Re: [Unschooling-Discussion] Introduction and question: Is unschooling perfe...
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In a message dated 8/4/03 7:25:54 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Mam2474@...
writes:
We rarely encounter arguments about our decisions regarding how Kass & Kree
(22 days until they are 12) learn/live. However, just yesterday, while at my
MIL's house for her birthday, Phil's (DH) cousin went off on some extrordinary
tangent about how brainwashed we are to be keeping them out of the system. What
was initiated as a question as to "when" they were going to go to school,
from the second I said never unless they choose to, the battle began. Luckily, he
is one of my favorite relatives, for if he weren't I am sure my patience
would have worn thin. Instead the dabate lasted a good 4 hours. His issue: the
twins are missing out on experiences!!!???
Throughout the four hours, every which way the conversation went, it fell
back to experiences. Problem for cousin was, he never did come up with an
experience they were missing, that didn't equate to a negative. I however, came up
with more than a handful, and at one point when Kass came in and heard the
discussion, she gave several of her own. Each one we gave was an experience we
would rather not have to deal with, i.e. when to eat, when to go to the bathroom,
when to talk, when to rest, when to play, when to learn. This unfortunately
led the cousin to only get more dispaired in that our kids will never know how
to "handle" these situations. As Kass ate chips and dip, before returning to
the pool, Richard said, "Well you are all brain-washed." The conversation only
got deeper when Kass exclaimed, "That will be a cold day in hell Uncle
Richard! We think for ourselves, that's the difference." She was by no means rude or
disrespectful, even though she was offended by a blanket statement about
brainwashing, from a loved one who doesn't even have children. Richard did ask if
we always "let" them talk that way. He was not pleased when we announced they
are "allowed" to say whatever they please, provided they use the words in the
proper context. If they use a word improperly, we may give other options and
some may be considered "bad" words. But irregardless, they are still just words.
The evening ended with my MIL, BIL, 2 SIL's, another CIL and a couple friends
all telling Richard, he had no idea what he was talking about and that he is
worrying about issues that don't even exist and may never exist for our
family. So the argument became mute quite quickly when all my in-laws took our side.
It was almost all I could do not to cry. Not because the argument was heated,
but because Phil's family "get's it." Every one of them gave examples of how
my kids differ from "schooled" kids in all positive ways and one even told
Richard, the problem lies in his fears and his own disappointment, that he never
had choices. One friend said what we are doing is nothing short of courageous
in a world that tells us we cannot make decisions unless someone else tell us
what to do or think. The other cousin closed with the argument, that our kids
obviously come before everything else, not to mention that we actually like
each other. He brought up how anxious his fiance is to send the kids back to
school, because being with them all day is way too hard. He also mentioned that
he only realizes what an odd thing that is when he sees us.
Richard went home mad and still not getting it, but it was really wonderful
to know that my in-laws back us up. Perhaps because the twins are the only
grandchildren, they see what they wish they had done, but didn't know was
available to them. I don't know what will happen when other grandchildren are born,
but the seeds of unschooling have definately been planted.
OK, so I went way off about me and mine, but the answer to your question is,
for US, unschooling is perfect. We can't imagine living any other way and
would never go back to a school mentality. We trust each other & our kids and our
family trusts us. So we would call that perfect all by itself.
Rhonda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
writes:
> But then I thought that maybe that wasn't entirely true. Maybe otherWelcome to posting Stephanie!!!
> unschoolers do find that unschooling has its problems, maybe even
> ones I would agree with. So, I decided to ask you all.
>
> Does unschooling have its own problems? I don't think it's perfect,
> but I do think it works, while school does not.
>
> Anyway, there we go. My first real post. Any thoughts?
>
> ~Stephanie
>
>
We rarely encounter arguments about our decisions regarding how Kass & Kree
(22 days until they are 12) learn/live. However, just yesterday, while at my
MIL's house for her birthday, Phil's (DH) cousin went off on some extrordinary
tangent about how brainwashed we are to be keeping them out of the system. What
was initiated as a question as to "when" they were going to go to school,
from the second I said never unless they choose to, the battle began. Luckily, he
is one of my favorite relatives, for if he weren't I am sure my patience
would have worn thin. Instead the dabate lasted a good 4 hours. His issue: the
twins are missing out on experiences!!!???
Throughout the four hours, every which way the conversation went, it fell
back to experiences. Problem for cousin was, he never did come up with an
experience they were missing, that didn't equate to a negative. I however, came up
with more than a handful, and at one point when Kass came in and heard the
discussion, she gave several of her own. Each one we gave was an experience we
would rather not have to deal with, i.e. when to eat, when to go to the bathroom,
when to talk, when to rest, when to play, when to learn. This unfortunately
led the cousin to only get more dispaired in that our kids will never know how
to "handle" these situations. As Kass ate chips and dip, before returning to
the pool, Richard said, "Well you are all brain-washed." The conversation only
got deeper when Kass exclaimed, "That will be a cold day in hell Uncle
Richard! We think for ourselves, that's the difference." She was by no means rude or
disrespectful, even though she was offended by a blanket statement about
brainwashing, from a loved one who doesn't even have children. Richard did ask if
we always "let" them talk that way. He was not pleased when we announced they
are "allowed" to say whatever they please, provided they use the words in the
proper context. If they use a word improperly, we may give other options and
some may be considered "bad" words. But irregardless, they are still just words.
The evening ended with my MIL, BIL, 2 SIL's, another CIL and a couple friends
all telling Richard, he had no idea what he was talking about and that he is
worrying about issues that don't even exist and may never exist for our
family. So the argument became mute quite quickly when all my in-laws took our side.
It was almost all I could do not to cry. Not because the argument was heated,
but because Phil's family "get's it." Every one of them gave examples of how
my kids differ from "schooled" kids in all positive ways and one even told
Richard, the problem lies in his fears and his own disappointment, that he never
had choices. One friend said what we are doing is nothing short of courageous
in a world that tells us we cannot make decisions unless someone else tell us
what to do or think. The other cousin closed with the argument, that our kids
obviously come before everything else, not to mention that we actually like
each other. He brought up how anxious his fiance is to send the kids back to
school, because being with them all day is way too hard. He also mentioned that
he only realizes what an odd thing that is when he sees us.
Richard went home mad and still not getting it, but it was really wonderful
to know that my in-laws back us up. Perhaps because the twins are the only
grandchildren, they see what they wish they had done, but didn't know was
available to them. I don't know what will happen when other grandchildren are born,
but the seeds of unschooling have definately been planted.
OK, so I went way off about me and mine, but the answer to your question is,
for US, unschooling is perfect. We can't imagine living any other way and
would never go back to a school mentality. We trust each other & our kids and our
family trusts us. So we would call that perfect all by itself.
Rhonda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/4/03 11:21:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
RJHill241@... writes:
never had any encounters about home/unschooling. But so often you hear about
family that is so opposed. It was nice to read about a family that came to
your defense. Great post.
We think unschooling is perfect too. Perfect in that it is life. Imperfect
in that you have all the ups and downs you have in life.
Pam G
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
RJHill241@... writes:
> It was almost all I could do not to cry. Not because the argument wasThat was so nice to read. We live so far away from any family that we have
> heated,
> but because Phil's family "get's it."
never had any encounters about home/unschooling. But so often you hear about
family that is so opposed. It was nice to read about a family that came to
your defense. Great post.
We think unschooling is perfect too. Perfect in that it is life. Imperfect
in that you have all the ups and downs you have in life.
Pam G
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/5/03 7:16:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
naliedel@... writes:
public school and so we have always done it this way. I guess it is sort of
like when the store clerk says "I don't know how you can handle it...I would go
crazy if my kids were home all day." I don't know any other way. LOL.
When I read the very first phrase of what you wrote I was thinking...what do
you mean... that is the good part about unschooling. I can go anywhere. Don't
have to wait for the kids to get home or for school vacation. Then I read
the rest and realized what you were talking about. ; )
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
naliedel@... writes:
> The biggest problem about unschooling is I cannot take off and do what IThat is funny because I never thought of that. My boys have never been to
> want, when I want during the day anymore. My time is no longer just my time
public school and so we have always done it this way. I guess it is sort of
like when the store clerk says "I don't know how you can handle it...I would go
crazy if my kids were home all day." I don't know any other way. LOL.
When I read the very first phrase of what you wrote I was thinking...what do
you mean... that is the good part about unschooling. I can go anywhere. Don't
have to wait for the kids to get home or for school vacation. Then I read
the rest and realized what you were talking about. ; )
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/4/03 9:21:14 PM, RJHill241@... writes:
<< We trust each other & our kids and our
family trusts us. So we would call that perfect all by itself. >>
What a good story!!
If Richard hadn't argued so hard, maybe some of the others there wouldn't
have formed the good arguments they had in favor of unschooling.
I suppose someone did point out that the brainwashing is what lets so many
people argue in favor of school!
Sandra
<< We trust each other & our kids and our
family trusts us. So we would call that perfect all by itself. >>
What a good story!!
If Richard hadn't argued so hard, maybe some of the others there wouldn't
have formed the good arguments they had in favor of unschooling.
I suppose someone did point out that the brainwashing is what lets so many
people argue in favor of school!
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/5/03 11:22:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
abtleo@... writes:
I have a question. Do you think that is because of the environment? The
military atmosphere? You are probably the only unschooler and probably one of
the only homeschoolers there. I remember when we were in Germany, my boys were
both toddlers then, but I knew no homeschoolers.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
abtleo@... writes:
> . If there's a way I findBrenda,
> unschooling imperfect, it's related to walking through life constantly
> feeling out of step.
I have a question. Do you think that is because of the environment? The
military atmosphere? You are probably the only unschooler and probably one of
the only homeschoolers there. I remember when we were in Germany, my boys were
both toddlers then, but I knew no homeschoolers.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]