NO
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/11/03 11:11:18 PM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< Is there ever a time that you're firm with your kids and say, "NO!
You will NOT keep hurting your sister, and then physically remove the
child from the situation? >>
Yes, definitely.
I will not permit anyone in MY house to hurt another person. If anyone,
adults included, are trying to run roughshod over anyone, I will end it right
now.
I think by saying yes most of the time, my NO's are more meaningful.
Hurting another person is only acceptable as self defense.
If a child was trying to continue to hurt the victimized child, even while I
was holding them, there would be a swift and immediete response of them being
immobilized.
I would be firm about not hurting the other person, hold them until they were
calm and probably remove them from the room while holding them.
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected] writes:
<< Is there ever a time that you're firm with your kids and say, "NO!
You will NOT keep hurting your sister, and then physically remove the
child from the situation? >>
Yes, definitely.
I will not permit anyone in MY house to hurt another person. If anyone,
adults included, are trying to run roughshod over anyone, I will end it right
now.
I think by saying yes most of the time, my NO's are more meaningful.
Hurting another person is only acceptable as self defense.
If a child was trying to continue to hurt the victimized child, even while I
was holding them, there would be a swift and immediete response of them being
immobilized.
I would be firm about not hurting the other person, hold them until they were
calm and probably remove them from the room while holding them.
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/12/03 1:29:42 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< John Rosemond whose
I can usually sense when one child is starting to feel irritable...usually
Sierra starts to melt down and I can feed her or cuddle or something to
prevent the build up between her an Jared.
Trevor has a bad habit of calling names when he gets frustrated. Usually
while gaming.
I am very, very firm about telling him it is NOT ok to add the "dummy" to an
explanation and I remind Jared that it is not ok to let people talk like that
to you.
If it continues I will have Trevor come out of the room with me (the boys
don't escalate into hitting anymore) to talk.
I know in my heart that a lot of his anger problems come from the way I
parented him before unschooling came into our lives.
I remind myself of that and how very far he's come in a short time.
He's really helpful and sweet most of the time. But his temper is par for the
course with the crap he had to deal with when he was younger.
Poor guy. I only have hitting problems come along with Sierra. I think she
feels helpless to solve issues any other way when she gets overwhelmed.
So it's my job to head it off at the pass! :)
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected] writes:
<< John Rosemond whose
> advice shouldn't be listened to does have one really good bit - heto
> says: "Strike while the iron is cold." This means that responding
> problems after-the-fact is tough - but if you plan ahead, don'twait
> until the "iron is hot" - the things you do when there are noproblems
> can help prevent problems from occurring. >>I think this is really, really important advice.
I can usually sense when one child is starting to feel irritable...usually
Sierra starts to melt down and I can feed her or cuddle or something to
prevent the build up between her an Jared.
Trevor has a bad habit of calling names when he gets frustrated. Usually
while gaming.
I am very, very firm about telling him it is NOT ok to add the "dummy" to an
explanation and I remind Jared that it is not ok to let people talk like that
to you.
If it continues I will have Trevor come out of the room with me (the boys
don't escalate into hitting anymore) to talk.
I know in my heart that a lot of his anger problems come from the way I
parented him before unschooling came into our lives.
I remind myself of that and how very far he's come in a short time.
He's really helpful and sweet most of the time. But his temper is par for the
course with the crap he had to deal with when he was younger.
Poor guy. I only have hitting problems come along with Sierra. I think she
feels helpless to solve issues any other way when she gets overwhelmed.
So it's my job to head it off at the pass! :)
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/12/03 9:07:53 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:
<< If a child was trying to continue to hurt the victimized child, even while
I
was holding them, there would be a swift and immediete response of them being
immobilized. >>
Something you learned reading Harry Potter, huh? <g>
Once a couple of years ago I was really furious with Kirby for a second (all
it takes) about something hateful he said to me (very rare, and I can't
remember what led up to it) and I tried to hit him. He blocked it quickly
and quietly without hurting either of us, just stuck his arm up.
I thought "Hmmm.... that karate has really done him some good! Worth the
money!"
So I can still say I haven't hit Kirby since he was really little, but not
because I didn't try, because he's trained to defend himself.
And he can take people down, but hasn't.
Very interestingly, I asked him one day if he ever sizes up a place when he
enters to see who he could take, if things got crazy. I asked him because a
couple of adult male friends had talked to me about that, and I'd asked
Keith, who said, "Sure, always."
Kirby said no.
But within one week, he had two incidents, a party and a guy on the sidewalk
outside the store where he works. Both times, he said he became clearly
aware of where people were, and what would be more efficient use of physical
force, but he only used words.
Very cool. Knowing that he COULD handle the situation physically made him
calm enough to be able to think of what to say to diffuse the situation.
So if I need someone big immobilized, I hope Kirby's there to help.
Sandra
<< If a child was trying to continue to hurt the victimized child, even while
I
was holding them, there would be a swift and immediete response of them being
immobilized. >>
Something you learned reading Harry Potter, huh? <g>
Once a couple of years ago I was really furious with Kirby for a second (all
it takes) about something hateful he said to me (very rare, and I can't
remember what led up to it) and I tried to hit him. He blocked it quickly
and quietly without hurting either of us, just stuck his arm up.
I thought "Hmmm.... that karate has really done him some good! Worth the
money!"
So I can still say I haven't hit Kirby since he was really little, but not
because I didn't try, because he's trained to defend himself.
And he can take people down, but hasn't.
Very interestingly, I asked him one day if he ever sizes up a place when he
enters to see who he could take, if things got crazy. I asked him because a
couple of adult male friends had talked to me about that, and I'd asked
Keith, who said, "Sure, always."
Kirby said no.
But within one week, he had two incidents, a party and a guy on the sidewalk
outside the store where he works. Both times, he said he became clearly
aware of where people were, and what would be more efficient use of physical
force, but he only used words.
Very cool. Knowing that he COULD handle the situation physically made him
calm enough to be able to think of what to say to diffuse the situation.
So if I need someone big immobilized, I hope Kirby's there to help.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/12/03 9:18:26 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:
<< I am very, very firm about telling him it is NOT ok to add the "dummy" to
an
explanation and I remind Jared that it is not ok to let people talk like that
to you. >>
Marty's our offender in that area. Sometimes he'll say what's fine to say,
and then end with "You retard." Gaming, with guys. Twice I've talked to
him when things are still and nobody else is there. And he does it less.
What I told him was those things stick and build up. He said, "Yeah, like
things Kirby has said to me."
"Exactly, so if you know it hurts, don't do it."
That makes sense to him, but in the excitement of four or five teenage boys
at top speed, he still sometimes will let slip a gratuitous insult.
I don't think Marty has ever met anyone who was truly retarded, and if he had
he probably wouldn't use the word.
He was using "gay" in that tacky way to mean "lame" and I objected one day
reminding him he had gay friends. He wasn't connecting the two. He was just
following his tacky friend, and he does have one friend who's the epitomy of
tack (not tact).
Sandra
<< I am very, very firm about telling him it is NOT ok to add the "dummy" to
an
explanation and I remind Jared that it is not ok to let people talk like that
to you. >>
Marty's our offender in that area. Sometimes he'll say what's fine to say,
and then end with "You retard." Gaming, with guys. Twice I've talked to
him when things are still and nobody else is there. And he does it less.
What I told him was those things stick and build up. He said, "Yeah, like
things Kirby has said to me."
"Exactly, so if you know it hurts, don't do it."
That makes sense to him, but in the excitement of four or five teenage boys
at top speed, he still sometimes will let slip a gratuitous insult.
I don't think Marty has ever met anyone who was truly retarded, and if he had
he probably wouldn't use the word.
He was using "gay" in that tacky way to mean "lame" and I objected one day
reminding him he had gay friends. He wasn't connecting the two. He was just
following his tacky friend, and he does have one friend who's the epitomy of
tack (not tact).
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/12/03 10:28:57 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
<<
So if I need someone big immobilized, I hope Kirby's there to help.
That quiet confidence that a person trained in self defense possesses is
something to be admired. That is really great.
I for one, would just like to have a magic wand. It would evaporate rude
drivers, lock the jaws of petty people and make my mean neighbors grow warts
all over their faces.
THEN, I could do some nice things. Like instant tea parties, see through eye
lids (ala Holly), give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
have a button to rewind time) and such.
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected] writes:
<<
So if I need someone big immobilized, I hope Kirby's there to help.
>>Or Harry Potter :)
That quiet confidence that a person trained in self defense possesses is
something to be admired. That is really great.
I for one, would just like to have a magic wand. It would evaporate rude
drivers, lock the jaws of petty people and make my mean neighbors grow warts
all over their faces.
THEN, I could do some nice things. Like instant tea parties, see through eye
lids (ala Holly), give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
have a button to rewind time) and such.
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/12/03 10:28:57 AM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< Marty's our offender in that area. Sometimes he'll say what's fine to
say,
and then end with "You retard." Gaming, with guys. Twice I've talked to
him when things are still and nobody else is there. And he does it less. >>
ARGH!! This is my biggest pet peeve right now.
He says important information and often times ends it with "dummy", "stupid"
or "ding dong". I have been pointing out the problem by saying "you didn't
have to add that last part"
It's getting better, but it really bugs me.
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected] writes:
<< Marty's our offender in that area. Sometimes he'll say what's fine to
say,
and then end with "You retard." Gaming, with guys. Twice I've talked to
him when things are still and nobody else is there. And he does it less. >>
ARGH!! This is my biggest pet peeve right now.
He says important information and often times ends it with "dummy", "stupid"
or "ding dong". I have been pointing out the problem by saying "you didn't
have to add that last part"
It's getting better, but it really bugs me.
Ren
"The sun is shining--the sun is shining. That is the magic. The flowers are
growing--the roots are stirring. That is the magic. Being alive is the
magic--being strong is the magic The magic is in me--the magic is in
me....It's in every one of us."
----Frances Hodgson Burnett
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/12/03 9:58:54 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:
<< Like instant tea parties, see through eye
lids (ala Holly), give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
have a button to rewind time) and such. >>
Holly told me more about her magic-wish eyelids. They don't look invisible
from the outside. And they're shaded. They're one-way sunglasses (sez I,
interpretting).
Sandra
<< Like instant tea parties, see through eye
lids (ala Holly), give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
have a button to rewind time) and such. >>
Holly told me more about her magic-wish eyelids. They don't look invisible
from the outside. And they're shaded. They're one-way sunglasses (sez I,
interpretting).
Sandra
Bronwen
A while ago, um seven years ago (kids 15, 10 now), I decided that me haveing
limits on what I "would allow" when they were dealing with eachother was not
consistant with my idea that I was to trust them. I think mostly, our
experiences showed me that what I was doing (the kind of positive parenting
things lately posted on the list) wasnt working, things would keep
happening- there was a "tremor in the force" - that is something I say when
I have this uncozy feeling that something is not right). I decided that if
I could trust them with their life, then I could definately trust them in
their own relationships, with the people that they love.
SO, I stopped. I stopped interfering when they where headed for a big (yes,
physical- which was my "limit") fight.
Their relationship changed. They stopped hurting eachother when they got
mad. They were FREE. They were free to get in a huge fight with out
looking over to me- or doing something they *would NOT* regret because I
forced them to stop. They experienced what it was like to hurt each other
(mentally and physically)- and they didn't like it. They were *totally
free* to have a real relationship. I got my face out of their business.
I was taking their responsibility away when I interfered.
Let me qualify this (to try to temper the list blows) by saying my kids had
always owned their relationship (because I didn't interfere *except* when it
reached my limit), and didn't fight too much anyway, this was a logical
step. Also, there was no other reasons for hurting eachother like um...like
they felt powerless because of something I did- and then went to try to gain
power back by hurting someone else.
Love,
Bronwen
limits on what I "would allow" when they were dealing with eachother was not
consistant with my idea that I was to trust them. I think mostly, our
experiences showed me that what I was doing (the kind of positive parenting
things lately posted on the list) wasnt working, things would keep
happening- there was a "tremor in the force" - that is something I say when
I have this uncozy feeling that something is not right). I decided that if
I could trust them with their life, then I could definately trust them in
their own relationships, with the people that they love.
SO, I stopped. I stopped interfering when they where headed for a big (yes,
physical- which was my "limit") fight.
Their relationship changed. They stopped hurting eachother when they got
mad. They were FREE. They were free to get in a huge fight with out
looking over to me- or doing something they *would NOT* regret because I
forced them to stop. They experienced what it was like to hurt each other
(mentally and physically)- and they didn't like it. They were *totally
free* to have a real relationship. I got my face out of their business.
I was taking their responsibility away when I interfered.
Let me qualify this (to try to temper the list blows) by saying my kids had
always owned their relationship (because I didn't interfere *except* when it
reached my limit), and didn't fight too much anyway, this was a logical
step. Also, there was no other reasons for hurting eachother like um...like
they felt powerless because of something I did- and then went to try to gain
power back by hurting someone else.
Love,
Bronwen
coyote's corner
Holly is very cool!!!
Janis
Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: SandraDodd@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2003 12:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] NO
In a message dated 4/12/03 9:58:54 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:
<< Like instant tea parties, see through eye
lids (ala Holly), give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
have a button to rewind time) and such. >>
Holly told me more about her magic-wish eyelids. They don't look invisible
from the outside. And they're shaded. They're one-way sunglasses (sez I,
interpretting).
Sandra
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bill and Diane
Sometimes I think if I hear "STOOPID!" one more time I'm going to
scream! I've tried to remind myself not to overreact, but I really
don't know what to do. I tell myself if I ignore it it'll go away, which
I think is true, but it gets a rise out of me (nearly) every time!
:-) Diane
//
scream! I've tried to remind myself not to overreact, but I really
don't know what to do. I tell myself if I ignore it it'll go away, which
I think is true, but it gets a rise out of me (nearly) every time!
:-) Diane
//
><< Marty's our offender in that area. Sometimes he'll say what's fine to
>say,
> and then end with "You retard." Gaming, with guys. Twice I've talked to
> him when things are still and nobody else is there. And he does it less. >>
>
nellebelle
Jackie once said, "you can't rewind life."
Mary Ellen
----- snip----- give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
Mary Ellen
----- snip----- give Trevor his instant time rewinder (he would like to
> have a button to rewind time)
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/13/03 11:26:24 AM, nellebelle@... writes:
<< Jackie once said, "you can't rewind life." >>
When Kirby was five or barely six, we had a discussion about people living
together who aren't married, because friends were getting married he thought
already WERE married. I was telling him I had lived with his dad several
years before we married, and the difference is if you're not married you can
just decide you don't want to live together anymore and say bye!
Wonder and fear were in his face as he said "You would re-set 'marry Daddy'?!"
He was thinking like a computer-age kid already. <g>
He didn't have the terminology to talk about complex social relations, but he
sure understood some programming already.
Sandra
<< Jackie once said, "you can't rewind life." >>
When Kirby was five or barely six, we had a discussion about people living
together who aren't married, because friends were getting married he thought
already WERE married. I was telling him I had lived with his dad several
years before we married, and the difference is if you're not married you can
just decide you don't want to live together anymore and say bye!
Wonder and fear were in his face as he said "You would re-set 'marry Daddy'?!"
He was thinking like a computer-age kid already. <g>
He didn't have the terminology to talk about complex social relations, but he
sure understood some programming already.
Sandra
Stephanie Elms
> Wonder and fear were in his face as he said "You would re-setI always chuckle when Jason (6 yo) will yell "pause game" when we are playing
> 'marry Daddy'?!"
tag or soccer or something instead of using "time out".
Stephanie E.
Shyrley
Stephanie Elms wrote:
Shyrley
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > Wonder and fear were in his face as he said "You would re-setMy kids say the saeme. They also use computer and TV terminology for books. I've often heard them say 'just fast-forward to the end of the book and see who the baddie is'.
> > 'marry Daddy'?!"
>
> I always chuckle when Jason (6 yo) will yell "pause game" when we are playing
> tag or soccer or something instead of using "time out".
>
> Stephanie E.
>
Shyrley
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/14/03 9:12:48 AM, shyrley.williams@... writes:
<< My kids say the saeme. They also use computer and TV terminology for
books. I've often heard them say 'just fast-forward to the end of the book
and see who the baddie is'. >>
Someone who used to be on AOL (anyone remember who?) said her littlest boy
left the dinner table one night to follow the older kids away to play, and
came back in a bit, stood where he had been sitting before, and burst into
tears. They couldn't get out of him why he was crying until he took enough
of a breath to say "You deleted my dinner!!"
Poor guy. They thought he was done, but he was just going to check out what
his options were. <g>
Sandra
<< My kids say the saeme. They also use computer and TV terminology for
books. I've often heard them say 'just fast-forward to the end of the book
and see who the baddie is'. >>
Someone who used to be on AOL (anyone remember who?) said her littlest boy
left the dinner table one night to follow the older kids away to play, and
came back in a bit, stood where he had been sitting before, and burst into
tears. They couldn't get out of him why he was crying until he took enough
of a breath to say "You deleted my dinner!!"
Poor guy. They thought he was done, but he was just going to check out what
his options were. <g>
Sandra