Re: Phun w/ Phonics
Luz Shosie and Ned Vare
In digest 2186, Sheila asks:
the situation I was talking about.
My short answer is NO, I would try not to TEACH the child anything. I would
give the child the tools so that he will learn with the least possible
teaching. You say the child is asking to learn; he is not asking to be
taught. The difference is significant.
Apparently, this child has the motivation -- he's curious to know what the
books say. And he has a reason -- he wants to know what the authors are
talking about. Now the kid needs only one thing: The HOW...How does reading
happen?
The hope that many of us have, I'm sure, is that someone has been reading
stories to this child for several years, so that he knows the joys of
stories and that it involves turning those marks on the pages into spoken
sounds, and that a skill is needed. He wants to acquire the skill.
Of course, it's not just books. It's signs that give helpful instructions
like STOP and DONT WALK, OPEN AT 9am, CLOSED, or MARKET or PARKING ON
WEEKDAYS ONLY, POISON, EXIT, FAMILY PLANNING: ENTRANCE IN REAR, etc.
(My wish is that the child will not be told that reading happens by magic,
even though learning can be said to be magical at any level. Skill is
needed.)
If the child knows that the print needs to be deciphered (decoded) in order
to turn it into familiar sounds, you're halfway home. If the child already
knows the alphabet, and/or knows that letters have distinct sounds (has
phonemic awareness), most of the problem is already solved...he is
definitely ready to read.
My suggestion is to determine what the child already knows and try to help
him build on that. One way to find out is to get a copy of Cat In the Hat
(or something similar with simple regular words...there are hundreds of such
children's books) and read it out loud, slowly of course, while he looks at
the pages. Point to the words as you read them. If, while you're reading,
the child says, "I get it. I can read it now," then you've done your job
for now.
The breakthrough to reading by a child might be surprisingly quick. That
depends on readiness, motivation, and other factors. If the child is
confident enough of his/her new skill to try to read other books by
him/herself, you can relax even more...s/he's on the way. Often, children
like to read a familiar book many times over. It seems to give them
confidence in their skills as they gain them.
Reading different books helps children learn more words as they progress,
and requires them to test their skill at decoding unfamiliar words on their
own, but when s/he asks you what a new word is, it's probably best simply
to read the word and let him/her continue (instead of asking him/her to
sound it out for you.
The idea is for the child to be able to recognize that the letters (for
example, C-A-T) have distinct sounds that make up the words.
There might be questions about capital letters and lower case letters that
you might need to answer, but I would advise against turning a child's
questions into teaching sessions. My son's favorite saying was from
Churchill who said, I love to learn but I hate being taught. Who doesn't?
...well, not everyone hates it, especially when we're interested.
A curious note: I once read an interview (or was it on the radio?) given by
Dr. Seuss. In it, he said that his publisher requested that his book, Cat In
The Hat, and several others, contain words that used the most basic
principles of phonics, and the publisher gave Seuss an actual list of words
that were to be included.
When Dr. Seuss (not his real name) was given his honorary degree (Doctor of
Letters) from Harvard, he announced that he could now call himself, Dr. Dr.
Seuss.
Ned Vare
>>So what would you do with a 5 year old who is asking to learn how toMy response: I hope we hear from others who have suggestions...but this is
>>read? Would you teach him phonics?
>>Sheila
the situation I was talking about.
My short answer is NO, I would try not to TEACH the child anything. I would
give the child the tools so that he will learn with the least possible
teaching. You say the child is asking to learn; he is not asking to be
taught. The difference is significant.
Apparently, this child has the motivation -- he's curious to know what the
books say. And he has a reason -- he wants to know what the authors are
talking about. Now the kid needs only one thing: The HOW...How does reading
happen?
The hope that many of us have, I'm sure, is that someone has been reading
stories to this child for several years, so that he knows the joys of
stories and that it involves turning those marks on the pages into spoken
sounds, and that a skill is needed. He wants to acquire the skill.
Of course, it's not just books. It's signs that give helpful instructions
like STOP and DONT WALK, OPEN AT 9am, CLOSED, or MARKET or PARKING ON
WEEKDAYS ONLY, POISON, EXIT, FAMILY PLANNING: ENTRANCE IN REAR, etc.
(My wish is that the child will not be told that reading happens by magic,
even though learning can be said to be magical at any level. Skill is
needed.)
If the child knows that the print needs to be deciphered (decoded) in order
to turn it into familiar sounds, you're halfway home. If the child already
knows the alphabet, and/or knows that letters have distinct sounds (has
phonemic awareness), most of the problem is already solved...he is
definitely ready to read.
My suggestion is to determine what the child already knows and try to help
him build on that. One way to find out is to get a copy of Cat In the Hat
(or something similar with simple regular words...there are hundreds of such
children's books) and read it out loud, slowly of course, while he looks at
the pages. Point to the words as you read them. If, while you're reading,
the child says, "I get it. I can read it now," then you've done your job
for now.
The breakthrough to reading by a child might be surprisingly quick. That
depends on readiness, motivation, and other factors. If the child is
confident enough of his/her new skill to try to read other books by
him/herself, you can relax even more...s/he's on the way. Often, children
like to read a familiar book many times over. It seems to give them
confidence in their skills as they gain them.
Reading different books helps children learn more words as they progress,
and requires them to test their skill at decoding unfamiliar words on their
own, but when s/he asks you what a new word is, it's probably best simply
to read the word and let him/her continue (instead of asking him/her to
sound it out for you.
The idea is for the child to be able to recognize that the letters (for
example, C-A-T) have distinct sounds that make up the words.
There might be questions about capital letters and lower case letters that
you might need to answer, but I would advise against turning a child's
questions into teaching sessions. My son's favorite saying was from
Churchill who said, I love to learn but I hate being taught. Who doesn't?
...well, not everyone hates it, especially when we're interested.
A curious note: I once read an interview (or was it on the radio?) given by
Dr. Seuss. In it, he said that his publisher requested that his book, Cat In
The Hat, and several others, contain words that used the most basic
principles of phonics, and the publisher gave Seuss an actual list of words
that were to be included.
When Dr. Seuss (not his real name) was given his honorary degree (Doctor of
Letters) from Harvard, he announced that he could now call himself, Dr. Dr.
Seuss.
Ned Vare
zenmomma *
>>If the child knows that the print needs to be deciphered (decoded) inI liked so many things in this post, but this is the kind of statement that
>>order to turn it into familiar sounds, you're halfway home. If the child
>>already knows the alphabet, and/or knows that letters have distinct sounds
>>(has phonemic awareness), most of the problem is already solved...he is
>>definitely ready to read.>>
just doesn't read true for me. And I'm afraid it will scare some parents
whose kids don't respond to phonics like this. It makes me think that
parents are going to think something is wrong if their child knows these
phonetical connections but is still not reading. Is not ready to read.
Casey knew her alphabet by 18 months of age. No kidding. She knew the sounds
that letters made by 3. No kidding. She was a writer (at 3) and asked me to
spell things for her by giving her the letter sound instead of the letter
name. So she definitely had the connection between printed letters, their
sounds and words. She was NOT however ready to read.
She tried on and off to start reading. She really wanted to be like her
older brother. She was a fabulous and independent writer. She is very
bright. She was still NOT ready to read. Whatever else needed to happen for
her, besides a phonics awareness, had not happened yet.
I think she had many sight words by 4 and 5, but wasn't able to sound out
c-a-t until later. She's 8 now and reading fluently. She still uses all the
options for new words available to her. She sounds out, guesses within
context, uses picture clues or asks. It all counts.
>>The breakthrough to reading by a child might be surprisingly quick.>>Or it might be surprisingly slow. There is no way I would have predicted how
long it would take Casey to get it all. If she had been 6 when she first
understood the letter/sound connection, and then took 4 or 5 years to become
a reader, I might have worried that something was wrong. Then she would be a
"late" reader. I think everyone out there needs to understand that kids
develop when and how they develop. For each child, the reading process will
be unique. It may follow a typical pattern but at a very different rate. Or
it may be, as you say, surpisingly quick, seemingly skipping over all the
typical steps.
Life is good.
~Mary
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In a message dated 8/4/02 11:06:04 AM, zenmomma@... writes:
<< Casey knew her alphabet by 18 months of age. No kidding. She knew the
sounds
that letters made by 3. No kidding. >>
Kirby too. Very precocious with basic "phonics" (because of plastic letters,
songs, Sesame Street and other games and toys).
He didn't read until he was nearly nine. And he learned to read Nintendo
Power Magazine and the gamers' manuals for Nintendo games he had.
Sandra
<< Casey knew her alphabet by 18 months of age. No kidding. She knew the
sounds
that letters made by 3. No kidding. >>
Kirby too. Very precocious with basic "phonics" (because of plastic letters,
songs, Sesame Street and other games and toys).
He didn't read until he was nearly nine. And he learned to read Nintendo
Power Magazine and the gamers' manuals for Nintendo games he had.
Sandra
KT
>Will, too! And Will, neither. As I said, he became a fluent reader at 7.
>
>Casey knew her alphabet by 18 months of age. No kidding. She knew the sounds
>that letters made by 3. No kidding. She was a writer (at 3) and asked me to
>spell things for her by giving her the letter sound instead of the letter
>name. So she definitely had the connection between printed letters, their
>sounds and words. She was NOT however ready to read.
>
I've been cleaning stuff out and found a bunch of the books he wrote and
drawings he made during his "Arkansas period". Sometimes it's my
handwriting in the books, but the stories are really good. During that
time, when he was 3, he learned how to read and write 2 words: Will,
and the name of his best friend, Grady. Will and Grady figure greatly
in those books. :)
Tuck
zenmomma *
>>Will and Grady figure greatly in those books. :)>>Casey's first books were about "The Little Girl". (Or I probably should say
"THE LTL GRL".) She wrote 5 or 6 of them in a row when she was 5. The little
girl was usually walking in the forest or making friends with small animals.
But one time the little girl got in a big time fight with her mom. :-/ Casey
swears it has nothing to do with *her* mom. ;-) In later, more sophisticated
versions of her stories, the little girl got a name (Gabrielle) and met up
with this way cool alien that morphs into a rabbit and takes her into space.
Life is good.
~Mary
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In a message dated 8/4/02 12:06:04 PM Central Daylight Time,
zenmomma@... writes:
ready to read then either.
~Ellen
«·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.»§«(¨`v´¨).»§«·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.»
` v´
"It is, in fact, nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of
instruction have not yet entirely strangled the holy curiousity of inquiry;
for this delicate little plant, aside from stimulation, stands mainly in need
of freedom."
-- Albert Einstein
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
zenmomma@... writes:
> She tried on and off to start reading. She really wanted to be like herMy 2nd son wanted to read because his older brother could too. But he wasn't
> older brother. She was a fabulous and independent writer. She is very
> bright. She was still NOT ready to read. Whatever else needed to happen for
>
> her, besides a phonics awareness, had not happened yet.
>
ready to read then either.
~Ellen
«·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.»§«(¨`v´¨).»§«·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.,¸¸,.·´¯`·.»
` v´
"It is, in fact, nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of
instruction have not yet entirely strangled the holy curiousity of inquiry;
for this delicate little plant, aside from stimulation, stands mainly in need
of freedom."
-- Albert Einstein
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mary krzyzanowski
When my brother was about 4 he wrote books with my mom's help. He told us
he wanted to be an author when he grew up. When asked why he wanted to be
that and not a writer he said,"An author gets published, a writer doesn't."
He's now 32 and a naval architect/marine engineer.
Mary-NY
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com
he wanted to be an author when he grew up. When asked why he wanted to be
that and not a writer he said,"An author gets published, a writer doesn't."
He's now 32 and a naval architect/marine engineer.
Mary-NY
>From: "zenmomma *" <zenmomma@...>_________________________________________________________________
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Phun w/ Phonics
>Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 18:29:57 -0600
>
>
> >>Will and Grady figure greatly in those books. :)>>
>
>Casey's first books were about "The Little Girl". (Or I probably should say
>"THE LTL GRL".) She wrote 5 or 6 of them in a row when she was 5. The
>little
>girl was usually walking in the forest or making friends with small
>animals.
>But one time the little girl got in a big time fight with her mom. :-/
>Casey
>swears it has nothing to do with *her* mom. ;-) In later, more
>sophisticated
>versions of her stories, the little girl got a name (Gabrielle) and met up
>with this way cool alien that morphs into a rabbit and takes her into
>space.
>
>Life is good.
>~Mary
>
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.c
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com