Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Limits/showering
Kelli Traaseth
----- Original Message -----
From: tuckervill2@...
**I know some day he's going to want to be clean and look nice. Until then I
guess I'm just going to have to put a clothespin on my nose, I guess, and
insist on a shower for the most important things. Yuck.**
We are at the same point here too. My son is 10, how old is yours?
I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would coincide, :) nope.
I also just mention the bath/shower if we're going to be getting together with others. The whole close proximity thing. <g> He pretty much will go along with it. Its just so far down on his priority list right now.
Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too, which is new. I guess I used to be so anal about everything that he never had that choice. He's making it now. :)
Kelli~
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/03 10:04:14 AM Eastern Standard Time,
tktraas@... writes:
We are at the same point here too. My son is 10, how old is yours?
I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would coincide,
:) nope.
I also just mention the bath/shower if we're going to be getting together
with others. The whole close proximity thing. <g> He pretty much will go
along with it. Its just so far down on his priority list right now.
Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too
<<<<<<
I've written about out situation before.. basically its "ditto" My son is
12. he's been resisting taking a shower, brushing his teeth and wearing socks (
not wearing socks makes his feet STINK) and changing clothes. since he was
about 10.5.. Now, I am paying him .25 every time he brushes his teeth. I
have also paid him to take a shower. Usually, I just end up "making" him
take a shower and/or change clothes.
Teresa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tktraas@... writes:
We are at the same point here too. My son is 10, how old is yours?
I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would coincide,
:) nope.
I also just mention the bath/shower if we're going to be getting together
with others. The whole close proximity thing. <g> He pretty much will go
along with it. Its just so far down on his priority list right now.
Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too
<<<<<<
I've written about out situation before.. basically its "ditto" My son is
12. he's been resisting taking a shower, brushing his teeth and wearing socks (
not wearing socks makes his feet STINK) and changing clothes. since he was
about 10.5.. Now, I am paying him .25 every time he brushes his teeth. I
have also paid him to take a shower. Usually, I just end up "making" him
take a shower and/or change clothes.
Teresa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Scott Bieser
At 06:50 AM 11/7/2003, you wrote:
I have to step in and force the issue. Health and safety, which includes
personal hygiene, is one of those issues for me.
On the other hand, sometimes it helps to have a homeschooling support group
around.
My elder son Zeke started stinkin' about the time he turned 12, which was
also about the time he started getting really slack about changing clothes.
So one day we get in the car to go to our bi-weekly "Park Day" gathering of
local home-schoolers, and I comment that he should have showered or at
least changed his shirt. He just shrugged. That time I decided not to force
the issue and just drove to the park.
Shortly after we got there, Zeke was standing about 5 feet behind one of
the mothers, and that mom suddenly said, without turning around, "I can
tell you're there, Zeke, and I can't see you. Do you know why?"
"Uh, no, why?"
"Because I can SMELL you."
Ever since then, Zeke has always showered and put on a clean shirt before
going to Park Day, at least. Sometimes a comment from someone NOT the kid's
own parent can be powerful.
--Scott Bieser
proprietor, LibertyArtworx.com
Professional Graphics and Personal Opinions
http://www.libertyartworx.com
Buy stuff with my art on it!
http://www.cafepress.com/libartworx
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> ----- Original Message -----I try to be minimalist in my direction of my sons, but sometimes I believe
> From: tuckervill2@...
>
> **I know some day he's going to want to be clean and look nice. Until
> then I
> guess I'm just going to have to put a clothespin on my nose, I guess, and
> insist on a shower for the most important things. Yuck.**
>
> We are at the same point here too. My son is 10, how old is yours?
>
> I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would
> coincide, :) nope.
>
> I also just mention the bath/shower if we're going to be getting
> together with others. The whole close proximity thing. <g> He pretty
> much will go along with it. Its just so far down on his priority list
> right now.
>
> Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too, which is
> new. I guess I used to be so anal about everything that he never had
> that choice. He's making it now. :)
I have to step in and force the issue. Health and safety, which includes
personal hygiene, is one of those issues for me.
On the other hand, sometimes it helps to have a homeschooling support group
around.
My elder son Zeke started stinkin' about the time he turned 12, which was
also about the time he started getting really slack about changing clothes.
So one day we get in the car to go to our bi-weekly "Park Day" gathering of
local home-schoolers, and I comment that he should have showered or at
least changed his shirt. He just shrugged. That time I decided not to force
the issue and just drove to the park.
Shortly after we got there, Zeke was standing about 5 feet behind one of
the mothers, and that mom suddenly said, without turning around, "I can
tell you're there, Zeke, and I can't see you. Do you know why?"
"Uh, no, why?"
"Because I can SMELL you."
Ever since then, Zeke has always showered and put on a clean shirt before
going to Park Day, at least. Sometimes a comment from someone NOT the kid's
own parent can be powerful.
--Scott Bieser
proprietor, LibertyArtworx.com
Professional Graphics and Personal Opinions
http://www.libertyartworx.com
Buy stuff with my art on it!
http://www.cafepress.com/libartworx
----------
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[email protected]
<< I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would
coincide, :) nope.>>
first they smell themselves and get the response of another person or two
that they might want to take a shower, and THEN comes the desire to take at least
one shower a day if not two. That's the way it was with my boys.
IF the mother forces him to take a shower, then if he takes a shower he's
doing what his mom made him do, and he can have neither joy nor virtue.
Weird as it seems, if you want it to be something he discovers is wonderful,
you have no choice than to suffer through some weeks or months of stinky-boy.
Sandra
coincide, :) nope.>>
first they smell themselves and get the response of another person or two
that they might want to take a shower, and THEN comes the desire to take at least
one shower a day if not two. That's the way it was with my boys.
IF the mother forces him to take a shower, then if he takes a shower he's
doing what his mom made him do, and he can have neither joy nor virtue.
Weird as it seems, if you want it to be something he discovers is wonderful,
you have no choice than to suffer through some weeks or months of stinky-boy.
Sandra
The Scanlons
What about baths for your boys? Lots of bubbles and dinosaur toys. My
nearly 9 yr old, who has always been a rather particular fellow, is now
resisting showers. A bath is more palatable for him, though. When I get my
rear in gear to actually scrub the tub beforehand, it's a lot easier to get
him into the bath. Somehow, that tub just never stays clean.
Sandy
nearly 9 yr old, who has always been a rather particular fellow, is now
resisting showers. A bath is more palatable for him, though. When I get my
rear in gear to actually scrub the tub beforehand, it's a lot easier to get
him into the bath. Somehow, that tub just never stays clean.
Sandy
[email protected]
Nope, that's not it! <g>
We have been extremely laissez-faire from the beginning and yet have
the same situation with our eight-year-old boy. I think it must be a guy thing
more than a schooling or unschooling thing.
The funny part is that he's very sensitive to smell, so much so that
he'll only eat very bland foods and won't even be in the same room with us when
we're cooking anything that has a noticeable aroma, even a nice one. I have
read that physiologically, young children's keen sense of smell and taste makes
them less likely to appreciate spicy and strong-tasting foods (so it's not
just building familiarity but the actual aging process that makes us willing to
eat a wider variety of foods as adults.)
But his nose doesn't work when it comes to body odors or the fabric
they run off onto. I imagine it's more cultural than either of us realizes, why
I like food smells as naturally pleasing but avoid body odors, while he likes
natural body odors and finds food odors objectionable! :)
Maybe several of us could use some encouraging perspective from
unschooling moms whose sons USED to be like this and aren't anymore! JJ
We have been extremely laissez-faire from the beginning and yet have
the same situation with our eight-year-old boy. I think it must be a guy thing
more than a schooling or unschooling thing.
The funny part is that he's very sensitive to smell, so much so that
he'll only eat very bland foods and won't even be in the same room with us when
we're cooking anything that has a noticeable aroma, even a nice one. I have
read that physiologically, young children's keen sense of smell and taste makes
them less likely to appreciate spicy and strong-tasting foods (so it's not
just building familiarity but the actual aging process that makes us willing to
eat a wider variety of foods as adults.)
But his nose doesn't work when it comes to body odors or the fabric
they run off onto. I imagine it's more cultural than either of us realizes, why
I like food smells as naturally pleasing but avoid body odors, while he likes
natural body odors and finds food odors objectionable! :)
Maybe several of us could use some encouraging perspective from
unschooling moms whose sons USED to be like this and aren't anymore! JJ
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would coincide,
> :) nope.
>
> I also just mention the bath/shower if we're going to be getting together
> with others. The whole close proximity thing. <g> He pretty much will go
> along with it. Its just so far down on his priority list right now.
>
> Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too, which is
> new. I guess I used to be so anal about everything that he never had that
> choice. He's making it now. :)
>
[email protected]
tktraas@... writes:
before putting them in the wash. I figure it saves me in laundry! Now, I do this
too, but I limit it to two wearings and let them air out on a hanger between
them! I don't sleep in them! lol
But hey, I only had to buy him three pairs of jeans because he wears them
over and over! I consider that to be a GOOD thing!
~Aimee
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too, which isMy son is really wearing in his new jeans, wearing them quite a few times
> new. I guess I used to be so anal about everything that he never had that
> choice. He's making it now. :)
>
>
> Kelli~
before putting them in the wash. I figure it saves me in laundry! Now, I do this
too, but I limit it to two wearings and let them air out on a hanger between
them! I don't sleep in them! lol
But hey, I only had to buy him three pairs of jeans because he wears them
over and over! I consider that to be a GOOD thing!
~Aimee
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jrossedd
Yes, bubble baths are the only hope and he enjoys them once I can
lure him in. Then he won't get out!
It's kind of discouraging to hear that the problem only developed
with puberty for many of your sons. Must I brace myself for adding
new teenage smells on top of all the indoor drips and drops, outdoor
dirt, and unchanged clothes of an eight-year-old? OTOH, could it be
too much worse? (Don't tell me!) <g> JJ
--- In [email protected], "The Scanlons"
<scanlon36@o...> wrote:
lure him in. Then he won't get out!
It's kind of discouraging to hear that the problem only developed
with puberty for many of your sons. Must I brace myself for adding
new teenage smells on top of all the indoor drips and drops, outdoor
dirt, and unchanged clothes of an eight-year-old? OTOH, could it be
too much worse? (Don't tell me!) <g> JJ
--- In [email protected], "The Scanlons"
<scanlon36@o...> wrote:
> What about baths for your boys? Lots of bubbles and dinosaurtoys. My
> nearly 9 yr old, who has always been a rather particular fellow, isnow
> resisting showers. A bath is more palatable for him, though. >
The Scanlons
>I remember that my younger brother had the aversion to showers. Then, after
> It's kind of discouraging to hear that the problem only developed
> with puberty for many of your sons.
a few years of that, he did a 180 and you could never get the kid *out* of
the shower. Many years later, after I married, I watched my husband's much
younger brother go through the same cycle. Seems to be starting a bit
earlier with my son, but he's not so stinky just yet. It's just something I
expect and will get through.
Sandy
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/03 12:38:29 PM, jrossedd@... writes:
<< Maybe several of us could use some encouraging perspective from
unschooling moms whose sons USED to be like this and aren't anymore! >>
Kirby and Marty used to be like that and aren't anymore.
They take a shower every day because they want to.
There were times when I would just go in and open the windows in Kirby's room
and aim a fan out to vent the boy-smell, but I didn't do it hatefully, just
gently.
Sometimes I'd ask one of them to change his shirt if we were going somewhere,
and he would. Sometimes I'd say "If you're going with [whoever], maybe you
should plan enough time to take a shower." I didn't say "If you don't take a
shower you can't go."
The time came when they started smelling their friends. And there were jokes
about the smell of the gaming shop (MANY teen boys, no windows), and at the
anime convention where Kirby goes, he spoke on a panel this year about how to
have the best experience at a con, and one of their points was take a shower.
<g>
Maybe it's partly a boy thing, and partly a dweebish thing. In my (limited,
as to boys) experience, jockish boys are more likely to take showers than
sedentary kinds of boys, but for while early in puberty they all seem to need them
more.
Another thing worth thinking about is that it might be one of the triggers
for separation of mothers and sons. We have a lot of other teenaged boys here,
and though sometimes I've smelled the scent of one, they never stank, but my
own boys did (to me). I've talked to other moms about that too, and they'd
not had any complaints about my boys, but thought their own boys needed a shower
QUICKLY.
Sandra
<< Maybe several of us could use some encouraging perspective from
unschooling moms whose sons USED to be like this and aren't anymore! >>
Kirby and Marty used to be like that and aren't anymore.
They take a shower every day because they want to.
There were times when I would just go in and open the windows in Kirby's room
and aim a fan out to vent the boy-smell, but I didn't do it hatefully, just
gently.
Sometimes I'd ask one of them to change his shirt if we were going somewhere,
and he would. Sometimes I'd say "If you're going with [whoever], maybe you
should plan enough time to take a shower." I didn't say "If you don't take a
shower you can't go."
The time came when they started smelling their friends. And there were jokes
about the smell of the gaming shop (MANY teen boys, no windows), and at the
anime convention where Kirby goes, he spoke on a panel this year about how to
have the best experience at a con, and one of their points was take a shower.
<g>
Maybe it's partly a boy thing, and partly a dweebish thing. In my (limited,
as to boys) experience, jockish boys are more likely to take showers than
sedentary kinds of boys, but for while early in puberty they all seem to need them
more.
Another thing worth thinking about is that it might be one of the triggers
for separation of mothers and sons. We have a lot of other teenaged boys here,
and though sometimes I've smelled the scent of one, they never stank, but my
own boys did (to me). I've talked to other moms about that too, and they'd
not had any complaints about my boys, but thought their own boys needed a shower
QUICKLY.
Sandra
nicole
----- Original Message -----
"Kelli Traaseth" <tktraas@...>
> Subject: Re: Limits/showering
> We are at the same point here too. My son is 10, how old is yours?
>
> I thought the wanting to get clean and the smell coming on would
coincide, :) nope.
>
> I also just mention the bath/shower if we're going to be getting
together with others. The whole close proximity thing. <g> He pretty much
will go along with it. Its just so far down on his priority list right
now.
>
> Also, him wearing the same clothes forever! To sleep in too, which is
new. I guess I used to be so anal about everything that he never had that
choice. He's making it now. :)
Kelli do you have my son's twin? LOL Mine is 9 and it started this year. He
HATES to stop ANYTHING to shower or bathe but will reluctantly with lots of
reminding. I cannot even imagine feeling how he must feel being dirty but he
honestly doesn't seem to mind. The sleeping in the same clothes and
re-wearing clothes multiple times is playing on my patience and my sanity
LOL
I think it's plain disgusting (this comes from someone who LOVES baths!)
LOL Apparently this is a boy thing? Do they ever outgrow it?!?!
LOL I sure hope so! I remember my brother taking showers for so long we
thought he drown in there. Then he'd come out and smell SO good and look so
nice but then he was a few years older than my son - at least when I can
remember that happening.
Ah well...the glory of boys!
Nicole
Betsy
** Maybe several of us could use some encouraging perspective from
unschooling moms whose sons USED to be like this and aren't anymore! JJ
**
Hi, JJ
I'm basically in the same boat with you with my 9 year old. I think
that perhaps one's nose becomes quickly accustomed to one's own odors,
so that a stink that others can smell is just unnoticeable to the boy
exuding it.
I'm trying to just be lighthearted and teasing about it, but I don't
want my son to have to hear from other kids that he smells bad.
I will work on trying to keep the tub nicer. (I bathe without my
glasses, so I notice a lot less than everyone else, regrettably.)
Betsy
unschooling moms whose sons USED to be like this and aren't anymore! JJ
**
Hi, JJ
I'm basically in the same boat with you with my 9 year old. I think
that perhaps one's nose becomes quickly accustomed to one's own odors,
so that a stink that others can smell is just unnoticeable to the boy
exuding it.
I'm trying to just be lighthearted and teasing about it, but I don't
want my son to have to hear from other kids that he smells bad.
I will work on trying to keep the tub nicer. (I bathe without my
glasses, so I notice a lot less than everyone else, regrettably.)
Betsy
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/2003 9:04:52 AM Central Standard Time,
tktraas@... writes:
My son is 10, how old is yours?
~~~
Just turned 10 on Wednesday!
He does like to dress nice ("cool"), but could care less about stinking up
the joint. I know someday he's going to take 2 showers a day like his 19 year
old brother did. I just sometimes wish it was now. lol.
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tktraas@... writes:
My son is 10, how old is yours?
~~~
Just turned 10 on Wednesday!
He does like to dress nice ("cool"), but could care less about stinking up
the joint. I know someday he's going to take 2 showers a day like his 19 year
old brother did. I just sometimes wish it was now. lol.
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/2003 1:44:46 PM Central Standard Time,
scanlon36@... writes:
What about baths for your boys?
~~~
Another developmental thing is fears. He's afraid of being in a room by
himself if there's not a light or a TV or music on. He wants easy access to me or
dad, too. Being in the shower or bathtub is creepy for him right now. When
he does shower, he doesn't want me in the bathroom, but he wants me to be
right outside the door, in my room.
Ten was really hard on my other sons in the fear department. They had deep
thoughts about death and dying and a higher power and had to talk about them
late at night. I was just consoling a friend whose 10 yo won't spend the night
for Will's birthday because he's afraid. He's never had this problem before.
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
scanlon36@... writes:
What about baths for your boys?
~~~
Another developmental thing is fears. He's afraid of being in a room by
himself if there's not a light or a TV or music on. He wants easy access to me or
dad, too. Being in the shower or bathtub is creepy for him right now. When
he does shower, he doesn't want me in the bathroom, but he wants me to be
right outside the door, in my room.
Ten was really hard on my other sons in the fear department. They had deep
thoughts about death and dying and a higher power and had to talk about them
late at night. I was just consoling a friend whose 10 yo won't spend the night
for Will's birthday because he's afraid. He's never had this problem before.
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Elizabeth Roberts
I've been following this thread about boys and not showering with dread. Is this what I have to look forward to when Logan is older?! YIKES!
Males are weird creatures.
Elizabeth in MA
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Males are weird creatures.
Elizabeth in MA
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Kelli Traaseth
**My son is 10, how old is yours?**
~~~
**Just turned 10 on Wednesday!**
There ya go. Too funny, <g>
**He does like to dress nice ("cool"),**
Yeah, Alec too, he goes through phases. Like when we were in Mexico he had to buy a necklace to wear and some types of pants he really likes. But I guess I am glad that he's not too worried about his appearance right now. Like what others will think and all that. He is definately his own person. :)
Kelli~
~~~
**Just turned 10 on Wednesday!**
There ya go. Too funny, <g>
**He does like to dress nice ("cool"),**
Yeah, Alec too, he goes through phases. Like when we were in Mexico he had to buy a necklace to wear and some types of pants he really likes. But I guess I am glad that he's not too worried about his appearance right now. Like what others will think and all that. He is definately his own person. :)
Kelli~
----- Original Message -----
From: tuckervill2@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, November 07, 2003 4:45 PM
Subject: Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Limits/showering
In a message dated 11/7/2003 9:04:52 AM Central Standard Time,
tktraas@... writes:
My son is 10, how old is yours?
~~~
Just turned 10 on Wednesday!
He does like to dress nice ("cool"), but could care less about stinking up
the joint. I know someday he's going to take 2 showers a day like his 19 year
old brother did. I just sometimes wish it was now. lol.
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Kelli Traaseth
----- Original Message -----
From: tuckervill2@...
**Another developmental thing is fears. He's afraid of being in a room by
himself if there's not a light or a TV or music on.**
Wow, this is interesting. Maybe that's why Alec is sleeping in our room at night. He just does not want to sleep by himself anymore. His sister, who is 9, just decided she wanted her own room and here we have her older bro who wants to sleep with Mom and Dad.
I'm OK with it, I know it won't last. Its created a closeness between us too that's really cool.
Kelli~
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Mary
From: <AimeeL73@...>
<<But hey, I only had to buy him three pairs of jeans because he wears them
over and over! I consider that to be a GOOD thing!>>
My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and then it's in
the laundry. Except for shoes!!! You can imagine the laundry I have with a
family of 6 and her doing school, work and social stuff!!!! It's at least 2
full outfits a day for her. On days she works, it's 3.
Mary B.
http://www.homeschoolingtshirts.com
<<But hey, I only had to buy him three pairs of jeans because he wears them
over and over! I consider that to be a GOOD thing!>>
My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and then it's in
the laundry. Except for shoes!!! You can imagine the laundry I have with a
family of 6 and her doing school, work and social stuff!!!! It's at least 2
full outfits a day for her. On days she works, it's 3.
Mary B.
http://www.homeschoolingtshirts.com
Marjorie Kirk
> ~~~to me or
> Another developmental thing is fears. He's afraid of being in a room by
> himself if there's not a light or a TV or music on. He wants easy access
> dad, too. Being in the shower or bathtub is creepy for him right now.When
> he does shower, he doesn't want me in the bathroom, but he wants me to beHave you tried taking a radio or tape player into the bathroom for him, so
> right outside the door, in my room.
>
>
> Tuck
>
he can listen to music while he bathes? Or maybe pulling the shower curtain
closed, but leaving the bathroom door open so he can chat with you while you
are going about you business?
marjorie
[email protected]
Thanks, Sandra!
This helps. :) JJ
This helps. :) JJ
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/03 8:54:39 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
Sometimes I'd ask one of them to change his shirt if we were going somewhere,
and he would.
shirt? What if you were going to a family reunion, where lots of folks hadn't
seen your children in months, maybe years.. Perhaps a lot of the relatives did
not embrace homeschooling, let alone unschooling.. The kid has on a 4 day old
shirt, steeped in armpit odor, spaghetti stains, maybe some snot and of course
regular dirt.. The kid knows he is going to this shindig, he wants to go..
enjoys seeing his cousins and the big dinner.. But, he don't want to change his
shirt? This is a very specific question, but you could insert "any formal
type setting" . or heck, even a casual night out for pizza and movies..
Basically, anywhere in public, where folks would assume neglectful parenting if they
saw the way your kid was dressed/smelled.
I know that I always gently suggest some "hygiene" .. several times..
before I get to the insisting.. If the guys changed thier shirts with no
resistance, then we wouldn't be having this discussion. You are lucky that your boys
changed/showered/cleaned up when you gently suggested it. I don't think it
is the same as what some folks here are experiencing.. YES, most early
pubescent boys STINK! And, yes, Im sure many of them need some gentle guidance
and reminders to shower and freshen up.. but we are talking about resisting
hygiene all together. If that were the case, what would you do?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
Sometimes I'd ask one of them to change his shirt if we were going somewhere,
and he would.
>>>Just out of curiousity.. what would you have done if he didnt change his
shirt? What if you were going to a family reunion, where lots of folks hadn't
seen your children in months, maybe years.. Perhaps a lot of the relatives did
not embrace homeschooling, let alone unschooling.. The kid has on a 4 day old
shirt, steeped in armpit odor, spaghetti stains, maybe some snot and of course
regular dirt.. The kid knows he is going to this shindig, he wants to go..
enjoys seeing his cousins and the big dinner.. But, he don't want to change his
shirt? This is a very specific question, but you could insert "any formal
type setting" . or heck, even a casual night out for pizza and movies..
Basically, anywhere in public, where folks would assume neglectful parenting if they
saw the way your kid was dressed/smelled.
I know that I always gently suggest some "hygiene" .. several times..
before I get to the insisting.. If the guys changed thier shirts with no
resistance, then we wouldn't be having this discussion. You are lucky that your boys
changed/showered/cleaned up when you gently suggested it. I don't think it
is the same as what some folks here are experiencing.. YES, most early
pubescent boys STINK! And, yes, Im sure many of them need some gentle guidance
and reminders to shower and freshen up.. but we are talking about resisting
hygiene all together. If that were the case, what would you do?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
pam sorooshian
On Nov 7, 2003, at 7:47 PM, TeresaBnNC@... wrote:
not about how Sandra would deal with a hypothetical situation that
wouldn't even arise between her and her boys.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> You are lucky that your boys changed/showered/cleaned up when youI don't think luck has anything to do with it.
> gently suggested it.
> I don't think it is the same as what some folks here areThen we should be talking more about how to build up mutual respect,
> experiencing..
not about how Sandra would deal with a hypothetical situation that
wouldn't even arise between her and her boys.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
Fetteroll
on 11/7/03 6:18 PM, Elizabeth Roberts at mamabethuscg@... wrote:
So am I. So is my husband. So are my cats. ;-)
You know, I've said similar things about oddnesses in life to my daughter
and I've noticed it brings discussion to a halt. It dismisses the
person/thing and action as not worthy of further discussion.
Now I say "Males are interesting," in a curious, pondering voice :-)
Joyce
> Males are weird creatures.So are females.
So am I. So is my husband. So are my cats. ;-)
You know, I've said similar things about oddnesses in life to my daughter
and I've noticed it brings discussion to a halt. It dismisses the
person/thing and action as not worthy of further discussion.
Now I say "Males are interesting," in a curious, pondering voice :-)
Joyce
Heidi
What about her doing her own laundry? Just teach her to make the
water level lower if it's a smaller load, and let her be responsible
for her own clean clothes...if she's got a job, she's probably very
capable of laundry.
Blessings, HeidiC
water level lower if it's a smaller load, and let her be responsible
for her own clean clothes...if she's got a job, she's probably very
capable of laundry.
Blessings, HeidiC
> My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and thenit's in
> the laundry. Except for shoes!!! You can imagine the laundry I havewith a
> family of 6 and her doing school, work and social stuff!!!! It's atleast 2
> full outfits a day for her. On days she works, it's 3.
>
>
> Mary B.
> http://www.homeschoolingtshirts.com
Shyrley
Mary wrote:
now being fussy about what she wears. One of her friends told her she
was ugly and unfashionable so I now have to deal with daily meltdowns
about what she's going to put on when she used to throw on any old
thing. Money is tight yet she feels she has to have nice clothes to be
'accepted'. Grrrrr
Luckily my two boys are slobs, will wear anything until it has to be
peeled off them. They are 10 and 8 and so far have no detectable odour.
They don't object to baths as such, just the time the bath removes them
from in front of the computer!
Shyrley
>From: <AimeeL73@...>My 11yo has just strated chaging her clothes several times a day and is
>
><<But hey, I only had to buy him three pairs of jeans because he wears them
>over and over! I consider that to be a GOOD thing!>>
>
>
>My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and then it's in
>the laundry. Except for shoes!!! You can imagine the laundry I have with a
>family of 6 and her doing school, work and social stuff!!!! It's at least 2
>full outfits a day for her. On days she works, it's 3.
>
>
>Mary B.
>http://www.homeschoolingtshirts.com
>
>
>
now being fussy about what she wears. One of her friends told her she
was ugly and unfashionable so I now have to deal with daily meltdowns
about what she's going to put on when she used to throw on any old
thing. Money is tight yet she feels she has to have nice clothes to be
'accepted'. Grrrrr
Luckily my two boys are slobs, will wear anything until it has to be
peeled off them. They are 10 and 8 and so far have no detectable odour.
They don't object to baths as such, just the time the bath removes them
from in front of the computer!
Shyrley
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/8/03 12:25:14 AM, msnicoleymca@... writes:
<< I think it's plain disgusting (this comes from someone who LOVES baths!)
LOL Apparently this is a boy thing? Do they ever outgrow it?!?! >>
Part of our culture's rejection of human instinct and denial that there ARE
"natural" ways for humans to be involves destroying the evidence.
Much of what makes nursing work well involves scent--the mothers smeling the
babies' heads, the babies being in proximity of the mother's armpit. Some of
sexuality involves scent. So to avoid sexuality, our culture has relatively
lately insisted on daily washing with soap, followed by application of things
to prevent natural smell returning. If men smell like storebought scents
and women smell like powdered anti-perspirant, we can go on to judging people
by physical appearance instead of using any real clues we might get from
smelling whether they seem happy or afraid or aroused.
So though we're all stuck in this culture, let's please not be so proud of
lending TOO much power to the anti-instinct, anti-nature forces that create
artificial differences between men and women and unnecessary artificial
differences between people and animals.
How could strong scent in a teenaged boy be adaptive biologically?
I do think it has to do with nest-leaving. Easier to push a stinky boy away
than one who smells like milk.
It might also have to do with (if we were sleeping in a cave or near an open
campfire) alerting prowling animals that humans were there and they might not
want to mess with them because they fight back pretty efficiently if they have
sticks and rocks.
I could be wrong, but if I didn't think I had a good chance of being right, I
wouldn't write it and hit "send."
It's worth thinking about.
Sandra
<< I think it's plain disgusting (this comes from someone who LOVES baths!)
LOL Apparently this is a boy thing? Do they ever outgrow it?!?! >>
Part of our culture's rejection of human instinct and denial that there ARE
"natural" ways for humans to be involves destroying the evidence.
Much of what makes nursing work well involves scent--the mothers smeling the
babies' heads, the babies being in proximity of the mother's armpit. Some of
sexuality involves scent. So to avoid sexuality, our culture has relatively
lately insisted on daily washing with soap, followed by application of things
to prevent natural smell returning. If men smell like storebought scents
and women smell like powdered anti-perspirant, we can go on to judging people
by physical appearance instead of using any real clues we might get from
smelling whether they seem happy or afraid or aroused.
So though we're all stuck in this culture, let's please not be so proud of
lending TOO much power to the anti-instinct, anti-nature forces that create
artificial differences between men and women and unnecessary artificial
differences between people and animals.
How could strong scent in a teenaged boy be adaptive biologically?
I do think it has to do with nest-leaving. Easier to push a stinky boy away
than one who smells like milk.
It might also have to do with (if we were sleeping in a cave or near an open
campfire) alerting prowling animals that humans were there and they might not
want to mess with them because they fight back pretty efficiently if they have
sticks and rocks.
I could be wrong, but if I didn't think I had a good chance of being right, I
wouldn't write it and hit "send."
It's worth thinking about.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/03 10:38:40 PM, mkirk@... writes:
<< Have you tried taking a radio or tape player into the bathroom for him, so
he can listen to music while he bathes? >>
Both Holly and Marty went through phases of wanting to take a long bath with
music on in the room. We'd put a boom box over the sink and find a long tape
and if I heard it end I would turn it over if they weren't ready to get out.
That's good for kids who are restless/hyper and like to do two things at
once. With cool enough tub toys, they get three things at once.
One of the best tub toys we've found is ice. Regular ice cubes are okay, but
ice frozen into molds (metal fish molds are easy to find--people hang them on
the wall and they're in thrift stores; we've used plastic toy boat hulls to
make ice boats; bundt pans make ring-ice) floats, melts interestingly, and
doesn't make a mess in the tub. You don't have to put it away later.
Sandra
<< Have you tried taking a radio or tape player into the bathroom for him, so
he can listen to music while he bathes? >>
Both Holly and Marty went through phases of wanting to take a long bath with
music on in the room. We'd put a boom box over the sink and find a long tape
and if I heard it end I would turn it over if they weren't ready to get out.
That's good for kids who are restless/hyper and like to do two things at
once. With cool enough tub toys, they get three things at once.
One of the best tub toys we've found is ice. Regular ice cubes are okay, but
ice frozen into molds (metal fish molds are easy to find--people hang them on
the wall and they're in thrift stores; we've used plastic toy boat hulls to
make ice boats; bundt pans make ring-ice) floats, melts interestingly, and
doesn't make a mess in the tub. You don't have to put it away later.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/8/03 6:15:35 AM, bunsofaluminum60@... writes:
<< > My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and then
it's in
less.
Clothes stink before people stink. Men who work barechested in the sun don't
stink as much as those who wet a T-shirt with sweat. Then the t-shirt really
stinks.
Perspiration is natural and (at least in the desert) functional. But there's
salt and other waste-stuff in there that are not good for the material if
they dry and then are stirred up again. Wool can handle not being washed, but
cotton not so well. And polyester stinks some even without people-smells on it.
I think pants can be worn more than once, but shirts shouldn't be, nor bras,
nor panties. I would encourage a girl to wash clothes that were next to any
scent-producing body parts. I would not complain about washing them for her.
Sandra
<< > My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and then
it's in
> the laundry. >>Interesting that on one hand people want more cleanlines, and on the other,
less.
Clothes stink before people stink. Men who work barechested in the sun don't
stink as much as those who wet a T-shirt with sweat. Then the t-shirt really
stinks.
Perspiration is natural and (at least in the desert) functional. But there's
salt and other waste-stuff in there that are not good for the material if
they dry and then are stirred up again. Wool can handle not being washed, but
cotton not so well. And polyester stinks some even without people-smells on it.
I think pants can be worn more than once, but shirts shouldn't be, nor bras,
nor panties. I would encourage a girl to wash clothes that were next to any
scent-producing body parts. I would not complain about washing them for her.
Sandra
nyneca
--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
have > sticks and rocks.
This comment brought back memories. I used to date a guy who went deer
hunting every fall. I learned from him that hunters never wash thier camo
outfits and avoid showering several days before opening day. Apparently the
deer can smell laundry products and soaps and shampoos from much farther
away than natural human body odors.
You may be right about strong body odors, though. I've heard anecdotal
reports of human urine applied to, say, the higher parts of landscaping plants
acting as a deterent to browsing animals by suggesting that a large predatory
mammal may be nearby.
Ellen
>not > want to mess with them because they fight back pretty efficiently if they
> How could strong scent in a teenaged boy be adaptive biologically?
> It might also have to do with (if we were sleeping in a cave or near an open
> campfire) alerting prowling animals that humans were there and they might
have > sticks and rocks.
This comment brought back memories. I used to date a guy who went deer
hunting every fall. I learned from him that hunters never wash thier camo
outfits and avoid showering several days before opening day. Apparently the
deer can smell laundry products and soaps and shampoos from much farther
away than natural human body odors.
You may be right about strong body odors, though. I've heard anecdotal
reports of human urine applied to, say, the higher parts of landscaping plants
acting as a deterent to browsing animals by suggesting that a large predatory
mammal may be nearby.
Ellen
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/7/03 6:08:56 PM Central Standard Time,
mummy124@... writes:
using her house as a closet, I only came home to shower and change and then leave
again...School, change,work, change, party. Repeat. And somehow I fit sleep
in there somewhere...lol
~Aimee
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mummy124@... writes:
> <<But hey, I only had to buy him three pairs of jeans because he wears themI was like that in my late teens. My mother joked at the time that I was
> over and over! I consider that to be a GOOD thing!>>
>
>
> My oldest daughter refuses to wear anything more than once and then it's in
> the laundry. Except for shoes!!! You can imagine the laundry I have with a
> family of 6 and her doing school, work and social stuff!!!! It's at least 2
> full outfits a day for her. On days she works, it's 3.
>
>
> Mary B.
using her house as a closet, I only came home to shower and change and then leave
again...School, change,work, change, party. Repeat. And somehow I fit sleep
in there somewhere...lol
~Aimee
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]