bluelotus

>>OH.. NOT BIG BIRD.. My kids loved (and still love) Sesame St
>>
>>
>Well they shouldn't. Big Bird is the voice of the government.
>He will only
>pass on the values the government wants all its citizens to adhere to.
>
Sorry if I missed something here, but are you saying that you wouldn't
let your kids watch Sesame Street if they wanted to?
I understand Holt's take on it, and yours as well, but I am just
wondering how do you handle things like this, which may go against your
values and ideals, in the context of unschooling?

Yol

--

Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com

Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org

**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 2:23:54 PM Eastern Standard Time,
bluelotus@... writes:

> >>OH.. NOT BIG BIRD.. My kids loved (and still love) Sesame St
> >>
> >>
> >Well they shouldn't. Big Bird is the voice of the government.
> >He will only
> >pass on the values the government wants all its citizens to adhere to.
> >
> Sorry if I missed something here, but are you saying that you wouldn't
> let your kids watch Sesame Street if they wanted to?
> I understand Holt's take on it, and yours as well, but I am just
> wondering how do you handle things like this, which may go against your
> values and ideals, in the context of unschooling?
>
> Yol
>

Yol,
I couldnt really tell if that message was just a joke or meant to be taken
literally either. ??? Sometimes it's hard for me to read through the lines
too. I know my kids watch Sesame St ( or at least they did a lot more when
they were little) I could care less what anyone thinks about it politically
or otherwise. I made a little joke in response to that post ( So, Big Bird
is really Big Brother?) but no one replied.. so I thought that maybe it
wasnt intended as a joke ( the original post I mean).. Who knows..

Teresa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 2:30:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, grlynbl@...
writes:

> Yol,
> I couldnt really tell if that message was just a joke or meant to be taken
> literally either. ??? Sometimes it's hard for me to read through the
> lines
> too. I know my kids watch Sesame St ( or at least they did a lot more when
>
> they were little) I could care less what anyone thinks about it
> politically
> or otherwise. I made a little joke in response to that post ( So, Big Bird
>
> is really Big Brother?) but no one replied.. so I thought that maybe it
> wasnt intended as a joke ( the original post I mean).. Who knows..
>
> Teresa
>
>
>
Why not ask?
Elissa

*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 2:30:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, grlynbl@...
writes:

> Yol,
> I couldnt really tell if that message was just a joke or meant to be taken
> literally either. ??? Sometimes it's hard for me to read through the
> lines
> too. I know my kids watch Sesame St ( or at least they did a lot more when
>
> they were little) I could care less what anyone thinks about it
> politically
> or otherwise. I made a little joke in response to that post ( So, Big Bird
>
> is really Big Brother?) but no one replied.. so I thought that maybe it
> wasnt intended as a joke ( the original post I mean).. Who knows..
>
> Teresa
>
>
>

Woops, I wasn't done!
Why not ask? Hey Joyce, I think you said that about Big Bird, right? Can you
go on a little?
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 2:39:04 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Earthmomma67@... writes:

> Hey Joyce, I think you said that about Big Bird, right? Can you
> go on a little?
>

Yeah, Joyce said that, but I had replied my "OH NO NOT Big Bird" statement to
something Sandra had said about Ned going around bashing Big Bird.. So, I
just wasnt sure of the intention of Joyces reply.. . But, yeah, Im interested
in knowing if it was a "real" opinion of hers, or just a tongue in cheek
comeback..

Teresa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 12:42:47 PM, grlynbl@... writes:

<< Yeah, Joyce said that, but I had replied my "OH NO NOT Big Bird" statement
to
something Sandra had said about Ned going around bashing Big Bird.. >>

I didn't mention Big Bird. I mentioned teachers and schools.

Joyce voiced one of Ned's opinions without saying it was Ned.
I don't believe Joyce agrees with the radical opinion that Big Bird is an
agent of the evil government.

The Big Brother has to do with the government watching individuals in their
homes. There's no way for Big Bird to do that in any incarnation, so that's
probably why people didn't respond.

Many comments are made which get no response. It's common and commentary on
that or explanations of why responses weren't made aren't productive to the
unschooling discussions.

My kids loved Sesame Street, learned lots from it, still sings songs from it,
Holly still watches it... Holly, Keith and I sang a really old Bert & Ernie
song at the music party last Friday which we have on a sing-along tape.

Sandra

Karin

> Sorry if I missed something here, but are you saying that you wouldn't
> let your kids watch Sesame Street if they wanted to?
> I understand Holt's take on it, and yours as well, but I am just
> wondering how do you handle things like this, which may go against your
> values and ideals, in the context of unschooling?
>
> Yol


No, this was Ned's view about Sesame Street.
I'm not sure, but I don't think the conversation took place on this group.
If you are a member of HEM-Unschooling, go into that group's messages and do
a search on "Sesame Street" You will find a thread about Sesame Street and
Ned's viewpoint - as well as others.

Karin

bluelotus

>
>
>> Sorry if I missed something here, but are you saying that you wouldn't
>> let your kids watch Sesame Street if they wanted to?
>> I understand Holt's take on it, and yours as well, but I am just
>> wondering how do you handle things like this, which may go against your
>> values and ideals, in the context of unschooling?
>>
>> Yol
>
>
<< No, this was Ned's view about Sesame Street.
I'm not sure, but I don't think the conversation took place on this group.
If you are a member of HEM-Unschooling, go into that group's messages and do
a search on "Sesame Street" You will find a thread about Sesame Street and
Ned's viewpoint - as well as others.>>

Thanks. I am not really interested in the topic of Big Bird, nor Ned's (or anyone's) take on it. My question was geared toward how to handle stuff that you may consider going against your values or ideals within the context of unschooling. Joyce's post on Big Bird simply triggered my question.

Yol

--

Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com

Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org

**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************

Fetteroll

on 1/10/03 4:46 PM, Karin at curtkar@... wrote:

> No, this was Ned's view about Sesame Street.

Thanks, Karen! That's what I meant.

Joyce

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 3:40:27 PM, bluelotus@... writes:

<< My question was geared toward how to handle stuff that you may consider
going against your values or ideals within the context of unschooling. >>

Where was the very recent discussion on mature video games which extended
into movies too? I thought it was here.

I grew up with and around people who controlled (tried to control) their
children's exposure so that they would grow up innocent and with the illusion
that all the world was like their surroundings. That would be the Southern
Baptists.

Rather than give my children something to rebel against, I try to give them
everything that casually comes along, and to always give them more than one
point of view so they can do some of their social discoveries now while
they're safe at home with people to discuss it with instead of hearing of
some things for the very first time when they're off with just other people
their age,
and maybe one of them is trying to persuade them to be/do/try something they
only just then heard of.

If kids were in school and heard something the parents were opposed to, the
parents could indignantly blame the school (for saying homosexuality wasn't
necessarily an abomination, or that humans and apes and monkeys were all
primates, or something else that opens the gates of hell). With unschooling,
I can't blame school or a curriculum, and I see no reason to "blame" anyone
anyway. I see opportunities.

I do avoid the news. This week is a dead baby fest on the news.

But Holly asked today why her dad hadn't wanted to go see what the lights
were (an apparent accident 1/4 mile up from our turnoff). I said he probably
didn't think she really wanted to see. But Holly has a fascination with
accidents that neither of her brothers ever had, and had it been just me and
Holly, I would've driven by.

It's not a value or ideal to show her wrecks, it's respecting her expressed
curiosity.

<<Sorry if I missed something here, but are you saying that you wouldn't
>> let your kids watch Sesame Street if they wanted to?>>

<<I am not really interested in the topic of Big Bird, nor Ned's (or
anyone's) take on it. >>

I think those were posted by the same person.

I think people's take on Sesame Street, in the context of families who are
dedicated to home learning, are pretty important and interesting!

Sandra

Fetteroll

on 1/10/03 5:38 PM, bluelotus at bluelotus@... wrote:

> My question was geared toward how to handle stuff that you may consider going
> against your values or ideals within the context of unschooling. Joyce's post
> on Big Bird simply triggered my question.

I think a lot of that was covered in the Grand Theft Auto thread! I don't
think most parents responding were delighted to have that particular game in
their homes! ;-)

It really depends on what it is. Vegetarians have mentioned letting their
kids choose whatever they want to eat outside the home. Peacelovers have
said their kids have toy weapons.

I suspect religion is a bit tricky for some people. I can imagine it being
incredibly tough to explore outside a faith if you're certain other paths
are not only false but misleading.

What did you have in mind specifically?

Joyce

kayb85 <[email protected]>

> Thanks. I am not really interested in the topic of Big Bird, nor
Ned's (or anyone's) take on it. My question was geared toward how to
handle stuff that you may consider going against your values or
ideals within the context of unschooling. Joyce's post on Big Bird
simply triggered my question.

I think it's really hard to know when to allow your kids to not do
something that you think they need.

From a homeopthic point of view, I'm facing that now. My son (5
years old) has been going to a homeopath for awhile and was cured of
food allergies. But he still has this thing where he hates to leave
the house, and he's being treated for that. So he hates to leave the
house, is mad because he's there, and refuses to take a remedy that
will make it easier for him to leave his house. Would you hold him
down and force him to take it?

If your child had a serious cavity and didn't want to go get it
filled, do you make him? How many parents would really be at peace
with watching their child's teeth fall out if that's what the parents
choose? Yet there are some adults who choose to not treat cavities
and not go to the dentist. When do we let go?

What if his appendix burst and he refused to go to the hospital for
an operation? Do you let him stay home and die?

At some point I think all parents would step in and say, "I am going
to take care of your needs whether you like it or not".

The problem comes in when parents think their child "needs" a
classical education. Or they "need" socialization. Or they "need"
to be punished for irresponsibility.

Sheila

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 4:40:35 PM, sheran@... writes:

<< How many parents would really be at peace
with watching their child's teeth fall out if that's what the parents
choose? >>

I've never seen a child's teeth fall out.
The ultimate exaggerations (he'll never read, his teeth will fall out, he'll
watch TV all the time if I let him) never seem to happen.

If a tooth hurts a child will complain. There are cures short of removal of
the baby teeth. There are short-term remedies, and such pain might come and
go.

My kids have said "I think I need to go to the dentist now" when things have
hurt (and more often things were caught early while they were there, found in
x-rays or whatever).

<<What if his appendix burst and he refused to go to the hospital for
an operation? Do you let him stay home and die? >>

That kind of pain blacks people right out.
Do you know any stories (even one) of someone choosing to stay home and die
of something like that?

I tried to press Kirby to go to the doctor for a wart he had on the bottom of
his foot. He kept saying no, and just limping and whining. One day he said
"I think I need to go to the doctor." It was better that it was his choice.
It took three visits, ultimately, but he's totally better now. It was
frustrating for me, but the mutual respect between us is better, and the
knowledge he gained from making his own decision will come in useful when
it's something more acute.

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/2003 5:54:43 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
> I think people's take on Sesame Street, in the context of families who are
> dedicated to home learning, are pretty important and interesting!

I'm probably the lone dissenter here, but I HATE Sesame Street. I swore after
watching it when I was pregnant with Cameron that my children would NEVER
watch it!

I can't STAND Elmo. The Grouch gave me the creeps. I think Jim Henson was a
genius, but the program was a real freak show. Neither child was interested,
to my delight. It gives me the heebie-jeebies to even think about!
::shivers::

~Kelly


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 9:53:51 PM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:

> Neither child was interested,
> to my delight. It gives me the heebie-jeebies to even think about!
> ::shivers::
>

Kelly, this is a perfect example.. What do you think you would have done if
your kids LOVED it.. were obsessive over it..wanted to watch it all the time,
had videos and games of it, wanted clothes with characters on it.. LOL.. you
know what I mean? Like lots of kids obsessions over characters or shows..
I've been lucky in those regards too.. my kids have never really liked
anything that I didnt like.. BUT, Im very flexible, I really cant think of
much I can't tolerate. Pokemon kinda gets on my nerves.. but not to a
"UGHGHGH gag me" point. I just dont watch it.

Teresa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

bluelotus

<< I think it's really hard to know when to allow your kids to not do
something that you think they need. >>

I know. I allow my dd to do pretty much what she wants, and respect her choices, but that doesn't mean I am not her mother anymore. I make her do things that I consider important as a mother, like brush her teeth, etc. I don't think I'm necessarily forcing her, just instilling good habits in her.

<< From a homeopthic point of view, I'm facing that now. My son (5
years old) has been going to a homeopath for awhile and was cured of
food allergies. But he still has this thing where he hates to leave
the house, and he's being treated for that. So he hates to leave the
house, is mad because he's there, and refuses to take a remedy that
will make it easier for him to leave his house. Would you hold him
down and force him to take it? >> Did your homeopath tell you that the remedy s/he's giving him is to *treat* that particular aspect, or is that your interpretation? I am asking you this because true homeopathy treats the whole person and not just certain aspects. So, I'd suggest you ask him/her if s/he is treating your son constitutionally, and if s/he isn't, look for a different homeopath!

Also, if the treatment is constitutional, perhaps you shouldn't tell your son that he's been treated for that specific aversion, or that the remedy is for that, because it is part of his imbalance and of course he's not gonna want to take it. And it is not totally true either. A true homeopath sees more than just what's bothering the patient (or her mom...lol) and focuses on the whole person.

<<If your child had a serious cavity and didn't want to go get it
filled, do you make him? How many parents would really be at peace
with watching their child's teeth fall out if that's what the parents
choose? Yet there are some adults who choose to not treat cavities
and not go to the dentist. When do we let go? >> I've made my girl brush her teeth ever since she was very little and now it's simply a habit. Same thing with her hair and personal hygiene. We all do those tings here, so it's not like something extraordinary, just for her. She knows why and she is willing to do it. I don't have to *force* her. I understand that unschooling is about trusting and letting kids lead their learning process, but they still need parenting, IMO.

<< At some point I think all parents would step in and say, "I am going
to take care of your needs whether you like it or not". >> Totally. I understand there are ways of doing it and ways of doing it, of course. So I try to make those things fun. I truly believe that my daughter needs me as her mother and not just *a buddy* or something like that... ;-)

<< The problem comes in when parents think their child "needs" a
classical education. Or they "need" socialization. Or they "need"
to be punished for irresponsibility. >>

I agree. My question was more geared toward certain values that may be opposed by say, TV shows and such. For example, I've heard parents say thay don't worry about their kids be exposed to porno on the net, and so on. Or to be exposed to anything, for that matter. I tend to think differently, not because I am a prude or anything like that, but because I believe there is a time for everything and as we grow up we develop a greater capacity to understand and assimilate the world. Any thoughts?

Yol

--

Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com

Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org

**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************

kayb85 <[email protected]>

--- In [email protected], bluelotus <bluelotus@a...>
wrote:
> << I think it's really hard to know when to allow your kids to not
do
> something that you think they need. >>
>
> I know. I allow my dd to do pretty much what she wants, and respect
her choices, but that doesn't mean I am not her mother anymore. I
make her do things that I consider important as a mother, like brush
her teeth, etc. I don't think I'm necessarily forcing her, just
instilling good habits in her.

I agree, except that sometimes what we think a child needs might be
different than what he really does need. For example, a parent might
tell a child that he needs antibiotics and make the child take the
medicine, when the antibiotic really wasn't a very healthy thing for
her body.

There might be times when a child is more in tune with her instincts
than a parent, yet is forced to do what the parent thinks is needed.
I'm not sure what the answer is, except for encouraging parents to be
healthy and in tune with their own instincts. And of course the same
concept applies to what tv shows we let our kids watch. The child
might be more in tune with his own instincts than the parent is. The
child might be right and the parent might be wrong.

"Did your homeopath tell you that the remedy s/he's giving him is to
*treat* that particular aspect, or is that your interpretation? I am
asking you this because true homeopathy treats the whole person and
not just certain aspects. So, I'd suggest you ask him/her if s/he is
treating your son constitutionally, and if s/he isn't, look for a
different homeopath!"

She is treating him constitutionally, and is treating the whole
person. I just didn't explain myself well. He has done really well
with homeopathy and he knows it. His diet used to be extremely
limited and now he can eat anything. In his mind, he's glad he was
treated but now he thinks he's better and doesn't see the point in
going. But he still has some little things, and the biggest one seems
to be being uncomfortable away from home. I'm not sure what his
remedy is at this point. At one point he was cal carb, but I think
she changed it at some point. Maybe lycopodium? Or maybe that was my
other son--I'm not sure. There are 6 of us being treated so I don't
always remember who's getting what. :)

>
> Also, if the treatment is constitutional, perhaps you shouldn't
tell your son that he's been treated for that specific aversion, or
that the remedy is for that, because it is part of his imbalance and
of course he's not gonna want to take it. And it is not totally true
either. A true homeopath sees more than just what's bothering the
patient (or her mom...lol) and focuses on the whole person.

We don't tell him that he's being treated for that. And I know she's
taking into account other things--like that he's sensitive to smells
and doesn't like to wear jeans and more that she hasn't even told me
I'm sure. Right now I hold him, she dumps them into his mouth and
holds it shut until she thinks it's been in long enough, then we let
him go and he spits them out.


> I agree. My question was more geared toward certain values that may
be opposed by say, TV shows and such. For example, I've heard parents
say thay don't worry about their kids be exposed to porno on the net,
and so on. Or to be exposed to anything, for that matter. I tend to
think differently, not because I am a prude or anything like that,
but because I believe there is a time for everything and as we grow
up we develop a greater capacity to understand and assimilate the
world. Any thoughts?
>

I don't think that there is really a difference between trusting them
to know what's good for them physically and what's good for them
morally/emotionally.

I know that my daughter will get upset seeing certain types of tv
shows. She is free to pick what tv shows she wants to watch and just
never picks anything scary. If dh and I are planning on watching
something that we think might scare her, we just tell her that and
she willingly chooses to stay out of the room.

As far as porn, she's never watched it. I recognize that the
possibility exists that at some point she might see it and be
curious. I would talk to her about it.

But how does one know when it is ok to lift the reigns and say when
something is ok to see? In my ideal world, my daughter wouldn't see
a naked male body until her wedding night.

Even if porn doesn't become an obsession, I don't think it's good to
watch porn even occasionally. Beyond that possible first time seeing
it, asking what it is, and then discussing why it isn't healthy, I
wouldn't want my kids watching it at all. I just don't believe it's
a good moral thing for anyone to watch.

Sheila

bluelotus

>
>
>> My question was geared toward how to handle stuff that you may consider going
>> against your values or ideals within the context of unschooling. Joyce's post
>> on Big Bird simply triggered my question.
>
>

<< I think a lot of that was covered in the Grand Theft Auto thread! I don't
think most parents responding were delighted to have that particular game in
their homes! ;-)

It really depends on what it is. Vegetarians have mentioned letting their
kids choose whatever they want to eat outside the home. Peacelovers have
said their kids have toy weapons.

I suspect religion is a bit tricky for some people. I can imagine it being
incredibly tough to explore outside a faith if you're certain other paths
are not only false but misleading.

What did you have in mind specifically? >>

Hmm, I don't know, I'm thinking out loud here... mainstream American culture... racism... the demeaning portrayal of women... porno... spanking kids... abuse of animals... political agendas... and all those things that seam to be accepted by this and other cultures that not only do not convey our family's ideals and values, but seem to go against them...

What about that new TV show that portrays a homeschooling family as a bunch of misfits who can't relate to the world outside their home?

Just for the record, *sheltering* or *denial* are not in my mind, but protecting and guiding are, especially because my dd is still very young.

Yol

--

Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com

Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org

**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************

Fetteroll

on 1/11/03 8:36 AM, bluelotus at bluelotus@... wrote:

> racism... the demeaning portrayal of women... porno... spanking kids... abuse
> of animals... political agendas...

> Just for the record, *sheltering* or *denial* are not in my mind, but
> protecting and guiding are, especially because my dd is still very young.

Why would she *want* to watch or participate in that list of things?

And I think if she did, it would be a great opportunity to spend time
sharing views with each other. If your values are right, can she come to a
wrong conclusion? She may for a while, but ultimately?

I don't think anyone is advocating exposing kids to those things, but if
they chance on it or become curious, then the answer is to help them deal
with it.

There are some things on that list that she'll probably encounter in the
course of American culture or entertainment and then you can talk about how
they make you feel or talk about the time period (if it's historical).

Joyce

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 9:51:40 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:

> <<What if his appendix burst and he refused to go to the hospital for
> an operation? Do you let him stay home and die? >>
>
> That kind of pain blacks people right out.
> Do you know any stories (even one) of someone choosing to stay home and die
>
> of something like that?
>
>

Yes....Before I joined the Army I was a Med Surg nurse in Maine and saw
people who ignored the slight pain they had in their abdomen and the fever.
Thinking it was just the flu. (Although not a lot of people) And came into
the hospital too late, major infections.....
Pam G.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 9:51:40 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:

> I tried to press Kirby to go to the doctor for a wart he had on the bottom
> of
> his foot. He kept saying no, and just limping and whining. One day he
> said
> "I think I need to go to the doctor." It was better that it was his
> choice.
>

Warts will go away on their own. The body will build up antibodies and get
rid of a wart. Although it is a long process. May take a year or longer.
And the bottom of the foot is a painful place for a wart. And in mild cases
the body will repair a cavity. If it is just a small decay. And it is kept
clean etc, the decayed enamel may repair although there will be a brown spot,
like a scar. Happened with my youngest and that is how our dentist described
it to me.

I give my son the same choice with cold sores. He gets one once in a while.
He can choose to use the cream that will help it stay small and go away in a
matter of a couple of days with little pain or he can choose no cream and it
takes longer to heal and may be a bit larger and a bit more painful. He says
the cream tastes bad and usually refuses. I know the sore will go away it is
just a matter of when.

Pam G.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/10/03 9:53:36 PM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:

> I'm probably the lone dissenter here, but I HATE Sesame Street. I swore
> after
> watching it when I was pregnant with Cameron that my children would NEVER
> watch it!
>
>

Neither one of my boys liked Sesame Street. Not sure why, I watched it as a
child and I never told them they couldn't watch it. They just didn't find it
interesting.
Pam G.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

bluelotus

<< I agree, except that sometimes what we think a child needs might be

different than what he really does need. For example, a parent might
tell a child that he needs antibiotics and make the child take the
medicine, when the antibiotic really wasn't a very healthy thing for
her body. >>

I agree. A lot of the time it's plain ingnorance about alternatives. Even unschoolers can be very mainstream when it comes to health care... ;-)

I let my dd choose what she wants to eat, and have done it ever since she was born. She was breastfed on demand and then when she started eating solid food, she would go for only rice or broccoli or whatever. I've never pressured her about any of that, because I totally trust her inner inteligence.

<< There might be times when a child is more in tune with her instincts
than a parent, yet is forced to do what the parent thinks is needed.
I'm not sure what the answer is, except for encouraging parents to be
healthy and in tune with their own instincts. >>

I agree with you here. I think that they are totally in tune with their instincts when it comes to instinctual stuff, but when it comes to mind stuff it gets a bit more tricky...

<< And of course the same
concept applies to what tv shows we let our kids watch. The child
might be more in tune with his own instincts than the parent is. The
child might be right and the parent might be wrong. >>

This is where I am not so sure. I think kids are extremely impressionable and tend to believe that what's out there is *normal*. Yet I don't think that most of what's out there is natural or normal at all! I don't think playing with guns is going to make a kid violent, but I do believe that watching someone spanking or hitting a kid may leave a disturbing impression on them, for example.

<< We don't tell him that he's being treated for that. And I know she's
taking into account other things--like that he's sensitive to smells
and doesn't like to wear jeans and more that she hasn't even told me
I'm sure. Right now I hold him, she dumps them into his mouth and
holds it shut until she thinks it's been in long enough, then we let
him go and he spits them out. >>

Have you ever asked him why he spits it out? There's cases when people fear they're being poisoned (and that's a rubric for the homeopath), but he may have other reasons. I won't say anymore. I was personally (privately) asked not to talk about homeopathy on these lists.


<< I don't think that there is really a difference between trusting them
to know what's good for them physically and what's good for them
morally/emotionally. >>

That's where I have my doubts. Not because I don't *trust* but because I know how impressonable we humans are. Perhaps it's just a question of good timing, and as they grow up they get more and more exposure to things (just like more choices, responsibilities, etc.).

<< Even if porn doesn't become an obsession, I don't think it's good to
watch porn even occasionally. Beyond that possible first time seeing
it, asking what it is, and then discussing why it isn't healthy, I
wouldn't want my kids watching it at all. I just don't believe it's
a good moral thing for anyone to watch. >>

That's a big one for me too. I think it's very polluting for one's mind.

Thanks for your comments!

Yol

--

Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com

Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org

**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************

[email protected]

<< And I know she's
taking into account other things--like that he's sensitive to smells
and doesn't like to wear jeans ... >>

Some people are better at smelling than others, right? They become wine
tasters and chefs and parfumiers and safety engineers.

Is wearing jeans so necessary in this culture that there are medical cures
for not liking them?

Sandra

Fetteroll

on 1/11/03 10:19 AM, bluelotus at bluelotus@... wrote:

> I was personally (privately) asked not to talk about homeopathy on these
> lists.

You know that isn't true. And I wonder why you would say so to the list.

I asked that you avoid jumping in with suggesting homeopathy for perfectly
ordinary kid behavior. Parents need to trust in their own powers of
observation and judgement. They don't need "experts" filling them with doubt
that problems are so subtle that only "experts" can spot them.

Joyce
Unschooling-dotcom moderator

pumpkin_kisses_fall_wishes <djac99_1999@

> > racism... the demeaning portrayal of women... porno... spanking
kids... abuse
> > of animals... political agendas...
>
> > Just for the record, *sheltering* or *denial* are not in my mind, but
> > protecting and guiding are, especially because my dd is still very
young.
>

> Why would she *want* to watch or participate in that list of things?

I asked a similar question about watching/playing GTA, and it didn't
go over well. What was the difference in our questions?

Denise

Fetteroll

on 1/11/03 2:14 PM, pumpkin_kisses_fall_wishes <djac99_1999@...> at
djac99_1999@... wrote:

> I asked a similar question about watching/playing GTA, and it didn't
> go over well. What was the difference in our questions?

Because Yol said her daughter is very young. The kids we were talking about
were much older and asking for Grand Theft Auto. A young child wouldn't ask
to see porn or political agendas or the other stuff Yol listed.

My daughter's eyes glaze over when there's even kissing and she's 11. To a
young child movies with sexual content would look like a bunch of adults
doing pointlessly boring stuff. My daughter has had free use of the TV
remote since forever. Occasionally she'll stay up all night watching TV
where I would suppose there are adult themed shows and movies on regular
cable. But she doesn't even pause at anything that doesn't look like it's
for kids because adult shows don't have the look that appeals to kids.

They *will* stumble over ideas like racism before it would seem useful to
introduce it to them, but they're not going to ask to see it before they're
ready.

Joyce

kayb85 <[email protected]>

Of course I would never make my son go to a homeopath just because he
doesn't like jeans. I took him because he cried because he couldn't
have ice cream like the other kids. I took him because my heart
almost stopped when he accidentally ate a dairy ingredient and his
throat swelled shut so bad he could hardly breathe. Now he eats what
he wants. But there are lots of remedies that can be used to help
someone with a food allergy. Knowing that someone doesn't like jeans
and is sensitive to smells can help a homeopath determine which
remedy she needs to give that particular individual.

I don't think my homeopath is trying to cure him of wearing
sweatpants too much. <grin> But if there is something
physiologically off balance that is making it so that he is bothered
by anything tight around his waist, and if that physiological thing
can be brought back into balance, then I would like to see him
balanced.

Your personal preferences are part of who you are and a homeopath had
to take them into account when determining a remedy.

Sheila


--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
>
> << And I know she's
> taking into account other things--like that he's sensitive to
smells
> and doesn't like to wear jeans ... >>
>
> Some people are better at smelling than others, right? They become
wine
> tasters and chefs and parfumiers and safety engineers.
>
> Is wearing jeans so necessary in this culture that there are
medical cures
> for not liking them?
>
> Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 1/11/03 12:15:20 PM, djac99_1999@... writes:

<< > Why would she *want* to watch or participate in that list of things?

I asked a similar question about watching/playing GTA, and it didn't
go over well. What was the difference in our questions? >>

I think the question was "Do you actually have a child who is wanting to
watch
<<racism... the demeaning portrayal of women... porno... spanking
kids... abuse of animals... political agendas...>>?


When/if you asked why people would want to play GTA, the answers were given.
And there ARE people who want to play it. And their characterization of the
game wasn't the same as yours. So those who HAVE played it (I'm assuming you
have not) had a different view of it than those who had learned of it from
critical essays somewhere out there.

Sandra

Tia Leschke

Any of you who know more about homeopathy want to hazard a suggestion for a
remedy that would help my granddaughter handle disappointment a little
better. She reacts very strongly to any disappointment. Like she just got
sick and will have to miss at least a couple of the classes she loves. Most
kids would be disappointed, might even cry, but Skye will be inconsolable.

While we're at it, my daughter remembers hearing about a remedy that helps
with small kids tending to be violent. Kaelin has been hitting, scratching,
etc for the last little while, often with no provocation at all. It's
likely just a stage, but if there's a remedy that will help his mother
through it . . .
Tia