Spanking for eternity
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/23/03 11:14:08 AM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< When people spank because their pastors and friends and paid speakers and
books all tell them it's their duty to their children and their God, that to
not spank their children is to withhold love from them, it's disingenious
for
others to say that it's not because they're conservative Christian. >>
My sister had decided long ago that they would not spank or be punitive about
their children acting up in church. She figured it would only make them hate
the message....so when they were noisy/wiggly/ normal kids, she simply let
them for a while and if they got disruptive or couldn't calm down with a
simply "shhhh", she would take them out (so as not to disrupt others) and
walk with them or something calming.
They were fairly disruptive, as they are high energy kids, but it wasn't
anything major.
She wasn't beating them into submission like other families in our church
though, so two of the female ministers scheduled a "visit" with her and her
dh.
It was quite a visit. I thought my bil was going to strangle both of them
when I hear about it later.
He told them in no uncertain terms that it was none of their business and
that they ought to be talking to the families that hit their children for
every little noise they made.
It is unfortunately a huge conservative christian issue.
That doesn't mean it is only a Christian problem, it IS anger and skill
related of course.
But most other parents can get nonspanking support, it isn't readily
available within conservative christian realms....it's encouraged and even
pushed.
Ren
"The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
complicated ones aren't."
"Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
[email protected] writes:
<< When people spank because their pastors and friends and paid speakers and
books all tell them it's their duty to their children and their God, that to
not spank their children is to withhold love from them, it's disingenious
for
others to say that it's not because they're conservative Christian. >>
My sister had decided long ago that they would not spank or be punitive about
their children acting up in church. She figured it would only make them hate
the message....so when they were noisy/wiggly/ normal kids, she simply let
them for a while and if they got disruptive or couldn't calm down with a
simply "shhhh", she would take them out (so as not to disrupt others) and
walk with them or something calming.
They were fairly disruptive, as they are high energy kids, but it wasn't
anything major.
She wasn't beating them into submission like other families in our church
though, so two of the female ministers scheduled a "visit" with her and her
dh.
It was quite a visit. I thought my bil was going to strangle both of them
when I hear about it later.
He told them in no uncertain terms that it was none of their business and
that they ought to be talking to the families that hit their children for
every little noise they made.
It is unfortunately a huge conservative christian issue.
That doesn't mean it is only a Christian problem, it IS anger and skill
related of course.
But most other parents can get nonspanking support, it isn't readily
available within conservative christian realms....it's encouraged and even
pushed.
Ren
"The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
complicated ones aren't."
"Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
ed hodgins
----- Original Message -----
From: <starsuncloud@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 1:57 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Spanking for eternity
> In a message dated 1/23/03 11:14:08 AM Central Standard Time,
> [email protected] writes:
>
> << When people spank because their pastors and friends and paid speakers
and
> books all tell them it's their duty to their children and their God, that
to
> not spank their children is to withhold love from them, it's disingenious
> for
> others to say that it's not because they're conservative Christian. >>
>
> My sister had decided long ago that they would not spank or be punitive
about
> their children acting up in church. She figured it would only make them
hate
> the message....so when they were noisy/wiggly/ normal kids, she simply let
> them for a while and if they got disruptive or couldn't calm down with a
> simply "shhhh", she would take them out (so as not to disrupt others) and
> walk with them or something calming.
>
> They were fairly disruptive, as they are high energy kids, but it wasn't
> anything major.
> She wasn't beating them into submission like other families in our church
> though, so two of the female ministers scheduled a "visit" with her and
her
> dh.
> It was quite a visit. I thought my bil was going to strangle both of them
> when I hear about it later.
> He told them in no uncertain terms that it was none of their business and
> that they ought to be talking to the families that hit their children for
> every little noise they made.
> It is unfortunately a huge conservative christian issue.
> That doesn't mean it is only a Christian problem, it IS anger and skill
> related of course.
> But most other parents can get nonspanking support, it isn't readily
> available within conservative christian realms....it's encouraged and even
> pushed.
>
> Ren
> "The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
> people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
> complicated ones aren't."
> "Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
>
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>
> I group up with my mom and step dad until I was 16. My biological parents
werent married. I was told about my dad at 16 yrs . Shortly after I met him.
I moved in with him due to favortism over a step sister. His discipline was
spanking or grounding. I moved in with my biological dad and found out there
were other better ways to deal with fustrations and problems. Communication
can go a long way.
My step dad hasnt changed his ways but I have now that my children are
18mths and 2. Time outs are working so far and taking things or priveleges.
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/23/03 6:46:16 PM, ed.hodgins@... writes:
<< My step dad hasnt changed his ways but I have now that my children are
18mths and 2. Time outs are working so far and taking things or priveleges. >>
Hang around here and we can help you find ways to avoid even time-outs or
removal of privileges!
Sandra
<< My step dad hasnt changed his ways but I have now that my children are
18mths and 2. Time outs are working so far and taking things or priveleges. >>
Hang around here and we can help you find ways to avoid even time-outs or
removal of privileges!
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/23/03 9:43:49 PM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< My step dad hasnt changed his ways but I have now that my children are
18mths and 2. Time outs are working so far and taking things or priveleges.
And with an 18month and 2 y.o. there is no way they will understand why
you're taking something away, it only sets you up for problems later.
Distraction works best at that age.
Ren
"The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
complicated ones aren't."
"Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
[email protected] writes:
<< My step dad hasnt changed his ways but I have now that my children are
18mths and 2. Time outs are working so far and taking things or priveleges.
>>These are still punishment oriented methods. Not as effective.
And with an 18month and 2 y.o. there is no way they will understand why
you're taking something away, it only sets you up for problems later.
Distraction works best at that age.
Ren
"The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
complicated ones aren't."
"Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/23/03 10:58:45 AM Pacific Standard Time,
starsuncloud@... writes:
given many dire predictions, mainly that she would grow up to be a brat. The
fact that she was honest, calm, polite, enjoyed being with me and other
adults only seemed to make it worse.
Unschooling and the progression towards no punishment eventually made it
almost impossible for me to continue in the company of these people. It was
a good move in the long run, I've since found dear friends who have made my
life and Lanora's so much richer, some christians, some just spiritual.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
starsuncloud@... writes:
> But most other parents can get nonspanking support, it isn't readilyAbsolutely true. I was hounded for years because I didn't spank Lanora, was
> available within conservative christian realms....it's encouraged and even
> pushed.
>
> Ren
>
given many dire predictions, mainly that she would grow up to be a brat. The
fact that she was honest, calm, polite, enjoyed being with me and other
adults only seemed to make it worse.
Unschooling and the progression towards no punishment eventually made it
almost impossible for me to continue in the company of these people. It was
a good move in the long run, I've since found dear friends who have made my
life and Lanora's so much richer, some christians, some just spiritual.
Kris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/24/03 9:55:15 AM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< I'm not saying all fundamentalists are like that. Only that those with that
type of personality will be drawn to fundamentalism. And those who are drawn
because they need to feel a part of a community that holds the "right"
answers will easily be persuaded to spank their children. >>
Ah, but don't forget those whose personalities would NOT be drawn to it, but
were raised in it and heavily brainwashed.
I don't believe my personality is one that would naturally be drawn to
fundamentalism.
Yet it took me until just the last couple of years to disentangle myself from
the church I grew up in. Mind control is powerful stuff.
And when you're raised in a church that your ENTIRE family believes is THE
way, it is more than church you're walking away from. Many people don't have
the strength it takes to walk away from family, extended family and friends
they've had their entire lives.
Not all churches are just another church. Some are very much like your family
and entire network of support. It's like being Amish, you don't just walk
away without huge repurcussions.
I am on a support group for former members and I hear daily of the anguish it
has caused in many lives.
Some of these folks have no contact with their families over it, how many are
still in because they're too scared to walk away from their families? Sad
stuff.
Ren
"The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
complicated ones aren't."
"Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
[email protected] writes:
<< I'm not saying all fundamentalists are like that. Only that those with that
type of personality will be drawn to fundamentalism. And those who are drawn
because they need to feel a part of a community that holds the "right"
answers will easily be persuaded to spank their children. >>
Ah, but don't forget those whose personalities would NOT be drawn to it, but
were raised in it and heavily brainwashed.
I don't believe my personality is one that would naturally be drawn to
fundamentalism.
Yet it took me until just the last couple of years to disentangle myself from
the church I grew up in. Mind control is powerful stuff.
And when you're raised in a church that your ENTIRE family believes is THE
way, it is more than church you're walking away from. Many people don't have
the strength it takes to walk away from family, extended family and friends
they've had their entire lives.
Not all churches are just another church. Some are very much like your family
and entire network of support. It's like being Amish, you don't just walk
away without huge repurcussions.
I am on a support group for former members and I hear daily of the anguish it
has caused in many lives.
Some of these folks have no contact with their families over it, how many are
still in because they're too scared to walk away from their families? Sad
stuff.
Ren
"The world's much smaller than you think. Made up of two kinds of
people--simple and complicated.....The simple ones are contented. The
complicated ones aren't."
"Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com
Bill and Diane
A great book I've found for learning about this is _The Discipline Book_
by Sears. They talk about what kids can and can't be expected to do and
to learn from.
:-) Diane
by Sears. They talk about what kids can and can't be expected to do and
to learn from.
:-) Diane
><< My step dad hasnt changed his ways but I have now that my children are
> 18mths and 2. Time outs are working so far and taking things or priveleges.
>
>
>These are still punishment oriented methods. Not as effective.
>And with an 18month and 2 y.o. there is no way they will understand why
>you're taking something away, it only sets you up for problems later.
>Distraction works best at that age.
>
Pam Hartley
----------
Christians spank" because I missed it and my re-reading of the archives
doesn't find it.
Pam
>From: [email protected]Please show me the exact post where someone said, "Only conservative
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Digest Number 2932
>Date: Sun, Jan 26, 2003, 9:34 AM
>
>> Nobody ever said that only conservative Christians spank, but as
> far as I
>> know they are the only ones who've made an industry from it.
>>
>> Pam
>
> Someone did. That's how this entire thread started.
Christians spank" because I missed it and my re-reading of the archives
doesn't find it.
Pam