Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: choices and growth
Tracy Oldfield
42
Why not call it a chair?
Tracy
Why not call it a chair?
Tracy
[email protected]
<< But this "I would rather yell than..." argument is a lot like the "I would
rather spank..." arguments I've heard. "I would rather spank than scream at
my kids." "I would rather spank than ground them." >>
It's a good tool, though, to make the better of two choices when a person is
stressed adn trying to decide what to do. It's cheap justification if the
two choices remain the same, but it's grown and progress if then afterward
the parent says "I chose yelling over spanking. Next time my two choices are
going to be yelling or taking a deep breath and saying something quietly."
And the time after that it can be either the quiet put-down or walking away
for a few minutes.
Progressive growth toward an ideal is doable by anyone with a desire to be
thoughtful about it.
It works for all kinds of things, like getting a more period SCA camp, taking
better care of your car, making your bedroom more organized (I could just
leave the laundry on the bed, or I could put it back in the basket... that
could build up to taking a deep breath and putting at least SOME of it in the
drawers and closets even though you'd much rather not).
Sandra
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
rather spank..." arguments I've heard. "I would rather spank than scream at
my kids." "I would rather spank than ground them." >>
It's a good tool, though, to make the better of two choices when a person is
stressed adn trying to decide what to do. It's cheap justification if the
two choices remain the same, but it's grown and progress if then afterward
the parent says "I chose yelling over spanking. Next time my two choices are
going to be yelling or taking a deep breath and saying something quietly."
And the time after that it can be either the quiet put-down or walking away
for a few minutes.
Progressive growth toward an ideal is doable by anyone with a desire to be
thoughtful about it.
It works for all kinds of things, like getting a more period SCA camp, taking
better care of your car, making your bedroom more organized (I could just
leave the laundry on the bed, or I could put it back in the basket... that
could build up to taking a deep breath and putting at least SOME of it in the
drawers and closets even though you'd much rather not).
Sandra
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
Pam Hartley
----------
they are limited to two or four or six things, all negative, that I start to
wonder if anyone is trying to think beyond them.
It's like a homeschooling family saying, "Well, we don't like to use this
curriculum, but it's better than that one" and somebody bringing up
unschooling as an alternative positive to two negatives.
Or, as Douglas Adams (RIP) said (paraphrased), "It was nearly 2000 years
since one man was nailed to a tree for saying, 'Wouldn't it be great to be
nice to each other for a change?'"
Pam
>From: [email protected]Sure, I can agree with that. It's just when the choices are put down as if
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Digest Number 1413
>Date: Thu, Sep 6, 2001, 10:13 AM
>
> << But this "I would rather yell than..." argument is a lot like the "I would
> rather spank..." arguments I've heard. "I would rather spank than scream at
> my kids." "I would rather spank than ground them." >>
>
> It's a good tool, though, to make the better of two choices when a person is
> stressed adn trying to decide what to do.
they are limited to two or four or six things, all negative, that I start to
wonder if anyone is trying to think beyond them.
It's like a homeschooling family saying, "Well, we don't like to use this
curriculum, but it's better than that one" and somebody bringing up
unschooling as an alternative positive to two negatives.
Or, as Douglas Adams (RIP) said (paraphrased), "It was nearly 2000 years
since one man was nailed to a tree for saying, 'Wouldn't it be great to be
nice to each other for a change?'"
Pam
Bonni Sollars
Has anyone ever heard of the book How to Make Your Children Mind Without
Losing Yours? I read it when my oldest was a baby. It helps me whenever
I babysit another child who I really don't have a lot of control over.
But I don't have it anymore. Still, I remember two points that really
help. One is to do it with them, that is, whatever it is that they don't
want to do. The other is, if they try and weasel out of something, just
say "Susie, take out the garbage" repeatedly in a calm, distinct and
polite manner until they see you're not going to let it go or bow to
them, and do it. Something else I remember learning in a program called
Second Step, (I think that is the name), was to give the child a choice.
This really helps teachers in public school who are working with special
needs children (abused, violent backgrounds who do not respond well to
threats). They would say, "John, will you put the apple in the garbage?"
If he's defiant, the teacher would say, "You have a choice to either put
the apple in the garbage or sit down in the hall, which do you choose?"
That way the child has a feeling of control, so it takes away the need to
rebel. Rebellion is a result of a feeling of powerlessness. Choice
gives the child power.
I don't know if any of this helps. I know it's a good reminder for me.
Bonni
Losing Yours? I read it when my oldest was a baby. It helps me whenever
I babysit another child who I really don't have a lot of control over.
But I don't have it anymore. Still, I remember two points that really
help. One is to do it with them, that is, whatever it is that they don't
want to do. The other is, if they try and weasel out of something, just
say "Susie, take out the garbage" repeatedly in a calm, distinct and
polite manner until they see you're not going to let it go or bow to
them, and do it. Something else I remember learning in a program called
Second Step, (I think that is the name), was to give the child a choice.
This really helps teachers in public school who are working with special
needs children (abused, violent backgrounds who do not respond well to
threats). They would say, "John, will you put the apple in the garbage?"
If he's defiant, the teacher would say, "You have a choice to either put
the apple in the garbage or sit down in the hall, which do you choose?"
That way the child has a feeling of control, so it takes away the need to
rebel. Rebellion is a result of a feeling of powerlessness. Choice
gives the child power.
I don't know if any of this helps. I know it's a good reminder for me.
Bonni
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/6/01 12:48:14 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
pamhartley@... writes:
brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
pamhartley@... writes:
> "It was nearly 2000 yearshe he he....i *love* that quote, and the book too!
> since one man was nailed to a tree for saying, 'Wouldn't it be great to be
> nice to each other for a change?'"
>
> Pam
>
brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bridget E Coffman
42
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 16:25:02 EDT brendaclaspell@... writes:
comes from morons?~~~~
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell;
And by and by my Soul returned to me,
And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 16:25:02 EDT brendaclaspell@... writes:
> In a message dated 9/6/01 12:48:14 PM US Eastern Standard Time,~~~~If electricity comes from electrons...does that mean that morality
> pamhartley@... writes:
>
>
> > "It was nearly 2000 years
> > since one man was nailed to a tree for saying, 'Wouldn't it be
> great to be
> > nice to each other for a change?'"
> >
> > Pam
> >
>
> he he he....i *love* that quote, and the book too!
>
> brenda
>
comes from morons?~~~~
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell;
And by and by my Soul returned to me,
And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
[email protected]
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:12:19 -0400 Bonni Sollars <BSOLLARS@...>
writes:
handouts. I taught "seriously emotionally disturbed" kids (back in my
former life) and they could quite clearly see this as a setup. These
aren't real choice, these are artificial - any kid who hasn't been
totally brainwashed by the system will say something like, "Neither, I'm
going to sit here on my butt and there's nothing you can do about it."
Actually, I think that's what I'd say...
Daron
writes:
> Something else I remember learning in a program calledchoice.
> Second Step, (I think that is the name), was to give the child a
> This really helps teachers in public school who are working withspecial
> needs children (abused, violent backgrounds who do not respond well togarbage?"
> threats). They would say, "John, will you put the apple in the
> If he's defiant, the teacher would say, "You have a choice toyou
> either put the apple in the garbage or sit down in the hall, which do
> choose?"I actually went to a training on this program, I think. I remember the
handouts. I taught "seriously emotionally disturbed" kids (back in my
former life) and they could quite clearly see this as a setup. These
aren't real choice, these are artificial - any kid who hasn't been
totally brainwashed by the system will say something like, "Neither, I'm
going to sit here on my butt and there's nothing you can do about it."
Actually, I think that's what I'd say...
Daron
Johanna SanInocencio
interesting quote Pam.
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pam Hartley" <pamhartley@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 12:29 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: choices and growth
>
>
> ----------
> >From: [email protected]
> >To: [email protected]
> >Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Digest Number 1413
> >Date: Thu, Sep 6, 2001, 10:13 AM
> >
>
> > << But this "I would rather yell than..." argument is a lot like the "I
would
> > rather spank..." arguments I've heard. "I would rather spank than scream
at
> > my kids." "I would rather spank than ground them." >>
> >
> > It's a good tool, though, to make the better of two choices when a
person is
> > stressed adn trying to decide what to do.
>
> Sure, I can agree with that. It's just when the choices are put down as if
> they are limited to two or four or six things, all negative, that I start
to
> wonder if anyone is trying to think beyond them.
>
> It's like a homeschooling family saying, "Well, we don't like to use this
> curriculum, but it's better than that one" and somebody bringing up
> unschooling as an alternative positive to two negatives.
>
> Or, as Douglas Adams (RIP) said (paraphrased), "It was nearly 2000 years
> since one man was nailed to a tree for saying, 'Wouldn't it be great to be
> nice to each other for a change?'"
>
> Pam
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/6/01 5:19:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
rumpleteasermom@... writes:
brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rumpleteasermom@... writes:
> 42lol :-)
>
brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bridget E Coffman
Eddy's in the space time continuum.
What's he doing there?
Bridget
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 02:00:17 +0100 "Tracy Oldfield"
<tracy.oldfield@...> writes:
comes from morons?~~~~
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell;
And by and by my Soul returned to me,
And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
What's he doing there?
Bridget
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 02:00:17 +0100 "Tracy Oldfield"
<tracy.oldfield@...> writes:
> 42~~~~If electricity comes from electrons...does that mean that morality
>
> Why not call it a chair?
>
> Tracy
>
comes from morons?~~~~
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell;
And by and by my Soul returned to me,
And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
[email protected]
> It's just when the choices are put downI agree Pam. Are we just so used to feeling like we have to choose
> as if
> they are limited to two or four or six things, all negative, that I
> start to
> wonder if anyone is trying to think beyond them.
between the lesser of two evils? ( politics, etc. )
We found a better way in unschooling. We can find better ways in
parenting and in just plain being human.
Deb L
jefferson academy
Another question related to how do you get your kids
to do something (good) or to not do something (bad).
How do all of you handle kids not taking 'no' for an
answer. For example one of my dd may want me to
purchase something that we can't/don't want to (for
whatever the reason.) Another example is when dd wants
to do something that I do not feel she should do
(example: go to a party of 18-22 yo where no parents
will be present -she's 13, but begs to hang out with
18-20yo sisters. They say go ask mom because they know
I'll say no and they don't want to be the 'bad guys'.
If I didn't say no (thinking they wouldn't bring her
anyway) they may actually bring her - (they're the
type who would have eaten the brownies rather than
back down themselves.) This really relates back to
the rules regarding safety thing. So...how does
everyone else handle it when kids won't take no for an
answer (without 'begging')?
=====
Michele
(mom of 5dd: Justice 22, Felicity 20, Christian 18, Grace 13, Elysian (Mia)2)
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo! Messenger
http://im.yahoo.com
to do something (good) or to not do something (bad).
How do all of you handle kids not taking 'no' for an
answer. For example one of my dd may want me to
purchase something that we can't/don't want to (for
whatever the reason.) Another example is when dd wants
to do something that I do not feel she should do
(example: go to a party of 18-22 yo where no parents
will be present -she's 13, but begs to hang out with
18-20yo sisters. They say go ask mom because they know
I'll say no and they don't want to be the 'bad guys'.
If I didn't say no (thinking they wouldn't bring her
anyway) they may actually bring her - (they're the
type who would have eaten the brownies rather than
back down themselves.) This really relates back to
the rules regarding safety thing. So...how does
everyone else handle it when kids won't take no for an
answer (without 'begging')?
=====
Michele
(mom of 5dd: Justice 22, Felicity 20, Christian 18, Grace 13, Elysian (Mia)2)
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo! Messenger
http://im.yahoo.com
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/7/2001 6:27:17 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
jeffersonacademy@... writes:
get it when I say No as they point something out -- and usually their 2 cents
on how expensive everything is! I say Yes to a lot of things though -- if I
can afford it. And they are allowed to spend their birthday money on
whatever glop they want.
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jeffersonacademy@... writes:
> So...how doesConsistently not caving in seems to have resulted in two kids (6 and 8) who
> everyone else handle it when kids won't take no for an
> answer (without 'begging')?
>
>
get it when I say No as they point something out -- and usually their 2 cents
on how expensive everything is! I say Yes to a lot of things though -- if I
can afford it. And they are allowed to spend their birthday money on
whatever glop they want.
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
<< They would say, "John, will you put the apple in the garbage?"
If he's defiant, the teacher would say, "You have a choice to either put
the apple in the garbage or sit down in the hall, which do you choose?" >>
If you say "Could you put the apple in the garbage, or take the dishes to the
sink?" that's a more reasonable, helpful, healthy choice.
The "give a choice" advice is used a lot with kids who were traumatized and
are stuck without being able to think easily. Instead of showing them a
whole menu and saying "What do you want to eat?" if you see them becoming
stuck and zoned out, say "Do you want a hamburger or grilled cheese?" That
makes it easier for them
To use "sitting in the hall" (a punishment) as the option, it's on the
slippery slope to what abusers do when they say the victim had a choice
between doing what they said or being hit or abandoned.
And I think with "chores" as well as with many other things, under normal
circumstances kids should be able to negotiate their way out of doing
something. Maybe they're really upset about something and they need to stay
in their room to maintain their calm. Maybe they have a hurt foot from
kicking something stupid and they don't want to talk about it. Maybe they're
too angry with a sibling to be cooperating with them yet, and the mom is
trying to get them to go stack wood together.
When parents are sensitive and flexible with their kids they're more likely
to get respectful sensitivity and flexibility in return.
I say "please" a lot, and "thank you" a ton.
Sandra
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
If he's defiant, the teacher would say, "You have a choice to either put
the apple in the garbage or sit down in the hall, which do you choose?" >>
If you say "Could you put the apple in the garbage, or take the dishes to the
sink?" that's a more reasonable, helpful, healthy choice.
The "give a choice" advice is used a lot with kids who were traumatized and
are stuck without being able to think easily. Instead of showing them a
whole menu and saying "What do you want to eat?" if you see them becoming
stuck and zoned out, say "Do you want a hamburger or grilled cheese?" That
makes it easier for them
To use "sitting in the hall" (a punishment) as the option, it's on the
slippery slope to what abusers do when they say the victim had a choice
between doing what they said or being hit or abandoned.
And I think with "chores" as well as with many other things, under normal
circumstances kids should be able to negotiate their way out of doing
something. Maybe they're really upset about something and they need to stay
in their room to maintain their calm. Maybe they have a hurt foot from
kicking something stupid and they don't want to talk about it. Maybe they're
too angry with a sibling to be cooperating with them yet, and the mom is
trying to get them to go stack wood together.
When parents are sensitive and flexible with their kids they're more likely
to get respectful sensitivity and flexibility in return.
I say "please" a lot, and "thank you" a ton.
Sandra
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/7/01 4:27:08 AM, jeffersonacademy@... writes:
<< So...how does
everyone else handle it when kids won't take no for an
answer (without 'begging')? >>
Marty is younger than Kirby and sometimes gets told no, he can't go (by Kirby
or by me). Kirby's friends might be saying they don't mind if Marty goes,
but Kirby minds, and I don't want Marty ruining Kirby's fun just by being
there.
So I offer Marty an alternative. I'll get one of his friends over, or take
him and a friend to a movie (and pay their way). Or Marty and I take his dog
to a park to chase balls. Something where Marty is NOT in his room feeling
sorry for himself for being home alone.
I buy them off with a distraction.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
<< So...how does
everyone else handle it when kids won't take no for an
answer (without 'begging')? >>
Marty is younger than Kirby and sometimes gets told no, he can't go (by Kirby
or by me). Kirby's friends might be saying they don't mind if Marty goes,
but Kirby minds, and I don't want Marty ruining Kirby's fun just by being
there.
So I offer Marty an alternative. I'll get one of his friends over, or take
him and a friend to a movie (and pay their way). Or Marty and I take his dog
to a park to chase balls. Something where Marty is NOT in his room feeling
sorry for himself for being home alone.
I buy them off with a distraction.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
Johanna SanInocencio
Bridget, Tracy, what is going on?? 42?? chair? Eddy? I don't get it!!!
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bridget E Coffman" <rumpleteasermom@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: choices and growth
> Eddy's in the space time continuum.
>
> What's he doing there?
>
> Bridget
>
> On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 02:00:17 +0100 "Tracy Oldfield"
> <tracy.oldfield@...> writes:
> > 42
> >
> > Why not call it a chair?
> >
> > Tracy
> >
>
> ~~~~If electricity comes from electrons...does that mean that morality
> comes from morons?~~~~
> I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
> Some letter of that After-life to spell;
> And by and by my Soul returned to me,
> And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
Bridget E Coffman
I bet you don't know where your towel is either!!!
Bridget
ps - it's a book!
On Fri, 7 Sep 2001 09:16:00 -0500 "Johanna SanInocencio"
<saninocencio@...> writes:
comes from morons?~~~~
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell;
And by and by my Soul returned to me,
And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
Bridget
ps - it's a book!
On Fri, 7 Sep 2001 09:16:00 -0500 "Johanna SanInocencio"
<saninocencio@...> writes:
>~~~~If electricity comes from electrons...does that mean that morality
> Bridget, Tracy, what is going on?? 42?? chair? Eddy? I don't get
> it!!!
> Johanna
comes from morons?~~~~
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell;
And by and by my Soul returned to me,
And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The Rubaiyat
[email protected]
Hitchhiker's Guide stuff. Read the books, or watch the BBC videos. My
daughter is much better at it than I am....
We went to a great towel day party last year, complete with pan-galactic
gargle blasters and vogon poetry. When Cacie sees the friends who gave
the party, she immediately goes into Marvin the robot mode - "I love the
way you say hello to me."
And in California, we have to file an R-4 private school affadavit to
homeschool/unshool legally and we got to name our "school". Our is
Milliways (The restauarant at the end of the universe).
Daron
On Fri, 7 Sep 2001 09:16:00 -0500 "Johanna SanInocencio"
<saninocencio@...> writes:
daughter is much better at it than I am....
We went to a great towel day party last year, complete with pan-galactic
gargle blasters and vogon poetry. When Cacie sees the friends who gave
the party, she immediately goes into Marvin the robot mode - "I love the
way you say hello to me."
And in California, we have to file an R-4 private school affadavit to
homeschool/unshool legally and we got to name our "school". Our is
Milliways (The restauarant at the end of the universe).
Daron
On Fri, 7 Sep 2001 09:16:00 -0500 "Johanna SanInocencio"
<saninocencio@...> writes:
>
> Bridget, Tracy, what is going on?? 42?? chair? Eddy? I don't get
> it!!!
> Johanna
> Life is the ultimate learning experience!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bridget E Coffman" <rumpleteasermom@...>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: choices and growth
>
>
> > Eddy's in the space time continuum.
> >
> > What's he doing there?
> >
> > Bridget
> >
> > On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 02:00:17 +0100 "Tracy Oldfield"
> > <tracy.oldfield@...> writes:
> > > 42
> > >
> > > Why not call it a chair?
> > >
> > > Tracy
> > >
> >
> > ~~~~If electricity comes from electrons...does that mean that
> morality
> > comes from morons?~~~~
> > I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
> > Some letter of that After-life to spell;
> > And by and by my Soul returned to me,
> > And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The
> Rubaiyat
> >
> >
> > Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> > Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
> >
> > To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> > http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
> >
> > Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> > http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bonni Sollars
Yeah, I see your point. I was just quoting a story I heard at second
step. The teacher made the mistake of saying, "Throw that in the garbage
right now!" and the child went ballistic, throwing chairs around and
everything. She said she wishes she had requested, then given choices if
he refused to cooperate, to have been more respectful. I have given my
children choices between a positive or negative behavior, and they will
pause, and say, "Okay,I choose this." I have only done it a few times
when to have not done it meant not respecting my child. I would never
say it to my older children, because they already know it is their
choice. I just wanted them to know that they did not have to only have
the choice of throwing a fit. I think the clue is in your motive. Do
you want to control them, then they'll see through it. Do you want to
show them you respect them and yourself enough to give a boundary? They
will feel honored. Choosing your battles. Some things are just stupid,
and there is no need to get control of a situation. But at times, the
child is asking for direction or for safe boundaries, because they never
learned them at home in a positive, nurturing environment. If my husband
were cheating on me, I would respectfully give him the option of leaving
that person behind or of leaving me. That is because I respect myself,
and I respect him. But if he is leaving his socks on the floor, I will
just ask them to pick them up. If he doesn't , I leave them there or
move them to his side of the room. Because it is not a battle worth
fighting, even if it does get on my nerves. If I told him "Get rid of
the socks or else..." that is stupid. This an interesting subject.
Bonni
step. The teacher made the mistake of saying, "Throw that in the garbage
right now!" and the child went ballistic, throwing chairs around and
everything. She said she wishes she had requested, then given choices if
he refused to cooperate, to have been more respectful. I have given my
children choices between a positive or negative behavior, and they will
pause, and say, "Okay,I choose this." I have only done it a few times
when to have not done it meant not respecting my child. I would never
say it to my older children, because they already know it is their
choice. I just wanted them to know that they did not have to only have
the choice of throwing a fit. I think the clue is in your motive. Do
you want to control them, then they'll see through it. Do you want to
show them you respect them and yourself enough to give a boundary? They
will feel honored. Choosing your battles. Some things are just stupid,
and there is no need to get control of a situation. But at times, the
child is asking for direction or for safe boundaries, because they never
learned them at home in a positive, nurturing environment. If my husband
were cheating on me, I would respectfully give him the option of leaving
that person behind or of leaving me. That is because I respect myself,
and I respect him. But if he is leaving his socks on the floor, I will
just ask them to pick them up. If he doesn't , I leave them there or
move them to his side of the room. Because it is not a battle worth
fighting, even if it does get on my nerves. If I told him "Get rid of
the socks or else..." that is stupid. This an interesting subject.
Bonni
Bonni Sollars
Beg away, I'm still saying no. Saying yes means I don't care about your
safety, and I love you too much for that.
Begging doesn't get you the things you want at the store, getting a
babysitting job might, though.
Bonni
safety, and I love you too much for that.
Begging doesn't get you the things you want at the store, getting a
babysitting job might, though.
Bonni
jefferson academy
--- marbleface@... wrote:
decision and then change my mind (because it was a bad
call in the first place - like I told dd no tv during
school hours and after discussion here changed my
mind) and dd interpret the change as being due to
begging. (And this is not to say that I haven't, at
times, given in because they really did wear me down.)
=====
Michele
(mom of 5dd: Justice 22, Felicity 20, Christian 18, Grace 13, Elysian (Mia)2)
__________________________________________________
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> In a message dated 9/7/2001 6:27:17 AM EasternI know that is part of my probem. Sometime I make a
> Daylight Time,
> jeffersonacademy@... writes:
>
>
> > So...how does
> > everyone else handle it when kids won't take no
> for an
> > answer (without 'begging')?
> >
> >
>
>
> Consistently not caving in seems to have resulted in
> two kids (6 and 8) who
> get it when I say No as they point something out --
decision and then change my mind (because it was a bad
call in the first place - like I told dd no tv during
school hours and after discussion here changed my
mind) and dd interpret the change as being due to
begging. (And this is not to say that I haven't, at
times, given in because they really did wear me down.)
=====
Michele
(mom of 5dd: Justice 22, Felicity 20, Christian 18, Grace 13, Elysian (Mia)2)
__________________________________________________
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jefferson academy
I take his dog
with your son! I alway thought all my dd and I were
close, but when I think of it this way, there is no
possible way doing anything with me would compare to
doing things with her sisters. (Not to mention the
fact she wants to be doing things *long* after I'm asleep.
=====
Michele
(mom of 5dd: Justice 22, Felicity 20, Christian 18, Grace 13, Elysian (Mia)2)
__________________________________________________
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> to a park to chase balls. Something where Marty isThis says wonderful things about your relationship
> NOT in his room feeling
> sorry for himself for being home alone.
with your son! I alway thought all my dd and I were
close, but when I think of it this way, there is no
possible way doing anything with me would compare to
doing things with her sisters. (Not to mention the
fact she wants to be doing things *long* after I'm asleep.
=====
Michele
(mom of 5dd: Justice 22, Felicity 20, Christian 18, Grace 13, Elysian (Mia)2)
__________________________________________________
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Bonni Sollars
That's a great idea, at least that way they know you care that they are
missing out on something.
Bonni
missing out on something.
Bonni
Johanna SanInocencio
now I get It!!! I read the books in say 1980 or so when the first came out.
I was in high school. something was too familiar and it was driving me crazy
because I couldn't place it. must have been the SEP field.
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
I was in high school. something was too familiar and it was driving me crazy
because I couldn't place it. must have been the SEP field.
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
----- Original Message -----
From: <freeform@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Cc: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2001 12:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: choices and growth
> Hitchhiker's Guide stuff. Read the books, or watch the BBC videos. My
> daughter is much better at it than I am....
>
> We went to a great towel day party last year, complete with pan-galactic
> gargle blasters and vogon poetry. When Cacie sees the friends who gave
> the party, she immediately goes into Marvin the robot mode - "I love the
> way you say hello to me."
>
> And in California, we have to file an R-4 private school affadavit to
> homeschool/unshool legally and we got to name our "school". Our is
> Milliways (The restauarant at the end of the universe).
>
> Daron
>
> On Fri, 7 Sep 2001 09:16:00 -0500 "Johanna SanInocencio"
> <saninocencio@...> writes:
> >
> > Bridget, Tracy, what is going on?? 42?? chair? Eddy? I don't get
> > it!!!
> > Johanna
> > Life is the ultimate learning experience!
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bridget E Coffman" <rumpleteasermom@...>
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:01 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: choices and growth
> >
> >
> > > Eddy's in the space time continuum.
> > >
> > > What's he doing there?
> > >
> > > Bridget
> > >
> > > On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 02:00:17 +0100 "Tracy Oldfield"
> > > <tracy.oldfield@...> writes:
> > > > 42
> > > >
> > > > Why not call it a chair?
> > > >
> > > > Tracy
> > > >
> > >
> > > ~~~~If electricity comes from electrons...does that mean that
> > morality
> > > comes from morons?~~~~
> > > I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
> > > Some letter of that After-life to spell;
> > > And by and by my Soul returned to me,
> > > And answered, "I Myself am Heaven and Hell." -- The
> > Rubaiyat
> > >
> > >
> > > Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> > > Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> > > http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
> > >
> > > Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> > > http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >
> > Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> > Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
> >
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> >
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> >
> >
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
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>
Bonni Sollars
This is such an interesting subject. I am really starting to think more
clearly about it now. It has sparked a lot of interesting conversations
with my kids already.
Bonni
clearly about it now. It has sparked a lot of interesting conversations
with my kids already.
Bonni
Bonni Sollars
Yes, true, but putting them on his side of the room is what he prefers,
since he doesn't like a hamper and does his own laundry. His choice so
his socks don't get mixed with the children's.
Bonni
since he doesn't like a hamper and does his own laundry. His choice so
his socks don't get mixed with the children's.
Bonni
[email protected]
<< But if he is leaving his socks on the floor, I will
just ask them to pick them up. If he doesn't , I leave them there or
move them to his side of the room. Because it is not a battle worth
fighting, even if it does get on my nerves. >>
I'd pick them up for him, and he would do the same for me.
Works the same way with kids, pretty much!
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
just ask them to pick them up. If he doesn't , I leave them there or
move them to his side of the room. Because it is not a battle worth
fighting, even if it does get on my nerves. >>
I'd pick them up for him, and he would do the same for me.
Works the same way with kids, pretty much!
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
Bonni Sollars
Because he's a bit different,no really, he has his reasons. He likes for
everything to be where he can see it and his side of the room is really
very small. We live in a very small place.
Bonni
everything to be where he can see it and his side of the room is really
very small. We live in a very small place.
Bonni
Sharon Rudd
Why?
Sharon
--- Bonni Sollars <BSOLLARS@...> wrote:
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Sharon
--- Bonni Sollars <BSOLLARS@...> wrote:
> Yes, true, but putting them on his side of the room__________________________________________________
> is what he prefers,
> since he doesn't like a hamper and does his own
> laundry. His choice so
> his socks don't get mixed with the children's.
> Bonni
>
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Sharon Rudd
Thanks Bonni, just wondered. We live in a small
indoor space, too. The outside is big, though!
Sharon
--- Bonni Sollars <BSOLLARS@...> wrote:
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indoor space, too. The outside is big, though!
Sharon
--- Bonni Sollars <BSOLLARS@...> wrote:
> Because he's a bit different,no really, he has his__________________________________________________
> reasons. He likes for
> everything to be where he can see it and his side of
> the room is really
> very small. We live in a very small place.
> Bonni
>
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