Basics of writing
[email protected]
My 11 yr old son sat down yesterday and wrote a letter to a little boy that
we where giving a bike to. After I read it I felt like a looser Mom.
He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I help
him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I went
over it with him I don't even think he herd me?
I my self am not very good and this was indeed my worst subject in school. He
was tested at school in 2nd grade and they responded by placing him in the
resource room and included a speech label also which I never understood? <
sigh> I had huge issues with this and he was teased daily until we took him
out.
He has been tested at Sylvan Learning centers. His Vocabulary knowledge is
advanced (maybe cuz he was home with Me)? His reading comprehension to
himself is advanced but once he reads aloud his numbers dipped to at least 2
years behind and couldn't remember what he read. I guess I attribute this to
being teased in school, I don't know?
Gosh, I almost feel like I am taking credit on the good stuff and blaming the
school for the bad. Shame on me!
The beginning of this year I was testing his spelling it was a huge stress
all the way around so I stopped. When I went back 2 months later he knew how
to spell the words without the practice or book work.
His writing is almost unreadable. When I offer to sit with him and work on
these he runs and says ahh, I just remembered I need to go rake the leaves or
something to the effect. Too funny! You know its not him either its me and my
panics over how he will favor in years to come.
His other areas are great. He knows some HTML, web pages, how to sell,
customer service, he is polite to others, loves history, shoots archery and
guns with precision. He loves surfing,xbox,trampoline jumping with Mom (too
funny cuz im out of shape after baby) He likes to build, incubated chicks
last year, cared for someone chickens for a year and is now training our
Brittany.
So my question is, in an Unschooling life how do I help him? Do I do
anything, will it come on its own?
Laura
Maine
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
we where giving a bike to. After I read it I felt like a looser Mom.
He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I help
him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I went
over it with him I don't even think he herd me?
I my self am not very good and this was indeed my worst subject in school. He
was tested at school in 2nd grade and they responded by placing him in the
resource room and included a speech label also which I never understood? <
sigh> I had huge issues with this and he was teased daily until we took him
out.
He has been tested at Sylvan Learning centers. His Vocabulary knowledge is
advanced (maybe cuz he was home with Me)? His reading comprehension to
himself is advanced but once he reads aloud his numbers dipped to at least 2
years behind and couldn't remember what he read. I guess I attribute this to
being teased in school, I don't know?
Gosh, I almost feel like I am taking credit on the good stuff and blaming the
school for the bad. Shame on me!
The beginning of this year I was testing his spelling it was a huge stress
all the way around so I stopped. When I went back 2 months later he knew how
to spell the words without the practice or book work.
His writing is almost unreadable. When I offer to sit with him and work on
these he runs and says ahh, I just remembered I need to go rake the leaves or
something to the effect. Too funny! You know its not him either its me and my
panics over how he will favor in years to come.
His other areas are great. He knows some HTML, web pages, how to sell,
customer service, he is polite to others, loves history, shoots archery and
guns with precision. He loves surfing,xbox,trampoline jumping with Mom (too
funny cuz im out of shape after baby) He likes to build, incubated chicks
last year, cared for someone chickens for a year and is now training our
Brittany.
So my question is, in an Unschooling life how do I help him? Do I do
anything, will it come on its own?
Laura
Maine
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Betsy
**My 11 yr old son sat down yesterday and wrote a letter to a little boy
that
we where giving a bike to. After I read it I felt like a looser Mom.
He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I
help
him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I
went
over it with him I don't even think he herd me?**
I think it's great that he wanted to write a letter. I wouldn't want to
criticize the details of his writing for fear he would decide he never
wanted to write another one.
Betsy
that
we where giving a bike to. After I read it I felt like a looser Mom.
He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I
help
him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I
went
over it with him I don't even think he herd me?**
I think it's great that he wanted to write a letter. I wouldn't want to
criticize the details of his writing for fear he would decide he never
wanted to write another one.
Betsy
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 11:37:04 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
ecsamhill@... writes:
should expose our children to this so they at least have a concept that there
is a standard way of writing that includes things like capital letters,
punctuations and such.
I've been finding myself holding back sharing things with my daughter because
I want to be "true" to unschooling but at the same time torn because if I
don't bring it up or somehow expose her, she has no idea it even exists, let
alone want to incorporate it into her being.
Like unschooling, I didn't even know it existed so how could I possibly have
known I wanted it for my children?
So what to do? Quietly "correct" the letter? Hmmm seems wrong. Point out
the capitalizations and punctuations in a non judgemental way? Probably
wrong too. Send off the letter with the poor grammer and let someone else
wonder what in the world this child could possibly be learning? Probably the
only solution...
I guess we have to give up on those preconcieved notions that we want our
children to appear to be learned and articulate and social and wonderful and
all of that and just let them be.
But then my ever burning question about HOW do they find this if they are not
exposed? Do we ever point out how books have certain punctuations? Do we
just let them one day ask about it and think it's only for books?
Oh Lord, I see the eyes rolling right now... Glena is ASKING QUESTIONS AGAIN!
But hey, I'm leaving for a romantic weekend in the mountains in a few hours
so I won't be asking and following up and trying to LEARN a new unschooling
task this weekend. I will look forward to the responses when I return!
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ecsamhill@... writes:
> My 11 yr old son sat down yesterday and wrote a letter to a little boyI wish I had some advice, but I do know how you feel. Like some how we
> that
> we where giving a bike to. After I read it I felt like a looser Mom.
>
> He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I
> help
> him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I
> went
> over it with him I don't even think he herd me?**
>
should expose our children to this so they at least have a concept that there
is a standard way of writing that includes things like capital letters,
punctuations and such.
I've been finding myself holding back sharing things with my daughter because
I want to be "true" to unschooling but at the same time torn because if I
don't bring it up or somehow expose her, she has no idea it even exists, let
alone want to incorporate it into her being.
Like unschooling, I didn't even know it existed so how could I possibly have
known I wanted it for my children?
So what to do? Quietly "correct" the letter? Hmmm seems wrong. Point out
the capitalizations and punctuations in a non judgemental way? Probably
wrong too. Send off the letter with the poor grammer and let someone else
wonder what in the world this child could possibly be learning? Probably the
only solution...
I guess we have to give up on those preconcieved notions that we want our
children to appear to be learned and articulate and social and wonderful and
all of that and just let them be.
But then my ever burning question about HOW do they find this if they are not
exposed? Do we ever point out how books have certain punctuations? Do we
just let them one day ask about it and think it's only for books?
Oh Lord, I see the eyes rolling right now... Glena is ASKING QUESTIONS AGAIN!
But hey, I'm leaving for a romantic weekend in the mountains in a few hours
so I won't be asking and following up and trying to LEARN a new unschooling
task this weekend. I will look forward to the responses when I return!
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tim and Maureen
----- Original Message -----
From: HMSL2@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 8:14 AM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Basics of writing
<So my question is, in an Unschooling life how do I help him? Do I do
anything, will it come on its own?>
Laura
My experience here is that it will come on its own. My 11 year old likes to write letters to his uncle who is in jail. He has always spelled with the sounds like system. When I i,n our early years at home, would suggest helping etc.. he too would lose interest. I shut up real quick and just explained to his uncle in my own letter that I would interpret later if he needed but that Kieran spelled this way and just read it as it sounds. He got it easily and did not need me to interpret.
I was never criticised and even if I had been I did not care because my son was loving the relationship with his uncle and that could easily have been destroyed by my worrying what others thought of me. Now he has become interested in spelling and will occassionally ask for help.
My older children who are 12 almost 13 and 14 almost 15 still are working on spelling. My almost 15 year old is all of the sudden spelling with great clarity and speed so it will happen.
Maureen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sorcha_aisling
> I've been finding myself holding back sharing things with mydaughter because
> I want to be "true" to unschooling but at the same time tornbecause if I
> don't bring it up or somehow expose her, she has no idea it evenexists, let
> alone want to incorporate it into her being.Glena,
>
I'm really not sure why you think unschooling means holding back and
not sharing things with children. I share everything with my kids.
If they're interested, I'll help them find what they need to learn
more. If they aren't interested, they can wander off and do
whatever. Everytime I sit down with a book, my son comes over to ask
what I'm reading. Most of the time, he wanders away. Occasionally,
he asks me to read it to him. Unschooling doesn't mean that I hide
in the coat closet and read with a flashlight and hope he discovers
books on his own.
Sorcha
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 12:07:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
sorcha-aisling@... writes:
DETAILS maybe is a better word.
We've been reading LOTS Of poetry the last couple of weeks and sharing back
and forth and talking about different authors and different times and what we
liked and what we thought was weird or strange or whatever. Those kinds of
things are fine and are shared always.
BUT things like the punctuations, the grammer things, Cait is pretty good at
writing but it's obvious that she's not real clear on when to capitalize and
when to not. The use of commas and such could be cleared up as well.
So like I said before I would feel like I was being "pushy" if I pointed
these things out yet I wonder how she will ever come to them if no one shows
her? There are other things too but mostly it's in the details.
I guess after the math response I'm a little nervous about introducing her to
ANYTHING she hasn't explicitly asked about. But it does leave me wondering
how she will be exposed to something she might end up loving but she didn't
know about to tell me she was interested.
Seems like a sorta catch 22 situation maybe. Obviously I'm still trying to
find my own path and a good balance that will not have me worrying about the
details of it all.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sorcha-aisling@... writes:
> Glena,It's not so much the basics like books that I would not share, it's the
>
> I'm really not sure why you think unschooling means holding back and
> not sharing things with children. I share everything with my kids.
> If they're interested, I'll help them find what they need to learn
> more. If they aren't interested, they can wander off and do
> whatever. Everytime I sit down with a book, my son comes over to ask
> what I'm reading. Most of the time, he wanders away. Occasionally,
> he asks me to read it to him. Unschooling doesn't mean that I hide
> in the coat closet and read with a flashlight and hope he discovers
> books on his own.
>
>
DETAILS maybe is a better word.
We've been reading LOTS Of poetry the last couple of weeks and sharing back
and forth and talking about different authors and different times and what we
liked and what we thought was weird or strange or whatever. Those kinds of
things are fine and are shared always.
BUT things like the punctuations, the grammer things, Cait is pretty good at
writing but it's obvious that she's not real clear on when to capitalize and
when to not. The use of commas and such could be cleared up as well.
So like I said before I would feel like I was being "pushy" if I pointed
these things out yet I wonder how she will ever come to them if no one shows
her? There are other things too but mostly it's in the details.
I guess after the math response I'm a little nervous about introducing her to
ANYTHING she hasn't explicitly asked about. But it does leave me wondering
how she will be exposed to something she might end up loving but she didn't
know about to tell me she was interested.
Seems like a sorta catch 22 situation maybe. Obviously I'm still trying to
find my own path and a good balance that will not have me worrying about the
details of it all.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tia Leschke
>at
> BUT things like the punctuations, the grammer things, Cait is pretty good
> writing but it's obvious that she's not real clear on when to capitalizeand
> when to not. The use of commas and such could be cleared up as well.Maybe when she's writing something she's planning to "publish" (as in send
it to someone or something) you could talk to her about copy editing.
Magazine and book publishers have someone go over the material to catch
spelling, grammar, and punctuation errors. (Too bad newspapers no longer
do. What a poor example of writing some of them are.) You could ask her if
she'd like some help with copy-editing her work. If she says yes, you could
maybe pick one or two of the most glaring errors and point them out to her,
telling her how it would be done in published writing.
The point is not to interfere with the writing process itself. One of the
most common pieces of writing advice is to separate the editing process from
the actual writing process.
Tia
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...
[email protected]
<< > He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I
Sometimes they say yes, and often no.
I will sometimes point out one or two things, but I've never "corrected" a
whole thing.
In the case you mentioned, I would probably have read it aloud and said
"Let's put periods so they can tell how you mean it to be read." That's one
thing, and not a big deal.
Or I might have said "Do you want to type it up and print it out so we can
use a cute font and put a picture of a bicycle?" (And my kids would probably
say "no" but it's another idea for a way to get a second pass at it, and
maybe show them a spellchecker exists).
There is a vast world between telling them nothing and telling them
everything.
Sandra
> helpI ask my kids "Do you want to make it fancier?"
> him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I
> went
> over it with him I don't even think he herd me?** >>
Sometimes they say yes, and often no.
I will sometimes point out one or two things, but I've never "corrected" a
whole thing.
In the case you mentioned, I would probably have read it aloud and said
"Let's put periods so they can tell how you mean it to be read." That's one
thing, and not a big deal.
Or I might have said "Do you want to type it up and print it out so we can
use a cute font and put a picture of a bicycle?" (And my kids would probably
say "no" but it's another idea for a way to get a second pass at it, and
maybe show them a spellchecker exists).
There is a vast world between telling them nothing and telling them
everything.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/03 11:06:58 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I
help
him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I
went
over it with him I don't even think he herd me? >>
He's 11, it's not a priority.
The above sentence you wrote has several mistakes. Is it hugely important? We
understand what you wrote, I guess it's ok. :)
So maybe "teaching" is the problem all around. Both at home and at school.
Exposing him to a world that is full of opportunities to write is far better
in my opinion.
Unschooling means trusting that when the skill becomes important, the person
will learn it with ease.
Trust him. Trust that it just isn't important right now. When he sees a need
for the skill he WILL figure it out, and you'll be there to help.
Until then, relax about writing, enjoy your child and have fun together.
Really.
Ren
"They dined on mince, and slices of quince, Which they ate with a runcible
spoon;
And hand in hand, on the edge of the sand, they danced by the light of the
moon."
--The Owl and the Pussycat
Edward Lear
[email protected] writes:
<< He had caps in places that they didn't belong, no commas etc.. How do I
help
him with this, he has avoided any "grammar teachings" and this am when I
went
over it with him I don't even think he herd me? >>
He's 11, it's not a priority.
The above sentence you wrote has several mistakes. Is it hugely important? We
understand what you wrote, I guess it's ok. :)
So maybe "teaching" is the problem all around. Both at home and at school.
Exposing him to a world that is full of opportunities to write is far better
in my opinion.
Unschooling means trusting that when the skill becomes important, the person
will learn it with ease.
Trust him. Trust that it just isn't important right now. When he sees a need
for the skill he WILL figure it out, and you'll be there to help.
Until then, relax about writing, enjoy your child and have fun together.
Really.
Ren
"They dined on mince, and slices of quince, Which they ate with a runcible
spoon;
And hand in hand, on the edge of the sand, they danced by the light of the
moon."
--The Owl and the Pussycat
Edward Lear
jmcseals SEALS
***I guess after the math response I'm a little nervous about introducing
her to
ANYTHING she hasn't explicitly asked about. But it does leave me wondering
how she will be exposed to something she might end up loving but she didn't
know about to tell me she was interested.***
Glena,
I don't think it's a catch 22. I think it's hard to grasp if you are
looking at it one-sided. There is nothing wrong with exposing her to new
things...you SHOULD! Key word being *exposing*. Ex: Hey! I just read the
coolest book about reptiles. They were talking about... and then they
showed..." That type of thing. If she's interested, she'll probe for more.
If not, she'll say so, either verbally or physically.
As for the math response you recieved, I think you still aren't
understanding that those responses were because she explicitly expressed a
disinterest in math and you were buying CD's to encourage her to have *fun*
with it, as opposed to it being strictly educational for her. See, had you
bought the math cd BEFORE she expressed a disinterest, THAT would be
exposing her to it. If she wanted to walk away and never touch it and you
were ok with that...THAT would be trusting that your child just isn't ready
right now.
It's offering something after your child has expressed NO desire in that
everyone had a problem with.
I hope this helps!
Jennifer
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
her to
ANYTHING she hasn't explicitly asked about. But it does leave me wondering
how she will be exposed to something she might end up loving but she didn't
know about to tell me she was interested.***
Glena,
I don't think it's a catch 22. I think it's hard to grasp if you are
looking at it one-sided. There is nothing wrong with exposing her to new
things...you SHOULD! Key word being *exposing*. Ex: Hey! I just read the
coolest book about reptiles. They were talking about... and then they
showed..." That type of thing. If she's interested, she'll probe for more.
If not, she'll say so, either verbally or physically.
As for the math response you recieved, I think you still aren't
understanding that those responses were because she explicitly expressed a
disinterest in math and you were buying CD's to encourage her to have *fun*
with it, as opposed to it being strictly educational for her. See, had you
bought the math cd BEFORE she expressed a disinterest, THAT would be
exposing her to it. If she wanted to walk away and never touch it and you
were ok with that...THAT would be trusting that your child just isn't ready
right now.
It's offering something after your child has expressed NO desire in that
everyone had a problem with.
I hope this helps!
Jennifer
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 12:17:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
him how to spell words, and he writes them down. I say "new word" so that he
leaves a space. He knows what periods and commas and question marks and
exclamation marks are---not necessarily when to use them! But he knows what
they look like and what they mean. He uses only upper case letter, so that's
not an issue yet. But the "rule" is fairly simple, so I doubt it'll be hard
to remember. He follows along in the books I read him, so he SEES that they
begin sentences and names---and all caps are yelling/loud.
If he were to write a letter, I'd offer to read it back. If it didn't "sound"
right to HIM (by inflection of my voice), I'd offer solutions---which he may
accept or not. It's HIS letter. I figure that, eventually, he'll want it
close to perfect, so he'll ask; I'll answer; and he'll get better and better.
It's not "sink or swim". It's a process. Baby steps. Most people WANT to be
understood.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
> BUT things like the punctuations, the grammer things, Cait is pretty good atYou don't have to "push". You could "offer". When Duncan writes, I still tell
>
> writing but it's obvious that she's not real clear on when to capitalize
> and
> when to not. The use of commas and such could be cleared up as well.
>
> So like I said before I would feel like I was being "pushy" if I pointed
> these things out yet I wonder how she will ever come to them if no one
> shows
> her? There are other things too but mostly it's in the details.
him how to spell words, and he writes them down. I say "new word" so that he
leaves a space. He knows what periods and commas and question marks and
exclamation marks are---not necessarily when to use them! But he knows what
they look like and what they mean. He uses only upper case letter, so that's
not an issue yet. But the "rule" is fairly simple, so I doubt it'll be hard
to remember. He follows along in the books I read him, so he SEES that they
begin sentences and names---and all caps are yelling/loud.
If he were to write a letter, I'd offer to read it back. If it didn't "sound"
right to HIM (by inflection of my voice), I'd offer solutions---which he may
accept or not. It's HIS letter. I figure that, eventually, he'll want it
close to perfect, so he'll ask; I'll answer; and he'll get better and better.
It's not "sink or swim". It's a process. Baby steps. Most people WANT to be
understood.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Fetteroll
on 4/25/03 12:14 PM, rubyprincesstsg@... at rubyprincesstsg@...
wrote:
thinking you're all the way into unschooling so you're question has two
modes of thinking wrapped up together.
The 2 things you've asked about as concerns are both academic things: math
and writing. And the questions you've asked about those are in the vein of
making sure your kids will learn these things. You're still stuck in the
thinking that these things are artificial. That they don't serve a purpose
in a child's real life so they need to be taught. And the answers you
received were about that academic mode of thinking, e.g., back off.
But you're extrapolating the answer into life -- even though you're *still*
asking about academics -- and seeing only two choices: pushing and not
introducing. Those aren't really the choices at all. Would you see those as
your only choices if we were talking about Egypt or video games or horse
backriding? Would you be concerned about "pushing" Egypt on them? What would
that look like? It would look like you thought there were important things
they needed to know and you didn't trust that life was enough to give it to
them. Would you be concerned about not introducing Egypt to them? Well, you
*should* be! *You* should be stumbling across Egypt (and other stuff) and
pointing out some cool things to them.
Your son *does* see writing with punctuation. It's there all around him.
Unless you are deliberately keeping books from him. How could he not be
exposed to it?
The idea of offering to be his copy editor is good but I wouldn't express it
as a concern but as a useful idea. I've suggested to my daughter that if she
wants *other people* to be able to understand the story she's telling that
standard spelling and punctuation will help them do that. Creative spelling
could make them miss the point she's trying to make.
Don't think of math and writing as any different than Egypt. Point out cool
stuff to your kids. If they think it's interesting or useful then they'll be
interested and ask questions. Make sure your life is such that interesting
things about lots of stuff is running through their lives so they know stuff
exist and they could pick something up and run with it if they wanted to.
Joyce
wrote:
> But it does leave me wonderingIt's like you've got one foot in school and one foot in unschooling while
> how she will be exposed to something she might end up loving but she didn't
> know about to tell me she was interested.
thinking you're all the way into unschooling so you're question has two
modes of thinking wrapped up together.
The 2 things you've asked about as concerns are both academic things: math
and writing. And the questions you've asked about those are in the vein of
making sure your kids will learn these things. You're still stuck in the
thinking that these things are artificial. That they don't serve a purpose
in a child's real life so they need to be taught. And the answers you
received were about that academic mode of thinking, e.g., back off.
But you're extrapolating the answer into life -- even though you're *still*
asking about academics -- and seeing only two choices: pushing and not
introducing. Those aren't really the choices at all. Would you see those as
your only choices if we were talking about Egypt or video games or horse
backriding? Would you be concerned about "pushing" Egypt on them? What would
that look like? It would look like you thought there were important things
they needed to know and you didn't trust that life was enough to give it to
them. Would you be concerned about not introducing Egypt to them? Well, you
*should* be! *You* should be stumbling across Egypt (and other stuff) and
pointing out some cool things to them.
Your son *does* see writing with punctuation. It's there all around him.
Unless you are deliberately keeping books from him. How could he not be
exposed to it?
The idea of offering to be his copy editor is good but I wouldn't express it
as a concern but as a useful idea. I've suggested to my daughter that if she
wants *other people* to be able to understand the story she's telling that
standard spelling and punctuation will help them do that. Creative spelling
could make them miss the point she's trying to make.
Don't think of math and writing as any different than Egypt. Point out cool
stuff to your kids. If they think it's interesting or useful then they'll be
interested and ask questions. Make sure your life is such that interesting
things about lots of stuff is running through their lives so they know stuff
exist and they could pick something up and run with it if they wanted to.
Joyce
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 3:40:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
fetteroll@... writes:
math that I personally think is fun and my child might very well enjoy and I
buy it, lay it around downstairs for her to use or NOT use, that could be
construed as meaning I am being too "pushy" about math, BUT if I find
something very interesting to do, like umm... maybe a new recipe to try out
and I lay it around and by the ingredients and ask her if she'd like to make
it, that might be a GOOD thing?
Or if I'm reading a book about poetry for example, it's very OK to ask her if
she'd like to read it or to lay it around for her to pick up or not and then
to discuss and investigate further with her?
I'm probably just making this way too complicated. I really don't accept any
part of the "schooling" stuff. Everything in life is a learning experience
and I truly believe children should learn about what interests them most but
I recognize there are other things that one must assimilate into one's brain
at some point in order to fit into society. Language, math skills, writing,
reading, are all things that one must obtain at some point I recognize this,
and I also recognize that there is no hurry for any one bit of information,
the child will ask for it when they feel the need/desire for it.
But I guess I'm still a little gun shy from that math incident to freely
bring up ideas out of the blue for fear it could be thought of as being
"pushy" and definitely NOT unschooly.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
fetteroll@... writes:
> But you're extrapolating the answer into life -- even though you're *still*Ok, but I still don't get "it" thoroughly. So if I see a computer game about
> asking about academics -- and seeing only two choices: pushing and not
> introducing. Those aren't really the choices at all. Would you see those as
> your only choices if we were talking about Egypt or video games or horse
> backriding? Would you be concerned about "pushing" Egypt on them? What
> would
> that look like? It would look like you thought there were important things
> they needed to know and you didn't trust that life was enough to give it to
> them. Would you be concerned about not introducing Egypt to them? Well, you
> *should* be! *You* should be stumbling across Egypt (and other stuff) and
> pointing out some cool things to them.
>
math that I personally think is fun and my child might very well enjoy and I
buy it, lay it around downstairs for her to use or NOT use, that could be
construed as meaning I am being too "pushy" about math, BUT if I find
something very interesting to do, like umm... maybe a new recipe to try out
and I lay it around and by the ingredients and ask her if she'd like to make
it, that might be a GOOD thing?
Or if I'm reading a book about poetry for example, it's very OK to ask her if
she'd like to read it or to lay it around for her to pick up or not and then
to discuss and investigate further with her?
I'm probably just making this way too complicated. I really don't accept any
part of the "schooling" stuff. Everything in life is a learning experience
and I truly believe children should learn about what interests them most but
I recognize there are other things that one must assimilate into one's brain
at some point in order to fit into society. Language, math skills, writing,
reading, are all things that one must obtain at some point I recognize this,
and I also recognize that there is no hurry for any one bit of information,
the child will ask for it when they feel the need/desire for it.
But I guess I'm still a little gun shy from that math incident to freely
bring up ideas out of the blue for fear it could be thought of as being
"pushy" and definitely NOT unschooly.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 2:04:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
leschke@... writes:
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
leschke@... writes:
> Maybe when she's writing something she's planning to "publish" (as in sendThanks, that idea sounds great! I'll try it with our poetry book.
> it to someone or something) you could talk to her about copy editing.
> Magazine and book publishers have someone go over the material to catch
> spelling, grammar, and punctuation errors. (Too bad newspapers no longer
> do. What a poor example of writing some of them are.) You could ask her
> if
> she'd like some help with copy-editing her work. If she says yes, you
> could
> maybe pick one or two of the most glaring errors and point them out to her,
> telling her how it would be done in published writing.
>
> The point is not to interfere with the writing process itself. One of the
> most common pieces of writing advice is to separate the editing process
> from
> the actual writing process.
>
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 1:02:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jmcseals@... writes:
disinterest. It was that she had shown NO interest, big difference. She
also hasn't expressed any interest in rebuilding a car engine but hey, who
knows I might get a book about that.
I was worried that I, personally, ME wasn't doing enough to expose her to the
"fun" side of math. That was the big question. I had read a lot of posts
about how some of the children represented on this list LOVE math. I didn't
see Cait seeking out ANY mathy FUN type activities and was worried I was
somehow cheating her by not exposing her to enough, not nurturing that "love
of math".
Wasn't like she had told me at any point she disliked math, didn't want to do
math or had no interest. I had just never seen her attempt any activity that
might involve math at any higher level and of course with the HS principals
comment to me that math is built in layers and that she really should be
exposed to more so it wasn't so difficult for her later echoing in my ears, I
wondered if a computer game laying on a shelf was enough.
It's enough and I got lots of good responses that should me about ways to
incorporate math everyday and to feel assured that she will find her way to
the "advanced" stuff when the time is right and that I am NOT cheating her by
just doing nothing about it.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jmcseals@... writes:
> As for the math response you recieved, I think you still aren'tOk, maybe I wasn't even clear about the math. It wasn't that she expressed a
> understanding that those responses were because she explicitly expressed a
> disinterest in math and you were buying CD's to encourage her to have *fun*
>
> with it, as opposed to it being strictly educational for her. See, had you
>
> bought the math cd BEFORE she expressed a disinterest, THAT would be
> exposing her to it. If she wanted to walk away and never touch it and you
> were ok with that...THAT would be trusting that your child just isn't ready
>
> right now.
>
disinterest. It was that she had shown NO interest, big difference. She
also hasn't expressed any interest in rebuilding a car engine but hey, who
knows I might get a book about that.
I was worried that I, personally, ME wasn't doing enough to expose her to the
"fun" side of math. That was the big question. I had read a lot of posts
about how some of the children represented on this list LOVE math. I didn't
see Cait seeking out ANY mathy FUN type activities and was worried I was
somehow cheating her by not exposing her to enough, not nurturing that "love
of math".
Wasn't like she had told me at any point she disliked math, didn't want to do
math or had no interest. I had just never seen her attempt any activity that
might involve math at any higher level and of course with the HS principals
comment to me that math is built in layers and that she really should be
exposed to more so it wasn't so difficult for her later echoing in my ears, I
wondered if a computer game laying on a shelf was enough.
It's enough and I got lots of good responses that should me about ways to
incorporate math everyday and to feel assured that she will find her way to
the "advanced" stuff when the time is right and that I am NOT cheating her by
just doing nothing about it.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/03 2:30:25 PM, rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
<< But I guess I'm still a little gun shy from that math incident to freely
bring up ideas out of the blue for fear it could be thought of as being
"pushy" and definitely NOT unschooly. >>
It wasn't a math incident.
It was an incident where people reflected to you your apparent attitudes and
expectations, based on the words you had chosen to post, and you got
defensive and made way more noise than everyone else, trying to make our help
go away.
<<Ok, but I still don't get "it" thoroughly. So if I see a computer game
about
math that I personally think is fun and my child might very well enjoy and I
buy it, lay it around downstairs for her to use or NOT use, that could be
construed as meaning I am being too "pushy" about math, BUT>>
You're still telling us (and sarcastically) what you think we said as though
it is what WAS said. It wasn't about the game or where you set the disk. It
was about what you told us about the need for math and what you showed us
about your beliefs concerning all that.
Instead of telling us what we said, or trying to decide what your daughter
needs or thinks, just live a busy, happy, talkative life. If you can't
decide what to do about a recipe or a punctuation problem, think of what you
would say if it were an adult friend of yours instead of "just a child." Try
to respond and react as you would to people
instead of trying to figure out what others thing should be the response to
an unschooled child.
Sandra
<< But I guess I'm still a little gun shy from that math incident to freely
bring up ideas out of the blue for fear it could be thought of as being
"pushy" and definitely NOT unschooly. >>
It wasn't a math incident.
It was an incident where people reflected to you your apparent attitudes and
expectations, based on the words you had chosen to post, and you got
defensive and made way more noise than everyone else, trying to make our help
go away.
<<Ok, but I still don't get "it" thoroughly. So if I see a computer game
about
math that I personally think is fun and my child might very well enjoy and I
buy it, lay it around downstairs for her to use or NOT use, that could be
construed as meaning I am being too "pushy" about math, BUT>>
You're still telling us (and sarcastically) what you think we said as though
it is what WAS said. It wasn't about the game or where you set the disk. It
was about what you told us about the need for math and what you showed us
about your beliefs concerning all that.
Instead of telling us what we said, or trying to decide what your daughter
needs or thinks, just live a busy, happy, talkative life. If you can't
decide what to do about a recipe or a punctuation problem, think of what you
would say if it were an adult friend of yours instead of "just a child." Try
to respond and react as you would to people
instead of trying to figure out what others thing should be the response to
an unschooled child.
Sandra
sorcha_aisling
If I remember correctly, you didn't say Cait had never in her entire
life heard of a thing called algebra. You said she wasn't interested
in it, but since you knew she'd need to learn it to be a doctor, you
were trying to show her how fun it can be. Do you honestly not see
the difference?
(that is, not locked in a basement somewhere) and *didn't* learn to
speak, read, write, and do basic arithmetic. It's like walking and
going to the potty. If you're physically able to do it and you
observe people around you doing it, you will learn it.
But if you have a checklist somewhere in the back of your head
of "what my child needs to know to be educated", do try to forget
about it. I know a ton of things my husband doesn't know, and he
knows a ton of things I don't know, and that's part of life. He
understands physics; I know how to fix things around the house. He
can drive a tractor-trailer. I've read Don Quixote de la Mancha in
Spanish. Which of us is "educated"?
Sorcha
life heard of a thing called algebra. You said she wasn't interested
in it, but since you knew she'd need to learn it to be a doctor, you
were trying to show her how fun it can be. Do you honestly not see
the difference?
>>> I recognize there are other things that one must assimilate intoone's brain
> at some point in order to fit into society. Language, math skills,writing,
> reading, are all things that one must obtain at some point Irecognize this,
> and I also recognize that there is no hurry for any one bit ofinformation,
> the child will ask for it when they feel the need/desire for it.<<<It would be astounding if an able child grew up in a normal situation
(that is, not locked in a basement somewhere) and *didn't* learn to
speak, read, write, and do basic arithmetic. It's like walking and
going to the potty. If you're physically able to do it and you
observe people around you doing it, you will learn it.
But if you have a checklist somewhere in the back of your head
of "what my child needs to know to be educated", do try to forget
about it. I know a ton of things my husband doesn't know, and he
knows a ton of things I don't know, and that's part of life. He
understands physics; I know how to fix things around the house. He
can drive a tractor-trailer. I've read Don Quixote de la Mancha in
Spanish. Which of us is "educated"?
Sorcha
Lisa M. C. Bentley
> So what to do? Quietly "correct" the letter? Hmmm seems wrong. Point outEeks. These all seem wrong to me. There are a thousand or more
> the capitalizations and punctuations in a non judgemental way? Probably
> wrong too. Send off the letter with the poor grammer and let someone else
> wonder what in the world this child could possibly be learning? Probably the
> only solution...
solutions in between the extremes that you are suggesting.
My daughter e-mails friends and family and various website (especially
ZOOM a lot currently). She sends a lot of notes off without me seeing
them. Once in a while I will see something that she wrote and if there
is a glaring misspelling or grammatical error, I usually say something
along the lines of: "The person you are sending that to might think
that you mean "x". Is that what you meant, or did you mean "y"
instead?" I wait for her answer, and she either doesn't care (about 1/3
the time) or she wonders why they would think "x" and I point out that
most people spell goat g-o-a-t instead of g-o-t (this is a very old
example). [Sometimes she even says that while most of the world might
spell something a certain way, her way is better and then she leaves
it.]
I never intrude and force her to change her style, but I or my husband
is ALWAYS available to help her if she wants help (and we stop if she
wants no more help). Sometimes she just gets tired of writing or typing
and she dictates the rest while one of us types (then she corrects our
typos). :) It goes both ways, she sees that whenever I send something
super important off, I almost always put it through a spell check and
have DH read it (or sometimes her recently). I certainly would never
red check mark her work all up, but I will offer suggestions on how to
make things more easily readable to the audience that she wants to read
it.
-Lisa in AZ
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/03 4:30:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
remember correctly but the math, I believe, was because you thought she
needed math to get into college and then into med school and you were worried
that she was not preparing enough for that now. And wanted to know what you
could buy or do to help her become interested in math. The why in that
scenario was the part that was not unschooling and was pushy.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
> OK, but I still don't get "it" thoroughly. So if I see a computer gameTry to think about the why instead of just the what. I am not sure I
> about
> math that I personally think is fun and my child might very well enjoy and
> I
> buy it, lay it around downstairs for her to use or NOT use, that could be
> construed as meaning I am being too "pushy" about math, BUT if I find
> something very interesting to do, like umm... maybe a new recipe to try out
>
> and I lay it around and by the ingredients and ask her if she'd like to
> make
> it, that might be a GOOD thing?
>
>
remember correctly but the math, I believe, was because you thought she
needed math to get into college and then into med school and you were worried
that she was not preparing enough for that now. And wanted to know what you
could buy or do to help her become interested in math. The why in that
scenario was the part that was not unschooling and was pushy.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Robin Clevenger
----- Original Message -----
From: <[email protected]>
> BUT things like the punctuations, the grammer things, Cait is pretty good
at
> writing but it's obvious that she's not real clear on when to capitalize
and
> when to not. The use of commas and such could be cleared up as well.
A lot of that kind of thing comes with just reading a bunch of different
stuff and after awhile the things that are wrong stand out more to your
eye.. But some of it is just memorization of rules (most of them terribly
inconsistent). Even people who make writing their *career* have professional
editors to fix bad punctuation and grammar and spell checkers to fix the
spelling. And in any given message on this list, you can find scads of
grammar, spelling, and punctuation errors (probably including this sentence,
I don't think you're supposed to start with "And"). When my writing counts,
I use the spell checker and even pull out Strunk for grammar.
Blue Skies!
-Robin-
Robin Clevenger
> The point is not to interfere with the writing process itself. One of theThis is really true and valid for me personally. If I stop to edit while I'm
> most common pieces of writing advice is to separate the editing process
> from
> the actual writing process.
writing, I totally lose my flow and the story comes to a screeching halt.
One of the things I learned in reading a whole bunch of books on writing is
that most authors have (what they consider) terrible first drafts. Even
famous authors like Hemingway (who I think originated the quote "The first
draft is always sh*t") often revised their text as many as 20 or 30 times.
I'm on about the 8th draft of my novel right now and hoping this one is the
last! One thing that really helped my son is that he sat with me as I read
aloud and edited my own chapters. He loved hearing me read my writing out
loud, but even more importantly it freed him to just start writing his own
stuff without worry so much about it being perfect (he tends to be a
perfectionist). He would ask me why I was crossing out and changing so many
things, and I explained about the revision process. After doing that with
me, his own writing just took off.
Any new thing looks really, really hard when you first start out. And if you
see people who are already doing it well, it can seem like it just came
easily to them. I think it's really helpful for kids to see adults learning
new things, struggling, making mistakes, starting over, failing, falling
down and getting back up. It lets them know that things don't come easily
for either, even though we are big and may seem more competent at
everything.
Blue Skies!
-Robin-
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 4:30:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rubyprincesstsg@... writes:
> Everything in life is a learning experienceWhy? To get the jokes? <g>
> and I truly believe children should learn about what interests them most
> but
> I recognize there are other things that one must assimilate into one's
> brain
> at some point in order to fit into society. Language, math skills,
> writing,
> reading, are all things that one must obtain at some point I recognize
> this,
> and I also recognize that there is no hurry for any one bit of information,
>
> the child will ask for it when they feel the need/desire for it.
>
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/03 9:17:08 PM, kbcdlovejo@... writes:
<< Why? To get the jokes? <g> >>
Some people will never get the jokes anyway.
It's a bonus for those whose brains are trivia-filing wonders.
I just bought (to keep) Eddie Izzard, "Dress to Kill," on DVD.
It's vurru' nice.
Sandra
<< Why? To get the jokes? <g> >>
Some people will never get the jokes anyway.
It's a bonus for those whose brains are trivia-filing wonders.
I just bought (to keep) Eddie Izzard, "Dress to Kill," on DVD.
It's vurru' nice.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 8:47:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
diamondair@... writes:
didn't HE hire an editor? Blech! Last draft was also shit!
~Kelly, NOT a Hemingway fan!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
diamondair@... writes:
> EvenYeah---and his "finished works" (hah!) are FULL of grammatical errors. Why
> famous authors like Hemingway (who I think originated the quote "The first
> draft is always sh*t") often revised their text as many as 20 or 30 times.
>
didn't HE hire an editor? Blech! Last draft was also shit!
~Kelly, NOT a Hemingway fan!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sorcha_aisling
>>> ~Kelly, NOT a Hemingway fan!<<<I thought I was the only one! I used to read a lot of books about
writing, and many of them would mention Hemingway as though he was a
god of the written word. The way he wrote his female characters
always had me wondering if he'd led some bizarre life in which he
hadn't actually met any women.
Sorcha
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/26/2003 7:32:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
sorcha-aisling@... writes:
And bad writer! <G> What a waste of my time!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sorcha-aisling@... writes:
> thought I was the only one! I used to read a lot of books aboutWell-known misogynist.
> writing, and many of them would mention Hemingway as though he was a
> god of the written word. The way he wrote his female characters
> always had me wondering if he'd led some bizarre life in which he
> hadn't actually met any women.
And bad writer! <G> What a waste of my time!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 4:58:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
different from adults in my life. However, I AM responsible for these
wonderful creatures that have been intrusted to my care, I'm not at all
responsible if an adult in my neighborhood does something that turns out
drastically because I did or didn't do something.
There is WAY more at stake with my precious child than with any other adult I
will ever encounter in my life. I HAVE to get it right. Therefore, I will
probably always worry that I am doing it right and being all I can be and
encouraging and guiding and being the mother that my children deserve.
It wasn't all that you described at all, maybe you are making it way more
involved than it is... it was the simple question in life, "am I doing
enough" for my child. That particular day it was about math. I wanted her
to have the LOVE of math that others children had. I didn't want her to NOT
know that joy, I just didn't know how to find it, nurture it, show her that
joy, I don't have it in MY life, but was willing to find new ways if others
were offered. Others were offered I explored them, it's great.
I was NOT being sarcastic in the post I made at all. I don't understand
where YOU get so defensive about MY posts. They are not meant as anything
other than the words you read there. I don't have the cunning wit for
sarcasm nor the personality for it. I'm straight forward and I use the words
that mean exactly what I say.
I do question something backwards and forwards and I want to know exactly how
this should work or the outcome of "that" particular thing. That is just my
learning style, my nature, my being. It is not meant to make anyone question
their own lives, values or anything else, it is NOT meant as sarcasm. In
fact I really don't know exactly what you were referring to as being
sarcastic, that's how far off you are with that post.
Seems you are trying edge towards a discussion of the value of my posts yet
again. I'm not going to debate that issue with you. It's a discussion
group, we post, we ask questions, we answer, we discuss. I do too.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> Instead of telling us what we said, or trying to decide what your daughterI do that already, my children are human beings, I do not treat them
> needs or thinks, just live a busy, happy, talkative life. If you can't
> decide what to do about a recipe or a punctuation problem, think of what
> you
> would say if it were an adult friend of yours instead of "just a child."
> Try
> to respond and react as you would to people
> instead of trying to figure out what others thing should be the response to
>
> an unschooled child.
>
different from adults in my life. However, I AM responsible for these
wonderful creatures that have been intrusted to my care, I'm not at all
responsible if an adult in my neighborhood does something that turns out
drastically because I did or didn't do something.
There is WAY more at stake with my precious child than with any other adult I
will ever encounter in my life. I HAVE to get it right. Therefore, I will
probably always worry that I am doing it right and being all I can be and
encouraging and guiding and being the mother that my children deserve.
It wasn't all that you described at all, maybe you are making it way more
involved than it is... it was the simple question in life, "am I doing
enough" for my child. That particular day it was about math. I wanted her
to have the LOVE of math that others children had. I didn't want her to NOT
know that joy, I just didn't know how to find it, nurture it, show her that
joy, I don't have it in MY life, but was willing to find new ways if others
were offered. Others were offered I explored them, it's great.
I was NOT being sarcastic in the post I made at all. I don't understand
where YOU get so defensive about MY posts. They are not meant as anything
other than the words you read there. I don't have the cunning wit for
sarcasm nor the personality for it. I'm straight forward and I use the words
that mean exactly what I say.
I do question something backwards and forwards and I want to know exactly how
this should work or the outcome of "that" particular thing. That is just my
learning style, my nature, my being. It is not meant to make anyone question
their own lives, values or anything else, it is NOT meant as sarcasm. In
fact I really don't know exactly what you were referring to as being
sarcastic, that's how far off you are with that post.
Seems you are trying edge towards a discussion of the value of my posts yet
again. I'm not going to debate that issue with you. It's a discussion
group, we post, we ask questions, we answer, we discuss. I do too.
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/25/2003 5:05:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
sorcha-aisling@... writes:
or in any way that I'm aware of. She's not locked in a basement but we don't
have school books lying around and maybe I should.
I'm not sure. I know modeling is a big thing. I also know that I don't sit
around and enjoyably do anything closely resembling algebra or even close to
it. So my concern was where did your children develop this love of math.
What activity did they see you modeling that provoked their minds to want to
know more.
I recognize that some people are just more naturally inclined towards math or
whatever but at some point they had to be given the words for this
inclination. How they were introduced, what forms did it take?
As for "my" obsession with her learning math. Yep, that week it was a big
deal to me, I just had a trusted friend, who the principal of the local high
school tell me what a disservice I was doing for Cait by not exposing her to
math right now. That it was a layers thing and had to built on layer by
layer and not all learned at once. I panicked, it happens. I KNEW I surely
wasn't exposing her to ANY math. Of course she WOULD need it at some point.
So I asked the "experts" that I knew who've been on this journey longer than
I. I got lots of answers and it helped. The best ones were the ones that
told me there was plenty of time for math. That it CAN be learned at once,
when one is ready. That I am NOT being an irresponsible mother because my
child has not professed an undying love of math at age 14.
I don't worry about it anymore in the math context. I do question everything
I do almost to make sure that I am not "offering" something she is not
interested in and questioning that I am "offering" enough to pique her
interests in all things, enough to expose her to something brand new that she
might just fall in love with, but not offer it in a way that would make her
feel it was MY choice and not hers.
We only get one shot at being the very best parent we can be for each child.
I want to know I got it right by doing the very best that I knew how at the
time I was parenting my child.
I guess if I really didn't care it would be a lot easier, send her to school
and let them figure it out, but I do care and now I KNOW better, so there is
no excuse other than for me to do this the right way, the best that I can do
for her.
I think it is a balancing act for sure... at least early on... to me
anyway...
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sorcha-aisling@... writes:
> If I remember correctly, you didn't say Cait had never in her entireI'm sure she's heard the term but she's never been introduced to it formally
> life heard of a thing called algebra. You said she wasn't interested
> in it, but since you knew she'd need to learn it to be a doctor, you
> were trying to show her how fun it can be. Do you honestly not see
> the difference?
>
or in any way that I'm aware of. She's not locked in a basement but we don't
have school books lying around and maybe I should.
I'm not sure. I know modeling is a big thing. I also know that I don't sit
around and enjoyably do anything closely resembling algebra or even close to
it. So my concern was where did your children develop this love of math.
What activity did they see you modeling that provoked their minds to want to
know more.
I recognize that some people are just more naturally inclined towards math or
whatever but at some point they had to be given the words for this
inclination. How they were introduced, what forms did it take?
As for "my" obsession with her learning math. Yep, that week it was a big
deal to me, I just had a trusted friend, who the principal of the local high
school tell me what a disservice I was doing for Cait by not exposing her to
math right now. That it was a layers thing and had to built on layer by
layer and not all learned at once. I panicked, it happens. I KNEW I surely
wasn't exposing her to ANY math. Of course she WOULD need it at some point.
So I asked the "experts" that I knew who've been on this journey longer than
I. I got lots of answers and it helped. The best ones were the ones that
told me there was plenty of time for math. That it CAN be learned at once,
when one is ready. That I am NOT being an irresponsible mother because my
child has not professed an undying love of math at age 14.
I don't worry about it anymore in the math context. I do question everything
I do almost to make sure that I am not "offering" something she is not
interested in and questioning that I am "offering" enough to pique her
interests in all things, enough to expose her to something brand new that she
might just fall in love with, but not offer it in a way that would make her
feel it was MY choice and not hers.
We only get one shot at being the very best parent we can be for each child.
I want to know I got it right by doing the very best that I knew how at the
time I was parenting my child.
I guess if I really didn't care it would be a lot easier, send her to school
and let them figure it out, but I do care and now I KNOW better, so there is
no excuse other than for me to do this the right way, the best that I can do
for her.
I think it is a balancing act for sure... at least early on... to me
anyway...
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Heidi
Hi glena
I'm not sure. I know modeling is a big thing. I also know that I
don't sit
around and enjoyably do anything closely resembling algebra or even
close to
it. So my concern was where did your children develop this love of
math.
What activity did they see you modeling that provoked their minds to
want to
know more.
If I may just jump in here. Your comments and concerns sound a lot
like mine. In feeling it out, this unschooling method, I've done some
reading in the past few months, and spent some time at a website
where the Sudbury school is explored.
I first read about Sudbury via John Gatto's writings, and found them
through a google search. On that page is a Discuss Sudbury Model
email list, not very active on a daily basis, but lots and lots of
good stuff about the unschooling idea. There's also a link somewhere
in there under free texts, where an alumnus of Sudbury tells of his
experience at the school. Mind you, this is a place where there is
ZERO formal instruction. Kids are free to spend their time just
exactly as they see fit: a lake on the property, helping adults
refurbish a barn or cook lunch, or doing those independent of adult
interaction, playing video games all day. Nothing is "taught" there
as a subject.
Well, the article that I'm thinking of describes how a boy got
interested in Algebra. this is the link to those alumni articles
http://www.sudval.org/texts/kingdom.html
It is the first article, number 11, and I found it fascinating and
hope engendering: the kid got an interest in nuclear science by some
reading, and found he couldn't understand most of what he read,
because he didn't know algebra. And so...he taught it to himself.
I highly recommend reading the stuff at the Sudbury page. Articles by
the students, by the teachers. They have a lengthy track record of
turning out literate, numerate, confident individuals, without any
external pressure of any sort. Kids just doing what they want to do
with their time, every day of the school year.
peace, HeidiC
I'm not sure. I know modeling is a big thing. I also know that I
don't sit
around and enjoyably do anything closely resembling algebra or even
close to
it. So my concern was where did your children develop this love of
math.
What activity did they see you modeling that provoked their minds to
want to
know more.
If I may just jump in here. Your comments and concerns sound a lot
like mine. In feeling it out, this unschooling method, I've done some
reading in the past few months, and spent some time at a website
where the Sudbury school is explored.
I first read about Sudbury via John Gatto's writings, and found them
through a google search. On that page is a Discuss Sudbury Model
email list, not very active on a daily basis, but lots and lots of
good stuff about the unschooling idea. There's also a link somewhere
in there under free texts, where an alumnus of Sudbury tells of his
experience at the school. Mind you, this is a place where there is
ZERO formal instruction. Kids are free to spend their time just
exactly as they see fit: a lake on the property, helping adults
refurbish a barn or cook lunch, or doing those independent of adult
interaction, playing video games all day. Nothing is "taught" there
as a subject.
Well, the article that I'm thinking of describes how a boy got
interested in Algebra. this is the link to those alumni articles
http://www.sudval.org/texts/kingdom.html
It is the first article, number 11, and I found it fascinating and
hope engendering: the kid got an interest in nuclear science by some
reading, and found he couldn't understand most of what he read,
because he didn't know algebra. And so...he taught it to himself.
I highly recommend reading the stuff at the Sudbury page. Articles by
the students, by the teachers. They have a lengthy track record of
turning out literate, numerate, confident individuals, without any
external pressure of any sort. Kids just doing what they want to do
with their time, every day of the school year.
peace, HeidiC
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/28/2003 11:19:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
bunsofaluminum60@... writes:
THANK YOU, that is EXACTLY what I was asking/hoping/looking for. I do NOT
intend for my questions to be confrontational but I DO want to find every bit
of information I can to be the very best that I can be for my children.
THANK YOU that is VERY helpful!!!
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
bunsofaluminum60@... writes:
> Well, the article that I'm thinking of describes how a boy gotHeidi,
> interested in Algebra. this is the link to those alumni articles
> http://www.sudval.org/texts/kingdom.html
>
> It is the first article, number 11, and I found it fascinating and
> hope engendering: the kid got an interest in nuclear science by some
> reading, and found he couldn't understand most of what he read,
> because he didn't know algebra. And so...he taught it to himself.
>
>
THANK YOU, that is EXACTLY what I was asking/hoping/looking for. I do NOT
intend for my questions to be confrontational but I DO want to find every bit
of information I can to be the very best that I can be for my children.
THANK YOU that is VERY helpful!!!
glena
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]