Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
gruvystarchild
,".. would have to bring the next cake.. it's a whole strange new
orleans thing.'
No, actually it's a whole Southern thing. Mardi Gras actually has
it's roots in Mobile (about 45 minutes from where I live) but New
Orleans gets all the focus and people think it started there because
it gets so insanely crazy over this holiday now.
Here in Pensacola, you will find King's cake in every store come
February, the typical purple, gold and green beads on people and
yards get decorated right after the Christmas decor comes down.
I love Mardi Gras here, we don't get the crazines of New Orleans, but
it is a big deal. Many parades and events to attend come February.
The kids love getting their moonpies (never knew what those were
before moving here) and beads.
Ren
orleans thing.'
No, actually it's a whole Southern thing. Mardi Gras actually has
it's roots in Mobile (about 45 minutes from where I live) but New
Orleans gets all the focus and people think it started there because
it gets so insanely crazy over this holiday now.
Here in Pensacola, you will find King's cake in every store come
February, the typical purple, gold and green beads on people and
yards get decorated right after the Christmas decor comes down.
I love Mardi Gras here, we don't get the crazines of New Orleans, but
it is a big deal. Many parades and events to attend come February.
The kids love getting their moonpies (never knew what those were
before moving here) and beads.
Ren
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/02 9:00:37 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:
<< Mardi Gras actually has
it's roots in Mobile (about 45 minutes from where I live) but New
Orleans gets all the focus and people think it started there because
it gets so insanely crazy over this holiday now. >>
They both/all have European roots.
Even in cob-up-butt early-Protestant England there were "king of the bean"
cakes at Twelfth Night.
Sandra
<< Mardi Gras actually has
it's roots in Mobile (about 45 minutes from where I live) but New
Orleans gets all the focus and people think it started there because
it gets so insanely crazy over this holiday now. >>
They both/all have European roots.
Even in cob-up-butt early-Protestant England there were "king of the bean"
cakes at Twelfth Night.
Sandra
gruvystarchild
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., SandraDodd@a... wrote:
roots in Mobile!!
Here's an interesting tidbit about the Mardi Gras/Three Kings
connection....
LOS REYES MAGOS
The Christmas season continues unabated in Mexico through Epiphany,
which is called Día de los Reyes (Three Kings Day). Echoing the
arrival in Bethlehem of Wise Men bearing gifts for the baby Jesus,
children throughout Mexico anxiously await waking up January 6 to
find toys and gifts left by the Reyes Magos (Magi). In some regions
it is customary to leave out shoes where treasures may be deposited
by the visiting Wise Men.
A special treat served one this day is the Rosca de Reyes--a crown-
shaped sweet bread decorated with jewel-like candied fruits. Tiny
figures of babies are hidden in the dough before baking. There is
much excitement as each partaker cuts his or her own slice, for
whoever gets a piece containing a baby is obliged to host another
party on or before Candlemas, February 2, when Mexico's holiday
season finally comes to an end.
So apparently, some of the Mardi Gras traditions (the baby in the
cake thing) is related to the epiphany (three kings) holiday?
And it's roots seem to be in Mexico, being heavily Catholic and all.
Which of course traces back to Europe at some point, because that's
where the Catholic religion began. So was it the Spanish that brought
all this to our neighbors to the South?
Must be.
Ren
>the bean"
> In a
> They both/all have European roots.
>
> Even in cob-up-butt early-Protestant England there were "king of
> cakes at Twelfth Night.Yes, right. I should have written that Mardi gras has it's American
>
> Sandra
roots in Mobile!!
Here's an interesting tidbit about the Mardi Gras/Three Kings
connection....
LOS REYES MAGOS
The Christmas season continues unabated in Mexico through Epiphany,
which is called Día de los Reyes (Three Kings Day). Echoing the
arrival in Bethlehem of Wise Men bearing gifts for the baby Jesus,
children throughout Mexico anxiously await waking up January 6 to
find toys and gifts left by the Reyes Magos (Magi). In some regions
it is customary to leave out shoes where treasures may be deposited
by the visiting Wise Men.
A special treat served one this day is the Rosca de Reyes--a crown-
shaped sweet bread decorated with jewel-like candied fruits. Tiny
figures of babies are hidden in the dough before baking. There is
much excitement as each partaker cuts his or her own slice, for
whoever gets a piece containing a baby is obliged to host another
party on or before Candlemas, February 2, when Mexico's holiday
season finally comes to an end.
So apparently, some of the Mardi Gras traditions (the baby in the
cake thing) is related to the epiphany (three kings) holiday?
And it's roots seem to be in Mexico, being heavily Catholic and all.
Which of course traces back to Europe at some point, because that's
where the Catholic religion began. So was it the Spanish that brought
all this to our neighbors to the South?
Must be.
Ren
Nora or Devereaux Cannon
FWIW Catholicism is a denomination of the Christian faith; it
"started" in Israel. Mardis Gras is French for Fat Tuesday.
"started" in Israel. Mardis Gras is French for Fat Tuesday.
----- Original Message -----
From: "gruvystarchild" <starsuncloud@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 06, 2002 12:15 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
| --- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., SandraDodd@a... wrote:
| >
| > In a
| > They both/all have European roots.
| >
| > Even in cob-up-butt early-Protestant England there were "king
of
| the bean"
| > cakes at Twelfth Night.
| >
| > Sandra
|
| Yes, right. I should have written that Mardi gras has it's
American
| roots in Mobile!!
| Here's an interesting tidbit about the Mardi Gras/Three Kings
| connection....
|
| LOS REYES MAGOS
|
| The Christmas season continues unabated in Mexico through
Epiphany,
| which is called Día de los Reyes (Three Kings Day). Echoing the
| arrival in Bethlehem of Wise Men bearing gifts for the baby
Jesus,
| children throughout Mexico anxiously await waking up January 6
to
| find toys and gifts left by the Reyes Magos (Magi). In some
regions
| it is customary to leave out shoes where treasures may be
deposited
| by the visiting Wise Men.
|
| A special treat served one this day is the Rosca de Reyes--a
crown-
| shaped sweet bread decorated with jewel-like candied fruits.
Tiny
| figures of babies are hidden in the dough before baking. There
is
| much excitement as each partaker cuts his or her own slice, for
| whoever gets a piece containing a baby is obliged to host
another
| party on or before Candlemas, February 2, when Mexico's holiday
| season finally comes to an end.
|
|
| So apparently, some of the Mardi Gras traditions (the baby in
the
| cake thing) is related to the epiphany (three kings) holiday?
| And it's roots seem to be in Mexico, being heavily Catholic and
all.
| Which of course traces back to Europe at some point, because
that's
| where the Catholic religion began. So was it the Spanish that
brought
| all this to our neighbors to the South?
| Must be.
|
| Ren
|
|
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In a message dated 8/6/02 11:21:09 AM, dcannon@... writes:
<< FWIW Catholicism is a denomination of the Christian faith; it
"started" in Israel. >>
How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
And it's not a denomination of the Christian faith. It's the original
Christian faith, from which others broke off one by one.
Sandra
<< FWIW Catholicism is a denomination of the Christian faith; it
"started" in Israel. >>
How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
And it's not a denomination of the Christian faith. It's the original
Christian faith, from which others broke off one by one.
Sandra
[email protected]
right.. it is ALL very old stuff..
so i have an idea.. let's celebrate mardi gras in Paris next year.. or perhaps Venice..
i believe it would be a great learning experience for our children.. (oh and we MIGHT have a little fun ouselves)
LLL
so i have an idea.. let's celebrate mardi gras in Paris next year.. or perhaps Venice..
i believe it would be a great learning experience for our children.. (oh and we MIGHT have a little fun ouselves)
LLL
----- Original Message -----
From: SandraDodd@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, August 06, 2002 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
In a message dated 8/6/02 9:00:37 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:
<< Mardi Gras actually has
it's roots in Mobile (about 45 minutes from where I live) but New
Orleans gets all the focus and people think it started there because
it gets so insanely crazy over this holiday now. >>
They both/all have European roots.
Even in cob-up-butt early-Protestant England there were "king of the bean"
cakes at Twelfth Night.
Sandra
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the Moderator, Joyce Fetteroll, at fetteroll@...
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Nora or Devereaux Cannon
Weeeeellllll - to the extent that you believe that a physical
place can be where a faith "started" - and the quotes were
intentional - I think it would be hard to pin point Christianity
as beginning anywhere except either Bethlehem (birth) or
Golgotha/Jerusalem (death). If you're hunting them on a map, you
would start by typing "Israel map" into Google - or turning to
"Israel" in the atlas. It certainly was intended as nothing more
than a simple answer to simple statement that Catholicism
"started in Spain". I wasn't planning on getting into the
merits of the other denominations, including pride of primacy,
given that it is so often a revelation for folks that we mackerel
snappers are Christians at all, LOL.
place can be where a faith "started" - and the quotes were
intentional - I think it would be hard to pin point Christianity
as beginning anywhere except either Bethlehem (birth) or
Golgotha/Jerusalem (death). If you're hunting them on a map, you
would start by typing "Israel map" into Google - or turning to
"Israel" in the atlas. It certainly was intended as nothing more
than a simple answer to simple statement that Catholicism
"started in Spain". I wasn't planning on getting into the
merits of the other denominations, including pride of primacy,
given that it is so often a revelation for folks that we mackerel
snappers are Christians at all, LOL.
----- Original Message -----
From: <SandraDodd@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 06, 2002 12:42 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
|
| In a message dated 8/6/02 11:21:09 AM, dcannon@... writes:
|
| << FWIW Catholicism is a denomination of the Christian faith;
it
|
| "started" in Israel. >>
|
| How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
|
| And it's not a denomination of the Christian faith. It's the
original
| Christian faith, from which others broke off one by one.
|
| Sandra
|
| ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups
Sponsor ---------------------~-->
| Will You Find True Love?
| Will You Meet the One?
| Free Love Reading by phone!
| http://us.click.yahoo.com/it_ffB/R_ZEAA/Ey.GAA/0xXolB/TM
| ---------------------------------------------------------------
------~->
|
| If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list,
please email the Moderator, Joyce Fetteroll, at
fetteroll@...
|
| To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
| [email protected]
|
| Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
|
| Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
|
|
audrey elwood
here's a? for you sandra. didn't the orthodox church precede the catholic?
what do you know about the great schism?
audrey
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what do you know about the great schism?
audrey
>From: SandraDodd@..._________________________________________________________________
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
>Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 13:42:45 EDT
>
>
>In a message dated 8/6/02 11:21:09 AM, dcannon@... writes:
>
><< FWIW Catholicism is a denomination of the Christian faith; it
>
>"started" in Israel. >>
>
>How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
>
>And it's not a denomination of the Christian faith. It's the original
>Christian faith, from which others broke off one by one.
>
>Sandra
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Shelly G
--- gruvystarchild <starsuncloud@...> wrote:
his wife moved to Gulf Shores, AL, last September, and
around Mardi Gras time they were talking about a big
parade there and other parades in the area. I, being a
clueless yankee <g> had no idea that Mardi Gras
existed anywhere other than in New Orleans!
Shelly
=====
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever does." -- Margaret Mead
__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
http://health.yahoo.com
> No, actually it's a whole Southern thing. Mardi GrasRen, I never knew this before this year. My dad and
> actually has
> it's roots in Mobile (about 45 minutes from where I
> live) but New
> Orleans gets all the focus and people think it
> started there because
> it gets so insanely crazy over this holiday now.
his wife moved to Gulf Shores, AL, last September, and
around Mardi Gras time they were talking about a big
parade there and other parades in the area. I, being a
clueless yankee <g> had no idea that Mardi Gras
existed anywhere other than in New Orleans!
Shelly
=====
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever does." -- Margaret Mead
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
http://health.yahoo.com
Nora or Devereaux Cannon
Try this site:
http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_hirc.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_hirc.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "audrey elwood" <audreyelwood@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 06, 2002 1:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
| here's a? for you sandra. didn't the orthodox church precede
the catholic?
| what do you know about the great schism?
| audrey
debi watson
'Cause that's where Christ lived? Just a thought.
How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/02 12:21:55 PM Central Daylight Time, dcannon@...
writes:
the Church in Rome. Peter being the first Pope.
many churches (Catholic and not Catholic) say the Nicene Creed with the
following words, We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
Because the (small c) catholic does not denote the (capitol C) Catholic
Church as a denomination, rather it refers to the universal church the
foundation of such set by the apostles after Christ's death. Peter became the
first Pope, or Bishop of Rome, beginning the Catholic Church. Years later a
monk by the name of Martin Luther nailed his 93 Thesis on the door of the
Church in Wittenberg in 1517. The Thesis was about the Power and Efficacy of
Indulgences. Luther wanted to draw attention to the ways he felt the common
priests, monks and brothers were selling indulgences, and how wrong he knew
that to be. It ended up with him being excommunicated and he and his
followers began the Lutheran Church. There have been many other breaking away
from the Catholic church such as the Greek Orthodox, and the Church of
England.
Neither the Catholic or catholic church started in Israel.
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
writes:
> FWIW Catholicism is a denomination of the Christian faith; itCatholicism started when the apostles Peter and Paul laid the foundation for
> "started" in Israel. Mardis Gras is French for Fat Tuesday
the Church in Rome. Peter being the first Pope.
> St. Irenaeus, Bishop of Lyons, Against Heresies 3:3:1, 3:3:2, and 3:3:3, ADThe word catholic (small c) is related to the universal church. That is why
> 189, "Matthew also issued among the Hebrews a written Gospel in their own
> language, while Peter and Paul were evangelizing in Rome and laying the
> foundation of the Church.
>
many churches (Catholic and not Catholic) say the Nicene Creed with the
following words, We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
Because the (small c) catholic does not denote the (capitol C) Catholic
Church as a denomination, rather it refers to the universal church the
foundation of such set by the apostles after Christ's death. Peter became the
first Pope, or Bishop of Rome, beginning the Catholic Church. Years later a
monk by the name of Martin Luther nailed his 93 Thesis on the door of the
Church in Wittenberg in 1517. The Thesis was about the Power and Efficacy of
Indulgences. Luther wanted to draw attention to the ways he felt the common
priests, monks and brothers were selling indulgences, and how wrong he knew
that to be. It ended up with him being excommunicated and he and his
followers began the Lutheran Church. There have been many other breaking away
from the Catholic church such as the Greek Orthodox, and the Church of
England.
Neither the Catholic or catholic church started in Israel.
~Nancy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kayb85
Christianity started in Israel because Jesus came to fulfill the
law. Now, instead of just the Israelites being God's chosen people,
all who come to faith in Christ are God's chosen people.
And actually, Catholicism claims to be the original Christian faith,
but the original Christian faith is homechurching. Early Christians
right after pentacost met from home to home. It wasn't until
Constantine that Christians moved from homes into "Christian
temples". Then Catholicism began.
Sheila
law. Now, instead of just the Israelites being God's chosen people,
all who come to faith in Christ are God's chosen people.
And actually, Catholicism claims to be the original Christian faith,
but the original Christian faith is homechurching. Early Christians
right after pentacost met from home to home. It wasn't until
Constantine that Christians moved from homes into "Christian
temples". Then Catholicism began.
Sheila
> How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?original
>
> And it's not a denomination of the Christian faith. It's the
> Christian faith, from which others broke off one by one.
>
> Sandra
audrey elwood
i was thinking "in the beginning was the word. and the word was with god,
and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is pretty old!
Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
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and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is pretty old!
>From: "kayb85" <sheran@...>_________________________________________________________________
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
>Date: Wed, 07 Aug 2002 03:01:09 -0000
>
>Christianity started in Israel because Jesus came to fulfill the
>law. Now, instead of just the Israelites being God's chosen people,
>all who come to faith in Christ are God's chosen people.
>
>And actually, Catholicism claims to be the original Christian faith,
>but the original Christian faith is homechurching. Early Christians
>right after pentacost met from home to home. It wasn't until
>Constantine that Christians moved from homes into "Christian
>temples". Then Catholicism began.
>
>Sheila
>
> > How do you figure Christianity started in Israel?
> >
> > And it's not a denomination of the Christian faith. It's the
>original
> > Christian faith, from which others broke off one by one.
> >
> > Sandra
>
Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
Nora or Devereaux Cannon
LOL - to a great extent, when/where you think Catholicism started
reflects what you believe to be true. Folks who hold to some
idea that Catholicism is a building in a city are reflecting
their belief that "You are Peter; upon this rock" was purely
personal to Peter.
As a Catholic, the unbroken line of apostolic succession, from
Peter to John Paul II, encompassing each priest bishop and
cardinal makes church that needs no buildings, requires no hills
in Rome. To say that a foundation stone was the start of a
faith is to deny that the faith is anything more than a physical
institution. Those are belief systems on both sides. Of all the
things I find it profitable to discuss on-line, religious beliefs
has never made the cut.
...but we are probably getting a bit away from unschooling,
except for the object lesson of how a simple question leads to
lots of learning, but that unless we know that we don't know we
can be awfully confident.
reflects what you believe to be true. Folks who hold to some
idea that Catholicism is a building in a city are reflecting
their belief that "You are Peter; upon this rock" was purely
personal to Peter.
As a Catholic, the unbroken line of apostolic succession, from
Peter to John Paul II, encompassing each priest bishop and
cardinal makes church that needs no buildings, requires no hills
in Rome. To say that a foundation stone was the start of a
faith is to deny that the faith is anything more than a physical
institution. Those are belief systems on both sides. Of all the
things I find it profitable to discuss on-line, religious beliefs
has never made the cut.
...but we are probably getting a bit away from unschooling,
except for the object lesson of how a simple question leads to
lots of learning, but that unless we know that we don't know we
can be awfully confident.
----- Original Message -----
From: "audrey elwood" <audreyelwood@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 7:39 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
| i was thinking "in the beginning was the word. and the word was
with god,
| and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is
pretty old!
|
|
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/02 12:54:32 PM, dcannon@... writes:
<< Weeeeellllll - to the extent that you believe that a physical
place can be where a faith "started" - and the quotes were
intentional - I think it would be hard to pin point Christianity
as beginning anywhere except either Bethlehem (birth) or
Golgotha/Jerusalem (death). >>
My point exactly. "Israel" was people, not place, and Christ and the
disciples travelled around, and the early church letters were to places all
around the northeastern Mediterranean.
Sandra
<< Weeeeellllll - to the extent that you believe that a physical
place can be where a faith "started" - and the quotes were
intentional - I think it would be hard to pin point Christianity
as beginning anywhere except either Bethlehem (birth) or
Golgotha/Jerusalem (death). >>
My point exactly. "Israel" was people, not place, and Christ and the
disciples travelled around, and the early church letters were to places all
around the northeastern Mediterranean.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/02 2:06:18 PM, dcannon@... writes:
<< | here's a? for you sandra. didn't the orthodox church precede
the catholic?
| what do you know about the great schism? >>
Rome and Byzantium were having political problems. Rome controlled both
until Constantinople broke off, and I'm assuming the religious history is
tied up with all that. I'm sure there are contradictory reports available to
read all over the place, because anything that old is reconstructed history,
and they still find scrolls in jars in caves.
Sandra
<< | here's a? for you sandra. didn't the orthodox church precede
the catholic?
| what do you know about the great schism? >>
Rome and Byzantium were having political problems. Rome controlled both
until Constantinople broke off, and I'm assuming the religious history is
tied up with all that. I'm sure there are contradictory reports available to
read all over the place, because anything that old is reconstructed history,
and they still find scrolls in jars in caves.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/6/02 9:02:24 PM, sheran@... writes:
<< Christianity started in Israel because Jesus came to fulfill the
law. >>
Where are you thinking "Israel" was though? That's my question.
Jesus was in Galilee and Canaan in most of the accounts. When did Israel
become a country? Hmmm??
Sandra
<< Christianity started in Israel because Jesus came to fulfill the
law. >>
Where are you thinking "Israel" was though? That's my question.
Jesus was in Galilee and Canaan in most of the accounts. When did Israel
become a country? Hmmm??
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/7/02 6:40:47 AM, audreyelwood@... writes:
<< i was thinking "in the beginning was the word. and the word was with god,
and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is pretty old! >>
Biblically speaking, Christianity doesn't even touch the Old Testament.
Baptists are sure everything revolves around them and some of them would
swear Jesus spoke 17th century English.
That interpretation of Genesis is very "low church."
Sandra
<< i was thinking "in the beginning was the word. and the word was with god,
and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is pretty old! >>
Biblically speaking, Christianity doesn't even touch the Old Testament.
Baptists are sure everything revolves around them and some of them would
swear Jesus spoke 17th century English.
That interpretation of Genesis is very "low church."
Sandra
audrey elwood
i'm not sure what you mean by low church-my ubderstanding is that the whole
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-is.64 comes to mind.are you
saying that john 1;1 is an interpretation of genesis?
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old testament is full of prophecy of christ-is.64 comes to mind.are you
saying that john 1;1 is an interpretation of genesis?
>From: SandraDodd@..._________________________________________________________________
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
>Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 11:28:36 EDT
>
>
>In a message dated 8/7/02 6:40:47 AM, audreyelwood@... writes:
>
><< i was thinking "in the beginning was the word. and the word was with
>god,
>and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is pretty old! >>
>
>Biblically speaking, Christianity doesn't even touch the Old Testament.
>
>Baptists are sure everything revolves around them and some of them would
>swear Jesus spoke 17th century English.
>
>That interpretation of Genesis is very "low church."
>
>Sandra
Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
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[email protected]
<< are you
saying that john 1;1 is an interpretation of genesis?>>
Meaning do I think it's a reference?
<<my ubderstanding is that the whole
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-is.64 comes to mind>>
ALL of that is interpretation.
"The High Churchmen, in theory at least, emphasize the principle of church
authority as the final court of doctrinal appeal; whilst the Low Churchmen
appeal rather to the Bible, privately interpreted, as the decisive judge. The
High Churchmen exalt ecclesiastical tradition as the voice of church
authority, regard the Holy Eucharist as in some sense a sacrifice and the
sacraments as efficacious channels of grace, and they insist on rites and
ceremonies as the appropriate expression of external worship. whilst the Low
Churchmen are distrustful of what they call human traditions, regard the Holy
Eucharist as a symbolic meal only, hold firmly that the grace of
justification and sanctification is imparted to the soul independently of
visible channels, and dislike all rites and ceremonies, save those of the
simplest kind, as tending to substitute an external formalism for true inward
devotion."
http://www.geocities.com/anglicelt/whatdoterms.html
Baptists are "low church." Church hierarchy and ritual aren't important, or
are all internal to each congregation (deacons are good; there are no
bishops, arch-bishops, etc. outside that congregation with authority though).
Sandra
saying that john 1;1 is an interpretation of genesis?>>
Meaning do I think it's a reference?
<<my ubderstanding is that the whole
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-is.64 comes to mind>>
ALL of that is interpretation.
"The High Churchmen, in theory at least, emphasize the principle of church
authority as the final court of doctrinal appeal; whilst the Low Churchmen
appeal rather to the Bible, privately interpreted, as the decisive judge. The
High Churchmen exalt ecclesiastical tradition as the voice of church
authority, regard the Holy Eucharist as in some sense a sacrifice and the
sacraments as efficacious channels of grace, and they insist on rites and
ceremonies as the appropriate expression of external worship. whilst the Low
Churchmen are distrustful of what they call human traditions, regard the Holy
Eucharist as a symbolic meal only, hold firmly that the grace of
justification and sanctification is imparted to the soul independently of
visible channels, and dislike all rites and ceremonies, save those of the
simplest kind, as tending to substitute an external formalism for true inward
devotion."
http://www.geocities.com/anglicelt/whatdoterms.html
Baptists are "low church." Church hierarchy and ritual aren't important, or
are all internal to each congregation (deacons are good; there are no
bishops, arch-bishops, etc. outside that congregation with authority though).
Sandra
[email protected]
my ubderstanding is that the whole
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-
Hindsight is 20/20.
I was taught that it prophesizes the Messiah, the requirements for being the
messiah were not met by Jesus.
~Elissa Cleaveland
"It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
have
not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-
Hindsight is 20/20.
I was taught that it prophesizes the Messiah, the requirements for being the
messiah were not met by Jesus.
~Elissa Cleaveland
"It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
have
not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein
kayb85
I'm thinking when God promised Abraham that his descendents would be
a nation. When God changed Jacob's name to Israel and his
descendents became a nation. When Israel begged God for a king
instead of continuing as a theocracy. Even when times came that
Israel wasn't considered a nation by the world, they were still God's
chosen people, His holy nation.
Remember Joshua and Caleb spying on Canaan? Didn't God end up
delivering that land to Israel? Maybe when Jesus was on earth the
world didn't recognize it as belonging to Israel, but Canaan is
Israel.
Sometimes Israel was conquered and enslaved, sometimes it was divided
and fought among itself, sometimes other nations claimed to own it's
land. But it was always Israel.
It is both a physical place and a group of people. It is the people
to whom were given a set of laws, to show the futility of trying to
have righteousness simply by one's own works. It is the place these
people lived to whom the Messiah came to fulfill these laws.
And then Jesus told these people to circumcise their hearts, not
their bodies. To rest in Jesus instead of Sabath laws. That all
their works are like filthy rags, so just trust in Jesus' blood to
cover their sins instead of sacrificing animals. And now not just
people who have born physically to Jewish parents can consider
themselves God's chosen people. Now all who accept Christ as Lord
and Savior are a holy nation and a chosen people.
Sheila
a nation. When God changed Jacob's name to Israel and his
descendents became a nation. When Israel begged God for a king
instead of continuing as a theocracy. Even when times came that
Israel wasn't considered a nation by the world, they were still God's
chosen people, His holy nation.
Remember Joshua and Caleb spying on Canaan? Didn't God end up
delivering that land to Israel? Maybe when Jesus was on earth the
world didn't recognize it as belonging to Israel, but Canaan is
Israel.
Sometimes Israel was conquered and enslaved, sometimes it was divided
and fought among itself, sometimes other nations claimed to own it's
land. But it was always Israel.
It is both a physical place and a group of people. It is the people
to whom were given a set of laws, to show the futility of trying to
have righteousness simply by one's own works. It is the place these
people lived to whom the Messiah came to fulfill these laws.
And then Jesus told these people to circumcise their hearts, not
their bodies. To rest in Jesus instead of Sabath laws. That all
their works are like filthy rags, so just trust in Jesus' blood to
cover their sins instead of sacrificing animals. And now not just
people who have born physically to Jewish parents can consider
themselves God's chosen people. Now all who accept Christ as Lord
and Savior are a holy nation and a chosen people.
Sheila
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/6/02 9:02:24 PM, sheran@p... writes:
>
> << Christianity started in Israel because Jesus came to fulfill the
> law. >>
>
> Where are you thinking "Israel" was though? That's my question.
> Jesus was in Galilee and Canaan in most of the accounts. When did
Israel
> become a country? Hmmm??
>
> Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/7/02 11:40:13 AM, sheran@... writes:
<< It is both a physical place and a group of people. >>
When before WWII was it a physical place?
I don't think it ever was. I think it was a language group and a set of
nomadic tribes. And then it was a religious concept.
Sandra
<< It is both a physical place and a group of people. >>
When before WWII was it a physical place?
I don't think it ever was. I think it was a language group and a set of
nomadic tribes. And then it was a religious concept.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/7/02 11:40:13 AM, sheran@... writes:
<< It is the people
to whom were given a set of laws, to show the futility of trying to
have righteousness simply by one's own works. >>
Don't apply "By grace are ye saved, not by works" to the Old Testament or to
the Jews! They have a TON of laws and rules by which they have to prove
themselves righteous. And any Christian who wants to use ANY of the Old
Testament to justify actions should follow all those rules too. But too many
Christians only use the Old Testament to justify hitting their kids and
discriminating against homosexuals. The rest they want to ignore.
<<And then Jesus told these people to circumcise their hearts, not
their bodies.>>
Please give a verse reference. I don't think Jesus said that.
Sandra
<< It is the people
to whom were given a set of laws, to show the futility of trying to
have righteousness simply by one's own works. >>
Don't apply "By grace are ye saved, not by works" to the Old Testament or to
the Jews! They have a TON of laws and rules by which they have to prove
themselves righteous. And any Christian who wants to use ANY of the Old
Testament to justify actions should follow all those rules too. But too many
Christians only use the Old Testament to justify hitting their kids and
discriminating against homosexuals. The rest they want to ignore.
<<And then Jesus told these people to circumcise their hearts, not
their bodies.>>
Please give a verse reference. I don't think Jesus said that.
Sandra
Nora or Devereaux Cannon
Ahh - but you omitted the "point" - which was if you want to
find the place on a map today, Israel is the entry you are
looking for - it really is possible to deal with facts without
bringing in every belief system. And you don't have to have any
opinions about Jenin, Arafat, the moral imperatives of Post Nazi
European guilt or anything else to figure out how to use a map or
search engine
find the place on a map today, Israel is the entry you are
looking for - it really is possible to deal with facts without
bringing in every belief system. And you don't have to have any
opinions about Jenin, Arafat, the moral imperatives of Post Nazi
European guilt or anything else to figure out how to use a map or
search engine
----- Original Message -----
From: <SandraDodd@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 9:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
|
| In a message dated 8/6/02 12:54:32 PM, dcannon@... writes:
|
| << Weeeeellllll - to the extent that you believe that a
physical
| place can be where a faith "started" - and the quotes were
| intentional - I think it would be hard to pin point
Christianity
| as beginning anywhere except either Bethlehem (birth) or
| Golgotha/Jerusalem (death). >>
|
| My point exactly. "Israel" was people, not place, and Christ
and the
| disciples travelled around, and the early church letters were
to places all
| around the northeastern Mediterranean.
|
| Sandra
[email protected]
wait a minute i GOTTA speak up now.. when everyone says what the bible is saying.. are we talking the king james version? or the one on the rocks? or like WHICH translation or which incarnation? when people start giving exact text to prove a point from a document that is SO many generations removed from the original source.. well.. uh.. i'm not too easily convinced..
and i know this sticks it's head into religious belief.. but . well, i'm willing to do it..cause it's just logical.. how can something have the same exact words after being thru so many human brains before it gets to ours..
L
and i know this sticks it's head into religious belief.. but . well, i'm willing to do it..cause it's just logical.. how can something have the same exact words after being thru so many human brains before it gets to ours..
L
----- Original Message -----
From: audrey elwood
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 10:56 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
i'm not sure what you mean by low church-my ubderstanding is that the whole
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-is.64 comes to mind.are you
saying that john 1;1 is an interpretation of genesis?
>From: SandraDodd@...
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
>Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 11:28:36 EDT
>
>
>In a message dated 8/7/02 6:40:47 AM, audreyelwood@... writes:
>
><< i was thinking "in the beginning was the word. and the word was with
>god,
>and the word was god..."biblically speaking, christianity is pretty old! >>
>
>Biblically speaking, Christianity doesn't even touch the Old Testament.
>
>Baptists are sure everything revolves around them and some of them would
>swear Jesus spoke 17th century English.
>
>That interpretation of Genesis is very "low church."
>
>Sandra
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In a message dated 8/7/02 2:29:19 PM, dcannon@... writes:
<< Ahh - but you omitted the "point" - which was if you want to
find the place on a map today, Israel is the entry you are
looking for - it really is possible to deal with facts without
bringing in every belief system. And you don't have to have any
opinions about Jenin, Arafat, the moral imperatives of Post Nazi
European guilt or anything else to figure out how to use a map or
search engine >>
I don't understand this.
My point is Christianity didn't start in Israel.
I didn't omit that.
Sandra
<< Ahh - but you omitted the "point" - which was if you want to
find the place on a map today, Israel is the entry you are
looking for - it really is possible to deal with facts without
bringing in every belief system. And you don't have to have any
opinions about Jenin, Arafat, the moral imperatives of Post Nazi
European guilt or anything else to figure out how to use a map or
search engine >>
I don't understand this.
My point is Christianity didn't start in Israel.
I didn't omit that.
Sandra
[email protected]
that is very interesting. i didn't know any of that..
L
L
----- Original Message -----
From: SandraDodd@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 11:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Twelfth Night/Mardi Gras
<< are you
saying that john 1;1 is an interpretation of genesis?>>
Meaning do I think it's a reference?
<<my ubderstanding is that the whole
old testament is full of prophecy of christ-is.64 comes to mind>>
ALL of that is interpretation.
"The High Churchmen, in theory at least, emphasize the principle of church
authority as the final court of doctrinal appeal; whilst the Low Churchmen
appeal rather to the Bible, privately interpreted, as the decisive judge. The
High Churchmen exalt ecclesiastical tradition as the voice of church
authority, regard the Holy Eucharist as in some sense a sacrifice and the
sacraments as efficacious channels of grace, and they insist on rites and
ceremonies as the appropriate expression of external worship. whilst the Low
Churchmen are distrustful of what they call human traditions, regard the Holy
Eucharist as a symbolic meal only, hold firmly that the grace of
justification and sanctification is imparted to the soul independently of
visible channels, and dislike all rites and ceremonies, save those of the
simplest kind, as tending to substitute an external formalism for true inward
devotion."
http://www.geocities.com/anglicelt/whatdoterms.html
Baptists are "low church." Church hierarchy and ritual aren't important, or
are all internal to each congregation (deacons are good; there are no
bishops, arch-bishops, etc. outside that congregation with authority though).
Sandra
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the Moderator, Joyce Fetteroll, at fetteroll@...
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 8/7/02 2:46:23 PM, llindsey3@... writes:
<< wait a minute i GOTTA speak up now.. when everyone says what the bible is
saying.. are we talking the king james version? or the one on the rocks? >>
No, the straight-up one, neat!
KJV!
That's the one used to wrestle people with.
The others are used for niceness.
I like my religion blended, with ice, strained, and with salt on the rim.
(LOTS of salt...)
Sandra
<< wait a minute i GOTTA speak up now.. when everyone says what the bible is
saying.. are we talking the king james version? or the one on the rocks? >>
No, the straight-up one, neat!
KJV!
That's the one used to wrestle people with.
The others are used for niceness.
I like my religion blended, with ice, strained, and with salt on the rim.
(LOTS of salt...)
Sandra