Kids and Trouble
Have a Nice Day!
I have a question for you guys.
What do you do with a child who is not rebelling against his family, but is rebelling against *society* and its rules, and does so by getting into trouble?
What do you do when getting into trouble is considered a "badge of honor"?
What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but has practically decided that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?
I'm guessing here that I actually have a political activist on my hands, (who probably has activist friends, and none of them know yet how to "choose battles" and "focus energy" into the very real work that it takes for real change.
Any ideas? This one is 14.
Kristen
****************************************************************
Today is even more important than tomorrow because "today" is a gift, and "tomorrow" might never come.
Today is where hope lives because today is when we can make things better than yesterday.
The only thing we can be sure of is today and life isn't worth living if it isn't lived in joy for as many moments of today as we can manage.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
What do you do with a child who is not rebelling against his family, but is rebelling against *society* and its rules, and does so by getting into trouble?
What do you do when getting into trouble is considered a "badge of honor"?
What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but has practically decided that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?
I'm guessing here that I actually have a political activist on my hands, (who probably has activist friends, and none of them know yet how to "choose battles" and "focus energy" into the very real work that it takes for real change.
Any ideas? This one is 14.
Kristen
****************************************************************
Today is even more important than tomorrow because "today" is a gift, and "tomorrow" might never come.
Today is where hope lives because today is when we can make things better than yesterday.
The only thing we can be sure of is today and life isn't worth living if it isn't lived in joy for as many moments of today as we can manage.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Annette Marshall
Kristen, My 14 yo sounds similar to your son. She
hasn't gotten into any trouble but it is always
lurking around in the back of my mind that those days
could be coming. She has many questions about
anarchism, she is oppossed to racism, smoking, drugs,
materialism, corporate America and she is vocal about
these convictions. She sets herself apart by her
appearance also. She is a non-conformist all of the
way. She doesn't have the maturity or life expereince
to always be tactful or to really know how to put to
use al of her big ideas....which is where we come in.
There have been times she has done things that we
question....but we talk to her a lot. I have learned
to not panic, to get the facts, to listen a lot, to
think before I speak, and to direct her toward ways to
affect change in her world. To empower her to stand up
and make her voice heard. I also accompany her to a
lot of places that she goes. If she goes to any punk
shows, I go too, carrying my nursing toddler in the
sling. I stay in the background or outside (to protect
my little one's hearing) but she knows I am nearby if
she or her friends needs me.
I guess we have had to let go of a lot. We never ever
dreamed that one of our kids would go in this
direction...but since it happened, we have decided to
go with it. We provide a circle so to speak in which
she can explore. Anything outside the circle has to be
talked over with us and decisions made on a case by
case basis....all to keep her safe and out of trouble.
So far it has worked well.
Do you mind me saying what kind of trouble your boy is
interested in getting into? We have had to deal with a
lot of attitude and emotional upheavel. I think though
that some of that is the age. From about 12 - 17 is
hard on them. My daughter has grown 6 inches and
gained 30 lbs....she went from a little girl to a
young woman in the span of about 6 months. That alone
is hard on a kid!
Anyway, keep listening and letting them talk.
Interject when you can. Even when they don't seem to
be listening I think they are. Another thing that I do
every few days is write letters to her. Sometimes its
just notes saying how much we love her and we know she
is so smart and we admire that she is thinking so much
and not just following. I tell her that I know God
created her with a special plan for her. It is no
accident that she is here. She has a big purpoise in
life that only she can fill.
I certainly fel like I am flying by the seat of my
pants most days and I hope I don't sound like a know
it all....but this is just some of the ways we are
handling our own 14 yo "political activist." :o)
Annette
--- Have a Nice Day! <litlrooh@...> wrote:
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hasn't gotten into any trouble but it is always
lurking around in the back of my mind that those days
could be coming. She has many questions about
anarchism, she is oppossed to racism, smoking, drugs,
materialism, corporate America and she is vocal about
these convictions. She sets herself apart by her
appearance also. She is a non-conformist all of the
way. She doesn't have the maturity or life expereince
to always be tactful or to really know how to put to
use al of her big ideas....which is where we come in.
There have been times she has done things that we
question....but we talk to her a lot. I have learned
to not panic, to get the facts, to listen a lot, to
think before I speak, and to direct her toward ways to
affect change in her world. To empower her to stand up
and make her voice heard. I also accompany her to a
lot of places that she goes. If she goes to any punk
shows, I go too, carrying my nursing toddler in the
sling. I stay in the background or outside (to protect
my little one's hearing) but she knows I am nearby if
she or her friends needs me.
I guess we have had to let go of a lot. We never ever
dreamed that one of our kids would go in this
direction...but since it happened, we have decided to
go with it. We provide a circle so to speak in which
she can explore. Anything outside the circle has to be
talked over with us and decisions made on a case by
case basis....all to keep her safe and out of trouble.
So far it has worked well.
Do you mind me saying what kind of trouble your boy is
interested in getting into? We have had to deal with a
lot of attitude and emotional upheavel. I think though
that some of that is the age. From about 12 - 17 is
hard on them. My daughter has grown 6 inches and
gained 30 lbs....she went from a little girl to a
young woman in the span of about 6 months. That alone
is hard on a kid!
Anyway, keep listening and letting them talk.
Interject when you can. Even when they don't seem to
be listening I think they are. Another thing that I do
every few days is write letters to her. Sometimes its
just notes saying how much we love her and we know she
is so smart and we admire that she is thinking so much
and not just following. I tell her that I know God
created her with a special plan for her. It is no
accident that she is here. She has a big purpoise in
life that only she can fill.
I certainly fel like I am flying by the seat of my
pants most days and I hope I don't sound like a know
it all....but this is just some of the ways we are
handling our own 14 yo "political activist." :o)
Annette
--- Have a Nice Day! <litlrooh@...> wrote:
> I have a question for you guys.__________________________________________________
>
> What do you do with a child who is not rebelling
> against his family, but is rebelling against
> *society* and its rules, and does so by getting into
> trouble?
>
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Robyn Carter
Annette;
WOW! You summed up so beautifully our experience with our 13dd. She also has
grown 6 inches, gained 30lbs and become a young woman over the summer.
Compounding her life is the fact that we moved from a very open and non
conformist community to a more conservative place, and she's finding it very
difficult to fit. I am definitely flying by the seat of my pants, too! See
ya out in space :-)
Robyn
WOW! You summed up so beautifully our experience with our 13dd. She also has
grown 6 inches, gained 30lbs and become a young woman over the summer.
Compounding her life is the fact that we moved from a very open and non
conformist community to a more conservative place, and she's finding it very
difficult to fit. I am definitely flying by the seat of my pants, too! See
ya out in space :-)
Robyn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Annette Marshall" <momuv4sweetiepies@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 9:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Kids and Trouble
> Kristen, My 14 yo sounds similar to your son. She
> hasn't gotten into any trouble but it is always
> lurking around in the back of my mind that those days
> could be coming. She has many questions about
> anarchism, she is oppossed to racism, smoking, drugs,
> materialism, corporate America and she is vocal about
> these convictions. She sets herself apart by her
> appearance also. She is a non-conformist all of the
> way. She doesn't have the maturity or life expereince
> to always be tactful or to really know how to put to
> use al of her big ideas....which is where we come in.
>
> There have been times she has done things that we
> question....but we talk to her a lot. I have learned
> to not panic, to get the facts, to listen a lot, to
> think before I speak, and to direct her toward ways to
> affect change in her world. To empower her to stand up
> and make her voice heard. I also accompany her to a
> lot of places that she goes. If she goes to any punk
> shows, I go too, carrying my nursing toddler in the
> sling. I stay in the background or outside (to protect
> my little one's hearing) but she knows I am nearby if
> she or her friends needs me.
>
> I guess we have had to let go of a lot. We never ever
> dreamed that one of our kids would go in this
> direction...but since it happened, we have decided to
> go with it. We provide a circle so to speak in which
> she can explore. Anything outside the circle has to be
> talked over with us and decisions made on a case by
> case basis....all to keep her safe and out of trouble.
> So far it has worked well.
>
> Do you mind me saying what kind of trouble your boy is
> interested in getting into? We have had to deal with a
> lot of attitude and emotional upheavel. I think though
> that some of that is the age. From about 12 - 17 is
> hard on them. My daughter has grown 6 inches and
> gained 30 lbs....she went from a little girl to a
> young woman in the span of about 6 months. That alone
> is hard on a kid!
>
> Anyway, keep listening and letting them talk.
> Interject when you can. Even when they don't seem to
> be listening I think they are. Another thing that I do
> every few days is write letters to her. Sometimes its
> just notes saying how much we love her and we know she
> is so smart and we admire that she is thinking so much
> and not just following. I tell her that I know God
> created her with a special plan for her. It is no
> accident that she is here. She has a big purpoise in
> life that only she can fill.
>
> I certainly fel like I am flying by the seat of my
> pants most days and I hope I don't sound like a know
> it all....but this is just some of the ways we are
> handling our own 14 yo "political activist." :o)
> Annette
>
>
> --- Have a Nice Day! <litlrooh@...> wrote:
> > I have a question for you guys.
> >
> > What do you do with a child who is not rebelling
> > against his family, but is rebelling against
> > *society* and its rules, and does so by getting into
> > trouble?
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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>
elaine greenwood-hyde
Hi,
I don't usually mention my politics on lists, (because I don't
particularly want to have to be defending myself all the time instead of
participating on the list subject) but I am an Anarchist. If you want some
sensible links about anarchism I'd be glad to post them for you. There's a
lot of 'silliness' about anarchism on the net. I guess in extremes people
either get afraid or are very immature and post a load of old rubbish. I
think most people confuse the word 'anarchy' with 'chaos' which is entirely
different.
Btw my eldest girl is 16 and she definitely sets herself apart by appearance
but I've always assumed it's fairly normal for teenagers to do that anyway.
It does appear to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that there is more pressure
in the US to conform (especially in appearance) than in the UK.
BWs Elaine
MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
I don't usually mention my politics on lists, (because I don't
particularly want to have to be defending myself all the time instead of
participating on the list subject) but I am an Anarchist. If you want some
sensible links about anarchism I'd be glad to post them for you. There's a
lot of 'silliness' about anarchism on the net. I guess in extremes people
either get afraid or are very immature and post a load of old rubbish. I
think most people confuse the word 'anarchy' with 'chaos' which is entirely
different.
Btw my eldest girl is 16 and she definitely sets herself apart by appearance
but I've always assumed it's fairly normal for teenagers to do that anyway.
It does appear to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that there is more pressure
in the US to conform (especially in appearance) than in the UK.
BWs Elaine
>Kristen, My 14 yo sounds similar to your son. She_________________________________________________________________
>hasn't gotten into any trouble but it is always
>lurking around in the back of my mind that those days
>could be coming. She has many questions about
>anarchism, she is oppossed to racism, smoking, drugs,
>materialism, corporate America and she is vocal about
>these convictions. She sets herself apart by her
>appearance also. She is a non-conformist all of the
>way. She doesn't have the maturity or life expereince
>to always be tactful or to really know how to put to
>use al of her big ideas....which is where we come in.
MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
bluelotus
>My two cents...
>
>What do you do with a child who is not rebelling against his family, but is rebelling against *society* and its rules, and does so by getting into trouble?
>
>What do you do when getting into trouble is considered a "badge of honor"?
>
>What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but has practically decided that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?
>
>I'm guessing here that I actually have a political activist on my hands, (who probably has activist friends, and none of them know yet how to "choose battles" and "focus energy" into the very real work that it takes for real change.
>
>Any ideas? This one is 14.
>
I can think of many homeopathic remedies that would fit this picture.
I'd take him to see a classical homeopath.
Most people think that extra rebellious and contrary behavior are just
personality traits. Us homeopaths think it's an imbalance. We all have
different temperaments, for sure, but clinical experience has shown us
that the aim of the vital force is to keep the body alive and motivate
us to fulfill our dreams and higher purposes, along with a sense of
peace and well being. So when the behavior is not aimed at that, we
suspect something triggered a reaction that is contrary to personal
fulfillment and a positive, creative attitude in life.
A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeper
imbalance that will usually show its ugly face time and again in the
form of physical symptoms or more serious mental stuff.
That's why I insist so much on treating people homeopathically, and
especially kids. That way you are preventing other possible problems
later in life. Not to mention that the quality of life of anybody under
homeopathic treatment gets greatly improved. E-mail me privately if
you'd want me to help you locate a homeopath in your area.
Yol
--
Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com
Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org
**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************
Christine Ford
I need to get removed from this e-mail list. I had no
idea I'd be getting so much mail -- my mailbox can't
handle it! I was thinking this would be simply a
monthly e-mail update, one document.
--- Jon and Rue Kream <skreams@...> wrote:
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idea I'd be getting so much mail -- my mailbox can't
handle it! I was thinking this would be simply a
monthly e-mail update, one document.
--- Jon and Rue Kream <skreams@...> wrote:
> Hi Elaine - I'd be interested in your anarchy links.__________________________________________________
> Thanks ~Rue
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>
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Gerard Westenberg
<A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeper
imbalance >
I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this needs to be treated homeopathically. I have one son, now 20, who questions and rebels against big corporate business, war, the Americanization of other cultures, rules and regulations ad infinitum...He likes groups like the Sex Pistols - the Anarchy in the Uk mob. :-) I listene to them as a teen ,too :-). He has always had this anti authorrity streak - now he is older he exerts some of this angst by being a member of a political party. I don't feel that had/has a behaviour problem - now or when he was younger. It is just him, and he has learned to see where he can make a difference. And he has been a good influence on all the rest of us in the family - we are careful what we buy and where, for eg, as part of G's influence...Leonie W.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
imbalance >
I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this needs to be treated homeopathically. I have one son, now 20, who questions and rebels against big corporate business, war, the Americanization of other cultures, rules and regulations ad infinitum...He likes groups like the Sex Pistols - the Anarchy in the Uk mob. :-) I listene to them as a teen ,too :-). He has always had this anti authorrity streak - now he is older he exerts some of this angst by being a member of a political party. I don't feel that had/has a behaviour problem - now or when he was younger. It is just him, and he has learned to see where he can make a difference. And he has been a good influence on all the rest of us in the family - we are careful what we buy and where, for eg, as part of G's influence...Leonie W.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Colonel Newton
>>>>>>>>>>>>What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but has practically decided that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?I'm guessing here that I actually have a political activist on my hands, (who probably has activist friends, and none of them know yet how to "choose battles" and "focus energy" into the very real work that it takes for real change.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Kristen,
I can't tell you exactly what to do, but I can tell you my own experience and perhaps some part of it will be useful to you.
I was like this at 14. I edited the school newspaper and frequently snuck in scathing editorials about the school's principal after the advisor had already signed off on the content. Suspensions were frequently threatened. I loved every minute of it-- partly for the drama, partly because there was nothing I liked more than seeing adults that I saw as being "stupid" getting all lathered up by something I'd done.
Part of the learning to focus energy and *work* for change over *time* just comes from maturity-- I don't think that I really saw that change is a *process* and not an event until I had my own children.
What is he really interested in? Is there some type of social change/ public awareness/ community activism project that he might become involved in? Is there a group that he might join to pursue his agenda? Could he start such a group? Set up a website? Start an underground newspaper?
I think that the most detrimental thing my parents did in dealing with me was trying to make me stop-- that just translated in my mind to more buttons that I was pushing... which was partially my aim anyway. Not that I didn't feel strongly about the various issues-- but the button pushing was a nice added bonus for me. ;) I think that if they had helped me find some way that I could express my dissatisfaction and exercise my need to be an activist, it would have been FAR more constructive... and I might have actually gotten into less trouble over the long haul.
I don't know if any of the above makes sense in the context of your family... I hope it does. :)
Teresa G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
It absolutely *does* make sense.
In fact, I've started a discussion on the pa-unschoolers list about this and my son has been posting his own comments in answer to some of the questions that have come up.
In my opinion, it has been very helpful to hear things from the unique perspective of being 14 and having to face these issues and decisions.
We've been talking a lot and its been very informative.
Kristen
In fact, I've started a discussion on the pa-unschoolers list about this and my son has been posting his own comments in answer to some of the questions that have come up.
In my opinion, it has been very helpful to hear things from the unique perspective of being 14 and having to face these issues and decisions.
We've been talking a lot and its been very informative.
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: Colonel Newton
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Kids and Trouble
>>>>>>>>>>>>What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but has practically decided that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?
I'm guessing here that I actually have a political activist on my hands, (who probably has activist friends, and none of them know yet how to "choose battles" and "focus energy" into the very real work that it takes for real change.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Kristen,
I can't tell you exactly what to do, but I can tell you my own experience and perhaps some part of it will be useful to you.
I was like this at 14. I edited the school newspaper and frequently snuck in scathing editorials about the school's principal after the advisor had already signed off on the content. Suspensions were frequently threatened. I loved every minute of it-- partly for the drama, partly because there was nothing I liked more than seeing adults that I saw as being "stupid" getting all lathered up by something I'd done.
Part of the learning to focus energy and *work* for change over *time* just comes from maturity-- I don't think that I really saw that change is a *process* and not an event until I had my own children.
What is he really interested in? Is there some type of social change/ public awareness/ community activism project that he might become involved in? Is there a group that he might join to pursue his agenda? Could he start such a group? Set up a website? Start an underground newspaper?
I think that the most detrimental thing my parents did in dealing with me was trying to make me stop-- that just translated in my mind to more buttons that I was pushing... which was partially my aim anyway. Not that I didn't feel strongly about the various issues-- but the button pushing was a nice added bonus for me. ;) I think that if they had helped me find some way that I could express my dissatisfaction and exercise my need to be an activist, it would have been FAR more constructive... and I might have actually gotten into less trouble over the long haul.
I don't know if any of the above makes sense in the context of your family... I hope it does. :)
Teresa G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
Yes, I appreciate the homeopathic point of view. Actually we've been down that road.
What I see though is a personality trait that can be used for good, or for bad.
This is teh same personality trait that I have and which has caused me to become politically active in changing the PA Home Ed law.
What would we do without people like us? LOL
Kristen
What I see though is a personality trait that can be used for good, or for bad.
This is teh same personality trait that I have and which has caused me to become politically active in changing the PA Home Ed law.
What would we do without people like us? LOL
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: Gerard Westenberg
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 10:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Kids and Trouble
<A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeper
imbalance >
I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this needs to be treated homeopathically. I have one son, now 20, who questions and rebels against big corporate business, war, the Americanization of other cultures, rules and regulations ad infinitum...He likes groups like the Sex Pistols - the Anarchy in the Uk mob. :-) I listene to them as a teen ,too :-). He has always had this anti authorrity streak - now he is older he exerts some of this angst by being a member of a political party. I don't feel that had/has a behaviour problem - now or when he was younger. It is just him, and he has learned to see where he can make a difference. And he has been a good influence on all the rest of us in the family - we are careful what we buy and where, for eg, as part of G's influence...Leonie W.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
Oh and by the way....we are trying to come up with ways to use that need to be an activist.
I'm hoping he and I can get a skatepark built here.
Kristen
I'm hoping he and I can get a skatepark built here.
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: Have a Nice Day!
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 11:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Kids and Trouble
It absolutely *does* make sense.
In fact, I've started a discussion on the pa-unschoolers list about this and my son has been posting his own comments in answer to some of the questions that have come up.
In my opinion, it has been very helpful to hear things from the unique perspective of being 14 and having to face these issues and decisions.
We've been talking a lot and its been very informative.
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: Colonel Newton
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Kids and Trouble
>>>>>>>>>>>>What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but has practically decided that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?
I'm guessing here that I actually have a political activist on my hands, (who probably has activist friends, and none of them know yet how to "choose battles" and "focus energy" into the very real work that it takes for real change.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Kristen,
I can't tell you exactly what to do, but I can tell you my own experience and perhaps some part of it will be useful to you.
I was like this at 14. I edited the school newspaper and frequently snuck in scathing editorials about the school's principal after the advisor had already signed off on the content. Suspensions were frequently threatened. I loved every minute of it-- partly for the drama, partly because there was nothing I liked more than seeing adults that I saw as being "stupid" getting all lathered up by something I'd done.
Part of the learning to focus energy and *work* for change over *time* just comes from maturity-- I don't think that I really saw that change is a *process* and not an event until I had my own children.
What is he really interested in? Is there some type of social change/ public awareness/ community activism project that he might become involved in? Is there a group that he might join to pursue his agenda? Could he start such a group? Set up a website? Start an underground newspaper?
I think that the most detrimental thing my parents did in dealing with me was trying to make me stop-- that just translated in my mind to more buttons that I was pushing... which was partially my aim anyway. Not that I didn't feel strongly about the various issues-- but the button pushing was a nice added bonus for me. ;) I think that if they had helped me find some way that I could express my dissatisfaction and exercise my need to be an activist, it would have been FAR more constructive... and I might have actually gotten into less trouble over the long haul.
I don't know if any of the above makes sense in the context of your family... I hope it does. :)
Teresa G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Betsy
**
What do you do when getting into trouble is considered a "badge of honor"?
What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but
has practically decided
that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?**
Uh, this is probably not quite what you wanted, but how about a nice
"unit study" on boat rockers and whistle-blowers and troublemakers? I
bet we could put our heads together as a group and come up with a pretty
interesting, long list of videos to start with.
I'm gonna suggest "Silkwood". Interesting characters, interesting
issues, and the possibility that somebody killed her might make your son
stop and think a minute before he tries to shake things up.
Betsy
What do you do when getting into trouble is considered a "badge of honor"?
What do you do with this child when he wants to go back to school, but
has practically decided
that he can't wait to get into trouble when he gets there?**
Uh, this is probably not quite what you wanted, but how about a nice
"unit study" on boat rockers and whistle-blowers and troublemakers? I
bet we could put our heads together as a group and come up with a pretty
interesting, long list of videos to start with.
I'm gonna suggest "Silkwood". Interesting characters, interesting
issues, and the possibility that somebody killed her might make your son
stop and think a minute before he tries to shake things up.
Betsy
bluelotus
>Perhaps your kid didn't actually have a behavioral problem, but from
>
>
><A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeper
>imbalance >
>
>I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this needs to be treated homeopathically. I have one son, now 20, who questions and rebels against big corporate business, war, the Americanization of other cultures, rules and regulations ad infinitum...He likes groups like the Sex Pistols - the Anarchy in the Uk mob. :-) I listene to them as a teen ,too :-). He has always had this anti authorrity streak - now he is older he exerts some of this angst by being a member of a political party. I don't feel that had/has a behaviour problem - now or when he was younger. It is just him, and he has learned to see where he can make a difference. And he has been a good influence on all the rest of us in the family - we are careful what we buy and where, for eg, as part of G's influence...Leonie W.
>
what I understood from the post I was replying to, this other kid was
anxiously waiting to *get in trouble*. Even though I didn't inquire
further what that meant, I assumed there was a problem being expressed.
I don't think that rebelling is necessarily a behavioral problems either
as a definition (I am a rebel at heart myself and married one as well),
and rebelliousness during adolescence is quite normal and healthy in
general, but there are many different ways of rebelling, and some can be
very self-destructive. They come in all shapes, shades and forms.
I was referring to those who do have a problem, not because they don't
accept the mainstream *box* and hypocritical masquerade of politicians
and such, but because they can make their lives (and those around them)
miserable.
On the other side of the spectrum, just as a quick example: a teenager
who is *too* proper and does not rebel at all (is subservient to his or
her parents), also has a behavioral problem from a homeopathic
viewpoint. Why? Because - to say it lightly- s/he is not looking for
his/her own identity as an individual and cannot embrace life completely
without it.
Just to try to keep things in perspective. What we consider *health* in
homeopathy is the *freedom* to fulfill our dreams and live a rich and
creative life, in the pursuit of our higher purpose. This means freedom
from disease, from fear, from traumatic experiences, from fixed ideas
and rigid conceptions, from desructive relationships, and so on... In
homeopathy, health stops (and the disease process starts) when the flow
of life, which is flexible, creative and loving gets stuck somewhere. In
other words, when an individual is not in harmony inside and out.
Yol
--
Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com
Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org
**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************
Helen Hegener
At 2:15 PM +1030 1/4/03, Gerard Westenberg wrote:
scanning a lot - but Leonie's comment caught my attention. I think
homeschoolers - and especially unschoolers - tend to be a little more
rebellious than most people in many ways, and it would only stand to
reason that their kids would show the same tendencies, though perhaps
manifesting in other ways.
Again, being a ways behind the list, I'm going to read more before
commenting further.
Helen
><A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeperI agree. I haven't been following this thread very closely - still
>imbalance >
>
>I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against
>society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this
>needs to be treated homeopathically.
scanning a lot - but Leonie's comment caught my attention. I think
homeschoolers - and especially unschoolers - tend to be a little more
rebellious than most people in many ways, and it would only stand to
reason that their kids would show the same tendencies, though perhaps
manifesting in other ways.
Again, being a ways behind the list, I'm going to read more before
commenting further.
Helen
Have a Nice Day!
Yol,
I probably didn't explain the situation very well, and I can see where you thought it might be an imbalance.
Since my original post, my son and I have talked A LOT. It does seem that what he is doing is trying to find an identity of his own, test the waters, and find his place in society while critically evaluating the standards society sets.
It does seem to be a normal (though very unsettling) adolescent thing. And its been VERY interesting hearing his point of view on a lot of things.
I discovered that even *he* draws the line somewhere and he explained why he draws the line where he does. So, it appears its not so much wrecklessness as it is a mission of some kind.
I think that is why I realized he was an activist...he just needs a constructive cause to be an activist about.
kristen
I probably didn't explain the situation very well, and I can see where you thought it might be an imbalance.
Since my original post, my son and I have talked A LOT. It does seem that what he is doing is trying to find an identity of his own, test the waters, and find his place in society while critically evaluating the standards society sets.
It does seem to be a normal (though very unsettling) adolescent thing. And its been VERY interesting hearing his point of view on a lot of things.
I discovered that even *he* draws the line somewhere and he explained why he draws the line where he does. So, it appears its not so much wrecklessness as it is a mission of some kind.
I think that is why I realized he was an activist...he just needs a constructive cause to be an activist about.
kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: bluelotus
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2003 12:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Kids and Trouble
>
>
>
><A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeper
>imbalance >
>
>I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this needs to be treated homeopathically. I have one son, now 20, who questions and rebels against big corporate business, war, the Americanization of other cultures, rules and regulations ad infinitum...He likes groups like the Sex Pistols - the Anarchy in the Uk mob. :-) I listene to them as a teen ,too :-). He has always had this anti authorrity streak - now he is older he exerts some of this angst by being a member of a political party. I don't feel that had/has a behaviour problem - now or when he was younger. It is just him, and he has learned to see where he can make a difference. And he has been a good influence on all the rest of us in the family - we are careful what we buy and where, for eg, as part of G's influence...Leonie W.
>
Perhaps your kid didn't actually have a behavioral problem, but from
what I understood from the post I was replying to, this other kid was
anxiously waiting to *get in trouble*. Even though I didn't inquire
further what that meant, I assumed there was a problem being expressed.
I don't think that rebelling is necessarily a behavioral problems either
as a definition (I am a rebel at heart myself and married one as well),
and rebelliousness during adolescence is quite normal and healthy in
general, but there are many different ways of rebelling, and some can be
very self-destructive. They come in all shapes, shades and forms.
I was referring to those who do have a problem, not because they don't
accept the mainstream *box* and hypocritical masquerade of politicians
and such, but because they can make their lives (and those around them)
miserable.
On the other side of the spectrum, just as a quick example: a teenager
who is *too* proper and does not rebel at all (is subservient to his or
her parents), also has a behavioral problem from a homeopathic
viewpoint. Why? Because - to say it lightly- s/he is not looking for
his/her own identity as an individual and cannot embrace life completely
without it.
Just to try to keep things in perspective. What we consider *health* in
homeopathy is the *freedom* to fulfill our dreams and live a rich and
creative life, in the pursuit of our higher purpose. This means freedom
from disease, from fear, from traumatic experiences, from fixed ideas
and rigid conceptions, from desructive relationships, and so on... In
homeopathy, health stops (and the disease process starts) when the flow
of life, which is flexible, creative and loving gets stuck somewhere. In
other words, when an individual is not in harmony inside and out.
Yol
--
Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com
Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org
**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Jon and Rue Kream
Hi Elaine - I'd be interested in your anarchy links. Thanks ~Rue
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/3/2003 11:36:24 PM Eastern Standard Time,
litlrooh@... writes:
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
litlrooh@... writes:
> I'm hoping he and I can get a skatepark built here.In PA? Has he been to Woodward? They might help.
>
> Kristen
>
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/4/03 9:34:50 AM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
surprise.)
Last night he bought Dave Mirra Freestyle BMX 2 for PS2. The whole game takes
place at Woodward. You can ride through the dining Hall, on all the tracks,
it's pretty cool!
Has anyone's kids gone there for camp?
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
> In PA? Has he been to Woodward? They might help.Zack may go there this summer. He's been asking forever. (Shh... It's a
>
> ~Kelly
>
>
>
surprise.)
Last night he bought Dave Mirra Freestyle BMX 2 for PS2. The whole game takes
place at Woodward. You can ride through the dining Hall, on all the tracks,
it's pretty cool!
Has anyone's kids gone there for camp?
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/4/2003 9:41:34 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Earthmomma67@... writes:
2-7?) He had a blast last year. Patti's boys AND her husband go every year.
It's a BEAUTIFUL drive up there, through Penn's Valley, so I don't mind AT
ALL taking them up! <G>
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Earthmomma67@... writes:
> Zack may go there this summer. He's been asking forever. (Shh... It's aCameron went last summer. He's going again --- the second session (June 1-6?
> surprise.)
> Last night he bought Dave Mirra Freestyle BMX 2 for PS2. The whole game
> takes
> place at Woodward. You can ride through the dining Hall, on all the tracks,
>
> it's pretty cool!
> Has anyone's kids gone there for camp?
2-7?) He had a blast last year. Patti's boys AND her husband go every year.
It's a BEAUTIFUL drive up there, through Penn's Valley, so I don't mind AT
ALL taking them up! <G>
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/3/03 9:20:49 PM, colnewt@... writes:
<< I think that the most detrimental thing my parents did in dealing with me
was trying to make me stop-- that just translated in my mind to more buttons
that I was pushing... which was partially my aim anyway. >>
Maybe a good way to both communicate with a teen in mid-protest and diffuse
the difficulty would be to draw the kid out to explain things to you, invite
her into the conversation, and find information for her. Send her links to
radical sites. <g>
Maybe if she sees it as something potentially mainstream and useful, she'll
stop.
Maybe she WON'T stop, but you'll be communicating and learning what she knows.
I figure if I agree with my kids that something shocking is interesting,
they'll be liking it because they really like it, rather than just because
it's a shocking thing adults wouldn't like.
From Netflix I got "An Evening with Kevin Smith." It's GREAT! Good stories,
funny exchanges, the intro where you choose "play" or chapters or subtitles
is a scream all by itself. I kept asking Marty to come and watch it. He
will, but he was busy.
If I had made a rule against him watching Kevin Smith, or banished "f-word"
input from our house, he would want it more, he would be sneaky about it...
but he will watch it or not for other reasons.
I realize this isn't in the realm of dangerous behavior involving police.
But some parents wouldn't realize that, assuming that every notch toward
debauchery will lead to prison.
Last night we were at a folksinging party. There's a humorous song I don't
know but have heard a few times. Kirby was there, and it was fun to watch
him hear it for the first time.
http://members.aol.com/berrymanp/alyrics/fword.html
It's called "A Chat With Your Mother (The F-Word Song)"
by Lou & Peter Berryman
Oh the pirates in their fetid galleons, daggers in their skivvies
With infected tattooed fingers on a blunderbuss or two
Signs of scurvy in their eyes & only mermaids on their minds
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
CHORUS:
We sit down to have a chat
It's F-word this and F-word that
I can't control how you young people talk to one another
But I don't want to hear you use that F-word with your mother
There's the lumberjacks from Kodiak vacationing in Anchorage
Enchanted with their pine tar soup & Caribou shampoo
With seven weeks of back pay in their aromatic woolens
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
There's the militant survivalists with Gucci bandeleros
Taking tacky khaki walkie talkies to the rendezvous
Trading all the latest armor-piercing ammo information
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
There are jocks who think that God himself is drooling in the bleachers
In a late November downpour with a belly full of brew
Their entire grasp of heaven has a lot to do with football
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
There's unsavory musicians with their filthy pinko lyrics
Who destroy the social fabric and enjoy it when they do
With their groupies & addictions & their poor heartbroken parents
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you...
<< I think that the most detrimental thing my parents did in dealing with me
was trying to make me stop-- that just translated in my mind to more buttons
that I was pushing... which was partially my aim anyway. >>
Maybe a good way to both communicate with a teen in mid-protest and diffuse
the difficulty would be to draw the kid out to explain things to you, invite
her into the conversation, and find information for her. Send her links to
radical sites. <g>
Maybe if she sees it as something potentially mainstream and useful, she'll
stop.
Maybe she WON'T stop, but you'll be communicating and learning what she knows.
I figure if I agree with my kids that something shocking is interesting,
they'll be liking it because they really like it, rather than just because
it's a shocking thing adults wouldn't like.
From Netflix I got "An Evening with Kevin Smith." It's GREAT! Good stories,
funny exchanges, the intro where you choose "play" or chapters or subtitles
is a scream all by itself. I kept asking Marty to come and watch it. He
will, but he was busy.
If I had made a rule against him watching Kevin Smith, or banished "f-word"
input from our house, he would want it more, he would be sneaky about it...
but he will watch it or not for other reasons.
I realize this isn't in the realm of dangerous behavior involving police.
But some parents wouldn't realize that, assuming that every notch toward
debauchery will lead to prison.
Last night we were at a folksinging party. There's a humorous song I don't
know but have heard a few times. Kirby was there, and it was fun to watch
him hear it for the first time.
http://members.aol.com/berrymanp/alyrics/fword.html
It's called "A Chat With Your Mother (The F-Word Song)"
by Lou & Peter Berryman
Oh the pirates in their fetid galleons, daggers in their skivvies
With infected tattooed fingers on a blunderbuss or two
Signs of scurvy in their eyes & only mermaids on their minds
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
CHORUS:
We sit down to have a chat
It's F-word this and F-word that
I can't control how you young people talk to one another
But I don't want to hear you use that F-word with your mother
There's the lumberjacks from Kodiak vacationing in Anchorage
Enchanted with their pine tar soup & Caribou shampoo
With seven weeks of back pay in their aromatic woolens
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
There's the militant survivalists with Gucci bandeleros
Taking tacky khaki walkie talkies to the rendezvous
Trading all the latest armor-piercing ammo information
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
There are jocks who think that God himself is drooling in the bleachers
In a late November downpour with a belly full of brew
Their entire grasp of heaven has a lot to do with football
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you
There's unsavory musicians with their filthy pinko lyrics
Who destroy the social fabric and enjoy it when they do
With their groupies & addictions & their poor heartbroken parents
It's from them I would expect to hear the F-word, not from you...
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/4/03 9:56:23 AM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
I'm going to register.
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
> so I don't mind ATAnd you'll stop to pick us up!
> ALL taking them up! <G>
> ~Kelly
>
>
>
>
I'm going to register.
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelli Traaseth
Hmmmm, this is interesting,,,,,,
**a teenager
who is *too* proper and does not rebel at all (is subservient to his or
her parents), also has a behavioral problem from a homeopathic
viewpoint. Why? Because - to say it lightly- s/he is not looking for
his/her own identity as an individual and cannot embrace life completely
without it.**
Yol, would you, or others, want to expound on this more, fits lots of people I know, don't necessarily feel very close to them, but it seems very main stream, I don't know maybe its just conservatism/comformism??
Now as an adult, if I allow myself to be that way, (what others think I should be) I get ill. As a teenager, I was probably ill too but didn't have the self awareness to see it, was never allowed it.
This seems to really lead me back to why we are unschooling;
In an unschooling life, my children won't ever have to feel pressure to be a 'certain' way, they can develop their true selves and feel good about it. They will see the value in their individuality and learn to nurture it and make the most of it. If they are different than me, I will embrace it. They will be able to make their own choices and really know who they are. And last but not least, I will also be able to learn who I am. What an amazing journey!
Take Care,
Kelli
bluelotus <bluelotus@...> wrote:>
what I understood from the post I was replying to, this other kid was
anxiously waiting to *get in trouble*. Even though I didn't inquire
further what that meant, I assumed there was a problem being expressed.
I don't think that rebelling is necessarily a behavioral problems either
as a definition (I am a rebel at heart myself and married one as well),
and rebelliousness during adolescence is quite normal and healthy in
general, but there are many different ways of rebelling, and some can be
very self-destructive. They come in all shapes, shades and forms.
I was referring to those who do have a problem, not because they don't
accept the mainstream *box* and hypocritical masquerade of politicians
and such, but because they can make their lives (and those around them)
miserable.
On the other side of the spectrum, just as a quick example: a teenager
who is *too* proper and does not rebel at all (is subservient to his or
her parents), also has a behavioral problem from a homeopathic
viewpoint. Why? Because - to say it lightly- s/he is not looking for
his/her own identity as an individual and cannot embrace life completely
without it.
Just to try to keep things in perspective. What we consider *health* in
homeopathy is the *freedom* to fulfill our dreams and live a rich and
creative life, in the pursuit of our higher purpose. This means freedom
from disease, from fear, from traumatic experiences, from fixed ideas
and rigid conceptions, from desructive relationships, and so on... In
homeopathy, health stops (and the disease process starts) when the flow
of life, which is flexible, creative and loving gets stuck somewhere. In
other words, when an individual is not in harmony inside and out.
Yol
--
Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com
Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org
**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
**a teenager
who is *too* proper and does not rebel at all (is subservient to his or
her parents), also has a behavioral problem from a homeopathic
viewpoint. Why? Because - to say it lightly- s/he is not looking for
his/her own identity as an individual and cannot embrace life completely
without it.**
Yol, would you, or others, want to expound on this more, fits lots of people I know, don't necessarily feel very close to them, but it seems very main stream, I don't know maybe its just conservatism/comformism??
Now as an adult, if I allow myself to be that way, (what others think I should be) I get ill. As a teenager, I was probably ill too but didn't have the self awareness to see it, was never allowed it.
This seems to really lead me back to why we are unschooling;
In an unschooling life, my children won't ever have to feel pressure to be a 'certain' way, they can develop their true selves and feel good about it. They will see the value in their individuality and learn to nurture it and make the most of it. If they are different than me, I will embrace it. They will be able to make their own choices and really know who they are. And last but not least, I will also be able to learn who I am. What an amazing journey!
Take Care,
Kelli
bluelotus <bluelotus@...> wrote:>
>Perhaps your kid didn't actually have a behavioral problem, but from
>
><A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeper
>imbalance >
>
>I'm sorry, but I don't really think that a kid who rebels against society is necessarily exhibiting a behaviour problem, or that this needs to be treated homeopathically. I have one son, now 20, who questions and rebels against big corporate business, war, the Americanization of other cultures, rules and regulations ad infinitum...He likes groups like the Sex Pistols - the Anarchy in the Uk mob. :-) I listene to them as a teen ,too :-). He has always had this anti authorrity streak - now he is older he exerts some of this angst by being a member of a political party. I don't feel that had/has a behaviour problem - now or when he was younger. It is just him, and he has learned to see where he can make a difference. And he has been a good influence on all the rest of us in the family - we are careful what we buy and where, for eg, as part of G's influence...Leonie W.
>
what I understood from the post I was replying to, this other kid was
anxiously waiting to *get in trouble*. Even though I didn't inquire
further what that meant, I assumed there was a problem being expressed.
I don't think that rebelling is necessarily a behavioral problems either
as a definition (I am a rebel at heart myself and married one as well),
and rebelliousness during adolescence is quite normal and healthy in
general, but there are many different ways of rebelling, and some can be
very self-destructive. They come in all shapes, shades and forms.
I was referring to those who do have a problem, not because they don't
accept the mainstream *box* and hypocritical masquerade of politicians
and such, but because they can make their lives (and those around them)
miserable.
On the other side of the spectrum, just as a quick example: a teenager
who is *too* proper and does not rebel at all (is subservient to his or
her parents), also has a behavioral problem from a homeopathic
viewpoint. Why? Because - to say it lightly- s/he is not looking for
his/her own identity as an individual and cannot embrace life completely
without it.
Just to try to keep things in perspective. What we consider *health* in
homeopathy is the *freedom* to fulfill our dreams and live a rich and
creative life, in the pursuit of our higher purpose. This means freedom
from disease, from fear, from traumatic experiences, from fixed ideas
and rigid conceptions, from desructive relationships, and so on... In
homeopathy, health stops (and the disease process starts) when the flow
of life, which is flexible, creative and loving gets stuck somewhere. In
other words, when an individual is not in harmony inside and out.
Yol
--
Blue Lotus Therapeutics -
Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Yoga & Therapeutic Massage
http://www.bluelotustherapeutics.com
Dhyanyoga Center of NC -
Meditation - Kundalini Maha Yoga
http://www.dyc-nc.org
**********************************
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone. The world is ruled by
letting things take their course. It cannot be ruled by interfering.
-- Tao Te Ching
**********************************
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Kelli Traaseth
Funny, Elissa,
We were driving all over looking for that game last week, I'll have to look closer at it, I have no idea what Woodward is?!
Kelli
Earthmomma67@... wrote:In a message dated 1/4/03 9:34:50 AM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
surprise.)
Last night he bought Dave Mirra Freestyle BMX 2 for PS2. The whole game takes
place at Woodward. You can ride through the dining Hall, on all the tracks,
it's pretty cool!
Has anyone's kids gone there for camp?
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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We were driving all over looking for that game last week, I'll have to look closer at it, I have no idea what Woodward is?!
Kelli
Earthmomma67@... wrote:In a message dated 1/4/03 9:34:50 AM Eastern Standard Time,
kbcdlovejo@... writes:
> In PA? Has he been to Woodward? They might help.Zack may go there this summer. He's been asking forever. (Shh... It's a
>
> ~Kelly
>
>
>
surprise.)
Last night he bought Dave Mirra Freestyle BMX 2 for PS2. The whole game takes
place at Woodward. You can ride through the dining Hall, on all the tracks,
it's pretty cool!
Has anyone's kids gone there for camp?
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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William Wordsworth
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
Camp Woodward, a skating/BMX camp in PA run by prof. skaters and riders.
<A HREF="http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html">http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html</A>
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<A HREF="http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html">http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html</A>
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelli Traaseth
Wow! I looked at the site,
thanks, Elissa and Kelly
Kelli
Earthmomma67@... wrote:Camp Woodward, a skating/BMX camp in PA run by prof. skaters and riders.
<A HREF="http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html">http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html</A>
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
thanks, Elissa and Kelly
Kelli
Earthmomma67@... wrote:Camp Woodward, a skating/BMX camp in PA run by prof. skaters and riders.
<A HREF="http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html">http://www.campwoodward.com/wweast/east_index.html</A>
*~*Elissa Jill*~*
unschooling Momma to 3 beautiful brilliant people
Loving partner for life to Joey
terrible guitarist, fair singer and happy woman.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Have a Nice Day!
Where is Woodard?
We live about 45 minuters from two skateparks. It would be so nice to have one here.
Kristen
We live about 45 minuters from two skateparks. It would be so nice to have one here.
Kristen
----- Original Message -----
From: kbcdlovejo@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2003 9:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Kids and Trouble
In a message dated 1/3/2003 11:36:24 PM Eastern Standard Time,
litlrooh@... writes:
> I'm hoping he and I can get a skatepark built here.
>
> Kristen
>
In PA? Has he been to Woodward? They might help.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[email protected]
In a message dated 1/3/2003 3:11:56 PM Central Standard Time,
elainegh8@... writes:
Somebody bought him a Mr. T Soap-on-a-Rope, and it has become a project of
photographing Mr. T in different settings and with different people. Since
Jon works in a mall, there's no lack of opportunity for people.
He showed me a picture of a group of teenagers, and the one holding Mr. T was
wearing a skullcap with that red anarchy symbol on it. But below the neck he
was wearing the same sweatshirt every other kid in the group was wearing! It
was quite humorous and informative.
The other pictures of Mr. T are funny, too. Maybe we'll put them on a
website somewhere.
Jon was just like the 14 yo girls that have been posted about. He was in
public school for a year when he was about 15-16. He organized a walk-out of
a school play that was about Christianity. He got in trouble for challenging
the English teacher when she talked about Christianity. (This was a rural
high school in Arkansas, where Christianity dominates.) He also got in
trouble for challenging the teacher about his right to use the restrooms at
will. Some of the teachers came to agreements with him. Others are probably
STILL glad he left! I know his guidance counselor is!
I handled it by encouraging him to push the limits that he felt necessary,
while also making clear that any consequences were his to own. I also
insisted that he strive at all times not to do anything that was actually
illegal (vandalism, violence, etc.). We talked about what some of those
things might be, and the repercussions if he did them and got caught. We
talked about the worth of the action versus the consequences. He knew he
didn't have to stay there if he didn't want to, and that I would drive the
150 miles to come and sign him out if I needed to. (He was living with his
father at the time.)
I can't say that I was always proud of what he did. He seemed to cause
unnecessary struggles for the teachers sometimes. But I figured he couldn't
be any worse than the kids who were challenges who DIDN'T have a parent
supporting and trusting them. My father labelled Jon a "contrarian" at an
early age (before he could walk, even). I don't know if it was correlation
or causation. <g> But that label still defines him in a lot of ways. He
and his girlfriend both have bright pink hair currently, yet they have
started to attend and perform dramas at an apparently (very) liberal
Christian church. Even I'm surprised, given his reaction when he took
college philosophy at age 14.
I think listening to kids is what gets you through. Wouldn't it be cool if
in 20 years your teenager said, "My mother always listened to me"?
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
elainegh8@... writes:
> There's aJon got a digital camera for x-mas and he's been having a lot of fun.
> lot of 'silliness' about anarchism on the net.
Somebody bought him a Mr. T Soap-on-a-Rope, and it has become a project of
photographing Mr. T in different settings and with different people. Since
Jon works in a mall, there's no lack of opportunity for people.
He showed me a picture of a group of teenagers, and the one holding Mr. T was
wearing a skullcap with that red anarchy symbol on it. But below the neck he
was wearing the same sweatshirt every other kid in the group was wearing! It
was quite humorous and informative.
The other pictures of Mr. T are funny, too. Maybe we'll put them on a
website somewhere.
Jon was just like the 14 yo girls that have been posted about. He was in
public school for a year when he was about 15-16. He organized a walk-out of
a school play that was about Christianity. He got in trouble for challenging
the English teacher when she talked about Christianity. (This was a rural
high school in Arkansas, where Christianity dominates.) He also got in
trouble for challenging the teacher about his right to use the restrooms at
will. Some of the teachers came to agreements with him. Others are probably
STILL glad he left! I know his guidance counselor is!
I handled it by encouraging him to push the limits that he felt necessary,
while also making clear that any consequences were his to own. I also
insisted that he strive at all times not to do anything that was actually
illegal (vandalism, violence, etc.). We talked about what some of those
things might be, and the repercussions if he did them and got caught. We
talked about the worth of the action versus the consequences. He knew he
didn't have to stay there if he didn't want to, and that I would drive the
150 miles to come and sign him out if I needed to. (He was living with his
father at the time.)
I can't say that I was always proud of what he did. He seemed to cause
unnecessary struggles for the teachers sometimes. But I figured he couldn't
be any worse than the kids who were challenges who DIDN'T have a parent
supporting and trusting them. My father labelled Jon a "contrarian" at an
early age (before he could walk, even). I don't know if it was correlation
or causation. <g> But that label still defines him in a lot of ways. He
and his girlfriend both have bright pink hair currently, yet they have
started to attend and perform dramas at an apparently (very) liberal
Christian church. Even I'm surprised, given his reaction when he took
college philosophy at age 14.
I think listening to kids is what gets you through. Wouldn't it be cool if
in 20 years your teenager said, "My mother always listened to me"?
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/3/2003 3:45:15 PM Central Standard Time,
bluelotus@... writes:
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
bluelotus@... writes:
> A behavioral problem in young people is just a sign of a greater, deeperI don't happen to think what she described was a "behavior problem" at all.
> imbalance that will usually show its ugly face time and again in the
> form of physical symptoms or more serious mental stuff.
>
Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tia Leschke
> I think listening to kids is what gets you through. Wouldn't it be coolif
> in 20 years your teenager said, "My mother always listened to me"?I was about to say something like, "what about the ones who won't talk?".
Then I remembered what I'd been thinking about lately, how I say what *I*
think to Lars far more often than I say, "what do *you* think?" I've been
realizing that I'm a good part of the reason why Lars doesn't talk much.
Yes, he's shy and reserved, but I guess he probably doesn't always want to
hear what I think, especially first. <g>
Tia
Betsy
**I've been
realizing that I'm a good part of the reason why Lars doesn't talk much.
Yes, he's shy and reserved, but I guess he probably doesn't always want to
hear what I think, especially first. **
Hi, Tia --
I dunno. I think introverts are real. I think there really are people
who don't get as much of a thrill out of expressing themselves as
extroverts do.
Will he talk leaning on the side of a pick-up truck? (I think that's a
Sandra article.) Will he talk when he's busy doing something with his
hands and not looking you in the face? My dh is really only any good
for conversation when he's *moving* so walks are good, and, fortunately
for my sanity, car rides are good. (And sometimes we swing on the
swingset and talk, if the whole family is at the park.)
But, you know, I've been thinking that we don't have conversations
because I fill up ALL the air time. Hmmmm. I've got that same
guilt/responsibility feeling that you have. I just don't know if it's
justified. It's really hard to tease out cause and effect here.
Betsy
PS I tried to send you private email but the mailer demon returned it
as undeliverable. Send me a private email if you can, ok?
realizing that I'm a good part of the reason why Lars doesn't talk much.
Yes, he's shy and reserved, but I guess he probably doesn't always want to
hear what I think, especially first. **
Hi, Tia --
I dunno. I think introverts are real. I think there really are people
who don't get as much of a thrill out of expressing themselves as
extroverts do.
Will he talk leaning on the side of a pick-up truck? (I think that's a
Sandra article.) Will he talk when he's busy doing something with his
hands and not looking you in the face? My dh is really only any good
for conversation when he's *moving* so walks are good, and, fortunately
for my sanity, car rides are good. (And sometimes we swing on the
swingset and talk, if the whole family is at the park.)
But, you know, I've been thinking that we don't have conversations
because I fill up ALL the air time. Hmmmm. I've got that same
guilt/responsibility feeling that you have. I just don't know if it's
justified. It's really hard to tease out cause and effect here.
Betsy
PS I tried to send you private email but the mailer demon returned it
as undeliverable. Send me a private email if you can, ok?