Intro & Career moms
Winifred Haun + Dancers
I've never introduced myself, but I've posted a few times. I really,
really enjoy this list. My name is Wini and I have one four year old
daughter. I'm 40 years old and before I had my daughter, I was a very
successful dancer, choreographer and artistic director of my own dance
company. We live right in the city of Chicago. My husband is a
theoretical physicist at Fermi National Accelerator Lab, which is 40 miles
west of Chicago (yes, he has an awful commute every day, but he doesn't
like suburban life). Our daughter doesn't attend pre-school, which in a
weird way, I guess, qualifies us as homeschoolers already.
I've loved the idea of homeschooling and unschooling, in particular, since
the day I first heard about the possibility, when my daughter was 9 months
old. (I was teaching a ballet class with my baby in arms, and one of my
students, a professor of education at the University of Chicago, mentioned
that my husband and I fit the standard profile of homeschooling parents --
artist and scientist, home birth, breastfeeding, I guess we had it all!)
Anyway, I know there must others like us on this list, and I was wondering
how the moms on this list balance their needs to work and find fulfillment
outside the family (mine is to make dances) with the need to homeschool
and be with their children? I'd love to hear stories of how other mothers
made the adjustment to family living from career.
Thanks, Wini
_____________________________________
WINIFRED HAUN & DANCERS
4225 N. Oakley
Chicago, IL 60618
773-583-2995
http://www.mcs.com/~wini/
______________________________________
really enjoy this list. My name is Wini and I have one four year old
daughter. I'm 40 years old and before I had my daughter, I was a very
successful dancer, choreographer and artistic director of my own dance
company. We live right in the city of Chicago. My husband is a
theoretical physicist at Fermi National Accelerator Lab, which is 40 miles
west of Chicago (yes, he has an awful commute every day, but he doesn't
like suburban life). Our daughter doesn't attend pre-school, which in a
weird way, I guess, qualifies us as homeschoolers already.
I've loved the idea of homeschooling and unschooling, in particular, since
the day I first heard about the possibility, when my daughter was 9 months
old. (I was teaching a ballet class with my baby in arms, and one of my
students, a professor of education at the University of Chicago, mentioned
that my husband and I fit the standard profile of homeschooling parents --
artist and scientist, home birth, breastfeeding, I guess we had it all!)
Anyway, I know there must others like us on this list, and I was wondering
how the moms on this list balance their needs to work and find fulfillment
outside the family (mine is to make dances) with the need to homeschool
and be with their children? I'd love to hear stories of how other mothers
made the adjustment to family living from career.
Thanks, Wini
_____________________________________
WINIFRED HAUN & DANCERS
4225 N. Oakley
Chicago, IL 60618
773-583-2995
http://www.mcs.com/~wini/
______________________________________
Beth Burnham
Wini,
Did you completely give it all up? I noticed you were a dance choreographer.
I haven't missed the work world too much after giving it up when my kids
were born 8 years ago and have read a lot of the Tight wad Gazette and now
lately in the bathtub! I imagine you will still dance with your daughter and
she is so lucky to have a mom like you!
Beth
Did you completely give it all up? I noticed you were a dance choreographer.
I haven't missed the work world too much after giving it up when my kids
were born 8 years ago and have read a lot of the Tight wad Gazette and now
lately in the bathtub! I imagine you will still dance with your daughter and
she is so lucky to have a mom like you!
Beth
David & Betsy Wright
Hi Again Wini!
I am right in the thick of making the (mental and emotional) change from career mom to SAHM. This and one other list have been one of the most helpful things to me. I am getting to know so many new people, have personal correspondence with a couple, and have met two of them - it's really cool. I told dh it's like having cyber co-workers!
Also, I know myself better than anyone, and I knew that I would have to feel as though I was doing something just for me. Keeping my online journal has been fun, challenging and keeps me sharp. I feel as though I'm doing something productive - contributing if you will. I have also met some great people through this as well!! :)
My biggest problem is not bringing in my own money. I have never not had my own income since I left my parent's house. David restocks my checking account every payday, but I still feel funny about it - like I'm taking $ from him. He in wonderful, though, and never makes me feel like he's giving me his money - I imagine a lot of working spouses do that. I'll get over this little pride issue eventually.
Anyway, if I ever really miss working, I just visit the ad agency where my friends still work and listen to them complain for a few minutes and I go home thinking - "I don't have to design that ad or fight with that rep or do that budget - ever again - hahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
I am right in the thick of making the (mental and emotional) change from career mom to SAHM. This and one other list have been one of the most helpful things to me. I am getting to know so many new people, have personal correspondence with a couple, and have met two of them - it's really cool. I told dh it's like having cyber co-workers!
Also, I know myself better than anyone, and I knew that I would have to feel as though I was doing something just for me. Keeping my online journal has been fun, challenging and keeps me sharp. I feel as though I'm doing something productive - contributing if you will. I have also met some great people through this as well!! :)
My biggest problem is not bringing in my own money. I have never not had my own income since I left my parent's house. David restocks my checking account every payday, but I still feel funny about it - like I'm taking $ from him. He in wonderful, though, and never makes me feel like he's giving me his money - I imagine a lot of working spouses do that. I'll get over this little pride issue eventually.
Anyway, if I ever really miss working, I just visit the ad agency where my friends still work and listen to them complain for a few minutes and I go home thinking - "I don't have to design that ad or fight with that rep or do that budget - ever again - hahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
[email protected]
Wini,
Welcome! I don't think that you have to completely leave off what you love
to do because you are homeschooling. Maybe you could do the same thing with
your homeschool support group. Or even go ahead and do part time teaching.
many homeschooling moms are looking for extra income, you have it right
there! LOL. Lots of homeschooling moms would love to have their children in
ballet, but they can't afford the fees. So maybe you could work something
out there. You need to always be able to do things that satisfy you as a
person as well as schooling your kids. So, don't give up on what you love,
just try to redirect it to fit what you are doing now.
Teresa
Welcome! I don't think that you have to completely leave off what you love
to do because you are homeschooling. Maybe you could do the same thing with
your homeschool support group. Or even go ahead and do part time teaching.
many homeschooling moms are looking for extra income, you have it right
there! LOL. Lots of homeschooling moms would love to have their children in
ballet, but they can't afford the fees. So maybe you could work something
out there. You need to always be able to do things that satisfy you as a
person as well as schooling your kids. So, don't give up on what you love,
just try to redirect it to fit what you are doing now.
Teresa
Tom & Nanci Kuykendall
My biggest problem is not bringing in my own money. I have never not had
my own income since I left my parent's house. David restocks my checking
account every payday, but I still feel funny about it - like I'm taking $
from him. He in wonderful, though, and never makes me feel like he's
giving me his money - I imagine a lot of working spouses do that. I'll get
over this little pride issue eventually.
Betsy Wright
Well if it makes you feel any better you could think of it as your pay for
the hard job of full time SAH parent and homeschooler. If anybody deserves
a salary, WE DO!
Nanci K.
my own income since I left my parent's house. David restocks my checking
account every payday, but I still feel funny about it - like I'm taking $
from him. He in wonderful, though, and never makes me feel like he's
giving me his money - I imagine a lot of working spouses do that. I'll get
over this little pride issue eventually.
Betsy Wright
Well if it makes you feel any better you could think of it as your pay for
the hard job of full time SAH parent and homeschooler. If anybody deserves
a salary, WE DO!
Nanci K.
[email protected]
In a message dated 02/06/2000 6:46:39 PM Pacific Standard Time, wini@...
writes:
<< Anyway, I know there must others like us on this list, and I was wondering
how the moms on this list balance their needs to work and find fulfillment
outside the family (mine is to make dances) with the need to homeschool
and be with their children? I'd love to hear stories of how other mothers
made the adjustment to family living from career.
supposed to be pretty good. About having it all, but maybe not all right
now.
Kathy
writes:
<< Anyway, I know there must others like us on this list, and I was wondering
how the moms on this list balance their needs to work and find fulfillment
outside the family (mine is to make dances) with the need to homeschool
and be with their children? I'd love to hear stories of how other mothers
made the adjustment to family living from career.
>>Hi Wini! There is a book called Sequencing. I have never read it but it is
supposed to be pretty good. About having it all, but maybe not all right
now.
Kathy
Tracy Oldfield
I dunno about this, I've never been single, always been the lesser earner, except when dh fell out with his boss and we took the plunge of becoming self-employed and I had to temp for a while, now that was fun, at the beginning of a pregnancy :-) It's never bothered me enough to do anything about, but I do tend to bow to his decisions on things like furntiture and car because basically he earns the money that we spend on these things. He does have strong feelings about such things, even clothes, I am often wary of buying stuff for the kids if I think he won't like it (there's no point spending money on stuff he wouldn't want them to wear, what a snob!!!) Recently I have felt more restricted by this, but since I don't want my children to go to school, or spend any more time away from me than they already do, I can't go out and earn a living, or take time away from them at home (although I do have a couple of little projects, anyone here write for a living???) so I'm deaing with it as I go. Even though I hate the car I drive most, it's my mother's and is currently residing on the drive, broken again!!! If I want a new one, I'd have to earn the pennies for it, so it'll have to wait!
I think what I'm trying to say is that even though I've never independently financed my life, I still feel restriced by being dependent on another. A little :-)
Tracy
I think what I'm trying to say is that even though I've never independently financed my life, I still feel restriced by being dependent on another. A little :-)
Tracy
----- Original Message -----
From: David & Betsy Wright
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 1:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Intro & Career moms
From: "David & Betsy Wright" <deejay@...>
Hi Again Wini!
I am right in the thick of making the (mental and emotional) change from career mom to SAHM. This and one other list have been one of the most helpful things to me. I am getting to know so many new people, have personal correspondence with a couple, and have met two of them - it's really cool. I told dh it's like having cyber co-workers!
Also, I know myself better than anyone, and I knew that I would have to feel as though I was doing something just for me. Keeping my online journal has been fun, challenging and keeps me sharp. I feel as though I'm doing something productive - contributing if you will. I have also met some great people through this as well!! :)
My biggest problem is not bringing in my own money. I have never not had my own income since I left my parent's house. David restocks my checking account every payday, but I still feel funny about it - like I'm taking $ from him. He in wonderful, though, and never makes me feel like he's giving me his money - I imagine a lot of working spouses do that. I'll get over this little pride issue eventually.
Anyway, if I ever really miss working, I just visit the ad agency where my friends still work and listen to them complain for a few minutes and I go home thinking - "I don't have to design that ad or fight with that rep or do that budget - ever again - hahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
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David & Betsy Wright
Hi Shelley,
I really enjoyed reading your post, I didn't think that other people felt the way I do about staying home - I should have known I wasn't the only one!
What you said about religion kind of struck me though, and as a Christian, I'd like to try to explain what I've learned as far as "who's on first". Here's the lineup:
1. I put God first in my life, because he's where my strength comes from. If I keep my relationship with him fresh everyday (through prayer or meditation, Bible reading and/or music), then I am constantly renewed.
2. I am married, so my marriage comes next, but not to deny myself (I am half of the marriage) or the children.
3. My children are my next priority and all the things that my life has to offer fall in after these 3 main things.
Now, I can honestly say that I don't do these in this order every day, but when I do, things run a lot smoother. If my relationship with God is current, then I can be effective in my marriage. If my marriage is strong, then I can take the best care of my kids. When all those things are satisfied, then, I can be available and useful to everyone else.
Did you see where I fit in? Right at the top in my relationship with God. Not that I put myself on the same level with him by any means, but I have to take care of myself before I can take care of anyone else and that's not self denial.
I know there are religions out there, or more aptly people, who enjoy denying themselves, but I think a lot of them enjoy being martyrs.(I know a few personally) They aren't doing anyone any good though. God certainly can't use someone who denies themself just for the sake of being a martyr.
I also loved how you said that making the other person happy, makes you happy. You're right - it's not denial of self - it's focusing on others. When we think of others we don't even have time to concentrate on those little daily bothers.
Now I've rambled on, but I guess this struck a chord with me because I have probably been feeling kind of like a martyr myself lately. I told David: "Since we've been homeschooling I feel like I do for everyone and I don't have anything for myself - Oh and I went on and on - you may have had these little closed door meetings too. He went to the store and bought me a candle - he's really trying :) Anyway, I decided yesterday that I wasn't going to let everyone else's mood determine my mood and what kind of day I have.
Does any of this make sense? As Dennis Miller used to say: " Now, I don't mean to get off on a rant here, but........" LOL
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
I really enjoyed reading your post, I didn't think that other people felt the way I do about staying home - I should have known I wasn't the only one!
What you said about religion kind of struck me though, and as a Christian, I'd like to try to explain what I've learned as far as "who's on first". Here's the lineup:
1. I put God first in my life, because he's where my strength comes from. If I keep my relationship with him fresh everyday (through prayer or meditation, Bible reading and/or music), then I am constantly renewed.
2. I am married, so my marriage comes next, but not to deny myself (I am half of the marriage) or the children.
3. My children are my next priority and all the things that my life has to offer fall in after these 3 main things.
Now, I can honestly say that I don't do these in this order every day, but when I do, things run a lot smoother. If my relationship with God is current, then I can be effective in my marriage. If my marriage is strong, then I can take the best care of my kids. When all those things are satisfied, then, I can be available and useful to everyone else.
Did you see where I fit in? Right at the top in my relationship with God. Not that I put myself on the same level with him by any means, but I have to take care of myself before I can take care of anyone else and that's not self denial.
I know there are religions out there, or more aptly people, who enjoy denying themselves, but I think a lot of them enjoy being martyrs.(I know a few personally) They aren't doing anyone any good though. God certainly can't use someone who denies themself just for the sake of being a martyr.
I also loved how you said that making the other person happy, makes you happy. You're right - it's not denial of self - it's focusing on others. When we think of others we don't even have time to concentrate on those little daily bothers.
Now I've rambled on, but I guess this struck a chord with me because I have probably been feeling kind of like a martyr myself lately. I told David: "Since we've been homeschooling I feel like I do for everyone and I don't have anything for myself - Oh and I went on and on - you may have had these little closed door meetings too. He went to the store and bought me a candle - he's really trying :) Anyway, I decided yesterday that I wasn't going to let everyone else's mood determine my mood and what kind of day I have.
Does any of this make sense? As Dennis Miller used to say: " Now, I don't mean to get off on a rant here, but........" LOL
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
>>I could go into a whole religious thing here....afterall, most religions are really pushing the denial of self. Here's the way most go.......first God, then everyone else, then self. My point isn't about religion, though.....it's about how most of us are raised to put ourselves last for everything.....especially us moms. I'm trying very hard to stop and ask myself what would make ME happy these days. Guess what I'm finding my answer is? Making "the other person" happy (the kids, hubby friends, strangers!). This has been quite illuminating for me, to say the least.<<
Shelley Mansberger
<<<I think what I'm trying to say is that even though I've never independently financed my life, I still feel restriced by being dependent on another. >>>
Hi Tracy,
I'm new to this list....and to unschooling. We took our son out of ps about a year and a half ago, did "school at home" until last week, when we realized our son was equally as miserable, and that we needed to change. So....we just let him go. He's still in shock, I think. So are we. He spends all day on the computer playing games, and I am trying very hard to re-work my thinking each and every hour. It's so scary.
Anyway, that's a bit of our schooling history, but your comment above really caught my eye. I, too, have been in the exact same position for most of my married life. I did work and put my dh through med school, then had a baby and quit to raise them. The dependence issue seems to be coming up more and more as my boys need me less and less. What am I contributing compared to dh? What I've realized this past year is that I've unconsciously created a life for myself where I "get to feel guilty" whichever way I seem to turn. If I spend "his" money, if I'm not here at home with the kids every minute, if I don't have nicely kept home, if I enjoy myself too much.....blah, blah, blah. I'm working deeply on seeing my own self denial.....or better said.....denial of self. It's all been about what others need and want that seems to make me whole. Caring for "just me" at a deep level seems somehow selfish. Should that be?
I could go into a whole religious thing here....afterall, most religions are really pushing the denial of self. Here's the way most go.......first God, then everyone else, then self. My point isn't about religion, though.....it's about how most of us are raised to put ourselves last for everything.....especially us moms. I'm trying very hard to stop and ask myself what would make ME happy these days. Guess what I'm finding my answer is? Making "the other person" happy (the kids, hubby friends, strangers!). This has been quite illuminating for me, to say the least.
My point is, guilt is really a poisonous thing. It may get us to do tons of things for everyone, but it rarely allows us to care for ourselves. My husband is deeply into alternative medicine and therapies, and we often discuss dis-ease......meaning "not at ease with ourselves". We think guilt is a major producer of certain illnesses. Who needs it? Apparently, a good many of us, unfortunately.
One of the biggest reasons we decided to just let go of the whole schooling thing is because we could see the stress it was putting on our son, and even more on the ps kids. They're all pushing and struggling and killing themselves for the right grades for the right college.....and at what cost? They're all losing themselves. We didn't want our boys to lose themselves in some schooling process. My husband likes to say......"Where are we all going?".....meaning, "What are all these kids struggling TO?" Certainly not peace and contentment. What we see is that more and more, the kids are struggling mercilessly to six figures!
Golly, I've run on way too long. I just wanted to respond to your dependence thought and I got carried away. Nice to find this list. Thanks for listening. On we go!
Shelley
Hi Tracy,
I'm new to this list....and to unschooling. We took our son out of ps about a year and a half ago, did "school at home" until last week, when we realized our son was equally as miserable, and that we needed to change. So....we just let him go. He's still in shock, I think. So are we. He spends all day on the computer playing games, and I am trying very hard to re-work my thinking each and every hour. It's so scary.
Anyway, that's a bit of our schooling history, but your comment above really caught my eye. I, too, have been in the exact same position for most of my married life. I did work and put my dh through med school, then had a baby and quit to raise them. The dependence issue seems to be coming up more and more as my boys need me less and less. What am I contributing compared to dh? What I've realized this past year is that I've unconsciously created a life for myself where I "get to feel guilty" whichever way I seem to turn. If I spend "his" money, if I'm not here at home with the kids every minute, if I don't have nicely kept home, if I enjoy myself too much.....blah, blah, blah. I'm working deeply on seeing my own self denial.....or better said.....denial of self. It's all been about what others need and want that seems to make me whole. Caring for "just me" at a deep level seems somehow selfish. Should that be?
I could go into a whole religious thing here....afterall, most religions are really pushing the denial of self. Here's the way most go.......first God, then everyone else, then self. My point isn't about religion, though.....it's about how most of us are raised to put ourselves last for everything.....especially us moms. I'm trying very hard to stop and ask myself what would make ME happy these days. Guess what I'm finding my answer is? Making "the other person" happy (the kids, hubby friends, strangers!). This has been quite illuminating for me, to say the least.
My point is, guilt is really a poisonous thing. It may get us to do tons of things for everyone, but it rarely allows us to care for ourselves. My husband is deeply into alternative medicine and therapies, and we often discuss dis-ease......meaning "not at ease with ourselves". We think guilt is a major producer of certain illnesses. Who needs it? Apparently, a good many of us, unfortunately.
One of the biggest reasons we decided to just let go of the whole schooling thing is because we could see the stress it was putting on our son, and even more on the ps kids. They're all pushing and struggling and killing themselves for the right grades for the right college.....and at what cost? They're all losing themselves. We didn't want our boys to lose themselves in some schooling process. My husband likes to say......"Where are we all going?".....meaning, "What are all these kids struggling TO?" Certainly not peace and contentment. What we see is that more and more, the kids are struggling mercilessly to six figures!
Golly, I've run on way too long. I just wanted to respond to your dependence thought and I got carried away. Nice to find this list. Thanks for listening. On we go!
Shelley
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/10/2000 6:37:24 AM Central Standard Time,
serene@... writes:
<< If I spend "his" money, if I'm not here at home with the kids every
minute, if I don't have nicely kept home, if I enjoy myself too
much.....blah, blah, blah. I'm working deeply on seeing my own self
denial.....or better said.....denial of self. It's all been about what
others need and want that seems to make me whole. Caring for "just me" at a
deep level seems somehow selfish. Should that be? >>
Shelley,
You raise an excellent point here. I struggle with the same issues as a non
wage-earning adult. Do you think it's more "natural" for women to feel this
way than men? Why is that? Is it because we're programmed as caregivers and
fixers-of-whatever's-wrong from the time we're small? Men on the list, what
do you think? Do you struggle with any of these issues? My husband gets
aggravated with me when I start telling myself that I need to do EVERYTHING,
right now, perfectly, or else I'm good for nothing. In turn, I get
aggravated with him for being so blase about taking care of things. I guess
I actually envy him his ability to see what's really important. He certainly
doesn't think of his salary as "his" money. I think maybe I do, however.
Hmmm. Food for thought.
**** Kim ****
runs with scissors
serene@... writes:
<< If I spend "his" money, if I'm not here at home with the kids every
minute, if I don't have nicely kept home, if I enjoy myself too
much.....blah, blah, blah. I'm working deeply on seeing my own self
denial.....or better said.....denial of self. It's all been about what
others need and want that seems to make me whole. Caring for "just me" at a
deep level seems somehow selfish. Should that be? >>
Shelley,
You raise an excellent point here. I struggle with the same issues as a non
wage-earning adult. Do you think it's more "natural" for women to feel this
way than men? Why is that? Is it because we're programmed as caregivers and
fixers-of-whatever's-wrong from the time we're small? Men on the list, what
do you think? Do you struggle with any of these issues? My husband gets
aggravated with me when I start telling myself that I need to do EVERYTHING,
right now, perfectly, or else I'm good for nothing. In turn, I get
aggravated with him for being so blase about taking care of things. I guess
I actually envy him his ability to see what's really important. He certainly
doesn't think of his salary as "his" money. I think maybe I do, however.
Hmmm. Food for thought.
**** Kim ****
runs with scissors
[email protected]
I've been following the discussion on sahms and money and guilt and
here's my $.02:
I wonder if the stress women feel isn't really a matter of undervaluing
the work they do in the home. I agree that finances are extremely
important, but earning the salary is not the only way to contribute
financially to your family. Consider the skill and care you invest in
managing your money -- creating a budget, paying bills on time, managing
your savings, and purchasing the necessities and the occasional luxuries.
When the paycheck is deposited in the bank, the work doesn't end, it is
just beginning! No matter how much the wage earner brings in, if the
spouse at home isn't working with him/her to manage it well, the finances
will be in shambles.
I remember an interview with Barbara Bush inwhich she prefaced an answer
with, "when we were vice president." I was single at the time and my
friends and I had a good laugh over that part of her response, but now
that I am married I understand where she's coming from. True, DHs
paycheck is made out to him alone, but I know that it is for me and my
children too. Marriage is a union, and whatever is done is done for the
benefit of that union.
Courtney in AZ, USA
---Cubessence@...
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here's my $.02:
I wonder if the stress women feel isn't really a matter of undervaluing
the work they do in the home. I agree that finances are extremely
important, but earning the salary is not the only way to contribute
financially to your family. Consider the skill and care you invest in
managing your money -- creating a budget, paying bills on time, managing
your savings, and purchasing the necessities and the occasional luxuries.
When the paycheck is deposited in the bank, the work doesn't end, it is
just beginning! No matter how much the wage earner brings in, if the
spouse at home isn't working with him/her to manage it well, the finances
will be in shambles.
I remember an interview with Barbara Bush inwhich she prefaced an answer
with, "when we were vice president." I was single at the time and my
friends and I had a good laugh over that part of her response, but now
that I am married I understand where she's coming from. True, DHs
paycheck is made out to him alone, but I know that it is for me and my
children too. Marriage is a union, and whatever is done is done for the
benefit of that union.
Courtney in AZ, USA
---Cubessence@...
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Joshua Heath
>From: Monkeycoop@...Do you think it's more "natural" for women to feel this
>way than men? Why is that? Is it because we're programmed as caregiversand
>fixers-of-whatever's-wrong from the time we're small? Men on the list,what
>do you think? Do you struggle with any of these issues? My husband getsEVERYTHING,
>aggravated with me when I start telling myself that I need to do
>right now, perfectly, or else I'm good for nothing. In turn, I getguess
>aggravated with him for being so blase about taking care of things. I
>I actually envy him his ability to see what's really important. Hecertainly
>doesn't think of his salary as "his" money. I think maybe I do, however.Kim, as a man who is just transitioning into being "dependant" on my wife
for an income I allready relate. My situation is helped by the fact that I
was our primary wage earner over the last 5 years.... and even now I have
unemployment insurance benifits that will last untel mid April. But I still
find myself "leaning" on these points to "justify" my upcoming dependance on
her income. I find it hard as well to be clear about her income being our
income. I as well want to do some small part time business (possibly as
something that will be a valuable unchooling experience for our boys) My
perspective anyways..... gotta run.... they are calling me to read "captain
underpants"!!!
Joshua
A. Yates
"Captain Underpants"??????????????????????
Please explain. I'm afraid that sounds mighty interesting!
Ann
Joshua Heath wrote:
Please explain. I'm afraid that sounds mighty interesting!
Ann
Joshua Heath wrote:
> From: "Joshua Heath" <heathfam@...>
>
> >From: Monkeycoop@...
> Do you think it's more "natural" for women to feel this
> >way than men? Why is that? Is it because we're programmed as caregivers
> and
> >fixers-of-whatever's-wrong from the time we're small? Men on the list,
> what
> >do you think? Do you struggle with any of these issues? My husband gets
> >aggravated with me when I start telling myself that I need to do
> EVERYTHING,
> >right now, perfectly, or else I'm good for nothing. In turn, I get
> >aggravated with him for being so blase about taking care of things. I
> guess
> >I actually envy him his ability to see what's really important. He
> certainly
> >doesn't think of his salary as "his" money. I think maybe I do, however.
> Kim, as a man who is just transitioning into being "dependant" on my wife
> for an income I allready relate. My situation is helped by the fact that I
> was our primary wage earner over the last 5 years.... and even now I have
> unemployment insurance benifits that will last untel mid April. But I still
> find myself "leaning" on these points to "justify" my upcoming dependance on
> her income. I find it hard as well to be clear about her income being our
> income. I as well want to do some small part time business (possibly as
> something that will be a valuable unchooling experience for our boys) My
> perspective anyways..... gotta run.... they are calling me to read "captain
> underpants"!!!
> Joshua
>
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Joshua Heath
Betsy wrote,
"Since we've been homeschooling I feel like I do for everyone and I don't have anything for myself - Oh and I went on and on - you may have had these little closed door meetings too. He went to the store and bought me a candle - he's really trying :) Anyway, I decided yesterday that I wasn't going to let everyone else's mood determine my mood and what kind of day I have.
Does any of this make sense?
Betsy
Betsy, thanks!! You struck a cord with me too. I am not at all religous, but what you said about putting your relationship with spirit (God) first before all else is so very true and so very helpful in being able to function well and make it through the day without being overwhelmed by STRESS. It makes all the difference in the world since being able to respond to the needs/ideas/whims/messes/creations/arguments/skinned knees/hurt feelings/demands etc of my kids in a calm and centered and supportive but still strong way is what makes a day of unschooling successfull in my mind.
All the time I have for now..
Joshua(career-dad ;-)
"Since we've been homeschooling I feel like I do for everyone and I don't have anything for myself - Oh and I went on and on - you may have had these little closed door meetings too. He went to the store and bought me a candle - he's really trying :) Anyway, I decided yesterday that I wasn't going to let everyone else's mood determine my mood and what kind of day I have.
Does any of this make sense?
Betsy
Betsy, thanks!! You struck a cord with me too. I am not at all religous, but what you said about putting your relationship with spirit (God) first before all else is so very true and so very helpful in being able to function well and make it through the day without being overwhelmed by STRESS. It makes all the difference in the world since being able to respond to the needs/ideas/whims/messes/creations/arguments/skinned knees/hurt feelings/demands etc of my kids in a calm and centered and supportive but still strong way is what makes a day of unschooling successfull in my mind.
All the time I have for now..
Joshua(career-dad ;-)
A. Yates
courtney,
That was very well put.
I always knew I liked Barbara Bush. :)
Ann
cubessence@... wrote:
That was very well put.
I always knew I liked Barbara Bush. :)
Ann
cubessence@... wrote:
> From: cubessence@...
>
> I've been following the discussion on sahms and money and guilt and
> here's my $.02:
>
> I wonder if the stress women feel isn't really a matter of undervaluing
> the work they do in the home. I agree that finances are extremely
> important, but earning the salary is not the only way to contribute
> financially to your family. Consider the skill and care you invest in
> managing your money -- creating a budget, paying bills on time, managing
> your savings, and purchasing the necessities and the occasional luxuries.
> When the paycheck is deposited in the bank, the work doesn't end, it is
> just beginning! No matter how much the wage earner brings in, if the
> spouse at home isn't working with him/her to manage it well, the finances
> will be in shambles.
>
> I remember an interview with Barbara Bush inwhich she prefaced an answer
> with, "when we were vice president." I was single at the time and my
> friends and I had a good laugh over that part of her response, but now
> that I am married I understand where she's coming from. True, DHs
> paycheck is made out to him alone, but I know that it is for me and my
> children too. Marriage is a union, and whatever is done is done for the
> benefit of that union.
>
> Courtney in AZ, USA
> ---Cubessence@...
>
> THE RULES HAVE CHANGED! You CAN get paid to surf the Web! Join me and
> take advantage of the Internet!
> http://www.alladvantage.com/go.asp?refid=JCF-074
>
> ________________________________________________________________
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David & Betsy Wright
I think most SAHs know deep down that what we're doing is invaluable - you can't even begin to put a price on what we do. But, just like our kids, we are affected by values we see portrayed all around us and through the media. Every once in a while we forget that no one else can replace our efforts.
I got a magazine in the mail the other day (a promotional copy), glanced through it and threw it away. Every woman in there appeared so self absorbed and pathetic. Most of them fit the working mom stereotype and appeared to "have it all". To me the pictures and articles were shallow and repulsive, but I know a few years ago I would have thought it was a glamorous, even enviable lifestyle.
Society tells us that we're successful if we have a great job, send our kids to the best schools, exercise ourselves skinny, take classes at night and fake everything we possibly can about our looks. If you can manage this (which only takes about 20 hours a day), then you've made it.
I am so glad that I am not chained to those ideas anymore. I think it's so cool that I am getting to know people like you who enjoy being REAL.
I guess on those days when I think it would be great to have a paycheck again I'll just remember that my number one job is raising REAL kids. What a performance bonus that will be!!!!!
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
I got a magazine in the mail the other day (a promotional copy), glanced through it and threw it away. Every woman in there appeared so self absorbed and pathetic. Most of them fit the working mom stereotype and appeared to "have it all". To me the pictures and articles were shallow and repulsive, but I know a few years ago I would have thought it was a glamorous, even enviable lifestyle.
Society tells us that we're successful if we have a great job, send our kids to the best schools, exercise ourselves skinny, take classes at night and fake everything we possibly can about our looks. If you can manage this (which only takes about 20 hours a day), then you've made it.
I am so glad that I am not chained to those ideas anymore. I think it's so cool that I am getting to know people like you who enjoy being REAL.
I guess on those days when I think it would be great to have a paycheck again I'll just remember that my number one job is raising REAL kids. What a performance bonus that will be!!!!!
Betsy Wright
The Wright Way To Homeschool
http://www.angelfire.com/fl3/homeschoolingwrights
email: deejay@...
I can do everything through Him who strengthens me. Phillipians 4:13
Tom & Nanci Kuykendall
Do you think it's more "natural" for women to feel this
cargivers from the very beginning. It took me many years and many abusive
relationships with needy men to finally learn that I did NOT need to be a
caretaker and this was a wrong and flawed way for my family to raise. I
spent my entire youth taking care of my older brother and my family and
friends and guests. Being a gracious hostess, giing till WAY past when it
hurt, belittling and ignoring my own needs to take care of those of others.
I am hypoglycemic and I still "forget" to eat, taking care of my family.
My husband has to physically stop me and tell me to eat, or bring me food
so that I won't feel guilty about caring for my own needs.
Looking at either my mother or my father's side of the family I can see
whole generations of women raised to be cartakers and men raised to be
taken care of. That 1950's home ec thing that was sent to the list
recently was a great emaple of this mentality.
Nanci K.
>way than men? Why is that? Is it because we're programmed as caregiversand
>fixers-of-whatever's-wrong from the time we're small?Definately yes! Many women (most women) are taught to be cartakers and
>
>**** Kim ****
>runs with scissors
cargivers from the very beginning. It took me many years and many abusive
relationships with needy men to finally learn that I did NOT need to be a
caretaker and this was a wrong and flawed way for my family to raise. I
spent my entire youth taking care of my older brother and my family and
friends and guests. Being a gracious hostess, giing till WAY past when it
hurt, belittling and ignoring my own needs to take care of those of others.
I am hypoglycemic and I still "forget" to eat, taking care of my family.
My husband has to physically stop me and tell me to eat, or bring me food
so that I won't feel guilty about caring for my own needs.
Looking at either my mother or my father's side of the family I can see
whole generations of women raised to be cartakers and men raised to be
taken care of. That 1950's home ec thing that was sent to the list
recently was a great emaple of this mentality.
Nanci K.
[email protected]
Betsy--I too believe that most SAHM will agree with that statement...atleast
I think most of us on this list know it to be true..it's not always so easy
to see though...and that is when you need to take "some time" and put what
you are doing in perspective..
THIS job..raising my son..is THE HARDEST JOB I have ever had...My career is
my family...my job used to be oncology RN...I have always wanted to be a
mother, and am fortunate enough to be able to stay at home..whom ever makes
the $$$ in the family, IMHO, that is irrelevant..you are both working towards
the same goal..right-- A strong, well balanced life for the family....
Well thats'just my .02 for today, I wasn't going to post this, but I truely
believe that to be successful at home, you need to forget about where/who
the $$ is coming from, and know that you're jobs are both equal.
Eileen
I think most of us on this list know it to be true..it's not always so easy
to see though...and that is when you need to take "some time" and put what
you are doing in perspective..
THIS job..raising my son..is THE HARDEST JOB I have ever had...My career is
my family...my job used to be oncology RN...I have always wanted to be a
mother, and am fortunate enough to be able to stay at home..whom ever makes
the $$$ in the family, IMHO, that is irrelevant..you are both working towards
the same goal..right-- A strong, well balanced life for the family....
Well thats'just my .02 for today, I wasn't going to post this, but I truely
believe that to be successful at home, you need to forget about where/who
the $$ is coming from, and know that you're jobs are both equal.
Eileen
Tom & Nanci Kuykendall
No matter how much the wage earner brings in, if the
the more she spends. They like to LOOK like they are rich and maintain a
certain "Quality of life" which is really just a superficial Status thing.
These days (my dad is 70) dad is still working full time and making a self
dsescribed "obscene" amount of money, and yet they just upgraded to a
larger custom built home and own a much more "obscene" amount of money to
credit cards and loans.
My In-Laws, practical, down to earth folks who are in a lower income
bracket, are not even comfortable at my parents home because it is so full
of immaculate and expensive trinkets and antiques.
Nanci K.
>spouse at home isn't working with him/her to manage it well, the financesI have seen this example all my life with my parents. The more he makes,
>will be in shambles.
>
>Courtney in AZ, USA
>---Cubessence@...
the more she spends. They like to LOOK like they are rich and maintain a
certain "Quality of life" which is really just a superficial Status thing.
These days (my dad is 70) dad is still working full time and making a self
dsescribed "obscene" amount of money, and yet they just upgraded to a
larger custom built home and own a much more "obscene" amount of money to
credit cards and loans.
My In-Laws, practical, down to earth folks who are in a lower income
bracket, are not even comfortable at my parents home because it is so full
of immaculate and expensive trinkets and antiques.
Nanci K.
David & Betsy Wright
You said it sister!!!!!!!! <bg>
----- Original Message -----
From: JazBallard@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 2:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Intro & Career moms
From: JazBallard@...
Betsy--I too believe that most SAHM will agree with that statement...atleast
I think most of us on this list know it to be true..it's not always so easy
to see though...and that is when you need to take "some time" and put what
you are doing in perspective..
THIS job..raising my son..is THE HARDEST JOB I have ever had...My career is
my family...my job used to be oncology RN...I have always wanted to be a
mother, and am fortunate enough to be able to stay at home..whom ever makes
the $$$ in the family, IMHO, that is irrelevant..you are both working towards
the same goal..right-- A strong, well balanced life for the family....
Well thats'just my .02 for today, I wasn't going to post this, but I truely
believe that to be successful at home, you need to forget about where/who
the $$ is coming from, and know that you're jobs are both equal.
Eileen
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A. Yates
I'm smiling... My Grandmother who is 93, still tells one of the girls to go
get the butter (or some such thing) for one of the boys in the family. Now,
we just snicker quietly and kick whichever male it is, on our way to get it.
*S*
Ann
get the butter (or some such thing) for one of the boys in the family. Now,
we just snicker quietly and kick whichever male it is, on our way to get it.
*S*
Ann
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/10/2000 2:52:45 PM Central Standard Time,
hooperck@... writes:
<< I always knew I liked Barbara Bush. :) >>
I agree! Why doesn't Barbara kick George W. off the ticket and run
herself??? I don't think I'd ever need to worry that she would be locked in
the Oval Office, "getting some" under the desk! I think she is an excellent
role model, and is soooo gracious.
**** Kim ****
runs with scissors
hooperck@... writes:
<< I always knew I liked Barbara Bush. :) >>
I agree! Why doesn't Barbara kick George W. off the ticket and run
herself??? I don't think I'd ever need to worry that she would be locked in
the Oval Office, "getting some" under the desk! I think she is an excellent
role model, and is soooo gracious.
**** Kim ****
runs with scissors
Lynda
I grew up in the most equal rights/liberated family in the world and it
always amazes me that other "girls" weren't raised the same. It was just
assumed that everyone had equal rights and responsibilities. I guess I was
blissfully blind for decades. I mean, I was raised in the dark ages and my
grandfather was born in 1866 and he taught ALL of the grandkids carpentry.
Gramma taught ALL the grandkids to to crochet and knit. It was really a
surprise to me to learn later that everyone wasn't treated that way!
Hmmmm, I guess they were born before their time.
Lynda
----------
always amazes me that other "girls" weren't raised the same. It was just
assumed that everyone had equal rights and responsibilities. I guess I was
blissfully blind for decades. I mean, I was raised in the dark ages and my
grandfather was born in 1866 and he taught ALL of the grandkids carpentry.
Gramma taught ALL the grandkids to to crochet and knit. It was really a
surprise to me to learn later that everyone wasn't treated that way!
Hmmmm, I guess they were born before their time.
Lynda
----------
> From: "A. Yates" <hooperck@...>to go
>
>
> I'm smiling... My Grandmother who is 93, still tells one of the girls
> get the butter (or some such thing) for one of the boys in the family.Now,
> we just snicker quietly and kick whichever male it is, on our way to getit.
> *S*
> Ann
Shelley Mansberger
Thanks to everyone for their thoughtful and heartfelt replies on this issue. I thoroughly enjoyed reading all of your thoughts, lifestyles, concerns and beliefs.
Shelley
Shelley