[email protected]

In a message dated 3/21/02 7:34:19 AM, starsuncloud@... writes:

<< And I don't understand why those people don't just join in at an
eclectic homeschoolers website? >>

Good idea. There are LOTS of websites where nobody argues about the
definition of unschooling, where families who require writing and math will
be welcomed and praised!

But if this one is not what it advertises itself to be, which is supportive
of unschooling, and the one discussion group of unschooling.com, then people
wanting good unschooling information won't have a good place to go.

There's no justification for watering this one down or for having people here
who insult unschoolers and say unschooling is anything in the world including
going to school.

There have been snarky objections to suggestions that there are other
discussion groups on yahoo that might be more welcoming of those who are
unschooling-resistent, or who have a need to try to bend and stretch the
definition to include their children who are in school or being tutored or
whatever. IF this were the only homescholing information source on earth, we
would have an obligation to be welcoming, but this is one of thousands.
Rather than people staying here and complaining and redefining terms to suit
any contingency, they could try other lists and either see that others are
not better, or find one that's MUCH better suited to them.

Here are some others which specifically advertised on yahoogroups to discuss
unschooling. (These links and comments, from here to the end, were posted to
another list a couple of weeks ago after I did a search on yahoogroups for
unschooling groups.)

Maybe some of you want more input and would like to join additional groups.
Maybe some of you are bored with this list and want a different style. Maybe
you're just curious about what else is there. I'll set my own comments
apart ******this way******** and the first number there is the number of
members listed. There were 210 groups listed, but many
of them were definitely NOT unschooling lists, and showed up because they
said so (using that term) or because they had a keywords list and unschooling
was one of their keywords (for no good reason at all).



395 RUL
This is the "Radical Unschoolers List". It is for all families, regardless of
religious affiliation, choosing to unschool their children. Unschooling is
child-led learning, learning as a part of life. It allows the child to learn
naturally, without adult-imposed "lessons", schedules, or timelines. This
list is to offer support, information, perspective, and enlightenment to
anyone already unschooling or interested in unschooling.


217 CCU-List
CCU stands for Christ Centered Unschooling. Unschooling is a well researched
theory which departs from the accepted norms of education in our society.
Learning should be as natural as any other life process, ie; breathing and
eating. The theory of unschooling depends on the human being's innate desire
to learn and strives to allow the individual the freedom to explore their
current areas of interest. This list was formed as a place for Christians who
are either unschooling, attempting to ... more

****I don't think unschooling is exactly "well researched," although it's
based on various parts of well-researched learning theory rejected by public
schools...****

299 members ***and the 123 is part of their forum name***
123ahomeschoolforme
Home School! Homeschoolers. Homeschooling! Unschoolers. This is a place for
home-schooled kids and parents. Here you can exchange ideas! support each
other! give links for school stuff! just talk including, scripture, God,
church, parents, kids, home cleaning, lessons and curriculum, on-line
courses, web sites, dogs and cats Please be considerate of others Please, no
rude talk, bad language, or anything of the sort. This is an unmoderated list
and the list owner does not have any legal ... more

***THIS IS IMPORTANT, because Pennsylvania appears to be an impossible place
to unschool, but look how many people DO know how to pull it off and are
offering help! So keep this one in mind when you're elsewhere and some new
Pennsylvania resident comes in scared and hopeless.***

264
PA-Unschoolers
Are you unschooling in Pennsylvania? Are you a relaxed or eclectic
homeschooler? Are you thinking about taking the leap of faith to unschool?
Come chat with us! PA has one of the most restrictive homeschooling laws in
the country. When you join our group, you will automatically get a copy of
the law in your email. You can also access the Law by clicking on "files" on
the website at Yahoogroups. Get together with us to talk about the ways that
unschoolers can meet the law's requirements. All are ... more


***This one's more like a newsletter and isn't a disussion group directly,
but it does have lots of members!
370 FUNNews
Brought to you by the Family Unschoolers Network. Members will receive our
online newsletter with articles, announcements, events listings, FUN Books
special offers, and other items of interest about unschooling and
homeschooling.


461
unschoolingcheap
Unschooling ? Homeschooling in a more relaxed way? Want to discuss ways to do
it cheaply? If your looking for a list that will help you find cheap and free
homeschool resources, but arnt interested in more worksheets, quiz makers,or
textbook swaps, then this is the list for you!!! I want this list to be for
everyone who is interested, but we will be discussing resources that are not
as schooly, fun things, books, movies, field trips, web sites etc.. This list
does have a no ads policy, no spam, ... more


**** and THE biggest list:*****
1039 unschooling
Unschooling is the art of using a child's natural curiosity to guide
learning. Join us and learn more about this. See more at Unschooling Support
Center http //www.homeschoolzone.com/unschooling/

****Not too many posts a month, 25 or so? But part of a HUGE website with
sponsors and color and flash.****

--------
705
Seedling
Seedlings Nurturing our children in the freedom of Christ A monthly Christian
homeschooling ezine. Subscriber-made. Christian Unschooling at it's best!!
***** (not a discussion, really; couldn't tell from peeking how it
worked)****


****A big local group, but not all unschoolers:****
241 dfw-hu
The DFW Homeschoolers & Unschoolers Loop is open to all, regardless of race,
creed, core belief system, basic motivation for home/unschooling, hair color,
marital status, sex, sexual preference, favorite color, etc., who share an
interest in home/unschooling children in the Dallas/Fort Worth Metroplex and
the surrounding area. It's purpose is to share homeschooling experiences,
suggestions and encouragement. This is not a list for "sale" ads of any type.
To subscribe, send an empty message to ... more


Sandra

Tia Leschke

>
>
>There's no justification for watering this one down or for having people here
>who insult unschoolers and say unschooling is anything in the world including
>going to school.

I agreed with most of what you said in this post, but this does imply that
I wouldn't be welcome here because I believe that *sometimes* unschooling
can include going to school for a period of time. I don't have a problem
with the fact that we disagree on this, but I do think there's a place for
me and my opinions here.

Disagree with me all you want, but don't tell me to get lost. <g>
Tia

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island

Kara Bauer

Sanda,
Thanks for sharing the lists, but I have a question for you (and all). I just received a phone call from a homeschooler who has been having some troubles and joined our local unschooling group. She was basically just asking some questions and wanted to know if she would still be welcome to come to some of our gatherings *if she didn't do things the same as everyone else. After talking more with her and her asking questions I did tell her that I thought she was more of a relaxed homeschooler, so because she doesn't 'fit' the definition, do I tell her... well, you do require subjects and well you put your kids in time out so you are not really worthy of support from our groups, go and find another one out there? Or do I WELCOME her and maybe, just maybe, let her see how great unschooling can be and that although our styles are completely different, we can still learn from each other?

Me, I told she was welcome anytime.

KaraGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tia Leschke

>After talking more with her and her asking questions I did tell her that I
>thought she was more of a relaxed homeschooler, so because she doesn't
>'fit' the definition, do I tell her... well, you do require subjects and
>well you put your kids in time out so you are not really worthy of support
>from our groups, go and find another one out there? Or do I WELCOME her
>and maybe, just maybe, let her see how great unschooling can be and that
>although our styles are completely different, we can still learn from each
>other?
>
>Me, I told she was welcome anytime.

Why not do both? Welcome her and tell her about groups that might be more
what she's looking for.
Tia

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island

[email protected]

In a message dated 3/22/02 11:26:24 AM, leschke@... writes:

<< Disagree with me all you want, but don't tell me to get lost. <g> >>

If you're not telling newcomers here to ignore the other posters and just
listen to you, what would be the problem?

It's the direct attacks on those who WOULD like to help people understand
that unschooling can work that are irritating. YES it can work really well,
but it can never work if people are headed off and discouraged from actually
trying it full out.

If the constant background noise is "school's no problem," and "math lessons
are fine," families will hesitate to believe that there is such a thing as
workable radical unschooling and there most certainly is.

Sandra

[email protected]

Or do I WELCOME her and maybe, just maybe, let her see how great unschooling
can be and that although our styles are completely different, we can still
learn from each other?

*****We welcome everyone to our group. I have recently made more of an
attempt to communicate to new comers that we are an unschooling group and
she may not get much support for her methods but we will never be rude or
mean. we do have a focus and as long as she understands our focus she is
welcome.
Check it out:
www.yahoogroups/group/MarylandUFC
~Elissa Cleaveland
"It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
have
not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein

[email protected]

In a message dated 3/22/02 11:52:57 AM, leschke@... writes:

<< Why not do both? Welcome her and tell her about groups that might be more
what she's looking for. >>

That's what I used to do when we did have an unschooling group. Because my
boys are older and didn't want to keep doing the new-homeschoolers social
work they had done for so many years, and I was tired of having my house
trashed by little kids I might never see again, we quit hosting the group.
Several of those families are still solidly part of our lives, but there are
other broader groups in town now where newcomers can go.

Another mom and I made three rules for the unschooling group. We had done a
weekly play group for years, and when we were both unschooling and our kids
were older and wanting friends, we organized "the Goof Group"--no officers,
no field trips, no discussion of curriculum. So if families wanted to come,
I just told them it was fine, but to just let the kids play, and if they were
curriculum users, not to talk about that during the meeting time.

The greatest benefit of the unschooling group was seeing unschooled kids
interacting with each other and with the parents. Those kids made more
parents change their beliefs than any words did.

And I've always tried to keep current contact information for other groups in
the area, and for web resources for whatever kinds of homeschooling they were
interested in. The New Mexico contact stuff is at sandradodd.com/nmex and
the various-particulars stuff (religions, clubs, regions) is at
sandradodd.com/unschoolingotherwise (that's not local, but international).



Sandra

Kara Bauer

Why not do both? Welcome her and tell her about groups that might be more
what she's looking for.>>

Sorry I didn't relay in the OP, but I did do that. I did make some suggestions, although I didn't know any IRL groups per say :)

KaraGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kara Bauer

Check it out:
www.yahoogroups/group/MarylandUFC>>

already there <wink>
KaraGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

I knew you are Kara, but I changed some wording on the welcome page.
PLease let me know off list if you have any suggestions.
~Elissa Cleaveland
"It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
have
not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein

Lynda

People don't learn to swim unless they get their feet wet. People won't
know if they like something until they try it.

By being welcoming she may decide that unschooling can and will work for
her. If not, she will find another group but won't go away from unschooling
with a negative impression thinking that unschoolers think of themselves as
some elitest group.

My hope is that even if folks can't "do" 100% pure unschooling as defined by
some, they will at least glean something from unschooling that will help
make life a nicer place for their children. And you simply never know, you
just may convert her which wouldn't have happened if you had said no, go
somewhere else you don't fit the box called unschooling.

Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kara Bauer" <KaraBauer4@...>
To: "Unschooling-dotcom" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, March 22, 2002 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling or not? (other lists people
might like)


> Sanda,
> Thanks for sharing the lists, but I have a question for you (and all). I
just received a phone call from a homeschooler who has been having some
troubles and joined our local unschooling group. She was basically just
asking some questions and wanted to know if she would still be welcome to
come to some of our gatherings *if she didn't do things the same as everyone
else. After talking more with her and her asking questions I did tell her
that I thought she was more of a relaxed homeschooler, so because she
doesn't 'fit' the definition, do I tell her... well, you do require subjects
and well you put your kids in time out so you are not really worthy of
support from our groups, go and find another one out there? Or do I WELCOME
her and maybe, just maybe, let her see how great unschooling can be and that
although our styles are completely different, we can still learn from each
other?
>
> Me, I told she was welcome anytime.
>
> KaraGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
http://explorer.msn.com
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

[email protected]

<< If the constant background noise is "school's no problem," and "math
lessons
are fine," families will hesitate to believe that there is such a thing as
workable radical unschooling and there most certainly is.
>>

I understand your point Sandra. And I agree that your perspective and others
like you should be put on the list. . . that radical unschooling can work for
every child. Others who disagree are also free to post their thoughts on it
and have discussion on it.

However, there is a problem with telling people to go find another list.
People are free to come and go on this list unless they get moderated and
then their posts have to be approved. Because of some of the totally uncalled
for posts today, unfortunately we have had to do that. I will ask that those
of you who have suggested that some people should find another list, please
discontinue to do so. I know there were several post of that nature and I
don't remember everyone who did it, so this is a general warning to those to
not do that anymore. Thanks for your cooperation.

Living in Abundance
Mary

rumpleteasermom

--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., SandraDodd@a... wrote:

>
> Good idea. There are LOTS of websites where nobody argues about the
> definition of unschooling, where families who require writing and
math will
> be welcomed and praised!
>

People keep saying this. I don't think I've seen anyone here say they
do require writing or math. So where is it coming from?

Bridget

[email protected]

<<However, there is a problem with telling people to go find another list.
People are free to come and go on this list unless they get moderated and
then their posts have to be approved. >>

Since they're free to come and go, why is there a problem with letting them
know there are other lists and giving them the descriptions and addresses
from yahoo? If a person says "this list sucks" why should the answer be "We
will all change to suit you" instead of "There are other lists which might
not suck for you!"?

It is very true that there are other lists. It's not secret. There is no
money lost to anyone if people are on more than one list. There seems to be
some desperation as though this is the only source of unschooling
information. But it isn't, and it never has been, and never will be.

I've never been on any forum or list, including AOL, where there was a rule
about letting people know other resources existed. Are you sure you want
that policy here?

Is there a problem with me having listed my articles page, or the
unschoolingotherwise page, or unschooling.com?

Sandra

Kara Bauer

Is there a problem with me having listed my articles page, or the
unschoolingotherwise page, or unschooling.com?>>

No, I think offering up the other options is actually good. But sometimes the 'tone' of a post is hard to tell and it can seem to sound like - go find another list.. it's a tricky line online because you can not see the other person and if you don't know them or their posting style some may get offended..

Just my .02,
KaraGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Bonni Sollars

Sandra, thank you for your stand. It has helped me to understand what
could be.
Bonni

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Josefa Wilson

SandraDodd@... wrote:

> <<However, there is a problem with telling people to go find another list.
> People are free to come and go on this list unless they get moderated and
> then their posts have to be approved. >>
>
> Since they're free to come and go, why is there a problem with letting them
> know there are other lists and giving them the descriptions and addresses
> from yahoo?

Because it is offensive to suggest that those who disagree with you definition of
unschooling go somewhere else. We are here to flesh out our ideas and discover, perhaps,
new ways of thinking. I, myself, am only too glad that others disagree with me. It makes
me question my thoughts and beliefs, perhaps reaffirming them, perhaps realizing they were
erroneous. I certainly would never suggest someone who disagrees with what I thought
about unschooling to go somewhere else. We ALL would not be here is we did not (1) think
of ourselves as unschoolers or (2) want to find out more about it. Therefore we should all
be welcome.


> I've never been on any forum or list, including AOL, where there was a rule
> about letting people know other resources existed. Are you sure you want
> that policy here?

But whose place is it to decide which types should go and which types should stay? The
suggestion and outright listing of other lists was a blatant statement that "those of you
who do this should go," even if those words were not used.

Josefa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tia Leschke

>
> >
>
>People keep saying this. I don't think I've seen anyone here say they
>do require writing or math. So where is it coming from?

I don't remember ever seeing it here. I've seen it on other lists though,
a lot.
Tia

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island

Tia Leschke

>
>
>No, I think offering up the other options is actually good. But sometimes
>the 'tone' of a post is hard to tell and it can seem to sound like - go
>find another list.. it's a tricky line online because you can not see the
>other person and if you don't know them or their posting style some may
>get offended.

Maybe information about other lists should always be prefaced with, "You're
always welcome here on this list, but there are other lists where you might
get more support for your particular style of homeschooling." Would
something like that be acceptable?
Tia

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island

[email protected]

<<We ALL would not be here is we did not (1) think
of ourselves as unschoolers or (2) want to find out more about it. Therefore
we should all
be welcome.>>

***This is true, I agree with you.

<<But whose place is it to decide which types should go and which types
should stay? The
suggestion and outright listing of other lists was a blatant statement that
"those of you
who do this should go," even if those words were not used.>>
I don't agree. I like hearning about other lists, websites anything to help
me along on my journey.
If someone says something to the group, and I think they are saying it
personally to me and I get upset/offended/angry, I need to wonder why. *I*
know whether or not the statement applies, if it doesn't apply to me, then I
just say, well, s/he can't be talking about me.
I can't spend my time getting offended for others, they can get offended
without my help.
I take what I need here, and I leave the rest. There may very well be a few
people who are lurking and saw the other lists and checked them out. With
the amount of people on this list compared to the amount who are active, we
have no way of knowing if the things we say are helping others or hurting
them, since many don't post. What if it was helpful? should we stop? Maybe
some people read the list of lists, joined them thinking they would explore
a more ecclectic style and then came back here convinced unschooling was
better?
Information is just information, do with it as you wish.
If one believes they belong here, They do! so how could providing info be
wrong?
If one doesn't like the commentary, think of oneself as the better person,
and just blow it off.
Miss Manners columns everyweek are based on the same premise. Someone being
rude to you is no excuse for being rude back. (and I'm NOT saying anyone in
particular is being rude, I'm using "you" as "one")
~Elissa Cleaveland
"It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
have
not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein

[email protected]

Maybe information about other lists should always be prefaced with, "You're
always welcome here on this list, but there are other lists where you might
get more support for your particular style of homeschooling." Would
something like that be acceptable?
Tia

Or even:
Here are some lists I found in case anyone is interested:
~Elissa Cleaveland
"It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
have
not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein

rumpleteasermom

--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., Tia Leschke <leschke@i...> wrote:

>
> Maybe information about other lists should always be prefaced with,
"You're
> always welcome here on this list, but there are other lists where
you might
> get more support for your particular style of homeschooling." Would
> something like that be acceptable?
> Tia
>

This is good Tia, but I think it is important that we not make
assumptions about others styles based on the first few posts they
make. We've seen the 'what people said vs. what they really do and
really meant' thing often enough to know that those first few posts
can look not at all like their style actually is.

I think questions, question and more questions (and actually
listening to the answers) are good.

Bridget

Tia Leschke

>
>This is good Tia, but I think it is important that we not make
>assumptions about others styles based on the first few posts they
>make. We've seen the 'what people said vs. what they really do and
>really meant' thing often enough to know that those first few posts
>can look not at all like their style actually is.

You're right about that.


>I think questions, question and more questions (and actually
>listening to the answers) are good.

I think we also need to be really careful to be focussed on helping people
see what they *could* be doing (or not doing) rather than getting them to
see that they're "wrong".
Tia

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island

zenmomma *

>>She was basically just asking some questions and wanted to know if she
would still be welcome to come to some of our gatherings *if she didn't do
things the same as everyone else. After talking more with her and her asking
questions I did tell her that I thought she was
more of a relaxed homeschooler, so because she doesn't 'fit' the definition,
do I tell her... well, you do require subjects and well you put your kids in
time out so you are not really worthy of support from our groups, go and
find another one out there? Or do I WELCOME her and maybe, just maybe, let
her see how great unschooling can be and that although our styles are
completely different, we can still learn from each other?>>

I would have told that she was welcome, but there might be times she might
be surprised or uncomfortable at the way people do things. I would also have
spent some time with her explaining the places where she might differ from
the group dynamic or thinking. That way she'd be prepared to start seeing
things done a little differently, or sharing her ideas with some history of
the group in mind. Maybe it would help her be less defensive when ideas are
brought up that don't match her own.

Life is good.
~Mary

_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com

[email protected]

I found the flyer yesterday advertising the earliest meetings of "The Goof
Group," our unschooling playgroup which lasted for several years. There was
a map kind of bandit/pirate style, to the park.

One side had DISCLAIMER AND GUARANTEES:

This is not a support group.
GUARANTEED: No officers.
GUARANTEED: No meetings.
GUARANTEED: No fieldtrips.
Support and encouragement
are likely but not GUARANTEED:
We will not be dangerous unless
you try to talk to us about
structure and curriculum.

The main blurb said

Unschoolers Wanted.

The Goof Group, all wild and crafty "unschoolers," welcome more of their ilk
to join them at their merry hideout on Tuesdays at 11:00. If you are
homeschoolers who take inspiration from John Holt or the Marx Brother, you're
in.

Bring food if you can; we'll disperse at 1:00; when it gets too cold we'll
hole up until Spring and meet again.

Kirby was nine, ten, eleven, in those days. It was lots and lots of fun.

Sandra

Lynda

But don't you think that info about other lists could be offered in a better
manner than saying the list would be happier if you left, so here's some
places you can go?

I have no problem with other information being offered. I have seen several
posters say, "Welcome, if you are new you might want to check out the
unschool boards. They offer lots of information."

I've seen some folks say, "Hey, have you heard of [fill in the blank], it
sounds like it is interesting."

I've seen folks say they are starting new lists which are specific to "a"
segment of unschooling as it relates to another segment of people's lives.

I've seen folks share lists that are for folks from particular states.

I've mentioned some of the lists that are run by radical unschoolers.

It isn't about sharing info on other lists, it is about about telling folks
or hinting that folks should "do it my way or hit the highway."

Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: <ElissaJC@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2002 4:35 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: Unschooling or not? (other lists
people might like)


> <<We ALL would not be here is we did not (1) think
> of ourselves as unschoolers or (2) want to find out more about it.
Therefore
> we should all
> be welcome.>>
>
> ***This is true, I agree with you.
>
> <<But whose place is it to decide which types should go and which types
> should stay? The
> suggestion and outright listing of other lists was a blatant statement
that
> "those of you
> who do this should go," even if those words were not used.>>
> I don't agree. I like hearning about other lists, websites anything to
help
> me along on my journey.
> If someone says something to the group, and I think they are saying it
> personally to me and I get upset/offended/angry, I need to wonder why. *I*
> know whether or not the statement applies, if it doesn't apply to me, then
I
> just say, well, s/he can't be talking about me.
> I can't spend my time getting offended for others, they can get offended
> without my help.
> I take what I need here, and I leave the rest. There may very well be a
few
> people who are lurking and saw the other lists and checked them out. With
> the amount of people on this list compared to the amount who are active,
we
> have no way of knowing if the things we say are helping others or hurting
> them, since many don't post. What if it was helpful? should we stop?
Maybe
> some people read the list of lists, joined them thinking they would
explore
> a more ecclectic style and then came back here convinced unschooling was
> better?
> Information is just information, do with it as you wish.
> If one believes they belong here, They do! so how could providing info be
> wrong?
> If one doesn't like the commentary, think of oneself as the better person,
> and just blow it off.
> Miss Manners columns everyweek are based on the same premise. Someone
being
> rude to you is no excuse for being rude back. (and I'm NOT saying anyone
in
> particular is being rude, I'm using "you" as "one")
> ~Elissa Cleaveland
> "It is nothing short of a miracle that the modern methods of instruction
> have
> not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry." A. Einstein
>
>
>
>
>
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