Julie Bogart

Hi all.

My 9 year old son is determined to be an animal trainer when he
grows up. We were are the zoo today and the trainers we met
talked a lot about college, zoology majors etc. as prep for animal
training. I asked about things he could do now or in the near
future that were with real animals (he's interested in cheetahs
and birds of prey). Pretty much came back with blanks.

Has anyone found meaningful ways for their kids to become
involved with wildlife (not just domestic animals--we've had pet
rats and a bunny and are planning to get a dog)?

And does anyone know if there is a better way to prepare than all
those in class hours? My son is amazingly knowledgeable about
the animals he loves and all that without any instruction. He
reads what interests him and gleans much from nature
programs and we go to the zoo and out birding together. He's
definitely not the kind of kid who is interested in classroom
instruction of any kind.

I just wondered what experiences some of you may have had
with kids like this (especially those who have children who went
into work with wildlife as adults, if there are any of you).

Thanks!

Julie B

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/03 02:22:24 AM Central Daylight Time,
julie@... writes:
Has anyone found meaningful ways for their kids to become
involved with wildlife (not just domestic animals--we've had pet
rats and a bunny and are planning to get a dog)?

And does anyone know if there is a better way to prepare than all
those in class hours? My son is amazingly knowledgeable about
the animals he loves and all that without any instruction. He
reads what interests him and gleans much from nature
programs and we go to the zoo and out birding together. He's
definitely not the kind of kid who is interested in classroom
instruction of any kind.

I just wondered what experiences some of you may have had
with kids like this (especially those who have children who went
into work with wildlife as adults, if there are any of you).
**************************************************

My dd, Moly (also 9) wants to be a vet. She is trying to volunteer at our
vet's office. She spends time at a local wildlife rescue/refuge as well. Her Girl
Scout leader works there and is a contact for people who have found injured
wildlife, or need opossums, raccoons, etc. removed from their homes, garages,
sheds and whatnot. She is the person who got Moly involved in caring for
animals at the nature center. At this time, they are feeding both a bald and golden
eagle, a turkey vulture, two coyote pups, an orphaned fawn, various snakes,
turtles, a cross eyed opossum, and other small birds.

She participates in the local Audubon society, going on bird watching walks,
and some of the "field trips" (for lack of a better word) they offer. We also
go to K-State every now and then to go through the vet school where she can
ask questions, and out to the Kanza Prairie. She also participates in some of
our local zoo's educational programs, and although she likes most of the
programs, she isn't too happy with the zoo. Lately they have had some problems and
have been under investigation at various times in the past few years. But, to
their credit, they are working very hard at improving the conditions for the
animals; expanding habitats, making the habitats more natural and so on.

Other things Moly does is read tons and tons of books on anything animal
related, and watch as much Animal Planet as her heart desires. Some of her
favorite shows are The Crocodile Hunter (and all the spin-offs of that) The Jeff
Corwin Experience, and Animal Cops. The last one is kind of heart wrenching to
watch, and depending on her mood, Moly will say she wants to be a vet, so she can
help the animals on the show. An animal cop, so she can rescue the animals
and arrest people who mistreat the animals, both a vet and a cop, because
sometimes the animals need both at the same time. And sometimes she gets so upset
over some horror, she just wants to do to the people the same things they do to
the animals.

This past summer, she found out about a protest of a local pet store chain
because of their known practice of buying and selling puppy mill puppies and she
wanted to participate, so she did.

There are many, many things a person can do. Look for nature centers,
wildlife rescues, zoos, shelters, vets... anyone who welcomes volunteers. Keep an eye
out for injured wildlife on walks, but be careful because injured animals
tend to bite, some carry rabies and bubonic plague. Raccoons tend to be rabid,
prairie dogs and gophers tend to carry the plague, crows tend to carry the west
Nile virus. Also, know that in some areas birds with injured wings are iffy.
If the wing is repairable and the bird could be returned to the wild, then they
are, but there are some new laws that state that birds with wings that have
to be amputated or are otherwise useless cannot be used as teaching birds
anymore, but must be euthanized. So don't be discouraged if that is the case in
your area too. Another thing to be aware of is local and state wildlife laws, if
your son is a "collector" of pets know that sometimes some animals are
endangered or protected. Our state reptile, the box turtle, is protected. When my
kids find one on the road, we let them keep it for a few days to check that it is
healthy and not in need of vet attention. Then we release them far out in the
country or at the nature center, as it is illegal to keep them, no matter
that the kids really want one as a pet!

Good luck to your son!
~Nancy

We call them dumb animals, and so they are, for they cannot tell us how they
feel, but they do not suffer less because they have no words.
Anna Sewell


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/2003 3:22:20 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
julie@... writes:
And does anyone know if there is a better way to prepare than all
those in class hours? ...
I just wondered what experiences some of you may have had
with kids like this (especially those who have children who went
into work with wildlife as adults, if there are any of you).
Columbia has a wildlife rescue organization. It's mostly raptors, but they
rehabilitate ANYTHING wild (injured turtles, foxes, opossums, bobcats, bunnies).
They know about me: I get all their domestic rabbits. When the novelty has
worn off, some folks think that they can just release a domestic bunny out into
the wild---or that they can drop it of at Wildlife Care. But since they aren't
wild and I have a bunny cage.... Anyway, you might try asking around for
something similar---or STARTING something similar. Ours was started with grants.
It's a small building with a lot of cages (mostly dog crates and bird cages).

I'm SURE that if your son would start one, he could get plenty of press
coverage, grants, donations, and volunteers as well as info and assistance from the
zoo (and not just your own). He would need special permission of some sort to
handle raptors as it's illegal to posess many of the birds of prey--or even a
feather!

The organization here is Wildlife Care of Carolina. 5551 Bush River Road
Columbia, SC 29212 (803) 772 3994. I can't imagine that they wouldn't agree to
talk with you and answer questions.

We also know of a wolf rehab group in North Carolina. I'm sure that if you
asked around, you'll find others nearby with the same interest and SOMEONE
willing to give him a leg up. I know that Wildlife Care is always in need of money
AND volunteers!

As for animal TRAINING, he might want to look into movies. If there are any
movies made in your area, there's bound to be a wrangler. Hook up with one.
Agree to kennel sit/scoop poop/water & feed the animals during the week when most
kids are in school. All that will also work with dog breeders. We often need
someone to "man the kennel" during a show weekend. With some time, he could
soon be GOING to the shows as an assistant and handling the dogs.

Ren's recently gotten into falconry and has been training raptors----she can
give some info there.

An ability to handle and understand animals is another one of those
"intelligences".

Good luck! A boy after my own heart!

~Kelly


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[email protected]

OH! And look around for a naturalist! Rudy Mancke is our local guru. He's
INCREDIBLE and would be happy to talk with your son about ALL things wild---birds
and animals and rocks and plants! He is amazing!

You can google him for his webpage---oh hell, so can I :
http://www.scetv.org/pressroom/NatureScene-Presskit/html/biographies-1.html

Actually, go ahead and google him---he pops up several times! I can get you
his phone number too, if you need it. He may know of a local-to-you naturalist
who would be willing to talk with your son.

~Kelly


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Holly Furgason

I know there are student divisions of the American Zoo Keeper
Association and the (International?) Association of Avian Educators
and Trainers. I think you need to be high school age but they have
notices of internships, conferences and other opportunities.

My daughter wants to be an avian vet and bird trainer. She has been
volunteering at the zoo for the last couple of years and they have a
special bird show. When I talked to the people who do the show, I
got the feeling that their education came first so they didn't even
consider the fact that you can train animals without a degree. I
think in the end though, it will boil down to who does the best job.

I was talking to a long time friend in CO yesterday and she said her
24 year old daughter will be graduating from college after this
September and will finally be able to start creating web pages for
people. My 13 year old daughter has been making web pages for 2
years now and has several clients including a public school plus a
waiting list. I don't think it ever dawned on my friend that you can
just start learning it on your own. :-) Same thing with the zoo
people.

Holly

--- In [email protected], "Julie Bogart"
<julie@b...> wrote:
> Hi all.
>
> My 9 year old son is determined to be an animal trainer when he
> grows up. We were are the zoo today and the trainers we met
> talked a lot about college, zoology majors etc. as prep for animal
> training. I asked about things he could do now or in the near
> future that were with real animals (he's interested in cheetahs
> and birds of prey). Pretty much came back with blanks.
>
> Has anyone found meaningful ways for their kids to become
> involved with wildlife (not just domestic animals--we've had pet
> rats and a bunny and are planning to get a dog)?
>
> And does anyone know if there is a better way to prepare than all
> those in class hours? My son is amazingly knowledgeable about
> the animals he loves and all that without any instruction. He
> reads what interests him and gleans much from nature
> programs and we go to the zoo and out birding together. He's
> definitely not the kind of kid who is interested in classroom
> instruction of any kind.
>
> I just wondered what experiences some of you may have had
> with kids like this (especially those who have children who went
> into work with wildlife as adults, if there are any of you).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Julie B

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/03 3:22:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
julie@... writes:

> Has anyone found meaningful ways for their kids to become
> involved with wildlife (not just domestic animals--we've had pet
> rats and a bunny and are planning to get a dog)?
>
>

I know some of the smaller zoos around here need and ask for volunteers.
Also some friends of mine have different pets like reptiles of different types
and tarantulas and they go into the schools to answer questions and let the kids
have contact with these animals that they might not otherwise.

My boys love animals so we have lots of them. Some of the usual pets and
some of the not so usual pets. They love going to different shows. We went to a
reptile show yesterday, they had lots there to see and touch and my boys
would ask questions etc and they loved it and the breeders, showers and animal
rescue groups that were there just loved my boys.

What about an animal shelter. They always need volunteers.
Just a couple of thoughts.
Pam G


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/03 3:22:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
julie@... writes:

> Has anyone found meaningful ways for their kids to become
> involved with wildlife (not just domestic animals--we've had pet
> rats and a bunny and are planning to get a dog)?
>
>

Also talk with the local vets office. There are people who take in injured
wild animals that need to recuperate before being released. Maybe he could
volunteer to help out someone like this.
Pam G.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/03 8:03:59 AM, genant2@... writes:

<< What about an animal shelter. They always need volunteers. >>

Liability insurance considerations might keep them from having young people
helping.

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/03 11:04:38 AM Central Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
Liability insurance considerations might keep them from having young people
helping.

Sandra
************************************************************
Exactly the problem Moly is running into with our vet. She wants to, he would
love to have her, the insurance might not like it too much! So we plug ahead
and actively search out other opportunities.

~Nancy

He felt that his whole life was some kind of dream and he sometimes wondered
whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.
Douglas Adams


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

julie@... writes:
> My 9 year old son is determined to be an animal trainer when he
> grows up. We were are the zoo today and the trainers we met
> talked a lot about college, zoology majors etc. as prep for animal
> training. I asked about things he could do now or in the near
> future that were with real animals (he's interested in cheetahs
> and birds of prey). Pretty much came back with blanks.


I would say keep hanging out at the zoo, at the circus, at the vets office,
anywhere he could talk to people who take care of those animals, and spend time
with the animals. The more he picks up and learns and understands, the more
likely he'd be able to get a job without a degree. Some will hire experience
over knowledge. He would possibly be limited, but not totally so.

Or worse comes to worse, maybe he could tackle those courses after he has
learned so much he can pass the tests and pick up anything he might've missed.
If he really had a clear purpose for that degree, and there's no way around
getting it, I betcha he could whip thru. I dunno, I understand that this is a
tough thing.

All these questions lately about classes and courses...we have to find ways
to get this info to these kids without jumping all these ridiculous hoops that
most people jump without even thinking about it. Independent study, mail or
online courses, and the like are a step up, but they still have many of the
same hoops. Tests, scores, time limits, etc.

And getting more info about stuff before we start it, which from my own
experience, is so hard to do. I am right now trying to track down a specific
teacher at the community college because no one seems to know what's entailed in
the computer class for kids, there. From reading other's experience, and from
my kid's concerns, we don't want to pay for a class where he won't learn much
more than he already knows, or is so constrictive he's going to quit right
away. Why is there such a dearth of info? Are they hiding it somewhere, and why?
lol

~Aimee



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 8/31/03 11:12:27 AM, AimeeL73@... writes:

<< I am right now trying to track down a specific
teacher at the community college because no one seems to know what's entailed
in
the computer class for kids, there. >>

E-mail.
Do a google search. Computer class teachers have GOT to have e-mail! <g>

[email protected]

SandraDodd@... writes:
> E-mail.
> Do a google search. Computer class teachers have GOT to have e-mail! <g>

That's a GREAT idea. Now, if they would only tell me which human being is
actually going to run the class so I can talk to him/her, even virtually, we'd
be getting somewhere!

~Aimee


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tia Leschke

> I was talking to a long time friend in CO yesterday and she said her
> 24 year old daughter will be graduating from college after this
> September and will finally be able to start creating web pages for
> people. My 13 year old daughter has been making web pages for 2
> years now and has several clients including a public school plus a
> waiting list. I don't think it ever dawned on my friend that you can
> just start learning it on your own. :-) Same thing with the zoo
> people.

Wendy Priesznitz (Life Learning Magazine) told a story on another list about
her daughter, who unschooled until high school, then didn't do any
university. She saw a job advertised, I think for designing web pages or
something along those lines. She faxed her resume and got an email very
quickly asking for an interview. She got the job and was told that they had
picked her over a number of university computer grads because of two things.
She had shown that she could learn on her own what she needed to know, and
university computer grads are a couple of years behind whatever technology
is current.
Tia

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...

Shyrley

>In a message dated 8/31/03 02:22:24 AM Central Daylight Time,
>julie@... writes:
>Has anyone found meaningful ways for their kids to become
>involved with wildlife (not just domestic animals--we've had pet
>rats and a bunny and are planning to get a dog)?
>
>And does anyone know if there is a better way to prepare than all
>those in class hours? My son is amazingly knowledgeable about
>the animals he loves and all that without any instruction. He
>reads what interests him and gleans much from nature
>programs and we go to the zoo and out birding together. He's
>definitely not the kind of kid who is interested in classroom
>instruction of any kind.
>
>I just wondered what experiences some of you may have had
>with kids like this (especially those who have children who went
>into work with wildlife as adults, if there are any of you).
>
>
Back home I volunteered at a Wildlife rescue centre once a week. They
were happy for the kids to help me clean out the hedgehogs, weigh them,
feed the fox cubs etc etc. We did look into it in VA but this state has
some annoying volunteer rules. Like you have to be 15. See what rules
your state has. Most rescue centres are short-handed and welcome volunteers.

Shyrley

Julie Bogart

--- In [email protected],
kbcdlovejo@a... wrote:
> OH! And look around for a naturalist! Rudy Mancke is our local
guru. He's
> INCREDIBLE and would be happy to talk with your son about
ALL things wild---birds
> and animals and rocks and plants! He is amazing!
>
> You can google him for his webpage---oh hell, so can I :
>
http://www.scetv.org/pressroom/NatureScene-Presskit/html/biog
raphies-1.html
>
> Actually, go ahead and google him---he pops up several times!
I can get you
> his phone number too, if you need it. He may know of a
local-to-you naturalist
> who would be willing to talk with your son.
>
> ~Kelly

Thank you, thank you! I'll follow up on this Tues.

Julie
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Andrea

Since his interest is in training animals, perhaps he should contact
an organization that does that, like the people who raise and train
guide dogs, for instance. Working with dogs that will eventually
help people would be quite meaningful. Guide Dogs for the Blind has
a training facility in Boring, OR. I don't know if they work with
children, but here's the link to their website.
http://www.guidedogs.com/

Good luck finding some animal contact for him!

~Andea