Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] My $2.00 worth.. Joyce
[email protected]
Joyce,
I find your advice valuable and useful. I also think that you have the most
tact and courtesy of anyone who holds views opposing my own ( even though, I
think in reality, my views are at least 90% in agreement with other
unschoolers) May I ask how you feel about how some of the others have
expressed thier views and opinions? Do you not agree that some comments have
been WAY out of line? I offer you kudos for moderating this group. I know it
takes time and effort.
Teresa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I find your advice valuable and useful. I also think that you have the most
tact and courtesy of anyone who holds views opposing my own ( even though, I
think in reality, my views are at least 90% in agreement with other
unschoolers) May I ask how you feel about how some of the others have
expressed thier views and opinions? Do you not agree that some comments have
been WAY out of line? I offer you kudos for moderating this group. I know it
takes time and effort.
Teresa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Shyrley
Just asking for a bit of advice re my MIL.
DH has invited her over from the UK to stay with us after Xmas. I'm
dreading the whole thing. She is a high school teacher of physics
and thinks physics and maths is the pinnacle of academic
acheivement. As you can imagine she doesn't approve of
unschooling in any way, shape or form and thinks I'm damaging my
kids and depriving them of oportunities to reach their full 'potential'
in physics (ahem)
When I first took the kids out of school she said it wasa good idea
as I could then concentrate on their maths and physics as, in her
opinion, schools don't teach physics well enough for my kids to do
a physics degree. i did pick my jaw up from the floor and point out
that maybe they didn't want to become physicists but she accused
me of saying that just to be m,anipulative. So there the situation
stands.
She hears nothing that I say, continually 'tests' the kids with
questions etc etc, not respecting their rights or my opinions.
Personally I wish she'd never darken my doorstep again (she also
goes on about my weight, my unfashionable clothes, my hair) but
DH is eager for her to visit and she is his mother and the kids
grandmother.
Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
DH has invited her over from the UK to stay with us after Xmas. I'm
dreading the whole thing. She is a high school teacher of physics
and thinks physics and maths is the pinnacle of academic
acheivement. As you can imagine she doesn't approve of
unschooling in any way, shape or form and thinks I'm damaging my
kids and depriving them of oportunities to reach their full 'potential'
in physics (ahem)
When I first took the kids out of school she said it wasa good idea
as I could then concentrate on their maths and physics as, in her
opinion, schools don't teach physics well enough for my kids to do
a physics degree. i did pick my jaw up from the floor and point out
that maybe they didn't want to become physicists but she accused
me of saying that just to be m,anipulative. So there the situation
stands.
She hears nothing that I say, continually 'tests' the kids with
questions etc etc, not respecting their rights or my opinions.
Personally I wish she'd never darken my doorstep again (she also
goes on about my weight, my unfashionable clothes, my hair) but
DH is eager for her to visit and she is his mother and the kids
grandmother.
Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/15/02 8:40:08 PM, shyrley.williams@... writes:
<< Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned? >>
I would fortify the kids with some practiced responses, tell them it's just
the way she is, and to just be nice to her and things will be back to calm
when she goes home.
It might not bother them nearly as much as you're afraid it will. (Or it
might, but they probably won't have the emotion and anxiety you have about
it.)
My kids are kind of amused by their grandparents' responses to them. Most of
the tension is in my own irritation and resentment. (Over the years, they
backed off.)
I would definitely have some John Holt or Gatto for her to read, if she
"seems interested" (which can mean "if she's being critical"), and if she
refuses to read it, you can remind her, if she starts in on it, that if she'd
read that she would understand your point of view better.
Sandra
<< Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned? >>
I would fortify the kids with some practiced responses, tell them it's just
the way she is, and to just be nice to her and things will be back to calm
when she goes home.
It might not bother them nearly as much as you're afraid it will. (Or it
might, but they probably won't have the emotion and anxiety you have about
it.)
My kids are kind of amused by their grandparents' responses to them. Most of
the tension is in my own irritation and resentment. (Over the years, they
backed off.)
I would definitely have some John Holt or Gatto for her to read, if she
"seems interested" (which can mean "if she's being critical"), and if she
refuses to read it, you can remind her, if she starts in on it, that if she'd
read that she would understand your point of view better.
Sandra
Mary Bianco
>From: "Shyrley" <shyrley.williams@...><<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?>>
Oh you poor thing. You mean the last suggestion isn't an option??? Shall I
take a road trip and kidnap her for you??? I could use some time off right
about now!
Other than that, can't help. I totally cut myself off from my in laws. Just
couldn't take them anymore. I try real hard to keep my mouth shut for the
sake of my husband and then explode because that really doesn't work for me.
Then I say all kinds of stuff!!!!
Can you just talk to your husband about how stressful it is for you and the
kids and maybe have him say something to her?? I know my husband is in
agreement with me and stands by my words and that helps with his family so
much. Other than that, I'm just a plane ride away!!!
Mary B
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Fetteroll
on 12/15/02 10:28 PM, grlynbl@... at grlynbl@... wrote:
My opinion is that it's my job to keep this list useful for listmembers. I
serve as a reminder to help people keep focused on what they presumably want
themselves: discussing unschooling.
I trust that people are self-aware enough to see what they've done to derail
that goal and mature enough to self-correct. They do it on their own because
they want the forum to stay useful, not because they fear some punishment
from the authorities.
There are people here I've known on lists and message boards for years -- in
a professional unschooling volunteer capacity you might say :-). I know from
the quality of what they say and the hours they volunteer saying it that
they *are* here to discuss unschooling and help others unschool. I know they
aren't here to deliberately hurt people and trust that if they have said
something hurtful that they recognize their mistake and don't need someone
to pushish or reprimand them. I also am aware that some people's posting
styles get repeatedly misperceived as personal attack when it is, as they
say, discussion of ideas.
Sometimes there are people who have goals other than or in addition to
discussing unschooling. So another part of my job is to look for patterns of
disruptive behavior that indicate goals that conflict and interfere with the
listmembers' goals.
Though as a moderator I can control *who* posts, none of us can control
*what* people post or *how* people post. I can only control what *I* post.
If someone posts something nasty -- or something I interpret as nasty -- I
get to choose how I respond. I can stoop to their level or I can be more
mature.
I know the people here and they are really truly trying to be helpful and
are not making personal attacks and are discussing ideas. I also know
everyone is human and they make mistakes. But presumably we're all here to
discuss unschooling so we should refocus on that and get back to it. :-)
Joyce
Unschooling-dotcom moderator
> May I ask how you feel about how some of the others haveThank you. :-)
> expressed thier views and opinions? Do you not agree that some comments have
> been WAY out of line? I offer you kudos for moderating this group. I know it
> takes time and effort.
My opinion is that it's my job to keep this list useful for listmembers. I
serve as a reminder to help people keep focused on what they presumably want
themselves: discussing unschooling.
I trust that people are self-aware enough to see what they've done to derail
that goal and mature enough to self-correct. They do it on their own because
they want the forum to stay useful, not because they fear some punishment
from the authorities.
There are people here I've known on lists and message boards for years -- in
a professional unschooling volunteer capacity you might say :-). I know from
the quality of what they say and the hours they volunteer saying it that
they *are* here to discuss unschooling and help others unschool. I know they
aren't here to deliberately hurt people and trust that if they have said
something hurtful that they recognize their mistake and don't need someone
to pushish or reprimand them. I also am aware that some people's posting
styles get repeatedly misperceived as personal attack when it is, as they
say, discussion of ideas.
Sometimes there are people who have goals other than or in addition to
discussing unschooling. So another part of my job is to look for patterns of
disruptive behavior that indicate goals that conflict and interfere with the
listmembers' goals.
Though as a moderator I can control *who* posts, none of us can control
*what* people post or *how* people post. I can only control what *I* post.
If someone posts something nasty -- or something I interpret as nasty -- I
get to choose how I respond. I can stoop to their level or I can be more
mature.
I know the people here and they are really truly trying to be helpful and
are not making personal attacks and are discussing ideas. I also know
everyone is human and they make mistakes. But presumably we're all here to
discuss unschooling so we should refocus on that and get back to it. :-)
Joyce
Unschooling-dotcom moderator
Nora or Devereaux Cannon
How to deal with her depends on what you want:
- If you want to force her to approve of you, then by all means
go at it hammer and tongs to prove to her that you are right
(though those convinced against their will are of the same
opinion still).
- If you want a peaceful and minimized conflict holiday season,
you might practice some gentle, deflecting comments - "how
interesting that you think that" "My, my, you don't say" -
strategize with the kids too, emphasizing that this in not a
mission in making an old lady miserable, but a way of avoiding
tension
- If you want a closer relationship, with more respect, you might
plan a run out for coffee or some such early in the visit and a
frank, respectful conversation, full of "when you do "x", I feel
"y"" rather than comments about how "you do "x", because you want
me to feel "y"" Practice with your husband who knows her better
than you do for likely gambits.
- If you want your husband to know just how much you are
suffering to be a "good wife and D-i-L", play up every single
comment that could be seen as in anyway critical.
- and so on....
- If you want to force her to approve of you, then by all means
go at it hammer and tongs to prove to her that you are right
(though those convinced against their will are of the same
opinion still).
- If you want a peaceful and minimized conflict holiday season,
you might practice some gentle, deflecting comments - "how
interesting that you think that" "My, my, you don't say" -
strategize with the kids too, emphasizing that this in not a
mission in making an old lady miserable, but a way of avoiding
tension
- If you want a closer relationship, with more respect, you might
plan a run out for coffee or some such early in the visit and a
frank, respectful conversation, full of "when you do "x", I feel
"y"" rather than comments about how "you do "x", because you want
me to feel "y"" Practice with your husband who knows her better
than you do for likely gambits.
- If you want your husband to know just how much you are
suffering to be a "good wife and D-i-L", play up every single
comment that could be seen as in anyway critical.
- and so on....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Shyrley" <shyrley.williams@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2002 9:44 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Mother-In_law
|
| Just asking for a bit of advice re my MIL.
| DH has invited her over from the UK to stay with us after Xmas.
I'm
| dreading the whole thing. She is a high school teacher of
physics
| and thinks physics and maths is the pinnacle of academic
| acheivement. As you can imagine she doesn't approve of
| unschooling in any way, shape or form and thinks I'm damaging
my
| kids and depriving them of oportunities to reach their full
'potential'
| in physics (ahem)
| When I first took the kids out of school she said it wasa good
idea
| as I could then concentrate on their maths and physics as, in
her
| opinion, schools don't teach physics well enough for my kids to
do
| a physics degree. i did pick my jaw up from the floor and point
out
| that maybe they didn't want to become physicists but she
accused
| me of saying that just to be m,anipulative. So there the
situation
| stands.
| She hears nothing that I say, continually 'tests' the kids with
| questions etc etc, not respecting their rights or my opinions.
| Personally I wish she'd never darken my doorstep again (she
also
| goes on about my weight, my unfashionable clothes, my hair) but
| DH is eager for her to visit and she is his mother and the kids
| grandmother.
| Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping
her
| mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
| How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?
|
| Shyrley
|
|
| "You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because
you are all the same."
|
|
| ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject
line! ~~~~
|
| If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list,
please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll
(fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener
(HEM-Editor@...).
|
| To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or
address an email to:
| [email protected]
|
| Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
|
| Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
|
|
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/15/02 10:26:39 PM Eastern Standard Time,
grlynbl@... writes:
are you trying to get me in trouble?
If Joyce chooses to mention her feelings to me, she will likely do it off
list as she has done to others in the past.
Elissa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
grlynbl@... writes:
> Do you not agree that some comments haveAs this was the 4th is a row, I have to ask,
> been WAY out of line? I offer you kudos for moderating this group. I know
> it
> takes time and effort.
>
> Teresa
>
>
>
are you trying to get me in trouble?
If Joyce chooses to mention her feelings to me, she will likely do it off
list as she has done to others in the past.
Elissa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deborah Lewis
Shyrley, would she take a friendly "ah, don't test me Grandma' it's
Christmas!" from your kids better than a "lay off" from you? Could
you advise your kids to kindly and politely stick up for themselves if
she gets pushy and it's bothering them?
Will your husband support you and maybe ask her to back off? What she
might not take seriously from you she may from him.
Maybe just very frankly telling her she's offending / hurting you and she
needs to stop.
That's a pretty stressful expectation and I'm sorry.
Deb L
Christmas!" from your kids better than a "lay off" from you? Could
you advise your kids to kindly and politely stick up for themselves if
she gets pushy and it's bothering them?
Will your husband support you and maybe ask her to back off? What she
might not take seriously from you she may from him.
Maybe just very frankly telling her she's offending / hurting you and she
needs to stop.
That's a pretty stressful expectation and I'm sorry.
Deb L
[email protected]
Or you could use my HORRIBLE passive-aggressive technique and pretend she
doesn't exist. I'm very good at it though!
Not exactly *kind* in any way, shape, or form. But sometimes it's the only
way I can get through a situation without blowing up and being incredibly
bitchy. I'm available for lessons! <G>
I'd suggest, though, to be sweet and kind and wish she'd go away.
~Kelly
doesn't exist. I'm very good at it though!
Not exactly *kind* in any way, shape, or form. But sometimes it's the only
way I can get through a situation without blowing up and being incredibly
bitchy. I'm available for lessons! <G>
I'd suggest, though, to be sweet and kind and wish she'd go away.
~Kelly
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 9:25, kbcdlovejo@... wrote:
that week. Y'all can come ;-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
> Or you could use my HORRIBLE passive-aggressive technique and pretendMaybe I should host several unschooling meetings in my home
> she doesn't exist. I'm very good at it though!
>
> Not exactly *kind* in any way, shape, or form. But sometimes it's the
> only way I can get through a situation without blowing up and being
> incredibly bitchy. I'm available for lessons! <G>
>
> I'd suggest, though, to be sweet and kind and wish she'd go away.
>
> ~Kelly
>
that week. Y'all can come ;-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/15/02 10:39:52 PM Eastern Standard Time,
shyrley.williams@... writes:
vacation from work when his dad is here and they spend a lot of quality time
together. "Take your dad to the Biltmore for the day, he'll love it and you
2 can spend time together". I just stay out of the picture a lot of the
time. Not allowing many opportunities for confrontation. Although you can
not always avoid it. I try to be nice when I say things and remember that it
is only for a short while and I don't have to see him often.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
shyrley.williams@... writes:
> How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?My husband's father is that same way. I tell my dh that he has to take
>
>
vacation from work when his dad is here and they spend a lot of quality time
together. "Take your dad to the Biltmore for the day, he'll love it and you
2 can spend time together". I just stay out of the picture a lot of the
time. Not allowing many opportunities for confrontation. Although you can
not always avoid it. I try to be nice when I say things and remember that it
is only for a short while and I don't have to see him often.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/15/02 10:39:52 PM Eastern Standard Time,
shyrley.williams@... writes:
vacation from work when his dad is here and they spend a lot of quality time
together. "Take your dad to the Biltmore for the day, he'll love it and you
2 can spend time together". I just stay out of the picture a lot of the
time. Not allowing many opportunities for confrontation. Although you can
not always avoid it. I try to be nice when I say things and remember that it
is only for a short while and I don't have to see him often.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
shyrley.williams@... writes:
> How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?My husband's father is that same way. I tell my dh that he has to take
>
>
vacation from work when his dad is here and they spend a lot of quality time
together. "Take your dad to the Biltmore for the day, he'll love it and you
2 can spend time together". I just stay out of the picture a lot of the
time. Not allowing many opportunities for confrontation. Although you can
not always avoid it. I try to be nice when I say things and remember that it
is only for a short while and I don't have to see him often.
Pam G.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
but pretending she doesn't exist on an email list wont work because she can't
SEE me pretending she doesn't exist.
I will be sweet and kind to Teresa, who is so upset over my insult to Yol,
who hasn'tr even responded!
Elissa
PS, List mom told me to behave.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SEE me pretending she doesn't exist.
I will be sweet and kind to Teresa, who is so upset over my insult to Yol,
who hasn'tr even responded!
Elissa
PS, List mom told me to behave.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelli Traaseth
Maybe Shyrley needs all sorts of 'unexpected' guests (unschooling buddies) to show up, we were just passing by! <g> "Oh, Hi, MIL, we unschool our family and we'd love to share with you!"
You'll be doing alot of deep breathing I'm sure.
Kelli
Mary Bianco <mummyone24@...> wrote:>From: "Shyrley" <shyrley.williams@...>
<<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?>>
Oh you poor thing. You mean the last suggestion isn't an option??? Shall I
take a road trip and kidnap her for you??? I could use some time off right
about now!
Other than that, can't help. I totally cut myself off from my in laws. Just
couldn't take them anymore. I try real hard to keep my mouth shut for the
sake of my husband and then explode because that really doesn't work for me.
Then I say all kinds of stuff!!!!
Can you just talk to your husband about how stressful it is for you and the
kids and maybe have him say something to her?? I know my husband is in
agreement with me and stands by my words and that helps with his family so
much. Other than that, I'm just a plane ride away!!!
Mary B
_________________________________________________________________
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
You'll be doing alot of deep breathing I'm sure.
Kelli
Mary Bianco <mummyone24@...> wrote:>From: "Shyrley" <shyrley.williams@...>
<<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?>>
Oh you poor thing. You mean the last suggestion isn't an option??? Shall I
take a road trip and kidnap her for you??? I could use some time off right
about now!
Other than that, can't help. I totally cut myself off from my in laws. Just
couldn't take them anymore. I try real hard to keep my mouth shut for the
sake of my husband and then explode because that really doesn't work for me.
Then I say all kinds of stuff!!!!
Can you just talk to your husband about how stressful it is for you and the
kids and maybe have him say something to her?? I know my husband is in
agreement with me and stands by my words and that helps with his family so
much. Other than that, I'm just a plane ride away!!!
Mary B
_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 6:46, Mary Bianco wrote:
she treated me and questioned the kids under the guise of
'concerned teacher'
DH has spent the last few months trying to persuade me to let her
visit. He's run 'but she's family' past me a few times.
If it was my sole decision (like if me and DH were divorced) then
she would never see us again but I try to be aware that she is his
mother, and that she is the garndmother of my children.
I kept quiet for 14 years then last Xmas just exploded. And said all
kinds of stuff. Dh and his father hid in the other room which is
typical of their family. They never deal with anything. Emotions
make them uncomfortable as does doing anything 'non-traditional'.
DH has loosened up a lot in some ways since he's known me.
doesn't seem the answer for me. I've told him this is her last
chance and just cos someone is family doesn't mean you have to
put up with crap from them.
The plane ride sounds good :-) I'll book my flight out for when she
lands so we'll only see her in passing.
Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
leave my kids in her clutches. She'll test them academically, then
she badgers DD to stay thin (DD is really skinny and MIL is
jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
scum. She ignores my boys cos they are of the lesser species.
Grrrrrrrrr
I think I need to do some meditation on this.
Shyrley
> >From: "Shyrley" <shyrley.williams@...>Good plan. I'll get the duct tape ready...
>
> <<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
> mouth and sticking er in the closet....) How have others answered
> relatives this thick-skinned?>>
>
>
> Oh you poor thing. You mean the last suggestion isn't an option???
> Shall I take a road trip and kidnap her for you??? I could use some
> time off right about now!
>I've had nothing to do with her since last xmas because of the way
> Other than that, can't help. I totally cut myself off from my in laws.
> Just couldn't take them anymore. I try real hard to keep my mouth shut
> for the sake of my husband and then explode because that really
> doesn't work for me. Then I say all kinds of stuff!!!!
she treated me and questioned the kids under the guise of
'concerned teacher'
DH has spent the last few months trying to persuade me to let her
visit. He's run 'but she's family' past me a few times.
If it was my sole decision (like if me and DH were divorced) then
she would never see us again but I try to be aware that she is his
mother, and that she is the garndmother of my children.
I kept quiet for 14 years then last Xmas just exploded. And said all
kinds of stuff. Dh and his father hid in the other room which is
typical of their family. They never deal with anything. Emotions
make them uncomfortable as does doing anything 'non-traditional'.
DH has loosened up a lot in some ways since he's known me.
>He's agreed to give her list of topics she may not broach which
> Can you just talk to your husband about how stressful it is for you
> and the kids and maybe have him say something to her?? I know my
> husband is in agreement with me and stands by my words and that helps
> with his family so much. Other than that, I'm just a plane ride
> away!!!
doesn't seem the answer for me. I've told him this is her last
chance and just cos someone is family doesn't mean you have to
put up with crap from them.
The plane ride sounds good :-) I'll book my flight out for when she
lands so we'll only see her in passing.
Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
leave my kids in her clutches. She'll test them academically, then
she badgers DD to stay thin (DD is really skinny and MIL is
jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
scum. She ignores my boys cos they are of the lesser species.
Grrrrrrrrr
I think I need to do some meditation on this.
Shyrley
>"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
> Mary B
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
> ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
>
> If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please
> email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the
> list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
>
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>
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>
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>
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/16/2002 9:19:35 AM Central Standard Time,
shyrley.williams@... writes:
in the room when she makes her comments and he stands up for your life
together, or you are free to pack up the kids and leave until she's gone.
I'm sure Elissa wouldn't mind having you in for a few days. ;)
I think after 14 years it's time for him to choose.
Ticked off Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
shyrley.williams@... writes:
> Dh and his father hid in the other room which isSeriously, I think I would give him an ultimatum. He either promises to stay
> typical of their family. They never deal with anything. Emotions
> make them uncomfortable as does doing anything 'non-traditional'.
> DH has loosened up a lot in some ways since he's known me.
>
in the room when she makes her comments and he stands up for your life
together, or you are free to pack up the kids and leave until she's gone.
I'm sure Elissa wouldn't mind having you in for a few days. ;)
I think after 14 years it's time for him to choose.
Ticked off Tuck
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelli Traaseth
Oh man Shyrley, I'm getting stressed from all the way up here!!
I would have a hard time leaving my kids there too!
Other wise I was going to say, come on up! We should have more snow by then.
I really feel for you,
Kelli
Shyrley <shyrley.williams@...> wrote:On 16 Dec 02, at 6:46, Mary Bianco wrote:
she treated me and questioned the kids under the guise of
'concerned teacher'
DH has spent the last few months trying to persuade me to let her
visit. He's run 'but she's family' past me a few times.
If it was my sole decision (like if me and DH were divorced) then
she would never see us again but I try to be aware that she is his
mother, and that she is the garndmother of my children.
I kept quiet for 14 years then last Xmas just exploded. And said all
kinds of stuff. Dh and his father hid in the other room which is
typical of their family. They never deal with anything. Emotions
make them uncomfortable as does doing anything 'non-traditional'.
DH has loosened up a lot in some ways since he's known me.
doesn't seem the answer for me. I've told him this is her last
chance and just cos someone is family doesn't mean you have to
put up with crap from them.
The plane ride sounds good :-) I'll book my flight out for when she
lands so we'll only see her in passing.
Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
leave my kids in her clutches. She'll test them academically, then
she badgers DD to stay thin (DD is really skinny and MIL is
jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
scum. She ignores my boys cos they are of the lesser species.
Grrrrrrrrr
I think I need to do some meditation on this.
Shyrley
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I would have a hard time leaving my kids there too!
Other wise I was going to say, come on up! We should have more snow by then.
I really feel for you,
Kelli
Shyrley <shyrley.williams@...> wrote:On 16 Dec 02, at 6:46, Mary Bianco wrote:
> >From: "Shyrley" <shyrley.williams@...>Good plan. I'll get the duct tape ready...
>
> <<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
> mouth and sticking er in the closet....) How have others answered
> relatives this thick-skinned?>>
>
>
> Oh you poor thing. You mean the last suggestion isn't an option???
> Shall I take a road trip and kidnap her for you??? I could use some
> time off right about now!
>I've had nothing to do with her since last xmas because of the way
> Other than that, can't help. I totally cut myself off from my in laws.
> Just couldn't take them anymore. I try real hard to keep my mouth shut
> for the sake of my husband and then explode because that really
> doesn't work for me. Then I say all kinds of stuff!!!!
she treated me and questioned the kids under the guise of
'concerned teacher'
DH has spent the last few months trying to persuade me to let her
visit. He's run 'but she's family' past me a few times.
If it was my sole decision (like if me and DH were divorced) then
she would never see us again but I try to be aware that she is his
mother, and that she is the garndmother of my children.
I kept quiet for 14 years then last Xmas just exploded. And said all
kinds of stuff. Dh and his father hid in the other room which is
typical of their family. They never deal with anything. Emotions
make them uncomfortable as does doing anything 'non-traditional'.
DH has loosened up a lot in some ways since he's known me.
>He's agreed to give her list of topics she may not broach which
> Can you just talk to your husband about how stressful it is for you
> and the kids and maybe have him say something to her?? I know my
> husband is in agreement with me and stands by my words and that helps
> with his family so much. Other than that, I'm just a plane ride
> away!!!
doesn't seem the answer for me. I've told him this is her last
chance and just cos someone is family doesn't mean you have to
put up with crap from them.
The plane ride sounds good :-) I'll book my flight out for when she
lands so we'll only see her in passing.
Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
leave my kids in her clutches. She'll test them academically, then
she badgers DD to stay thin (DD is really skinny and MIL is
jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
scum. She ignores my boys cos they are of the lesser species.
Grrrrrrrrr
I think I need to do some meditation on this.
Shyrley
>"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
> Mary B
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
> ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
>
> If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please
> email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the
> list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address
> an email to: [email protected]
>
> Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/16/02 2:32:10 AM, mummyone24@... writes:
<<
<<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?>>
places:
The Children's Museum
Natural History Museum
Space Cube (rocket museum)
public park
They see that the kids' reactions to things are interesting, that they're
bright and fun and creative.
Sandra
<<
<<Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?>>
>>When we have to deal with in-laws, it seems to work best at the following
places:
The Children's Museum
Natural History Museum
Space Cube (rocket museum)
public park
They see that the kids' reactions to things are interesting, that they're
bright and fun and creative.
Sandra
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 9:23, Kelli Traaseth wrote:
Northern Lights. If she really ticks me off I'll just leave and drive up
to your house.
Get the coffee on :-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
>I've laways wanted to visit Minnesota. I wanna see snow and the
> Oh man Shyrley, I'm getting stressed from all the way up here!!
>
> I would have a hard time leaving my kids there too!
>
> Other wise I was going to say, come on up! We should have more
> snow by then.
>
> I really feel for you,
>
> Kelli
>
Northern Lights. If she really ticks me off I'll just leave and drive up
to your house.
Get the coffee on :-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/16/02 8:19:22 AM, shyrley.williams@... writes:
<< Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
leave my kids in her clutches. >>
SMITHSONIAN
<< Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
leave my kids in her clutches. >>
SMITHSONIAN
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/16/02 11:51:26 AM Eastern Standard Time,
tuckervill@... writes:
Shyrley can come to our apartment and she and I will head off to Berkely west
virginia and do all the hot spring spa packages.
Elissa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tuckervill@... writes:
> I'm sure Elissa wouldn't mind having you in for a few days. ;)Oh Oh, she's scaring me. (ticked off tuck, that is)
>
> I think after 14 years it's time for him to choose.
>
> Ticked off Tuck
>
>
>
>
Shyrley can come to our apartment and she and I will head off to Berkely west
virginia and do all the hot spring spa packages.
Elissa
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelli Traaseth
I mean it!!! You are so welcome!!
I was going to e-mail the list last week, we had the most spectacular northern lights that I had ever seen. We had to get out of the car and just stand in awe. I have never seen anything like it, it was like the cartoon drawings of them, like in the movie Superman when he's with his crystals!! And we had just watched those movies!
I have 2 guest rooms, come on up! How long is she staying? Could you stay for a little bit and leave for a little. So she can see the kids for a little?
I'd meet you in Minneapolis, if you wanted! Other wise there is an airport in Bemidji!! There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St. Paul right now, Viking exhibit at the Science Center, Egyptian exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of Art.
You've got me going now.
Kelli
Shyrley <shyrley.williams@...> wrote:On 16 Dec 02, at 9:23, Kelli Traaseth wrote:
Northern Lights. If she really ticks me off I'll just leave and drive up
to your house.
Get the coffee on :-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I was going to e-mail the list last week, we had the most spectacular northern lights that I had ever seen. We had to get out of the car and just stand in awe. I have never seen anything like it, it was like the cartoon drawings of them, like in the movie Superman when he's with his crystals!! And we had just watched those movies!
I have 2 guest rooms, come on up! How long is she staying? Could you stay for a little bit and leave for a little. So she can see the kids for a little?
I'd meet you in Minneapolis, if you wanted! Other wise there is an airport in Bemidji!! There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St. Paul right now, Viking exhibit at the Science Center, Egyptian exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of Art.
You've got me going now.
Kelli
Shyrley <shyrley.williams@...> wrote:On 16 Dec 02, at 9:23, Kelli Traaseth wrote:
>I've laways wanted to visit Minnesota. I wanna see snow and the
> Oh man Shyrley, I'm getting stressed from all the way up here!!
>
> I would have a hard time leaving my kids there too!
>
> Other wise I was going to say, come on up! We should have more
> snow by then.
>
> I really feel for you,
>
> Kelli
>
Northern Lights. If she really ticks me off I'll just leave and drive up
to your house.
Get the coffee on :-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/16/02 12:59:19 PM, kellitraas@... writes:
<< There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St. Paul right now, Viking exhibit
at the Science Center, Egyptian exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of
Art.
whatever-all-that-stuff is.
We should all go to St. Paul.
(When we had quarterly trips to St. Paul, we got tired of going and missed a
few (when Keith was doing contract work there and the family could go visit
occasionally). NOW I want those I missed!! <g>)
Sandra
<< There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St. Paul right now, Viking exhibit
at the Science Center, Egyptian exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of
Art.
>>It must be nearly time for the winter carnival, ice parade, ice sculpture,
whatever-all-that-stuff is.
We should all go to St. Paul.
(When we had quarterly trips to St. Paul, we got tired of going and missed a
few (when Keith was doing contract work there and the family could go visit
occasionally). NOW I want those I missed!! <g>)
Sandra
Kelli Traaseth
Sure!!
Winter gathering in St. Paul,,,,,I'm sure my sister and brother wouldn't mind housing a bunch of people! <g>
Yeah, Winter Carnival should be going at that time. Although hopefully it will get colder or the Ice Palace will be a slush palace, its been up in the 40's lately, my snow is almost gone. Done in Mpls/St.Paul there isn't any snow right now. We need a dump!
You could stay at my house and we'll drive 4 hours, OK, so that's a drive, but it would be fun.
Kelli
SandraDodd@... wrote:
In a message dated 12/16/02 12:59:19 PM, kellitraas@... writes:
<< There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St. Paul right now, Viking exhibit
at the Science Center, Egyptian exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of
Art.
whatever-all-that-stuff is.
We should all go to St. Paul.
(When we had quarterly trips to St. Paul, we got tired of going and missed a
few (when Keith was doing contract work there and the family could go visit
occasionally). NOW I want those I missed!! <g>)
Sandra
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Winter gathering in St. Paul,,,,,I'm sure my sister and brother wouldn't mind housing a bunch of people! <g>
Yeah, Winter Carnival should be going at that time. Although hopefully it will get colder or the Ice Palace will be a slush palace, its been up in the 40's lately, my snow is almost gone. Done in Mpls/St.Paul there isn't any snow right now. We need a dump!
You could stay at my house and we'll drive 4 hours, OK, so that's a drive, but it would be fun.
Kelli
SandraDodd@... wrote:
In a message dated 12/16/02 12:59:19 PM, kellitraas@... writes:
<< There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St. Paul right now, Viking exhibit
at the Science Center, Egyptian exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of
Art.
>>It must be nearly time for the winter carnival, ice parade, ice sculpture,
whatever-all-that-stuff is.
We should all go to St. Paul.
(When we had quarterly trips to St. Paul, we got tired of going and missed a
few (when Keith was doing contract work there and the family could go visit
occasionally). NOW I want those I missed!! <g>)
Sandra
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 12/15/2002 9:39:55 PM Central Standard Time,
shyrley.williams@... writes:
For the testing of the kids, teach them in advance to take a turn asking a
question after she does. She'll ask "Can you tell me Newton's Laws?"
They'll either answer yes or no and then ask her something they are
interested in, like "Have you ever seen what can happen to a marshmallow in a
fire?"
When she goes on about you, just turn it back to her. My sister is a pest
about a lot of things, primarily lately about my mending ankle. She went on
and on yesterday about how she had broken her foot twice and how I really
needed to be doing this and that and why hadn't I gotten the doctor to do
this and that and yada, yada, yada. I interrupted her with a short answer
and then said "And how are YOU." She loves talking about herself. Ask you
mil how she does this or that and let her ramble on while you tune out. If
she starts in on the nagging again, turn it back to her again. She may never
get it, but you can learn to manipulate it.
You could also conduct a discourse on the many positive influences of Allan
Rickman in your life...
Elizabeth
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
shyrley.williams@... writes:
> She hears nothing that I say, continually 'tests' the kids withHere are some things that have worked for me, ymmv.
> questions etc etc, not respecting their rights or my opinions.
> Personally I wish she'd never darken my doorstep again (she also
> goes on about my weight, my unfashionable clothes, my hair) but
> DH is eager for her to visit and she is his mother and the kids
> grandmother.
> Any tips for dealing with this ordeal (apart from duct taping her
> mouth and sticking er in the closet....)
> How have others answered relatives this thick-skinned?
>
>
For the testing of the kids, teach them in advance to take a turn asking a
question after she does. She'll ask "Can you tell me Newton's Laws?"
They'll either answer yes or no and then ask her something they are
interested in, like "Have you ever seen what can happen to a marshmallow in a
fire?"
When she goes on about you, just turn it back to her. My sister is a pest
about a lot of things, primarily lately about my mending ankle. She went on
and on yesterday about how she had broken her foot twice and how I really
needed to be doing this and that and why hadn't I gotten the doctor to do
this and that and yada, yada, yada. I interrupted her with a short answer
and then said "And how are YOU." She loves talking about herself. Ask you
mil how she does this or that and let her ramble on while you tune out. If
she starts in on the nagging again, turn it back to her again. She may never
get it, but you can learn to manipulate it.
You could also conduct a discourse on the many positive influences of Allan
Rickman in your life...
Elizabeth
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Betsy
**Maybe I should host several unschooling meetings in my home
that week. Y'all can come ;-)**
I think that's brilliant! Multiply the targets and drag in as many
allies as you can find. With enough kids running in circles around her
she may get too dizzy to cause trouble. And you are unlikely to attempt
to murder her in front of so many witnesses.<g>
Betsy
more
**He's agreed to give her list of topics she may not broach which
doesn't seem the answer for me.**
Maybe you could spin this in a more positive way -- same list, but
change the title to "topics guaranteed to start a fight w. Shyrley".
Then the ball is really in her court as to whether or not she wants to
fight. It becomes more of a "warning" and less like a "restraining
order". With luck she'll decide that she PREFERS to have a pleasant visit.
**(DD is really skinny and MIL is
jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
scum.**
Does this educated woman know anything about anorexia? I recently read
some good articles (I think in back issues of Rosie). One was about a
woman who had fertility treatments and gave birth to twins while
undereating. The list of medical problems those children have is truly
tragic. The same issue had an anorexia article about Jamie Lyn Siegler
(sp?) on the Sopranos. Maybe the articles are available if you search
online? If your mil won't *read* them, then roll them up and whack her
over the head with them! Really!
that week. Y'all can come ;-)**
I think that's brilliant! Multiply the targets and drag in as many
allies as you can find. With enough kids running in circles around her
she may get too dizzy to cause trouble. And you are unlikely to attempt
to murder her in front of so many witnesses.<g>
Betsy
more
**He's agreed to give her list of topics she may not broach which
doesn't seem the answer for me.**
Maybe you could spin this in a more positive way -- same list, but
change the title to "topics guaranteed to start a fight w. Shyrley".
Then the ball is really in her court as to whether or not she wants to
fight. It becomes more of a "warning" and less like a "restraining
order". With luck she'll decide that she PREFERS to have a pleasant visit.
**(DD is really skinny and MIL is
jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
scum.**
Does this educated woman know anything about anorexia? I recently read
some good articles (I think in back issues of Rosie). One was about a
woman who had fertility treatments and gave birth to twins while
undereating. The list of medical problems those children have is truly
tragic. The same issue had an anorexia article about Jamie Lyn Siegler
(sp?) on the Sopranos. Maybe the articles are available if you search
online? If your mil won't *read* them, then roll them up and whack her
over the head with them! Really!
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 15:52, Betsy wrote:
and she was jealous. Told me I looked better like that cos I was so
fat before (135 pounds)
My hair was falling out etc etc.
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
>I was anorexic and went down to 70 pounds or so - I'm 5 foot 10
> **(DD is really skinny and MIL is
> jealous) filling her head with shit about overweight people being
> scum.**
>
> Does this educated woman know anything about anorexia? I recently
> read some good articles (I think in back issues of Rosie). One was
> about a woman who had fertility treatments and gave birth to twins
> while undereating. The list of medical problems those children have
> is truly tragic. The same issue had an anorexia article about Jamie
> Lyn Siegler (sp?) on the Sopranos. Maybe the articles are available
> if you search online? If your mil won't *read* them, then roll them
> up and whack her over the head with them! Really!
>
and she was jealous. Told me I looked better like that cos I was so
fat before (135 pounds)
My hair was falling out etc etc.
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 18:30, ejcrewe@... wrote:
screen saver of AR, show her the web sites I visit then watch all his
films :-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
>Coo. What a brilliant idea. I could talk about AR, show her my
> You could also conduct a discourse on the many positive influences of
> Allan Rickman in your life...
>
> Elizabeth
>
screen saver of AR, show her the web sites I visit then watch all his
films :-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 11:56, Kelli Traaseth wrote:
We're spending xmas here and MIL ain't due till January. Hows
Jan? Lots of snow?
We'd drive. I hate flying. I think its about 1000 miles to Minn.
3 days for me.
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
>I am so tempted. How long do the northern lights last?
> I mean it!!! You are so welcome!!
>
> I was going to e-mail the list last week, we had the most
> spectacular northern lights that I had ever seen. We had to get out
> of the car and just stand in awe. I have never seen anything like
> it, it was like the cartoon drawings of them, like in the movie
> Superman when he's with his crystals!! And we had just watched
> those movies!
>
We're spending xmas here and MIL ain't due till January. Hows
Jan? Lots of snow?
> I have 2 guest rooms, come on up! How long is she staying? CouldI'm packing, I'm packing....
> you stay for a little bit and leave for a little. So she can see the
> kids for a little?
>Coo.
> I'd meet you in Minneapolis, if you wanted! Other wise there is
> an airport in Bemidji!! There is a ton to do in Minneapolis/St.
> Paul right now, Viking exhibit at the Science Center, Egyptian
> exhibit at the Minneapolis Institute of Art.
We'd drive. I hate flying. I think its about 1000 miles to Minn.
3 days for me.
>Me too. I'll certainly come up to Bemidji at some point.
> You've got me going now.
>
> Kelli
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
Shyrley
On 16 Dec 02, at 13:20, SandraDodd@... wrote:
As an exhibit or what?
;-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."
>They'll take her will they?
> In a message dated 12/16/02 8:19:22 AM, shyrley.williams@...
> writes:
>
> << Actually DH did suggest I went away that week but I'm reluctant to
> leave my kids in her clutches. >>
>
> SMITHSONIAN
>
As an exhibit or what?
;-)
Shyrley
"You laugh at me because I'm different. I laugh at you because you are all the same."