Kolleen

>>Kolleen wrote:
>>I can't help but wonder... his mother and grandmother were clean
>> freaks... so he was getting the modeling there... BUT what happened? >>
>
>Andrea Kim wrote:
>What happened is that he was taught that WOMEN cleaned
>up these messes, not men. My husband (Korean) was brought
>up the very same way as your husband.

>Mimi wrote:
>You mentioned this man was brought up in Albanian household. Don't you
>think that their CULTURE and his parents' expectations of him played a
>part in his sloppiness?


You know, if the entire modeling was via culture, then I would tend to
agree here.

The differences I see is that the two sisters were only responsible for
the cleanliness of their room as he was also.

Sister #1 married a darling Croatian man (8 years her younger - he 21 her
29) and they worked together to keep the house clean. He *does* things
around the house and genuinely wants a nice home.

Sister #2 is pushing 30 and is a career woman (pharmacist) and is revered
by the dad for
*likeing* money so much. No need or push for her to settle down and be
*controlled*.

My guy *hates* anything that is considered manly duties, like garbage,
recycling, fixing things. He is incapable of fixing things, most of the
time I do the fixing.

He also was home with the kid in the beginning while I worked. Even
during pregnacy he was home a lot putzing around the kitchen cooking
while I worked right up until 3 days before birthing.

I used to come home for lunch to nurse and go back to work.

He also likes to cook - and is so damn messy at it, that I dont' find the
*nice* meal worth it. He can't understand why. I guess we both have our
issues as to what role food should play in one's life.

If he were true to his culture, then me being the breadwinner would of
been an issue.

Nobody was given chores around the house when they were young (sisters
included) because the mother did everything and grandmother too when she
was able.. mostly she was there to watch the kids.

As the sisters got older, they would help around the house because the
mother was working (as a cleaning woman) and they didn't like SEEING
their own mess.

As far as my son goes.. technically he would *see* his father cooking and
washing dishes as a toddler.. because I was working.. so there was
modeling (and toddlers don't see half-ass attempts at cleaning - they
just see the attempt).

I truly think this is beyond culture.. like a *messy gene* or something..
because *he* doesn't mind if the house is filthy or not.. he doesn't mind
if I clean or not.. and he cannot relate as to how a messy house throws
my entire emotional grid offline..

His mother is another story - she used to tell people that she couldn't
understand how I kept the house so messy - neglecting to tell them that I
was working and her son wasn't.

Although, I'm still semi-tempted to ask the mother if he had chores when
young - but I don't know if I wanted to be jumped on for started troubled
again *smirk*.

regards,
kolleen

ps. mimi, I am very familiar with the Greek culture. I dated one for 5
years way back when and I worked in the restaurant business for 18 years.

Pat Cald...

Kolleen wrote:
>Nobody was given chores around the house when they were young (sisters
>included) because the mother did everything and grandmother too when she
>was able.. mostly she was there to watch the kids.

Well Kolleen maybe your guy was just looking for someone like his mother that would do everything for him. I guess you weren't looking for someone to mother :-). When my husband and I were first married, we both worked full time yet I made his breakfast, packed his lunch, made lots of homecooked dinners and just was this super woman, I guess I did this because I liked nurturing and he liked being nurtured. When the kids were born I had enough to nurture so he was put into a different role. He has slowly adjusted and come a long way in being an equal partner but it has been difficult. I still put out the garbage, cut the lawn and do all the day to day jobs around the house. It works out better for us if I make suggestions for a to-do list of household maintenance chores. He is very handy - just doesn't like regular mundane stuff. I often wonder if his mother had not done as much for him if things would have been different. What can we learn from this for our own children? I do agree with what most were saying about people's nature but to me it just means that certain life skills do not come easily to some. It doesn't mean they don't ever have to learn to do them. Some people are not organized but most people still need to learn some organizational skills to accomplish the things they want to accomplish.

Pat


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