You people have created a monster--ME (long)
Kelly Lenhart
I was asked, after a brief note to a friend on a parenting list, about
unschooling. Then there was a question about my reply. I'm posting what I
wrote, because I want you brainwashing, evil people to see what you have
DONE TO ME!!! LOL!
Kelly
(Letter one in response to "what is unschooling?)
Unschooling is the philosophy that a child will learn what he needs if
presented with an environment full of opportunity to learn and the resources
and support to do so. This does presume that not every child *needs* to
learn the same stuff. So you may end up with a kid who knows EVERYTHING
about ancient Egypt and not much about the American Revolution.
But what you do get is a kid who knows HOW to learn. And, if it turns out
they suddenly NEED to learn about the American Revolution, they understand
research and sources and stuff and can find it out.
It also presumes that you can learn the basics through just living. And
through unrestricted play. Like James doing most of his reading on Zelda.
He's a great reader. He just doesn't sit down with a book. And you
wouldn't sit down and "teach" fractions, but your child would end up
learning them just fine by cooking. LOTS of fractions in cooking! -grin-
In some ways it's harder on the parents than a straight curriculum because
you sort of have to be willing to drop everything and help your child study
fruit flies for as long as they are interested. But they really get a
confidence in their own knowledge because it is self motivated.
And for many familes it extends to other lifestyle/parenting issues. I'm
realizing that I was always much more "unschooly" than not. James never had
a strict bedtime. Even when he was in school it was "tenish." And now???
It's rare the night he's not up later than me. He watches all the tv he
wants, plays tons of video games, eats anything he wants, etc. He has much
more control over his personal environment than a lot of kids I know.
(note to unschooling list: having written this, I'm not even sure how true
it is. We'll see if I get off my but enough to do anything formal. -grin-)
I'm not sure we are going to go the full unschooling path next year. I
*like* working with him on stuff. And sometimes he enjoys it. -grin-
We'll see. It's a pretty big leap, in many ways and I'm not sure I'm ready.
Mostly because with the two little ones, I'm not sure I'll be able to do
that "fruit fly" stuff well enough. And if we have even a loose guideline
it will help make sure James gets enough Mommy time, if nothing else.
Hope this explains it.
Kelly
second letter
personal environment? When you can set your own goals, work to meet them, do
them in the evironment you find most comfortable?
Everyone has their own circadian rhythm. In this family it runs from about
10 am to about 1 am. On average. We fought for 2 years with James to get him
to have a 9 PM bed time, when he was 1-3 years old. Then we let him stay up
a couple nights and noticed he crashed at 10:30 like clockwork. Well, gee,
that was simple! So we set a 10 PM bedtime and he was out with some
cuddling. That was when he had to be up at 7 for daycare. He doesn't HAVE to
be up now, unless we have plans. So why set an arbitrary bedtime?
We don't sit down to dinner much, so the kids will eat "dinner" either
before Joe and I or after. When THEY are hungry. It's much healthier to eat
when you are hungry than to set up times for it and wait until then. In fact
I watched just that the other day with his best friend. The rule was "you
could have a big snack before 4 pm, a small snack after 4." So James was
visiting and the kids were more busy playing than snacking. 5:45 came around
and we were packing to leave. The kid was hungry, but because dinner was
being made he couldn't have a snack. He got really angry. I was told by the
nanny that this happens every day. Well, maybe you need to move dinner up or
let the kid eat when HE's hungry??? When I'm hungry for something just
before my meal I call it an appetizer. -grin- When he was hungry for
something just before dinner it's called being whiny. -no grin- It struck me
as so nuts. I mean, my 33 year old husband forgets to eat because he's
deeply into something, why would I expect a 7 year old not to do the same
thing. But when Joe does it he can eat when he remembers. Why can't a 7 year
old?
As for the video games and such? So his goal right now is to beat Zelda? He
has to figure out what items and skills he needs to aquire and then aquire
them. He has to keep working at it when he might fail the first (dozen)
times. He has to seek out the advice of experts to accomplish his goal. (His
dad and the guys from work are primary, but he can find info himself on the
internet--including using google.) He has to be able to read and retain
information in context.
A lot of it has to do with trusting your child and modeling for him. (It's
in the modeling that I'm not so strong. -sigh-) I have to trust that just
living his life, doing things that he enjoys and being with family and
friends will expose James to the experiences that he needs to start learning
what he needs for life. Then I have to be there for him and help him when he
wants to learn more than is on the surface. So if he finds a cool tool in
Zelda and asks about it, I have to be right there to help him figure out how
to find out more about it. But I also have to trust that sometimes, just
playing the game is enough.
And James *knows* I trust him. He knows that I am confident he will get some
sleep, eat a meal, etc. So he has the safety to try out new sleep patterns
and see if they make him feel better. He can skip the fancy meal I made for
Dad and me and have peanut butter sandwich later, 'cause I know he'll eat.
Most unschooled teens don't go through the same kind of "rebellious" stage
because they haven't has as many arbitrary ("Your bedtime is 9PM because you
are 9 years old") kinds of rules.
Ok, now I've really rambled enough. It's been a real philosophy switch for
me. Or more, finding out there is a philosophy which fits my natural take on
life.
unschooling. Then there was a question about my reply. I'm posting what I
wrote, because I want you brainwashing, evil people to see what you have
DONE TO ME!!! LOL!
Kelly
(Letter one in response to "what is unschooling?)
Unschooling is the philosophy that a child will learn what he needs if
presented with an environment full of opportunity to learn and the resources
and support to do so. This does presume that not every child *needs* to
learn the same stuff. So you may end up with a kid who knows EVERYTHING
about ancient Egypt and not much about the American Revolution.
But what you do get is a kid who knows HOW to learn. And, if it turns out
they suddenly NEED to learn about the American Revolution, they understand
research and sources and stuff and can find it out.
It also presumes that you can learn the basics through just living. And
through unrestricted play. Like James doing most of his reading on Zelda.
He's a great reader. He just doesn't sit down with a book. And you
wouldn't sit down and "teach" fractions, but your child would end up
learning them just fine by cooking. LOTS of fractions in cooking! -grin-
In some ways it's harder on the parents than a straight curriculum because
you sort of have to be willing to drop everything and help your child study
fruit flies for as long as they are interested. But they really get a
confidence in their own knowledge because it is self motivated.
And for many familes it extends to other lifestyle/parenting issues. I'm
realizing that I was always much more "unschooly" than not. James never had
a strict bedtime. Even when he was in school it was "tenish." And now???
It's rare the night he's not up later than me. He watches all the tv he
wants, plays tons of video games, eats anything he wants, etc. He has much
more control over his personal environment than a lot of kids I know.
(note to unschooling list: having written this, I'm not even sure how true
it is. We'll see if I get off my but enough to do anything formal. -grin-)
I'm not sure we are going to go the full unschooling path next year. I
*like* working with him on stuff. And sometimes he enjoys it. -grin-
We'll see. It's a pretty big leap, in many ways and I'm not sure I'm ready.
Mostly because with the two little ones, I'm not sure I'll be able to do
that "fruit fly" stuff well enough. And if we have even a loose guideline
it will help make sure James gets enough Mommy time, if nothing else.
Hope this explains it.
Kelly
second letter
>> It's rare the night he's not up later than me. He watches all theDon't *you* feel better and function better when you have control of your
>> tv he wants, plays tons of video games, eats anything he wants, etc.
>>He has much more control over his personal environment than a lot of kids
>>I know.
>And how is the above description a good thing?
>(I'm not trying to be rude, just seriously curious)
personal environment? When you can set your own goals, work to meet them, do
them in the evironment you find most comfortable?
Everyone has their own circadian rhythm. In this family it runs from about
10 am to about 1 am. On average. We fought for 2 years with James to get him
to have a 9 PM bed time, when he was 1-3 years old. Then we let him stay up
a couple nights and noticed he crashed at 10:30 like clockwork. Well, gee,
that was simple! So we set a 10 PM bedtime and he was out with some
cuddling. That was when he had to be up at 7 for daycare. He doesn't HAVE to
be up now, unless we have plans. So why set an arbitrary bedtime?
We don't sit down to dinner much, so the kids will eat "dinner" either
before Joe and I or after. When THEY are hungry. It's much healthier to eat
when you are hungry than to set up times for it and wait until then. In fact
I watched just that the other day with his best friend. The rule was "you
could have a big snack before 4 pm, a small snack after 4." So James was
visiting and the kids were more busy playing than snacking. 5:45 came around
and we were packing to leave. The kid was hungry, but because dinner was
being made he couldn't have a snack. He got really angry. I was told by the
nanny that this happens every day. Well, maybe you need to move dinner up or
let the kid eat when HE's hungry??? When I'm hungry for something just
before my meal I call it an appetizer. -grin- When he was hungry for
something just before dinner it's called being whiny. -no grin- It struck me
as so nuts. I mean, my 33 year old husband forgets to eat because he's
deeply into something, why would I expect a 7 year old not to do the same
thing. But when Joe does it he can eat when he remembers. Why can't a 7 year
old?
As for the video games and such? So his goal right now is to beat Zelda? He
has to figure out what items and skills he needs to aquire and then aquire
them. He has to keep working at it when he might fail the first (dozen)
times. He has to seek out the advice of experts to accomplish his goal. (His
dad and the guys from work are primary, but he can find info himself on the
internet--including using google.) He has to be able to read and retain
information in context.
A lot of it has to do with trusting your child and modeling for him. (It's
in the modeling that I'm not so strong. -sigh-) I have to trust that just
living his life, doing things that he enjoys and being with family and
friends will expose James to the experiences that he needs to start learning
what he needs for life. Then I have to be there for him and help him when he
wants to learn more than is on the surface. So if he finds a cool tool in
Zelda and asks about it, I have to be right there to help him figure out how
to find out more about it. But I also have to trust that sometimes, just
playing the game is enough.
And James *knows* I trust him. He knows that I am confident he will get some
sleep, eat a meal, etc. So he has the safety to try out new sleep patterns
and see if they make him feel better. He can skip the fancy meal I made for
Dad and me and have peanut butter sandwich later, 'cause I know he'll eat.
Most unschooled teens don't go through the same kind of "rebellious" stage
because they haven't has as many arbitrary ("Your bedtime is 9PM because you
are 9 years old") kinds of rules.
Ok, now I've really rambled enough. It's been a real philosophy switch for
me. Or more, finding out there is a philosophy which fits my natural take on
life.
jmcseals SEALS
>>It's rare the night he's not up later than me. He watches all theIn reading this, I wonder if this is how we wish to present ourselves to the
>>tv he wants, plays tons of video games, eats anything he wants, etc.
>>He has much more control over his personal environment than a lot of kids
>>I know.
>And how is the above description a good thing?
>(I'm not trying to be rude, just seriously curious)
non-unchooling world. Actually, the above description fits my oldest
daughter a lot of times, but to an outsider looking in, reading everything
written, this paragraph sticks out like a sore thumb. I can see where the
rest of the information would be forgotten upon reading that one paragraph.
I think it is important, when explaining unschooling, to include information
on restrictions...well lack of...but I wonder how legitimate this sounds to
someone wanting to transition into child-led learning. I think the thought
of having a child sit in front of video games, eating potato chips and
drinking coke all day is what keeps a lot of people from even considering
unschooling. When we began homeschooling five years ago, I had this
fear...BIG time! I struggled with other issues (will they learn enough, I'm
not creative enough, etc.) but had I heard that there are unschooling kids
out there actually doing it, I would have run as far in the opposite
direction as possible.
<I'm not sure we are going to go the full unschooling path next year. I
<*like* working with him on stuff. And sometimes he enjoys it. -grin-
<We'll see. It's a pretty big leap, in many ways and I'm not sure I'm ready.
<Mostly because with the two little ones, I'm not sure I'll be able to do
<that "fruit fly" stuff well enough. And if we have even a loose guideline
<it will help make sure James gets enough Mommy time, if nothing else.
Don't give up on unschooling! Why do you need a 'loose guidline' (I assume
you mean curriculum?) to give your son Mommy time? You don't! All those
little fruit fly moments will take care of that. If you have the time and
interest to follow a guidline *prescribed* by someone outside your family,
why not follow your children's guideline? Their *prescription* will lead
you along the path *they* need to follow. You can still work on stuff with
him without forcing schooling onto him. You say he enjoys it 'sometimes'.
What about the times he doesn't enjoy it?
Give yourself some time. It doesn't have to be a big leap. It can be a
gradual enlightenment! Keep reading. Go to the SC conference!!! Follow
their cues and you *will* have Mommy time with them. Find websites of
unschooled kids and read their stories to James aloud. Talk with him about
what he thinks is cool and exciting. Use that as a springboard and absorb
yourselves in fun and adventurous quests for knowledge together! I'm not
sure how old your younger ones are, but even a baby can be slung on your
back to enjoy the ride!
I believe Mary (?) said, unschooling is the journey, not the destination.
You don't have to have it all figured out right this minute. There's not a
book or curriculum out there that will figure it out for you anyway. The
only thing that will bring you to your destination is life itself. Strive
to make every moment enjoyable and when you reach your destination, you will
have no regrets! :)
Jennifer
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[email protected]
In a message dated 5/23/03 10:24:13 AM, jmcseals@... writes:
<< I think it is important, when explaining unschooling, to include
information
on restrictions...well lack of...but I wonder how legitimate this sounds to
someone wanting to transition into child-led learning. I think the thought
of having a child sit in front of video games, eating potato chips and
drinking coke all day is what keeps a lot of people from even considering
unschooling. When we began homeschooling five years ago, I had this
fear...BIG time! >>
I don't talk about freedoms and respect when I talk about unschooling to
"outsiders," BUT it was a homeschooling list! And the writer was on a roll, and
enthusiastic!
It's worth leaving that bit of food-for-thought for them to eat (or not) when
they're hungry!
If we decide we don't know what our children need to know or should be
learning or can learn today, it's a teeny baby step to realizing we do NOT know what
they need to eat or whether they're really tired or not.
Sandra
<< I think it is important, when explaining unschooling, to include
information
on restrictions...well lack of...but I wonder how legitimate this sounds to
someone wanting to transition into child-led learning. I think the thought
of having a child sit in front of video games, eating potato chips and
drinking coke all day is what keeps a lot of people from even considering
unschooling. When we began homeschooling five years ago, I had this
fear...BIG time! >>
I don't talk about freedoms and respect when I talk about unschooling to
"outsiders," BUT it was a homeschooling list! And the writer was on a roll, and
enthusiastic!
It's worth leaving that bit of food-for-thought for them to eat (or not) when
they're hungry!
If we decide we don't know what our children need to know or should be
learning or can learn today, it's a teeny baby step to realizing we do NOT know what
they need to eat or whether they're really tired or not.
Sandra
Kelly Lenhart
>I think it is important, when explaining unschooling, to includeinformation
>on restrictions...well lack of...but I wonder how legitimate this sounds toYeah, I know, but it was to a group I trust, so I was a little "looser"
>someone wanting to transition into child-led learning.
about the language I used. And the reality is, this is what James is doing
right now! -grin- In someways it was more about me being comfortable just
saying it and not "justifying" it that made it a big deal for me.
>Don't give up on unschooling! Why do you need a 'loose guidline' (I assumeI sat down with the stuff I used to do his "first grade" curriculum and made
>you mean curriculum?) to give your son Mommy time? You don't!
a list of things to "cover" while we were away on vacation. I used those
Core Curriculum books by Hirsch. I just told James today that I'd like to
sit down with the list and work out the things we'd like to cover next year
and talk about it together. Then we'd basically put the list away, having
decided to cover them, we could trust that it would happen. That's how
loose I am with it at this point.
> You can still work on stuff withOh, I meant we'll do it when he's in the mood. Which he is sometimes. Not
>him without forcing schooling onto him. You say he enjoys it 'sometimes'.
>What about the times he doesn't enjoy it?
that we'd do it regularly on the hope that it was sometimes fun.
>I'm notWell, part of the issue is that I have a 2 year old and another one due in
>sure how old your younger ones are, but even a baby can be slung on your
>back to enjoy the ride!
August. So there will be plenty of "wait for the baby" crap to deal
ith. -smile- Just a fact of life.
>You don't have to have it all figured out right this minute.I don't! But I just bought the t-shirt, drat it!!! -giggle-
Thanks for the support.
Kelly
Kelly Lenhart
>I don't talk about freedoms and respect when I talk about unschooling toroll, and
>"outsiders," BUT it was a homeschooling list! And the writer was on a
>enthusiastic!I sure was on a roll, wasn't I? That took about 10 minutes to
rite. -grin-
And it wasn't to a homeschool group, though. It was to a group of moms who
have been together since we were all pregnant together. We were all due
with a baby in Feb '96. We've stayed together through childbirth and the
last 7 years. We are a very close group which includes families on either
end of the parenting spectrum. I treasure that group of connections.
If I couldn't be honest with them....
>It's worth leaving that bit of food-for-thought for them to eat (or not)when
>they're hungry!-laugh-
>If we decide we don't know what our children need to know or should beknow what
>learning or can learn today, it's a teeny baby step to realizing we do NOT
>they need to eat or whether they're really tired or not.It's funny, but I really came to it the other way round. Realizing that I
couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
that I couldn't know what he needed to learn--and neither could the school.
Kelly
Kelly Lenhart
>But Hirsch knows?Hell no! -grin- But it's a useful guideline of what a well rounded liberal
>You trust that he will learn what the books say he should learn?
arts education is. In a Western culture anyway. If I were going the
"curriculum" route I wouldn't feel too badly using them as a starting place
and adding more World Cultures stuff as well as our religious stuff.
But to go through them at the "right" grade and one above and below and see
what looks neat that I hadn't thought of and sit down with my son and talk
about it....The books have value as a resource, that's all.
Kelly
nellebelle
----- Original Message ----- Realizing that I
But Hirsch knows?
snip>>>>>I used those Core Curriculum books by Hirsch. I just told James
today that I'd like to sit down with the list and work out the things we'd
like to cover next year and talk about it together. Then we'd basically put
the list away, having decided to cover them, we could trust that it would
happen. >>>>>>
You trust that he will learn what the books say he should learn?
Mary Ellen
> couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizingschool.
> that I couldn't know what he needed to learn--and neither could the
But Hirsch knows?
snip>>>>>I used those Core Curriculum books by Hirsch. I just told James
today that I'd like to sit down with the list and work out the things we'd
like to cover next year and talk about it together. Then we'd basically put
the list away, having decided to cover them, we could trust that it would
happen. >>>>>>
You trust that he will learn what the books say he should learn?
Mary Ellen
Michele Evard
hi kelly,
At 02:57 PM 5/23/2003 -0400, Kelly Lenhart wrote:
timing is everything... this morning i wrote a long message to my december
98 group (also a pregnancy group) giving my reasons for homeschooling. (i
mentioned unschooling but said i'd give more detail later--the message was
long enough!)
one mom posted last night that she is considering homeschooling, because
her 4.5 year old son is very active, and his preschool teacher said things
to her yesterday like "He's got an amazing vocabulary, but he doesn't sit
still." "He doesn't listen well." "He fidgets." ack! in their case, the
DH stays home & the mom works, and the mom is the one who wants to consider
homeschooling. she is looking for info for her DH. any stay-at-home dads
here, or places i could point them? anyway, in my reply to her, i
mentioned that we've decided we're not sending our kids to school. then i
was asked why, so i wrote my long message. i hope my group responds as
thoughtfully as yours did.
michele
andre 12/98
rose 4/01
joelle 4/01
At 02:57 PM 5/23/2003 -0400, Kelly Lenhart wrote:
>And it wasn't to a homeschool group, though. It was to a group of moms whotoo cool! i loved your messages to them, and hope people there took them well.
>have been together since we were all pregnant together. We were all due
>with a baby in Feb '96. We've stayed together through childbirth and the
>last 7 years. We are a very close group which includes families on either
>end of the parenting spectrum. I treasure that group of connections.
>
>If I couldn't be honest with them....
timing is everything... this morning i wrote a long message to my december
98 group (also a pregnancy group) giving my reasons for homeschooling. (i
mentioned unschooling but said i'd give more detail later--the message was
long enough!)
one mom posted last night that she is considering homeschooling, because
her 4.5 year old son is very active, and his preschool teacher said things
to her yesterday like "He's got an amazing vocabulary, but he doesn't sit
still." "He doesn't listen well." "He fidgets." ack! in their case, the
DH stays home & the mom works, and the mom is the one who wants to consider
homeschooling. she is looking for info for her DH. any stay-at-home dads
here, or places i could point them? anyway, in my reply to her, i
mentioned that we've decided we're not sending our kids to school. then i
was asked why, so i wrote my long message. i hope my group responds as
thoughtfully as yours did.
michele
andre 12/98
rose 4/01
joelle 4/01
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/23/03 1:11:04 PM, mina@... writes:
<< I sat down with the stuff I used to do his "first grade" curriculum and
made
a list of things to "cover" while we were away on vacation. I used those
Core Curriculum books by Hirsch. I just told James today that I'd like to
sit down with the list and work out the things we'd like to cover next year
and talk about it together. Then we'd basically put the list away, having
decided to cover them, we could trust that it would happen. That's how
loose I am with it at this point. >>
If you do that, though, and he discovers any of those things naturally (or if
you casually leave them out for him to find), it will be "schoolwork" instead
of joyous discovery.
I hope you'll consider cancelling your meeting about what to learn next year.
It really does have the great potential to keep you from seeing unschooling
work as well and as soon as you would without it.
It also maintains for you the object/field separation which causes some thing
s/subjects/ideas to be more valuable than others, and you really don't know
what will be valuable to him in the longrun.
<<>You don't have to have it all figured out right this minute.
<<I don't! But I just bought the t-shirt, drat it!!! -giggle->>
Then put the t-shirt on and cancel that IEP meeting you have planned with
your own sweet child!!
Sandra
<< I sat down with the stuff I used to do his "first grade" curriculum and
made
a list of things to "cover" while we were away on vacation. I used those
Core Curriculum books by Hirsch. I just told James today that I'd like to
sit down with the list and work out the things we'd like to cover next year
and talk about it together. Then we'd basically put the list away, having
decided to cover them, we could trust that it would happen. That's how
loose I am with it at this point. >>
If you do that, though, and he discovers any of those things naturally (or if
you casually leave them out for him to find), it will be "schoolwork" instead
of joyous discovery.
I hope you'll consider cancelling your meeting about what to learn next year.
It really does have the great potential to keep you from seeing unschooling
work as well and as soon as you would without it.
It also maintains for you the object/field separation which causes some thing
s/subjects/ideas to be more valuable than others, and you really don't know
what will be valuable to him in the longrun.
<<>You don't have to have it all figured out right this minute.
<<I don't! But I just bought the t-shirt, drat it!!! -giggle->>
Then put the t-shirt on and cancel that IEP meeting you have planned with
your own sweet child!!
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/23/03 1:29:50 PM, nellebelle@... writes:
<< > couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
But Hirsch knows? >>
<< > couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
> that I couldn't know what he needed to learn--and neither could theschool.
But Hirsch knows? >>
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/23/03 1:29:50 PM, nellebelle@... writes:
<< > couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
-=-But Hirsch knows? >>
OH!
A very palpable hit.
Some kids know that quote well before Hirsch thinks they need to, and anyone
here who does NOT know it has obviously gotten this far in life, can read and
write, has reproduced, is raising children using alternative methods they
researched themselves, and so THAT is proof that knowing all the bits of cultural
trivia isn't necessary.
And what about whatever bits Hirsch left out?
I think knowing lots of stuff is fun. People get more jokes, the more they
know.
You have to know a HECK of a lot to get all the jokes on the new Weird Al CD.
I sure don't get them all, but everyone I got was fun and made me feel well
rounded. <g>
New this week!
Poodle Hat, by Weird Al.
Worth as much any whole year of the Hirsh books, if you can follow each trail
and understand each reference. [But how horrible it would be if a mom
assigned a kid to do that!]
Sandra
<< > couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
> that I couldn't know what he needed to learn--and neither could theschool.
-=-But Hirsch knows? >>
OH!
A very palpable hit.
Some kids know that quote well before Hirsch thinks they need to, and anyone
here who does NOT know it has obviously gotten this far in life, can read and
write, has reproduced, is raising children using alternative methods they
researched themselves, and so THAT is proof that knowing all the bits of cultural
trivia isn't necessary.
And what about whatever bits Hirsch left out?
I think knowing lots of stuff is fun. People get more jokes, the more they
know.
You have to know a HECK of a lot to get all the jokes on the new Weird Al CD.
I sure don't get them all, but everyone I got was fun and made me feel well
rounded. <g>
New this week!
Poodle Hat, by Weird Al.
Worth as much any whole year of the Hirsh books, if you can follow each trail
and understand each reference. [But how horrible it would be if a mom
assigned a kid to do that!]
Sandra
[email protected]
This was sitting on my desktop as thought it hadn't been sent, so I'm sending
again. Sorry if it's a duplicate. Didn't find it in new or old received
mail.
In a message dated 5/23/03 1:29:50 PM, nellebelle@... writes:
<< > couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
-=-But Hirsch knows? >>
OH!
A very palpable hit.
Some kids know that quote well before Hirsch thinks they need to, and anyone
here who does NOT know it has obviously gotten this far in life, can read and
write, has reproduced, is raising children using alternative methods they
researched themselves, and so THAT is proof that knowing all the bits of cultural
trivia isn't necessary.
And what about whatever bits Hirsch left out?
I think knowing lots of stuff is fun. People get more jokes, the more they
know.
You have to know a HECK of a lot to get all the jokes on the new Weird Al CD.
I sure don't get them all, but everyone I got was fun and made me feel well
rounded. <g>
New this week!
Poodle Hat, by Weird Al.
Worth as much any whole year of the Hirsh books, if you can follow each trail
and understand each reference. [But how horrible it would be if a mom
assigned a kid to do that!]
Sandra
again. Sorry if it's a duplicate. Didn't find it in new or old received
mail.
In a message dated 5/23/03 1:29:50 PM, nellebelle@... writes:
<< > couldn't tell my son when he was tired, etc, was the basis for realizing
> that I couldn't know what he needed to learn--and neither could theschool.
-=-But Hirsch knows? >>
OH!
A very palpable hit.
Some kids know that quote well before Hirsch thinks they need to, and anyone
here who does NOT know it has obviously gotten this far in life, can read and
write, has reproduced, is raising children using alternative methods they
researched themselves, and so THAT is proof that knowing all the bits of cultural
trivia isn't necessary.
And what about whatever bits Hirsch left out?
I think knowing lots of stuff is fun. People get more jokes, the more they
know.
You have to know a HECK of a lot to get all the jokes on the new Weird Al CD.
I sure don't get them all, but everyone I got was fun and made me feel well
rounded. <g>
New this week!
Poodle Hat, by Weird Al.
Worth as much any whole year of the Hirsh books, if you can follow each trail
and understand each reference. [But how horrible it would be if a mom
assigned a kid to do that!]
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/23/2003 3:58:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
"Everything your child needs to know, if you want him to grow up to be E. D.
Hirsh." It makes me chuckle every time I think of it.
Amy Kagey
Email me for a list
of used homeschooling books!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> But Hirsch knows? >>David Albert makes a crack about that in his new book....something like
>
>
> OH!
> A very palpable hit.
>
> Some kids know that quote well before Hirsch thinks they need to, and anyone
>
> here who does NOT know it has obviously gotten this far in life, can read
> and
> write, has reproduced, is raising children using alternative methods they
> researched themselves, and so THAT is proof that knowing all the bits of
> cultural
> trivia isn't necessary.
>
"Everything your child needs to know, if you want him to grow up to be E. D.
Hirsh." It makes me chuckle every time I think of it.
Amy Kagey
Email me for a list
of used homeschooling books!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Julie Solich
> I don't talk about freedoms and respect when I talk about unschooling toroll, and
> "outsiders," BUT it was a homeschooling list! And the writer was on a
> enthusiastic!when
>
> It's worth leaving that bit of food-for-thought for them to eat (or not)
> they're hungry!Since I began unschooling, another family from my homeschool support group
> Sandra
has also taken the plunge.
Most of my friends laugh and shake their heads when I share the changes that
are taking place in my home but they listen and we are able to talk about
it.
My copy of The Unschooling Handbook is doing the rounds. Even a friend who
is very controlling asked to borrow it yesterday so that she and her husband
could read it.
Another friend who is using the Sonlight curriculum has said she has begun
to question how she speaks to her kids and why she says no to certain
things.
I think it's worth leaving tidbits around for them to 'chew' over at their
leisure!
Julie
>the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner,
> ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
>
> If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email
Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
>email to:
> To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an
> [email protected]
>
> Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Backstrom kelli
how do you get the unschooling handbook? and one other question what happens when you opt for the digest format? Can you still contribute to the conversation and how often does it come? I really love being on the list but it is so hard to keep up with three children, two babies:) thanks Kelli
Julie Solich <mjsolich@...> wrote:> I don't talk about freedoms and respect when I talk about unschooling to
has also taken the plunge.
Most of my friends laugh and shake their heads when I share the changes that
are taking place in my home but they listen and we are able to talk about
it.
My copy of The Unschooling Handbook is doing the rounds. Even a friend who
is very controlling asked to borrow it yesterday so that she and her husband
could read it.
Another friend who is using the Sonlight curriculum has said she has begun
to question how she speaks to her kids and why she says no to certain
things.
I think it's worth leaving tidbits around for them to 'chew' over at their
leisure!
Julie
Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Julie Solich <mjsolich@...> wrote:> I don't talk about freedoms and respect when I talk about unschooling to
> "outsiders," BUT it was a homeschooling list! And the writer was on aroll, and
> enthusiastic!when
>
> It's worth leaving that bit of food-for-thought for them to eat (or not)
> they're hungry!Since I began unschooling, another family from my homeschool support group
> Sandra
has also taken the plunge.
Most of my friends laugh and shake their heads when I share the changes that
are taking place in my home but they listen and we are able to talk about
it.
My copy of The Unschooling Handbook is doing the rounds. Even a friend who
is very controlling asked to borrow it yesterday so that she and her husband
could read it.
Another friend who is using the Sonlight curriculum has said she has begun
to question how she speaks to her kids and why she says no to certain
things.
I think it's worth leaving tidbits around for them to 'chew' over at their
leisure!
Julie
>the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner,
> ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
>
> If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email
Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
>email to:
> To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an
> [email protected]Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
> Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Michele Evard
hi kelli,
At 06:41 PM 5/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
book. :-)
The Unschooling Handbook : How to Use the Whole World As Your Child's Classroom
by Mary Griffith
if there's another 'handbook' i'd like to hear about it too.
one file. according to yahoo.com "Messages are delivered in batches of 25
or daily, whichever comes sooner."
still seems i only read email while i'm nursing them. my son is almost 4.5
now, and wants to know what the messages are about, or play zoo tycoon with
me. (i've got to get a copy for his computer soon.) :-)
i've found that i prefer to not use the digest, since then i can't sort the
messages by title. my email software (eudora) allows me to set up filters,
so all messages from this group go into one folder. i know other mail
software allows this too. that way you can just read the group messages
when you have time. you can also usually sort them by title, so you can go
to the topics that you think will be most useful to you.
michele
At 06:41 PM 5/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>how do you get the unschooling handbook?i got my copy of it from amazon.com, assuming we're talking about the same
book. :-)
The Unschooling Handbook : How to Use the Whole World As Your Child's Classroom
by Mary Griffith
if there's another 'handbook' i'd like to hear about it too.
> and one other question what happens when you opt for the digest format?you can still contribute. digests are just groups of messages all sent in
> Can you still contribute to the conversation and how often does it come?
one file. according to yahoo.com "Messages are delivered in batches of 25
or daily, whichever comes sooner."
> I really love being on the list but it is so hard to keep up with threei know what you're saying! my (twin) girls are now 2 years old, but it
> children, two babies:) thanks Kelli
still seems i only read email while i'm nursing them. my son is almost 4.5
now, and wants to know what the messages are about, or play zoo tycoon with
me. (i've got to get a copy for his computer soon.) :-)
i've found that i prefer to not use the digest, since then i can't sort the
messages by title. my email software (eudora) allows me to set up filters,
so all messages from this group go into one folder. i know other mail
software allows this too. that way you can just read the group messages
when you have time. you can also usually sort them by title, so you can go
to the topics that you think will be most useful to you.
michele