Root of hemlock digg'd i' the dark" (and there's a pic. of hemlock on the card) and I thought that was from the witches as they are stirring their cauldron. We go and google Shakespeare plays and find a website with lines from all the plays. Look up Macbeth and there ya go, there's the witches, as she is reading through the witches scene, (which is so fun to do, cackling and all) we had a really cool connection happen,,,,

She sees the lines, "Double, double, toil and trouble; Fire burn and Cauldron bubble." She stops and thinks, hmmm and I'm also stopping and thinking.

Earlier we had been downloading the trailer to the new Harry Potter movie, Prisoner of Azkaban, we had seen it in the theater when we went to the Looney Tunes movie and wanted to see it again. Well,,,,did you know that there's Shakespeare in Harry Potter? There's a choir singing "Double, double, toil and trouble; Fire burn and Cauldron bubble" over and over and then they also have, "Something wicked this way comes" which is from the same scene in Macbeth! Blew me over, it was so cool!

So of course we had to go and download the trailer again and listen to the music some more!

As we are doing that, Abbi decides she wants to read through the whole play of Macbeth. She wants to divide up the parts and take turns reading through it. I tell her I think I still have my Complete Works of Shakepeare up above the garage in storage and she is soooo excited! But she says we first have to finish our 'go fish' game. <g> After go fish, we go and dig out the Shakespeare book and... there you have it, we ended up sitting, reading Macbeth last night. I was amazed at how much she was understanding and how she sat there with her finger on each word as she read. Also, she wanted the Macbeth part! Lots of hard reading. There is so much to learn in reading Shakespeare, wow! The style of writing and speaking for one, the history, we looked up a ton of words. Ones that I didn't know either. A dictionary is another book we use, alot! We did that for 2 hours and will be finishing it today.

So yes, unschoolers do use books, its just when they want to use them. :))

Have a fun day in your new unschooling life.


Kelli~

PS. Oh, and if you want to check out that song and the trailer , just go to here: http://harrypotter.warnerbros.com/web/dailyprophet/article.jsp?id=POA_Teaser_Trailer






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 11/17/03 4:12:33 AM, fetteroll@... writes:

<< and running the world through their lives >>

And vice versa! <g>

Being at one with the world.

<<It's like
working on a huge mural of your own design and filling in the details as you
come to them and need them.>>

Good image!
I call it constructing our internal model of the universe, but the mural idea
is probably easier to envision. Except the mural IS the person, and vice
versa.

<<By your homeschooling you're throwing it in his face that you're so lacking
confidence in schools that you're willing to do it yourself, despite a lack
of professional training. Your actions are letting his fears come to the
surface and he doesn't want that. He wants to keep them stuffed down because
facing them is overwhelming and something he doesn't feel he has the ability
to tackle.>>

Excellently put.

So have compassion for his unfortunate position, but still keep him away from
your kids if and while he's hostile.

I feel sorry for a crazed pained dog, but I know better than to pick it up
and kiss its face.

We would contribute to a kind of world peace by just forgetting all of this
nonsense and putting our kids in school without comment, just quietly accept
whatever happens to them, knowing that statistically they're not likely to be
shot by another student, and that they have as much chance as anyone of
navigating school successfully.

That's all statistics, though. In reality, some have a greater chance of
being honors students. Some have a better chance of being prom queen or captain
of the football team.

In any situation which aims to have a few winners, there are by necessity a
WHOLE lot of losers.

So (in my disposable for-the-moment model here) the peace of the
school-parent community would be bought by sacrificing the peace of MANY individual
children.

And there lies the problem. My children's peace and prosperity has sadly
added to the frustration of other families which would have had more peace if
they didn't know that my kids frolick during school hours (after they wake up, at
noon).

It's a problem, but one for which I know no solution.

No one was more angry at liberated women during the early days of the women's
movement than other women who wanted boat rockers to SIT DOWN AND SHUT UP.

They wrecked the curve, is what they did (in school terms).

Sandra

pam sorooshian

On Nov 17, 2003, at 8:14 AM, SandraDodd@... wrote:

> That's all statistics, though. In reality, some have a greater chance
> of
> being honors students. Some have a better chance of being prom queen
> or captain
> of the football team.
>
> In any situation which aims to have a few winners, there are by
> necessity a
> WHOLE lot of losers.

And apparent winners are often really the biggest losers. Those prom
queens and football players - so popular in high school but sometimes
so very very unhappy later, when the bigger outside-of-high-school
world doesn't actually "care" about the prom or the high school
football team anymore.

-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

Kelli, your Macbeth story inspired me to add a Shakespeare link to my
"strewing" page. THANKS!!!

I have an article on Shakespeare here:
http://www.unschooling.com/library/essays/essay05.shtml

and now Kelli's account of how "Go Fish" led to Macbeth is here:

http://sandradodd.com/strew/shakespeare

and the main strewing page (still in progress, as I guess most of those pages
will always be, but this one isn't all filled in yet) is here:

http://sandradodd.com/strewing

Sandra

pam sorooshian

On Nov 17, 2003, at 8:52 AM, SandraDodd@... wrote:

> Kelli, your Macbeth story inspired me to add a Shakespeare link to my
> "strewing" page. THANKS!!!
>
All the works of Shakespeare are online here:
<http://www.online-literature.com/> and they are searchable - meaning
you can search for words or phrases.

Also - there is a place on the bottom of their front Shakespeare page
where you can sign up for a Shakespeare Sonnet email list -- I get a
Shakespeare sonnet in my email 3 times a week.

There are lots of other public domain works published there, too, and a
large quotations database.

-pam

[email protected]

In a message dated 11/17/2003 9:59:50 AM Central Standard Time,
tktraas@... writes:
I think what Joyce advised is so helpful. I know when I was starting out on
my unschooling journey, the more I read there and here--the better. As you
get more and more information in your own head and feel more comfortable,
dealing with quesions does get easier. It does take some time though.
~~~
And in the meantime you're not hovering over your child making sure he learns
something! I've often advised new homeschoolers to consider their kids on
"summer vacation" while they spend the next 6-8 months reading everything they
can about unschooling. ;)

Tuck


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelli Traaseth

----- Original Message -----
From: pam sorooshian

**All the works of Shakespeare are online here:
<http://www.online-literature.com/>**

Cool Pam, this is a different from what I found. I like that you can search quotes.

And this:

** there is a place on the bottom of their front Shakespeare page
where you can sign up for a Shakespeare Sonnet email list -- I get a
Shakespeare sonnet in my email 3 times a week.**
We are signing up for this. :))

Kelli~



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Crystal

> And apparent winners are often really the biggest losers. Those
prom
> queens and football players - so popular in high school but
sometimes
> so very very unhappy later, when the bigger outside-of-high-school
> world doesn't actually "care" about the prom or the high school
> football team anymore.

Have you seen Romy and Michelle's High School Reunion? It is all
about exactly what you are saying. My kids have all been to school,
so we can relate. It's one of my and my kids' favorite movies. I
loved that everyone's perception of themselves in school is so
different from who they really were inside and also different from
the way others actually saw them.

Crystal

Julie Solich

And there lies the problem. My children's peace and prosperity has sadly
added to the frustration of other families which would have had more peace
if they didn't know that my kids frolick during school hours (after they
wake up, at noon).

Sandra

This made me think of a poem by Jewel Kilcher. Here's part of it.

Steady yourself, love,
be strong beside me
and know that our
unrelenting gives them
dis-ease. And that
the clearer your mouth
raises itself in
songs of freedom
the more others will come to
warm themselves around
the flag of your faith
For our numbers grow
and soon will outweigh
their tattered armies
and I want your heart
to rejoice in its
inevitable victory

-Jewel Kilcher

Julie

>
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>

kayb85

I LOVE it! Are all of her poems that good?
Sheila

>
> Steady yourself, love,
> be strong beside me
> and know that our
> unrelenting gives them
> dis-ease. And that
> the clearer your mouth
> raises itself in
> songs of freedom
> the more others will come to
> warm themselves around
> the flag of your faith
> For our numbers grow
> and soon will outweigh
> their tattered armies
> and I want your heart
> to rejoice in its
> inevitable victory
>
> -Jewel Kilcher
>
> Julie

Julie Solich

> I LOVE it! Are all of her poems that good?
> Sheila


YES!

My husband bought me a book of her poetry a few years ago. It's called "a
night without armor". It's one of my favourite all time presents!

Julie
>
>
>
> "List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
>
> To unsubscribe from this send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
> Visit the Unschooling website and message boards:
http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

kayb85

Cool! I found a great deal at half.com on that book. (I LOVE
half.com!)
Sheila



> My husband bought me a book of her poetry a few years ago. It's
called "a
> night without armor". It's one of my favourite all time presents!
>
> Julie

24hrmom

<<Kelli Traaseth wrote: Earlier we had been downloading the trailer to the new Harry Potter movie, Prisoner of Azkaban, we had seen it in the theater when we went to the Looney Tunes movie and wanted to see it again. Well,,,,did you know that there's Shakespeare in Harry Potter? There's a choir singing "Double, double, toil and trouble; Fire burn and Cauldron bubble" over and over and then they also have, "Something wicked this way comes" which is from the same scene in Macbeth! Blew me over, it was so cool!>>

We've been watching the trailer as well, and this tidbit sent me to get out our complete works of Shakespeare and look it up. Did you notice that the witches in that scene are named The Weird Sisters? It seemed familiar so I asked my daughter and sure enough, that's the name of the band that plays at the Yule Ball in Goblet of Fire. We spent a few minutes as well discussing this!

Cool again.

Pam L.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

pam sorooshian

On Nov 17, 2003, at 7:16 PM, 24hrmom wrote:

> There's a choir singing "Double, double, toil and trouble; Fire burn
> and Cauldron bubble" over and over and then they also have,
> "Something wicked this way comes" which is from the same scene in
> Macbeth! Blew me over, it was so cool!>>

Another connection --- "Something Wicked This Way Comes" - Ray Bradbury
novel - carousel that stops or reverses time - evil carnival story (I
can't remember more about it). Which could lead to other Ray Bradbury
books and stories. I saw him speak a year or so ago and fell BACK in
love with him. What a guy!

And - another connection - Agatha Christie - "By the Pricking of My
Thumbs" - one of her novels. This is the line that comes right before
"Something wicked this way comes," in Macbeth.

-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robyn Coburn

I love them all. These books will probably end up published in annotated
versions, like "Name of the Rose". I have an annotated Alice in Wonderland.

Robyn L. Coburn





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelli Traaseth

----- Original Message -----
From: pam sorooshian

**Another connection --- "Something Wicked This Way Comes" - Ray Bradbury
novel - carousel that stops or reverses time - evil carnival story **

Alright, I was wondering why that sounded familiar, I think thats it. I don't think I was remembering Macbeth when I first saw the trailer.

I love these kind-of conversations. Its amazing how things link around to each other.

Kelli~





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 11-17-2003 10:25:58 PM Mountain Standard Time,
pamsoroosh@... writes:
Another connection --- "Something Wicked This Way Comes" - Ray Bradbury novel
- carousel that stops or reverses time - evil carnival story
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There's an evil carousel in Neil Geiman's book, American Gods. It's the
first time I'd heard his name, but now I understand he's quite the comic book
author. It was a good fantasy read.

diana,
The wackiest widow westriver...
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The
latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to
hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence." ~ Albert
Einstein


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

pam sorooshian

On Nov 17, 2003, at 9:29 PM, HaHaMommy@... wrote:

> There's an evil carousel in Neil Geiman's book, American Gods. It's
> the
> first time I'd heard his name, but now I understand he's quite the
> comic book
> author. It was a good fantasy read.

Was it here we talked about the names of the days of the week? Nordic
gods? Roxana (major major Neil Gaiman fan) points out the connection
back to that discussion because American Gods has a number of Nordic
gods in it. She also chastises me for not having read any Neil Gaiman -
she says he is absolutely brilliant!!!

-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]