nellebelle

Just want to share a peaceful parenting moment, inspired by this list and
Sandra's Peaceful Parenting tape.

dd had a slurpee from 7-11. She spilled half of it on the car floor just
minutes after we'd bought it (the slurpee, not the car :-). My first
thought was, she spilled it, the natural consequence is that she only gets
half a slurpee. Not to mention being annoyed at the spillage! Fortunately,
I didn't say any of that aloud. I pulled back into the parking lot, gave
her money to go buy another one, then dealt with the mess while she was
getting it.

When she came back out, I told her I loved her and that her happiness was
far more important to me than an 89 cent slurpee. We drove home smiling and
happy.

On a related topic, we are still defooding around here. I had thought I was
easygoing about food and eating, but conversations here helped me become
aware of all the ways I WAS controlling their eating. They are tending to
eat lots of certain foods, then they seem to have their fill of it, for
awhile at least, and want something else instead. It has been good for me
too, to eat what I desire. It is very satisfying!

Mary Ellen

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/12/2003 11:17:40 PM Eastern Standard Time,
nellebelle@... writes:

> dd had a slurpee from 7-11. She spilled half of it on the car floor just
> minutes after we'd bought it (the slurpee, not the car :-). My first
> thought was, she spilled it, the natural consequence is that she only gets
> half a slurpee. Not to mention being annoyed at the spillage! Fortunately,
> I didn't say any of that aloud. I pulled back into the parking lot, gave
> her money to go buy another one, then dealt with the mess while she was
> getting it.
>
> When she came back out, I told her I loved her and that her happiness was
> far more important to me than an 89 cent slurpee. We drove home smiling and
> happy.
>
We are having a lot of moments like that at our home now too, since I got the
tape, have been reading Thich Nhat Hahn, and since I have begun just
meditating on each kid...their likes, dislikes, needs, loves, talents...they are each
just soooo amazing, and so different.

I am sort of running up against a brick wall, in that my husband has not
grasped onto the "peaceful parenting" idea nearly as much as I have (hasn't
listened to the tape, probably won't, but we've talked a LOT about it), and now that
I have put on a pair of "peace glasses" I notice so much more the controlling
things he says, arbitrary rules, unnecessary ultimatums. Don't get me wrong,
he's not a control freak and doesn't spank, but it's very hard getting him to
see that he's getting himself stressed out about unnecessary bullshit! :o)
Yesterday we had a looonnnnggggg conversation about wanting a much more
peaceful home, no arguing, much more joy and happiness. But a couple hours later he
wouldn't let my 17 yo go out with friends "because he said so." His brother
was coming for a visit (is here for about 4 days) and that was his reasoning,
but it was very frustrating for me and my daughter. I'm having a hard time not
siding with them in front of him and having him resent me.

We're a work in progress, and things are getting much better, just hitting a
few bumps in the road.

Nancy


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Betsy

**I am sort of running up against a brick wall, in that my husband has
not
grasped onto the "peaceful parenting" idea nearly as much as I have
(hasn't
listened to the tape, probably won't, but we've talked a LOT about it),
and now that
I have put on a pair of "peace glasses" I notice so much more the
controlling
things he says, arbitrary rules, unnecessary ultimatums. **

When we start being sweeter than before to our kids, is there a parallel
way that we can start also being sweeter to our husbands, so that they
are more able to see the upside of living in a gentle and caring way?

Betsy

Kelli Traaseth

**When we start being sweeter than before to our kids, is there a parallel
way that we can start also being sweeter to our husbands, so that they
are more able to see the upside of living in a gentle and caring way?**

I think so.

I know in trying to be more peaceful in my parenting I have in turn been a
more peaceful person in all situations.

Also, I have a thread sticking out in my mind about this from a few months
ago, maybe a year, <g>(time goes so fast). Something Ren said, about how
she just keeps acting in that peaceful/caring way instead of correcting her
dh. Good comments Ren, I do believe it rubs off onto them. I've seen it
in my dh. He hasn't been able to read this list or books I've been able
to, but has listened to the Peaceful Parenting tape. He has definitely
become a more peaceful parent.

It takes a little time, isn't going to happen overnight, just like any
other transformation.

Its amazing what some breathing, gentleness and trust can do for a family.
I can't tell you how much this type of thinking has improved our lives. I
get teary eyed just thinking about it.

Kelli~


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[email protected]

In a message dated 6/13/2003 1:54:09 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
> We are having a lot of moments like that at our home now too, since I got
> the
> tape, have been reading Thich Nhat Hahn

I LOVE him. What in inspiration he is....and such a gentle, kind soul.
I really, really want to visit Plum Village someday....sigh.

Ren


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/13/2003 9:16:24 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
>
> Also, I have a thread sticking out in my mind about this from a few months
> ago, maybe a year, <g>(time goes so fast). Something Ren said, about how
> she just keeps acting in that peaceful/caring way instead of correcting her
> dh. Good comments Ren, I do believe it rubs off onto them.

It does rub off....but I certainly don't always act in that peaceful way
without correcting him.
I'm getting more and more skilled at handling it, but my main thing lately is
to just talk when things are calm and happy. The whole Myers-Briggs test
opened up the doors for some FAB conversations the last couple of days. Dh is
very aware of wanting his children to develop in their own unique way, but we
both tend to shame and guilt as a first reaction. It happens less and less and I
catch myself a LOT quicker now.

I think we've come a long way, and Mark is so much more aware and gentle now.
We're helping each other stay on track. As much as he says he isn't into
unschooling, he sure acts like an unschooler!!! What a goober.

Ren


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Have A Nice Day!

we
both tend to shame and guilt as a first reaction. It happens less and less and I
catch myself a LOT quicker now.



Same here. I am MUCH faster at recognizing it and much quicker to apologize when I cross the line. My husband isn't so much into changing how he feels about things, but he takes his cue from me at least.


Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: starsuncloud@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 4:11 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] peaceful parenting moment


In a message dated 6/13/2003 9:16:24 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
>
> Also, I have a thread sticking out in my mind about this from a few months
> ago, maybe a year, <g>(time goes so fast). Something Ren said, about how
> she just keeps acting in that peaceful/caring way instead of correcting her
> dh. Good comments Ren, I do believe it rubs off onto them.

It does rub off....but I certainly don't always act in that peaceful way
without correcting him.
I'm getting more and more skilled at handling it, but my main thing lately is
to just talk when things are calm and happy. The whole Myers-Briggs test
opened up the doors for some FAB conversations the last couple of days. Dh is
very aware of wanting his children to develop in their own unique way, but we
both tend to shame and guilt as a first reaction. It happens less and less and I
catch myself a LOT quicker now.

I think we've come a long way, and Mark is so much more aware and gentle now.
We're helping each other stay on track. As much as he says he isn't into
unschooling, he sure acts like an unschooler!!! What a goober.

Ren


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Lee Roversi

>I'm having a hard time not
siding with them in front of him and having him resent me.

This was what Nancy said about her husbnd and his path of attempting to get
the peaceful parenting she is in process on.

I am curious about this and those of you in successful and happy marriages.
This was a HUGE issue with my now-ex-husband and our kids. I basically
always "got" the peaceful/easy-going/attachment parenting (not that I don't
have my moments, believe me!). And, when they were infants and toddlers, he
was all behind the constant breastfeeding, family bed, etc. Somehow, when
our children became older, got more independent, developed more clear ideas
of their own, etc, he became more and more resistent to their expressing
their own thoughts, if they were different than his. He could not go beyond
the "because I said so" with pre-teens and teens and their discussions. I
often would, calmly and without any charge, state their case in different
lingo in the attempt to have him hear them in another way. I was accused of
siding with them or contradicting him or disempowering him as a father,etc.
This was not the sole reason for the demise of our marriage, but a factor.
Yet, even in reflection, I cannot see another way of doing it, without
compromising my position as my children's mom and constant supporter and
defender (even to their dad).

Now, this is still an issue between us, as our teens take on life in an
unstructured and passionate fashion - and DEFINITELY not the prescribed
traditional regular path. Really, this is a whole other discussion. I'm
mostly interested in ways you women who have partners who are
less-than-supportive of our 'different' ways handle it peacefully and
respectfully.

Aloha, Lee



North Country Farms
An Eco-Tourism Destination
P.O. Box 723
Kilauea, Kauai, HI 96754
808-828-1513 phone and voice mail
www.northcountryfarms.com

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/13/2003 10:39:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ncfarms@... writes:

> Somehow, when
> our children became older, got more independent, developed more clear ideas
> of their own, etc, he became more and more resistent to their expressing
> their own thoughts, if they were different than his. He could not go beyond
> the "because I said so" with pre-teens and teens and their discussions. I
> often would, calmly and without any charge, state their case in different
> lingo in the attempt to have him hear them in another way. I was accused of
> siding with them or contradicting him or disempowering him as a father,etc.
> This was not the sole reason for the demise of our marriage, but a factor.
> Yet, even in reflection, I cannot see another way of doing it, without
> compromising my position as my children's mom and constant supporter and
> defender (even to their dad).

This is sort of what we are going through, but I at least can see that my
husband is TRYING to change, and be more open minded. We may never see eye to
eye on it, totally, but, and this sounds really sneaky or deceitful, I just have
a way of talking him into things and keeping the peace so it is never
unbearable, and we end up at a compromise. I have been thanking him and
complimenting him when he's backed up a bit on a rule that at one time was more rigid. We
have a way of wanting to please each other, and often that takes the form of
him laying off the kids, or letting them go someplace he usually wouldn't, to
please me.

On the other hand, at times our older daughter at home (17) can be really
snobby, unkind and rude to us. (Honest to God, it started when she went to
public school...it's something we are really struggling with right now) and if she
speaks to my husband like that, or me, we stand together in calling it to her
attention and asking for an apology. Sometimes one of us will say hurts for
us to hear our spouse treated in that way (hubbies version is usually, "No one
is gonna talk to my wife that way, especially not her own child!" (He's
really trying...;o)

>
> Now, this is still an issue between us, as our teens take on life in an
> unstructured and passionate fashion - and DEFINITELY not the prescribed
> traditional regular path. Really, this is a whole other discussion. I'm
> mostly interested in ways you women who have partners who are
> less-than-supportive of our 'different' ways handle it peacefully and
> respectfully.
>
I also keep reminding him, that there will be a day, soon (especially for our
17 yo) that she will be making her own decisions anyway, and we will have to
let go, so we need to start now. I remind him how our oldest (19) got very
mouthy before she moved out, but how now she is like a best friend, and she has
thanked us over and over for being "good" parents. She has also apologized
for acting like a "know it all." (I reminded her of all my awful faults,
mistakes I made parenting, and asked forgiveness too :o)

Nancy


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Have A Nice Day!

I'm
mostly interested in ways you women who have partners who are
less-than-supportive of our 'different' ways handle it peacefully and
respectfully.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I'm not sure exactly. My husband and I have always been opposites on just about everything. I earnestly live by that saying: "G-d grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change".

I can't change my husband so I do the best I can to support him in front of the kids, but then to explain things to the kids when I'm alone with them. I don't undermine my husband's opinion because I don't want my kids to pawn us off of each other. I just try to make his POV more clear to the kids. They might still disagree, but my hope is it diffuses the resentment that sometimes builds up. Most of the time, they are just glad to talk about their frustration and it helps them to know that their dad is usually not just being spiteful.

And then when I'm alone with my husband, I try to explain the kids POV to him so that he can understand where they are coming from.

Of course, all of this depends on timing and moods too. I have to really pay attention to when the right time is to discuss this stuff.

He thinks I let them get involved in too many activities. He feels he was not all allowed to get involved in stuff like they are. (In reality, they aren't involved in any more than he was. Its a perceptual thing.)

Anyway, I've explained to him that he *did* have all kinds of opportunites *in school*. Since our kids are not in school, and we unschool, their activities are a large part of them figuring out who they are and what they want to do when they get older. Their activities are a large part of their education. He seems to get it when I explain it, but I think his gut reaction is still conditioned to reject that kind of thinking.

When he found out I was giving them an allowance and they didn't necessarily have to help out, I explained that its not required that they help out, but I do ask them to do things, and they do help. And I also explained that although they are getting a generous allowance, they also have to use it to buy their clothing, etc..(.it makes for a fixed amount in the budget instead of constantly "robbing peter to pay paul"). And like I said, they are far more careful with money and content with what they have.

I dont' think he's convinced, but he's let it drop :o).

The rest of it is mostly his unrealistic expectations that the kids value his work as much as he does. For example, when he wants the lawn mowed, he wants it done the way *he* would do it. He forgets that nobody is perfect and experience takes practice.

Sometimes my role is to facilitate ways to build trust between him and the kids.

Yesterday, I told hubby I'd mow the lawn for him, could he get the brand new rider out for me. After he got it out, it occurred to me that ds was bored, why not let ds do it! Well, hubster is not fond of the idea of letting ds use the brand new rider. He made ds use push mowers for the longest time before letting him use the OLD rider.

I think my husband realized that here we were offering to do work for him that he did not have time to do and he'd be silly to say no. He also didn't have the time to argue about it <g>

When it began storming and pouring down rain, ds was wise enough to cover the mower with a large tarp. I didnt even have to ask him to and he scored a big point with his dad. But had I not gently suggested it, he never would have had the chance to even use the mower in the first place.

Other times I've told the kids to go out and do some of the stuff that their dad does, just to take the load off of him. It really helps.

Kristen







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Have A Nice Day!

I also keep reminding him, that there will be a day, soon (especially for our
17 yo) that she will be making her own decisions anyway, and we will have to
let go, so we need to start now. <<<<


Yes, I've done this too. I think this is important, maybe the most important of all.

When I remind my husband that some day they will be making their own decisions, (and he is reminded of all the stuff HE did which we won't get into!!), I think he realizes that we really can't control them.

Our best hope is to have some influence, and to let them make their own mistakes.

Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: CelticFrau@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 11:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] peaceful parenting moment


In a message dated 6/13/2003 10:39:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ncfarms@... writes:

> Somehow, when
> our children became older, got more independent, developed more clear ideas
> of their own, etc, he became more and more resistent to their expressing
> their own thoughts, if they were different than his. He could not go beyond
> the "because I said so" with pre-teens and teens and their discussions. I
> often would, calmly and without any charge, state their case in different
> lingo in the attempt to have him hear them in another way. I was accused of
> siding with them or contradicting him or disempowering him as a father,etc.
> This was not the sole reason for the demise of our marriage, but a factor.
> Yet, even in reflection, I cannot see another way of doing it, without
> compromising my position as my children's mom and constant supporter and
> defender (even to their dad).

This is sort of what we are going through, but I at least can see that my
husband is TRYING to change, and be more open minded. We may never see eye to
eye on it, totally, but, and this sounds really sneaky or deceitful, I just have
a way of talking him into things and keeping the peace so it is never
unbearable, and we end up at a compromise. I have been thanking him and
complimenting him when he's backed up a bit on a rule that at one time was more rigid. We
have a way of wanting to please each other, and often that takes the form of
him laying off the kids, or letting them go someplace he usually wouldn't, to
please me.

On the other hand, at times our older daughter at home (17) can be really
snobby, unkind and rude to us. (Honest to God, it started when she went to
public school...it's something we are really struggling with right now) and if she
speaks to my husband like that, or me, we stand together in calling it to her
attention and asking for an apology. Sometimes one of us will say hurts for
us to hear our spouse treated in that way (hubbies version is usually, "No one
is gonna talk to my wife that way, especially not her own child!" (He's
really trying...;o)

>
> Now, this is still an issue between us, as our teens take on life in an
> unstructured and passionate fashion - and DEFINITELY not the prescribed
> traditional regular path. Really, this is a whole other discussion. I'm
> mostly interested in ways you women who have partners who are
> less-than-supportive of our 'different' ways handle it peacefully and
> respectfully.
>
I also keep reminding him, that there will be a day, soon (especially for our
17 yo) that she will be making her own decisions anyway, and we will have to
let go, so we need to start now. I remind him how our oldest (19) got very
mouthy before she moved out, but how now she is like a best friend, and she has
thanked us over and over for being "good" parents. She has also apologized
for acting like a "know it all." (I reminded her of all my awful faults,
mistakes I made parenting, and asked forgiveness too :o)

Nancy


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mary

From: "Have A Nice Day!" <litlrooh@...>


<<I also keep reminding him, that there will be a day, soon (especially for
our
17 yo) that she will be making her own decisions anyway, and we will have to
let go, so we need to start now. <<<<


Yes, I've done this too. I think this is important, maybe the most
important of all.

When I remind my husband that some day they will be making their own
decisions, (and he is reminded of all the stuff HE did which we won't get
into!!), I think he realizes that we really can't control them.>>



I'm just wondering if maybe these posts were worded differently than what
you really meant? The part about the the teens that "will be" making their
own decisions anyway. By the time a teen hits 17 I would hope they would be
making their own decisions for a long time by then. I have a 17 year old
daughter and I make no decisions for her at all. She lives here just like
she would if she were living alone. Well pretty much from the decision part
of it anyway. If she were to take off next year, although I would always
worry, it certainly wouldn't be because I didn't know if she could handle
all the decisions herself. I don't see 18 as any magic number for decision
making. Aside from the part where most school kids know their parents can't
"make" them do things anymore. With kids who are truly respected, I don't
see that happening. Tara looks forward to 18 from the point of how society
looks at it but as far as what she can't and can do, no difference here.

Mary B

Mary B

Heidi Wordhouse-Dykema

> >I'm having a hard time not
>siding with them in front of him and having him resent me.

Well, I'd suggest *not* siding with them in front of him - but immediately
pulling dh into a side room and asking him why he is feeling the way he is
feeling. How were these things handled when he was a child? How did he
like/not like it then? What is he worried will happen? What does he see
as the worst-case scenario if the kids were to be able to do as they
desired? Is there a warning point before worst-case is reached that the
two of you could use as a 'decision time', to re-evaluate the kids being
able to choose for themselves...but give the kids leeway up to that area?

When you're done talking it out, HE needs to be the one to go back and
amend any proclamations he might have made. That way, you're 'supporting
him in front of the kids' (in his mind, at least.) For some people, it's
important to have that, even though it's very adults vs. kids when you get
right down to it.

He's probably got to work through some of his own issues in private (with
you) before he can be free enough to give freedom to his kids. Maybe get
started now, when there isn't an emotionally charged situation? (and be
sure to constantly remind him of what he's doing RIGHT!)
Dad's are 'kids' too!
HeidiWD


"Self-reliance is the antidote to institutional stupidity." JTGatto,
Monarch Notes guide to One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

Have A Nice Day!

Mary,

It is worded from the perspective my husband has when we begin talking. And his perspective usually changes by the time we are done to agree with mine.

Whenever we talk, I try to meet him where he is at, and help him get to where I am.

Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: Mary
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2003 12:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] peaceful parenting moment


From: "Have A Nice Day!" <litlrooh@...>


<<I also keep reminding him, that there will be a day, soon (especially for
our
17 yo) that she will be making her own decisions anyway, and we will have to
let go, so we need to start now. <<<<


Yes, I've done this too. I think this is important, maybe the most
important of all.

When I remind my husband that some day they will be making their own
decisions, (and he is reminded of all the stuff HE did which we won't get
into!!), I think he realizes that we really can't control them.>>



I'm just wondering if maybe these posts were worded differently than what
you really meant? The part about the the teens that "will be" making their
own decisions anyway. By the time a teen hits 17 I would hope they would be
making their own decisions for a long time by then. I have a 17 year old
daughter and I make no decisions for her at all. She lives here just like
she would if she were living alone. Well pretty much from the decision part
of it anyway. If she were to take off next year, although I would always
worry, it certainly wouldn't be because I didn't know if she could handle
all the decisions herself. I don't see 18 as any magic number for decision
making. Aside from the part where most school kids know their parents can't
"make" them do things anymore. With kids who are truly respected, I don't
see that happening. Tara looks forward to 18 from the point of how society
looks at it but as far as what she can't and can do, no difference here.

Mary B

Mary B




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Heidi

Where does one acquire this peaceful parenting tape?
\
HeidiC


--- In [email protected], "nellebelle"
<nellebelle@c...> wrote:
> Just want to share a peaceful parenting moment, inspired by this
list and
> Sandra's Peaceful Parenting tape.
>
> dd had a slurpee from 7-11. She spilled half of it on the car
floor just
> minutes after we'd bought it (the slurpee, not the car :-). My
first
> thought was, she spilled it, the natural consequence is that she
only gets
> half a slurpee. Not to mention being annoyed at the spillage!
Fortunately,
> I didn't say any of that aloud. I pulled back into the parking
lot, gave
> her money to go buy another one, then dealt with the mess while she
was
> getting it.
>
> When she came back out, I told her I loved her and that her
happiness was
> far more important to me than an 89 cent slurpee. We drove home
smiling and
> happy.
>
> On a related topic, we are still defooding around here. I had
thought I was
> easygoing about food and eating, but conversations here helped me
become
> aware of all the ways I WAS controlling their eating. They are
tending to
> eat lots of certain foods, then they seem to have their fill of it,
for
> awhile at least, and want something else instead. It has been good
for me
> too, to eat what I desire. It is very satisfying!
>
> Mary Ellen