Re: The EVILS of Exercises for Mindful Parenting /Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] I...
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/2/03 10:01:48 AM Pacific Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
understood why she did what she did, even when it appeared to be "bad". Even
selfishness comes from a real human need. Now I have to explain this concept
to HER when dealing with her brother!
When Lanora was three we were her friend's birthday party. The people
attending were primarily from church. One woman, an avid spanker, came to me
insisting that I start spanking Lanora because she was becoming a brat.
Evidently Lanora had yelled at this woman's mother, "You get out of here!!"
Without seeing your child as whole and perfect the knee jerk reaction would
be to assume the worst. Instead, I simply ASKED why. She had recently
learned about "stranger danger" and had been told that if she was approached
by a stranger and couldn't get to an adult she trusted that she should yell
at them to go away.
The woman, someone Lanora didn't know, came up to her while she was standing
inside a play structure. She couldn't get out and run to me so she did what
she had heard. Real simple, no rudeness, no evil "sin" nature, no need for
correction of any kind.
I've seen so many parents in church accuse their kids, refuse to hear any
explanation and then punish. These are the same people who look at me like
I've got two heads when I BELIEVE my kids. They can't conceive of trusting
their own children! I don't hang around these people any more.
Okay, I'm too sad now.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> << Practice seeing your children as perfect just the way they are. See ifI know I was taught different but I always saw Lanora as perfect. I
> you can stay mindful of their sovereignty from moment to moment >>
>
> That's blasphemy for Christians.
>
understood why she did what she did, even when it appeared to be "bad". Even
selfishness comes from a real human need. Now I have to explain this concept
to HER when dealing with her brother!
When Lanora was three we were her friend's birthday party. The people
attending were primarily from church. One woman, an avid spanker, came to me
insisting that I start spanking Lanora because she was becoming a brat.
Evidently Lanora had yelled at this woman's mother, "You get out of here!!"
Without seeing your child as whole and perfect the knee jerk reaction would
be to assume the worst. Instead, I simply ASKED why. She had recently
learned about "stranger danger" and had been told that if she was approached
by a stranger and couldn't get to an adult she trusted that she should yell
at them to go away.
The woman, someone Lanora didn't know, came up to her while she was standing
inside a play structure. She couldn't get out and run to me so she did what
she had heard. Real simple, no rudeness, no evil "sin" nature, no need for
correction of any kind.
I've seen so many parents in church accuse their kids, refuse to hear any
explanation and then punish. These are the same people who look at me like
I've got two heads when I BELIEVE my kids. They can't conceive of trusting
their own children! I don't hang around these people any more.
Okay, I'm too sad now.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Barb Eaton
I'mm join you there Kris. It's really sad. People don't generally lie
unless they are cornered. If you want to honestly know how you look, sound,
etc ask a child.
Sandra I just couldn't bring myself to even look. :-(
Barb E
"We live in a wonderful world that is full of beauty,
charm and adventure. There is no end to the adventures
that we can have if only we seek them with our eyes open."
- Jawaharlal Nehru, Prime Minister of India
on 2/2/03 3:05 PM, louisaem@... at louisaem@... wrote:
unless they are cornered. If you want to honestly know how you look, sound,
etc ask a child.
Sandra I just couldn't bring myself to even look. :-(
Barb E
"We live in a wonderful world that is full of beauty,
charm and adventure. There is no end to the adventures
that we can have if only we seek them with our eyes open."
- Jawaharlal Nehru, Prime Minister of India
on 2/2/03 3:05 PM, louisaem@... at louisaem@... wrote:
>
> Okay, I'm too sad now.
>
> Kris
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/2/03 1:06:49 PM, louisaem@... writes:
<< I don't hang around these people any more.
Okay, I'm too sad now.
Don't look at the sadness. Look at the many people you and your daughter
will meet who will see your relationship and reconsider their own.
I had a friend I'd known for years before either of us had children. She has
not excuse for spanking but that she's just controlling and mean. Although
she has fundamentalist ancestors (grandparents and beyond there), she was
raised "logically" and scientifically. And they had saved in their set of
logical "facts" that if you didn't spank kids they would be bad.
So when Kirby was being absolutely normal and curious and active, and her
daughter was sitting right where they had told her to sit and being quiet
they way they told her to be, they wanted me to spank Kirby.
The main purpose was so that they were justified.
They would have been happy for me to hurt Kirby to make their daughter feel
better about her sitting still to avoid a spanking.
Isn't that sad?
Our friendship started to fail then.
She told me that Kirby was going to grow up to hit me.
That didn't happen.
Current situation is her kids are cynical and frustrated and mean and I have
been told by a mutual friend that her son (Marty's age) has actually hit her
at least once.
My kids are happy and peaceable and generous.
We both had choices. I asked her several times to think about homeschooling.
She said she might homeschool when they were older. But by the time they
were older the dad had shot himself in the head and she had to work fulltime.
More happiness sooner could have turned their lives around HUGELY.
The dozen+ families who knew both my family AND that family have a no-brainer
display of whether being gentle with little kids can turn out well, and
whether spanking guarantees good teen behavior. And more. It took a while
to set the tableaux up for them, and I'm sad that it involved a death, but
twelve, fourteen years after the parting of ways, we are making serious
differences in MANY lives.
Sandra
<< I don't hang around these people any more.
Okay, I'm too sad now.
>>OH NO!
Don't look at the sadness. Look at the many people you and your daughter
will meet who will see your relationship and reconsider their own.
I had a friend I'd known for years before either of us had children. She has
not excuse for spanking but that she's just controlling and mean. Although
she has fundamentalist ancestors (grandparents and beyond there), she was
raised "logically" and scientifically. And they had saved in their set of
logical "facts" that if you didn't spank kids they would be bad.
So when Kirby was being absolutely normal and curious and active, and her
daughter was sitting right where they had told her to sit and being quiet
they way they told her to be, they wanted me to spank Kirby.
The main purpose was so that they were justified.
They would have been happy for me to hurt Kirby to make their daughter feel
better about her sitting still to avoid a spanking.
Isn't that sad?
Our friendship started to fail then.
She told me that Kirby was going to grow up to hit me.
That didn't happen.
Current situation is her kids are cynical and frustrated and mean and I have
been told by a mutual friend that her son (Marty's age) has actually hit her
at least once.
My kids are happy and peaceable and generous.
We both had choices. I asked her several times to think about homeschooling.
She said she might homeschool when they were older. But by the time they
were older the dad had shot himself in the head and she had to work fulltime.
More happiness sooner could have turned their lives around HUGELY.
The dozen+ families who knew both my family AND that family have a no-brainer
display of whether being gentle with little kids can turn out well, and
whether spanking guarantees good teen behavior. And more. It took a while
to set the tableaux up for them, and I'm sad that it involved a death, but
twelve, fourteen years after the parting of ways, we are making serious
differences in MANY lives.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/2/03 12:31:06 PM Pacific Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
think of the relationships I had and how this "doctrine" of spanking has been
made such a cornerstone. I'm sad about the relationships that have been lost
over this issue. I'm even more sad about the kids I've seen lost once they
were old enough to throw off the control of their parents. Most of them go
off the deep end.
It's so weird! It was obvious to everyone near us how wonderful Lanora was.
She was bright, friendly, well spoken, related easily with adults and was
responsive to my words. All of this and people STILL told me I needed to
spank her. I asked them "Why would I? Do you think her behavior could be
any better?" They agreed with how great she was but I guess they thought I
should just schedule spankings, needed or not.
It got me to question a lot of things and that has been good. I just wish I
could get all of the "punishment" mind set out of my head. It's a long
learning curve for me I guess, the doubts make it hard to stay on course.
I'm thankful for this list and those who hold up the standard so I can't
forget where I'm going.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> OH NO!Thanks Sandra, you're right and do see it that way. I just get sad when I
>
> Don't look at the sadness. Look at the many people you and your daughter
> will meet who will see your relationship and reconsider their own.
>
think of the relationships I had and how this "doctrine" of spanking has been
made such a cornerstone. I'm sad about the relationships that have been lost
over this issue. I'm even more sad about the kids I've seen lost once they
were old enough to throw off the control of their parents. Most of them go
off the deep end.
It's so weird! It was obvious to everyone near us how wonderful Lanora was.
She was bright, friendly, well spoken, related easily with adults and was
responsive to my words. All of this and people STILL told me I needed to
spank her. I asked them "Why would I? Do you think her behavior could be
any better?" They agreed with how great she was but I guess they thought I
should just schedule spankings, needed or not.
It got me to question a lot of things and that has been good. I just wish I
could get all of the "punishment" mind set out of my head. It's a long
learning curve for me I guess, the doubts make it hard to stay on course.
I'm thankful for this list and those who hold up the standard so I can't
forget where I'm going.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelli Traaseth
louisaem@... wrote: ** These are the same people who look at me like
I've got two heads when I BELIEVE my kids. They can't conceive of trusting
their own children! I don't hang around these people any more.
Okay, I'm too sad now.**
Kris,
it is sad and it is hard, I know how you are feeling. Lots of transition around our circle of friends too. I just keep hoping that as these friends go, new ones will come that will be more accepting and similar in their parenting styles.
Kelli
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I've got two heads when I BELIEVE my kids. They can't conceive of trusting
their own children! I don't hang around these people any more.
Okay, I'm too sad now.**
Kris,
it is sad and it is hard, I know how you are feeling. Lots of transition around our circle of friends too. I just keep hoping that as these friends go, new ones will come that will be more accepting and similar in their parenting styles.
Kelli
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
I was thinking about this last night.
A good friend of mine and I have sons that are similar in many ways. We were supposed to take a trip together. Our boys have never met though, and we've never done anything like that before.
She and I are very different in how we parent, etc. It turned out we couldn't go on the trip anyway, but I was glad because after thinking about it, I realized it very well could have been a disaster. She would have seen some things in my son that she would have "disciplined" and I would have handled it much differently than she does.
She talks about her son all the time and I do understand her frustration, but I think she needs to change the way she thinks about him.
Anyway, the only way I seem to be able to maintain many of these kinds of friendships is just not to talk about what I do or how I do it, and not to have our kids spend time together, or at least under certain circumstances. I share very little of my philosophy with these people.
Its not hard in this case because we are co-workers so we see each other there without having to get together outside of work. But I also have friends of all kinds everywhere, and there are just some people who I count as a friend but not the kind of friend I would share things with. There are just different kinds of friends I guess.
Its amazing to me to listen to some of these people though. When I told my hacker story, the first thing they jumped on was why an 11 year old would be online chatting in the first place (sigh). I've met really wonderful people online and spent time at their HOMES! Why would I deny that to my children? It expands their universe and their cultural experience to meet people this way.
So many people have bought into a deeper philsophy, not just about education, not just about spanking or "training a child" but the idea that children are really little more than animals (though none of them would ever use "animal" to describe their child's intelligence). People just cannot conceive that children would have intelligent thinking even at their young ages and that it is *good* to support and encourage that.
Someone asked me last night why I homeschool. Turned out he was a college history prof. but I didn't know that right away. I told him it wasn't the teachers necessarily, and we liked family time together, but I want my kids to have a real opinion on things...even if it differs with authority.
He asked if I was prepping them for SAT's. I said I didn't know yet, that I have a philosophical problem with testing (and why). I told a stranger more in that 5 minutes than I've told my co-workers in 15 years LOL.
Kristen
A good friend of mine and I have sons that are similar in many ways. We were supposed to take a trip together. Our boys have never met though, and we've never done anything like that before.
She and I are very different in how we parent, etc. It turned out we couldn't go on the trip anyway, but I was glad because after thinking about it, I realized it very well could have been a disaster. She would have seen some things in my son that she would have "disciplined" and I would have handled it much differently than she does.
She talks about her son all the time and I do understand her frustration, but I think she needs to change the way she thinks about him.
Anyway, the only way I seem to be able to maintain many of these kinds of friendships is just not to talk about what I do or how I do it, and not to have our kids spend time together, or at least under certain circumstances. I share very little of my philosophy with these people.
Its not hard in this case because we are co-workers so we see each other there without having to get together outside of work. But I also have friends of all kinds everywhere, and there are just some people who I count as a friend but not the kind of friend I would share things with. There are just different kinds of friends I guess.
Its amazing to me to listen to some of these people though. When I told my hacker story, the first thing they jumped on was why an 11 year old would be online chatting in the first place (sigh). I've met really wonderful people online and spent time at their HOMES! Why would I deny that to my children? It expands their universe and their cultural experience to meet people this way.
So many people have bought into a deeper philsophy, not just about education, not just about spanking or "training a child" but the idea that children are really little more than animals (though none of them would ever use "animal" to describe their child's intelligence). People just cannot conceive that children would have intelligent thinking even at their young ages and that it is *good* to support and encourage that.
Someone asked me last night why I homeschool. Turned out he was a college history prof. but I didn't know that right away. I told him it wasn't the teachers necessarily, and we liked family time together, but I want my kids to have a real opinion on things...even if it differs with authority.
He asked if I was prepping them for SAT's. I said I didn't know yet, that I have a philosophical problem with testing (and why). I told a stranger more in that 5 minutes than I've told my co-workers in 15 years LOL.
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: louisaem@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 2:28 AM
Subject: Re: The EVILS of Exercises for Mindful Parenting /Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] I...
In a message dated 2/2/03 12:31:06 PM Pacific Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
> OH NO!
>
> Don't look at the sadness. Look at the many people you and your daughter
> will meet who will see your relationship and reconsider their own.
>
Thanks Sandra, you're right and do see it that way. I just get sad when I
think of the relationships I had and how this "doctrine" of spanking has been
made such a cornerstone. I'm sad about the relationships that have been lost
over this issue. I'm even more sad about the kids I've seen lost once they
were old enough to throw off the control of their parents. Most of them go
off the deep end.
It's so weird! It was obvious to everyone near us how wonderful Lanora was.
She was bright, friendly, well spoken, related easily with adults and was
responsive to my words. All of this and people STILL told me I needed to
spank her. I asked them "Why would I? Do you think her behavior could be
any better?" They agreed with how great she was but I guess they thought I
should just schedule spankings, needed or not.
It got me to question a lot of things and that has been good. I just wish I
could get all of the "punishment" mind set out of my head. It's a long
learning curve for me I guess, the doubts make it hard to stay on course.
I'm thankful for this list and those who hold up the standard so I can't
forget where I'm going.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
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Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/3/03 11:06:51 AM, litlrooh@... writes:
<< He asked if I was prepping them for SAT's. I said I didn't know yet, that
I have a philosophical problem with testing (and why). I told a stranger
more in that 5 minutes than I've told my co-workers in 15 years LOL. >>
Was his response good?
<<So many people have bought into a deeper philsophy, not just about
education, not just about spanking or "training a child" but the idea that
children are really little more than animals (though none of them would ever
use "animal" to describe their child's intelligence). People just cannot
conceive that children would have intelligent thinking even at their young
ages and that it is *good* to support and encourage that.>>
I know. It's almost as though in some families if a young child shows real
thought, they get hosed down like on Planet of the Apes.
Sandra
<< He asked if I was prepping them for SAT's. I said I didn't know yet, that
I have a philosophical problem with testing (and why). I told a stranger
more in that 5 minutes than I've told my co-workers in 15 years LOL. >>
Was his response good?
<<So many people have bought into a deeper philsophy, not just about
education, not just about spanking or "training a child" but the idea that
children are really little more than animals (though none of them would ever
use "animal" to describe their child's intelligence). People just cannot
conceive that children would have intelligent thinking even at their young
ages and that it is *good* to support and encourage that.>>
I know. It's almost as though in some families if a young child shows real
thought, they get hosed down like on Planet of the Apes.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/3/03 10:06:50 AM Pacific Standard Time,
litlrooh@... writes:
friendships as Jonathan gets older. Right now, where I am - he is. He can't
bear being away from me and that's fine. My dearest friend just happens to
be the mother of Jonathan's best friend. God is watching out for me.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
litlrooh@... writes:
> Anyway, the only way I seem to be able to maintain many of these kinds ofThat's good and I'm sure I will be able to establish these kinds of
> friendships is just not to talk about what I do or how I do it, and not to
> have our kids spend time together, or at least under certain circumstances.
> I share very little of my philosophy with these people.
>
friendships as Jonathan gets older. Right now, where I am - he is. He can't
bear being away from me and that's fine. My dearest friend just happens to
be the mother of Jonathan's best friend. God is watching out for me.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
In a message dated 2/3/03 11:06:51 AM, litlrooh@... writes:
<< He asked if I was prepping them for SAT's. I said I didn't know yet, that
I have a philosophical problem with testing (and why). I told a stranger
more in that 5 minutes than I've told my co-workers in 15 years LOL. >>
Was his response good?
Well....actually it was. But he did say that if my kids ever want to get into any good (selective) college
they'll HAVE to have good SAT's whether we like it or not. He was very nice and I think his point had more to do with his thought that reality dictates their necessity, not that testing is a poor way to evaluate learning. I don't think he's ever really run into a situation where he's *had* to think about how to get around it. And if the circumstances had been different, I might have talked more about that. He was a family member visiting a patient that I had, and circumstances were such that I did not want to cause any distress. He *DID* say that the university where he teaches doesn't use SAT's though, and I thought that was interesting.
He teaches in West Virginia I think.
But, at that point, I started using my "evasive" tactics then (aka diplomacy LOL) and said that I have been reading up on it and that I think I"ve found some ways around it. I also mentioned that I wasn't quite sure which direction my kids were going to take yet so it wasn't really an issue quite yet.
In my favor though, the reason we began talking was bec. he was watching a Benedict Arnold movie and telling me how the movie has it all wrong, etc. We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about them (but couldn't remember their names). And then we got to talking about Jefferson and I said "oh yeah, he's the one who was sort of the aristocrat but believed that every man should have a vote, and not be overun by aristrocracy.
From there we got into a lively discussion about history, students, education, etc etc. And the SAT kind of fell by the wayside...but he did say he was impressed that a nurse would know this information when his political science majors and History majors do not.
We also talked about learning and some of the books I've chosen to have around the house...some of the ones we've read.
Overall, I think we agreed on more than we would have disagreed on. I *really* enjoyed the discussion and I know he did too. Its so neat to see someone come alive with their passion like that and it was very affirming to be able to say "I never learned this stuff in school, but I'm learning it now with my kids". We had so much to talk about. We talked about the constitution and declaration, etc etc. and I told him how I finally understood how the constitution came to be when I read it side by side with the declaration and how we had never done that in school.
I even shared that I was involved in the legislative effort here in PA and that the legislators on the ed commmittee don't even know what is in the PA constitution (sad isn't it!).
The whole family was such a neat neat family. I wish I knew them better.
Kristen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<< He asked if I was prepping them for SAT's. I said I didn't know yet, that
I have a philosophical problem with testing (and why). I told a stranger
more in that 5 minutes than I've told my co-workers in 15 years LOL. >>
Was his response good?
Well....actually it was. But he did say that if my kids ever want to get into any good (selective) college
they'll HAVE to have good SAT's whether we like it or not. He was very nice and I think his point had more to do with his thought that reality dictates their necessity, not that testing is a poor way to evaluate learning. I don't think he's ever really run into a situation where he's *had* to think about how to get around it. And if the circumstances had been different, I might have talked more about that. He was a family member visiting a patient that I had, and circumstances were such that I did not want to cause any distress. He *DID* say that the university where he teaches doesn't use SAT's though, and I thought that was interesting.
He teaches in West Virginia I think.
But, at that point, I started using my "evasive" tactics then (aka diplomacy LOL) and said that I have been reading up on it and that I think I"ve found some ways around it. I also mentioned that I wasn't quite sure which direction my kids were going to take yet so it wasn't really an issue quite yet.
In my favor though, the reason we began talking was bec. he was watching a Benedict Arnold movie and telling me how the movie has it all wrong, etc. We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about them (but couldn't remember their names). And then we got to talking about Jefferson and I said "oh yeah, he's the one who was sort of the aristocrat but believed that every man should have a vote, and not be overun by aristrocracy.
From there we got into a lively discussion about history, students, education, etc etc. And the SAT kind of fell by the wayside...but he did say he was impressed that a nurse would know this information when his political science majors and History majors do not.
We also talked about learning and some of the books I've chosen to have around the house...some of the ones we've read.
Overall, I think we agreed on more than we would have disagreed on. I *really* enjoyed the discussion and I know he did too. Its so neat to see someone come alive with their passion like that and it was very affirming to be able to say "I never learned this stuff in school, but I'm learning it now with my kids". We had so much to talk about. We talked about the constitution and declaration, etc etc. and I told him how I finally understood how the constitution came to be when I read it side by side with the declaration and how we had never done that in school.
I even shared that I was involved in the legislative effort here in PA and that the legislators on the ed commmittee don't even know what is in the PA constitution (sad isn't it!).
The whole family was such a neat neat family. I wish I knew them better.
Kristen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/3/03 2:31:01 PM, litlrooh@... writes:
<< We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know
about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about
them (but couldn't remember their names). >>
whigs and whirlygigs?
tories and toreadors?
Something. <g>
<< We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know
about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about
them (but couldn't remember their names). >>
whigs and whirlygigs?
tories and toreadors?
Something. <g>
coyote's corner
Isn't it Whigs and Tories?
Coyotes Corner
Very Cool Stuff for the World
<www.coyotescorner.com>
-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@... [mailto:SandraDodd@...]
Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 5:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: The EVILS of Exercises for Mindful Parenting /Re:
[Unschooling-dotcom] I...
In a message dated 2/3/03 2:31:01 PM, litlrooh@... writes:
<< We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know
about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about
them (but couldn't remember their names). >>
whigs and whirlygigs?
tories and toreadors?
Something. <g>
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the
moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner,
Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an
email to:
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Coyotes Corner
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-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@... [mailto:SandraDodd@...]
Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 5:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: The EVILS of Exercises for Mindful Parenting /Re:
[Unschooling-dotcom] I...
In a message dated 2/3/03 2:31:01 PM, litlrooh@... writes:
<< We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know
about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about
them (but couldn't remember their names). >>
whigs and whirlygigs?
tories and toreadors?
Something. <g>
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Have a Nice Day!
LOL..
It was Federalists and Republicans. Then it was Whigs and I forget what else, maybe "Democratic republicans"?
Kristen
It was Federalists and Republicans. Then it was Whigs and I forget what else, maybe "Democratic republicans"?
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: coyote's corner
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 9:35 AM
Subject: RE: The EVILS of Exercises for Mindful Parenting /Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] I...
Isn't it Whigs and Tories?
Coyotes Corner
Very Cool Stuff for the World
<www.coyotescorner.com>
-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@... [mailto:SandraDodd@...]
Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 5:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: The EVILS of Exercises for Mindful Parenting /Re:
[Unschooling-dotcom] I...
In a message dated 2/3/03 2:31:01 PM, litlrooh@... writes:
<< We got to talking about history and he said his students often don't know
about the names of the two original political parties, etc. I knew about
them (but couldn't remember their names). >>
whigs and whirlygigs?
tories and toreadors?
Something. <g>
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the
moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner,
Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
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Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]