Re: child centered parenting...Very Long
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/5/99 1:18:24 PM Central Daylight Time, faithb@...
writes:
<< A lot of this, if not all, will mean nothing to the non-Christian. It's
based
on scripture and God. To those of you who are going to read this, please
don't take offense and think I am saying you have to follow this. Erin asked
me a question of what I have learned and the reasons to the way I believe. I
am simply answering her question.
God intended our priorities to be:
1. God
2. husband/wife
3. children
When we get away from that and put children before our husband/wife
relationship and sometimes even before God we are getting into child-centered
parenting. Putting the child's feelings before anything, including their
behavior. Always making the child 'feel' happy instead of making him
responsible for his actions. When the child leads what the family does
instead of mom and dad. Basically making the child the center of our
existence. >>
Faith,
I have purposely kept out of this conversation until now. I really
hate confrontational topics, as in other loops, I have watched things
escalate until there were hurt feelings, wrong interpretations, and out and
out war. However, I really feel as though I must step in on this one. Also,
like you have said, I don't mean this
as being against you. I really hope you don't take offense either. I just
feel very strongly, and even led by my faith in God, and the path we have
taken, to clarify some things.
Before I begin, I must tell you that you have the wrong understanding of
what Attachment Parenting is. It is "not" the child "leading" the family!
It is not soooo
child-centered that the child is leading the family, controlling the family,
or even the center of the family. Quite opposite!!!!! By allowing the child
freedom from being "controlled", the parents are also free!! The parents (if
they feel led to) can still put God First, Spouse Second, and Children Last.
The difference is that we don't feel like there is a need to say "Hey kids,
you must sit over there on the couch while your dad and I have alone time,
because Dad must come first!" Instead by loving, respecting, and listening
to each other (even the kids---especially making the kids a part of
that--they deserve respect and listening to just as much as an adult), it
just comes natural. It is like letting your kids know that there is enough
love to go around to each of them (whether you have two kids or fifteen).
They feel so loved, accepted, and respected that they don't fear or resent
that you have love first for God and then your husband.
We show them by our actions every day, and by the things we talk about, that
God comes first because he is the Almighty, the Creator, the Savior of the
World. Then they know that our spouse comes next because we fell in love and
married each other before we ever had the kids. They know that, understand
that and respect it because they feel confident and secure in the love they
get from us, and that is because they are being raised by "Attachment
Parenting" and "Positive Discipline".
First of all, I am a Christian. I am a very strong, devoted to Jesus
Christ, even considered Fundamental Christian. I was born in a Christian
home, so I have been a Christian all of my life.
Second of all, I was raised exactly the way this Ezzo guy is teaching in
his classes. My parents are very much into this way of raising children
(although they have never heard of this guys name). I was born into that
time period where parents were told not to hold their children very much (it
would spoil them), to let them cry it out (it was good for them), to make
them sleep through the night in their own bedroom (we were fed cereal at 2
weeks of age, and then if we woke during the night, they would stick a
pacifier in our mouths to make us go back to sleep), we were spanked even as
babies (to stress "no" to us and teach us what not to do), we were fed every
4 hours (not ever in between to matter how hungry we got--we were to be
trained to eat at the proper time), we were potty trained early (my mother
loves to tell the story of starting potty training me at 9 months of age. If
I had an "accident", I was paddled for it), we were never allowed to give our
opinions about anything (that was "mouthing off" and we were smacked across
the mouth for that), we spent our days in playpens and bouncers. Our parents
both worked and we went to babysitters (they didn't have all the daycares
like they do now). I was lucky, because our babysitters were our
grandparents or an aunt.
Anyway, my parents and me and my brother all had alot of stuggles once
we became older. My brother and I resented the fact that we were not allowed
opinions of our own. We hated being smacked or spanked for every little
thing (half of the time we didn't even know what we had done wrong. We were
always "flinching" and afraid of being hit, because we didn't know what we
were doing to cause it. We lived in a type of fear, because we couldn't ever
tell for sure if we were doing something right or wrong. Yet, my parents
loved us!! They weren't doing these things to abuse us or hurt us. They
actually thought that this was the way kids should be raised!
Now I am 39 years old. I have four children of my own, and the oldest
is 17 (almost 18). My parents have insisted on trying to control my life
even now. They still think that "respect" for ones parents (like the bible
says) means that I should automatically obey and follow their opinions on
everything. Instead of spanking me, now they say I am stupid, or I am not
using my head. They call me stubborn and say that I have never listened!
This all came about because they didn't like my homeschool methods! (They
were both public school teachers). They also don't like the way I keep
house, or the way I raise my kids, or my ideas on what is right or wrong, we
even disagree about some of the things in the bible. I tend to take the
bible very literally (but by literal, it means I study and try to find out
what the Greek or Hebrew words really meant, because alot of times their
meaning is very different than ours). Finally, I had to lovingly (but
firmly) tell my parents that I am an adult, I am 39 and I have to live my own
life!! They were livid!!! They shouted and screamed at me in front of my
children and some friends that were over (I had just got out of the hospital
after having a hysterectomy, so there were people over trying to help me).
My friends sat me down and finally opened my eyes that my parents were
actually abusing me---even if they thought they were doing it out of love. I
have noticed that alot of parents who raised their kids in the way this Ezzo
guy teaches, do not want to give up control of their kids when they are
grown. And that is what it is all about CONTROL.
Now to try to get on to my story. When my first son was born in 1982, I
started off raising him in much the way I was raised. After all, that is the
way I was raised, my friends were raised, and it was the way our church
taught. The difference was that I did try to breastfeed him (I had
difficulties with him latching on however--he has a tongue thrust problem-and
I had cracked and bleeding nipples. Unfortunately the only La Leche League I
could get hold of was long distance, we had no groups by us at that time, so
I finally gave up) and I did hold him all the time---against all the advice
that I was spoiling him. But I did spank my son for disobeying and I did
make sure that he always obeyed me. My mother was always pointing out to me
that I should always be the one in control (there is that word
again!!!!---see it is about control!) and not my child.
When my 2nd child was born 4 years later, I was still raising them the
same way. Since I had trouble nursing the first time, I didn't even try with
the 2nd child.
However, as I watched him become a toddler, I began to be troubled with the
way I was raising my children. I was struggling with my parents having so
much control over us (I was 25 and I had never told my parents to let us make
our own decisions. They told us which house we should buy. They told my
husband to go back to school---and he did, although he told me that he really
resented their interference, and he thought I should "cut the apron strings",
and they told us how to raise our kids.) I was very much under the influence
of my parents, and I was really starting to resent it. I felt much like a
puppet on a string!
When my 3rd child was born, I had decided to make some changes. I had
no support group or even friends that believed in the way I was deciding to
go. I had never even read about it, but my new pediatrician was very much
into breastfeeding and letting your baby sleep with you. I was excited by
the concept and I decided to do that with my son. Well I had alot of
opposition!! My parents and everyone else around me pushed me to not nurse
long, please don't nurse out in public, please don't continue to sleep with
your baby--you will suffocate him!!, please quit nursing on demand--you will
spoil him and he won't be trained right. Well thank goodness, for once I was
stubborn enough to ignore everyone and follow my own instincts!!!
I wish that I had even followed them longer than I did, because unfortunately
I gave in under pressure and quit nursing him at nine months (it looked so
awful to nurse him when he was so old!!!!---everyone kept telling me!)
However, I continued to pray and study my bible and question God about the
way I was raising my children. I was still spanking them and "controlling"
them and things just didn't feel right! My children would get angry and
rebel against the control, and I would get angry and try even harder to
control them! I knew that my Christian friends and family all said that that
was the way Christians should raise their kids, but it sure didn't feel
Christian to me. I could not imagine Jesus Christ ever treating a child this
way!
Anyway, after much praying and thinking, I decided to take this even
farther with my fourth child. I nursed her until she was 18 months old (I
would have gone farther, but I was pregnant again, and the OB told me to quit
because I was having problems. I really regret quitting, since it hurt both
me and my daughter to quit before we were ready, and then I still lost the
baby anyway a few weeks later), I allowed her to sleep with me all the time,
I kept her on me buy wearing her in a cloth front baby carrier, and I fed her
on demand and she never took a pacifier---she used me as one instead, so
there were times it seemed like she never quit nursing :-).
It was wonderful and I loved it!
Anyway, my parents hated it! Especially when we began to quit spanking
our kids and allowing them more decision making. My mother said that we
would lose control!! You know what though? We haven't lost any "control".
We are still the parents, so when it comes to big monumental decisions, we
still make them. Our kids can't go out and get drunk, or have sex, or walk
out in front of a car--just because we dont try to "control" their lives and
make them obey. They know that there are some things that we know would hurt
them and they take our word for it,
However, I have noticed that the younger two children are much more at peace
with themselves, they are happier and closer knit to me, they care alot about
the feelings of the people around them, and they have been TONS more
healthier than the older two. I really feel like this was because of
Attachment parenting. (Unfortunately, even though we had began to practice
this, I wasn't aware there was a term for it until a year ago. By then my
youngest was 7 years old!! A little late for a support group during the
fact!). As a matter of fact, when we started this, my older two were too old
to really benefit. Besides our infant daughter, we had a 3 yr. old, a 6 yr
old and a 10 yr. old. Now I have really regretted not starting with the
Attachment parenting when our first child was born. It was too late to have
the 6yr old and the 10 yr old come back to bed with us. They were happy
sharing a bunk bed with each other. However, we did start the "positive
discipline" and more listening and allowing them to tell us how they felt.
There has been such a change in my kids!!! There is not so much tension and
rebelling at authority. They don't have to worry about being hit or spanked
when they do something we don't like. However, I am constantly being told by
my parents (although they wouldn't admit that they were being raised right),
by my friends, and by strangers and people at church that my kids are so well
behaved!!! They are also amazed at how well they treat each other!!
I really wish that I could have had more children! Unfortunately, I had
two miscarriages after our 4th child was born. I also had alot of "problems"
until finally I had a hysterectomy. Now that is another big regret!!!!! I
wish that I had looked into alternative treatments and medicine and maybe now
I would have more kids!! If I could have had more (even by adoption), I
would practice attachment parenting. I am a very firm believer in it, as I
have seen the consequences from both sides! I would constantly recommend
Attachment Parenting, breastfeeding, and no hysterectomies (unless absolutely
necessary-like cancer) to everyone.Believe me, the children raised with
Attachment Parenting are much better behaved than those raised in such a
strict manner. And kids raised by Attachment Parenting are NOT controlling
their parents! Believe me, I know! God still comes first in our lives, and
I teach that to my kids by my actions not just words!!! Then my husband
still comes 2nd. This my kids also see by actions. They see us walk off
onto our acreage and take walks into our woods holding hands, or having our
arms wrapped around each other, while we have our heads close together
talking. They see us smiling, laughing, teasing, and kissing each other.
They see us go out on a "date" every once in awhile--just because we want to
be together. My kids have no reason to resent this, because we don't make
them sit down and let mom and dad have their time together!!--instead we
spend so much time laughing and loving as a "family" that it is natural that
their parents would love each other and spend time alone. After all, their
parents were together before the children were ever in the picture!! Last
comes the children. But we include them in almost everything we do
(homeschooling, church, going out to eat, going on trips, etc) because we
ENJOY spending time with our children. We enjoy playing with them, learning
with them, talking with them and listening to them. It is wonderful not to
feel like I have to "control" them. Now that I am away from that, and I have
seen the wonderful consequences of this new way of life, I realize how
"silly" and "ridiculous" it is to feel like we have to control our kids!
Where in the bible does it say to "control" anybody? The only time I
remember reading about "control" it dealt with ourselves. LIke controlling
our tongue or our actions!
As far as finding in the bible about Attachment Parenting, I am sure
that there are some references to it if someone looks for them. Off hand, I
can't come up with Chapter and Verse. I do know that there were instances
were things are suggested, like Solomon (I believe it was) whose mother
weaned him before giving him to Gods work. If you study Greek and Hebrew
translations, you will learn that it was "typical" to wean children from the
breast quite late (like age 4-6 yrs old). You will also learn that children
went every where with their parents and worked along side of them. They were
not shipped off to school. As a matter of fact, only boys were sent to
school, and usually they were about 12 or 13 yrs old by then.
Because of my interest in historic facts about families, I have read
about families back then. It seems as though, by the things I have read, the
poor families of those times lived in one or two rooms. Alot of the time,
the whole family shared one bed, even the teenagers!! (Voila, the family
bed was born 1,000's of years ago!). Women alot of times wore their children
on makeshift slings worn on their hip or back while they worked. Children
were very involved in family life. As a matter of fact, it seems like it was
the last couple of centuries that have become so "anti-family". So it seems
to me that "attachment parenting" is natural, Christian, and a custom from
way back--even from the time of Christ!
Well, as you can tell from the long, long post that this topic is very
near and dear to my heart. Honey, I have been where you are. I know the
pressures from some of the Christians about the "correct Christian way" of
child rearing. Unfortunately, I have also walked down both paths, and I know
which path is working the right way and feels right. I feel so much that
this is the Christian way of raising kids. I go to a very Fundamentalist,
Bible preaching church. My church is very large (over 600 people), but I now
know many, many Christians who also believe this way. Before you jump into
this, please, please pray alot more about it. Check it out more fully.
I have heard from my Christian circles about how awful this new teaching from
this Ezzo guy really is. Most Christians I know now, would never take that
path. But most of all, I know first hand how damaging that can be to raise
your children like that. First of all, I know how much it has hurt me.
Second, and worse of all to me, I know how much it hurt my own children to be
raised like that. It is a regret that will always bother me and I am so
sorry for it. I really would hate for you to also look back and regret what
you have done to your kids. All of us are only telling you these things
because we care!!! It is not to hurt you or offend you. We really are
afraid that you may make a mistake that you will regret for the rest of your
life!!! Please, check into this further!
Tami
writes:
<< A lot of this, if not all, will mean nothing to the non-Christian. It's
based
on scripture and God. To those of you who are going to read this, please
don't take offense and think I am saying you have to follow this. Erin asked
me a question of what I have learned and the reasons to the way I believe. I
am simply answering her question.
God intended our priorities to be:
1. God
2. husband/wife
3. children
When we get away from that and put children before our husband/wife
relationship and sometimes even before God we are getting into child-centered
parenting. Putting the child's feelings before anything, including their
behavior. Always making the child 'feel' happy instead of making him
responsible for his actions. When the child leads what the family does
instead of mom and dad. Basically making the child the center of our
existence. >>
Faith,
I have purposely kept out of this conversation until now. I really
hate confrontational topics, as in other loops, I have watched things
escalate until there were hurt feelings, wrong interpretations, and out and
out war. However, I really feel as though I must step in on this one. Also,
like you have said, I don't mean this
as being against you. I really hope you don't take offense either. I just
feel very strongly, and even led by my faith in God, and the path we have
taken, to clarify some things.
Before I begin, I must tell you that you have the wrong understanding of
what Attachment Parenting is. It is "not" the child "leading" the family!
It is not soooo
child-centered that the child is leading the family, controlling the family,
or even the center of the family. Quite opposite!!!!! By allowing the child
freedom from being "controlled", the parents are also free!! The parents (if
they feel led to) can still put God First, Spouse Second, and Children Last.
The difference is that we don't feel like there is a need to say "Hey kids,
you must sit over there on the couch while your dad and I have alone time,
because Dad must come first!" Instead by loving, respecting, and listening
to each other (even the kids---especially making the kids a part of
that--they deserve respect and listening to just as much as an adult), it
just comes natural. It is like letting your kids know that there is enough
love to go around to each of them (whether you have two kids or fifteen).
They feel so loved, accepted, and respected that they don't fear or resent
that you have love first for God and then your husband.
We show them by our actions every day, and by the things we talk about, that
God comes first because he is the Almighty, the Creator, the Savior of the
World. Then they know that our spouse comes next because we fell in love and
married each other before we ever had the kids. They know that, understand
that and respect it because they feel confident and secure in the love they
get from us, and that is because they are being raised by "Attachment
Parenting" and "Positive Discipline".
First of all, I am a Christian. I am a very strong, devoted to Jesus
Christ, even considered Fundamental Christian. I was born in a Christian
home, so I have been a Christian all of my life.
Second of all, I was raised exactly the way this Ezzo guy is teaching in
his classes. My parents are very much into this way of raising children
(although they have never heard of this guys name). I was born into that
time period where parents were told not to hold their children very much (it
would spoil them), to let them cry it out (it was good for them), to make
them sleep through the night in their own bedroom (we were fed cereal at 2
weeks of age, and then if we woke during the night, they would stick a
pacifier in our mouths to make us go back to sleep), we were spanked even as
babies (to stress "no" to us and teach us what not to do), we were fed every
4 hours (not ever in between to matter how hungry we got--we were to be
trained to eat at the proper time), we were potty trained early (my mother
loves to tell the story of starting potty training me at 9 months of age. If
I had an "accident", I was paddled for it), we were never allowed to give our
opinions about anything (that was "mouthing off" and we were smacked across
the mouth for that), we spent our days in playpens and bouncers. Our parents
both worked and we went to babysitters (they didn't have all the daycares
like they do now). I was lucky, because our babysitters were our
grandparents or an aunt.
Anyway, my parents and me and my brother all had alot of stuggles once
we became older. My brother and I resented the fact that we were not allowed
opinions of our own. We hated being smacked or spanked for every little
thing (half of the time we didn't even know what we had done wrong. We were
always "flinching" and afraid of being hit, because we didn't know what we
were doing to cause it. We lived in a type of fear, because we couldn't ever
tell for sure if we were doing something right or wrong. Yet, my parents
loved us!! They weren't doing these things to abuse us or hurt us. They
actually thought that this was the way kids should be raised!
Now I am 39 years old. I have four children of my own, and the oldest
is 17 (almost 18). My parents have insisted on trying to control my life
even now. They still think that "respect" for ones parents (like the bible
says) means that I should automatically obey and follow their opinions on
everything. Instead of spanking me, now they say I am stupid, or I am not
using my head. They call me stubborn and say that I have never listened!
This all came about because they didn't like my homeschool methods! (They
were both public school teachers). They also don't like the way I keep
house, or the way I raise my kids, or my ideas on what is right or wrong, we
even disagree about some of the things in the bible. I tend to take the
bible very literally (but by literal, it means I study and try to find out
what the Greek or Hebrew words really meant, because alot of times their
meaning is very different than ours). Finally, I had to lovingly (but
firmly) tell my parents that I am an adult, I am 39 and I have to live my own
life!! They were livid!!! They shouted and screamed at me in front of my
children and some friends that were over (I had just got out of the hospital
after having a hysterectomy, so there were people over trying to help me).
My friends sat me down and finally opened my eyes that my parents were
actually abusing me---even if they thought they were doing it out of love. I
have noticed that alot of parents who raised their kids in the way this Ezzo
guy teaches, do not want to give up control of their kids when they are
grown. And that is what it is all about CONTROL.
Now to try to get on to my story. When my first son was born in 1982, I
started off raising him in much the way I was raised. After all, that is the
way I was raised, my friends were raised, and it was the way our church
taught. The difference was that I did try to breastfeed him (I had
difficulties with him latching on however--he has a tongue thrust problem-and
I had cracked and bleeding nipples. Unfortunately the only La Leche League I
could get hold of was long distance, we had no groups by us at that time, so
I finally gave up) and I did hold him all the time---against all the advice
that I was spoiling him. But I did spank my son for disobeying and I did
make sure that he always obeyed me. My mother was always pointing out to me
that I should always be the one in control (there is that word
again!!!!---see it is about control!) and not my child.
When my 2nd child was born 4 years later, I was still raising them the
same way. Since I had trouble nursing the first time, I didn't even try with
the 2nd child.
However, as I watched him become a toddler, I began to be troubled with the
way I was raising my children. I was struggling with my parents having so
much control over us (I was 25 and I had never told my parents to let us make
our own decisions. They told us which house we should buy. They told my
husband to go back to school---and he did, although he told me that he really
resented their interference, and he thought I should "cut the apron strings",
and they told us how to raise our kids.) I was very much under the influence
of my parents, and I was really starting to resent it. I felt much like a
puppet on a string!
When my 3rd child was born, I had decided to make some changes. I had
no support group or even friends that believed in the way I was deciding to
go. I had never even read about it, but my new pediatrician was very much
into breastfeeding and letting your baby sleep with you. I was excited by
the concept and I decided to do that with my son. Well I had alot of
opposition!! My parents and everyone else around me pushed me to not nurse
long, please don't nurse out in public, please don't continue to sleep with
your baby--you will suffocate him!!, please quit nursing on demand--you will
spoil him and he won't be trained right. Well thank goodness, for once I was
stubborn enough to ignore everyone and follow my own instincts!!!
I wish that I had even followed them longer than I did, because unfortunately
I gave in under pressure and quit nursing him at nine months (it looked so
awful to nurse him when he was so old!!!!---everyone kept telling me!)
However, I continued to pray and study my bible and question God about the
way I was raising my children. I was still spanking them and "controlling"
them and things just didn't feel right! My children would get angry and
rebel against the control, and I would get angry and try even harder to
control them! I knew that my Christian friends and family all said that that
was the way Christians should raise their kids, but it sure didn't feel
Christian to me. I could not imagine Jesus Christ ever treating a child this
way!
Anyway, after much praying and thinking, I decided to take this even
farther with my fourth child. I nursed her until she was 18 months old (I
would have gone farther, but I was pregnant again, and the OB told me to quit
because I was having problems. I really regret quitting, since it hurt both
me and my daughter to quit before we were ready, and then I still lost the
baby anyway a few weeks later), I allowed her to sleep with me all the time,
I kept her on me buy wearing her in a cloth front baby carrier, and I fed her
on demand and she never took a pacifier---she used me as one instead, so
there were times it seemed like she never quit nursing :-).
It was wonderful and I loved it!
Anyway, my parents hated it! Especially when we began to quit spanking
our kids and allowing them more decision making. My mother said that we
would lose control!! You know what though? We haven't lost any "control".
We are still the parents, so when it comes to big monumental decisions, we
still make them. Our kids can't go out and get drunk, or have sex, or walk
out in front of a car--just because we dont try to "control" their lives and
make them obey. They know that there are some things that we know would hurt
them and they take our word for it,
However, I have noticed that the younger two children are much more at peace
with themselves, they are happier and closer knit to me, they care alot about
the feelings of the people around them, and they have been TONS more
healthier than the older two. I really feel like this was because of
Attachment parenting. (Unfortunately, even though we had began to practice
this, I wasn't aware there was a term for it until a year ago. By then my
youngest was 7 years old!! A little late for a support group during the
fact!). As a matter of fact, when we started this, my older two were too old
to really benefit. Besides our infant daughter, we had a 3 yr. old, a 6 yr
old and a 10 yr. old. Now I have really regretted not starting with the
Attachment parenting when our first child was born. It was too late to have
the 6yr old and the 10 yr old come back to bed with us. They were happy
sharing a bunk bed with each other. However, we did start the "positive
discipline" and more listening and allowing them to tell us how they felt.
There has been such a change in my kids!!! There is not so much tension and
rebelling at authority. They don't have to worry about being hit or spanked
when they do something we don't like. However, I am constantly being told by
my parents (although they wouldn't admit that they were being raised right),
by my friends, and by strangers and people at church that my kids are so well
behaved!!! They are also amazed at how well they treat each other!!
I really wish that I could have had more children! Unfortunately, I had
two miscarriages after our 4th child was born. I also had alot of "problems"
until finally I had a hysterectomy. Now that is another big regret!!!!! I
wish that I had looked into alternative treatments and medicine and maybe now
I would have more kids!! If I could have had more (even by adoption), I
would practice attachment parenting. I am a very firm believer in it, as I
have seen the consequences from both sides! I would constantly recommend
Attachment Parenting, breastfeeding, and no hysterectomies (unless absolutely
necessary-like cancer) to everyone.Believe me, the children raised with
Attachment Parenting are much better behaved than those raised in such a
strict manner. And kids raised by Attachment Parenting are NOT controlling
their parents! Believe me, I know! God still comes first in our lives, and
I teach that to my kids by my actions not just words!!! Then my husband
still comes 2nd. This my kids also see by actions. They see us walk off
onto our acreage and take walks into our woods holding hands, or having our
arms wrapped around each other, while we have our heads close together
talking. They see us smiling, laughing, teasing, and kissing each other.
They see us go out on a "date" every once in awhile--just because we want to
be together. My kids have no reason to resent this, because we don't make
them sit down and let mom and dad have their time together!!--instead we
spend so much time laughing and loving as a "family" that it is natural that
their parents would love each other and spend time alone. After all, their
parents were together before the children were ever in the picture!! Last
comes the children. But we include them in almost everything we do
(homeschooling, church, going out to eat, going on trips, etc) because we
ENJOY spending time with our children. We enjoy playing with them, learning
with them, talking with them and listening to them. It is wonderful not to
feel like I have to "control" them. Now that I am away from that, and I have
seen the wonderful consequences of this new way of life, I realize how
"silly" and "ridiculous" it is to feel like we have to control our kids!
Where in the bible does it say to "control" anybody? The only time I
remember reading about "control" it dealt with ourselves. LIke controlling
our tongue or our actions!
As far as finding in the bible about Attachment Parenting, I am sure
that there are some references to it if someone looks for them. Off hand, I
can't come up with Chapter and Verse. I do know that there were instances
were things are suggested, like Solomon (I believe it was) whose mother
weaned him before giving him to Gods work. If you study Greek and Hebrew
translations, you will learn that it was "typical" to wean children from the
breast quite late (like age 4-6 yrs old). You will also learn that children
went every where with their parents and worked along side of them. They were
not shipped off to school. As a matter of fact, only boys were sent to
school, and usually they were about 12 or 13 yrs old by then.
Because of my interest in historic facts about families, I have read
about families back then. It seems as though, by the things I have read, the
poor families of those times lived in one or two rooms. Alot of the time,
the whole family shared one bed, even the teenagers!! (Voila, the family
bed was born 1,000's of years ago!). Women alot of times wore their children
on makeshift slings worn on their hip or back while they worked. Children
were very involved in family life. As a matter of fact, it seems like it was
the last couple of centuries that have become so "anti-family". So it seems
to me that "attachment parenting" is natural, Christian, and a custom from
way back--even from the time of Christ!
Well, as you can tell from the long, long post that this topic is very
near and dear to my heart. Honey, I have been where you are. I know the
pressures from some of the Christians about the "correct Christian way" of
child rearing. Unfortunately, I have also walked down both paths, and I know
which path is working the right way and feels right. I feel so much that
this is the Christian way of raising kids. I go to a very Fundamentalist,
Bible preaching church. My church is very large (over 600 people), but I now
know many, many Christians who also believe this way. Before you jump into
this, please, please pray alot more about it. Check it out more fully.
I have heard from my Christian circles about how awful this new teaching from
this Ezzo guy really is. Most Christians I know now, would never take that
path. But most of all, I know first hand how damaging that can be to raise
your children like that. First of all, I know how much it has hurt me.
Second, and worse of all to me, I know how much it hurt my own children to be
raised like that. It is a regret that will always bother me and I am so
sorry for it. I really would hate for you to also look back and regret what
you have done to your kids. All of us are only telling you these things
because we care!!! It is not to hurt you or offend you. We really are
afraid that you may make a mistake that you will regret for the rest of your
life!!! Please, check into this further!
Tami
faith buckley
Tami,
Thank you for your concern and sharing with me how you feel. I would like to say
that I agree with you wholeheartedly about breastfeeding. I only breastfed my son
for 2 months, and I wish I had done it longer but I was only 19 and didn't want to
be "tied down"(I really didn't know what I was doing). My 5 yr old is my
step-daughter, and my 2 yr old daughter I nursed for a year and I plan to do the
same with my 2month old. I feel that breastfeeding is essential and the way God
created infants to be fed. I have friends of mine from church that nursed their
kids for 2+ yrs. I don't argue, at all, that it is the best thing for children to
be nursed. I personally wouldn't be able to deal with nursing for more than 2
yrs. But that doesn't make it wrong to go longer! Also, I have been known to
take my kids to bed with me. I do not do it on a regular basis, but sometimes I
am just too tired to sit up a breastfeed so I do it in bed and fall asleep with my
daughter attached. I have no problem with it and neither does my husband. Like I
said I do not make a practice of it though. I prefer to have my half of a bed to
myself. :-)
My 2 year old has been known to climb into bed with us if she continues to be
fussy and not want to sleep, which is rare, but when she was young I would nurse
her in bed and fall asleep with her, too.
I also would like to say that I'm sorry for the way your parents act with you.
They were wrong and I wish things could be different for you.
I am having a very hard time with the fact that so many people are judging the
Ezzo's on what they have heard other people say, instead of reading the material
and then judging for themselves. All of the posts I have read about what people
think of the Ezzo's methods have been based on what they have heard. The way you
described your parents is NOT what the Ezzo's teach. I have gone over my book
again since this whole thing started and I don't find anything in it that is even
remotely along the same lines as people have said. They DO NOT teach
authoritarian parenting at all. They DO NOT teach parents to totally control
their children and not let them think for themselves. Quite the opposite. All
the Ezzo's teach is how to train your children to think for themselves and make
correct moral decisions. I don't find that bad at all. I want to have children
who, when I am not there, know the difference between right and wrong and make a
decision accordingly. Morality is what they teach. Not brainwashing.
About the baby thing and the Ezzo's. I wrote to Erin on another post about what
they teach. Parent-Controlled Feeding is so different than what everyone thinks
and has made it out to be. Please find and read that post and it will explain how
they are not teaching what your parents did.
I myself give my daughter a pacifier in the middle of the night if she wakes up.
If she goes back to sleep, YEAH. If she won't, then she's really hungry and I
feed her. I need my sleep to be able to make it through the day but I do not
neglect my child. If she really does need to be fed, I don't care what time it
is, I will do it.
I wanted to correct something that you misunderstood. When the parents have
"couch time" they do not make their children sit down to watch. The children are
free to do as they please but just not interrupt mommy and daddy while they talk
for 10-15 min.. That's all.
Again, thank you for your thoughts and God bless!
Living for Him, also :-)
Faith
Thank you for your concern and sharing with me how you feel. I would like to say
that I agree with you wholeheartedly about breastfeeding. I only breastfed my son
for 2 months, and I wish I had done it longer but I was only 19 and didn't want to
be "tied down"(I really didn't know what I was doing). My 5 yr old is my
step-daughter, and my 2 yr old daughter I nursed for a year and I plan to do the
same with my 2month old. I feel that breastfeeding is essential and the way God
created infants to be fed. I have friends of mine from church that nursed their
kids for 2+ yrs. I don't argue, at all, that it is the best thing for children to
be nursed. I personally wouldn't be able to deal with nursing for more than 2
yrs. But that doesn't make it wrong to go longer! Also, I have been known to
take my kids to bed with me. I do not do it on a regular basis, but sometimes I
am just too tired to sit up a breastfeed so I do it in bed and fall asleep with my
daughter attached. I have no problem with it and neither does my husband. Like I
said I do not make a practice of it though. I prefer to have my half of a bed to
myself. :-)
My 2 year old has been known to climb into bed with us if she continues to be
fussy and not want to sleep, which is rare, but when she was young I would nurse
her in bed and fall asleep with her, too.
I also would like to say that I'm sorry for the way your parents act with you.
They were wrong and I wish things could be different for you.
I am having a very hard time with the fact that so many people are judging the
Ezzo's on what they have heard other people say, instead of reading the material
and then judging for themselves. All of the posts I have read about what people
think of the Ezzo's methods have been based on what they have heard. The way you
described your parents is NOT what the Ezzo's teach. I have gone over my book
again since this whole thing started and I don't find anything in it that is even
remotely along the same lines as people have said. They DO NOT teach
authoritarian parenting at all. They DO NOT teach parents to totally control
their children and not let them think for themselves. Quite the opposite. All
the Ezzo's teach is how to train your children to think for themselves and make
correct moral decisions. I don't find that bad at all. I want to have children
who, when I am not there, know the difference between right and wrong and make a
decision accordingly. Morality is what they teach. Not brainwashing.
About the baby thing and the Ezzo's. I wrote to Erin on another post about what
they teach. Parent-Controlled Feeding is so different than what everyone thinks
and has made it out to be. Please find and read that post and it will explain how
they are not teaching what your parents did.
I myself give my daughter a pacifier in the middle of the night if she wakes up.
If she goes back to sleep, YEAH. If she won't, then she's really hungry and I
feed her. I need my sleep to be able to make it through the day but I do not
neglect my child. If she really does need to be fed, I don't care what time it
is, I will do it.
I wanted to correct something that you misunderstood. When the parents have
"couch time" they do not make their children sit down to watch. The children are
free to do as they please but just not interrupt mommy and daddy while they talk
for 10-15 min.. That's all.
Again, thank you for your thoughts and God bless!
Living for Him, also :-)
Faith
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/6/99 0:12:41 AM PST, faithb@... writes:
<<
I am having a very hard time with the fact that so many people are judging
the
Ezzo's on what they have heard other people say, instead of reading the
material
and then judging for themselves. All of the posts I have read about what
people
think of the Ezzo's methods have been based on what they have heard >>
Some of us HAVE read the materials and taken the classes. We STILL disagree.
I personally have several problems with their methods. First, since when is
ONE method right for every child? Second, How can individual children and
families possibly have only ONE right way to raise a child? (The implication
of the title of the classes is that if you don't do it THIS way it isn't
God's Way).
Have you been to their web-site? Checked out their discussion boards? It is
full of mothers who are in turmoil asking questions about how to raise their
kids. They no longer rely on their instinct, they stuff that - because GARY
says do it this way.... I have sat many hours in tears reading how mother's
were worried that the child seemed listless, never smiled, was fussy a lot,
and they were tempted to give up nursing all together because it wasn't
enjoyable - the baby needed to eat to early. There is NO education in these
books about breast milk. (at least the version I have - they have come under
such fire, that they have SEVERAL revisions because of inaccurate medical
info) - A child who is exclusively nursed generally CAN'T go 3 to 4 hours
without eating again. Often, the baby needs to nurse every hour and a half.
Ezzos have not (in the past) made provision for this. Even my sister's book,
which is the latest revision, discourages nursing past 6 months. How awful!
Especially since the medical community has come out and said 1 year is the
MINIMUM they reccomend. As far as the GKGW for older kids, it really is a
"formula". I don't believe God intended us to use a "formula" in raising our
kids when he said "Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is
old he will not depart from it." My studying on this verse leads me to
believe that we should train our children according to their personalities,
their own natural "bent". Teach them according to their interests, develop
their God given talents and educate them toward those talents, as God created
this person and HE knows the path he is to take.
Mary
<<
I am having a very hard time with the fact that so many people are judging
the
Ezzo's on what they have heard other people say, instead of reading the
material
and then judging for themselves. All of the posts I have read about what
people
think of the Ezzo's methods have been based on what they have heard >>
Some of us HAVE read the materials and taken the classes. We STILL disagree.
I personally have several problems with their methods. First, since when is
ONE method right for every child? Second, How can individual children and
families possibly have only ONE right way to raise a child? (The implication
of the title of the classes is that if you don't do it THIS way it isn't
God's Way).
Have you been to their web-site? Checked out their discussion boards? It is
full of mothers who are in turmoil asking questions about how to raise their
kids. They no longer rely on their instinct, they stuff that - because GARY
says do it this way.... I have sat many hours in tears reading how mother's
were worried that the child seemed listless, never smiled, was fussy a lot,
and they were tempted to give up nursing all together because it wasn't
enjoyable - the baby needed to eat to early. There is NO education in these
books about breast milk. (at least the version I have - they have come under
such fire, that they have SEVERAL revisions because of inaccurate medical
info) - A child who is exclusively nursed generally CAN'T go 3 to 4 hours
without eating again. Often, the baby needs to nurse every hour and a half.
Ezzos have not (in the past) made provision for this. Even my sister's book,
which is the latest revision, discourages nursing past 6 months. How awful!
Especially since the medical community has come out and said 1 year is the
MINIMUM they reccomend. As far as the GKGW for older kids, it really is a
"formula". I don't believe God intended us to use a "formula" in raising our
kids when he said "Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is
old he will not depart from it." My studying on this verse leads me to
believe that we should train our children according to their personalities,
their own natural "bent". Teach them according to their interests, develop
their God given talents and educate them toward those talents, as God created
this person and HE knows the path he is to take.
Mary
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/6/99 3:12:52 AM Central Daylight Time, faithb@...
writes:
<< I want to have children
who, when I am not there, know the difference between right and wrong and
make a
decision accordingly. Morality is what they teach. >>
Faith,
On this topic, we both agree! I do understand what you are saying,
although I do not agree with you. However, throughout your other posts,
there seemed to be a strong vocal point coming from you that Christians would
not use Attachment Parenting. You seemed to feel as if a Christian truly
believed in what the Bible says about raising Godly children, that we could
not in good faith use another type of discipline except spanking our
children. I just felt the need to let you know that there are many very
devoted Christians out there who do not spank their children. We all believe
very strongly in the bible and study it diligently, but I do not think it
ever tells us that we must spank our children, As a matter of fact, after
studying the life of Christ, I feel led to do just the opposite!!
I believe you have the right to make your own decision on the matter. I
also feel very deeply that you really love and have concern for your children
and want only the best. I am sure that you are truly trying to follow Gods
leading in this matter, and I will not presume to tell you what God is saying
to you. We each have our own personal walk with Jesus Christ.
What I am saying is that there are Christians who believe in spanking,
and there are Christians who believe in Attachment Parenting. Both groups
are equally Christians in their faith and we should never presume that if
someone is raising their children in a different way, then that makes them
weaker Christians than we are.
As Christians that practice Attachment Parenting, we still strongly believe
in teaching our children right from wrong and morality. We are also teaching
our children to be able to think for themselves during our absence and choose
right over wrong. So it sounds to me like our goals are very similar, it is
just our methods that are different! :-)
Tami
writes:
<< I want to have children
who, when I am not there, know the difference between right and wrong and
make a
decision accordingly. Morality is what they teach. >>
Faith,
On this topic, we both agree! I do understand what you are saying,
although I do not agree with you. However, throughout your other posts,
there seemed to be a strong vocal point coming from you that Christians would
not use Attachment Parenting. You seemed to feel as if a Christian truly
believed in what the Bible says about raising Godly children, that we could
not in good faith use another type of discipline except spanking our
children. I just felt the need to let you know that there are many very
devoted Christians out there who do not spank their children. We all believe
very strongly in the bible and study it diligently, but I do not think it
ever tells us that we must spank our children, As a matter of fact, after
studying the life of Christ, I feel led to do just the opposite!!
I believe you have the right to make your own decision on the matter. I
also feel very deeply that you really love and have concern for your children
and want only the best. I am sure that you are truly trying to follow Gods
leading in this matter, and I will not presume to tell you what God is saying
to you. We each have our own personal walk with Jesus Christ.
What I am saying is that there are Christians who believe in spanking,
and there are Christians who believe in Attachment Parenting. Both groups
are equally Christians in their faith and we should never presume that if
someone is raising their children in a different way, then that makes them
weaker Christians than we are.
As Christians that practice Attachment Parenting, we still strongly believe
in teaching our children right from wrong and morality. We are also teaching
our children to be able to think for themselves during our absence and choose
right over wrong. So it sounds to me like our goals are very similar, it is
just our methods that are different! :-)
Tami
faith buckley
Tami,
I did not mean to sound like all Christians do not chose attachment parenting.
In fact in the majority, if not all, of my posts I have been very quick to say
that this is how I do things and that I know that everyone (Christians and
non-Christianss alike) have their own way of doing things. Please understand
that I do not think of myself as the authority to Christian living. I certainly
am not nor do I expect every Christian to live like I do!!!
Sincerely,
Faith
FreeSchool@... wrote:
I did not mean to sound like all Christians do not chose attachment parenting.
In fact in the majority, if not all, of my posts I have been very quick to say
that this is how I do things and that I know that everyone (Christians and
non-Christianss alike) have their own way of doing things. Please understand
that I do not think of myself as the authority to Christian living. I certainly
am not nor do I expect every Christian to live like I do!!!
Sincerely,
Faith
FreeSchool@... wrote:
> From: FreeSchool@...
>
> In a message dated 10/6/99 3:12:52 AM Central Daylight Time, faithb@...
> writes:
>
> << I want to have children
> who, when I am not there, know the difference between right and wrong and
> make a
> decision accordingly. Morality is what they teach. >>
>
> Faith,
> On this topic, we both agree! I do understand what you are saying,
> although I do not agree with you. However, throughout your other posts,
> there seemed to be a strong vocal point coming from you that Christians would
> not use Attachment Parenting. You seemed to feel as if a Christian truly
> believed in what the Bible says about raising Godly children, that we could
> not in good faith use another type of discipline except spanking our
> children. I just felt the need to let you know that there are many very
> devoted Christians out there who do not spank their children. We all believe
> very strongly in the bible and study it diligently, but I do not think it
> ever tells us that we must spank our children, As a matter of fact, after
> studying the life of Christ, I feel led to do just the opposite!!
> I believe you have the right to make your own decision on the matter. I
> also feel very deeply that you really love and have concern for your children
> and want only the best. I am sure that you are truly trying to follow Gods
> leading in this matter, and I will not presume to tell you what God is saying
> to you. We each have our own personal walk with Jesus Christ.
> What I am saying is that there are Christians who believe in spanking,
> and there are Christians who believe in Attachment Parenting. Both groups
> are equally Christians in their faith and we should never presume that if
> someone is raising their children in a different way, then that makes them
> weaker Christians than we are.
> As Christians that practice Attachment Parenting, we still strongly believe
> in teaching our children right from wrong and morality. We are also teaching
> our children to be able to think for themselves during our absence and choose
> right over wrong. So it sounds to me like our goals are very similar, it is
> just our methods that are different! :-)
> Tami
>
> > Check it out!
> http://www.unschooling.com