Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Digest Number 2197
[email protected]
Mary...Here is the situation I find myself in with my 3 year old and her
'reading'. She has already learned the 26 basic letter sounds. She did
this back when she was about 2 1/2! She was an early talker, and very
verbal and very interested in letters and words. We've been reading
with her since she was a baby and now, must read an average of 10-15
books a day (by her request!). I'll catch her 'reading' to her dolls
and stuffed animals.
Right now she's very into rhyming. Em makes up songs and rhymes the
ending sentences (and will make up a nonsense word to rhyme if she can't
think of a 'real' word' :) Anyway, she notices that some words that
rhyme are spelled similarly, and some words are spelled differently
(like cream and seem, for example).
My question to you all (regarding helping her learn 'sounds') is how do
you explain (once they understand and are sounding out the basic 26
sounds) all those other sounds? Like, this morning she was sounding out
a book she'd picked up, A Trip to the Pond. First she sounded out
'p-o-n-d' and exclaimed POND! Then she did the same with 'trip'. But
then she sounded out 'to' and of course 'to' doesn't say 'tuh' 'ah'...it
says 'tuh' 'oo'. I'm looking for ideas in HOW to explain these
differences. How about why the 'oa' in boat, doesn't sound out that
way, but instead the 'oa' makes an 'oh' sound? I think Em is looking
for some guidance, and I'm unsure of how to explain it to her.
Am I making too much of all this? Do you just plainly state what
different words sound like, or do you actually explain 'why'? That's
why the book reading reflex seemed attractive. They use the ideas of
sound pictures, which seemed easier to comprehend for kids that the way
I'd learned.. For example, they say that the letter 'o' has many
'sound pictures'....the _sound_ 'oe' as in 'toe' can also be spelled as
'oa' as in 'boat', 'ough' as in 'though', 'ow' as in 'tow'. But anyway,
I'm feeling like I could use some guidance and suggestions. I'm
floundering!
I'm feeling like if I can help her understand the basics (which she
seems to grasp very easily) that she'll love reading and be a great
speller, which will, in turn help her on the road to learning anything
she wants... But is this a 'correct' assumption? Or am I still too
hung up on thinking that she 'needs' to know these basics to become a
good reader and speller???
Hugs,
Denise
'reading'. She has already learned the 26 basic letter sounds. She did
this back when she was about 2 1/2! She was an early talker, and very
verbal and very interested in letters and words. We've been reading
with her since she was a baby and now, must read an average of 10-15
books a day (by her request!). I'll catch her 'reading' to her dolls
and stuffed animals.
Right now she's very into rhyming. Em makes up songs and rhymes the
ending sentences (and will make up a nonsense word to rhyme if she can't
think of a 'real' word' :) Anyway, she notices that some words that
rhyme are spelled similarly, and some words are spelled differently
(like cream and seem, for example).
My question to you all (regarding helping her learn 'sounds') is how do
you explain (once they understand and are sounding out the basic 26
sounds) all those other sounds? Like, this morning she was sounding out
a book she'd picked up, A Trip to the Pond. First she sounded out
'p-o-n-d' and exclaimed POND! Then she did the same with 'trip'. But
then she sounded out 'to' and of course 'to' doesn't say 'tuh' 'ah'...it
says 'tuh' 'oo'. I'm looking for ideas in HOW to explain these
differences. How about why the 'oa' in boat, doesn't sound out that
way, but instead the 'oa' makes an 'oh' sound? I think Em is looking
for some guidance, and I'm unsure of how to explain it to her.
Am I making too much of all this? Do you just plainly state what
different words sound like, or do you actually explain 'why'? That's
why the book reading reflex seemed attractive. They use the ideas of
sound pictures, which seemed easier to comprehend for kids that the way
I'd learned.. For example, they say that the letter 'o' has many
'sound pictures'....the _sound_ 'oe' as in 'toe' can also be spelled as
'oa' as in 'boat', 'ough' as in 'though', 'ow' as in 'tow'. But anyway,
I'm feeling like I could use some guidance and suggestions. I'm
floundering!
I'm feeling like if I can help her understand the basics (which she
seems to grasp very easily) that she'll love reading and be a great
speller, which will, in turn help her on the road to learning anything
she wants... But is this a 'correct' assumption? Or am I still too
hung up on thinking that she 'needs' to know these basics to become a
good reader and speller???
Hugs,
Denise
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/02 10:31:54 AM, kevden@... writes:
<< How about why the 'oa' in boat, doesn't sound out that
way, but instead the 'oa' makes an 'oh' sound? >>
"When two vowels go walking
the first one does the talking."
And tell her there are exceptions to that too!
And a later vowel (either immediately or after a consonate) usually makes the
vowel "longer" (say its name).
Holly heard another one on TV, on Between the Lions:
"When two vowels stand side by side,
The first one says its name with pride."
It was in "vowel boot camp," she says.
<<Am I making too much of all this? Do you just plainly state what
different words sound like, or do you actually explain 'why'? >>
Often they "why" is because of vowel shifts hundreds of years ago, wars
between nations, the natural tendency of common words to lose precision
because everyone knows the word in context, and if there is a word in a
language with no near-sounding neighbors it's often contracted (shortened).
That's too much to explain to just say one little thing!
Yesterday Holly was talking about Al and all, and how the verb changes for
having more letters. Al is a name, and names rarely follow rules! <g> She
also pointed out "of" and "off" do the same sort of thing. Some things you
just have to look at and go "Yep, that's the way it is." Otherwise you're
into the whole history of Germanic tribes and human anatomy.
Sandra
<< How about why the 'oa' in boat, doesn't sound out that
way, but instead the 'oa' makes an 'oh' sound? >>
"When two vowels go walking
the first one does the talking."
And tell her there are exceptions to that too!
And a later vowel (either immediately or after a consonate) usually makes the
vowel "longer" (say its name).
Holly heard another one on TV, on Between the Lions:
"When two vowels stand side by side,
The first one says its name with pride."
It was in "vowel boot camp," she says.
<<Am I making too much of all this? Do you just plainly state what
different words sound like, or do you actually explain 'why'? >>
Often they "why" is because of vowel shifts hundreds of years ago, wars
between nations, the natural tendency of common words to lose precision
because everyone knows the word in context, and if there is a word in a
language with no near-sounding neighbors it's often contracted (shortened).
That's too much to explain to just say one little thing!
Yesterday Holly was talking about Al and all, and how the verb changes for
having more letters. Al is a name, and names rarely follow rules! <g> She
also pointed out "of" and "off" do the same sort of thing. Some things you
just have to look at and go "Yep, that's the way it is." Otherwise you're
into the whole history of Germanic tribes and human anatomy.
Sandra
Fetteroll
on 8/6/02 12:31 PM, kevden@... at kevden@... wrote:
And I'll also say don't worry. :-) She needs to know them but she doesn't
need taught them. And she'll learn them without even realizing she's
learning them.
If you were to try to teach English to a toddler you'd get even more
overwhelmed. We take the learning of spoken English so casually and yet look
at how difficult it is to learn a foreign language formally! The only reason
we think reading needs some high powered explanations is because schools
teach it -- and don't do a good job at it either! So that makes it sound
like it's *really* hard.
But schools teach foreign languages too -- and don't do a very good job at
that either. Whereas your daughter picked up English all on her own as a
side effect of living and I bet has done a fabulous job at it! :-)
a pattern out of the chaos of English. That's the way we all learn. We take
in input and naturally draw patterns from it and from that devise rules. But
the patterns the book presents probably won't be the same patterns she would
pull out and definitely -- since the patterns won't be in context -- have
the same meaning.
So, yes, as you've done helping her speak English, just tell her what the
word is and she'll naturally figure out patterns and rules as she acquires
more and more words. That discovery is really the fun part! It's an
adventure because you never know what surprising thing you'll stumble on.
:-) It's a mystery or detective story. Phonics books just skip the story
and tell you who did it. How interesting is that? ;-)
If she gets curious about the inconsistencies in spellings you can mention
that every language has it's own spelling rules but English has words from
all over the world. So every word carries a bit of history inside and tells
you of its travels, like words that spell the f sounds as "ph" and the k
sound as "ch" are from the Greek, "ough" probably means Old English.
That doesn't mean she won't enjoy the book or that it would be "dangerous".
She might think the patterns they show are really neat. She might like to
look at the pictures. Don't worry about her doing it "right". Just let her
enjoy. Or not and move onto something else she does enjoy :-)
Joyce
> But is this a 'correct' assumption? Or am I still tooI won't say hung up. I'll say worried.
> hung up on thinking that she 'needs' to know these basics to become a
> good reader and speller???
And I'll also say don't worry. :-) She needs to know them but she doesn't
need taught them. And she'll learn them without even realizing she's
learning them.
If you were to try to teach English to a toddler you'd get even more
overwhelmed. We take the learning of spoken English so casually and yet look
at how difficult it is to learn a foreign language formally! The only reason
we think reading needs some high powered explanations is because schools
teach it -- and don't do a good job at it either! So that makes it sound
like it's *really* hard.
But schools teach foreign languages too -- and don't do a very good job at
that either. Whereas your daughter picked up English all on her own as a
side effect of living and I bet has done a fabulous job at it! :-)
> Do you just plainly state whatIt doesn't sound like the book explains why either. It just attempts to draw
> different words sound like, or do you actually explain 'why'?
a pattern out of the chaos of English. That's the way we all learn. We take
in input and naturally draw patterns from it and from that devise rules. But
the patterns the book presents probably won't be the same patterns she would
pull out and definitely -- since the patterns won't be in context -- have
the same meaning.
So, yes, as you've done helping her speak English, just tell her what the
word is and she'll naturally figure out patterns and rules as she acquires
more and more words. That discovery is really the fun part! It's an
adventure because you never know what surprising thing you'll stumble on.
:-) It's a mystery or detective story. Phonics books just skip the story
and tell you who did it. How interesting is that? ;-)
If she gets curious about the inconsistencies in spellings you can mention
that every language has it's own spelling rules but English has words from
all over the world. So every word carries a bit of history inside and tells
you of its travels, like words that spell the f sounds as "ph" and the k
sound as "ch" are from the Greek, "ough" probably means Old English.
That doesn't mean she won't enjoy the book or that it would be "dangerous".
She might think the patterns they show are really neat. She might like to
look at the pictures. Don't worry about her doing it "right". Just let her
enjoy. Or not and move onto something else she does enjoy :-)
Joyce
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/2002 9:31:54 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
kevden@... writes:
you just need to recognize -- you can start her a master list of them: "to",
"the", and explain that they are often words that are used REALLY often -
that's why they got warped into sounding different than they look. Later you
can add to her list, saying: "That is one of THOSE words - let's write it on
your big list." Just as they come up... not in any planned way. You don't
need a system, just be responsive.
For the "oa" in boat -- you can say that there are LOTS of words like that --
so that when she sees "oa" she should give that "oh" sound a try -- and play
your rhyming games with oat and goat and float and boat etc.
Don't worry - just be responsive.
--pamS
National Home Education Network
http://www.NHEN.org
Changing the Way the World Sees Homeschooling!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kevden@... writes:
> ButYou just explain them as they come up. First - explain that there are words
> then she sounded out 'to' and of course 'to' doesn't say 'tuh' 'ah'...it
> says 'tuh' 'oo'. I'm looking for ideas in HOW to explain these
> differences. How about why the 'oa' in boat, doesn't sound out that
> way, but instead the 'oa' makes an 'oh' sound?
you just need to recognize -- you can start her a master list of them: "to",
"the", and explain that they are often words that are used REALLY often -
that's why they got warped into sounding different than they look. Later you
can add to her list, saying: "That is one of THOSE words - let's write it on
your big list." Just as they come up... not in any planned way. You don't
need a system, just be responsive.
For the "oa" in boat -- you can say that there are LOTS of words like that --
so that when she sees "oa" she should give that "oh" sound a try -- and play
your rhyming games with oat and goat and float and boat etc.
Don't worry - just be responsive.
--pamS
National Home Education Network
http://www.NHEN.org
Changing the Way the World Sees Homeschooling!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]