Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] nicknames and my family
Myranda
Alright, please don't anyone take offense here, but this is really starting to bug me. First off, my son, when asked why he's called lazybones, has in the past answered, because most times I like to stay put a lot more than getting up and doing a bunch of stuff. He has a very good grasp on the meaning we give, and the dictionary gives, "lazy", and it is not negative in any way, shape, or form.
Secondly, these nicknames ARE positive to us, or we wouldn't be using them. (yes, we all have more than one, and lord knows I'll never mention them on here) By us I do mean all of us, not just me or whoever is using the nickname.
Yes, I'm saying that it doesn't hurt because I am the one here listening to my children's thoughts and wishes and following them. No one else is here and cannot make judgement calls about our family life.
If you (general you) have life experiences that have caused you to believe that some words are negative no matter what, and that you disliked or were hurt by being called a nickname, then I'm sorry. I promise I will never call you by a nickname. But those are your thoughts and feelings, not mine or my children's.
I'm not upset at the fact it was brought up that some things CAN be hurtful, but I am very upset at all of the insinuations that I do not know my own children, that they would not speak up and tell me things, that I do not take care of them right, and most of all, that you (again, general) know better than I how my own children think and feel. I devoutly pray I will never come down so judgementally on someone I've never even met, and presume to know what goes on in their children's heads and hearts. No matter what kind of experiences or degrees or research one has done, they cannot know a child better than the mother does.
And I'll shut up now before I say something I really shouldn't and lose any friends I have here. (See, Sandra, I will come out and say something if it is what I really mean.)
Myranda <-- who has no hard feelings, and hope she has caused none
Scene: two little boys sitting on front porch,
chatting and lounging. The day is hot.
Mom enters from the house.
Mom: Hey Guys. (to son with affection)How's my little
Lazybones liking this heat?
Son: It's hot.
Mom - exits to garden.
Other Boy: Why does your Mom always call you
Lazybones. Are you Lazy?
Son: I don't know. I guess I am Lazy.
This is how you want your son to think of himself?
Why is it hard to understand that calling someone a
negative thing results in them thinking negatively
about themselves? That's not something we made up,
it's been consistently found to be true.
We're not saying don't call him anything endearing or
affectionate, but why not something that is positive
(my little Go-getter)or even nuetral (my little
snickerdoodle)?
You're saying it doesn't hurt. We are all telling you
that it does. Why wait to find out when it's too late?
Elissa Jill
--- Myranda <myrandab@...> wrote:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Secondly, these nicknames ARE positive to us, or we wouldn't be using them. (yes, we all have more than one, and lord knows I'll never mention them on here) By us I do mean all of us, not just me or whoever is using the nickname.
Yes, I'm saying that it doesn't hurt because I am the one here listening to my children's thoughts and wishes and following them. No one else is here and cannot make judgement calls about our family life.
If you (general you) have life experiences that have caused you to believe that some words are negative no matter what, and that you disliked or were hurt by being called a nickname, then I'm sorry. I promise I will never call you by a nickname. But those are your thoughts and feelings, not mine or my children's.
I'm not upset at the fact it was brought up that some things CAN be hurtful, but I am very upset at all of the insinuations that I do not know my own children, that they would not speak up and tell me things, that I do not take care of them right, and most of all, that you (again, general) know better than I how my own children think and feel. I devoutly pray I will never come down so judgementally on someone I've never even met, and presume to know what goes on in their children's heads and hearts. No matter what kind of experiences or degrees or research one has done, they cannot know a child better than the mother does.
And I'll shut up now before I say something I really shouldn't and lose any friends I have here. (See, Sandra, I will come out and say something if it is what I really mean.)
Myranda <-- who has no hard feelings, and hope she has caused none
Scene: two little boys sitting on front porch,
chatting and lounging. The day is hot.
Mom enters from the house.
Mom: Hey Guys. (to son with affection)How's my little
Lazybones liking this heat?
Son: It's hot.
Mom - exits to garden.
Other Boy: Why does your Mom always call you
Lazybones. Are you Lazy?
Son: I don't know. I guess I am Lazy.
This is how you want your son to think of himself?
Why is it hard to understand that calling someone a
negative thing results in them thinking negatively
about themselves? That's not something we made up,
it's been consistently found to be true.
We're not saying don't call him anything endearing or
affectionate, but why not something that is positive
(my little Go-getter)or even nuetral (my little
snickerdoodle)?
You're saying it doesn't hurt. We are all telling you
that it does. Why wait to find out when it's too late?
Elissa Jill
--- Myranda <myrandab@...> wrote:
> I see that, but it is not the case with us.__________________________________________________
> Nicknames are not labels unless used as such. Just
> because you call someone "sweetie" doesn't mean that
> they are always sweet, does it? It's just a nice,
> friendly, nickname. Ugh, and I said I wouldn't say
> anything else on this subject!
> Myranda
> Myranda,
> I think what many are trying to point out to you
> is
> that you ARE labeling, (ds1 is the lazy one, ds2
> is
> the curious one, etc) and that maybe your words
> may be
> damaging in a way you have not realized. Think
> about
> what we are saying. We may be picking up on
> something
> you are not aware of, showing you some of the
> words
> and phrases you've been using and implications of
> those words.
> Elissa Jill
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pam Hartley
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Myranda" <myrandab@b...>
wrote:
do not know my own children, that they would not speak up and
tell me things, that I do not take care of them right, and most of
all, that you (again, general) know better than I how my own
children think and feel. I devoutly pray I will never come down so
judgementally on someone I've never even met, and presume to
know what goes on in their children's heads and hearts. No
matter what kind of experiences or degrees or research one has
done, they cannot know a child better than the mother does.
think they do, and don't. Some mothers know their children very
well indeed, and still get some things wrong. No mother is 100%
right every time about what her child likes, doesn't like, is able or
willing to tell her, isn't able or willing to tell her.
I think it's foolish to believe that all mothers know their children
and do what's best for them all the time. I even think it's foolish to
believe that a terrific mother always knows what's best for her
children or is personally capable of always doing what's best
even when she knows it.
If the opinion of strangers is bothering you, it can mean several
things: it can mean that you were hoping the people here would
just nod and smile if they disagreed with you (or were hoping
they would never disagree with you to begin with, as one poster
wrote she was disappointed to find people not "open minded"); it
can mean that at some level you think you're wrong and, your
back to the wall of your own making, are fighting us instead
having to face something unpleasant.
No one here can make you change, or look at things you're
doing. If you stopped posting responses, those debating would
soon stop, too, so you have some control here. You have
explained your position repeatedly. Various people here have
disagreed with that position, repeatedly. You are under no
obligation to lie to us and say you think we're right, we're under
no obligation to lie to you and say, "oh, yes, mothers always
know best and of course you're doing it right" if we don't think so.
It's a weary world.
Pam
wrote:
> I'm not upset at the fact it was brought up that some thingsCAN be hurtful, but I am very upset at all of the insinuations that I
do not know my own children, that they would not speak up and
tell me things, that I do not take care of them right, and most of
all, that you (again, general) know better than I how my own
children think and feel. I devoutly pray I will never come down so
judgementally on someone I've never even met, and presume to
know what goes on in their children's heads and hearts. No
matter what kind of experiences or degrees or research one has
done, they cannot know a child better than the mother does.
>Some mothers do not know their children at all. Some mothers
think they do, and don't. Some mothers know their children very
well indeed, and still get some things wrong. No mother is 100%
right every time about what her child likes, doesn't like, is able or
willing to tell her, isn't able or willing to tell her.
I think it's foolish to believe that all mothers know their children
and do what's best for them all the time. I even think it's foolish to
believe that a terrific mother always knows what's best for her
children or is personally capable of always doing what's best
even when she knows it.
If the opinion of strangers is bothering you, it can mean several
things: it can mean that you were hoping the people here would
just nod and smile if they disagreed with you (or were hoping
they would never disagree with you to begin with, as one poster
wrote she was disappointed to find people not "open minded"); it
can mean that at some level you think you're wrong and, your
back to the wall of your own making, are fighting us instead
having to face something unpleasant.
No one here can make you change, or look at things you're
doing. If you stopped posting responses, those debating would
soon stop, too, so you have some control here. You have
explained your position repeatedly. Various people here have
disagreed with that position, repeatedly. You are under no
obligation to lie to us and say you think we're right, we're under
no obligation to lie to you and say, "oh, yes, mothers always
know best and of course you're doing it right" if we don't think so.
It's a weary world.
Pam
Myranda
Opinions do not bother me at all; opinions presented as fact do bother me, no matter what the subject.
Myranda
From: Pam Hartley
Some mothers do not know their children at all. Some mothers
think they do, and don't. Some mothers know their children very
well indeed, and still get some things wrong. No mother is 100%
right every time about what her child likes, doesn't like, is able or
willing to tell her, isn't able or willing to tell her.
I think it's foolish to believe that all mothers know their children
and do what's best for them all the time. I even think it's foolish to
believe that a terrific mother always knows what's best for her
children or is personally capable of always doing what's best
even when she knows it.
If the opinion of strangers is bothering you, it can mean several
things: it can mean that you were hoping the people here would
just nod and smile if they disagreed with you (or were hoping
they would never disagree with you to begin with, as one poster
wrote she was disappointed to find people not "open minded"); it
can mean that at some level you think you're wrong and, your
back to the wall of your own making, are fighting us instead
having to face something unpleasant.
No one here can make you change, or look at things you're
doing. If you stopped posting responses, those debating would
soon stop, too, so you have some control here. You have
explained your position repeatedly. Various people here have
disagreed with that position, repeatedly. You are under no
obligation to lie to us and say you think we're right, we're under
no obligation to lie to you and say, "oh, yes, mothers always
know best and of course you're doing it right" if we don't think so.
It's a weary world.
Pam
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
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To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
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Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Myranda
From: Pam Hartley
Some mothers do not know their children at all. Some mothers
think they do, and don't. Some mothers know their children very
well indeed, and still get some things wrong. No mother is 100%
right every time about what her child likes, doesn't like, is able or
willing to tell her, isn't able or willing to tell her.
I think it's foolish to believe that all mothers know their children
and do what's best for them all the time. I even think it's foolish to
believe that a terrific mother always knows what's best for her
children or is personally capable of always doing what's best
even when she knows it.
If the opinion of strangers is bothering you, it can mean several
things: it can mean that you were hoping the people here would
just nod and smile if they disagreed with you (or were hoping
they would never disagree with you to begin with, as one poster
wrote she was disappointed to find people not "open minded"); it
can mean that at some level you think you're wrong and, your
back to the wall of your own making, are fighting us instead
having to face something unpleasant.
No one here can make you change, or look at things you're
doing. If you stopped posting responses, those debating would
soon stop, too, so you have some control here. You have
explained your position repeatedly. Various people here have
disagreed with that position, repeatedly. You are under no
obligation to lie to us and say you think we're right, we're under
no obligation to lie to you and say, "oh, yes, mothers always
know best and of course you're doing it right" if we don't think so.
It's a weary world.
Pam
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
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Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Betsy
Nine out of ten people that you meet on the street will tell you that
lazy is a negative word. It's kind of surprising that you don't already
know that.
Betsy
**
I'm not upset at the fact it was brought up that some things CAN be hurtful,
but I am very upset at all of the insinuations that I do not know my own
children, that they would not speak up and tell me things, that I do not
take care of them right, and most of all, that you (again, general) know
better than I how my own children think and feel. I devoutly pray I will
never come down so judgementally on someone I've never even met, and presume
to know what goes on in their children's heads and hearts. No matter what
kind of experiences or degrees or research one has done, they cannot
know a
child better than the mother does. **
lazy is a negative word. It's kind of surprising that you don't already
know that.
Betsy
**
I'm not upset at the fact it was brought up that some things CAN be hurtful,
but I am very upset at all of the insinuations that I do not know my own
children, that they would not speak up and tell me things, that I do not
take care of them right, and most of all, that you (again, general) know
better than I how my own children think and feel. I devoutly pray I will
never come down so judgementally on someone I've never even met, and presume
to know what goes on in their children's heads and hearts. No matter what
kind of experiences or degrees or research one has done, they cannot
know a
child better than the mother does. **
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/10/2002 12:56:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
myrandab@... writes:
fact?
You're telling us that the name does NOT and will not hurt your child.
I think that is your opinion being presented as fact.
So what on other people's part is bothering you?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
myrandab@... writes:
> Opinions do not bother me at all; opinions presented as fact do bother me,What has someone said here which seemed to you as being opinion presented as
> no matter what the subject.
>
fact?
You're telling us that the name does NOT and will not hurt your child.
I think that is your opinion being presented as fact.
So what on other people's part is bothering you?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Myranda
Several people have stated that it does and will hurt my children to be called nicknames, especially ones that others view as negative. There is no way anyone can know this as they are not here.
I'm not telling my opinion that it will not/does not hurt my children, it is fact. They want the nickname, they asked to be called the nickname, they are happy if we use the nickname, they get upset if no one uses the nickname. They say when they do not want to be called the nickname any longer. Can't get any clearer than that.
Myranda
What has someone said here which seemed to you as being opinion presented as
fact?
You're telling us that the name does NOT and will not hurt your child.
I think that is your opinion being presented as fact.
So what on other people's part is bothering you?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'm not telling my opinion that it will not/does not hurt my children, it is fact. They want the nickname, they asked to be called the nickname, they are happy if we use the nickname, they get upset if no one uses the nickname. They say when they do not want to be called the nickname any longer. Can't get any clearer than that.
Myranda
What has someone said here which seemed to you as being opinion presented as
fact?
You're telling us that the name does NOT and will not hurt your child.
I think that is your opinion being presented as fact.
So what on other people's part is bothering you?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]