[email protected]

In a message dated 5/12/2003 9:58:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,
diamondair@... writes:

> One thing I've noted that is interesting (this is veering off on a tangent,
> but oh well here goes) is when people post about their unschooling days,
> almost all of the posts I've read involved going somewhere and buying
> something - Target, WalMart, whatever. Buying video games or clothes or
> toys
> or books or going out for food or whatever. That's one thing we just don't
> do very much of. I can't remember the last time I was in a Target or
> Walmart - maybe 6 months ago? I don't buy books in Borders or Barnes and
> Noble anymore, I get them at the library or borrow them from friends. Our
> clothes are hand-me-downs or thrift stores, and going out to eat (even fast
> food) happens less than once a month.

I just wrote an email about funds and spending money and deleted it. Then I
read this so now I guess I will add my thoughts. We go to Walmart for diapers
and groceries and we can write a check before Friday and it wont clear till
Saturday. We are actually the ones that went to B & N and I spent 40.00 and
sat and had a capachino (sp) with my son. It was great BUT I did come home to
my husband who said you spent what! We dont have the money!
I go once every couple months.

Yesterday I sat in the kitchen and cried and told him I feel like it will
always be this way.
We own a home and a vehicle each but we are in debt and ready to file
Bankruptcy. I am very depressed about this and have put it off for almost two
years. We have two mortgages and the second is what caused this whole mess.
There is actually a class action suit against them but it is too far off to
help us.

I too want to go to SC but he says no we cant do it and I didn't even tell
him about the fees to get in.
I know he works hard and has often worked Saturday's to make the mortgages
and I know I sound inconsiderate. He says please dont get a night job and I
dont want to do this either but there has to be a light at the end of the
tunnel..

I think what stresses me the most is when I see these families in their SUV's
or not counting what is in their cart at the store. I know the grass looks
greener on the other side and no I dont want to be them but it all does way
heavy on my heart.

Laura D



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

zenmomma2kids

>> I know the grass looks greener on the other side and no I dont
want to be them but it all does way heavy on my heart.>>

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Laura D}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

I wish I had a magic wand to make your financial troubles disappear.
Try to focus on what you do have and work to get the rest under some
manageable system. Hang in there.

Life is good.
~Mary

Olga

Laura,

I am sorry you are struggling. We have been lucky thus far in that
we have enough to get by and a little extra but who knows what the
future holds. It does give me alot of faith when I hear others tell
me they are happy with less and are managing. I am trying to make
steps towards that on a daily basis. My dh could care less, he is
wonderful about being happy with where he is. His family lost his
brother in a fire before he was born but that loss effects my dh to
this day. He is not materialistic and I am trying to get better
about it myself.

We live in a very affluent neighborhood (we bought our house for
almost nothing and then there was a huge boom). We have been fixing
our house ourselves slowly. Homes in our neighborhood are benig
knocked down to make way for million dollar homes on the water. The
funny thing is me and dh were discussing this the other day. He
said, we all spend the same in a sense. If you have more, you spend
more but are we truley more free? For example, I had to pick up
something from a mom from my mommy & me program. She lives on the
water in a very wealthy area. Her house was all remodoled, HUGE.
But, I noticed her windows were still old and so was her kitchen. I
thought, here is this woman who probably pays about $20,000 a year a
in taxes alone and they can't even have it all. Even the wealthy
live above their means, it is just not so obvious to the rest of us.

I know it is frustrating. I have a friends who both work and their
kids are in preschool. They did the Disney cruise and are planning
to go again. I had this twinge of jealousy. Then I thought, you
know what I am on vacation with my kids everday! I could go to work
and make a nice income and we could have vacations and a bigger house
but my choices tell me that is not important.

Your beleifs and choices tell you it is more important to give your
son an amazing childhood and memories. That family is more important
than money. Just try and remember what you enjoy about these choices
because it is all too easy to see what we do not have. Lord knows, I
am trying to remember that too!!

Olga :)

--- In [email protected], HMSL2@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 5/12/2003 9:58:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> diamondair@e... writes:
>
> > One thing I've noted that is interesting (this is veering off on
a tangent,
> > but oh well here goes) is when people post about their
unschooling days,
> > almost all of the posts I've read involved going somewhere and
buying
> > something - Target, WalMart, whatever. Buying video games or
clothes or
> > toys
> > or books or going out for food or whatever. That's one thing we
just don't
> > do very much of. I can't remember the last time I was in a Target
or
> > Walmart - maybe 6 months ago? I don't buy books in Borders or
Barnes and
> > Noble anymore, I get them at the library or borrow them from
friends. Our
> > clothes are hand-me-downs or thrift stores, and going out to eat
(even fast
> > food) happens less than once a month.
>
> I just wrote an email about funds and spending money and deleted
it. Then I
> read this so now I guess I will add my thoughts. We go to Walmart
for diapers
> and groceries and we can write a check before Friday and it wont
clear till
> Saturday. We are actually the ones that went to B & N and I spent
40.00 and
> sat and had a capachino (sp) with my son. It was great BUT I did
come home to
> my husband who said you spent what! We dont have the money!
> I go once every couple months.
>
> Yesterday I sat in the kitchen and cried and told him I feel like
it will
> always be this way.
> We own a home and a vehicle each but we are in debt and ready to
file
> Bankruptcy. I am very depressed about this and have put it off for
almost two
> years. We have two mortgages and the second is what caused this
whole mess.
> There is actually a class action suit against them but it is too
far off to
> help us.
>
> I too want to go to SC but he says no we cant do it and I didn't
even tell
> him about the fees to get in.
> I know he works hard and has often worked Saturday's to make the
mortgages
> and I know I sound inconsiderate. He says please dont get a night
job and I
> dont want to do this either but there has to be a light at the end
of the
> tunnel..
>
> I think what stresses me the most is when I see these families in
their SUV's
> or not counting what is in their cart at the store. I know the
grass looks
> greener on the other side and no I dont want to be them but it all
does way
> heavy on my heart.
>
> Laura D
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

coyote's corner

Hi,
What you are feeling is part of "the theology of consumerism".
Stop.
Step back.
Think.

Look around - you have so much! Really! You have your own home - so you're better off then those that are paying rent and on the edge of bankruptcy.
You speak of people living beyond their means. That's a symptom of this illness. Consume. Purchase. Covet
Is your home warm in the winter, cool in the summer?
Is it dry in the rain and snug in the snow??

What is it you need? A newer model home? A newly remodeld home?

You know what I would do?
I'd sell the house - and go somewhere else in this great big world and buy a house there! I'd pay less for my mortage..and worry less about my kitchen or my windows - and I won't ever drive a SUV .

Be happy.
I know about being broke. I have no property, not even a car - I borrow a van for work.
I have no credit.

Still, it's a beautiful day and none of this stuff really means anything.

Shake it off - woman!!!

Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: Olga
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 1:40 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Unschooling and funds was Feeling alienated from non-homeschool moms


Laura,

I am sorry you are struggling. We have been lucky thus far in that
we have enough to get by and a little extra but who knows what the
future holds. It does give me alot of faith when I hear others tell
me they are happy with less and are managing. I am trying to make
steps towards that on a daily basis. My dh could care less, he is
wonderful about being happy with where he is. His family lost his
brother in a fire before he was born but that loss effects my dh to
this day. He is not materialistic and I am trying to get better
about it myself.

We live in a very affluent neighborhood (we bought our house for
almost nothing and then there was a huge boom). We have been fixing
our house ourselves slowly. Homes in our neighborhood are benig
knocked down to make way for million dollar homes on the water. The
funny thing is me and dh were discussing this the other day. He
said, we all spend the same in a sense. If you have more, you spend
more but are we truley more free? For example, I had to pick up
something from a mom from my mommy & me program. She lives on the
water in a very wealthy area. Her house was all remodoled, HUGE.
But, I noticed her windows were still old and so was her kitchen. I
thought, here is this woman who probably pays about $20,000 a year a
in taxes alone and they can't even have it all. Even the wealthy
live above their means, it is just not so obvious to the rest of us.

I know it is frustrating. I have a friends who both work and their
kids are in preschool. They did the Disney cruise and are planning
to go again. I had this twinge of jealousy. Then I thought, you
know what I am on vacation with my kids everday! I could go to work
and make a nice income and we could have vacations and a bigger house
but my choices tell me that is not important.

Your beleifs and choices tell you it is more important to give your
son an amazing childhood and memories. That family is more important
than money. Just try and remember what you enjoy about these choices
because it is all too easy to see what we do not have. Lord knows, I
am trying to remember that too!!

Olga :)

--- In [email protected], HMSL2@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 5/12/2003 9:58:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> diamondair@e... writes:
>
> > One thing I've noted that is interesting (this is veering off on
a tangent,
> > but oh well here goes) is when people post about their
unschooling days,
> > almost all of the posts I've read involved going somewhere and
buying
> > something - Target, WalMart, whatever. Buying video games or
clothes or
> > toys
> > or books or going out for food or whatever. That's one thing we
just don't
> > do very much of. I can't remember the last time I was in a Target
or
> > Walmart - maybe 6 months ago? I don't buy books in Borders or
Barnes and
> > Noble anymore, I get them at the library or borrow them from
friends. Our
> > clothes are hand-me-downs or thrift stores, and going out to eat
(even fast
> > food) happens less than once a month.
>
> I just wrote an email about funds and spending money and deleted
it. Then I
> read this so now I guess I will add my thoughts. We go to Walmart
for diapers
> and groceries and we can write a check before Friday and it wont
clear till
> Saturday. We are actually the ones that went to B & N and I spent
40.00 and
> sat and had a capachino (sp) with my son. It was great BUT I did
come home to
> my husband who said you spent what! We dont have the money!
> I go once every couple months.
>
> Yesterday I sat in the kitchen and cried and told him I feel like
it will
> always be this way.
> We own a home and a vehicle each but we are in debt and ready to
file
> Bankruptcy. I am very depressed about this and have put it off for
almost two
> years. We have two mortgages and the second is what caused this
whole mess.
> There is actually a class action suit against them but it is too
far off to
> help us.
>
> I too want to go to SC but he says no we cant do it and I didn't
even tell
> him about the fees to get in.
> I know he works hard and has often worked Saturday's to make the
mortgages
> and I know I sound inconsiderate. He says please dont get a night
job and I
> dont want to do this either but there has to be a light at the end
of the
> tunnel..
>
> I think what stresses me the most is when I see these families in
their SUV's
> or not counting what is in their cart at the store. I know the
grass looks
> greener on the other side and no I dont want to be them but it all
does way
> heavy on my heart.
>
> Laura D
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

melissa4123

Laura,
reading you post brought tears to my eyes. My DH and I have just
crawled out of that hole you are talking about. He was laid off after
9/11 (he worked for American Airlines in SF). Luckily, I was able to
go back to my pre-mommy job and we earned the same amount of money.

All that ended when my DH decided that he wanted to move us to Fresno,
CA to be closer to his family. He just didn't feel like a man when he
couldn't be the one to "bring home the bacon." So...off we moved
(about 3 to 4 hours south of where we were). He worked several
different jobs, trying to find something that not only paid the bills
but made him happy as well. We lived with his parents for about a
month before he just couldn't take it any more and we moved to an apt.
Shortly after that, he quit his next job and we were both unemployed
for about a month. We had no savings and no income, I still don't
know how I managed to pay the bills. And, let me tell you, there was
NOTHING extra and I mean nothing. We turned off the cable and were
thinking of having the phone turned off when his brother sent us a
check for $1000! They didn't even call to say the money was
coming...I just went out the mail box one afternoon and there it was.
When we called to say thank you they just said that they had been
there and do that and they wanted to help. Told us if we needed more,
to call and not to worry about paying them back. That's when things
started to change for the better. My husband, through a network of
old friends, got a great job working for an airline here in town.
Now, a year later, we own a home and have started to pay some of the
credit card bills down. We can just now go to Target or Wal-mart and
buy a pair of jeans, if we need them. That's not to say that we just
go and spend only that we have less worries now than before. But, we
also learned from our mistakes of spending beyond our means. If we
had saved when he had that great job with American, we never would
have been in that mess to begin with. So....now we put money into a
savings account every month. There's not much there now but, there
will be soon.

I can honestly say that, we never once fought over money. Both of us
have seen what can happen when you start to do that and just didn't
want to go there. That experience only made us more solid that we
already were. We can even look back and smile at that time and wonder
how we ever paid bills and put food on the table. But, it is true
what Olga said about the wealthy also living beyond their means. The
more money you make, the more you spend. If you can just hand in
there, I'm sure things will start to look up. Something I started to
do that made me feel better every day. I kept a journal and every
night, after my little girl had gone to bed, I wrote 5 things that I
was thankful for during that day. Once you start to be grateful and
thankful for what you DO have, it makes the negitave much easier to
deal with. You aren't alone, try to remember that as well.

Melissa

--- In [email protected], "Olga" <britcontoo@a...> wrote:
> Laura,
>
> I am sorry you are struggling. We have been lucky thus far in that
> we have enough to get by and a little extra but who knows what the
> future holds. It does give me alot of faith when I hear others tell
> me they are happy with less and are managing. I am trying to make
> steps towards that on a daily basis. My dh could care less, he is
> wonderful about being happy with where he is. His family lost his
> brother in a fire before he was born but that loss effects my dh to
> this day. He is not materialistic and I am trying to get better
> about it myself.
>
> We live in a very affluent neighborhood (we bought our house for
> almost nothing and then there was a huge boom). We have been fixing
> our house ourselves slowly. Homes in our neighborhood are benig
> knocked down to make way for million dollar homes on the water. The
> funny thing is me and dh were discussing this the other day. He
> said, we all spend the same in a sense. If you have more, you spend
> more but are we truley more free? For example, I had to pick up
> something from a mom from my mommy & me program. She lives on the
> water in a very wealthy area. Her house was all remodoled, HUGE.
> But, I noticed her windows were still old and so was her kitchen. I
> thought, here is this woman who probably pays about $20,000 a year a
> in taxes alone and they can't even have it all. Even the wealthy
> live above their means, it is just not so obvious to the rest of us.
>
> I know it is frustrating. I have a friends who both work and their
> kids are in preschool. They did the Disney cruise and are planning
> to go again. I had this twinge of jealousy. Then I thought, you
> know what I am on vacation with my kids everday! I could go to work
> and make a nice income and we could have vacations and a bigger house
> but my choices tell me that is not important.
>
> Your beleifs and choices tell you it is more important to give your
> son an amazing childhood and memories. That family is more important
> than money. Just try and remember what you enjoy about these choices
> because it is all too easy to see what we do not have. Lord knows, I
> am trying to remember that too!!
>
> Olga :)
>
> --- In [email protected], HMSL2@a... wrote:
> > In a message dated 5/12/2003 9:58:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> > diamondair@e... writes:
> >
> > > One thing I've noted that is interesting (this is veering off on
> a tangent,
> > > but oh well here goes) is when people post about their
> unschooling days,
> > > almost all of the posts I've read involved going somewhere and
> buying
> > > something - Target, WalMart, whatever. Buying video games or
> clothes or
> > > toys
> > > or books or going out for food or whatever. That's one thing we
> just don't
> > > do very much of. I can't remember the last time I was in a Target
> or
> > > Walmart - maybe 6 months ago? I don't buy books in Borders or
> Barnes and
> > > Noble anymore, I get them at the library or borrow them from
> friends. Our
> > > clothes are hand-me-downs or thrift stores, and going out to eat
> (even fast
> > > food) happens less than once a month.
> >
> > I just wrote an email about funds and spending money and deleted
> it. Then I
> > read this so now I guess I will add my thoughts. We go to Walmart
> for diapers
> > and groceries and we can write a check before Friday and it wont
> clear till
> > Saturday. We are actually the ones that went to B & N and I spent
> 40.00 and
> > sat and had a capachino (sp) with my son. It was great BUT I did
> come home to
> > my husband who said you spent what! We dont have the money!
> > I go once every couple months.
> >
> > Yesterday I sat in the kitchen and cried and told him I feel like
> it will
> > always be this way.
> > We own a home and a vehicle each but we are in debt and ready to
> file
> > Bankruptcy. I am very depressed about this and have put it off for
> almost two
> > years. We have two mortgages and the second is what caused this
> whole mess.
> > There is actually a class action suit against them but it is too
> far off to
> > help us.
> >
> > I too want to go to SC but he says no we cant do it and I didn't
> even tell
> > him about the fees to get in.
> > I know he works hard and has often worked Saturday's to make the
> mortgages
> > and I know I sound inconsiderate. He says please dont get a night
> job and I
> > dont want to do this either but there has to be a light at the end
> of the
> > tunnel..
> >
> > I think what stresses me the most is when I see these families in
> their SUV's
> > or not counting what is in their cart at the store. I know the
> grass looks
> > greener on the other side and no I dont want to be them but it all
> does way
> > heavy on my heart.
> >
> > Laura D
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jon and Rue Kream

"I think what stresses me the most is when I see these families in their
SUV's
or not counting what is in their cart at the store. I know the grass looks
greener on the other side and no I dont want to be them but it all does way
heavy on my heart."



Well, I have an SUV (so scary to admit here :0)), that we bought used, for
cash. I count what is in my cart before it goes in my cart. Really, before
I go into the store. We have no debt, aside from our mortgage - no credit
cards, no other loans. We live below our means, on a budget. We don't
consider shopping a pastime.



It was not always this way. I've been on the buybuybuy treadmill, I
remember the nagging guilty feelings at the cash register, the night-time
worrying, and the thrill of finding a 'bargain' on some unnecessary item
that I just had to have. When we decided that something had to change, we
just stopped shopping. That simple. We throw away catalogs without looking
at them. We came up with a yearly budget. We agreed never to have another
credit card. We only go to a store when there is something we NEED.
Thinking about what a need is made a huge difference for us. We started
putting any money we could find into savings - even if it was .02. If the
electric budget was $50, and the bill was $48.50, $1.50 went into savings.
We couldn't believe how quickly those small amounts added up. We do buy
things that we want, but not on impulse, and not without making sure we can
spare the money first. Our whole perspective has changed.

We are by no means wealthy, and Jon had been laid off for over a year, but
we are in control of what money we do have. I don't think it matters how
much you make (I'm not talking about truly impoverished families) - anyone
can make a budget and stick to it if they decide to.

We're all responsible for our own grass. If it doesn't look green enough,
we're the only ones who can change it. The same way we can be at peace in
our families because of the choices we make, we can be at peace with our
money because of the choices we make. ~Rue











[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

zenmomma2kids

>> We throw away catalogs without looking at them. >>


We made the choice to do this too. My dh calls those catalogs Yuppie
Pornography. <g>

Life is good.
~Mary

Deborah Lewis

You really don't need to be spending money to have fun.

We hike a lot. We pack a lunch, peanut butter and jelly and water, and
go.
We take our sketch books and some drawing stuff and our binoculars and we
always find something interesting. We go to ghost towns, rock quarries,
old mining camps, lakes, ponds, rivers, streams. Last week when the sun
came out we hiked up middle fork Cottonwood creek to Cliff Mountain. We
saw so many animals and birds we're still talking about it.

Or, we go to the parks. There are two in our town and several in the
next town. When we're going to be out for the afternoon I take snacks.
Our snacks are home made usually, sometimes raisins and nuts.

We tour places. The Great Harvest bread company gives tours and when
you go in everyone gets a big slice of warm bread. You get to see
handsome hairy guys tossing great gobs of dough around. Kids love it.
<g>

Find a fish hatchery! Last time we went they let Dylan put on waders
and get into the tank. Scurry to the nearest rancher's agra and look at
the baby chicks and ducks and geese. (and bunnies.)

Go see your friendly local fish and wildlife biologist and see if you can
tag along sometime when she's going somewhere. You usually have to
drive your own vehicle but once you're at the destination you have a good
brain to pick for interesting trivia which will impress your mother in
law.

You can visit the animal shelter and play with puppies and kittens.

Some museums are free and have great things for kids to do.

We shop for books at the Goodwill or other second hand stores. Goodwill
paperbacks are ten cents each here. We go to library book sales.

We shop the thrift stores for clothing too. AND costumes for silly plays
at home.

Pick up a belly dance video at the library and try it with your kids. I
dare you not to laugh yourself sick.

Dylan had an idea this year to plant a flower bed in the shape of his
body. He said he wants to put crime scene tape around it like a fence.
<g>

I know it's not easy to be struggling financially but if you are not the
family wage earner I'm recommending you stop worrying about it. Your
worry won't change things and will only affect how you approach each day
with your kids. Let your concern be having fun with your kids and leave
the worry behind. Things will work out.

How old are your kids and what do they like to do? Do you live in the
city or country. I'm sure folks here will have some fun ideas for things
to do.

Deb L

Jon and Rue Kream

>>>We made the choice to do this too. My dh calls those catalogs Yuppie
>>>Pornography. <g>

Perfect! I'll be using that one :-). ~Rue



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robin Clevenger

> From: HMSL2@...
> I just wrote an email about funds and spending money and deleted it. Then
I
> read this so now I guess I will add my thoughts. We go to Walmart for
diapers
> and groceries and we can write a check before Friday and it wont clear
till
> Saturday. We are actually the ones that went to B & N and I spent 40.00
and
> sat and had a capachino (sp) with my son. It was great BUT I did come home
to
> my husband who said you spent what! We dont have the money!
> I go once every couple months.


Well, for what it's worth, I re-read my email when it came through on in the
digest and I sure didn't mean it to sound so snotty. I hope it didn't come
across that way. I was trying to describe our situation, but the way I
juxtaposed it didn't make it come across the way I was thinking it (which
was more stream of consciousness). I hope I didn't inadvertantly make anyone
feel like I was passing a judgement for going to Borders!

And I really sympathize about the B & N. That's the one thing I think I miss
the most. I always used to go to bookstores and never came out empty-handed,
I love buying books! Well, that and traveling. I just keep thinking that
these years are short, it's much more important to be at home with my kids
than to have my former salary and no time with my children when it counts.
Wouldn't trade it for anything but some days you just wish you could have
your cake and eat it too!

Blue Skies,
-Robin-

who wishes she could bicycle to SC ;-) Hey, that's not such a bad idea, but
at the speed I bike with the kids, I'd have to leave tomorrow.

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/12/2003 11:39:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time, HMSL2@...
writes:
> Yesterday I sat in the kitchen and cried and told him I feel like it will
> always be this way.
> We own a home and a vehicle each but we are in debt and ready to file
> Bankruptcy. I am very depressed about this and have put it off for almost
> two
> years. We have two mortgages and the second is what caused this whole
> mess.
> There is actually a class action suit against them but it is too far off to
>
> help us.
>

Laura,

Been there; done that. Filed for bankruptcy. Saved the house, our cars, and
my small business. Almost ruined the marriage. Severe depression. The hole
kept getting deeper and deeper.

The bankruptcy---as awful as it was---actually helped in the long run. It's
been five years, I guess. It gets better. It doesn't have to last forever.
Life sucked for a long time. We were both angry for a long time. And sad.

I felt so bad for so long. Things got better. A lot better. The cool thing is
when the money does finally come in, you don't know what to DO with it! <g>
We found that we don't NEED as much as we used to think we did. Life is
easier now because we know what we really need and what we can do without.

I don't envy you your position. Happy thoughts---and (((Hugs)))

~Kelly


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/12/2003 9:18:12 PM Eastern Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

> >>>We made the choice to do this too. My dh calls those catalogs Yuppie
> >>>Pornography. <g>
>
>

Since buying our house, we compulsively watch shows like Trading Spaces,
Christopher Lowell (well, that's partially because he's the gayest person on
tv), etc.
We refer to it as Decorating Porn.

Kathryn


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

zenmomma2kids

>> Christopher Lowell (well, that's partially because he's the gayest
person on tv), etc.>>

LOL! I love Christopher. But is he really gayer than Jack on Will
and Grace?

>> We refer to it as Decorating Porn.>>

I like it. I'll have to tell my dh that one. We love Trading Spaces.

Life is good.
~Mary

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/13/2003 10:22:00 PM Eastern Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

> >>Christopher Lowell (well, that's partially because he's the gayest
> person on tv), etc.>>
>
> LOL! I love Christopher. But is he really gayer than Jack on Will
> and Grace?
>

Actually, yes, I think so. Keep in mind that Christopher is supposed to be a
real person, while Jack is just a character. When Christopher uses the word
"fabulous," he really means it.

> >> We refer to it as Decorating Porn.>>
>
> I like it. I'll have to tell my dh that one. We love Trading Spaces.
>
>

Oh, us too. All of it really. We're addicted. Juls thinks we're nuts.
Kathryn


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

zenmomma2kids

>> Actually, yes, I think so. Keep in mind that Christopher is
supposed to be a real person, while Jack is just a character.>>

My dh was just telling me the other day that Jack is based on a real
person. This guy is suing the producers (a former friend, I think)
for not compensating him for using his persona onscreen.

Life is good.
~Mary

nellebelle

It urks me when people tell me I'm "lucky to be a stay at home mom". Luck
is when you win the lottery or when you end up OK after doing something
stupid.

I'm home with my kids by choice, not by luck. I can't say what is right for
other families, and I do sometimes wish for more cash, but these years are
flying by and I love that I have lots of time with my kids now.

marry Ellen

----- Original Message ----- > Wouldn't trade it for anything but some days
you just wish you could have
> your cake and eat it too!

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/16/03 4:29:24 PM, nellebelle@... writes:

<< I'm home with my kids by choice, not by luck. >>

I do feel lucky to have the choice. Something could happen to Keith, or one
of the kids could have a really expensive problem that insurance wouldn't
cover, or or or...

Maybe grateful is 'cleaner' than "lucky," but somehow I'm glad.

Sandra