[email protected]

In a message dated 2/13/2003 11:04:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,
carlasue@... writes:


>
> This brings up an issue we've been having with our almost 4yod. She has
> very curly/tangly babyfine hair and it's now been cut to shoulder length
> (when it's dry, longer when it's wet), because we thought it would be
> easier
> to deal with if the ends were cut off (she had never had a haircut). But
> she still fights like mad to keep from getting her hair combed, so I almost
> never comb it. She ends up looking very messy and.well.uncombed. Once or
> twice a week I force her to have it washed and combed.

Just let me state that I could have written this post about my 3.5yo dd. I
don't mind if her hair is messy at home, but if we are going somewhere I try
to have it look neat. I guess to me it's the same idea as not taking her in
public wearing stained or ripped clothing. The more I write here, I'm
realizing that it's because I care what people think about how we look and
that she probably doesn't give a rat's butt about that. LOL I'm interested
in hearing advice about this since the times I try to deal with the hair
thing usually leaves her upset and me feeling like crap.
Amy Kagey
E-mail me for a list of used
homeschooling books for sale!
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/14/2003 7:14:10 AM Eastern Standard Time,
amycats2@... writes:

> I'm interested
> in hearing advice about this since the times I try to deal with the hair
> thing usually leaves her upset and me feeling like crap.

Have y'all tried braids? Sleeping in them too---and brushing out in the
morning and then back up into a braid? I know, when I used to ride, that was
the best sloution for me NOT to get tangles. I have boys who are particular
about hair, so I have no experience as a mom. But I DO remember as a
child--and braids worked well for me---I could go days without brushing, then
they fell into three separate sections to brush out.

??
~Kelly


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/14/2003 7:53:36 AM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:


>
> Have y'all tried braids?

Will try the braids idea, thanks! She doesn't sit still for very long but
maybe she'll like the idea enough to try it. (I'm getting a mental
picture...didn't women in the 1800's braid their long hair at night so it
wouldn't tangle?)
Amy Kagey
E-mail me for a list of used
homeschooling books for sale!
<A HREF="http://www.ubah.com/ecommerce/default.asp?sid=Z0939&gid=462366">Shop: Usborne Books!</A>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Schuyler Waynforth <[email protected]>

We've tried braids, her hair is too fine to stay in a braid. And we
use a detangling spray. I can clearly remember having permanantly
tangled hair as a child, not quite dreadlocks but bad enough that it
was a horrible fight to brush my hair. I think there is a major
tangle-gene in the family lineage. I was so pleased when she
offered to do it herself. I hope it is a solution that will be
maintainable.

Schuyler

--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 2/14/2003 7:14:10 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> amycats2@a... writes:
>
> > I'm interested
> > in hearing advice about this since the times I try to deal with
the hair
> > thing usually leaves her upset and me feeling like crap.
>
> Have y'all tried braids? Sleeping in them too---and brushing out
in the
> morning and then back up into a braid? I know, when I used to
ride, that was
> the best sloution for me NOT to get tangles. I have boys who are
particular
> about hair, so I have no experience as a mom. But I DO remember as
a
> child--and braids worked well for me---I could go days without
brushing, then
> they fell into three separate sections to brush out.
>
> ??
> ~Kelly
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Heidi Wordhouse-Dykema

My son has really long, fine blonde hair. He didn't want it cut and for
the longest time, he didn't want it brushed, not by himself, and certainly
not by anyone else. (He was hyper-sensitive about how it feels.) So, we
went out in public with the 'rats nests' and usually nobody looked
twice! (although he was usually in knee-high boots, sweats and
baggy-to-his-knees T-shirts he'd inherited from his 6'5" uncles, so maybe
there was just too much 'funk' for folks to take in all at once...)

When I cared how his hair looked, I'd ask him if he would wear a hat. He
likes his hats. He has all sorts of hats from a huge foam cowboy hat to a
thick, furry mountain-man hat, to funky ski hats (with lots of bits and
dangles on them) to fuzzy, tall, cat-in-the-hat -type hats. With a hat on,
nobody noticed the rats nests because they were hidden or folks were too
busy thinking, "funky hat" to notice.

Maybe you could offer to get your hair-sensitive kids some fun
hats? (Amusement parks are great places to get fun hats.)

We're pretty much past those concerns now as he's hit puberty and had
decided to shower every night (with conditioner.) No more rats
nests! Hooray! ...although I miss the hats sometimes.
Hmmm.... maybe he'd wear one for a while if I asked him to...
HeidiWD

sorcha_aisling <[email protected]

>(I'm getting a mental
> picture...didn't women in the 1800's braid their long hair at night
so it
> wouldn't tangle?)

I'm not a woman from the 1800's <g> but I braid my long hair at
night. I have naturally curly hair and it *cannot* be brushed when
it's dry or 1.it would hurt immensely and 2.all the curl would come
out and it would be an Afro.

When I wash my hair I put conditioner in and use a wide-toothed
plastic brush to work the conditioner through (I've read in magazines
to never brush wet hair -- they're absolutely wrong. It's the *only*
time I can use a brush).

I start at the bottom, brushing out the tangles and work my way up
(if I started at the top and worked down I'd rip out patches of
hair). Then I rinse, put just a dab more conditioner in, and brush
it again. I immediately braid it and it stays that way until it's
dry.

When I unbraid it, I shake my head to make it look cohesive (instead
of three lumps). Before bed, I braid it again because sleeping on
it "loose" would look disastrous and the only thing to do when it's
tangled is wash it, which isn't good for dry curly hair on a daily
basis.

Hope that helps someone (though I don't know what to say to someone
dealing with fine, thin hair ... except ignore the parts about
gooping conditioner in it!).

Sorcha

kayb85 <[email protected]>

The more I write here, I'm
> realizing that it's because I care what people think about how we
look and
> that she probably doesn't give a rat's butt about that.

I think this is the issue for a LOT of things that have to do with
struggles between parents and kids. How much you clean the house,
whether or not you let your 3 year old wear what he really wants to
wear, even if it's pajamas, whether or not you think 20 minutes of
tears to get your daughter's hair looking "good" is worth it, whether
or not you make your 7 year old sit and do phonics.

It's a challenge to get myself to the point where I can say, "I don't
care what others think". And just when I'm at the brink of getting
there, two other things come to mind. 1. Other parents might not want
their kids playing here if the house is a mess 2. Someone might call
children and youth.

I had a friend who had children and youth called on her. She was
given the ultimatim, "Get your house cleaned up by tomorrow or we
will find a temporary home for the children". A friend and I did
come over and get it to the point where it did pass their scrutiny
(she had just gotten off of complete bed rest due to a difficult
pregnancy when she got the knock on the door). However, this was
months ago and she still has them popping in for surprise visits to
check the cleanliness of her house.

Does anyone worry about social services being called on them because
of how their kids dress, how their house looks, or even just the fact
that their child isn't reading? Does the fact that unschoolers
are "different" and often more relaxed about housework make us an
easy target for those anonymous calls?

Sheila

Angela

In this state, from what I have read in the papers, a dirty house isn't
reason enough to have social services pay you a call. I read about a case
where a mother had called social services on her own daughter because she
felt her daughter's house was unsafe for her grandkids because it was so
filthy. From what the mother said, she wanted social services to teach the
daughter how to keep her house neater and safer. Social services would help
her out. The reason it was in the paper, is that the house (mobile home)
burned to the ground a few months later and the mom was blaming social
services for not helping out when she asked them too. The fire started
because of a faulty appliance though.

My first question was why didn't the mother help her daughter clean if she
cared so much about the grand kids. At one point the mother lived with her
daughter and grandkids, but said she had to move out because it was too
gross. Anyway, the whole point of this story was that a filthy house might
not be enough reason to have social services involved, depending on the
state you live in.





Angela in Maine- unschooling@...

<http://userpages.prexar.com/rickshaw/>
http://userpages.prexar.com/rickshaw/

"What you are shouts so loudly in my ears I cannot hear what you say."
Emerson


Does anyone worry about social services being called on them because
of how their kids dress, how their house looks, or even just the fact
that their child isn't reading? Does the fact that unschoolers
are "different" and often more relaxed about housework make us an
easy target for those anonymous calls?

Sheila



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Alan & Brenda Leonard

2/14/03 16:07:

> (I'm getting a mental
> picture...didn't women in the 1800's braid their long hair at night so it
> wouldn't tangle?)

Forget the "in the 1800's part", I still do!

brenda

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/14/03 9:03:30 AM, sheran@... writes:

<< Does anyone worry about social services being called on them because
of how their kids dress, how their house looks, or even just the fact
that their child isn't reading? Does the fact that unschoolers
are "different" and often more relaxed about housework make us an
easy target for those anonymous calls? >>

Yes.
It's easier when they're older and the neighbors know them better (in my
experience).

It's just another one of those risk factors you take into consideration when
considering unschooling.

What bothers me the most is that some of the worst criticism (not about
cleanliness, but about kids not reading and that sort of thing) comes from
structured homeschoolers, because THEY are afraid of our "lowering the
average" or making homeschooling look unworkable.

There is that very awkward period for unschoolers when the kids are ten, give
or take a couple of years, and they're learning TONS of stuff that doesn't
show, while the other kids are learning to write in cursive and do long
division.

After that hump, people don't complain NEARLY as much about unschooled kids,
and I find more and more local and in-person homeschoolers who were afraid
NOT to teach their kids school-style looking at my kids, and looking at their
kids, and saying they wished they had been braver.

But as to the fear, I do remind my kids every month or two that considering
our unschooling situation, they need to be quiet after 10:00 (in-house quiet,
not outside attracting the neighbors' attention, or making noise that can be
heard outside the house), they need to wear coats when it's cold, and be
circumspect in public. They understand it, even though we've never had
social services visits. They know a couple of families who have. One poor
mom had two bio kids and had adopted three, non-English speakers (Korean and
Russian) she was gradually bringing up to speed at various ages, and she was
not really well organized. Their huge laundry pile tended to grow in the e
ntryway, across from the door to the garage. Once when she was having
appliance trouble and the pile was big, social services had been called by a
neighbor, and just before the CPS worker showed up, a 50 pound bag of dogfood
broke and spilled all over the pile of laundry. Right in the doorway. So
my kids have that vision to work (away) from.

Sandra

Carla Tucker

You've hit the nail on the head. She doesn't care what it looks like at
all.



Carla



-----Original Message-----
From: amycats2@... [mailto:amycats2@...]
I
don't mind if her hair is messy at home, but if we are going somewhere I try

to have it look neat. I guess to me it's the same idea as not taking her in
public wearing stained or ripped clothing. The more I write here, I'm
realizing that it's because I care what people think about how we look and
that she probably doesn't give a rat's butt about that. LOL I'm interested

in hearing advice about this since the times I try to deal with the hair
thing usually leaves her upset and me feeling like crap.
Amy Kagey



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Carla Tucker

Messing with the hair is when the hassle starts. Braids are about as bad as
combing. We have braided at her request a few times, but it's not something
I think she would sit still for every day. But I have a sister with much
longer hair that is very similar to Serena's and that's her solution, too.
She keeps it in a braid all week and undoes it in the shower and combs
conditioner through it and it goes right back into the braid when she's done
unless she is leaving it loose for a special occasion or something.



Carla



-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@... [mailto:kbcdlovejo@...]
Have y'all tried braids? Sleeping in them too---and brushing out in the
morning and then back up into a braid?



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Carla Tucker

I braid my own hair every night to keep it from tangling :-) But I have
staightish hair, too. Her curly hair just doesn't seem to be tamed that
easily!



Carla



didn't women in the 1800's braid their long hair at night so it
wouldn't tangle?)
Amy Kagey




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Carla Tucker

One thing to keep in mind about CPS (what it's called in Arizona) is that
you don't have to let them into our house unless they have a court order.
If they knock on your door and ask to come in, just say no. They don't
pursue it unless there is an actual substantial complaint of abuse or
neglect. And at that point you are forewarned and have a bit of time to
step back and see what could be going on to make them show up at your door
and how you can refute it if they do come back with a policeman at their
side.



Carla



-----Original Message-----
From: kayb85 <sheran@...> [mailto:sheran@...]
Does anyone worry about social services being called on them because
of how their kids dress, how their house looks, or even just the fact
that their child isn't reading? Does the fact that unschoolers
are "different" and often more relaxed about housework make us an
easy target for those anonymous calls?




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mary Bianco

>From: "sorcha_aisling <sorcha-aisling@...>" <sorcha-

<<I'm not a woman from the 1800's <g> but I braid my long hair at
night. I have naturally curly hair and it *cannot* be brushed when
it's dry or 1.it would hurt immensely and 2.all the curl would come
out and it would be an Afro.>>


You just described my Sierra to a tee. Can't even think about combing let
alone brushing when her hair is dry. Total giant fuzz. Her hair is long and
extremely curly. We go through No More Tanlges like water here. We ponytail
her hair every Friday for sports camp but I don't like doing that often. I
admit it's great as there is no tangling but I worry about what it will do
to her hair in the long run. Never thought about braiding. I'll have to try
that. Wish I knew how to french braid.

I remember my grandmother always had her hair in a braid and wrapped around
her head. Never saw her any other way. My mom told me she saw her with her
hair down once. (it was her MIL) She said it was way past her waist. Even
though I never saw it, I always imagined seeing her like that. Very matronly
with long gray hair streaming down her back. I digress.

Mary B



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[email protected]

In a message dated 2/15/2003 12:58:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
mummyone24@... writes:


> . Wish I knew how to french braid.
>
You *could* ask a hairdresser---but if you find an equestrian---now THERE's
your serious braider! Go to a barn or tack shop---they love to show off. And
if you come to SC, I'll show you how!

~Kelly


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/14/03 10:58:19 PM, mummyone24@... writes:

<< Never thought about braiding. I'll have to try
that. Wish I knew how to french braid. >>

I can't do it on my own head, but can do it on other people's. It's not too
hard. I bet there are even useable instructions on line.

<<I remember my grandmother always had her hair in a braid and wrapped around
her head.>>

I remember seeing the old women of twenty and thirty years ago with a kind of
french-braided crown of hair, altogether fastened all the way around. At
grocery stores. <g> Done up that fancy just to go to the store, or I would
see them at church or concerts. But somehow the braid didn't have an end,
just fastened to them everywhere.

Sandra

Alan & Brenda Leonard

2/15/03 07:12:

> Never thought about braiding. I'll have to try
> that. Wish I knew how to french braid.

It's not all that tough, as long as its not on your own head. I have
trouble doing my own, but I can do someone else's.

There are books written to teach different kinds of braiding. Klutz press
makes a really good (and expensive) one, but you can probably find one in
the library. The best one I have is probably 50 years old and cost me 25
cents at the thrift shop one day.

brenda
who hopes everyone noticed she actually changed the subject line, and even
to the "right" thing this time!

kayb85 <[email protected]>

American Girl and Klutz both make books showing you how to do
different kinds of braids.
Sheila

--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 2/15/2003 12:58:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> mummyone24@h... writes:
>
>
> > . Wish I knew how to french braid.
> >
> You *could* ask a hairdresser---but if you find an equestrian---now
THERE's
> your serious braider! Go to a barn or tack shop---they love to show
off. And
> if you come to SC, I'll show you how!
>
> ~Kelly
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mary Bianco

>From: SandraDodd@...

<<I can't do it on my own head, but can do it on other people's. It's not
too hard. I bet there are even useable instructions on line.>>>


Yes, I was so into the idea last night that I searched and found
instructions with pictures and all. Who would have thunk it??!! It doesn't
look that hard at all. Think I will give it a try. Thanks for the idea
ladies.

Mary B


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