[email protected]

Thanks all. Many good ideas. I just have such resistance to being taught.
It feels like it would be hard to find a teacher who wouldn't teach! Right
now what I do when I have time is choose songs I like or want to know and
play the right hand because I can't read bass clef. (Actually the whole
notion of reading two lines of music in different clefs at the same time
totally overwhelms me!) I've been feeling like I'm not following school
rules by doing this, but I've noticed I'm getting better at it.

Re whether someone is self taught if they take lessons, etc.: I think this
is a mostly semantic distinction that would only be taken seriously by this
list! But it's a distinction that matters to me as a point of pride. I
think if you follow lessons,from a teacher or a book, it's not self teaching.
I think if you use a book as reference or a human being as a sort of
consultant, that's different (and probably very hard to do without). I think
if somebody or something is telling you what to do, how well you did it, and
when you're ready to go on to the next step, you aren't self taught.

Kelli - thanks for the summary of the essay. I love the point about thinking
about playing, not practicing. Yesterday, I sat down at the piano and asked
Sam to join me and said, "Let's see if you can find two notes and I can find
two notes that sound good together when we play them." (I did this mostly to
distract him enough so he wouldn't say stop playing, which is what both my
kids do! With recorded music too. I occasionally get away with singing.)
We banged around for awhile and then he picked up some pencils and used them
laying down horizontally to press many keys down at once and then got us all
to try his new piano playing invention, because for Sam, inventing things is
way more important than music! John Cage would be proud. (I'm proud.)

Brenda, thanks for your list. What wind instrument? This week, it's
ocarina. (That counts doesn't it?) I found someone who sells songbooks with
fingering charted. The bit I tried seemed like a great shortcut to making
music. Last spring I went out and got recorders for the whole family and a
couple of lesson books, but was too rebellious to follow the lessons, so the
recorders are in the piano bench. I'm open to sugestions on that instrument.
Sandra?

I just realized that what's been inspiring me about playing music is the
homeschoolers' round singing group I'm in. We meet monthly at a park. The
kids almost always just play while we moms sing. The person who started the
group provides most of the music and "teaches" us most of the songs but the
rest of us have provided a fair share. The kids pick up the songs from about
30 feet away while they're playing. That's self taught! But I feel like I'm
unschooling music with this group. I can sight read better than two years
ago, my voice is stronger. Rounds don't overwhelm me anymore - I can listen
and sing at the same time. And I'll sing anybody our favorite songs (wish
you could hear me and I know there's some way to put this on the web but I
don't wanna!)

Oh the dishes, the dirty dishes, when will we ever be through with all the
dishes?
Oh, it's wash and dry and it's moan and cry every single day the whole year
long
It's dishes Monday and Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday (beat)
and Sunday

AND

The most important rule of life is never never never never,
no never never never never
no never
no never
no never leave your wallet on the roof of your car.

_Pam T.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelli Traaseth

Pam, I loved reading your post, it sounds like life around my house. We all love music, but it has to be on our own terms(each individuals). If I want my son to listen to something it isn't cool enough, he has to find it himself. Maybe with time he'll give me a chance.
Kelli T
warblwarbl@... wrote:Thanks all. Many good ideas. I just have such resistance to being taught.
It feels like it would be hard to find a teacher who wouldn't teach! Right
now what I do when I have time is choose songs I like or want to know and
play the right hand because I can't read bass clef. (Actually the whole
notion of reading two lines of music in different clefs at the same time
totally overwhelms me!) I've been feeling like I'm not following school
rules by doing this, but I've noticed I'm getting better at it.

Re whether someone is self taught if they take lessons, etc.: I think this
is a mostly semantic distinction that would only be taken seriously by this
list! But it's a distinction that matters to me as a point of pride. I
think if you follow lessons,from a teacher or a book, it's not self teaching.
I think if you use a book as reference or a human being as a sort of
consultant, that's different (and probably very hard to do without). I think
if somebody or something is telling you what to do, how well you did it, and
when you're ready to go on to the next step, you aren't self taught.

Kelli - thanks for the summary of the essay. I love the point about thinking
about playing, not practicing. Yesterday, I sat down at the piano and asked
Sam to join me and said, "Let's see if you can find two notes and I can find
two notes that sound good together when we play them." (I did this mostly to
distract him enough so he wouldn't say stop playing, which is what both my
kids do! With recorded music too. I occasionally get away with singing.)
We banged around for awhile and then he picked up some pencils and used them
laying down horizontally to press many keys down at once and then got us all
to try his new piano playing invention, because for Sam, inventing things is
way more important than music! John Cage would be proud. (I'm proud.)

Brenda, thanks for your list. What wind instrument? This week, it's
ocarina. (That counts doesn't it?) I found someone who sells songbooks with
fingering charted. The bit I tried seemed like a great shortcut to making
music. Last spring I went out and got recorders for the whole family and a
couple of lesson books, but was too rebellious to follow the lessons, so the
recorders are in the piano bench. I'm open to sugestions on that instrument.
Sandra?

I just realized that what's been inspiring me about playing music is the
homeschoolers' round singing group I'm in. We meet monthly at a park. The
kids almost always just play while we moms sing. The person who started the
group provides most of the music and "teaches" us most of the songs but the
rest of us have provided a fair share. The kids pick up the songs from about
30 feet away while they're playing. That's self taught! But I feel like I'm
unschooling music with this group. I can sight read better than two years
ago, my voice is stronger. Rounds don't overwhelm me anymore - I can listen
and sing at the same time. And I'll sing anybody our favorite songs (wish
you could hear me and I know there's some way to put this on the web but I
don't wanna!)

Oh the dishes, the dirty dishes, when will we ever be through with all the
dishes?
Oh, it's wash and dry and it's moan and cry every single day the whole year
long
It's dishes Monday and Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday (beat)
and Sunday

AND

The most important rule of life is never never never never,
no never never never never
no never
no never
no never leave your wallet on the roof of your car.

_Pam T.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 9/20/02 1:55:50 AM, warblwarbl@... writes:

<< Re whether someone is self taught if they take lessons, etc.: I think
this
is a mostly semantic distinction that would only be taken seriously by this
list! >>

I don't think so.

I think it involves not only language, but ethics and psychology. Lots of
people could pick it apart in their own idiom! <g>

[email protected]

In a message dated 9/20/02 1:55:50 AM, warblwarbl@... writes:

<< Last spring I went out and got recorders for the whole family and a
couple of lesson books, but was too rebellious to follow the lessons, so the
recorders are in the piano bench. I'm open to sugestions on that instrument.
Sandra?
>>

Recorder is a precursor to all those woodwinds with all the keys that cover
up little bitty holes way away, and some keys that cover up two or three
holes down below.

So with recorder, you have to cover up (or squeak a bit of air through) those
other holes yourself!

Cross-fingerings, it's called. Which doesn't mean you cross your fingers.
(At least THAT'S a relief.)

I recommend the old standard, the Trapp Family books. They're cheap and
clear. And if they're not clear enough without a teacher, get the Usborne
first recorder book, which has more cartoons and illustrations.

Here's what you'll probably be doing wrong, though:

Blowing too hard (just kind of breathe into it, more than blow)

tonguing too hard (use a soft "duh" rather than the "TOO" of most woodwinds,
because that will make it just squeak and chuff)

Not covering up the holes fully (Especially middle finger on the left hand,
ring finger on the right)

Opening too much of the thumb hole (when they say "half-hole" they mean
"90%"--leave some little bit of the hole open, but not half)

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 9/20/02 7:58:27 PM Central Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:

<< What is a good online source for a good quality recorder? >>

I found some really cool ones at ebay.

Ren