[email protected]

In a message dated 10/27/02 6:13:18 AM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

<<
Thank you Pam for writing this, I agree with you on the Jesus point, I can
see him loving unschooling!
I'm going out on a limb now, look out,
If I were a 'better' Christian my signature line might read:
Jesus was an unschooler!
Kelli >>

Yep, yep, yep!!!
I often think of the story of his parents discovering he wasn't with them as
they left town (after passover I believe) and finding him with the sages and
wise men of the Jewish faith...learning from them.
He didn't ask his parent permission apparently, they were upset to discover
he was missing.
And I don't read of him getting beaten or berated for choosing his own path.
He answered them in a very adult manner and we don't read that he was taught
to "answer the first time they call" or anything.
Interesting food for thought for the spanker out there.....

Ren

Kelli Traaseth

Yep!
And this is exactly why I am having a hard time going to church right now!
I hear such contradictions. And I am way to honest for them.
Take Care,
Kelli
starsuncloud@... wrote:In a message dated 10/27/02 6:13:18 AM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

<<
Thank you Pam for writing this, I agree with you on the Jesus point, I can
see him loving unschooling!
I'm going out on a limb now, look out,
If I were a 'better' Christian my signature line might read:
Jesus was an unschooler!
Kelli >>

Yep, yep, yep!!!
I often think of the story of his parents discovering he wasn't with them as
they left town (after passover I believe) and finding him with the sages and
wise men of the Jewish faith...learning from them.
He didn't ask his parent permission apparently, they were upset to discover
he was missing.
And I don't read of him getting beaten or berated for choosing his own path.
He answered them in a very adult manner and we don't read that he was taught
to "answer the first time they call" or anything.
Interesting food for thought for the spanker out there.....

Ren

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[email protected]

Jesus really did personify the essence of unschooling, IMO. He spoke
about LIVING the word of God and having it written on your heart. He
showed the difference between what the power mongering religious leaders
of the day were doing and what true belief was.

I have used His example many times to illustrate how unschooling works.
Jesus didn't hand out curriculm to his disciples, He lived life with them
and guided them through the experiences. He didn't wait for "lesson
time" to teach, it happened constantly, whenever and wherever, He was
always ready to discuss and explore.

Kris

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[email protected]

In a message dated 10/27/02 8:45:04 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:

<< I often think of the story of his parents discovering he wasn't with them
as
they left town (after passover I believe) and finding him with the sages and
wise men of the Jewish faith...learning from them. >>

I think it says he was teaching them.

In an early-20th century children's literature series, there was a retelling
of that tale and they said Jesus was with his schoolgroup, and that of course
Jesus had to go to school, just like you do (addressed to the reader). They
showed the trip to Jerusalem as some sort of school field trip, if I remember
correctly.

I can't go find it for a few months, but if someone reminds me I'll try to
quote the whole thing here. <g>

<<And I don't read of him getting beaten or berated for choosing his own
path. >>

There's an English ballad about Jesus getting a spanking.
Sometimes it's called The Bitter Withy or The Rainbow Bridge--the title and
texts aren't always even similar, but Jesus goes and asks some kids if he can
play ball with them, and they say
O we are Lords and Ladies' sons
Born in bower or in hall, in hall,
And you are but a poor maid's child
Born in an ox's stall

Well if you are lords and ladies sons
Born in bower or in hall, in hall,
Then at the very end I shall make it appear
That I am above you all

So our Savior built a bridge of the beams of the sun
Over it gone, he gone, gone he,
and after followed the three jolly children
and drownded were they all three.

(It was upling scorn and downling scorn)
The mothers of them did whoop and call
Crying out, "Mary Mild, call home your child
For ours are dronwded all."

Mary Mild, Mary Mild called home her child
Laid our Savior across her knee
And with a whole handfull of bitter withy
She gave him slashes three

(And the last verse is jesus speaking)
...the withy that causes me to smart, to smart
The withy it shall be the very first tree
That perisheth at the heart (or hearth, in some texts)

So Jesus got spanked with willow and cursed the willow tree. Those kinds of
stories are called apocryphal stories, and in the Middle Ages many of them
were believed just as surely as if they had been in the Bible.

So that would justify spankings, since Jesus even got one. (For murder, but
the song doesn't discuss that. They should have let him play ball and not
insulted his mother, I guess.)

Sandra

kayb85

--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 10/27/02 8:45:04 AM, starsuncloud@c... writes:
>
> << I often think of the story of his parents discovering he wasn't
with them
> as
> they left town (after passover I believe) and finding him with the
sages and
> wise men of the Jewish faith...learning from them. >>
>
> I think it says he was teaching them.
>
> In an early-20th century children's literature series, there was a
retelling
> of that tale and they said Jesus was with his schoolgroup, and that
of course
> Jesus had to go to school, just like you do (addressed to the
reader). They
> showed the trip to Jerusalem as some sort of school field trip, if
I remember
> correctly.
>
> I can't go find it for a few months, but if someone reminds me I'll
try to
> quote the whole thing here. <g>
>
> <<And I don't read of him getting beaten or berated for choosing
his own
> path. >>
>
> There's an English ballad about Jesus getting a spanking.
> Sometimes it's called The Bitter Withy or The Rainbow Bridge--the
title and
> texts aren't always even similar, but Jesus goes and asks some kids
if he can
> play ball with them, and they say
> O we are Lords and Ladies' sons
> Born in bower or in hall, in hall,
> And you are but a poor maid's child
> Born in an ox's stall
>
> Well if you are lords and ladies sons
> Born in bower or in hall, in hall,
> Then at the very end I shall make it appear
> That I am above you all
>
> So our Savior built a bridge of the beams of the sun
> Over it gone, he gone, gone he,
> and after followed the three jolly children
> and drownded were they all three.
>
> (It was upling scorn and downling scorn)
> The mothers of them did whoop and call
> Crying out, "Mary Mild, call home your child
> For ours are dronwded all."
>
> Mary Mild, Mary Mild called home her child
> Laid our Savior across her knee
> And with a whole handfull of bitter withy
> She gave him slashes three
>
> (And the last verse is jesus speaking)
> ...the withy that causes me to smart, to smart
> The withy it shall be the very first tree
> That perisheth at the heart (or hearth, in some texts)
>
> So Jesus got spanked with willow and cursed the willow tree. Those
kinds of
> stories are called apocryphal stories, and in the Middle Ages many
of them
> were believed just as surely as if they had been in the Bible.
>
> So that would justify spankings, since Jesus even got one. (For
murder, but
> the song doesn't discuss that. They should have let him play ball
and not
> insulted his mother, I guess.)
>
> Sandra

I think most Christians today would agree that Jesus was without sin,
therefore never did anything that would deserve a spanking. But it is
sad what religion will say and what people will believe, just because
a religious person said it.
Sheila

[email protected]

In a message dated 10/27/02 8:18:31 PM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

<< I think most Christians today would agree that Jesus was without sin,
therefore never did anything that would deserve a spanking. >>

So not telling your parents where you are going, and making them worry about
you needlessly, would not be deemed worthy of a spanking by most Christians?
I think he was probably a pretty normal baby and toddler that got into stuff
and all.
A Christian family today that believes in spanking, would have found cause to
hit I'm sure.

Ren

kayb85

> So not telling your parents where you are going, and making them
worry about
> you needlessly, would not be deemed worthy of a spanking by most
Christians?

Maybe. Most Christian spankers I know only spank for outright
disobedience. Like, "Don't go anywhere other than here" and the
child goes there anyway. Something like this may or may not be just
considered a misunderstanding. However, Mary and Joseph knew who He
was. They knew that He was not only their son, but their Savior and
Master as well. Their son created them. Weird situation, huh?

> I think he was probably a pretty normal baby and toddler that got
into stuff
> and all.

Most Christian spankers I know wouldn't punish a baby or toddler for
just getting into stuff out of normal toddler curiousity. Only when
the child is told, "Don't get into that cabinet" and the child says
no and goes into teh cabinet anyway.

Sheila