new member intro
Linda
Hi everyone! We are an unschooling family with a single daughter age 11 1/2 that has always unschooled.
We feel that life is filled with things to learn at every moment and that it is the decisions we make in regard to this challenge that create our experience. Sometimes we feel a bit in the minority as we have a single child and the world at large usually has more than one. It is funny to write this because at the moment dd is at The Hulbert Homeschool Camp in Vermont this week. Our interests include; organic gardening, eco-villages, holistic health, simple living, earth-based spirituality, puppetry, alternative building, contra-dancing, folk festivals/music, world music, drumming, ritual, sacred space, sustainable living, flower essences, herbs, Reiki, magical gardening, sewing, ornithology, astrology....just what comes to mind at the moment. My daughter and husband just returned from a trip to China with her martial arts school which was an opportunity of a lifetime. My dh takes gong fu as well as my dd and I take Tai Chi/Qi Gong. I am a massage therapist, RN. My husband and I are Reiki Masters and my dd has taken the 2nd level of Reiki. My dream at the moment is to create a learning center here at my home. We live on 3 acres that borders a State Forest...we would like to facilitate holistic connection to the earth as well as holistic health practices. So, that's a not so brief into. of our family and I look forward to connecting with others committed to unschooling in their families.
Peace
Linda
We feel that life is filled with things to learn at every moment and that it is the decisions we make in regard to this challenge that create our experience. Sometimes we feel a bit in the minority as we have a single child and the world at large usually has more than one. It is funny to write this because at the moment dd is at The Hulbert Homeschool Camp in Vermont this week. Our interests include; organic gardening, eco-villages, holistic health, simple living, earth-based spirituality, puppetry, alternative building, contra-dancing, folk festivals/music, world music, drumming, ritual, sacred space, sustainable living, flower essences, herbs, Reiki, magical gardening, sewing, ornithology, astrology....just what comes to mind at the moment. My daughter and husband just returned from a trip to China with her martial arts school which was an opportunity of a lifetime. My dh takes gong fu as well as my dd and I take Tai Chi/Qi Gong. I am a massage therapist, RN. My husband and I are Reiki Masters and my dd has taken the 2nd level of Reiki. My dream at the moment is to create a learning center here at my home. We live on 3 acres that borders a State Forest...we would like to facilitate holistic connection to the earth as well as holistic health practices. So, that's a not so brief into. of our family and I look forward to connecting with others committed to unschooling in their families.
Peace
Linda
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/2003 10:04:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, sunny@...
writes:
let him learn on his own! They don't even use workbooks and "schooly" things
in SCHOOL at that age! By the time he's legally required to be registered
with the state, you may have deschooled yourself to UNschool.
You can't "partially unschool", but you CAN "be on your way" there!
Ren, other Floridians--- at what age is a child required to be registered in
FL? Until then, relax and enjoy his learning!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
writes:
> Our little one, Orin, learns better when he moves at hisSunny, He's FOUR! Spend the next couple of years deschooling yourSELF, and
> own pace. He would probably benefit greatly from unschooling, but I
> need slightly more structure, at least until I've finished deprogramming
> myself from the years of schooling I went through. So, for now we're
> doing a mix of the two - letting him choose what he wants to learn at
> the moment, and me helping him learn with worksheets, field trips,
> games, etc. At least I know by now that anything can be a learning
> experience, if you approach it the right way
let him learn on his own! They don't even use workbooks and "schooly" things
in SCHOOL at that age! By the time he's legally required to be registered
with the state, you may have deschooled yourself to UNschool.
You can't "partially unschool", but you CAN "be on your way" there!
Ren, other Floridians--- at what age is a child required to be registered in
FL? Until then, relax and enjoy his learning!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
And Ren is in Pensacola and has a local support group!
~Kelly
~Kelly
Sunshyne Powell
lol - I know I've got plenty of time. Florida doesn't require
registration until the age of 6. And the choice for him to learn now
isn't my choice, believe me. We've discussed homeschooling together (as
much as you can with a 4 year old), and he is all excited about it. He
has been dying to go to school since he first heard it existed, and the
thought that he could do it every day at home has put a very bright
gleam in his eyes.
So, the first thing he said he wanted to do, when asked, was learn how
to read. At 4. lol... I don't know what I was expecting him to say,
but learning to read was not it. The worksheets and things I'll be
getting are only to help him learn how to read. Well, to supplement us
reading together. Beyond that I'm not going to spend the extra money on
anything like worksheets and like items. At least not right now.
And yes, four is young. You are right, we have all the time in the
world, but when he is coming to me and asking to learn _____ (it may
change at any moment), I can't say no.
I just hope no one's getting the wrong idea here. I'm not pushing him;
he's dragging me!
Sunny
-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
Sunny, He's FOUR! Spend the next couple of years deschooling yourSELF,
and
let him learn on his own! They don't even use workbooks and "schooly"
things
in SCHOOL at that age! By the time he's legally required to be
registered
with the state, you may have deschooled yourself to UNschool.
You can't "partially unschool", but you CAN "be on your way" there!
Ren, other Floridians--- at what age is a child required to be
registered in
FL? Until then, relax and enjoy his learning!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
registration until the age of 6. And the choice for him to learn now
isn't my choice, believe me. We've discussed homeschooling together (as
much as you can with a 4 year old), and he is all excited about it. He
has been dying to go to school since he first heard it existed, and the
thought that he could do it every day at home has put a very bright
gleam in his eyes.
So, the first thing he said he wanted to do, when asked, was learn how
to read. At 4. lol... I don't know what I was expecting him to say,
but learning to read was not it. The worksheets and things I'll be
getting are only to help him learn how to read. Well, to supplement us
reading together. Beyond that I'm not going to spend the extra money on
anything like worksheets and like items. At least not right now.
And yes, four is young. You are right, we have all the time in the
world, but when he is coming to me and asking to learn _____ (it may
change at any moment), I can't say no.
I just hope no one's getting the wrong idea here. I'm not pushing him;
he's dragging me!
Sunny
-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
Sunny, He's FOUR! Spend the next couple of years deschooling yourSELF,
and
let him learn on his own! They don't even use workbooks and "schooly"
things
in SCHOOL at that age! By the time he's legally required to be
registered
with the state, you may have deschooled yourself to UNschool.
You can't "partially unschool", but you CAN "be on your way" there!
Ren, other Floridians--- at what age is a child required to be
registered in
FL? Until then, relax and enjoy his learning!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 8:04:43 AM, sunny@... writes:
<< My husband and I are looking into
homeschooling. Well, a combination of home- and un- schooling to be
more accurate. >>
Someone might have beat me to this, but you might as well get the full new
member treatment.
The best unschoolers don't believe there CAN be partial unschooling.
(By "best" I mean those for whom unschooling has come to work well, not
dabblers.)
<< He would probably benefit greatly from unschooling, but I
need slightly more structure, at least until I've finished deprogramming
myself from the years of schooling I went through. >>
It's not about what you need.
Until it's about what your child needs, you won't be unschooling.
You won't "deprogram" yourself by clinging to school stuff.
Until you see learning where school stuff is not, you won't get unschooling
at a gut and soul level.
Here:
http://sandradodd.com/deschooling
That's about deschooling parents (and not continuing to "school" kids while
you do it).
If schooling needs to be undone, why lay more on him which will have to be
undone?
Just say no. No more school-style stuff. If it worked, why wouldn't you
have him in school?
<<So, for now we're
doing a mix of the two - letting him choose what he wants to learn at
the moment, and me helping him learn with worksheets, field trips,
games, etc. >>
Field trips have the potential to be non-harmful. Depends how much
teacher-voice you use while you're there. Do you go to a museum with him the
same way you would go to the museum with an adult friend? Or do you take him
to a museum the way a teacher takes a child to a museum?
Games aren't teaching, or don't need to be. Games you should put in the
unschooling column.
Worksheets... If you put a workbook out and don't check back to see whether
he did it, the workbook won't jump up and bite him, and he might have fun
with it. If you have a series of worksheets designed to teach him math or
phonics, you might find you are teaching him to avoid anything that looks
like math or phonics. Or you might be teaching him that those are things he
has to be taught, that don't exist outside of worksheets.
<<At least I know by now that anything can be a learning
experience, if you approach it the right way.>>
It's a learning experience even if you approach it "the wrong way."
Everything is a learning experience.
<<We are just starting out on the home/un schooling path, although it
feels like we've been doing this all along anyway. >>
Good point! So don't change. Kids have been learning since birth, because
humans are programmed to learn, so the best thing you can do is provide them
with opportunities and input and experience and not mess up their natural
learning!
If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday calendar
and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start putting clippings or
little stickers inside the envelopes of various individuals. Alphabetize
your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder your kids, to fulfill your need
for structure and organization.
Sandra
<< My husband and I are looking into
homeschooling. Well, a combination of home- and un- schooling to be
more accurate. >>
Someone might have beat me to this, but you might as well get the full new
member treatment.
The best unschoolers don't believe there CAN be partial unschooling.
(By "best" I mean those for whom unschooling has come to work well, not
dabblers.)
<< He would probably benefit greatly from unschooling, but I
need slightly more structure, at least until I've finished deprogramming
myself from the years of schooling I went through. >>
It's not about what you need.
Until it's about what your child needs, you won't be unschooling.
You won't "deprogram" yourself by clinging to school stuff.
Until you see learning where school stuff is not, you won't get unschooling
at a gut and soul level.
Here:
http://sandradodd.com/deschooling
That's about deschooling parents (and not continuing to "school" kids while
you do it).
If schooling needs to be undone, why lay more on him which will have to be
undone?
Just say no. No more school-style stuff. If it worked, why wouldn't you
have him in school?
<<So, for now we're
doing a mix of the two - letting him choose what he wants to learn at
the moment, and me helping him learn with worksheets, field trips,
games, etc. >>
Field trips have the potential to be non-harmful. Depends how much
teacher-voice you use while you're there. Do you go to a museum with him the
same way you would go to the museum with an adult friend? Or do you take him
to a museum the way a teacher takes a child to a museum?
Games aren't teaching, or don't need to be. Games you should put in the
unschooling column.
Worksheets... If you put a workbook out and don't check back to see whether
he did it, the workbook won't jump up and bite him, and he might have fun
with it. If you have a series of worksheets designed to teach him math or
phonics, you might find you are teaching him to avoid anything that looks
like math or phonics. Or you might be teaching him that those are things he
has to be taught, that don't exist outside of worksheets.
<<At least I know by now that anything can be a learning
experience, if you approach it the right way.>>
It's a learning experience even if you approach it "the wrong way."
Everything is a learning experience.
<<We are just starting out on the home/un schooling path, although it
feels like we've been doing this all along anyway. >>
Good point! So don't change. Kids have been learning since birth, because
humans are programmed to learn, so the best thing you can do is provide them
with opportunities and input and experience and not mess up their natural
learning!
If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday calendar
and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start putting clippings or
little stickers inside the envelopes of various individuals. Alphabetize
your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder your kids, to fulfill your need
for structure and organization.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 8:37:51 AM, sunny@... writes:
<< And yes, four is young. You are right, we have all the time in the
world, but when he is coming to me and asking to learn _____ (it may
change at any moment), I can't say no.
<<I just hope no one's getting the wrong idea here. I'm not pushing him;
he's dragging me! >>
Okay. That's different.
But answering his questions when he asks about something isn't the same as
structured homeschooling. You'll figure out how to anwer the questions
conversationally and not teacher-style. Just be aware of the tone and intent
and expectation in you when he asks, and of how you feel about your duty and
responsibility to "teach."
When a little kid asks where babies come from, they don't want to know all
about the human reproductive system, marriage customs, fertility problems,
sexual positions... they want a very short answer, like "From inside their
moms."
"OH!"
And it might be an hour or five years before they come back and ask how it
got in there. And even then, they don't want to know all about the human
reproductive system, marriage customs, fertility problems, sexual
positions...
So if a child wants to read, you can write two or three words down that he
knows and can recognize by the beginning letter (like names of family members
or pets or fictional characters they like) and let them "read" those a while
until they want more.
Sandra
<< And yes, four is young. You are right, we have all the time in the
world, but when he is coming to me and asking to learn _____ (it may
change at any moment), I can't say no.
<<I just hope no one's getting the wrong idea here. I'm not pushing him;
he's dragging me! >>
Okay. That's different.
But answering his questions when he asks about something isn't the same as
structured homeschooling. You'll figure out how to anwer the questions
conversationally and not teacher-style. Just be aware of the tone and intent
and expectation in you when he asks, and of how you feel about your duty and
responsibility to "teach."
When a little kid asks where babies come from, they don't want to know all
about the human reproductive system, marriage customs, fertility problems,
sexual positions... they want a very short answer, like "From inside their
moms."
"OH!"
And it might be an hour or five years before they come back and ask how it
got in there. And even then, they don't want to know all about the human
reproductive system, marriage customs, fertility problems, sexual
positions...
So if a child wants to read, you can write two or three words down that he
knows and can recognize by the beginning letter (like names of family members
or pets or fictional characters they like) and let them "read" those a while
until they want more.
Sandra
Mary
From: <kbcdlovejo@...>
<<Ren, other Floridians--- at what age is a child required to be registered
in
FL? Until then, relax and enjoy his learning!>>
Six years old by Feb. 1.
Mary B
<<Ren, other Floridians--- at what age is a child required to be registered
in
FL? Until then, relax and enjoy his learning!>>
Six years old by Feb. 1.
Mary B
Mary
From: <SandraDodd@...>
<<If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday calendar
and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start putting clippings
or
little stickers inside the envelopes of various individuals. Alphabetize
your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder your kids, to fulfill your
need
for structure and organization.>>
Alphabetize your shoes????? LOL!!!!! That's funny Sandra. You have such a
way of getting a point across. Thanks for the morning laugh.
Mary B
<<If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday calendar
and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start putting clippings
or
little stickers inside the envelopes of various individuals. Alphabetize
your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder your kids, to fulfill your
need
for structure and organization.>>
Alphabetize your shoes????? LOL!!!!! That's funny Sandra. You have such a
way of getting a point across. Thanks for the morning laugh.
Mary B
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 5:31:32 PM, SandraDodd@... writes:
<< If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday calendar
and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start putting clippings or
little stickers inside the envelopes of various individuals. Alphabetize
your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder your kids, to fulfill your need
for structure and organization. >>
Or Scrapbook (photo albums)!!! It's fun, you end up with cool books about
your family, chock full of pictures, AND, it takes TONS of organization
because of *all* the *stuff* available, and getting all/what pics together
you're going to use, etc!! And structure? Boy you definitely need it in order
to get much done! Lara...........
<< If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday calendar
and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start putting clippings or
little stickers inside the envelopes of various individuals. Alphabetize
your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder your kids, to fulfill your need
for structure and organization. >>
Or Scrapbook (photo albums)!!! It's fun, you end up with cool books about
your family, chock full of pictures, AND, it takes TONS of organization
because of *all* the *stuff* available, and getting all/what pics together
you're going to use, etc!! And structure? Boy you definitely need it in order
to get much done! Lara...........
Sunshyne Powell
-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
When a little kid asks where babies come from,
lol - We just went through this one, as a matter of fact... Grady and I
are preparing to have another one (not in the oven yet, but close), and
we are including Orin from the beginning so that hopefully he will be
prepared for the changes that will come about from two kids in the house
(he's an only child right now). He has already picked what room the
baby will have (he suggested his room, so we get to move his things into
the spare room and make it his).
When he asked where baby's come from, my belly was the answer. He did
go a step further and ask how it got into my belly, which was unexpected
to say the least. So, for now, baby's come from "Momma Nature", who
puts them into a mommy's belly where it can grow until it's ready to be
born. lol - I think his curiosity was filled at that point and he went
back to playing his computer game...
So if a child wants to read, you can write two or three words down that
he
knows and can recognize by the beginning letter (like names of family
members
or pets or fictional characters they like) and let them "read" those a
while
until they want more.
Oh, he already knows his name. And my name, daddy's name, and a few
other "basic" words (thank goodness for PBS..lol) But he wants to be
able to read his books by himself. Well, more accurately he wants to be
able to read to us...lol
Sunny
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
From: SandraDodd@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
When a little kid asks where babies come from,
lol - We just went through this one, as a matter of fact... Grady and I
are preparing to have another one (not in the oven yet, but close), and
we are including Orin from the beginning so that hopefully he will be
prepared for the changes that will come about from two kids in the house
(he's an only child right now). He has already picked what room the
baby will have (he suggested his room, so we get to move his things into
the spare room and make it his).
When he asked where baby's come from, my belly was the answer. He did
go a step further and ask how it got into my belly, which was unexpected
to say the least. So, for now, baby's come from "Momma Nature", who
puts them into a mommy's belly where it can grow until it's ready to be
born. lol - I think his curiosity was filled at that point and he went
back to playing his computer game...
So if a child wants to read, you can write two or three words down that
he
knows and can recognize by the beginning letter (like names of family
members
or pets or fictional characters they like) and let them "read" those a
while
until they want more.
Oh, he already knows his name. And my name, daddy's name, and a few
other "basic" words (thank goodness for PBS..lol) But he wants to be
able to read his books by himself. Well, more accurately he wants to be
able to read to us...lol
Sunny
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sunshyne Powell
-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
Someone might have beat me to this, but you might as well get the full
new member treatment.
It's to be expected...lol
The best unschoolers don't believe there CAN be partial unschooling. (By
"best" I mean those for whom unschooling has come to work well, not
dabblers.)
Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. I say this not only from my
own personal experience, but from what I've seen in my son. If others
see us a dabbling, well - others will see us however they choose to.
<<We are just starting out on the home/un schooling path, although it
feels like we've been doing this all along anyway. >>
Good point! So don't change. Kids have been learning since birth,
because humans are programmed to learn, so the best thing you can do is
provide them with opportunities and input and experience and not mess up
their natural learning!
Who said we were going to change? I might have been assumed, but then
again the welcome I've received so far as been full of "well, that not
the right way to do it for your child", or at least that's the feeling
I've been getting. It doesn't affect me one way or the other; I've
always been a poor communicator of my true intentions, so I expect other
to not understand what I'm trying to say (and to usually see it in the
worst light possible)
If anyone has gotten the impression that my child's need and wishes
won't be first and foremost, then consider yourself corrected.
If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday
calendar and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start
putting clippings or little stickers inside the envelopes of various
individuals. Alphabetize your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder
your kids, to fulfill your need for structure and organization.
Yes, I do need to feel organized. If I ever want to take over his
learning experiences I can try one of these suggestions.
Okay, we will be leaving soon to go to a Spiral Scout meeting - if
anyone else has any pearls of wisdom for me fire them at will. I
expected to draw some fire...lol
Sunny
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
From: SandraDodd@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
Someone might have beat me to this, but you might as well get the full
new member treatment.
It's to be expected...lol
The best unschoolers don't believe there CAN be partial unschooling. (By
"best" I mean those for whom unschooling has come to work well, not
dabblers.)
Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. I say this not only from my
own personal experience, but from what I've seen in my son. If others
see us a dabbling, well - others will see us however they choose to.
<<We are just starting out on the home/un schooling path, although it
feels like we've been doing this all along anyway. >>
Good point! So don't change. Kids have been learning since birth,
because humans are programmed to learn, so the best thing you can do is
provide them with opportunities and input and experience and not mess up
their natural learning!
Who said we were going to change? I might have been assumed, but then
again the welcome I've received so far as been full of "well, that not
the right way to do it for your child", or at least that's the feeling
I've been getting. It doesn't affect me one way or the other; I've
always been a poor communicator of my true intentions, so I expect other
to not understand what I'm trying to say (and to usually see it in the
worst light possible)
If anyone has gotten the impression that my child's need and wishes
won't be first and foremost, then consider yourself corrected.
If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday
calendar and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start
putting clippings or little stickers inside the envelopes of various
individuals. Alphabetize your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder
your kids, to fulfill your need for structure and organization.
Yes, I do need to feel organized. If I ever want to take over his
learning experiences I can try one of these suggestions.
Okay, we will be leaving soon to go to a Spiral Scout meeting - if
anyone else has any pearls of wisdom for me fire them at will. I
expected to draw some fire...lol
Sunny
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Mary
From: "Sunshyne Powell" <sunny@...>
<<Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. I say this not only from my
own personal experience, but from what I've seen in my son. If others
see us a dabbling, well - others will see us however they choose to.>>
I'm confused. If you see unschooling as making sense and working, why
wouldn't you want to be the best at it?? It's to the benefit of your child,
not anyone else. And Sandra said to be the best meant doing it so that it
works well. Who wouldn't want that? It's like they say on this list, you
can't unschool everything but math. You either do it or you don't. If you
don't, then don't say you unschool.
<<Who said we were going to change? I might have been assumed, but then
again the welcome I've received so far as been full of "well, that not
the right way to do it for your child", or at least that's the feeling
I've been getting. It doesn't affect me one way or the other; I've
always been a poor communicator of my true intentions, so I expect other
to not understand what I'm trying to say (and to usually see it in the
worst light possible)>>
I think if you have the feeling that we are telling you what is right for
you child, then you need to ask to clarify what's been said. People here
have years of experience. They are the best unschoolers and just relay what
works and what doesn't through their own experience. They give advice when
asked and impart great wisdom when situations come up that they see as not
being unschooling. That's what the list is for. Not to say good job to
someone who doesn't unschool.
<<Okay, we will be leaving soon to go to a Spiral Scout meeting - if
anyone else has any pearls of wisdom for me fire them at will. I
expected to draw some fire...lol>>
Now I get the impression that you enjoy not unschooling on a unschooling
list. You're dabbling among people who don't want to dabble. You wouldn't be
the first person to say you unschool and don't restrict and that your kids
really want to learn all this stuff only to find out that you are on the
same road, just going in a different direction.
Mary B
<<Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. I say this not only from my
own personal experience, but from what I've seen in my son. If others
see us a dabbling, well - others will see us however they choose to.>>
I'm confused. If you see unschooling as making sense and working, why
wouldn't you want to be the best at it?? It's to the benefit of your child,
not anyone else. And Sandra said to be the best meant doing it so that it
works well. Who wouldn't want that? It's like they say on this list, you
can't unschool everything but math. You either do it or you don't. If you
don't, then don't say you unschool.
<<Who said we were going to change? I might have been assumed, but then
again the welcome I've received so far as been full of "well, that not
the right way to do it for your child", or at least that's the feeling
I've been getting. It doesn't affect me one way or the other; I've
always been a poor communicator of my true intentions, so I expect other
to not understand what I'm trying to say (and to usually see it in the
worst light possible)>>
I think if you have the feeling that we are telling you what is right for
you child, then you need to ask to clarify what's been said. People here
have years of experience. They are the best unschoolers and just relay what
works and what doesn't through their own experience. They give advice when
asked and impart great wisdom when situations come up that they see as not
being unschooling. That's what the list is for. Not to say good job to
someone who doesn't unschool.
<<Okay, we will be leaving soon to go to a Spiral Scout meeting - if
anyone else has any pearls of wisdom for me fire them at will. I
expected to draw some fire...lol>>
Now I get the impression that you enjoy not unschooling on a unschooling
list. You're dabbling among people who don't want to dabble. You wouldn't be
the first person to say you unschool and don't restrict and that your kids
really want to learn all this stuff only to find out that you are on the
same road, just going in a different direction.
Mary B
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 11:34:58 AM, sunny@... writes:
<< Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. >>
Maybe. I think its calling a persimmon a tomato.
You don't want to give your children an education if you want to create an
unstructured environment. You want to help them learn.
"Giving an education" implies insertion.
It suggests that you know in advance the block of knowledge you intend to
insert.
Sandra
<< Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. >>
Maybe. I think its calling a persimmon a tomato.
You don't want to give your children an education if you want to create an
unstructured environment. You want to help them learn.
"Giving an education" implies insertion.
It suggests that you know in advance the block of knowledge you intend to
insert.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 11:34:58 AM, sunny@... writes:
<< Who said we were going to change? >>
You came to this list.
You'll change.
Bwaaaahahaha....
Sandra
<< Who said we were going to change? >>
You came to this list.
You'll change.
Bwaaaahahaha....
Sandra
Backstrom kelli
I have to say that I agree with Sunny a lot and can empathize with her feelings. It is difficult beginning this process of figuring out what is the best thing for our children and then coming here, being honest and being totally shot down at every turn. I guess I realize as I get older and have been a parent longer that people are going to disagree with me and that is just the way it is, that's ok, I just try to disagree with people in a respectful courteous way. I really don't think that Sunny is a bad parent for trying to be structured in some ways. I think she is an honest person. There are things that I would do from an unschooling perspective and then are things that I feel that I would need to do in a more structured way (I am going to get really attacked for saying that, I know go ahead). There are things that I learned in school that were extremely damaging and negative but my entire experience in school was not traumatic and terrible. I learned some very insightful things in school and had some wonderful teachers along the way. I just don't think it has to be so black and white, but hey, what do I know? Kelli
Sunshyne Powell <sunny@...> wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
Someone might have beat me to this, but you might as well get the full
new member treatment.
It's to be expected...lol
The best unschoolers don't believe there CAN be partial unschooling. (By
"best" I mean those for whom unschooling has come to work well, not
dabblers.)
Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. I say this not only from my
own personal experience, but from what I've seen in my son. If others
see us a dabbling, well - others will see us however they choose to.
<<We are just starting out on the home/un schooling path, although it
feels like we've been doing this all along anyway. >>
Good point! So don't change. Kids have been learning since birth,
because humans are programmed to learn, so the best thing you can do is
provide them with opportunities and input and experience and not mess up
their natural learning!
Who said we were going to change? I might have been assumed, but then
again the welcome I've received so far as been full of "well, that not
the right way to do it for your child", or at least that's the feeling
I've been getting. It doesn't affect me one way or the other; I've
always been a poor communicator of my true intentions, so I expect other
to not understand what I'm trying to say (and to usually see it in the
worst light possible)
If anyone has gotten the impression that my child's need and wishes
won't be first and foremost, then consider yourself corrected.
If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday
calendar and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start
putting clippings or little stickers inside the envelopes of various
individuals. Alphabetize your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder
your kids, to fulfill your need for structure and organization.
Yes, I do need to feel organized. If I ever want to take over his
learning experiences I can try one of these suggestions.
Okay, we will be leaving soon to go to a Spiral Scout meeting - if
anyone else has any pearls of wisdom for me fire them at will. I
expected to draw some fire...lol
Sunny
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sunshyne Powell <sunny@...> wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@...
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
Someone might have beat me to this, but you might as well get the full
new member treatment.
It's to be expected...lol
The best unschoolers don't believe there CAN be partial unschooling. (By
"best" I mean those for whom unschooling has come to work well, not
dabblers.)
Ok, a case of tomAto/tomato. I don't want to be a "best unschooler", I
want to give my child the best education I can, which is *not* going to
happen in a structured school environment. I say this not only from my
own personal experience, but from what I've seen in my son. If others
see us a dabbling, well - others will see us however they choose to.
<<We are just starting out on the home/un schooling path, although it
feels like we've been doing this all along anyway. >>
Good point! So don't change. Kids have been learning since birth,
because humans are programmed to learn, so the best thing you can do is
provide them with opportunities and input and experience and not mess up
their natural learning!
Who said we were going to change? I might have been assumed, but then
again the welcome I've received so far as been full of "well, that not
the right way to do it for your child", or at least that's the feeling
I've been getting. It doesn't affect me one way or the other; I've
always been a poor communicator of my true intentions, so I expect other
to not understand what I'm trying to say (and to usually see it in the
worst light possible)
If anyone has gotten the impression that my child's need and wishes
won't be first and foremost, then consider yourself corrected.
If you like structure, reorganize your spices, or make a birthday
calendar and buy cards for everyone for the coming year and start
putting clippings or little stickers inside the envelopes of various
individuals. Alphabetize your shoes. Do something that doesn't hinder
your kids, to fulfill your need for structure and organization.
Yes, I do need to feel organized. If I ever want to take over his
learning experiences I can try one of these suggestions.
Okay, we will be leaving soon to go to a Spiral Scout meeting - if
anyone else has any pearls of wisdom for me fire them at will. I
expected to draw some fire...lol
Sunny
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Robin Clevenger
> From: "Sunshyne Powell" <sunny@...>Welcome, so were most of us here. It might take some time to shake all that
> Hello all! My name is Sunny, and I was schooled as a child. I promise,
> I'm getting better...lol
out of your head, but fortunately as unschoolers we get a lot of time to do
just that.
> My husband and I are looking intoNot sure there is such a thing as a combination. I'm sure if you hang out
> homeschooling. Well, a combination of home- and un- schooling to be
> more accurate.
here for awhile you'll understand what I mean (esp. as there are plenty of
people here far more eloquent on this subject). Unschooling is about having
the faith that your child will choose the experiences they need to learn
from, and respecting those choices. You can't simultaneously do that and
also think that they need to be taught anything.
> Our little one, Orin, learns better when he moves at hisI think all of us would say the same thing!
> own pace.
> He would probably benefit greatly from unschooling, but IWell, the great news is that you have plenty of years to do that. I'd
> need slightly more structure, at least until I've finished deprogramming
> myself from the years of schooling I went through.
suggest hitting the library and checking out any and all books by John Holt,
Grace Llewellyn, & John Taylor Gatto for starters. They made gret reading
material when I was nursing my first babe. By the time he was old enough for
me to start meddling in his learning, I knew enough not to.
In the meantime, I bet you'll find that Orin will do just fine if you just
let him lead himself down whatever road he chooses. And this list can be a
great source of wisdom along the way.
Blue Skies!
-Robin-
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 5:07:19 PM, kellibac@... writes:
<< I really don't think that Sunny is a bad parent for trying to be
structured in some ways. >>
Lots of good parents have their kids in school.
We're not here talking about good parents. There are dillions of them.
Once someone decides they want to unschool, should we make them walk slowly
square to square like a snakes & ladders game with no shortcuts?
Sandra
<< I really don't think that Sunny is a bad parent for trying to be
structured in some ways. >>
Lots of good parents have their kids in school.
We're not here talking about good parents. There are dillions of them.
Once someone decides they want to unschool, should we make them walk slowly
square to square like a snakes & ladders game with no shortcuts?
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/2003 8:51:55 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
Where could I find one?
~Kelly <g>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
> like a snakes & ladders game with no shortcuts?I've never seen one, but I'm sure Duncan would like a Snakes & Ladders game.
>
Where could I find one?
~Kelly <g>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bill and Diane
It's also important that he do what *he* wants with the worksheet. If
the instructions say "circle the blue things" and he circles everything
on the page, it's really OK.
:-) Diane
the instructions say "circle the blue things" and he circles everything
on the page, it's really OK.
:-) Diane
>Worksheets... If you put a workbook out and don't check back to see whether
>he did it, the workbook won't jump up and bite him, and he might have fun
>with it. If you have a series of worksheets designed to teach him math or
>phonics, you might find you are teaching him to avoid anything that looks
>like math or phonics. Or you might be teaching him that those are things he
>has to be taught, that don't exist outside of worksheets.
>
Bill and Diane
So why post? Just for the "attaboys?"
:-) Diane
:-) Diane
><< Who said we were going to change? >>
>
>You came to this list.
>You'll change.
>
>
>
>Bwaaaahahaha....
>
>Sandra
>
Sunshyne Powell
Assuming this is for me (please correct me if I'm wrong), attaboys
weren't being sought. I wasn't really looking for anything, just trying
to introduce myself. However, when someone came back with the "full new
member treatment", which wasn't very positive - full of "you need to do
it this way" types of advice, well... It seemed like someone was trying
to fit me into a mold that's just not my size. I didn't ask for advice,
but got it in spades.
I stated the truth in the beginning - we will be doing a cross between
homeschooling and unschooling. I don't believe in the complete
structure that seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, but complete
unschooling would not fit my family's situation either. We'll be in a
gray area. If that offends anyone, you are entitled to your feeling and
opinions just the same as anyone is.
It seems like most on the list that have spoken up so far disagree with
almost everything I've tried to say. Fine, disagree all you want to.
I'm not looking for approval or disapproval, but do whatever makes you
feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
attention.
I don't plan on leaving the list, but I definitely won't be very vocal -
why encourage the criticism?
None of this is being posted to encourage a reply. Personally I'd
rather see this topic die out. What I thought was a simple introduction
has gone awry. If anyone feels moved to respond all I can ask for is to
please do it privately - there have *got* to be better things to talk
about...
Sunny
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill and Diane
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
So why post? Just for the "attaboys?"
:-) Diane
weren't being sought. I wasn't really looking for anything, just trying
to introduce myself. However, when someone came back with the "full new
member treatment", which wasn't very positive - full of "you need to do
it this way" types of advice, well... It seemed like someone was trying
to fit me into a mold that's just not my size. I didn't ask for advice,
but got it in spades.
I stated the truth in the beginning - we will be doing a cross between
homeschooling and unschooling. I don't believe in the complete
structure that seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, but complete
unschooling would not fit my family's situation either. We'll be in a
gray area. If that offends anyone, you are entitled to your feeling and
opinions just the same as anyone is.
It seems like most on the list that have spoken up so far disagree with
almost everything I've tried to say. Fine, disagree all you want to.
I'm not looking for approval or disapproval, but do whatever makes you
feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
attention.
I don't plan on leaving the list, but I definitely won't be very vocal -
why encourage the criticism?
None of this is being posted to encourage a reply. Personally I'd
rather see this topic die out. What I thought was a simple introduction
has gone awry. If anyone feels moved to respond all I can ask for is to
please do it privately - there have *got* to be better things to talk
about...
Sunny
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill and Diane
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] new member intro
So why post? Just for the "attaboys?"
:-) Diane
><< Who said we were going to change? >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>You came to this list.
>You'll change.
>
>
>
>Bwaaaahahaha....
>
>Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/5/03 9:57:33 PM, sunny@... writes:
<< If anyone feels moved to respond all I can ask for is to
please do it privately -there have *got* to be better things to talk
about...>>
There is nothing better to talk about on an unschooling list than how
unschooling works.
<< do whatever makes you
feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
attention. >>
If you're determined to stick with what you've decided when your child is
four and to never, ever change, that's your difficult business. But there
are over 1000 people on this list, and if something someone writes helps any
one of THEIR children, the discussion is worth having.
Writing to one person privately makes no sense, since the posts are for the
benefit of anyone who is subscribed and those who might come later and read
the archives.
-=I'm not looking for approval or disapproval, but do whatever makes you
feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
attention.-=-
How can you say you're giving it no attention, since you responded?
Seriously, information is information. The same way you won't be able to
control what your child learns, you yourself also learn in ways beyond your
control.
Sandra
<< If anyone feels moved to respond all I can ask for is to
please do it privately -there have *got* to be better things to talk
about...>>
There is nothing better to talk about on an unschooling list than how
unschooling works.
<< do whatever makes you
feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
attention. >>
If you're determined to stick with what you've decided when your child is
four and to never, ever change, that's your difficult business. But there
are over 1000 people on this list, and if something someone writes helps any
one of THEIR children, the discussion is worth having.
Writing to one person privately makes no sense, since the posts are for the
benefit of anyone who is subscribed and those who might come later and read
the archives.
-=I'm not looking for approval or disapproval, but do whatever makes you
feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
attention.-=-
How can you say you're giving it no attention, since you responded?
Seriously, information is information. The same way you won't be able to
control what your child learns, you yourself also learn in ways beyond your
control.
Sandra
Pamela Sorooshian
On Saturday, April 5, 2003, at 07:23 AM, Sunshyne Powell wrote:
After many years of intense interest in how children learn to read, I
am firmly convinced that early reading instruction increases the
probability of later reading problems. A child who is ready to read at
4 (or 5 or 6 or ....) will DRAW the help he/she needs out of you - it
doesn't take ANY special materials - just a lot of print materials in
his/her environment. You'd be WAY better off to just get a copy of Jim
Trelease's New Read-Aloud Handbook and maybe Peggy Kaye's "Games for
Reading," for ideas of word-based fun.
When my little ones said they wanted to learn to read, I'd ask them,
"What words do you want to read?" They'd tell me the words, "dinosaur"
and "umbrella" and other words. I'd write them on index cards and
they'd decorate them. We kept them in a special envelope in a special
place and they would pull them out and practice "reading" them whenever
they wanted. They'd add to the words when a special word came up.
I had one of my children who learned to read at 3 1/2 years old - so it
isn't like I didn't have an early reader, I'm obviously not saying that
it isn't possible. But that was with NO workbook pages and NO
instruction - just answering questions and having fun with rhyming
games and a LOT of reading aloud and being surrounded by books and
completely and totally letting the child lead the way. HOW would a 4 yo
ever know to ASK for workbook pages - they shouldn't be in his
vocabulary.
--pam
> So, the first thing he said he wanted to do, when asked, was learn howPlease consider not BUYING anything at all to help him learn to read.
> to read. At 4. lol... I don't know what I was expecting him to say,
> but learning to read was not it. The worksheets and things I'll be
> getting are only to help him learn how to read. Well, to supplement us
> reading together. Beyond that I'm not going to spend the extra money
> on
> anything like worksheets and like items. At least not right now.
>
After many years of intense interest in how children learn to read, I
am firmly convinced that early reading instruction increases the
probability of later reading problems. A child who is ready to read at
4 (or 5 or 6 or ....) will DRAW the help he/she needs out of you - it
doesn't take ANY special materials - just a lot of print materials in
his/her environment. You'd be WAY better off to just get a copy of Jim
Trelease's New Read-Aloud Handbook and maybe Peggy Kaye's "Games for
Reading," for ideas of word-based fun.
When my little ones said they wanted to learn to read, I'd ask them,
"What words do you want to read?" They'd tell me the words, "dinosaur"
and "umbrella" and other words. I'd write them on index cards and
they'd decorate them. We kept them in a special envelope in a special
place and they would pull them out and practice "reading" them whenever
they wanted. They'd add to the words when a special word came up.
I had one of my children who learned to read at 3 1/2 years old - so it
isn't like I didn't have an early reader, I'm obviously not saying that
it isn't possible. But that was with NO workbook pages and NO
instruction - just answering questions and having fun with rhyming
games and a LOT of reading aloud and being surrounded by books and
completely and totally letting the child lead the way. HOW would a 4 yo
ever know to ASK for workbook pages - they shouldn't be in his
vocabulary.
--pam
Pamela Sorooshian
On Saturday, April 5, 2003, at 09:20 AM, SandraDodd@... wrote:
Think think think think think before you do anything at all
"school-like" to your child. You are new at this and your child is SO
young. How about, in honor of the MANY years of combined experience of
some of us on this list, you postpone anything that seems remotely
"school-like" for 6 months and, in the meantime, you agree to read some
recommended books and to spend a lot of time carefully observing your
son with unschooling ideas in mind?
-pam
> Or you might be teaching him that those are things heThe hidden lessons are, often, the most well-learned and most regretted.
> has to be taught, that don't exist outside of worksheets.
Think think think think think before you do anything at all
"school-like" to your child. You are new at this and your child is SO
young. How about, in honor of the MANY years of combined experience of
some of us on this list, you postpone anything that seems remotely
"school-like" for 6 months and, in the meantime, you agree to read some
recommended books and to spend a lot of time carefully observing your
son with unschooling ideas in mind?
-pam
Pamela Sorooshian
Ah - so he DID ask for workbooks? <G>
Take it all as gentle teasing, Sunny. Don't ignore it, though. You're
young, your child is young and you have lots of time and you know
you'll learn and change, so be flexible, and (I know you don't really
care but..) we old fogeys think you're just great for caring so much
and showing such respect for your son.
-pam
Take it all as gentle teasing, Sunny. Don't ignore it, though. You're
young, your child is young and you have lots of time and you know
you'll learn and change, so be flexible, and (I know you don't really
care but..) we old fogeys think you're just great for caring so much
and showing such respect for your son.
-pam
On Saturday, April 5, 2003, at 10:13 AM, Sunshyne Powell wrote:
> If anyone has gotten the impression that my child's need and wishes
> won't be first and foremost, then consider yourself corrected.
Mary
From: "Sunshyne Powell" <sunny@...>
<<I stated the truth in the beginning - we will be doing a cross between
homeschooling and unschooling. I don't believe in the complete
structure that seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, but complete
unschooling would not fit my family's situation either. We'll be in a
gray area. If that offends anyone, you are entitled to your feeling and
opinions just the same as anyone is.>>
If you are doing some of this and some of that, than you are eclectic. You
have to remember this is an unschooling list and no one here will not
question your motives or methods when it's not unschooling. Maybe there is
an eclectic homeschooling list that you would not feel pounced upon at.
Mary B
<<I stated the truth in the beginning - we will be doing a cross between
homeschooling and unschooling. I don't believe in the complete
structure that seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, but complete
unschooling would not fit my family's situation either. We'll be in a
gray area. If that offends anyone, you are entitled to your feeling and
opinions just the same as anyone is.>>
If you are doing some of this and some of that, than you are eclectic. You
have to remember this is an unschooling list and no one here will not
question your motives or methods when it's not unschooling. Maybe there is
an eclectic homeschooling list that you would not feel pounced upon at.
Mary B
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/6/03 6:58:05 AM, pamsoroosh@... writes:
<< HOW would a 4 yo
ever know to ASK for workbook pages - they shouldn't be in his
vocabulary. >>
My 4 year old, now just turned 5, found them all on her own at the book
store. Asked for them, asks for more every time we go, has a ton of them, and
50% of the time runs to them first thing in the morning and grabs one, runs
back to me and enthusiastically (like we're at the fair or Disneyland asking
to go on a ride) asking "Help me with this page Mommy!" before I have the
sleep rubbed out of my eyes. Yes, I said 50% of the time. (She does plenty of
other things, but she loves her workbooks, no help from me or any other
human.) Lara........
<< HOW would a 4 yo
ever know to ASK for workbook pages - they shouldn't be in his
vocabulary. >>
My 4 year old, now just turned 5, found them all on her own at the book
store. Asked for them, asks for more every time we go, has a ton of them, and
50% of the time runs to them first thing in the morning and grabs one, runs
back to me and enthusiastically (like we're at the fair or Disneyland asking
to go on a ride) asking "Help me with this page Mommy!" before I have the
sleep rubbed out of my eyes. Yes, I said 50% of the time. (She does plenty of
other things, but she loves her workbooks, no help from me or any other
human.) Lara........
Pamela Sorooshian
On Saturday, April 5, 2003, at 08:56 PM, Sunshyne Powell wrote:
sense. I think it is more likely that you're offended because people
responded to your post with ideas that were different than yours.
You're on an unschooling list and talking about giving a four-year-old
workbook pages to teach him to read. If you didn't expect to get pretty
negative feedback about that, then you clearly didn't take the welcome
notice to the list seriously - you haven't been reading for a while
before posting, right? If you had, you'd have known what to expect. So
- maybe you should read for a while. You have LOTS of time - there is
no hurry.
always reject anything here- nobody can enforce anything. It is all
just free offerings of ideas and experience and nobody stands to gain
anything whether you use the ideas and benefit from the experience or
not.
Maybe it would help if you read posts out loud in the sweetest voice
you can imagine. People here are SUPER kind and gentle folks - hearing
these posts in a harsh or critical tone of voice would change them from
what is intended.
-pam
> I stated the truth in the beginning - we will be doing a cross betweenSome people call it relaxed homeschooling. Unschooling it isn't.
> homeschooling and unschooling.
> I don't believe in the completeWhy would it offend us what you choose to do? That doesn't even make
> structure that seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, but
> complete
> unschooling would not fit my family's situation either. We'll be in a
> gray area. If that offends anyone, you are entitled to your feeling
> and
> opinions just the same as anyone is.
>
sense. I think it is more likely that you're offended because people
responded to your post with ideas that were different than yours.
You're on an unschooling list and talking about giving a four-year-old
workbook pages to teach him to read. If you didn't expect to get pretty
negative feedback about that, then you clearly didn't take the welcome
notice to the list seriously - you haven't been reading for a while
before posting, right? If you had, you'd have known what to expect. So
- maybe you should read for a while. You have LOTS of time - there is
no hurry.
> It seems like most on the list that have spoken up so far disagree withToo bad to not even listen and consider...I wish you would. You can
> almost everything I've tried to say. Fine, disagree all you want to.
> I'm not looking for approval or disapproval, but do whatever makes you
> feel better - neither will help me or my child so I'm not giving it any
> attention.
always reject anything here- nobody can enforce anything. It is all
just free offerings of ideas and experience and nobody stands to gain
anything whether you use the ideas and benefit from the experience or
not.
Maybe it would help if you read posts out loud in the sweetest voice
you can imagine. People here are SUPER kind and gentle folks - hearing
these posts in a harsh or critical tone of voice would change them from
what is intended.
-pam
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/6/03 7:04:10 AM, pamsoroosh@... writes:
<<
Think think think think think before you do anything at all
"school-like" to your child. You are new at this and your child is SO
young. How about, in honor of the MANY years of combined experience of
some of us on this list, you postpone anything that seems remotely
"school-like" for 6 months and, in the meantime, you agree to read some
recommended books and to spend a lot of time carefully observing your
son with unschooling ideas in mind?
-pam >>
I know I'll get reamed for saying this, but I think the above is much better
advice than getting jumped all over, to a newbie. Why? Not because the
jumped-all-over things that were said aren't true, but because people don't
hear very well when they're pounced on, and have things shoved down their
throat. (Do our kids learn that way? Isn't that why we unschool? I've heard
we should treat our kids like we would adults, but maybe, *if we want to be
heard*, we should treat adults like we do our kids.) I would venture to say
that the reason 'oldies' post here is to educate others about unschooling. (I
believe I remember reading a post that this is not a support group.) I would
also venture to say that the above will be heard better than anything so far
that's been said to her. And isn't that why *oldies in-the-know* are here? To
be heard, and to help kids? It just seems to me that it would be done in a
way that all the wisdom hear is *heard*. Lara.........
<<
Think think think think think before you do anything at all
"school-like" to your child. You are new at this and your child is SO
young. How about, in honor of the MANY years of combined experience of
some of us on this list, you postpone anything that seems remotely
"school-like" for 6 months and, in the meantime, you agree to read some
recommended books and to spend a lot of time carefully observing your
son with unschooling ideas in mind?
-pam >>
I know I'll get reamed for saying this, but I think the above is much better
advice than getting jumped all over, to a newbie. Why? Not because the
jumped-all-over things that were said aren't true, but because people don't
hear very well when they're pounced on, and have things shoved down their
throat. (Do our kids learn that way? Isn't that why we unschool? I've heard
we should treat our kids like we would adults, but maybe, *if we want to be
heard*, we should treat adults like we do our kids.) I would venture to say
that the reason 'oldies' post here is to educate others about unschooling. (I
believe I remember reading a post that this is not a support group.) I would
also venture to say that the above will be heard better than anything so far
that's been said to her. And isn't that why *oldies in-the-know* are here? To
be heard, and to help kids? It just seems to me that it would be done in a
way that all the wisdom hear is *heard*. Lara.........
Fetteroll
on 4/6/03 3:59 AM, Laramike12@... at Laramike12@... wrote:
of weeks is in the introduction. :-)
I think many people see a list as a place where the members come to kick
back and relax for some adult conversation. But this list isn't one of
those. It's a place where people can find help to get where they imply they
want to go by signing up -- unschooling.
Our society has filled us with all sorts of screwy notions about what
children need in terms of learning and parenting. This is a place where
people can find help in recognizing when they're doing things "just because"
and getting rid of that thinking so they can get to unschooling.
Ultimately the list is for our children rather than for us.
Rather than think of the list as a conversation between you and a bunch of
people, think of it as like a free magazine. When you ask a question, you
get a dozen articles by different authors on the same topic. And those
articles in response to your question go out to everyone, not just to you.
Not every author will have a style that speaks to you or have information
you can use. So you skip theirs. Why not? It's free! The only investment
you're making is your time so why waste your time on authors and articles
that don't help you? But the authors you skip may be saying things in
exactly the way that someone else needed to hear. Someone else may be
skipping the ones you found most helpful.
Joyce
> I know I'll get reamed for saying this, but I think the above is much betterThis *is* a challenging list! That's why the suggestion to read for a couple
> advice than getting jumped all over, to a newbie.
of weeks is in the introduction. :-)
I think many people see a list as a place where the members come to kick
back and relax for some adult conversation. But this list isn't one of
those. It's a place where people can find help to get where they imply they
want to go by signing up -- unschooling.
Our society has filled us with all sorts of screwy notions about what
children need in terms of learning and parenting. This is a place where
people can find help in recognizing when they're doing things "just because"
and getting rid of that thinking so they can get to unschooling.
Ultimately the list is for our children rather than for us.
Rather than think of the list as a conversation between you and a bunch of
people, think of it as like a free magazine. When you ask a question, you
get a dozen articles by different authors on the same topic. And those
articles in response to your question go out to everyone, not just to you.
Not every author will have a style that speaks to you or have information
you can use. So you skip theirs. Why not? It's free! The only investment
you're making is your time so why waste your time on authors and articles
that don't help you? But the authors you skip may be saying things in
exactly the way that someone else needed to hear. Someone else may be
skipping the ones you found most helpful.
Joyce