Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Digest Number 1487
Bridget E Coffman
>That's why it has the word probably in it. Anyway, given what I know
>
> ..........
> > Others probably had to work long
> > and hard to break their 'programming' and ......
>
> > Bridget
>
> Ooops...that is another of those projected
> assumptions...
> Sharon
about a few of you and what you, yourselves have said, I think it may be
accurate. Mind you, I said MAY.
Bridget
~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~
Think like a man of action, act like a man of thought
- Henri Bergson
Bridget E Coffman
> >and
> >Also you said:
> > >She could write tosome students at the colleges she's thinking of
> >*ask* how much writingto
> > >is involved. (Colleges generally have some students who volunteer
> >host others.)was
> >
> >So, you don't consider my opinion or my husband's valid even though I
> >a student at her chosen college as recently as two years ago and hegoing
> >graduated less than 5 years ago? Funny, she considers our opinions
> >valid. Well, that and what she WATCHED me doing.
>
> Bridget, your clarifications have helped me to understand better what
> happens in your family. But why did you have to jump on her about
> this? It was a suggestion. Nobody says you have to take someone's
> suggestion. Besides which, she might like knowing someone who is
> there when she starts.I don't think I jumped on her (at least not hard). She was saying that
> Tia
>
> Tia Leschke leschke@...
> On Vancouver Island
instead of ME telling Rachel what would be required at college, I should
let her ask someone who goes there. So, I asked why I don't count
considering that I've been there recently. But it is a little deeper
than that. I am still reading her posts as saying that I am much too
controlling with my kids. It irks me that no matter what I say, she
still seems to think I hold the paper and insist Rachel write on it
right now when I say so. I guess that shows in my response.
Bridget
~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~ ~\/~
Think like a man of action, act like a man of thought
- Henri Bergson
LisaBugg
It irks me that no matter what I say, she
could just delete that person unread? It would be eaiser all the way
around, wouldn't it?
> still seems to think I hold the paper and insist Rachel write on itIf you are going to be irked by one posters way of writing, do you think you
> right now when I say so. I guess that shows in my response.
>
>
could just delete that person unread? It would be eaiser all the way
around, wouldn't it?
Tia Leschke
>So when she wrote her list of suggestions, she was supposed to know that
>I don't think I jumped on her (at least not hard). She was saying that
>instead of ME telling Rachel what would be required at college, I should
>let her ask someone who goes there. So, I asked why I don't count
>considering that I've been there recently.
you went there recently? Did she actually even *say* that you didn't count?
>But it is a little deeperDo you think that you could just agree to disagree and move on?
>than that. I am still reading her posts as saying that I am much too
>controlling with my kids. It irks me that no matter what I say, she
>still seems to think I hold the paper and insist Rachel write on it
>right now when I say so. I guess that shows in my response.
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."
-Eleanor Roosevelt
What you think of me is none of my business.
*********************************************************
Tia Leschke leschke@...
On Vancouver Island
Joseph Fuerst
Tia:
I am currently struggling with my almost 10yr old re: reading (or lack
thereof).....I know part of my struggle comes from my own having been
'schooled' and having been an early reader. My dh and I LOVE to read,
have always read to her.....she says she hates it (but begs us to read
stories to her still). She listens to books on tape, gets people to read
to her. She loves games but her illiteracy is beginning to interfere (i.e.,
in Harry Potter trivia...you've got to read questions to opponents). She
loves logic and math problems.....gets Mathmania, but can't read the puzzle
instructions. She's oldest of four......and with the littler ones around
it's not like I can be there to read things to her when she wants. I am
frustrated and exasperated. I want her to read. And I'm trying trying
tring not to allow my feelings to get in her way. I just cannot understand
why she doesn't want to read.....why doesn't she see its value? why doesn't
she see she needs it to do things she WANTS to do? Can I stay out of her
way and let her come to this on her own? I am struggling with falling off
the unschooling wagon....though I'm sure if I push her, she'll resist
stubbornly. (So I'm thinking of a tutor*****and now ducking the backlash
from this list LOL!*****)
Honestly, do all of you just truly always trust.....Or is reading like
the swimmimg lessons Nance has mentioned? In other words, have I let her
down by not knowing how to make her comfortable in the great 'pool' of
reading?
Suz---about to pull my hair out on this one.
I did this a bit with my son, pointing to words or using my finger to
follow along. Then I'd look at him and he was very obviously looking away
from the book until I stopped. <g> He read at age 12, and then only
because I slipped away from my unschooling ideals and made him. (He still
doesn't read very well at 13, likely *because* of the pressure I put on him
earlier.)
Tia
Tia Leschke leschke@...
I am currently struggling with my almost 10yr old re: reading (or lack
thereof).....I know part of my struggle comes from my own having been
'schooled' and having been an early reader. My dh and I LOVE to read,
have always read to her.....she says she hates it (but begs us to read
stories to her still). She listens to books on tape, gets people to read
to her. She loves games but her illiteracy is beginning to interfere (i.e.,
in Harry Potter trivia...you've got to read questions to opponents). She
loves logic and math problems.....gets Mathmania, but can't read the puzzle
instructions. She's oldest of four......and with the littler ones around
it's not like I can be there to read things to her when she wants. I am
frustrated and exasperated. I want her to read. And I'm trying trying
tring not to allow my feelings to get in her way. I just cannot understand
why she doesn't want to read.....why doesn't she see its value? why doesn't
she see she needs it to do things she WANTS to do? Can I stay out of her
way and let her come to this on her own? I am struggling with falling off
the unschooling wagon....though I'm sure if I push her, she'll resist
stubbornly. (So I'm thinking of a tutor*****and now ducking the backlash
from this list LOL!*****)
Honestly, do all of you just truly always trust.....Or is reading like
the swimmimg lessons Nance has mentioned? In other words, have I let her
down by not knowing how to make her comfortable in the great 'pool' of
reading?
Suz---about to pull my hair out on this one.
I did this a bit with my son, pointing to words or using my finger to
follow along. Then I'd look at him and he was very obviously looking away
from the book until I stopped. <g> He read at age 12, and then only
because I slipped away from my unschooling ideals and made him. (He still
doesn't read very well at 13, likely *because* of the pressure I put on him
earlier.)
Tia
Tia Leschke leschke@...
Julie Stauffer
<<unschooling parenting>>
But I see a difference between education and day to day stuff. I don't
force my kids to learn anything (education) but sometimes I do need the kids
to do something they already know how to do, such as clean up a mess they
made (chores---we call anything that needs to get done a chore, many of them
we enjoy, many of them are simply necessary, the kids have chores, I have
chores, dh has chores)
Example: I don't need dd to learn to read. No one is relying on her to
learn to read. She will learn it when she either wants to or needs to.
BUT....I need her to clean her rabbit cages. The rabbit is relying on her
for his health. She doesn't need to learn how to do it. She already knows
how, she just needs to bite the bullet. The rabbit is a project of hers,
chosen freely by her from which she earns ribbons, honors and sometimes even
money based on how she compares with other rabbit raisers. Because of this,
I don't help out much with them. I help out a lot with the dog, its a pet,
its hers, but there is no competition as to her husbandry.
The way we as a family have chosen to handle the chore situation is with a
breakfast meeting. We all talk about what needs to be done that day
(shopping, vacuuming, clean rabbit cages, whatever) with everyone having
input. Then people begin to volunteer for chores that they prefer. Today,
8yo volunteered to fix lunch and dust while 4yo volunteered to clean
toilets. I volunteered to clean 10yo rabbit cages because her wrist is
injured. All kids volunteered to help straighten mess the 2yo made in 10yo
room. Usually there are 1 or 2 things left that nobody jumped up an down
about and usually I do those or we do them together. But we consider these
things chores because they have to get done. If you don't feed the goat,
the goat suffers.
But in my opinion, there is a difference between learning things and doing
things that you already know how to do.
Julie
But I see a difference between education and day to day stuff. I don't
force my kids to learn anything (education) but sometimes I do need the kids
to do something they already know how to do, such as clean up a mess they
made (chores---we call anything that needs to get done a chore, many of them
we enjoy, many of them are simply necessary, the kids have chores, I have
chores, dh has chores)
Example: I don't need dd to learn to read. No one is relying on her to
learn to read. She will learn it when she either wants to or needs to.
BUT....I need her to clean her rabbit cages. The rabbit is relying on her
for his health. She doesn't need to learn how to do it. She already knows
how, she just needs to bite the bullet. The rabbit is a project of hers,
chosen freely by her from which she earns ribbons, honors and sometimes even
money based on how she compares with other rabbit raisers. Because of this,
I don't help out much with them. I help out a lot with the dog, its a pet,
its hers, but there is no competition as to her husbandry.
The way we as a family have chosen to handle the chore situation is with a
breakfast meeting. We all talk about what needs to be done that day
(shopping, vacuuming, clean rabbit cages, whatever) with everyone having
input. Then people begin to volunteer for chores that they prefer. Today,
8yo volunteered to fix lunch and dust while 4yo volunteered to clean
toilets. I volunteered to clean 10yo rabbit cages because her wrist is
injured. All kids volunteered to help straighten mess the 2yo made in 10yo
room. Usually there are 1 or 2 things left that nobody jumped up an down
about and usually I do those or we do them together. But we consider these
things chores because they have to get done. If you don't feed the goat,
the goat suffers.
But in my opinion, there is a difference between learning things and doing
things that you already know how to do.
Julie
Tia Leschke
At 10:39 PM 9/18/01 -0400, you wrote:
impatience started to build when Lars was around 10. It peaked at 12 and I
gave in to it, making him do phonics with me. Try not to make that
mistake. I think now that if I had left him alone, he'd be reading well by
now.
I must have been my karma or something. For years I've done phone
counselling of new homeschoolers and always told them not to worry about
reading, that their child would come to it when ready. Of course I *would*
have to get an especially late reader. <g>
either isn't ready to do it on her own, or she doesn't yet want to badly
enough.
Tia
Tia Leschke leschke@...
On Vancouver Island
**************************************************************************
It is the answers which separate us, the questions which unite us. - Janice
Levy
>Tia:So when she gets fed up with waiting for you to read things to her.......
>I am currently struggling with my almost 10yr old re: reading (or lack
>thereof).....I know part of my struggle comes from my own having been
>'schooled' and having been an early reader. My dh and I LOVE to read,
>have always read to her.....she says she hates it (but begs us to read
>stories to her still). She listens to books on tape, gets people to read
>to her. She loves games but her illiteracy is beginning to interfere (i.e.,
>in Harry Potter trivia...you've got to read questions to opponents). She
>loves logic and math problems.....gets Mathmania, but can't read the puzzle
>instructions. She's oldest of four......and with the littler ones around
>it's not like I can be there to read things to her when she wants.
>I amBeen there done that. It's really a tough one to wait out. I think my
>frustrated and exasperated. I want her to read. And I'm trying trying
>tring not to allow my feelings to get in her way. I just cannot understand
>why she doesn't want to read.....why doesn't she see its value? why doesn't
>she see she needs it to do things she WANTS to do? Can I stay out of her
>way and let her come to this on her own? I am struggling with falling off
>the unschooling wagon....though I'm sure if I push her, she'll resist
>stubbornly.
impatience started to build when Lars was around 10. It peaked at 12 and I
gave in to it, making him do phonics with me. Try not to make that
mistake. I think now that if I had left him alone, he'd be reading well by
now.
I must have been my karma or something. For years I've done phone
counselling of new homeschoolers and always told them not to worry about
reading, that their child would come to it when ready. Of course I *would*
have to get an especially late reader. <g>
>(So I'm thinking of a tutor*****and now ducking the backlashNo comment. <g>
>from this list LOL!*****)
> Honestly, do all of you just truly always trust.....Or is reading likeShe knows the value of reading if she asks people to read to her. She
>the swimmimg lessons Nance has mentioned? In other words, have I let her
>down by not knowing how to make her comfortable in the great 'pool' of
>reading?
either isn't ready to do it on her own, or she doesn't yet want to badly
enough.
>Suz---about to pull my hair out on this one.Don't. You probably look better with hair. %^)
Tia
Tia Leschke leschke@...
On Vancouver Island
**************************************************************************
It is the answers which separate us, the questions which unite us. - Janice
Levy
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/18/01 8:34:24 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
rumpleteasermom@... writes:
you've seen on these lists, yet no one else can? I've read many posts from
you, upset that others have assessed or labeled or passed judgement on you or
your family dynamics without really knowing you. You've done what you've said
was wrong of others, make a decision about them by reading their posts. I
think it's ok, I just wish you did too.
Brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rumpleteasermom@... writes:
> That's why it has the word probably in it. Anyway, given what I knowBridget, why is it alright for you to assess us (chosen few) based on what
> about a few of you and what you, yourselves have said, I think it may be
> accurate. Mind you, I said MAY.
>
> Bridget
>
you've seen on these lists, yet no one else can? I've read many posts from
you, upset that others have assessed or labeled or passed judgement on you or
your family dynamics without really knowing you. You've done what you've said
was wrong of others, make a decision about them by reading their posts. I
think it's ok, I just wish you did too.
Brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 09/19/2001 2:02:51 AM !!!First Boot!!!,
LisaBugg@... writes:
actually consider the content and context, don't waste all of our time by
picking apart every little phrase!
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
LisaBugg@... writes:
> It irks me that no matter what I say, sheIn both directions! If you don't want to read what someone writes, and
> > still seems to think I hold the paper and insist Rachel write on it
> > right now when I say so. I guess that shows in my response.
> >
> >
> If you are going to be irked by one posters way of writing, do you think you
> could just delete that person unread? It would be eaiser all the way
>
actually consider the content and context, don't waste all of our time by
picking apart every little phrase!
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]