reconciling college thoughts
[email protected]
How would some of you handle their unschooling child asking about starting
college at a young age?
Most times I think I should honor her request, other times I think it's wrong
to jump back into the classroom, for lots of reasons, then I think I am just
being selfish because we are having too much fun right now.
Her reasons for wanting to start now are that she will be finished sooner
than later, this is the only reason she can really give me.
It's not about taking one or two classes, she's considering a full load of
classes as a good "starting point".
What would you do? Talk about it some more? Go ahead and register her? Try
a compromise with maybe a partial load?
One day she really really wants to do this and then a few days later, she
changes her mind, which is fine with me, but I'm really at a loss for which
way to best help her with this choice.
My best instincts tell me that the REAL reason she is considering this is
that some of her friends who are in school have been talking about college
and expectations and who will and will not "make it". I think it's about
proving herself and her choices more than really wanting to begin a new part
of her life's journey.
How would you approach this as a parent?
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
college at a young age?
Most times I think I should honor her request, other times I think it's wrong
to jump back into the classroom, for lots of reasons, then I think I am just
being selfish because we are having too much fun right now.
Her reasons for wanting to start now are that she will be finished sooner
than later, this is the only reason she can really give me.
It's not about taking one or two classes, she's considering a full load of
classes as a good "starting point".
What would you do? Talk about it some more? Go ahead and register her? Try
a compromise with maybe a partial load?
One day she really really wants to do this and then a few days later, she
changes her mind, which is fine with me, but I'm really at a loss for which
way to best help her with this choice.
My best instincts tell me that the REAL reason she is considering this is
that some of her friends who are in school have been talking about college
and expectations and who will and will not "make it". I think it's about
proving herself and her choices more than really wanting to begin a new part
of her life's journey.
How would you approach this as a parent?
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 9:26:38 AM, rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
<< What would you do? Talk about it some more? Go ahead and register her?
Try
a compromise with maybe a partial load? >>
I'd talk her into trying one or two classes to see how she likes it, IF it's
something she can do from home, or at a community college or something local.
If we were in a town without any college opportunity and Kirby wanted to go
to a college town to try it, I'd help him do it but would discourage him from
doing any more than 12 hours at first, because it's EASY to take more on your
plate than you can handle when you're young and looking at a college
class-catalog.
A successful first experience could move either way, then, either "That was
fun, but weird" or "Wow! I can do this!" An unsuccessful first experience
could be overwhelmingly discouraging.
Sandra
<< What would you do? Talk about it some more? Go ahead and register her?
Try
a compromise with maybe a partial load? >>
I'd talk her into trying one or two classes to see how she likes it, IF it's
something she can do from home, or at a community college or something local.
If we were in a town without any college opportunity and Kirby wanted to go
to a college town to try it, I'd help him do it but would discourage him from
doing any more than 12 hours at first, because it's EASY to take more on your
plate than you can handle when you're young and looking at a college
class-catalog.
A successful first experience could move either way, then, either "That was
fun, but weird" or "Wow! I can do this!" An unsuccessful first experience
could be overwhelmingly discouraging.
Sandra
the_clevengers
--- In [email protected], rubyprincesstsg@a... wrote:
college, how much it would cost, what the commitment would be, etc.
If they were talking about going to a local community college and
were maybe serious about it, they could probably dabble easily
without it being too much of a problem. But if they were talking
about applying to $40k a year Ivy League college, than I think they'd
have to be a lot more serious about wanting it in order to go through
all the application and cost hoops necessary to get there.
I think some of it would dalso epend on how much of it she was going
to cover cost-wise, how much was refundable if she decided to drop
classes, etc. I'd be pretty unwilling to shuck out a lot of non-
refundable dollars if a kid wasn't pretty committed to going. But I'd
be more likely to do a trial effort of a certain number of classes.
Of course, if she's paying for the whole thing, then it's really her
decision completely.
I went to college early and for me it was a very good decision. Of
course, my parents weren't able to help me out financially, so it was
completely up to me to get scholarships set up, apply for more
scholarships, financial aid, etc. and work 2 or 3 jobs at a time to
pay for it. So it was totally my responsibility, and thus I was
pretty invested in making sure I got the most out of it.
I think it would be a lot different if a child was expecting a parent
to pay for it.
not. Is she asking for funding or transportation from you? If so, are
you able to provide them? If providing funding or trasporation is a
basic problem, then you'd probably want to discuss that and make sure
she is serious. If not, why not let her play around with it? I guess
I see unschooling as supporting my kids decisions to the best of my
ability. Sometimes, as with funding and transportation issues, that's
not possible. Then we have to figure out what will work best to meet
as many of the needs as possible. That's what I would do in this
situation.
Blue Skies,
-Robin-
> How would some of you handle their unschooling child asking aboutstarting
> college at a young age?I guess that would depend on where they were thinking of going to
college, how much it would cost, what the commitment would be, etc.
If they were talking about going to a local community college and
were maybe serious about it, they could probably dabble easily
without it being too much of a problem. But if they were talking
about applying to $40k a year Ivy League college, than I think they'd
have to be a lot more serious about wanting it in order to go through
all the application and cost hoops necessary to get there.
I think some of it would dalso epend on how much of it she was going
to cover cost-wise, how much was refundable if she decided to drop
classes, etc. I'd be pretty unwilling to shuck out a lot of non-
refundable dollars if a kid wasn't pretty committed to going. But I'd
be more likely to do a trial effort of a certain number of classes.
Of course, if she's paying for the whole thing, then it's really her
decision completely.
I went to college early and for me it was a very good decision. Of
course, my parents weren't able to help me out financially, so it was
completely up to me to get scholarships set up, apply for more
scholarships, financial aid, etc. and work 2 or 3 jobs at a time to
pay for it. So it was totally my responsibility, and thus I was
pretty invested in making sure I got the most out of it.
I think it would be a lot different if a child was expecting a parent
to pay for it.
> Most times I think I should honor her request, other times I thinkit's wrong
> to jump back into the classroom, for lots of reasons, then I thinkI am just
> being selfish because we are having too much fun right now.I guess the question is why is it up to you to "honor" her request or
not. Is she asking for funding or transportation from you? If so, are
you able to provide them? If providing funding or trasporation is a
basic problem, then you'd probably want to discuss that and make sure
she is serious. If not, why not let her play around with it? I guess
I see unschooling as supporting my kids decisions to the best of my
ability. Sometimes, as with funding and transportation issues, that's
not possible. Then we have to figure out what will work best to meet
as many of the needs as possible. That's what I would do in this
situation.
Blue Skies,
-Robin-
myfunny4
--- In [email protected], rubyprincesstsg@a... wrote:
My reaction or response would probably depend on my child;
specifically, her age and maturity level.
Some community colleges will not accept students younger than 16
years old. How old is your daughter?
begin full-time at our local community college in the fall (she'll be
18 by then), and we've been having a lot of these discussions.
Again, I think checking with the local community college about their
admission requirements would be a good place to start. My daughter
has done all the phone calls, paperwork, collecting information, etc.
necessary to gain admission. All I did was drive her to the college
for placement testing, and write a check for a down payment. Does
your daughter exhibit this kind of determination and motivation, or
is it more idle thinking at this point? That might give you some
insight on how badly she wants to do this.
I would certainly encourage her to take at least one class at the
community college for the experience.
I hope this helps.
Debbie
> How would some of you handle their unschooling child asking aboutstarting
> college at a young age?Hi Glena,
My reaction or response would probably depend on my child;
specifically, her age and maturity level.
Some community colleges will not accept students younger than 16
years old. How old is your daughter?
>sooner
> Her reasons for wanting to start now are that she will be finished
> than later, this is the only reason she can really give me.Has she mentioned what she'd like to study in college? My dd-17 will
begin full-time at our local community college in the fall (she'll be
18 by then), and we've been having a lot of these discussions.
> It's not about taking one or two classes, she's considering a fullload of > classes as a good "starting point".
Again, I think checking with the local community college about their
admission requirements would be a good place to start. My daughter
has done all the phone calls, paperwork, collecting information, etc.
necessary to gain admission. All I did was drive her to the college
for placement testing, and write a check for a down payment. Does
your daughter exhibit this kind of determination and motivation, or
is it more idle thinking at this point? That might give you some
insight on how badly she wants to do this.
I would certainly encourage her to take at least one class at the
community college for the experience.
I hope this helps.
Debbie
Betsy
**Her reasons for wanting to start now are that she will be finished
sooner
than later, this is the only reason she can really give me.**
"Finished sooner" doesn't sound like a great reason to me.
I've heard lots of people say that they didn't know what they wanted out
of college until after they had some work experience and really
identified their career interests in the "real world". Sometimes even
people who have graduated want to "change their major".
So, perhaps it would be helpful to talk to various people that you and
your daughter know about their college experiences: what was useful and
what was useless and what they would do differently if they had a second chance.
Signing up for more classes than you really want and dropping the ones
where the teachers don't excite you is a valid way to sift through
courses. You can't always tell a good course just from the description
in the book.
I think I would give her information about pros and cons of different
approaches to college and let her make her own decisions (subject to
your approval if you have to chauffeur her). But mark the drop deadline
in red on *your* calendar, too.
Betsy
sooner
than later, this is the only reason she can really give me.**
"Finished sooner" doesn't sound like a great reason to me.
I've heard lots of people say that they didn't know what they wanted out
of college until after they had some work experience and really
identified their career interests in the "real world". Sometimes even
people who have graduated want to "change their major".
So, perhaps it would be helpful to talk to various people that you and
your daughter know about their college experiences: what was useful and
what was useless and what they would do differently if they had a second chance.
Signing up for more classes than you really want and dropping the ones
where the teachers don't excite you is a valid way to sift through
courses. You can't always tell a good course just from the description
in the book.
I think I would give her information about pros and cons of different
approaches to college and let her make her own decisions (subject to
your approval if you have to chauffeur her). But mark the drop deadline
in red on *your* calendar, too.
Betsy
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 11:32:36 AM, ecsamhill@... writes:
<< Signing up for more classes than you really want and dropping the ones
where the teachers don't excite you is a valid way to sift through
courses. You can't always tell a good course just from the description
in the book. >>
Good point, depending how the fee structure works at that school.
Sandra
<< Signing up for more classes than you really want and dropping the ones
where the teachers don't excite you is a valid way to sift through
courses. You can't always tell a good course just from the description
in the book. >>
Good point, depending how the fee structure works at that school.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 1:59:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
a step above high school but not so far different? Well, dramatically
different in lots of ways but still sitting in classes all day type of the
sameness.
I think she feels the need at times to prove to some friends she is still
learning, but maybe not.
This is a back and forth things with her these days, so I guess we'll just
see where it leads us both.
She knows I'm open to considering it. Are there times when you think your
children might be testing you to see if for once you might just say NO?
Maybe it's just that she really truly doesn't know what she wants, being 14
(nearly 15 she would add) is a great time to be indecisive I think, so many
possibilities, so many infinite things to choose from.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> Signing up for more classes than you really want and dropping the onesAll of the advice is sound but does anyone think that at 14 it would be just
> where the teachers don't excite you is a valid way to sift through
> courses. You can't always tell a good course just from the description
> in the book. >>
>
> Good point, depending how the fee structure works at that school.
>
a step above high school but not so far different? Well, dramatically
different in lots of ways but still sitting in classes all day type of the
sameness.
I think she feels the need at times to prove to some friends she is still
learning, but maybe not.
This is a back and forth things with her these days, so I guess we'll just
see where it leads us both.
She knows I'm open to considering it. Are there times when you think your
children might be testing you to see if for once you might just say NO?
Maybe it's just that she really truly doesn't know what she wants, being 14
(nearly 15 she would add) is a great time to be indecisive I think, so many
possibilities, so many infinite things to choose from.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pamela Sorooshian
Maybe you and she could both work on being more clear or more "solid"
about what you mean. Instead of saying she wants to go to college and
then saying she doesn't, flip-flopping like that, it would be a lot
more reasonable and logical for her to be saying, "I might like to take
a college class and see how I like it." She sounds like she's picked up
your habit of saying something and then saying later that she didn't
mean it.
What is more likely is that you two have not yet really come to terms
with unschooling. You still think, to some degree, in school-like terms
- you posted, for example, about her making a cake that was a model of
a cell. That's cute, but it seemed like you thought that was somehow
more valuable than just making a cake would have been, or making a cake
that was a model of a pokemon or a teddy bear or something else,
because learning the parts of a cell is more "educational." Unless it
was for a biology party or something, that mostly sounds like a sort of
contrived way of getting "educational content" into a daily life. Now -
I'm not saying it couldn't have come up very naturally - unschooled
kids can get some wild ideas and make some very interesting connections
- "Let's make a cake model of a cell," isn't impossible to imagine,
that's for sure. But I'm putting together the various things you've
posted and it seems to me that you still put greater value on things
that look most like your child is learning traditional school lessons.
You also said that she's listening to schooled friends talking about
college and stuff like that. How old is she again?
If you want to unschool, you have to deschool. You don't seem to have
really done that yet. You've gone from worrying about how she'll learn
the math she needs to get into college to her wanting to go to college
now, but not because she wants to go, but because she wants to be
finished with it.
My two older girls both take college courses - they did start at 13 and
14 years old. But they were never really, "going to college," the see
the college as a vast cafeteria of incredible resources to learn things
they really want to learn and filled with people who are actually paid
to be resource people - to offer them new information and ideas and
supplies and studios - such as ceramics, photography, choral groups,
and so on. They don't want to be finished - they have no concept of
being "finished." They want to learn and have discovered that the local
community college offers incredible learning opportunities.
doomed to have to live out and she wants to "get it over with."
I'd be a whole lot less concerned with whether she should go to college
or not - and a whole lot more concerned with why her thinking is so
unclear and muddy and why she cares so much about what other kids are
talking about, etc. After all your concern about whether she'd know
enough math for college and how she wants to be a doctor and so on -
this sounds just bizarre -- if she wants to be a doctor so badly, then
why isn't she saying she wants to go to college now so that she can
hurry up and get into med school because she just can't WAIT to be a
doctor. Or something like that?
To me, it sounds more like a kid who isn't feeling entirely comfortable
in her own life and is thinking she ought to "do something" more
educational than she's doing. Where is she getting that idea? How can
you help her to find and pursue her own passionate interests? How can
you help yourself and her let go of the idea that the things normally
taught in school are more educational? How can you help her not care
what her schooled friends are doing?
-pam
about what you mean. Instead of saying she wants to go to college and
then saying she doesn't, flip-flopping like that, it would be a lot
more reasonable and logical for her to be saying, "I might like to take
a college class and see how I like it." She sounds like she's picked up
your habit of saying something and then saying later that she didn't
mean it.
What is more likely is that you two have not yet really come to terms
with unschooling. You still think, to some degree, in school-like terms
- you posted, for example, about her making a cake that was a model of
a cell. That's cute, but it seemed like you thought that was somehow
more valuable than just making a cake would have been, or making a cake
that was a model of a pokemon or a teddy bear or something else,
because learning the parts of a cell is more "educational." Unless it
was for a biology party or something, that mostly sounds like a sort of
contrived way of getting "educational content" into a daily life. Now -
I'm not saying it couldn't have come up very naturally - unschooled
kids can get some wild ideas and make some very interesting connections
- "Let's make a cake model of a cell," isn't impossible to imagine,
that's for sure. But I'm putting together the various things you've
posted and it seems to me that you still put greater value on things
that look most like your child is learning traditional school lessons.
You also said that she's listening to schooled friends talking about
college and stuff like that. How old is she again?
If you want to unschool, you have to deschool. You don't seem to have
really done that yet. You've gone from worrying about how she'll learn
the math she needs to get into college to her wanting to go to college
now, but not because she wants to go, but because she wants to be
finished with it.
My two older girls both take college courses - they did start at 13 and
14 years old. But they were never really, "going to college," the see
the college as a vast cafeteria of incredible resources to learn things
they really want to learn and filled with people who are actually paid
to be resource people - to offer them new information and ideas and
supplies and studios - such as ceramics, photography, choral groups,
and so on. They don't want to be finished - they have no concept of
being "finished." They want to learn and have discovered that the local
community college offers incredible learning opportunities.
> **Her reasons for wanting to start now are that she will be finishedSheesh - this is sad. It sounds like she thinks it is a sentence she's
> sooner
> than later, this is the only reason she can really give me.*
doomed to have to live out and she wants to "get it over with."
I'd be a whole lot less concerned with whether she should go to college
or not - and a whole lot more concerned with why her thinking is so
unclear and muddy and why she cares so much about what other kids are
talking about, etc. After all your concern about whether she'd know
enough math for college and how she wants to be a doctor and so on -
this sounds just bizarre -- if she wants to be a doctor so badly, then
why isn't she saying she wants to go to college now so that she can
hurry up and get into med school because she just can't WAIT to be a
doctor. Or something like that?
To me, it sounds more like a kid who isn't feeling entirely comfortable
in her own life and is thinking she ought to "do something" more
educational than she's doing. Where is she getting that idea? How can
you help her to find and pursue her own passionate interests? How can
you help yourself and her let go of the idea that the things normally
taught in school are more educational? How can you help her not care
what her schooled friends are doing?
-pam
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 2:24:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
pamsoroosh@... writes:
for various sprinkles or candies to decorate the cake with. I really wasn't
a part of that cake baking but in the end she told me it was a "cell cake",
it had licorice whips and fire balls and gum drops and she pointed out what
she had used as various things, so I guess I could see that it was indeed a
"cell cake". Personally I don't have the creativity to even come up with an
idea like a cell cake, but I thought it was great that she did and it was a
great dessert too!
<Sheesh - this is sad. It sounds like she thinks it is a sentence she's
doomed to have to live out and she wants to "get it over with.">
Not at all, it just as you suggested, that once she's gotten it "over with"
THEN she can do what she really wants in life, become a doctor and help
people.
I think lots of us probably had irrational thoughts at 14 and probably a lot
of indecision and probably to some extent wanting to have our future now, at
least some days anyway.
College isn't anything that is a requisite for ME at all, my oldest child
went to college because she wanted to, my next oldest didn't for the same
reason, next in line has gone for a year and thinks he might not go back in
the fall. It's whatever they choose.
I think you give me too much credit in the decision making process of my
kids. They are very clear that it is THEIR life they are living and not
mine, nor for me, they are very independent thinkers.
I just thought it was unusual for a 14 (nearly 15 year old) to be tossing
back and forth the idea of college full time and wondered what others
thought.
<How can
you help yourself and her let go of the idea that the things normally
taught in school are more educational? How can you help her not care
what her schooled friends are doing?>
I'm not sure she thinks things learned in the classroom have more value or
are more educational, I think she is simply weighing options, dreaming of
life as a doctor, wishing it were NOW.
Of course college comes up often especially this time of year when kids are
getting acceptance letters and holding their breaths waiting. Tales of great
times and wonderful preparations abound. So I think maybe it's just like a
vacation you've planned for a long time and you keep reading and getting
brochures and your friends who've been tell you what a great time it will be
and you just wish it were July 8th and you were there already so you'd know
how great it is yourself and you were home with memories and photos and can
talk about it with others who found it so wonderful.
Mostly it's probably just being 14 and dreaming.
Thank you for your input, I've asked myself the questions you've asked me and
looked for answers to them.
I'm glad your daughters had such wonderful experiences with college. I have
just found out that for the local colleges they "encourage" students to be 16
or older because the enrollments are so high and classes are so full. At
this point it seems to be out of my hands anyway.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
pamsoroosh@... writes:
> Unless itThe cell cake came about quite by accident. She baked a cake and was looking
> was for a biology party or something, that mostly sounds like a sort of
> contrived way of getting "educational content" into a daily life. Now -
> I'm not saying it couldn't have come up very naturally - unschooled
> kids can get some wild ideas and make some very interesting connections
> - "Let's make a cake model of a cell," isn't impossible to imagine,
>
for various sprinkles or candies to decorate the cake with. I really wasn't
a part of that cake baking but in the end she told me it was a "cell cake",
it had licorice whips and fire balls and gum drops and she pointed out what
she had used as various things, so I guess I could see that it was indeed a
"cell cake". Personally I don't have the creativity to even come up with an
idea like a cell cake, but I thought it was great that she did and it was a
great dessert too!
<Sheesh - this is sad. It sounds like she thinks it is a sentence she's
doomed to have to live out and she wants to "get it over with.">
Not at all, it just as you suggested, that once she's gotten it "over with"
THEN she can do what she really wants in life, become a doctor and help
people.
I think lots of us probably had irrational thoughts at 14 and probably a lot
of indecision and probably to some extent wanting to have our future now, at
least some days anyway.
College isn't anything that is a requisite for ME at all, my oldest child
went to college because she wanted to, my next oldest didn't for the same
reason, next in line has gone for a year and thinks he might not go back in
the fall. It's whatever they choose.
I think you give me too much credit in the decision making process of my
kids. They are very clear that it is THEIR life they are living and not
mine, nor for me, they are very independent thinkers.
I just thought it was unusual for a 14 (nearly 15 year old) to be tossing
back and forth the idea of college full time and wondered what others
thought.
<How can
you help yourself and her let go of the idea that the things normally
taught in school are more educational? How can you help her not care
what her schooled friends are doing?>
I'm not sure she thinks things learned in the classroom have more value or
are more educational, I think she is simply weighing options, dreaming of
life as a doctor, wishing it were NOW.
Of course college comes up often especially this time of year when kids are
getting acceptance letters and holding their breaths waiting. Tales of great
times and wonderful preparations abound. So I think maybe it's just like a
vacation you've planned for a long time and you keep reading and getting
brochures and your friends who've been tell you what a great time it will be
and you just wish it were July 8th and you were there already so you'd know
how great it is yourself and you were home with memories and photos and can
talk about it with others who found it so wonderful.
Mostly it's probably just being 14 and dreaming.
Thank you for your input, I've asked myself the questions you've asked me and
looked for answers to them.
I'm glad your daughters had such wonderful experiences with college. I have
just found out that for the local colleges they "encourage" students to be 16
or older because the enrollments are so high and classes are so full. At
this point it seems to be out of my hands anyway.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 1:32:16 PM, rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
<< Are there times when you think your
children might be testing you to see if for once you might just say NO? >>
No, but my kids have never been to school, and have been here always, and
we've always been straight with one another about everything.
<<All of the advice is sound but does anyone think that at 14 it would be
just
a step above high school but not so far different? >>
In what ways?
College is something adults do. High school is not.
College is not a government lock-up facility. High school is.
Nobody is forced to go to college by the government. High school kids are.
I think they're really different things.
If SHE thinks college is just new-improved high school, maybe her motives
will be impure (as to whether she wants it herself or wants others to see her
being there) but so? If she likes it, she'll know more; if she doesn't like
it she'll know more.
If the family can afford it and the school is accessible, I would recommend
letting it be the teen's decision and not the parents', no differently than
if it were piano lessons or ice hockey that just happened to require cash,
supplies and transportation.
Sandra
<< Are there times when you think your
children might be testing you to see if for once you might just say NO? >>
No, but my kids have never been to school, and have been here always, and
we've always been straight with one another about everything.
<<All of the advice is sound but does anyone think that at 14 it would be
just
a step above high school but not so far different? >>
In what ways?
College is something adults do. High school is not.
College is not a government lock-up facility. High school is.
Nobody is forced to go to college by the government. High school kids are.
I think they're really different things.
If SHE thinks college is just new-improved high school, maybe her motives
will be impure (as to whether she wants it herself or wants others to see her
being there) but so? If she likes it, she'll know more; if she doesn't like
it she'll know more.
If the family can afford it and the school is accessible, I would recommend
letting it be the teen's decision and not the parents', no differently than
if it were piano lessons or ice hockey that just happened to require cash,
supplies and transportation.
Sandra
[email protected]
Conflict:
Original question contained this:
-=-How would some of you handle their unschooling child asking about starting
college at a young age?
-=-Most times I think I should honor her request, other times I think it's
wrong
to jump back into the classroom, for lots of reasons, then I think I am just
being selfish because we are having too much fun right now.-=-
After friendly response by someone who has had young teens take college
classes, this response seemed not to match the original question:
-=-I think you give me too much credit in the decision making process of my
kids. They are very clear that it is THEIR life they are living and not
mine, nor for me, they are very independent thinkers.-=-
-=-I just thought it was unusual for a 14 (nearly 15 year old) to be tossing
back and forth the idea of college full time and wondered what others
thought.-=-
Other gave quick, honest, and friendly ideas.
-=I'm glad your daughters had such wonderful experiences with college. I
have
just found out that for the local colleges they "encourage" students to be 16
or older because the enrollments are so high and classes are so full. At
this point it seems to be out of my hands anyway.
-=-
Will you use the statement of what the local college "encourages" to say no
then? Is that what "out of my hands" means? Many places will make
exceptions for homeschoolers.
Sandra
Original question contained this:
-=-How would some of you handle their unschooling child asking about starting
college at a young age?
-=-Most times I think I should honor her request, other times I think it's
wrong
to jump back into the classroom, for lots of reasons, then I think I am just
being selfish because we are having too much fun right now.-=-
After friendly response by someone who has had young teens take college
classes, this response seemed not to match the original question:
-=-I think you give me too much credit in the decision making process of my
kids. They are very clear that it is THEIR life they are living and not
mine, nor for me, they are very independent thinkers.-=-
-=-I just thought it was unusual for a 14 (nearly 15 year old) to be tossing
back and forth the idea of college full time and wondered what others
thought.-=-
Other gave quick, honest, and friendly ideas.
-=I'm glad your daughters had such wonderful experiences with college. I
have
just found out that for the local colleges they "encourage" students to be 16
or older because the enrollments are so high and classes are so full. At
this point it seems to be out of my hands anyway.
-=-
Will you use the statement of what the local college "encourages" to say no
then? Is that what "out of my hands" means? Many places will make
exceptions for homeschoolers.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 3:44:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
learning, teacher directed learning, learning from books with set lessons and
goals in mind each day. True often you get a syllabus with everything you
are expected to learn for the entire semester but that often happens in high
school too. This would still be like high school in the way that Cait is
able to chose on her own whether she would go or not. High school is forced
in a way but not for all children, children who's parents agree to not let
them go there.
She doesn't at all think it's a new and improved high school. She thinks its
a grand adventure one minute and a way to get where she wants at another
time, I think it probably can be both to her at some point, IF she wants it.
Money isn't the issue but now it looks like rules and regulations are. Seems
it will be impossible to consider until she is 16 anyway, so it's really not
something that is possible presently. She's back to happily chasing a ball
with the dog while her cheer uniform is washing.
I guess maybe she just wondered what it would be like, if it were at all
possible and what my feelings were about it, maybe just wondering for the
sake of wondering about life.
Thank you for your thoughtful replies.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> All of the advice is sound but does anyone think that at 14 it would beIt would be the same as high school in the ways that it is classroom
> just
> a step above high school but not so far different? >>
>
> In what ways?
>
learning, teacher directed learning, learning from books with set lessons and
goals in mind each day. True often you get a syllabus with everything you
are expected to learn for the entire semester but that often happens in high
school too. This would still be like high school in the way that Cait is
able to chose on her own whether she would go or not. High school is forced
in a way but not for all children, children who's parents agree to not let
them go there.
She doesn't at all think it's a new and improved high school. She thinks its
a grand adventure one minute and a way to get where she wants at another
time, I think it probably can be both to her at some point, IF she wants it.
Money isn't the issue but now it looks like rules and regulations are. Seems
it will be impossible to consider until she is 16 anyway, so it's really not
something that is possible presently. She's back to happily chasing a ball
with the dog while her cheer uniform is washing.
I guess maybe she just wondered what it would be like, if it were at all
possible and what my feelings were about it, maybe just wondering for the
sake of wondering about life.
Thank you for your thoughtful replies.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 3:49:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
diamondair@... writes:
it would affect a lot of things, but since they don't accept students under
16, it's no longer an issue.
Thanks for your thoughts and letting me know that early college worked out
for you.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
diamondair@... writes:
> guess the question is why is it up to you to "honor" her request orI would most definitely be paying for school and doing the transportation, so
> not. Is she asking for funding or transportation from you?
it would affect a lot of things, but since they don't accept students under
16, it's no longer an issue.
Thanks for your thoughts and letting me know that early college worked out
for you.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 3:51:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
anyone under 16. Classes are too full. Maybe if I knew someone or a
professor it might be different but I don't.
There are lots of community classes if she really wanted to explore a "class"
but she says she doesn't right now.
Like I said previously, some days she's perfectly happy with things as they
are (most days) but she has asked about college and occasionally expressed a
desire to be there NOW.
As for saying yes or no... I don't really do that about anything. If she
decides she wants to pursue this, then she can contact someone at the college
and see what if anything they will do to accommodate her at her age. I think
if she does the contacting they might take it more seriously than a mother
who might seem like she is just pushing her child into college early.
For now, she's seems fine with the age limitations we found out about.
Thank you all for your thoughtful considerations and remarks.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> Will you use the statement of what the local college "encourages" to say noWell it is out of my hands, they are currently accepting no applications from
> then? Is that what "out of my hands" means? Many places will make
> exceptions for homeschoolers.
>
anyone under 16. Classes are too full. Maybe if I knew someone or a
professor it might be different but I don't.
There are lots of community classes if she really wanted to explore a "class"
but she says she doesn't right now.
Like I said previously, some days she's perfectly happy with things as they
are (most days) but she has asked about college and occasionally expressed a
desire to be there NOW.
As for saying yes or no... I don't really do that about anything. If she
decides she wants to pursue this, then she can contact someone at the college
and see what if anything they will do to accommodate her at her age. I think
if she does the contacting they might take it more seriously than a mother
who might seem like she is just pushing her child into college early.
For now, she's seems fine with the age limitations we found out about.
Thank you all for your thoughtful considerations and remarks.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tia Leschke
> Maybe you and she could both work on being more clear or more "solid"This whole post is so right on. I hope it's read and thought about and
> about what you mean.
chewed on rather than argued with.
Tia
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...
Tia Leschke
>I've known a few who did that (well at 15 and 16) but they knew exactly why
> I just thought it was unusual for a 14 (nearly 15 year old) to be tossing
> back and forth the idea of college full time and wondered what others
> thought.
they wanted to go and what they wanted to get out of it. On the other hand,
I went at almost 18 after unschooling while my peers were finishing their
last 2 years of high school. I would sign up for a full load of classes and
then drop all but the ones that really interested me. But it was a
community college with no tuition fees. I'm not sure I would have paid full
tuition to do that. <G>
Tia
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 4:15:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
leschke@... writes:
all the time? I know that some probably do, or they are sure about
something's but might change their minds about others. (especially what they
want to WEAR or how they want their hair to look)
Should she be saying something and sticking to it? Should I just go along
with her saying something and then later changing her mind about it? Should
I try to somehow persuade her to say something and stick to it?
I might be completely wrong with thinking it's perfectly OK for a 14 year old
to say something and then changing her mind about it. I don't want her to
think she shouldn't come to me unless her plans are etched in stone and she
isn't wavering at all about them.
Do those of you who have young teens do this? I thought it was part of
dreaming of the future and deciding plans and changing minds. If she were
twenty maybe I would think she needs to be more decisive, but then maybe I
wouldn't, maybe 25?
I'm really curious to find out other's thoughts on this. Should I just tell
her when she's decided for sure to let me know?
I thought if she wanted to try it then she should go ahead and see what it
was all about. If she wasn't fully committed to it, I doubt she would last
the tedious process of interviews and registrations and all the lengthy
process it seems to be here to get into a class schedule, so she'd save it
for a later time when it was worth it to her.
I remember my oldest looking forward to college but as the time drew closer
for her to actually move to another state, she had her doubts and I thought
that was normal, but she went. She wasn't at all homesick until her junior
year for some reason. Lots of things happened at college for her, some good,
some very bad, but all in all, I'm sure she's glad she went. She was 17 when
she went away though and seemed much older than Cait does. (well she WAS)
Are other 14 year olds very set in thoughts and decisions? I know one day
she might say that strawberry ice cream is her very favorite flavor, next
week she might say it's whatever is the specialty and I thought that was OK.
I look forward to hearing what others experiences have been.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
leschke@... writes:
> Maybe you and she could both work on being more clear or more "solid"Do you think that most 14 year olds know what they want and are sure of it
> >about what you mean.
>
all the time? I know that some probably do, or they are sure about
something's but might change their minds about others. (especially what they
want to WEAR or how they want their hair to look)
Should she be saying something and sticking to it? Should I just go along
with her saying something and then later changing her mind about it? Should
I try to somehow persuade her to say something and stick to it?
I might be completely wrong with thinking it's perfectly OK for a 14 year old
to say something and then changing her mind about it. I don't want her to
think she shouldn't come to me unless her plans are etched in stone and she
isn't wavering at all about them.
Do those of you who have young teens do this? I thought it was part of
dreaming of the future and deciding plans and changing minds. If she were
twenty maybe I would think she needs to be more decisive, but then maybe I
wouldn't, maybe 25?
I'm really curious to find out other's thoughts on this. Should I just tell
her when she's decided for sure to let me know?
I thought if she wanted to try it then she should go ahead and see what it
was all about. If she wasn't fully committed to it, I doubt she would last
the tedious process of interviews and registrations and all the lengthy
process it seems to be here to get into a class schedule, so she'd save it
for a later time when it was worth it to her.
I remember my oldest looking forward to college but as the time drew closer
for her to actually move to another state, she had her doubts and I thought
that was normal, but she went. She wasn't at all homesick until her junior
year for some reason. Lots of things happened at college for her, some good,
some very bad, but all in all, I'm sure she's glad she went. She was 17 when
she went away though and seemed much older than Cait does. (well she WAS)
Are other 14 year olds very set in thoughts and decisions? I know one day
she might say that strawberry ice cream is her very favorite flavor, next
week she might say it's whatever is the specialty and I thought that was OK.
I look forward to hearing what others experiences have been.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/2003 3:32:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
think, "so many possibilities, so many infinite things to choose from."
~Kelly, busy girl! <g>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
> being 14I don't think age has ANYthing to do with that. I'm almost 43 and I *still*
> (nearly 15 she would add) is a great time to be indecisive I think, so many
>
> possibilities, so many infinite things to choose from.
>
think, "so many possibilities, so many infinite things to choose from."
~Kelly, busy girl! <g>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 4:36:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, leschke@...
writes:
tuition, pay for every class I take, and forfiet my fees if I drop a class
after 7 days. I've dropped a lot of classes and lost a lot of money.
Here in NC, a law was recently passed that will allow 14 year olds to go to
community college IF they pass some tests that prove they are above average
in intelligence... It't a pretty strict policy, like, you have to score in
the top 10% or something ( I cant find the exact details right now)
College is not like high school in all of the ways that Sandra mentioned.
But, community college IS like high school in lots of ways too.( well, the
CC, I go to, that is) Landon said there is a running joke at his high
school, Bandys High School, that our local CC is "Bandys with ash trays"..
In lots of ways, that description is accurate. There are attendance
requirements, senseless assignments, redundant material, and lots of "busy
work". I havent taken one class at CC college that an intelligent and
determined 14 yo could not pass. BUT, lots and lots of folks over 18 fail
all the time. Students can eat and drink in class, smoke outside, and no
one sends you to the office for cursing, but, aside from those things, the CC
in my area is run much like high school.
Teresa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
writes:
> But it was aDag, I wish I could go to that community college.. lol. I still have to pay
> community college with no tuition fees.
tuition, pay for every class I take, and forfiet my fees if I drop a class
after 7 days. I've dropped a lot of classes and lost a lot of money.
Here in NC, a law was recently passed that will allow 14 year olds to go to
community college IF they pass some tests that prove they are above average
in intelligence... It't a pretty strict policy, like, you have to score in
the top 10% or something ( I cant find the exact details right now)
College is not like high school in all of the ways that Sandra mentioned.
But, community college IS like high school in lots of ways too.( well, the
CC, I go to, that is) Landon said there is a running joke at his high
school, Bandys High School, that our local CC is "Bandys with ash trays"..
In lots of ways, that description is accurate. There are attendance
requirements, senseless assignments, redundant material, and lots of "busy
work". I havent taken one class at CC college that an intelligent and
determined 14 yo could not pass. BUT, lots and lots of folks over 18 fail
all the time. Students can eat and drink in class, smoke outside, and no
one sends you to the office for cursing, but, aside from those things, the CC
in my area is run much like high school.
Teresa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
nellebelle
----- Original Message ----- > So, perhaps it would be helpful to talk to
various people that you and
> your daughter know about their college experiences: what was useful and
> what was useless and what they would do differently if they had a second
chance.> > > > >
I would not have gone to college straight from high school. I had no reason
for being there, other than I had good grades in high school and my parents
thought I should go and were willing to pay. I withdrew from all the
classes I didn't like. (That was probably good, as it kept my GPA up!) I
didn't return for the second year, which classified me as a drop-out. I'd
gone to Kodiak, AK to earn money over the summer, and liked it so much that
I stayed there for 9 years. It was quite a let down to my parents. At one
time, I worked as a nanny for room and board only. They really thought I
was a loser, but I was having the time of my life (including making the
acuaintance of some amazing people with children who helped to shape my
ideas of parenting.)
Later, I became interested in something and got a job in that field. I
studied the subject in my spare time, and on the job, which was encouraged
by management because they wanted their employees to be well informed. I
decided to take a community college class for some science background that I
lacked. That class led to another, then another.
I took one class at a time. Perfect for a 20 something with a full time
job. I was able to do really well in each class (keeping that GPA up)
because I only had one class at a time to focus on.
When I decided to return to school full-time, it was much easier to get
through the classes that I knew were only hoops to jump through, because I
had personal reasons and goals for being there. I transferred with a high
GPA, so when I did get a couple of Ds (gasp!) they hardly effected my GPA.
Please note, I only think the GPA matters if you will need it for
scholarships or future schooling.
After graduation, I worked a fairly short time in my field, then had a child
and decided I'd rather be home.
If I really had to do it all again, would I have even got the B.S.? Hard to
say. University actually led to some of my ideas about the myths of the
importance of formal education. I really don't think my field needs to be a
college degree. Those with the credentials, of course, want to keep it that
way.
Mary Ellen
[email protected]
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
<< THEN she can do what she really wants in life, become a doctor and help
people. >>
I was going to ask is there a specific thing she wanted to do as a career,
and if it required college. That makes a big difference, wanting to be like
her friends is one thing, but a clear goal is another.
<>
And from your other post, she said she wants to get it over with, in a sense?
She may be very eager to learn everything she needs to be a doctor and start
practicing, and that kind of motivation sounds like a very positive thing. I
don't think that's necessarily unusual, in fact, in one way, it reinforces my
idea that when children are unschooled, they could have very precise career
goals and education goals at a very early age, I personally, wouldn't
discourage that at all.
<< I have
just found out that for the local colleges they "encourage" students to be 16
or older because the enrollments are so high and classes are so full. >>
I was wondering if there was an age requirement, if it is just a suggestion,
tho, they can't stop her! lol
~Aimee
<< THEN she can do what she really wants in life, become a doctor and help
people. >>
I was going to ask is there a specific thing she wanted to do as a career,
and if it required college. That makes a big difference, wanting to be like
her friends is one thing, but a clear goal is another.
<>
And from your other post, she said she wants to get it over with, in a sense?
She may be very eager to learn everything she needs to be a doctor and start
practicing, and that kind of motivation sounds like a very positive thing. I
don't think that's necessarily unusual, in fact, in one way, it reinforces my
idea that when children are unschooled, they could have very precise career
goals and education goals at a very early age, I personally, wouldn't
discourage that at all.
<< I have
just found out that for the local colleges they "encourage" students to be 16
or older because the enrollments are so high and classes are so full. >>
I was wondering if there was an age requirement, if it is just a suggestion,
tho, they can't stop her! lol
~Aimee
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 4:55:54 PM, AimeeL73@... writes:
<< it reinforces my
idea that when children are unschooled, they could have very precise career
goals and education goals at a very early age, >>
Until just the past few months neither of my teenaged boys had any idea what
they might want to do.
I, on the other hand, decided at six years old that I was going to be a
teacher (for a while it was a missionary-teacher) and my fall-back was
magazine journalism. I wanted to go to college and get it going! I decided
before I was thirty that I did NOT want to be a teacher anymore. But hey, it
was over 20 years of decisiveness I stuck with, from first grade on through!
Knowing early isn't always knowing best.
Kirby has said law or programing and Marty has said police work or air force
MP. I'm not holding either of them to it, but we're not discouraging them
either (nor pressing).
Sandra
<< it reinforces my
idea that when children are unschooled, they could have very precise career
goals and education goals at a very early age, >>
Until just the past few months neither of my teenaged boys had any idea what
they might want to do.
I, on the other hand, decided at six years old that I was going to be a
teacher (for a while it was a missionary-teacher) and my fall-back was
magazine journalism. I wanted to go to college and get it going! I decided
before I was thirty that I did NOT want to be a teacher anymore. But hey, it
was over 20 years of decisiveness I stuck with, from first grade on through!
Knowing early isn't always knowing best.
Kirby has said law or programing and Marty has said police work or air force
MP. I'm not holding either of them to it, but we're not discouraging them
either (nor pressing).
Sandra
Betsy
**(for a while it was a missionary-teacher) and my fall-back was
magazine journalism.**
Hey, this list is missionary journalism, of a kind.
Betsy
magazine journalism.**
Hey, this list is missionary journalism, of a kind.
Betsy
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 5:30:01 PM, ecsamhill@... writes:
<< Hey, this list is missionary journalism, of a kind. >>
It really is. <g>
Home Education Magazine is too!
<< Hey, this list is missionary journalism, of a kind. >>
It really is. <g>
Home Education Magazine is too!
Deborah Lewis
Glena,
My friends daughter went to college at fourteen.
She started with two classes she was really interested in, did very well
and will be going back this year.
One of her professors did some kind of magic dance and she can even go
for credits this year if she chooses to. The rule was a student had to
be sixteen, but they're waiving it for her, and I'll bet it can be done
elsewhere.
Lindsey has always been an unschooler though, has amazing confidence, and
went because she really wanted to take these particular classes, not
because she's defined a long term goal for herself.
***teacher directed learning,***
It's a little different though because nobody sends you to the principal
if you decide not to do the work<G>
She really will have all the responsibility of keeping up and doing the
work herself.
If she'd just go take a class or two she'd have a better idea whether
it's something she wants to commit herself to full time.
Deb L
My friends daughter went to college at fourteen.
She started with two classes she was really interested in, did very well
and will be going back this year.
One of her professors did some kind of magic dance and she can even go
for credits this year if she chooses to. The rule was a student had to
be sixteen, but they're waiving it for her, and I'll bet it can be done
elsewhere.
Lindsey has always been an unschooler though, has amazing confidence, and
went because she really wanted to take these particular classes, not
because she's defined a long term goal for herself.
***teacher directed learning,***
It's a little different though because nobody sends you to the principal
if you decide not to do the work<G>
She really will have all the responsibility of keeping up and doing the
work herself.
If she'd just go take a class or two she'd have a better idea whether
it's something she wants to commit herself to full time.
Deb L
Tia Leschke
> Dag, I wish I could go to that community college.. lol. I still have topay
> tuition, pay for every class I take, and forfiet my fees if I drop a classWell, it was in the late '60s. <g> Things might well have changed since
> after 7 days. I've dropped a lot of classes and lost a lot of money.
then.
> College is not like high school in all of the ways that Sandra mentioned.fail
> But, community college IS like high school in lots of ways too.( well, the
> CC, I go to, that is) Landon said there is a running joke at his high
> school, Bandys High School, that our local CC is "Bandys with ash trays"..
> In lots of ways, that description is accurate. There are attendance
> requirements, senseless assignments, redundant material, and lots of "busy
> work". I havent taken one class at CC college that an intelligent and
> determined 14 yo could not pass. BUT, lots and lots of folks over 18
> all the time. Students can eat and drink in class, smoke outside, and noCC
> one sends you to the office for cursing, but, aside from those things, the
> in my area is run much like high school.Too bad. What I liked about the community college was that it was so
different than high school. There was no babysitting. If you missed class,
you figured out a way to make it up. They did have a rule about missing
tests for unexcused absences. The only time it was used against me, believe
it or not, was by my German teacher when I took an extra week at spring
break to go to . . . Germany!
Tia
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...
Tia Leschke
> How would some of you handle their unschooling child asking about startingwrong
> college at a young age?
>
> Most times I think I should honor her request, other times I think it's
> to jump back into the classroom, for lots of reasons, then I think I amjust
> being selfish because we are having too much fun right now.Mine has no interest at all in college, but if he did, I'd show him where to
find the information about it and offer to help if he got stuck with any
part of the choosing and/or registration process.
That's how I would honour his request.
Tia
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/19/03 6:25:51 PM, rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
<< Are other 14 year olds very set in thoughts and decisions? I know one day
she might say that strawberry ice cream is her very favorite flavor, next
week she might say it's whatever is the specialty and I thought that was OK.
<<I thought that was OK.>>
It's okay if you think it's okay. Our agreement or disagreement shouldn't
matter.
People can change their minds about ice cream no matter how old they are.
Sandra
<< Are other 14 year olds very set in thoughts and decisions? I know one day
she might say that strawberry ice cream is her very favorite flavor, next
week she might say it's whatever is the specialty and I thought that was OK.
>>Depends.
<<I thought that was OK.>>
It's okay if you think it's okay. Our agreement or disagreement shouldn't
matter.
People can change their minds about ice cream no matter how old they are.
Sandra
Pamela Sorooshian
On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 01:30 PM, rubyprincesstsg@... wrote:
what you mean." For example, you said very explicitly that her only
reason was to get it over with: "Her reasons for wanting to start now
are that she will be finished sooner
than later, this is the only reason she can really give me." But then
you say in another post that she thinks it will be a "grand adventure."
That is the LAST thing anybody could have gotten out of what you said
in your first post. Once again, you add information later that
completely changes the meaning of the first request for ideas. You
waste people's time that way.
My comment was that MAYBE both of you could work on really being clear
in what you say - that it might help you communicate - maybe you
wouldn't have to guess what she means - like you say in this post: "My
best instincts tell me that the REAL reason she is considering this is
that some of her friends who are in school have been talking about
college
and expectations and who will and will not "make it". I think it's
about proving herself and her choices more than really wanting to begin
a new part of her life's journey."
Again, my response to you had absolutely NOTHING to do with 14 yo's
changing their minds. Did you read the rest of the post or only the
first line?
-pam
>> Maybe you and she could both work on being more clear or more "solid"You're reading "stick to it" but I wrote "be more clear or solid about
>>> about what you mean.
>>
>
> Do you think that most 14 year olds know what they want and are sure
> of it
> all the time? I know that some probably do, or they are sure about
> something's but might change their minds about others. (especially
> what they
> want to WEAR or how they want their hair to look)
>
> Should she be saying something and sticking to it? Should I just go
> along
> with her saying something and then later changing her mind about it?
> Should
> I try to somehow persuade her to say something and stick to it?
>
what you mean." For example, you said very explicitly that her only
reason was to get it over with: "Her reasons for wanting to start now
are that she will be finished sooner
than later, this is the only reason she can really give me." But then
you say in another post that she thinks it will be a "grand adventure."
That is the LAST thing anybody could have gotten out of what you said
in your first post. Once again, you add information later that
completely changes the meaning of the first request for ideas. You
waste people's time that way.
My comment was that MAYBE both of you could work on really being clear
in what you say - that it might help you communicate - maybe you
wouldn't have to guess what she means - like you say in this post: "My
best instincts tell me that the REAL reason she is considering this is
that some of her friends who are in school have been talking about
college
and expectations and who will and will not "make it". I think it's
about proving herself and her choices more than really wanting to begin
a new part of her life's journey."
Again, my response to you had absolutely NOTHING to do with 14 yo's
changing their minds. Did you read the rest of the post or only the
first line?
-pam
> I might be completely wrong with thinking it's perfectly OK for a 14
> year old
> to say something and then changing her mind about it. I don't want
> her to
> think she shouldn't come to me unless her plans are etched in stone
> and she
> isn't wavering at all about them.
>
> Do those of you who have young teens do this? I thought it was part of
> dreaming of the future and deciding plans and changing minds. If she
> were
> twenty maybe I would think she needs to be more decisive, but then
> maybe I
> wouldn't, maybe 25?
>
> I'm really curious to find out other's thoughts on this. Should I
> just tell
> her when she's decided for sure to let me know?
>
> I thought if she wanted to try it then she should go ahead and see
> what it
> was all about. If she wasn't fully committed to it, I doubt she would
> last
> the tedious process of interviews and registrations and all the lengthy
> process it seems to be here to get into a class schedule, so she'd
> save it
> for a later time when it was worth it to her.
>
> I remember my oldest looking forward to college but as the time drew
> closer
> for her to actually move to another state, she had her doubts and I
> thought
> that was normal, but she went. She wasn't at all homesick until her
> junior
> year for some reason. Lots of things happened at college for her,
> some good,
> some very bad, but all in all, I'm sure she's glad she went. She was
> 17 when
> she went away though and seemed much older than Cait does. (well she
> WAS)
>
> Are other 14 year olds very set in thoughts and decisions? I know one
> day
> she might say that strawberry ice cream is her very favorite flavor,
> next
> week she might say it's whatever is the specialty and I thought that
> was OK.
>
> I look forward to hearing what others experiences have been.
myfunny4
--- In [email protected], rubyprincesstsg@a... wrote:
My dd-13 (14 next month) takes a long time to make choices or
decisions, but once she does, she doesn't often change her mind. My
dd-17 (18 in August) can change her mind as often as she changes her
clothes.
today that she wants to be a molecular biologist, I'll smile and tell
her that I'm sure she'll be a wonderful scientist; but I won't make
her "stick" to that statement. If my daughter tells me that she's
volunteering to work at our church's vacation bible program this
summer, then I will ask her "stick" with it, if necessary. It's
never been necessary, though. The first statement was an projection
of a future event that may or may not take place; the second
statement was a commitment to a specific action, a promise to do
something, on which other people would reasonably rely and depend
on.
her to say something just to make her stick to it?
dinner tonight; I changed my mind because circumstances changed...I
discovered I didn't have enough barbecue sauce for the pork
chops...then dh called to say he would be home earlier than usual
which wouldn't give me enough time to make and cook lasagna...then
the day was so nice that I took Kevin out for a walk and along the
way I decided it was a perfect day to grill turkey burgers.
I don't think you should do that. Why would you close off the
opportunity for such wonderful conversations with your daughter? I
love with my daughters talk with me, sharing their thoughts and hopes
with me, even if those hopes and desires change every day.
Debbie
>sure of it
> Do you think that most 14 year olds know what they want and are
> all the time?Some do and some don't; it depends on the personality of the child.
My dd-13 (14 next month) takes a long time to make choices or
decisions, but once she does, she doesn't often change her mind. My
dd-17 (18 in August) can change her mind as often as she changes her
clothes.
> Should she be saying something and sticking to it?I think it depends on what she's saying. If my daughter tells me
today that she wants to be a molecular biologist, I'll smile and tell
her that I'm sure she'll be a wonderful scientist; but I won't make
her "stick" to that statement. If my daughter tells me that she's
volunteering to work at our church's vacation bible program this
summer, then I will ask her "stick" with it, if necessary. It's
never been necessary, though. The first statement was an projection
of a future event that may or may not take place; the second
statement was a commitment to a specific action, a promise to do
something, on which other people would reasonably rely and depend
on.
>ShouldWhat could you persuade her to say? Do you mean you would *persuade*
> I try to somehow persuade her to say something and stick to it?
her to say something just to make her stick to it?
> Do those of you who have young teens do this? I thought it waspart of
> dreaming of the future and deciding plans and changing minds.>LOL! I changed my mind three times today about what to make for
dinner tonight; I changed my mind because circumstances changed...I
discovered I didn't have enough barbecue sauce for the pork
chops...then dh called to say he would be home earlier than usual
which wouldn't give me enough time to make and cook lasagna...then
the day was so nice that I took Kevin out for a walk and along the
way I decided it was a perfect day to grill turkey burgers.
> I'm really curious to find out other's thoughts on this. Should Ijust tell > her when she's decided for sure to let me know?>
I don't think you should do that. Why would you close off the
opportunity for such wonderful conversations with your daughter? I
love with my daughters talk with me, sharing their thoughts and hopes
with me, even if those hopes and desires change every day.
Debbie